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Warhammer Fantasy Battles - My plastic men can beat up your plastic men

ErandusErandus Registered User
edited September 2009 in Critical Failures
WARHAMMER: THE GAME OF FANTASY BATTLES

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Aren't Toy Soldiers for Nerds?

Yeah, but nerds have money and toy soldiers are more awesome than most other things you can waste your money on. Warhammer refers to a fantasy setting and a number of distinct tabletop and computer games. This thread is concerned with the original, a tabletop miniatures wargame.
Wikipedia wrote:
Warhammer: The Game of Fantasy Battles, formerly Warhammer Fantasy Battle and often abbreviated to Warhammer, is a tabletop wargame created by Games Workshop and the origin of the Warhammer Fantasy setting.

The game is played with 'regiments' of fantasy miniatures. It uses stock fantasy races such as humans, elves, dwarfs, undead, orcs, goblins, vampires, as well as some more unusual types such as lizardmen, skaven, etc. Each race has its own unique strengths and flaws; Wood Elves, for example, have some of the most powerful archers in the game but have poor overall defense.

Since first appearing in 1983, Warhammer has been periodically updated and re-released with changes to the gaming system and army lists. The current official version is the seventh edition, released on 9 September 2006.
In a nutshell, each player collects an army of Citadel miniatures. Then, using the Warhammer rulebook as a guideline, they fight epic battles against their fellow generals. Dice (like you'd find in almost any board game) are used to determine success and failure: to decide whether an arrow hits its target, or whether a magical power works, for example. Each game is played, not on a regular 'board' but in a special gaming area where models are not confined to 'squares' but are free to move as their controller wishes. Because Warhammer is not played on a set game board, tape measures or rulers are used to see how far a miniature can move - a horse can run faster than a stumpy-legged Dwarf, after all.
Setting

The Warhammer story, or background, is vast. It begins tens of thousands of years before the current day with the Old Ones: beings of vast power that sailed between worlds on a sea of infinite potential (known as the Warp, Aethyr, or Realm of Chaos). Armed with incomprehensible techno-magicks and knowledge, the Old Ones raised the races of the Warhammer World from barbarism, teaching elf and dwarf how to draw upon the Realm of Chaos to shape extra-dimensional potential into physical forms… or magic, and bestowing upon them the joys of enlightened civilization. This golden age ended too soon, however, as the Old Ones were exterminated or driven away by things from the Aethyr: the daemons of Chaos and Ruinous Powers native to that Realm. Given form and purpose by the Warp-reflected flaws of mortals, these daemons invaded the Warhammer World, ending the age of Law and advancement brought about by the Old Ones. Many millennia later, the children of the Old Ones continue the battle gainst Chaos.

It is important to note that there are many, varied, implementations of Warhammer lore; none are more "right" or "official" than others. To put it quite simply, according to GW: THERE IS NO WARHAMMER CANON. Players are free to pick, choose, and research the bits they like.

WHERE DID GAMES WORKSHOP COME UP WITH THIS STUFF?

Warhammer's imagery and style are influenced heavily by gritty, classic fantasy authors, such as Michael Moorcock, Robert E. Howard, and H.P. Lovecraft, as well as real-world history and a bit of Tolkien. Designers also list influences such as Terry Gilliam, Black Adder, and Monty Python. The Warhammer world is a playground-like amalgam of everything from Napoleonic gun lines, to sanity-blasting tentacled horrors, to halfings and their giant cocks (depictions of a large rooster that serves as a provincial symbol for the little folk). Those interested in learning more might be urged to pick up some of these older books; Warhammer’s roots are clearly evident in Conan, Elric, and Martin Luther.


THE WARHAMMER WORLD

The unnamed (to its inhabitants) Warhammer world roughly resembles our own. Maps can be found here. At the “heart” of the known setting is the Old World, analogous to Earth’s Europe. Here one finds the human nations of the Empire, Bretonnia, Kislev, brutal Nosrca, Tilea, and Estalia as well as the remnants of the Dwarfs’ ancient empire beneath the mountains. Scattered pockets of wood elves (both civilized and less so…) share lands with the Empire and Bretonnia. To the south, past the rogue settlements of the Border Princes and orc-infested Badlands, lie trackless deserts. Cut through by the great River Mortis, the ancient, dusty realm of Nehekkarha lies not-as-silent as it should be, duly earning its title as the Land of the Dead. Past here, one finds the mysterious human nation of Araby, rife with proscribed cults and unknown magic, with the dark jungles of the Southlands engulfing the rest of the southern continent. Nothing but sun-mad orcs and the remains of the Old Ones’ world live here.

To the east lie the dead plains of the Dark Lands, choked with the fumes of Chaos Dwarf industry. Yet further east, in the Mountains of Mourn, are the Ogre Kingdoms. These inhospitable vaults are dotted with the scattered ruins of forgotten civilizations and shaggy prehistoric beasts, pierced in the south by the Silver Road, the sole not-so-safe route between the lands of the Old World and mysterious Far East. Of the kingdoms of Ind, Cathay, and Nippon little is known… other than that the presence of Chaos.

In the middle of the Great Ocean hides Ulthuan, the last great holding of the Asur, first and favorite children of the Old Ones. This magic and mist enshrouded isle contains the kingdoms of the High Elves, including mystical Avelorn and stately Eataine; recently opened to outsiders by the Phoenix King Finubar. Unknown to most of the Warhammer world, Ulthuan is of critical importance. In ancient times, the elves created a vortex of Chaos energy, woven of the structure of the island itself. This vortex drained the Chaos-stuff feeding daemonic legions after the fall of the Old Ones, allowing the elves to fight back and forestall the end of the world. Were this vortex to ever fail, Ulthuan would sink beneath the waves, heralding the final invasion of Chaos.

West of Ulthuan one finds the brooding forests and icy mountains of Naggaroth, the Land of Chill. Now refuge of the Druchii, exiled for millennia from Ulthuan, this is a land as cruel as its inhabitants. To the south is fabled Lustria, where the seat of the Old Ones lies rotting in the jungles. Overseen by things blindly following the edicts of the lost Old Ones, many attempt to enter these jungles to secure the gold and riches within. A few even make it back.

Finally, at the very ends of the Warhammer world lie madness and infinity. The collapsed interdimensional gates of the Old Ones spill Aethyr into the material, and thoughts of mortals into the Realm of Chaos. Surrounding the northern pole gate are the Chaos Wastes, lands of blended Warp and Material, realms of madness, eternal war, and the whims of the Chaos Gods. No one can leave this place entirely untouched by Chaos.

Armies: Who's killin' who

Games Workshop's Warhammer Page
Beasts of Chaos
Hidden in the darkest places of the world are the Beasts of Chaos. Beastmen, Minotaurs, Centaurs, and other spawn of the Dark Gods, these things are Warhammer’s version of the archetypal medieval daemonic satyr or beast in the woods. Beastmen were once human, but became the true and favored children of the Dark Gods when the Warp Gates fell, spilling pure Aethyr into the world. They’re still closely linked too; often a human baby is born horned and hoofed. These turnskins are either killed by Witch Hunters and priests, or taken by insane but loving parents into the woods, where they’re left for the Beasts.

Bretonnia
A thousand years younger than the Empire, the Bretonni tribe became the nation of Bretonnia under the guidance of Giles le Breton. Eschewing the philosophy and science of the Empire in favor of mysticism and feudalism, Bretonnians rely on the martial strength of their lordly knights in battle. They follow the edicts of the Lady, a goddess of suspect origin, but sometimes uphold her message of honor and mercy. A curious blend of pre-revolution France, English fighting styles, and Le Morte d’Arthur, the Bretonnians are a bit of an anachronism compared to the rest of the Old World.

Dark Elves
Warhammer’s version of the Melnibonean archetype, the Druchii have little to do with D&D dark elves or Tolkien’s fading perfect beings. Inheritors of the Phoenix King’s crown by way of heredity, the dark elves followed Malekith, son of the first Phoenix King, into exile after he was driven from Ulthuan by conspirators. The Druchii respect strength above all, and solely worship Khaine, the elven god of war. Taking a cue from the original sorcerers and their Chaos vortex, the Druchii do not fear Chaos, but seek to bind it to their will and purpose. Some would say this has corrupted them as a race and nation, but the dark elves don’t (officially) worship the Dark Gods- just see them as a means to an end.

Daemons of Chaos
At the heart of the Ream of Chaos lie the architects of the Old Ones’ fall. Born of fear and rage, ambition and despair, the most primal of these beings are the most powerful; the Great Gods of Chaos, four brothers who would see the end of the world. First among them is great Khorne, lord of all that is war, hatred, and bloodshed. There are few the martially-minded god hates so much as his sibling, the passionate Slaanesh. Patron of excess and indulgence, Slaanesh is least amongst the Chaos gods but popular with depraved cults of the Empire. Jovial grandfather Nurgle seeks to enrich the world’s despair by blessing mortals with virulent plagues and pestilences. Finally, of primary import to WAR is Tzeentch, the Architect of Fate. Tzeentch brings hope. Hope of change without reason or balance; Tzeentch is a manipulator, plotter, and sorcerer. His touch brings ambition and madness.

At times, the powers of Chaos put their differences aside and send splinters of their selves into the material world; where the skin of reality is thin, daemons can step into the mortal realms and fulfill the urges of their patron.

Dogs of War
As an army, Dogs of War include everything from Tilean pikes and crossbowmen to suicidal Dwarf pirates to an exiled Asur prince and his dragon. This has allowed GW to release a number of unique and interesting models over the years, often from nations that don’t warrant their own armies. Araby, Tilea, Estalia, and rogue elements of other armies have all been detailed.

Dwarfs
As those following WAR are probably aware, Warhammer dwarfs are the Nordic and Tolkien archetype taken to an extreme. More obsessive, drunk, and gold-hungry than most settings’ dwarfs, these guys are a major reason for the success of the Empire, having taught humans ironworking, gunpowder, and numerous other advances. The friendship between the dwarf kings and Empire is one of the few true alliances in the Warhammer world. The dwarfs once held a mighty empire running the length and breadth of the Old World. A mysterious cataclysm befell them many years before the founding of the Empire, followed by battles against the greenskins, then a costly war against the elves known as the “War of Vengeance”. These events saw the dwarfs greatly reduced in power, but through sheer spite and stubbornness, the race continues to survive.

The Empire
The point-of-view for most of the Warhammer World (and setting for WFRP), the Empire is an especially mad take on the 16th century, pre-Protestant Holy Roman Empire. The Empire learned metalworking and industry from the dwarfs, and were taught magic by the elves. The last true hopes of civilization against Chaos, Imperial armies combine gunlines, professional soldiers, knights, artillery, and magic to defeat their foes. Founded by Sigmar two and a half millennia before the current game period, Imperials now worship their founder as a god. It was Sigmar who forged the first true alliance with the dwarfs, saving their High King from capture by a superior band of orcs. For this, Sigmar was granted the hammer Ghal-Maraz, an heirloom dwarf runic hammer (and the titular weapon for the setting)… which is probably still carried by Karl-Franz, the current Emperor.

High Elves
First experiment of the Old Ones, these ancient and lawful beings taught the elves their magic, art, song, and civilization. Unlike other experiments, elven history vaguely remembers the Old Ones, giving them a racial memory and learning that vastly exceeds all others. Physically resistant to Chaos, the elves still suffer the moral and mental effects, especially when succumbing to their own arrogance and passions. High elf culture is extremely rigid and controlled because of this and they see themselves as the protectors of the world, justifying their near-fascism and unchallenged control of major sea-routes. Unlike the Tolkien archetype, the Asur are warriors and imperialists, with a strong fascination in the arts of warfare and bloodshed.

Lizardmen
During their time elevating the races of the Warhammer world, the Old Ones also created servants to help them with their work. After their fall, these servants blindly continued the Old Ones’ inscrutable plans, carrying on adjustment of the planet itself and battling Chaos in all its forms. The mighty Slaan, beings of immense Aethyric and psychic ability, interpret the Old Ones plans, while the Skinks act as their agents. Saurus warriors emerge from spawning pools, ready to defend their Lustrian homes, while Kroxigor and other prehistoric beasts are used for industry and war.

Ogre Kingdoms
One of the final experiments of the Old Ones, Ogres are among the most physically robust and resistant to Chaos. Not completely resistant, however, as an event early in their development lead them to worship of an entity known as the Great Maw, and granted the race an all-consuming hunger to fuel their massive bodies. Ogres have no allegiance to Chaos, though, nor hatred of it, often showing up as Dogs of War or mercenaries in the armies of humans, Orcs, Chaos, and anyone else willing to pay a bit of coin or bucket of stew.

Greenskins
Mushrooms? Monsters? Degenerate barbarians? However one classifies Orcs and Goblins, the only certainty is that they’re as certain as death and taxes. Little more complex than human two-year olds in massively tough and muscled bodies (or quick and wiry in the case of Goblins) greenskins enjoy nothing more than scrappin’ and fightin’. Dey’s ded ‘ard too, and dem Gobbos is pretty kunnin’ too, tho dey’s a buncha weedy gits. All ‘oomies need to know is dat da Waaagh! can’t be stopped and yous gonna get yer ‘ed bashed right in!

Skaven
There is no such thing as skaven. Just because you’ve seen evidence of rat-like beastmen doesn’t mean there’s some sort of intelligent Chaos beats below all the cities of the world, with technology that surpasses the Empire and a master plan to rule the ruins of civilization. That’s ridiculous.

Tomb Kings
Before the time of Sigmar, the first true civilization of Man arose in the deserts south of the Old World. Living amongst architecture strangely reminiscent of both Lustrian ruins and the monuments of the high elves, the people of ancient Nehekhara considered themselves the favored children of the gods. Over time, they came to fear and worship death above all else, believing their lives were mere preparation for a glorious and shining afterlife; much like the real world’s ancient Egyptians. For one Nehekharan, however, the afterlife was not enough; a brother of the Priest-King of mighty Khemri, this man sought eternal life and coveted the lands of all Nehekhara to be his shining paradise. After capturing and torturing the secrets of magic from stranded Druchii sailors, this man developed the science that would one day be known as Necromancy; power over the dead and death itself. Distilling an elixir from human blood, he was able to prolong his life, eventually usurping his brother and taking Khemri as his own. Eventually, the other Priest-Kings united and drove him into the desert, where he passed beyond the realm of the living, but did not truly die.

In his bitterness at being driven out, this man, known as the Accursed One to Nehekharans and He Who Shall Not Be Named to modern Arabyans, polluted the headwaters of the River Mortis, the very backbone of life in Nehekhara. Not content with merely bringing the ancient nation to its knees, he then attempted to cast a single spell that would awaken the entire nation from death and bind them to his will, creating an eternal army to rule the world with. Though he cast the spell and tore generations of Nehekharans from their graves, he was mysteriously interrupted at the peak of the spell, losing control of his would-be slaves. The Tomb Kings and their entombed soldiers were not put to rest, however, and have since resumed the activities of their lives, protecting their dusty homes from invaders and warring against each other. All of these undead, however, nurse a hatred for he who tore them from the afterlife, and the dry desert winds carry their whispers of the Great Necromancer’s hated name; Nagash.

Vampire Counts
As with most undead in the Warhammer world, the vampires have roots in old Nehekhara. When Nagash was driven from Khemri by an alliance of kings, samples of his Elixir of Life and notes were captured and taken as spoils. In the city-state of Lahmia, the queen and her court drank of the Elixir and continued Nagash’s experiments. Soon these depraved nobles learned to sustain themselves indefinitely, not just by consuming the Elixir, but by drawing the very essence of life from living beings. Their souls sustained thusly, their bodies became strong and fast, driven by their own willpower and able to grasp and manipulate the Aethyr. These beings, known later as vampires, were eventually discovered by the Priest-Kings of other cities and driven out, later allying with, then fleeing from, Nagash.

In the modern Warhammer world, the vampires are often split along lines of bloodline and creed, following common archetypes of vampires from all of fantasy stories. Some have infiltrated the nobility of the Empire, counts of the blighted province of Sylvania. Some vampires are physically powerful, while others great sorcerers and necromancers. Some are affected by curses laid upon them by Nagash for their escape and cannot tolerate sunlight or holy relics. All are selfish and driven to make use of their long lives; whether through study, survival, or conquest.

Warriors of Chaos
Mortals who flock to the standards of the Dark Gods can consist of the disillusioned, the corrupt, and the insane. Some are refugees from the civilized nations of the Old World, while the bulk come from tribes of corrupted Norse. Living in the ever-changing wastes beyond Norsca and Kislev, bands of these warriors dedicate themselves to the Gods of Chaos, fighting for glory, the capricious favor of the gods, and the ultimate gift of Daemonhood. At times, a great champion will arise, sometimes dedicated to a single god, others loyal to all Chaos as a pantheon. These champions will then sweep from the north at the head of a vast horde, encased in dark iron armor and wielding weapons of madness and gifts of mutation from their gods.

Wood Elves
Long before the birth of Sigmar, the elves withdrew from their extensive colonies in the Old World. Caught between an unwinnable war against the dwarfs and civil war led by Malekith, the Asur were forced to the defensive. Not all the elven colonists followed the Phoenix King’s call for retreat, however. Small pockets of elves remained behind, in particular the colonists who settled in an ancient and dark forest known as Athel Loren. One of the most ancient and untouched woods of the world, Loren is a living, breathing entity, jealous of its borders and willing and able to brutally protect itself. Allied with the forest, the former elven colonists, called Asraii have returned to many of their rustic roots, favoring bow and bronze spear, eschewing advanced metalworking and armor. Wood elves owe more to medieval legends of forest spirits than Tolkien’s elves; they’re feral and vengeful, uncaring for little but defending the forest.
Crunchy Stuff: Links and Books

A guide to Warhammer books

Current Army Book Releases
Erandus wrote:
Books who's most recent release is their 6th ed edition:

Tomb Kings (jan 2003)
Beasts of Chaos (aug 2003)
Bretonnia (feb 2004)
Ogre Kingdoms (jan 2005)
Wood Elves (aug 2005)
Dwarfs (mar 2006)

Books who's most recent release is their 7th ed edition:

Orcs & Goblins (oct 2006)
Empire (jan 2007)
High Elves (nov 2007)
Vampire Counts (mar 2008)
Daemons of Chaos (may 2008)
Dark Elves (aug 2008)
Warriors of Chaos (nov 2008)
Lizardmen (feb 2009)

Books likely to be released next:

Skaven (july/aug? 2009)
Beasts of Chaos (nov? 2009)
Tomb Kings (early 2010?)

Skaven and Beasts have been confirmed by GW to be next, and in that order. No dates are confirmed yet. The next 3 releases are based on GW's usual pace of fantasy releases. Tomb Kings as the release after BoC is an educated guess based on the fact that retailers are no longer able to restock some TK models, which suggests they are either being repackaged or redone, and is a good indicator of the book being in line for update.

Books on the horizon and general guesses as to order and dates:

Ogre Kingdoms (spring 2010)
Bretonnia (summer 2010)

Bretonnia is "likely” to go last, as they are the strongest of those three remaining books. Dwarfs, Wood Elves and Ogre Kingdoms are technically 6th edition books, but were written “with 7th edition in mind”, so don’t quite count. Except for Ogres, who sucked ass even when they were new.

Links and Where to Buy
Where can I buy this stuff online?
http://www.games-workshop.com/ - The main site. Not the cheapest place to get minis, but if you can't find it anywhere else...

http://www.forgeworld.com/ - Beautiful resin models to add spiff to any army. The place to go if you love your hobby, but hate your wallet.

http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk - Consistent discounts, extra discounts on 5+ 'army bundles', free international shipping, great selection. Used as #1 seller by myself and several other users.

http://www.chaosorc.com - Good discounts (particularly on large items), cheap shipping. patchy selection but carries lots of older products and non-GW stuff. Some items aren't clearly labeled differently from older versions, but they're a good alternative on specific items.

http://thewarstore.com/ - Excellent selection, good discounts, good service. 20% off normal prices, 25% off orders of $400 (adjusted price) or more. $3.95 shipping flat rate (free on certain orders I believe.)

http://www.bartertown.com/ - The place to go when looking for like-minded people with models for trade and sale. I just picked up a Forgeworld Warhound Titan for half-off from someone who needed to raise cash for a ring.

Other places of Note:
http://www.warseer.com - Currently about the biggest GW-related forum on the net.

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/ - Space Marines, and high fashion (not really)

http://www.the-waaagh.com - Orks orks orks orks! Jobs a gud'un boss.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/ - They used to be cool. Kinda fallen on hard times.

http://www.the-warforge.com - Ein's modelling and converting site. Totally slipped this into the OP because I could.

And because you need a way to cart all your wonderful new toys around, here are a couple recommendations beyond what you can get from GW:

Sabol Army Transports A little expensive, but I use them exclusively, because of the quite reasonable international shipping price, and mostly for the fact that you can custom cut the foam trays to fit your models. Also available from the War Store, and BattleWagon Bits.

Figures in Comfort A wide range of precut foam trays, and carrying cases for whatever your needs.

OP shamelessly plagiarized from Morskittar.

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Erandus on
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Posts

  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Continuation from old thread:
    Ianator wrote: »
    Orc dude again. I don't have any boars except for two HQs (a Warboss and I think a Shaman) and I'm already using almost all my Boyz. It also looks as if I'll be going against High Elves, so I'm hesitant to add any more Goblins for fear of, um... Fear? I could use some more Spider Riders though, should I ditch the Spear Chukkas and/or Doom Divers for another unit?

    Goblins are really pretty much a fanatic delivery system, so fear isn't a big deal. Also, your goblin unit will likely outnumber any elf unit that you'll see, which helps to mitigate the effects of fear to a point. Swapping to them or not really depends on what the freed up points can get you. How many points do you save swapping 24ish boyz for 24ish gobbos and some fanatics?

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CorporateLogoCorporateLogo The toilet knows how I feelRegistered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Plagiarizing OPs? Shameful.

    Lizardmen keep trying to suck me in, but I don't want to start a new army before I finish my current mounted O&G list.

    Do not have a cow, mortal.

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  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Plagiarizing OPs? Shameful.

    I'm at work and I'm lazy, sue me. :D
    Lizardmen keep trying to suck me in, but I don't want to start a new army before I finish my current mounted O&G list.

    Everything I read about them points to good things. Balanced, flexible, fair.. More armies need to fit into the mold cast by the new Lizardmen and WoC. I see DE as pushing the limit of what an army should be capable of.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Remember how Flamers can Stand and Shoot?
    Remember they're also Skirmishers?

    Guess what those two add up to: 360 degree SnS with d6 shots per. D:
    It's just a shame you can't take them in units of nine any more...:P

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • A steak!A steak! Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited June 2009
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    Remember how Flamers can Stand and Shoot?
    Remember they're also Skirmishers?

    Guess what those two add up to: 360 degree SnS with d6 shots per. D:
    It's just a shame you can't take them in units of nine any more...:P

    They're ridiculous. The only time I've actually won against them was when I charged them with a unit of BG that was babysat by a Master with Ring of Darkness. Not so hot with BS 2. I threw two Chillwinds a turn at the other unit to keep it down, and finally got a charge with a Manti to finish it off.

  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    Remember how Flamers can Stand and Shoot?
    Remember they're also Skirmishers?

    Guess what those two add up to: 360 degree SnS with d6 shots per. D:
    It's [strike]just a shame[/strike] good for game store murder rates you can't take them in units of nine any more...:P

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • IanatorIanator Delightfully mediocre! Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    In case it was missed before, my current list:
    Orcs and Goblins, 998pts

    Hero(G): Black Orc Big Boss
    Black Orc Big Boss w/ heavy armor, shield, Martog's Best Basha

    Hero: Goblin Shaman
    Lv2 Goblin Shaman w/ Wolf mount, Staff of Buduumm

    Core: Orc Boyz
    24 Boyz w/ moar choppaz, full command

    Core: Orc Boyz
    24 Boyz w/ shields, full command

    Core: Spider Riders
    7 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Special: Goblin Spear Chukkas
    2 Spear Chukkas

    Special: Black Orcs
    15 Black Orcs w/ shields

    My 'Ard Boyz are 174 as-is, so I could fit a 30-strong Night Gobbos unit and load it with fanatics. Also, how often are Nets worth it? It looks like they'd help with the whole Tarpit profile.

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  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Nets depends on who you're playing against, really. You'll get mixed reviews depending on who you ask. Some people swear by them, some don't bother. I think experimentation is the only way to really find out.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • DraevenDraeven Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    i could see nets doing very well against highelfs , since in general they are all st3. So that might actualy give your T3 goblins a chance to live.

    Morskitter wrote "Spikes, choppas, tentacles, magic? Can't hold a candle to Sergeant Pimp here."

  • IanatorIanator Delightfully mediocre! Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Gonna try out nets then. Change the Chukkas for five more Riders with bows plus one from the other unit aaand...
    Orcs and Goblins, 999pts

    Hero(G): Black Orc Big Boss
    Black Orc Big Boss w/ heavy armor, shield, Martog's Best Basha

    Hero: Goblin Shaman
    Lv2 Goblin Shaman w/ Wolf mount, Staff of Buduumm

    Core: Orc Boyz
    24 Boyz w/ moar choppaz, full command

    Core: Night Goblins
    30 Night Gobbos w/ nets, 2 Fanatics

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Special: Black Orcs
    15 Black Orcs w/ shields

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  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    If you drop one orc, two night gobs, and your orc champ, or some combination of the above, can you get your general mounted on a boar?

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • IanatorIanator Delightfully mediocre! Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Only need to drop the Boyz' boss.
    Orcs and Goblins, 1000pts

    Hero(G): Black Orc Big Boss
    Black Orc Big Boss w/ heavy armor, shield, Boar mount, Martog's Best Basha

    Hero: Goblin Shaman
    Lv2 Goblin Shaman w/ Wolf mount, Staff of Buduumm

    Core: Orc Boyz
    24 Boyz w/ moar choppaz, standard, musician

    Core: Night Goblins
    30 Night Gobbos w/ nets, 2 Fanatics

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Special: Black Orcs
    15 Black Orcs w/ shields

    Should I drop the Standard+Musician instead?

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  • SJSJ Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Old OP was better, etc, etc

  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    I'll write a new one when I'm not feeling so lazy.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • A steak!A steak! Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited June 2009
    From looking at Orcs, if I had to make a 2k army I'm pretty sure I'd mount 4 Heroes on Chariots, take 4 Pump Wagons and try to WAAAGH! my way to victory. The Pump Wagon might be totally unpredictable, but 2d6 S4 impact hits looks nice.

  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Pump wagons are my favorite theoretical unit in the game.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • JackmodeJackmode Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Erandus wrote: »
    Pump wagons are my favorite theoretical unit in the game.

    No love for the Halfling Hot-Pot Catapult?

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • jackisrealjackisreal Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Going back to the conversation about the Hydra from the end of the last thread--

    I'm a Dark Elf player who doesn't use one, largely because it doesn't appeal to me, but also because I hear it's too good and I don't want to (completely) rape my friends. I've been having a lot of trouble cracking armor though (Empire knights with a warrior priest, specifically). To try and overcome 1+ armor I've run:

    -14 Black Guard, 7 wide, with ASF Banner, Crimson Death (S6 Halberd), and a Master wielding Soulrender (Great weapon, -1 AS). This unit failed to beat 5 Empire knights with a Warrior Priest.
    -14 Executioners, 7 wide, with Death Hag wielding ASF Banner. Same thing.

    I'm thinking of trying to use the unit that I used to take out chariots at 2,000+:
    5 Cold One Knights, and a Dreadlord with a Hydra Blade (+D3 attacks) Potion of Strength (+3 Strength for one round) and Pendant of Khaeleth. Getting the charge on other cavalry is tough with them, though.

    A Cauldron of Blood seems like it could help, but i'd probably have to devote more resources to protecting it from fast cav/etc. Can it really move?

    I'm torn because it seems like the Hydra performs a necessary function in the Dark Elf list, it just does its job a bit too well.

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  • Ultros64Ultros64 Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    What's a good combination of runes for a CC Thane?

    It doesn't matter what I say, as long as I sing with inflection
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Ultros64 wrote: »
    What's a good combination of runes for a CC Thane?
    Hmmm... When you say "CC Thane" do you mean a line fighter, up there with the Ironbreakers, or the prise at the bottom of the unit of Quarrellers?

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • Ultros64Ultros64 Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    Ultros64 wrote: »
    What's a good combination of runes for a CC Thane?
    Hmmm... When you say "CC Thane" do you mean a line fighter, up there with the Ironbreakers, or the prise at the bottom of the unit of Quarrellers?

    Front line fighter up there with the Ironbreakers - a meaty tornado of stunty limbs and axes.

    EDIT: Wait a second. Can you put runes on a Crossbow?

    It doesn't matter what I say, as long as I sing with inflection
  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    This just in: While Skaven are the next Fantasy army release, there is "something" else for fantasy coming out before them.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Ultros64 wrote: »
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    Ultros64 wrote: »
    What's a good combination of runes for a CC Thane?
    Hmmm... When you say "CC Thane" do you mean a line fighter, up there with the Ironbreakers, or the prize at the bottom of the unit of Quarrellers?

    Front line fighter up there with the Ironbreakers - a meaty tornado of stunty limbs and axes.

    EDIT: Wait a second. Can you put runes on a Crossbow?

    First, yes you can put runes on a crossbow, but then it stops being a crossbow and becomes a magical hand weapon, just like if you put runes on a great weapon. Sorry.

    Anyway, line thanes want to be as tough as possible, so...
    Gromril armour, shield, Rune of Stone, Rune of Iron, Rune of Preservation.
    And he needs to be able to deal with what his unit can't, so...
    Axe with Rune of Might and Rune of Fire.
    Since we've got a few points left...
    Ring with Rune of the Furnace.
    Total 70pts.

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • DayspringDayspring the Phoenician Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Erandus wrote: »
    This just in: While Skaven are the next Fantasy army release, there is "something" else for fantasy coming out before them.
    Hmmmm.
    How would a 40k Apocalypse style release work for Fantasy, do you think? The main problem I can see you already get huge things like dragons and shit running around in WH, and extra big toys is one of the main draws of Apoc.

  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS regular
    edited June 2009
    Okay here's my 1000 point version of my Lizardmen Army almost done:
    LIZARDMEN ARMY
    1000 Points

    HEROES
    Saurus Scar-Veteran(General) - Light Armor, The Maiming Shield, Carnosaur Pendant - 135

    Skink Priest - Level 2 Wizard, Dispell Scroll - 125


    CORE

    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204
    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204

    Skink Skirmishers(10) - Javelins and Shields - 80
    Skinks(10) - Kroxigor - 105

    SPECIAL

    Terradon Riders(3) - 90

    Total
    943
    I have 57 points left over, should I A) Buy a Skink Chief, B) Get another unit of 11 Skinks or C) Get my Priest the Diadem of Power and buy an extra Terradon Rider

    SIG.gif
  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    I would probably dump the 10 skinks accompanying the Krox and just buy some more Krox.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS regular
    edited June 2009
    Works for me. I love the new Krox models so much

    SIG.gif
  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    standards on boyz tend to be 100 VP that likes to run off the table

    STEAM
    Skayel wrote:
    One time, I had a friend over to play a bit of Red Alert on my LAN. During the game he said he needed to go to the bathroom, so we paused it. After about 10 minutes of wondering where the hell he went, I get up and go to check on him.

    Turns out he was trying to screw my dog.
    Once I was taking a poop at a restaurant and a kid crept underneath the door into my stall. I let out a big fart and then he threw up all over the floor in front of me and I just stared at him.
  • IanatorIanator Delightfully mediocre! Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    I kinda figured. Final list:
    Orcs and Goblins, 1000pts

    Hero(G): Black Orc Big Boss
    Black Orc Big Boss w/ heavy armor, shield, Martog's Best Basha

    Hero: Goblin Shaman
    Lv2 Goblin Shaman w/ Wolf mount, Staff of Buduumm

    Core: Orc Boyz
    24 Boyz w/ moar choppaz, Boss

    Core: Night Goblins
    30 Night Gobbos w/ nets, 2 Fanatics

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Core: Spider Riders
    6 Spider Riders w/ shortbows

    Special: Black Orcs
    15 Black Orcs w/ shields

    Now to make up a list at 2250...

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  • DraevenDraeven Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Try a unit of cold ones for heavy hitting power, this might be what you need to take down that unit of Armor 1+ guys, but would agree that DE or bolt thrower are lacking in the armor breaking unit.

    Morskitter wrote "Spikes, choppas, tentacles, magic? Can't hold a candle to Sergeant Pimp here."

  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    If you're not doing the hydra, CoKs or bolt throwers are your best bet.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • zenpotatozenpotato Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    Ultros64 wrote: »
    What's a good combination of runes for a CC Thane?
    Hmmm... When you say "CC Thane" do you mean a line fighter, up there with the Ironbreakers, or the prise at the bottom of the unit of Quarrellers?

    The classic Thane of Pain:

    Sheild
    Rune of Stone
    Rune of Fury
    Rune of Cleaving
    Master Rune of Swiftness

  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS regular
    edited June 2009
    Okay with the Krox I am sitting at 1003 points. I'm pretty certain my shop wouldn't care if I was 3 points over so it looks like this is my final list:
    LIZARDMEN ARMY
    1000 Points

    HEROES
    Saurus Scar-Veteran(General) - Light Armor, The Maiming Shield, Carnosaur Pendant - 135

    Skink Priest - Level 2 Wizard, Dispell Scroll - 125


    CORE

    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204
    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204

    Skink Skirmishers(10) - Javelins and Shields - 80

    SPECIAL

    Terradon Riders(3) - 90
    Kroxigor(3) - 165

    Total 1003

    SIG.gif
  • EterenalEterenal Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Blankspace wrote: »
    Okay with the Krox I am sitting at 1003 points. I'm pretty certain my shop wouldn't care if I was 3 points over so it looks like this is my final list:
    LIZARDMEN ARMY
    1000 Points

    HEROES
    Saurus Scar-Veteran(General) - Light Armor, The Maiming Shield, Carnosaur Pendant - 135

    Skink Priest - Level 2 Wizard, Dispell Scroll - 125


    CORE

    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204
    Saurus Warriors(16) - Spears, Standard Bearer - 204

    Skink Skirmishers(10) - Javelins and Shields - 80

    SPECIAL

    Terradon Riders(3) - 90
    Kroxigor(3) - 165

    Total 1003

    Looks like a fun low fantasy list for you to learn how to play the game with. Could be made quite a bit more competitive though. Also, I never leave home without musicians on my saurus blocks. You could drop a saurus out of one of the units (your general goes in one of them anyways) and add in two musicians.

    admanb wrote: »
    Always remember that beasts have two states: dead, and fucking your face.
  • ErandusErandus Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Eterenal wrote: »
    You could drop a saurus out of one of the units (your general goes in one of them anyways) and add in two musicians.

    Yeah, do that.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • AsherAsher Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Please be Chaos Dwarfs, please be Chaos Dwarfs. They are odd and little.

    Things my Red Terror has Swallowed Whole: A Mentors Librarian, a Fire Warrior Sash'Ui. Total Points: 109 (so far...)
    "Leapin' and Hoppin' on a Warpshadow" - Mah Nids
    The Swordwind Rises! - Biel Tan. All Aspects. All the time.
    "Before seeking Victory, first make yourself Invulnerable to defeat" - Sneaky sneaky Raptors
  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Asher wrote: »
    Please be Chaos Dwarfs, please be Chaos Dwarfs. They are odd and little.

    SILLY HATS

    STEAM
    Skayel wrote:
    One time, I had a friend over to play a bit of Red Alert on my LAN. During the game he said he needed to go to the bathroom, so we paused it. After about 10 minutes of wondering where the hell he went, I get up and go to check on him.

    Turns out he was trying to screw my dog.
    Once I was taking a poop at a restaurant and a kid crept underneath the door into my stall. I let out a big fart and then he threw up all over the floor in front of me and I just stared at him.
  • AsherAsher Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    AND BEARDS. AND LAMMASUS. AND GIANT FIRE BREATHING BULLS.

    Things my Red Terror has Swallowed Whole: A Mentors Librarian, a Fire Warrior Sash'Ui. Total Points: 109 (so far...)
    "Leapin' and Hoppin' on a Warpshadow" - Mah Nids
    The Swordwind Rises! - Biel Tan. All Aspects. All the time.
    "Before seeking Victory, first make yourself Invulnerable to defeat" - Sneaky sneaky Raptors
  • DayspringDayspring the Phoenician Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    forgeworld is doing chaos dwarves.

  • MorskittarMorskittar Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Ridiculous OP. Needs more skaven.
    Dayspring wrote: »
    Erandus wrote: »
    This just in: While Skaven are the next Fantasy army release, there is "something" else for fantasy coming out before them.
    Hmmmm.
    How would a 40k Apocalypse style release work for Fantasy, do you think? The main problem I can see you already get huge things like dragons and shit running around in WH, and extra big toys is one of the main draws of Apoc.

    Mat Ward did tell me at Baltimore that a Planetstrike-style campaign would be "very possible" for WFB. That said, I can't imagine skaven as a Summer release if this next non-army thing is very big.

    On the bright side, that post seems to confirm new plastic clanrats!

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