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Man raises demon in church. Is this a crime?
Posts
Bombs exist.
Demons do not exist.
This is where your comparison fails.
If someone expressed an open and honest desire to kill people I would be all for them being forced to go through mental evaluation.
An impossible outcome is not a permissible defence against attempted murder.
Law isn't about being reasonable.
Fuck people, an impossible outcome is not a permissible defence against a plot executed with murderous intent.
Where it succeeds, however, is demonstrating that intent is important. I, for one, don't like letting people run around trying to kill people until they do so in a fashion that works.
so youre saying i should be convicted of attempted murder because i bought some guy candy?
now we really are in stupid land.
It's not like Christians also don't have elaborate rituals surrounding their attempts to communicate with their god and direct their god's actions.
I think your "troubling parallels" argument does have some merit. But he didn't say anything about a bomb. His description was just specific. If a Christian prayed to God to strike down a specific person in a specific location, which has obviously happened many times, I fail to see the distinction.
Also,
Don't be ridiculous he's saying you should be arrested for thinking about it.
how did the truck get there? why did he think it was full of bombs? what other actions did he take? did he purchase items he thought were illegal? did he assemble the bombs? did he have accomplices? what is his background? what kinds of previous actions had he taken?
each case is different. summoning a demon =/= buying shit, assembling them into bombs (but for the fact that one ingredient was not c-4), and trying to blow people up.
the facts of the case actually matter.
The key difference here is that a phone exists and could detonate a car bomb(which also exist). Where as demons don't exist, and there for he could not summon one.
Using your standard ANY preacher who EVER calls for gods judgement to come down and smite someone, would also need to be charged with attempted murder.
This whole discussion makes me think of LARPers. IF they really really believe they are shooting a magic missile, then they are attempting murder.
Remember that guy who brought an AR-15 to the Obama town hall? He and his pastor pray for god to kill Obama. They haven't been arrested.
Pretty much how I feel. I also wouldn't feel threatened if somebody told me they were going to off me via demon summoning.
actually, the practice of law is all about being reasonable. i should know, being a lawyer and all.
are you a law student or something? wait until you get some actual practice in the field.
o_O
I'd say they were insane and thus not guilty.
why limit this to murder? what about assault and battery? drunk driving?
i was intending to have a drink tonight, then probably go driving. i had the drink but my friends overpowered me and took the keys from me, those sons of bitches. i still got drunk as hell though. attempted drunk driving for the win, baby!
http://www.drinkdrivinglaw.co.uk/offences/driving_or_attempting_to_drive_with_excess_alcohol.htm
"Okay Ezekial, are you ready to adjure Lord God to bring his wrath down upon Obama the Antichrist?"
"You bet, Matthew!"
"Have you cleansed your mind of sin and spoken in tongues?"
"Alabahbahlazagaba!"
"Okay, open the holy scriptures..."
As Ezekial opens the Bible and begins speaking the Lord's prayer, suddenly 20 feds kick down the door with machine guns. Matthew stands, revealing a wire.
"That was a close one!"
i guess the u.k. is stupid land.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/nyctap/comments/i01_0009.htm
Yes, laws between states and countries vary.
Well, if an actual demon showed up and started farting lighting and vomiting fire all over the place I guess you could get burned or shocked.
And if God actually showed up to smite the sinners, they'd get smitten (smote?).
So, praying for such things would be attempted murder.
wait a minute, is attempted suicide causing by demon summoning already outlawed in the u.k. also?
man, you should have just said something earlier.
The murderous demon murders people. Duh.
Trying to cause a person to commit suicide through your actions is outlawed in the UK.
Attempted drunk driving is considered a crime in several places, and I don't believe it is inherently absurd.
Why do you think we defeated the redcoats so easily?
Also, blasphemy was illegal until a couple years ago.
Nevertheless, if the act plays out the way the intender intends, harm will come to people.
It just won't, and can't.
really? can you cite please? ive never heard of anything like that. you're not talking about duress are you? because those are conceptually different things.
and besides, like ive said earlier, the facts of the case actually matter. trying to make you kill yourself by threating your family (duress and murder, not "suicide-causing") is different from trying to make you kill yourself by feeding you fatty foods and cigarettes.
well, it's definitely not as absurd as attempted suicide causing demon summoning.
So your question wasn't 'What's the harm if it happens as intended' so much as 'What's the harm if it doesn't happen as intended which it won't because he's nuts'?
These two questions are not the same.
It is physically possible to construct a bomb and blow up people with it. If you buy stuff to make a bomb and fail, or are tricked into buying fake components via a sting operation, you obviously still should be prosecuted because it is within the realm of possibility of constructing a real bomb; it's a physical act that doesn't need to be filtered through theology to make any sense.
It is not physically possible to summon a demon. It is not physically possible to get God to kill your enemies. You need to do more than ask supernatural deities for their help in accomplishing goals to be legally culpable. You have to perform actions that could actually cause harm.