HITSCAN FORTRESS 2 - NO OFF TOPICS

CorporateLogo · July 2009

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BlindPsychic · July 2009

BlindPsychic wrote: »

CommunityFortress.com writer MMZ>eXtine emailed Valve's Team Fortress 2 Lead Designer, Robin Walker, and asked him some interesting questions. His exclusive answers are below:

Q: Much to the delight of fans and customers, Valve has always believed in ensuring the longevity of their titles. Counter-strike's continued popularity is in large part due to the competitive scene that has developed around it, what are Valve's thoughts on the competitive TF2 scene at large?

A: We're excited to see the steady growth of the TF2 competitive scene around the world, and we try to keep track of what we can do to help it. So far, most of that help has taken the form of feature additions to the game, but in the future I think we'd like to get more insight into what else we can do. In particular, I'd like to build some more bridges to organizers within the competitive community, which is something we've tried to do but still continue to have trouble with.

As an example of the kind of work we could do for them, several of the competitive organizations have built external tools, server mods, and scripts to help organize & run their tournaments. We'd like to see if we could move some of those systems directly into the game.

Q: The Team Fortress 2 community has produced many great videos of their own, such as EgadPit's "Soldja Boy", the Scout advertising the Slap Chop, and the countless highlight/training videos. While you recently discussed an upcoming change in demo formats to enable users to easily get videos of exceptional plays, are there also going to be changes in the ways that SourceTV works and how these demos are edited in game?

A: Initially, the new demo system won't affect the SourceTV system, but we'd like to unify them at some point. Demos in the new format can be converted into a robust, "fatter" demo file that won't break, and supports a much greater editing capability than anything we've done before. In the first release the in-game demo viewer will remain similar to the previous version, albeit with full featured time scrubbing capability. In later releases we'll be improving the editing functionality within that viewer.

Q: Obviously a large focus of TF2 and the best way for new players to get involved with the game are the Public servers. These servers usually swing towards easy to understand maps that accommodate large player counts, such as: Dustbowl, Gold Rush, Badwater Basin, 2Fort, and Pipeline. With the vast majority of competitive TF2 matches being played using a 6v6 setup on CP maps such as Badlands, Granary, Well and smaller custom maps, how has this dichotomy affected the map making philosophy of the TF2 design team?

A: The quick summary is that it makes us less efficient, because it almost forces us to divide our workload up into work for each group. It's also disappointing that a couple of our most popular public game modes (Dustbowl style Attack/Defense, and Payload) don't really work at all with small team sizes. Still, we're optimistic as always, and are trying to tackle some of the problems that cause this split. We've got a map where we're trying out areas that modify themselves based on the number of players in the game, in the hopes that both public & competitive players can use it. We've got another new Attack/Defense map that's aimed at shorter, fixed time limit so that competitive teams can play a full round of it within the same timeframe that they play a 5 point CP match currently (unlike Dustbowl/Payload where matches could take over an hour). And we're got new 5 point CP & CTF maps in the works that we know will work for everyone.

Q: This split between the well designed casual public server gameplay and the desires of more competitive gamers has always been a bit of a sore point for TF2. Do you feel like there needs to be an attempt to reconcile the two worlds of TF2 or does the competitive scene need to be accommodated separately from the public scene?

A: Clearly the two groups have different goals, and from that different desires, so our job is to try and find ways to please each of them without hurting the other. While doing that, we try and be as efficient as possible by making changes that serve both. That said, we occasionally do work specifically for one of the groups because the work is valuable enough even without the wide appeal. Examples of that would be things like the Payload game mode for public players, or Tournament mode & its associated server settings for competitive players.

Q: It has been announced that Left 4 Dead will be implementing a match making system where four players can search for a Versus game together, it has also been previously reported that some of the L4D match making system might make its way into Team Fortress 2, are there plans to implement a similar system for Team Fortress 2 featuring 6v6 matches or even the "Highlander" game mode to help promote the competitive pick up game scene?

A: We'd like to use the L4D matchmaking work, but they're still iterating on it right now, so we'll see where they end up. Highlander mode is always something we thought was really neat, but it wasn't clear how valuable it'd be, because public players seem to want more than 9 players per team, and competitive players want less. Since the class limit feature lets you essentially organize it yourself, we thought we'd done enough. If you want extra features or support around that though, feel free to send us your thoughts.

Q: When the random drop system was implemented with the Spy/Sniper update pack there was a backlash against it due to the random nature of unlocking the newly released weapons. There was also speculation that the system could be used to dole out randomized items in the fashion of Diablo and other RPGs. While the ability to unlock the new weapons through achievements satiated the hardcore players, did the backlash negate any such plans to expand the random drop system or is the current implementation and the help it gives new players all that was intended?

A: I think we've learned that the random drop system is only good for some types of things, like the rare cosmetic hats. It's good for delivering items to newer players over time, so they're not swamped with choices when they're starting out, and they're not required to grind achievements to get them once they reach the point where they want to start making strategic choices. For competitive players, it's obviously a bad way to deliver items. At the very least, future packs will allow you to use achievements to get the new items, but we might move to a mode where we just give them to you. As part of our goal of supporting tournaments more, I think we'll probably add better tools for them to control exactly what players can & can't use within matches.

Q: With only two more class movies left to produce and 3 classes waiting to receive unlockable weapons (Soldier, Demo, and Engineer) we are getting closer and closer to the end of announced future content for TF2. Can TF2 fans continue to expect major modifications to the game or will most of the updates be of a smaller nature?

A: We don't really know yet, to be honest. We've still got lots of ideas for what we could do with TF2, but in the short term we'll continue to do what we've done up until now: not plan too far ahead, so we can remain fluid and reactive to the feedback we get from players. We already have a couple of large updates in the works that aren't tied to a specific class, so we'll see what you think of those.

Q: While obviously a smaller portion of the TF2 audience, there is a significant audience of console players who love TF2 and are devoted to it despite the archaic version they are playing. Any comment concerning updates for the Xbox 360 version of TF2?

A: We have a title update in certification right now that will address the server cheating that's going on, and adds a few of the requested settings to run matches. Unfortunately, we still don't have an update on shipping the class packs.

Thanks again to MMZ>eXtine and Robin Walker for their time spent on this interview. Be sure to discuss it on our TF2 forums.

http://communityfortress.com/tf2/news/exclusive-interview-with-valves-robin-walker.php

Copying over

Bruce Forsyth · July 2009

Sniper Rifle = Stand as far back as possible and one-shot kill people with a hitscan weapon. I'd like them to fix the generous headshots the huntsman has, but any sniper using the rifle is a pussy, regardless.

And of all the recently annoying weapons that were added, why are we suddenly bitching about the use of a weapon that has been around for about a year?

Peewi · July 2009

New version of dbheights is interesting.

CommunistCow · July 2009

BlindPsychic wrote: »

CommunistCow wrote: »

BlindPsychic wrote: »

Everyone is ignoring the huge interview I posted

I read it but there was so much about competition play which I don't care about at all. The only interesting tid bit was the vague answer to the 'item drop' topic.

I would have liked some more answers about the next 3 class updates and any plans for feature updates after that.

Q: With only two more class movies left to produce and 3 classes waiting to receive unlockable weapons (Soldier, Demo, and Engineer) we are getting closer and closer to the end of announced future content for TF2. Can TF2 fans continue to expect major modifications to the game or will most of the updates be of a smaller nature?

A: We don't really know yet, to be honest. We've still got lots of ideas for what we could do with TF2, but in the short term we'll continue to do what we've done up until now: not plan too far ahead, so we can remain fluid and reactive to the feedback we get from players. We already have a couple of large updates in the works that aren't tied to a specific class, so we'll see what you think of those.

Yea exactly. That is a political answer right there. They didn't say shit other than "we don't know what we are going to do"

Edit: It would have been nice if they said the next class update will be q4 '09 or that the demo is going to get a different secondary weapon. Something to that effect would have been nice.

CommunistCow · July 2009

You might want to put tf2 in the title somewhere so its easier to find

Icemopper · July 2009

Awwww where's Kris's thread

?

Mars · July 2009

I bet Kris woulda put some effort into the OP too

El Extremo · July 2009

Kris for OP in '09!

Hey You · July 2009

Please PM me any errors on pl_dbheights_b5 you find. Screen shots help me the most. Thank you for your help.

Kaglicious · July 2009

I still haven't tried the new release of heights, maybe that's a sign I need to play more.

Roland_tHTG · July 2009

It is, and the new version is up on jobs

Kris_xK · July 2009

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I knew answer that call from Sales was a huge mistake. I should have just posted my OP and let Tube beat me with it if necessary. Next time....

Also, you people either have far too much faith in me, or just wish to see me crash and burn in spectacular fashion.

BlindPsychic · July 2009

CommunistCow wrote: »

BlindPsychic wrote: »

CommunistCow wrote: »

BlindPsychic wrote: »

Everyone is ignoring the huge interview I posted

I read it but there was so much about competition play which I don't care about at all. The only interesting tid bit was the vague answer to the 'item drop' topic.

I would have liked some more answers about the next 3 class updates and any plans for feature updates after that.

Q: With only two more class movies left to produce and 3 classes waiting to receive unlockable weapons (Soldier, Demo, and Engineer) we are getting closer and closer to the end of announced future content for TF2. Can TF2 fans continue to expect major modifications to the game or will most of the updates be of a smaller nature?

A: We don't really know yet, to be honest. We've still got lots of ideas for what we could do with TF2, but in the short term we'll continue to do what we've done up until now: not plan too far ahead, so we can remain fluid and reactive to the feedback we get from players. We already have a couple of large updates in the works that aren't tied to a specific class, so we'll see what you think of those.

Yea exactly. That is a political answer right there. They didn't say shit other than "we don't know what we are going to do"

Edit: It would have been nice if they said the next class update will be q4 '09 or that the demo is going to get a different secondary weapon. Something to that effect would have been nice.

They've never done either of those things. They only talk about weapons when they're doing post-mortems on updates.

Icemopper · July 2009

Kris_xK wrote: »

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I knew answer that call from Sales was a huge mistake. I should have just posted my OP and let Tube beat me with it if necessary. Next time....

Also, you people either have far too much faith in me, or just wish to see me crash and burn in spectacular fashion.

Post it anyway, we'll all leave this one and come to that one.

BlindPsychic · July 2009

Kazhiim · July 2009

only assholes complain about knockback

you wanna be an asshole? Of course not

take it like a man

Fuga · July 2009

no, fuck the knockback!

TheCrumblyCracker · July 2009

Okay, I will ask for halp one more time before attempting to venture into the Valve official forums.

My TF2 server list refuses to update no matter what I do. I can right click and hit refresh server and nothing changes, its like it took a screenshot of my server list 3 weeks ago and hasn't changed since. I join empty servers that are supposed to be near full. I die inside.

UEAKCrash · July 2009

I haven't played in days.

This needs to be remedied tonight.

UEAKCrash · July 2009

TheCrumblyCracker wrote: »

Okay, I will ask for halp one more time before attempting to venture into the Valve official forums.

My TF2 server list refuses to update no matter what I do. I can right click and hit refresh server and nothing changes, its like it took a screenshot of my server list 3 weeks ago and hasn't changed since. I join empty servers that are supposed to be near full. I die inside.

Are you sure it's not just player count spoofing? Some pubs like to do that.

Cognisseur · July 2009

Fuga wrote: »

no, fuck the knockback!

Man, fuck you. This isn't counter-strike; I don't want to just get pick between a gun that fires fast and does lots of damage or fires slightly faster and does moderate damage.

I like these fun new weapons. I like the complex interaction of lots of elements of combat. Yeah, I'm worried it'll get to the point that newbies won't be able to get the hang of things too well, but as a person whose been here since the start I'm thrilled.

chrono_traveller · July 2009

As knowing nothing at all about the mechanics and such of competitive play, why is 6v6 so popular in competitive play? Is it just a raw numbers thing (i.e. too hard to organize teams of 12)? Is it a carry over from other fps games? From my point of view (completely pub/PA server player) 6v6 is the absolute bare minimum that things become interesting, and doesn't seem like it would as fun to play competitively as higher numbers of players.

Any thoughts?

tofu · July 2009

I think every gun should have knockback.

Kazhiim · July 2009

I mean, the scout dies if you look at him the wrong way and he is all about mobility so letting him affect the mobility of his opponents isn't a bad thing

the pyro is supposed to be the final say in close range combat, if anything airblasting pushes enemies out of his flame range and is therefore a benefit to them

if neither of these excuses work for you, that's okay. "I play scout and pyro" is my other one

No Great Name · July 2009

Oh boy a full server, I can get in some much needed practice before the tourney match

log on

Junction

no more people

heh

BlindPsychic · July 2009

They're not getting rid of the knockback, they're fixing how it operates. I'd be fine if it were more like the airblast than it is now. Basically how it works now is you get hit, you travel back a little bit, then directly up while your ability to move in the air is disabled. This is why right now, when you get shot in the back by the fan you get stunned instead of moved, because the game is pushing you up and taking away your ability to move for a few seconds on every hit.

savooipeerd · July 2009

No Great Name wrote: »

Oh boy a full server, I can get in some much needed practice before the tourney match

log on

Junction

no more people

heh

It was already emptying before goldrush ended, junction just sealed the deal.

xzzy · July 2009

Hey You wrote: »

Please PM me any errors on pl_dbheights_b5 you find. Screen shots help me the most. Thank you for your help.

Roland_tHTG wrote: »

It is, and the new version is up on jobs

This is the best news all day. You should stop the talk about the FAN and go play some v5.

mrflippy · July 2009

I don't care about knockback so much really. Lots and lots of instant kills bother me more I think.

mrflippy · July 2009

BlindPsychic wrote: »

They're not getting rid of the knockback, they're fixing how it operates. I'd be fine if it were more like the airblast than it is now. Basically how it works now is you get hit, you travel back a little bit, then directly up while your ability to move in the air is disabled. This is why right now, when you get shot in the back by the fan you get stunned instead of moved, because the game is pushing you up and taking away your ability to move for a few seconds on every hit.

Ah, maybe that's why sometimes I actually am knocked forward by the FaN.

Like, I will be facing a Scout, he shoots me in the face, and I am knocked towards him. Bizarre.

jothki · July 2009

Kazhiim wrote: »

the pyro is supposed to be the final say in close range combat

Not necessarily. At point blank range a heavy will slaughter a pyro, often even if the pyro gets the drop on him.

xzzy · July 2009

jothki wrote: »

Kazhiim wrote: »

the pyro is supposed to be the final say in close range combat

Not necessarily. At point blank range a heavy will slaughter a pyro, often even if the pyro gets the drop on him.

I'd almost say the heavy will win every single time. Unless the heavy is me, and my framerate is too shitty to track him as he strafes around me.

I have never won a one on one battle with a spun-up heavy who was at full health. You get within flame range of that minigun and you're toast.

TheCrumblyCracker · July 2009

UEAKCrash wrote: »

TheCrumblyCracker wrote: »

Okay, I will ask for halp one more time before attempting to venture into the Valve official forums.

My TF2 server list refuses to update no matter what I do. I can right click and hit refresh server and nothing changes, its like it took a screenshot of my server list 3 weeks ago and hasn't changed since. I join empty servers that are supposed to be near full. I die inside.

Are you sure it's not just player count spoofing? Some pubs like to do that.

No its not player count spoofing

Kazhiim · July 2009

jothki wrote: »

Kazhiim wrote: »

the pyro is supposed to be the final say in close range combat

Not necessarily. At point blank range a heavy will slaughter a pyro, often even if the pyro gets the drop on him.

And a soldier can end a pyro who is unfamiliar with airblasting at close range

it isn't perfect

Mandalorian Rooster · July 2009

What did I miss? Why is knockback an issue? Scouts are god damn pansies, just shoot them.

donhonk · July 2009

Oh gosh, I had an OP still. NEXT TIME I WONT FORGET, I probably will but anyway.

mrflippy · July 2009

Mandalorian Rooster wrote: »

What did I miss? Why is knockback an issue? Scouts are god damn pansies, just shoot them.

They're too fast.

Kazhiim · July 2009

maybe you should use natascha then

I would not object to jarate slowing down characters by some speed

I could not imagine running fast while covered in pissjar

Zek · July 2009

1v1 battles with Heavies are what the Axtinguisher is for.

And the FaN is annoying to others, just like Scouts as a whole, but it's not overpowered at all. It's relatively a even tradeoff now. I still love the Scattergun because unlike the FaN which requires you to take your 2 shots and then run away like a little bitch, with the Scattergun you can charge right the fuck in and kill that dude the moment you smell weakness. You need a good eye for opportunity and to evaluate whether or not you can take him, but people leave themselves open to a frontal attack all the time. A quick FaN kill requires a perfect setup and a safe escape route - the Scattergun will kill anybody, anywhere.

BlindPsychic · July 2009

TheCrumblyCracker wrote: »

UEAKCrash wrote: »

TheCrumblyCracker wrote: »

Okay, I will ask for halp one more time before attempting to venture into the Valve official forums.

My TF2 server list refuses to update no matter what I do. I can right click and hit refresh server and nothing changes, its like it took a screenshot of my server list 3 weeks ago and hasn't changed since. I join empty servers that are supposed to be near full. I die inside.

Are you sure it's not just player count spoofing? Some pubs like to do that.

No its not player count spoofing

try deleting your clientregistry.blob in the steam folder

Penny Arcade

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