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[Game On] Dawn of War II: The Balancing

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Posts

  • DeadOnArrivalDeadOnArrival Registered User
    edited August 2009
    Retzinsky wrote: »
    DoA forbade me to ever share the scout spam game. I didn't save the Team Lictor game but I'll ask to see if the other two have it.

    I saw a Waaagh banner recently but I think it was only under construction and I remember winning the game pretty easily. Back in 1.3 I played 2v2 where a Mekboy spammed Waaagh banners, maybe as many as 12 on one screen. Needless to say it didn't work.

    I was only joking. You can share all you like. Everyone already knows how much I sucks at the DoW2. :(

    2zz3vp4.jpg
  • RetzinskyRetzinsky Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Ok then, here's the replay. From a hatecasting point of view it's really an embarrassment of riches. You'll need two sets of eyes to spot everything wrong with this perfect storm of bullshit. In fact, here's a new phrase I created to describe it: "catastrofucking ridiculame."

  • MedanMedan Registered User
    edited August 2009
  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Retzinsky wrote: »
    This is such a beautiful progression of posts. Call me a misery vampire or whatever, but I can't help but smile:
    Akira wrote: »
    I don't even understand why Defend is a factor, the damage reduction is only against ranged and AG gaunts are fast/plentiful enough to have all your shit tied up almost instantly.
    Goomba wrote: »
    No, it works in melee too. What, you trust the tooltip? Remember conceal/distort field?
    Akira wrote: »
    I hate this game and everyone who plays it.

    After our disaster yesterday, Dalzi, DoA and myself turned to the dark side and played a couple of games like complete dickheaded dickheads. The first was against people pretty much playing their first game. If they play a second one, I'll be surprised. The next game was against a TS 28/29 team which should have made for a close game, except we all picked Lictor. None of us play nids, but we made the other team look completely fucking ordinary. It was a joke how easy it was. I built two squads of Horms (for three total) and gave them the AG upgrade. The next unit I built was a Screamer-Killer and there was hardly anything left for it to shoot at. We'd completely crushed the enemy team with a handful of squads of the basic fucking unit. I could have sleepwalked to victory. I think we wanted to kill ourselves when the match ended, it was a complete horrorshow.
    I don't mean to be rude or anything but welcome to Akira, Goomba, and Pancake circa fucking months ago.

    Akira and I came up with a great idea last night. Make horms and terms pants-on-head retarded out of synapse, but give all the heroes a "basic" synapse so they can do basic movement/damage and then real synapse units let them function fully and real synapse lets them function at current levels, basic synapse they don't get the benefits of any upgrades and can't use an abilities. A reason to use synapse, tada. P.S. don't buff synapse units because then they'll be the only things used like in 1.3. It'd also keep horms from chasing shit down all retarded-like.

    But that reminds me of the most fucking amazing thing that horm/terms are slightly weaker than other counter units, but cost less. BUT THEN GET SYNAPSE BONUSES THAT MAKE THEM COST LESS AND DO MORE ARGRAGJ

    AJSGKAJGSH

    FUCK RELIC WHY

    GODDAMNIT

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • RetzinskyRetzinsky Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Goomba wrote: »
    I don't mean to be rude or anything but welcome to Akira, Goomba, and Pancake circa fucking months ago.

    Oh, I know I know, it was just so perfect I couldn't resist. It's like the whole Relic Experience™ condensed into three lines of text, what you might get if you refined these threads down to their purest essence and bottled it. :D

  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    How do people do Scout spam? I tried it against the PC as a joke once, and it didn't work out particularly well. They all died pretty fast. Then again they're cheap as hell so maybe it wouldn't matter.

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Retzinsky wrote: »
    Goomba wrote: »
    I don't mean to be rude or anything but welcome to Akira, Goomba, and Pancake circa fucking months ago.

    Oh, I know I know, it was just so perfect I couldn't resist. It's like the whole Relic Experience™ condensed into three lines of text, what you might get if you refined these threads down to their purest essence and bottled it. :D
    Oh, yeah, that too! I meant the whole TEAM (TYRANID HERO) thing.

    By the way guess which hero is still overpowered time's up it's ravener alpha.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CampyCampy Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Half price ftw.

    I am tempted by this offer, but cannot find it. Are ye talking about steam?

  • The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    retreating wouldn't be so bad if retreating units clipped through everything.

    scarab you have mental problems
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Goomba wrote: »
    Retzinsky wrote: »
    Goomba wrote: »
    I don't mean to be rude or anything but welcome to Akira, Goomba, and Pancake circa fucking months ago.

    Oh, I know I know, it was just so perfect I couldn't resist. It's like the whole Relic Experienceâ„¢ condensed into three lines of text, what you might get if you refined these threads down to their purest essence and bottled it. :D
    Oh, yeah, that too! I meant the whole TEAM (TYRANID HERO) thing.

    By the way guess which hero is still overpowered time's up it's ravener alpha.

    Really? It feels like the other two are worse.

    When I random up as him it's troublesome. I however use a well balanced army generally. Probably would be better if I just spammed AG gaunts and melee with him.

    I'm sure he's still great in reasonably experienced nid hands.

    Or is the point here that there is no underpowered nid hero here?

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Goomba wrote: »
    Retzinsky wrote: »
    Goomba wrote: »
    I don't mean to be rude or anything but welcome to Akira, Goomba, and Pancake circa fucking months ago.

    Oh, I know I know, it was just so perfect I couldn't resist. It's like the whole Relic Experience™ condensed into three lines of text, what you might get if you refined these threads down to their purest essence and bottled it. :D
    Oh, yeah, that too! I meant the whole TEAM (TYRANID HERO) thing.

    By the way guess which hero is still overpowered time's up it's ravener alpha.

    Really? It feels like the other two are worse.

    When I random up as him it's troublesome. I however use a well balanced army generally. Probably would be better if I just spammed AG gaunts and melee with him.

    I'm sure he's still great in reasonably experienced nid hands.

    Or is the point here that there is no underpowered nid hero here?
    Well, tunnel plus horms. I'll let you find the answer to that.

    And yeah, every tyranid hero is pretty much broken as fuck.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CanisAquilusCanisAquilus Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I find it funny how quickly my teamates akira and goomba go from "hey, this games pretty fun" to "FUCK THIS GAME AND EVERYTHING ABOUT IT". The difference between those two states are about three losses.

    Look guys, blame it on me if you want... poor play last night, or my mic being broken or whatever, but for god sakes just calm down we'll take another crack at it tomorrow or something.

    Losing isnt fun... we all know.

  • Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity Ask me about Super Propane and Super Propane accessoriesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I'd like to play the game with peopel again!

    344B2YT.gifsteamicon48x48.gif Know about web development? I need your help with my professional site!
  • Dr.TongueDr.Tongue Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    How exactly are the HT/LA broken as fuck? They are both pretty strong but I wouldn't go as far as to say they are broken.

  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I find it funny how quickly my teamates akira and goomba go from "hey, this games pretty fun" to "FUCK THIS GAME AND EVERYTHING ABOUT IT". The difference between those two states are about three losses.

    Look guys, blame it on me if you want... poor play last night, or my mic being broken or whatever, but for god sakes just calm down we'll take another crack at it tomorrow or something.

    Losing isnt fun... we all know.

    Like I said, it's a game...on the internet, where every single time you hit start search, you are betting against the odds of running into an asshole.

  • CanisAquilusCanisAquilus Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Tarranon wrote: »
    I find it funny how quickly my teamates akira and goomba go from "hey, this games pretty fun" to "FUCK THIS GAME AND EVERYTHING ABOUT IT". The difference between those two states are about three losses.

    Look guys, blame it on me if you want... poor play last night, or my mic being broken or whatever, but for god sakes just calm down we'll take another crack at it tomorrow or something.

    Losing isnt fun... we all know.

    Like I said, it's a game...on the internet, where every single time you hit start search, you are betting against the odds of running into an asshole.

    Prior to the three losses we had last night we were on a twenty game win streak.
    Dr. Tongue wrote:
    How exactly are the HT/LA broken as fuck? They are both pretty strong but I wouldn't go as far as to say they are broken.

    Hive tyrants t2 invulnerability wargear is too strong, and undermines the natural method of countering synapse blobs cost effectively, while lictor alpha is just dumb with its feeding tendrils and flesh hooks and shit.

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    I find it funny how quickly my teamates akira and goomba go from "hey, this games pretty fun" to "FUCK THIS GAME AND EVERYTHING ABOUT IT". The difference between those two states are about three losses.

    Look guys, blame it on me if you want... poor play last night, or my mic being broken or whatever, but for god sakes just calm down we'll take another crack at it tomorrow or something.

    Losing isnt fun... we all know.
    No, basically, DoW 2 has a one or two week grace period before everyone figures out what's broken. Once we start fighting TS 30 and above guys, we don't stand a chance because despite them being awful, they just mash H or B until they have five melee squads. It was a fun half week, but the broken stuff is here and more blatant than ever, yet Relic sits silently on their vacation. They think they did a great job, but they didn't address any of the issues that have been in the game since the start, or if they did, they made them worse.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CanisAquilusCanisAquilus Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I bet if you get over last night and take another crack at it things will improve. I wasnt playing well last night at all, and I'm sure that was a contributing factor.

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    I bet if you get over last night and take another crack at it things will improve. I wasnt playing well last night at all, and I'm sure that was a contributing factor.
    Yes, horm and banshee spam will just vanish, not get worse.

    No, I'm gonna stop now while I'm ahead.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • AkiraAkira Registered User
    edited August 2009
    I always end up playing again no matter how bad it gets, I'm like some kind of virtual masochist.

    Also if you want to know how bad the Ravener Alpha is now, here is what you do. You get 1 or 2 of your other teammates to force a retreat while Ravener sets up a tunnel in their path. Once the mass retreat starts you take your blob of AG Gaunts out of the tunnel and proceed to wipe out their entire retreating army.


    The insane thing right now is that I would rather fight 5 squads of AG Gaunts with a BS Warrior squad, than just 5 squads of AG gaunts. I would literally give the Tyranids a free unit so there would be at least some way to slow them down/counter them.

    akira.gif
  • Alfred J. KwakAlfred J. Kwak Registered User
    edited August 2009
    Hey, Tyranids wouldn't be considered the bane of the universe if they weren't fearsome enemies. You can't really blame Relic for sticking as close to the source material as possible, so deal with it.

    On a more serious note, and I know that it might be considered heresy or something mentioning the singleplayer part of the game in this thread, but how long does the campaign last? We've done quite a few missions already, but the stats for our squads are no where near maxed out, and I was just wondering if you ever get to fill out at least a few of those bars.

  • CanisAquilusCanisAquilus Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Goomba wrote:
    Yes, horm and banshee spam will just vanish, not get worse.

    No, I'm gonna stop now while I'm ahead.

    There are counters... good grenade micro, for example. The witchblade of kuronus is great too for that purpose, and minces both of them, which I'm going to rush to in the future against tyranid and eldar. Warpspiders destroy banshees. Set-up teams work pretty well against AG gaunts, especially combined with a grenade. I'm sure we can come up with a lot more than that if we dont just bow out like pussies.

  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I though AG gaunts needed synapse to leap but the disasterpiece has taught me otherwise.

    Thanks disasterpiece!

  • RetzinskyRetzinsky Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    The thing with the Lictor is that if you're going for a Hormagaunts of Bullshit build he gives you total immunity from suppression teams which are the only thing that could possibly stall you. Between Infiltrate/Hooks/Jump they don't stand a chance, and he gets two of those tools by default. Not that the other two nid heroes don't have a million tools to make suppression teams worthless, but they're like 8/10 and 9/10 to the Lictor's crushing 10/10 FATALITY. The other thing is hooking/jumping retreating squads to really hammer home the fact that if you touch nids, your squads are totally dead, to the last man. Lone Tactical Marine escaping? Hooks. Hero getting away? Hooks. Squad retreating? Jump. (Yes, it knocks down retreating units.) It's the ironclad squad killing of AG Hormagaunts and then he snaps shut a big fucking padlock on it that guarantees you are rebuying some or all of your guys.

  • Dr.TongueDr.Tongue Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I don't know whats up with retreating units and flesh hooks. There are times it only does damage and other times it pulls retreating commanders to their doom. Not like it matters since horms will chase them down anyway.

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Goomba wrote:
    Yes, horm and banshee spam will just vanish, not get worse.

    No, I'm gonna stop now while I'm ahead.

    There are counters... good grenade micro, for example. The witchblade of kuronus is great too for that purpose, and minces both of them, which I'm going to rush to in the future. Warpspiders destroy banshees. Set-up teams work pretty well against AG gaunts, especially combined with a grenade. I'm sure we can come up with a lot more than that.
    A lucky grenade, keyword lucky since anything else is not enough, will stop a single squad. The the three will tear you apart. When that one comes back, your grenade is still on a cooldown. When does the farseer get the Witchblade of Kurnous? I don't remember, it's tier WARLOCK WEAPON right? Warp spiders will destroy one squad of banshees, not four. And the intense micromanagement it takes to do any of those things versus melee spam requires you to get 500 points in multitask. It's more work than DoW 1 and with a hell of a lot less payback for it.

    I'll stick to games that the developers give half a shit about.

    P.S. Platforms are a joke.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CanisAquilusCanisAquilus Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    My plat did really well against the nid in that game we lost to armyguy9000 or whatever for quite a while. Got a shit-ton of kills, let me set up quite a few nice nades, gave akira breathing room.

    Stop throwing a pity party for yourself and just start thinking of counters, godamn. Over the past two weeks or whatever we've still got a 6-1 win ratio.

  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    My plat did really well against the nid in that game we lost to armyguy9000 or whatever for quite a while. Got a shit-ton of kills, let me set up quite a few nice nades, gave akira breathing room.

    Stop throwing a pity party for yourself and just start thinking of counters, godamn. Over the past two weeks or whatever we've still got a 6-1 win ratio.
    You had a platform against a tyranid and it didn't get killed by one of the four hard counters and one soft counter? I can't say I believe that, not if we lost that game.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    My plat did really well against the nid in that game we lost to armyguy9000 or whatever for quite a while. Got a shit-ton of kills, let me set up quite a few nice nades, gave akira breathing room.

    Stop throwing a pity party for yourself and just start thinking of counters, godamn. Over the past two weeks or whatever we've still got a 6-1 win ratio.

    that is because that guy was playing horribly and didn't once get out anything other than AG gaunts. Do you realize how long that thing was up for? It was unreasonable.

    And that is what kills me. Those guys were so bad, canis. They were so bad. They would select all->retreat the second it looked like they wouldn't be able to completely annihilate my ragtag band of space mercenaries, and they still beat us.

  • BlueDestinyBlueDestiny Registered User
    edited August 2009
    Do flamers do damage in a cone? Also, do Tyranids have a sniper unit other than the Zoanthrope?

    Any sufficiently advanced friendship is indistinguishable from magic.
  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Do flamers do damage in a cone? Also, do Tyranids have a sniper unit other than the Zoanthrope?
    Yep and technically the zoan is artillery, but VB warriors are tank snipers.

    Only, you know, neither of them have setup. (Again, Relic, what the hell?)

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • JepheryJephery Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Heavy would like to tell you "Cry some more."

    }
    "Orkses never lose a battle. If we win we win, if we die we die fightin so it don't count. If we runs for it we don't die neither, cos we can come back for annuver go, see!".
  • AlegisAlegis Impeckable Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Not even a sandvich would save the Heavy from tyranids.

    If the heavy were a devestator you have to imagine a 100% accurate sandman wielding scout NPC following every other player around.

  • JepheryJephery Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Put Heavy in Terminator Armor with an Assault Cannon and Power Fist.

    }
    "Orkses never lose a battle. If we win we win, if we die we die fightin so it don't count. If we runs for it we don't die neither, cos we can come back for annuver go, see!".
  • Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity Ask me about Super Propane and Super Propane accessoriesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Alegis wrote: »
    Not even a sandvich would save the Heavy from tyranids.

    If the heavy were a devestator you have to imagine a 100% accurate sandman wielding scout NPC following every other player around.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEn2smJoul8&feature=related

    344B2YT.gifsteamicon48x48.gif Know about web development? I need your help with my professional site!
  • GoombaGoomba __BANNED USERS
    edited August 2009
    Jephery wrote: »
    Heavy would like to tell you "Cry some more."
    I never get to hear what heavies have to say because they're dead before they can finish.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • BethrynBethryn Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Oh fat man, please! You died, as you lived; morbidly obese.

  • RetzinskyRetzinsky Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Here's a couple of serious games for the casting mill. Both on Siccaris Plateau. Me/Shep/DoA. First game was an epic that ended 2-0. We were looking for a nice rest after the trials of that game. We didn't get it. Second game was another epic, ending 11-0 (I think.)

    Nerves now officially frazzled.

  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Starting to grow accustomed to the FC as Marines.

    He's a pretty enjoyable hero. Very tricky to use well unfortunately. Seems like he's a hero you have to tech with. The only armor worth using feels like alacrity: what's up with artificer? Like one extra health every two seconds? Give him some health regeneration that actually counts and I'll consider it. Even the techmarine's armor is more impressive in terms regeneration. Not to mention it gives the the ability to lay mines! You don't have to bring it to Farseer levels, but a boost is needed. Maybe make it more interesting: turn it into an ability like Angry Bits with more focus on regeneration. Faith is the blade of war!

    I still suck pretty bad with him and marines though. All in due time.

    Might consider one of them for a shoutcast Team Klyka-Beth! The replays that Retz just posted above. They're good fun!

  • subediisubedii Registered User regular
    edited August 2009

    On a more serious note, and I know that it might be considered heresy or something mentioning the singleplayer part of the game in this thread, but how long does the campaign last? We've done quite a few missions already, but the stats for our squads are no where near maxed out, and I was just wondering if you ever get to fill out at least a few of those bars.

    Nah, despite the complaints about the multiplayer, the SP is really enjoyable, even more so in co-op, and I have no problems saying that. I just wish that the MP was freaking balanced, because grief, Relic, your game is NOT SUPPOSED TO MAKE ME PINE FOR STARCRAFT 2 INSTEAD.

    To answer your question, I can't give you a rough estimate on how long the campaign takes, I can't remember how long it took me. In general though, using all squads roughly equally I'd get them to around level 18-20 without any need for "grinding". I'd be doing side-missions as a matter of course for the game, usually to protect a resource or if there was a piece of wargear I wanted. It wasn't difficult to reach level 20 for all of them.

    Level 20 is the max level you can reach in this game. Bear in mind, you cannot gain enough points to max out all stats, usually at least one of those bars per squad is going to be heavily underdeveloped, and one other will probably be half or three-quarters developed. Just keep in mind what the roles you want your squads to be filling and develope them accordingly.

    Some squads have what could be called "natural" fits, say Thaddeus is probably at his best when you can develop his health enough to get Aegis of Fury. But in general, as long as you're not solo-ing Primarch difficulty, whatever build works. Melee Tarkus is pretty awesome for example. And you don't need to stick to specific weapon / wargear roles either. Cyrus with a flamethrower and his special ammo upgrade can be a sight to behold.

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