They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
So, is there any word of them putting the music just on CDs? I would love to just listen to this stuff, and not from a dude's Youtube account
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
The only way this argument is ever going to get "solved" is by seeing sales numbers. If DJ Hero sells well, then perhaps XiaNaphryz and I's point was correct. If it sells like trash, then we greatly over estimated the appeal of this kind of thing to the masses.
They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
You've completely missed my point.
I AGREE with you that the game is likely not going to sell as well as Activision hopes. I'm DISAGREEING with you that the music is "niche" and a possible factor for said poor sales. If anything, it is exactly the opposite - the music is the only possible reason the game will sell better than expected, and if this happens it'll likely be not through immediate sales but long-term ones (i.e. the game will have a lower decay curve than expected). Not because most of the music is comprised of mixes, but because many of the mixes use R&B/hip-hop tracks that cater to an audience that have yet to see a major rhythm music game with their music preferences in mind, plus many of the other mixes that incorporate other music genres are still done in a way that appeals to said demographic.
I just don't see where the disconnect is between us, unless you consider R&B and hip-hop in general to be "niche," in which case that would be it as a bunch of us would not consider Bell Biv Devoe, Young MC, 2Pac, Jay-Z, Public Enemy, etc as niche. Again, for a large segment of the population this is the stuff we listen to all the time and grew up with. DJs have been playing these and similar tracks and doing mixes/mashups since dances back in junior high. But if you're not into this sort of music, I can see how you might consider it to be "niche." I know many people who would think most of the stuff in GH and RB are "niche" because they never listen to it and don't know anyone personally who really do either outside one or two acquaintances.
They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
I think sales of mixes/mashups is still a bad way to judge the genre. You wouldn't judge the popularity of rock on cover bands or tribute albums, which is what Guitar Hero is.
I'd look at the popularity of musicians who are in the dance/club genre, but don't rely on just mixing other people's works.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
For those who care what the real thing is like, DJ Shiftee, the DMC winner for this year (this video isn't of this year, but it's impressive, his hand speed is beyond anything I can muster).
They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
You've completely missed my point.
I AGREE with you that the game is likely not going to sell as well as Activision hopes. I'm DISAGREEING with you that the music is "niche" and a possible factor for said poor sales. If anything, it is exactly the opposite - the music is the only possible reason the game will sell better than expected, and if this happens it'll likely be not through immediate sales but long-term ones (i.e. the game will have a lower decay curve than expected). Not because most of the music is comprised of mixes, but because many of the mixes use R&B/hip-hop tracks that cater to an audience that have yet to see a major rhythm music game with their music preferences in mind, plus many of the other mixes that incorporate other music genres are still done in a way that appeals to said demographic.
I just don't see where the disconnect is between us, unless you consider R&B and hip-hop in general to be "niche," in which case that would be it as a bunch of us would not consider Bell Biv Devoe, Young MC, 2Pac, Jay-Z, Public Enemy, etc as niche. Again, for a large segment of the population this is the stuff we listen to all the time and grew up with. DJs have been playing these and similar tracks and doing mixes/mashups since dances back in junior high. But if you're not into this sort of music, I can see how you might consider it to be "niche." I know many people who would think most of the stuff in GH and RB are "niche" because they never listen to it and don't know anyone personally who really do either outside one or two acquaintances.
I think you missed my point completely, again. I've got nothing against R&B, hip-hop, etc. I don't think that's niche. The thing I'm saying is niche is mash-ups, which is a sub-genre of all these. It's kind of the difference between Metallica and Bauhaus... just because they're (arguably) under the umbrella of metal doesn't mean they'll both sell equally, since Bauhaus is part of the goth sub-genre. Just because someone likes R&B doesn't mean they'll automatically like mashups. "What the fuck did they do to Jay-Z?" could very likely be a reaction. And I've been to dance clubs recently and didn't hear a single mash-up. And yes, outside of Oklahoma, I went to Club Pure in Vegas. (Then again I've come to think Club Pure kinda sucks, but that's an entirely different conversation.) Mashups really are a sub-genre.
Besides, mashups made a fairly noticeable blip in the mainstream when they first came en vogue two years ago... but then they vanished from the general public consciousness. If they didn't truly take off in the mainstream before I don't really see how DJ Hero will change things. Honestly, the two of you are obviously immersed in the scene hardcore. You seek this information out. This is just the perspective of someone looking from the outside in. The vast majority of the buying public don't have your background.
They go to clubs, but they don't buy the music. Which contradicts the point I made about DJ Hero's music being niche as far as sales goes not one whit.
What? Of course they buy some of the music. Many of the tracks in DJH did well on R&B/hip-hop/urban charts when they first came out - many of us grew up to this stuff. And no, they don't generally buy mixes - if they really want a particular mix, they usually ask for a copy from someone who knows the DJ.
But how does not buying mixes equate into not being interesting in the music and, by extension, the game? I just don't understand how you seem to keep missing the point I've been trying to make.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
You've completely missed my point.
I AGREE with you that the game is likely not going to sell as well as Activision hopes. I'm DISAGREEING with you that the music is "niche" and a possible factor for said poor sales. If anything, it is exactly the opposite - the music is the only possible reason the game will sell better than expected, and if this happens it'll likely be not through immediate sales but long-term ones (i.e. the game will have a lower decay curve than expected). Not because most of the music is comprised of mixes, but because many of the mixes use R&B/hip-hop tracks that cater to an audience that have yet to see a major rhythm music game with their music preferences in mind, plus many of the other mixes that incorporate other music genres are still done in a way that appeals to said demographic.
I just don't see where the disconnect is between us, unless you consider R&B and hip-hop in general to be "niche," in which case that would be it as a bunch of us would not consider Bell Biv Devoe, Young MC, 2Pac, Jay-Z, Public Enemy, etc as niche. Again, for a large segment of the population this is the stuff we listen to all the time and grew up with. DJs have been playing these and similar tracks and doing mixes/mashups since dances back in junior high. But if you're not into this sort of music, I can see how you might consider it to be "niche." I know many people who would think most of the stuff in GH and RB are "niche" because they never listen to it and don't know anyone personally who really do either outside one or two acquaintances.
I think you missed my point completely, again. I've got nothing against R&B, hip-hop, etc. I don't think that's niche. The thing I'm saying is niche is mash-ups, which is a sub-genre of all these. It's kind of the difference between Metallica and Bauhaus... just because they're (arguably) under the umbrella of metal doesn't mean they'll both sell equally, since Bauhaus is part of the goth sub-genre. Just because someone likes R&B doesn't mean they'll automatically like mashups. "What the fuck did they do to Jay-Z?" could very likely be a reaction. And I've been to dance clubs recently and didn't hear a single mash-up. And yes, outside of Oklahoma, I went to Club Pure in Vegas. (Then again I've come to think Club Pure kinda sucks, but that's an entirely different conversation.) Mashups really are a sub-genre.
Besides, mashups made a fairly noticeable blip in the mainstream when they first came en vogue two years ago... but then they vanished from the general public consciousness. If they didn't truly take off in the mainstream before I don't really see how DJ Hero will change things. Honestly, the two of you are obviously immersed in the scene hardcore. You seek this information out. This is just the perspective of someone looking from the outside in. The vast majority of the buying public don't have your background.
I guess where we disagree is the whole mashup thing again. I don't consider it a genre or subgenre at all - it's just something a DJ does.
You're correct that most dance clubs wouldn't focus on mixes, they'd be going from one song to another and if there was any creative mashup it would be in the transition. Full on mashups would be a lot more work and for a DJ doing a few hours in a row, they probably wouldn't consider it.
What IS more common though are mashups where they use just the instrumental of a different track to mix with. This has been going on for as long as I can remember back personally, and is the most common type of mashup you would hear at clubs and on the major R&B/hip-hop radio stations here.
So hearing a mashup wouldn't necessarily be immediately off-putting to many of us. We don't think of a mashup as its own thing, we just think of it as a remix, a R&B or hip-hop or dance or whatever remix. Never a "mashup."
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
What Shiftee is doing there is not "mash-up", it's turntabilism, which is quite a bit different (though one can be used to do the other). A mash-up is a straight remix of two songs together, usually with very little scratching. DJ Hero actually aims to represent the latter, but uses the former to give it a nice easy to understand package.
So, is there any word of them putting the music just on CDs? I would love to just listen to this stuff, and not from a dude's Youtube account
As much as I would love to purchase something like this, there's a "collection" out there with most of the mixes ripped from the game to hold you over for now. It is however missing 3 songs as of right now, but it's ripped directly of the game disc.
Ah, I think I see where we're diverging, XiaNaphryz. You're talking about the tendencies of club DJs to make songs flow into one another as a form of transition. I'm talking about mixing up elements of two different songs to create a unique, self-contained song. I can dig that. I'd still argue that someone used to the first could still be put off by the second, but that's where opinions come in.
Incidentally, in the UK (where sales data comes out weekly rather than monthly as here) DJ Hero debuted at number 32 for the 360 version. That's pretty worrying, since club-style music is more popular there than here. Then again Beatles Rock Band bombed horribly over there while it actually beat Guitar Hero 5 here, so who knows.
So, is there any word of them putting the music just on CDs? I would love to just listen to this stuff, and not from a dude's Youtube account
As much as I would love to purchase something like this, there's a "collection" out there with most of the mixes ripped from the game to hold you over for now. It is however missing 3 songs as of right now, but it's ripped directly of the game disc.
The only collection I knew of had a little over half of the soundtrack split across 3 rar files on Mediafire. Has the rest been put up, or is this a different collection?
So, is there any word of them putting the music just on CDs? I would love to just listen to this stuff, and not from a dude's Youtube account
As much as I would love to purchase something like this, there's a "collection" out there with most of the mixes ripped from the game to hold you over for now. It is however missing 3 songs as of right now, but it's ripped directly of the game disc.
The only collection I knew of had a little over half of the soundtrack split across 3 rar files on Mediafire. Has the rest been put up, or is this a different collection?
Is anyone having trouble getting the crossfader to properly register it's actual location? Sometimes I have to bring it from left, past center untill it registers as right to get it to recenter. And I have problems with it registering in general. Also, anyone still have that video of the one guy who tried to recreate a mix from this game on his own actual turn tables? I think I missed watching that.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
I did notice that with the fader. Unlike a real fader, it's not a gradient fade, it's a tri-boolean, left/center/right, and sometimes if you don't go far enough to one side, it won't ever register you being there, and you have to reset at neutral center. Best advice I can give is to make sure you are hitting the left/right stops every time you make a fader change.
Is anyone having trouble getting the crossfader to properly register it's actual location? Sometimes I have to bring it from left, past center untill it registers as right to get it to recenter. And I have problems with it registering in general. Also, anyone still have that video of the one guy who tried to recreate a mix from this game on his own actual turn tables? I think I missed watching that.
Sounds like you might have a wonky unit. I can stop short of center from the left side, for example, and it will reigster as center. Might need to exchange it?
I picked this up along with Forza 3 last payday. I must say, I had no idea what to expect gameplay-wise, but so far I'm pretty impressed. There is a much bigger disconnect with this concept than that of something like GH or RB, in that they are not emulating playing an instrument, but rather the interaction with audio hardware. So it may be more difficult for people to "get", since you are not "playing" the songs, as you would in other rhythm games. That being said, I think what Freestyle Gamers has pulled off here is quite nice. When you are really kicking ass it does feel as though your actions are affecting what you hear in a tangible way.
The difficulty/learning curve is also quite different from how it ramps up in GH/RB. I find that Medium is a bit too easy, but Hard gets complex VERY quickly. Even though I'm somewhat comfortable on Hard, and getting better all the time, I feel like I need to finish the whole setlist on Medium anyway, if for no other reason than to become more familiar with the mixes and have some idea of what to expect on a harder difficulty.
All in all, though, I can't really say I regret checking it out at all, and I've had a few of the mixes stuck in my head for days!
I'm gonna go ahead and say Bring the Noise/Genesis is the best mix in the game. Especially because it's Bring the Noise 20XX, and Z-Trip went ahead and stripped out all of Zakk Wylde's bullshit so all we get is sweet Chuck D.
I keep on meaning to go to Best Buy to try this out. As someone who has been an electronic music fan for a long time (the Hackers soundtrack got me started), as well as someone who has always been interested in turntablism, this should be right down my alley.
But I am very hesitant (any may be even if I try it and like it). Some of it is the expense, along with the sheer amount of games coming out that I may be interested in in the next couple of months. Another part is that as a fan of electronic music the lack of even big name electronic artists in the track list is more than a little disappointing. It seems like hip-hop got really great representation from very old-school to recent stuff (great to see Afrika Bambataa on that list), but electronic music got very sidelined---I mean, I understand things I like that are kind of obscure like Leftfield or Chicane not being on there, but no Crystal Method, no Armin Van Buuren, no Chemical Brothers? Glad they got in Tiesto, and good to see a lot of Daft Punk in there, but it seems sparse otherwise in terms of non hip-hop music. DJ Shadow is something I would have been happier about if his last two albums hadn't been so disappointing.
I mean, I get that the relative popularity of the two genres meant that it was going to be skewed (in addition to hip-hop being the origin of the DJ, obviously) but it was disappointing to see the only music game where a mostly neglected genre I really love had a chance to have some representation ultimately get very little.
I'm also not sure I'm a huge fan of the majority of the tracks being mash-ups.
Finally got my copy home and played for about 2 hours, did the first 6 setlists on medium.
Its fun, its very different from other music games I've played. I'm still getting used to the crossfader, but its coming. It's fun to feel challenged in a way that RB/GH hasn't in a while.
Music is pretty good, some of the mixes I'm not super into it, but most of the ones I've heard are good.
Just a quick question for those of you who have the game.
Is ther a "Freestyle" option availible or not? I mean the preselected mixes sound nice but it seams like it would be a whole lot of fun to make up your own mixes on the fly.
Just a quick question for those of you who have the game.
Is ther a "Freestyle" option availible or not? I mean the preselected mixes sound nice but it seams like it would be a whole lot of fun to make up your own mixes on the fly.
Unfortunately not - that's the biggest flaw of this game IMO. There is only one game mode, even in multiplayer: play a song straight through.
Just a quick question for those of you who have the game.
Is ther a "Freestyle" option availible or not? I mean the preselected mixes sound nice but it seams like it would be a whole lot of fun to make up your own mixes on the fly.
Nope. Not suprising really, as this is the first iteration of the game and the biggest barrier right now is just getting people used to the whole concept in general. It's also why they only went with one turntable with their controller. I suspect it would be in the sequel.
I'm thinking once I get good enough at Expert to 5 star/FC most of the songs well, I'll switch the turntable to the other side and try and do the same from the lefty side. Since FSG did mention they'd like to have double turntable support in the future, I figure it wouldn't be a bad idea to try.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
Only issue is that you will end up with the fader above the turntable, rather than below it, on the axis of the unit. So it's not just learning to manipulate with your left hand, but you'll have to change your posture as well. Could be weird.
Just a quick question for those of you who have the game.
Is ther a "Freestyle" option availible or not? I mean the preselected mixes sound nice but it seams like it would be a whole lot of fun to make up your own mixes on the fly.
Nope. Not suprising really, as this is the first iteration of the game and the biggest barrier right now is just getting people used to the whole concept in general. It's also why they only went with one turntable with their controller. I suspect it would be in the sequel.
I'm thinking once I get good enough at Expert to 5 star/FC most of the songs well, I'll switch the turntable to the other side and try and do the same from the lefty side. Since FSG did mention they'd like to have double turntable support in the future, I figure it wouldn't be a bad idea to try.
I'm wondering if Scratch (if it ever comes out) will have some sort of freestyle option. I've got a feeling I might've read something along those lines, but there's a high chance I may have been very tired and making things up.
Only issue is that you will end up with the fader above the turntable, rather than below it, on the axis of the unit. So it's not just learning to manipulate with your left hand, but you'll have to change your posture as well. Could be weird.
As far as I know, you don't have to flip the mixer upside down at all. You just detach the turntable and connect it to the other side.
I'm wondering if Scratch (if it ever comes out) will have some sort of freestyle option. I've got a feeling I might've read something along those lines, but there's a high chance I may have been very tired and making things up.
Isn't Scratch a really different game? From what I've seen, it's more of a Beatmania clone, so it's more of a button tapper. No crossfader, etc. Unless I'm confusing it with a different game.
XiaNaphryz on
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
Only issue is that you will end up with the fader above the turntable, rather than below it, on the axis of the unit. So it's not just learning to manipulate with your left hand, but you'll have to change your posture as well. Could be weird.
As far as I know, you don't have to flip the mixer upside down at all. You just detach the turntable and connect it to the other side.
Ahhh, I wasn't aware the whole thing came apart. I guess it has to for left handed people to be able to use the unit properly.
Only issue is that you will end up with the fader above the turntable, rather than below it, on the axis of the unit. So it's not just learning to manipulate with your left hand, but you'll have to change your posture as well. Could be weird.
As far as I know, you don't have to flip the mixer upside down at all. You just detach the turntable and connect it to the other side.
Ahhh, I wasn't aware the whole thing came apart. I guess it has to for left handed people to be able to use the unit properly.
Plus having a connection port on the other side gives upgradeability if we do get double turntables in the future. C'mon Expert+!
Say there's a long blue scratch bar. At the beginning, a down scratch. At the end, up scratch. Nothing in between. Is there something I should be doing in that blank area in between?
Say there's a long blue scratch bar. At the beginning, a down scratch. At the end, up scratch. Nothing in between. Is there something I should be doing in that blank area in between?
Technically, you're supposed to keep the button held in between with no movement. Though I believe you can let go of the button during blank sections in a long directional scratch as long as you scratch correctly/on-time when the next symbol goes by.
XiaNaphryz on
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TrippyJingMoses supposes his toeses are roses.But Moses supposes erroneously.Registered Userregular
Nope. Not suprising really, as this is the first iteration of the game and the biggest barrier right now is just getting people used to the whole concept in general. It's also why they only went with one turntable with their controller. I suspect it would be in the sequel.
There actually was a DJing arcade game by the name of Crackin' DJ that made use of two turntables. There are videos of it up on Youtube. It's an interesting thing to see, considering that the only controls are two turntables and a crossfader.
Only issue is that you will end up with the fader above the turntable, rather than below it, on the axis of the unit. So it's not just learning to manipulate with your left hand, but you'll have to change your posture as well. Could be weird.
No you don't. The section of the unit with the fader pops off, and can be rotated 180deg and reconnected. Thus, you end up with the fader still close you you and the table on the left. Flip it over and take a look.
*edit* Must refresh more often... beat'd so, so badly.
Say there's a long blue scratch bar. At the beginning, a down scratch. At the end, up scratch. Nothing in between. Is there something I should be doing in that blank area in between?
Technically, you're supposed to keep the button held in between with no movement. Though I believe you can let go of the button during blank sections in a long directional scratch as long as you scratch correctly/on-time when the next symbol goes by.
Just confirming that yes, you can let go of the button and do anything you want.
How do you guys do multiple quick directional scratches in a row pointing the same direction? I have been switching between either constantly moving the turntable in the direction of the scratch while tapping the button or trying to basically do a normal scratch but letting off the button when I move the turntable backwards. Neither has been particularly successful, heh.
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I had no idea. I just knew that it was the one that came with the case/stand.
I didn't know that.
I also didn't know what DMC stood for.
So I googled it and one of the top matches is DeLorean Motor Company.
Which is probably worlds cooler than whatever it really stands for.
Actually, the bolded part shows you kinda missed my point. Peripheral fatigue aside, I like the idea of DJ Hero, the execution seems well-done, and I want to play it. My point was that the niche nature of the music will probably be a barrier to sales.
It really is possible to enjoy a game and expect it to sell like crap.
Also, the fact that you said they don't generally buy mixes kinda proves my point.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
DMC World DJ Championships, it's pretty much the biggest DJ competition in the world (though others have cropped up lately).
The only way this argument is ever going to get "solved" is by seeing sales numbers. If DJ Hero sells well, then perhaps XiaNaphryz and I's point was correct. If it sells like trash, then we greatly over estimated the appeal of this kind of thing to the masses.
You've completely missed my point.
I AGREE with you that the game is likely not going to sell as well as Activision hopes. I'm DISAGREEING with you that the music is "niche" and a possible factor for said poor sales. If anything, it is exactly the opposite - the music is the only possible reason the game will sell better than expected, and if this happens it'll likely be not through immediate sales but long-term ones (i.e. the game will have a lower decay curve than expected). Not because most of the music is comprised of mixes, but because many of the mixes use R&B/hip-hop tracks that cater to an audience that have yet to see a major rhythm music game with their music preferences in mind, plus many of the other mixes that incorporate other music genres are still done in a way that appeals to said demographic.
I just don't see where the disconnect is between us, unless you consider R&B and hip-hop in general to be "niche," in which case that would be it as a bunch of us would not consider Bell Biv Devoe, Young MC, 2Pac, Jay-Z, Public Enemy, etc as niche. Again, for a large segment of the population this is the stuff we listen to all the time and grew up with. DJs have been playing these and similar tracks and doing mixes/mashups since dances back in junior high. But if you're not into this sort of music, I can see how you might consider it to be "niche." I know many people who would think most of the stuff in GH and RB are "niche" because they never listen to it and don't know anyone personally who really do either outside one or two acquaintances.
I think sales of mixes/mashups is still a bad way to judge the genre. You wouldn't judge the popularity of rock on cover bands or tribute albums, which is what Guitar Hero is.
I'd look at the popularity of musicians who are in the dance/club genre, but don't rely on just mixing other people's works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmOANzaOsh8
I think you missed my point completely, again. I've got nothing against R&B, hip-hop, etc. I don't think that's niche. The thing I'm saying is niche is mash-ups, which is a sub-genre of all these. It's kind of the difference between Metallica and Bauhaus... just because they're (arguably) under the umbrella of metal doesn't mean they'll both sell equally, since Bauhaus is part of the goth sub-genre. Just because someone likes R&B doesn't mean they'll automatically like mashups. "What the fuck did they do to Jay-Z?" could very likely be a reaction. And I've been to dance clubs recently and didn't hear a single mash-up. And yes, outside of Oklahoma, I went to Club Pure in Vegas. (Then again I've come to think Club Pure kinda sucks, but that's an entirely different conversation.) Mashups really are a sub-genre.
Besides, mashups made a fairly noticeable blip in the mainstream when they first came en vogue two years ago... but then they vanished from the general public consciousness. If they didn't truly take off in the mainstream before I don't really see how DJ Hero will change things. Honestly, the two of you are obviously immersed in the scene hardcore. You seek this information out. This is just the perspective of someone looking from the outside in. The vast majority of the buying public don't have your background.
I guess where we disagree is the whole mashup thing again. I don't consider it a genre or subgenre at all - it's just something a DJ does.
You're correct that most dance clubs wouldn't focus on mixes, they'd be going from one song to another and if there was any creative mashup it would be in the transition. Full on mashups would be a lot more work and for a DJ doing a few hours in a row, they probably wouldn't consider it.
What IS more common though are mashups where they use just the instrumental of a different track to mix with. This has been going on for as long as I can remember back personally, and is the most common type of mashup you would hear at clubs and on the major R&B/hip-hop radio stations here.
So hearing a mashup wouldn't necessarily be immediately off-putting to many of us. We don't think of a mashup as its own thing, we just think of it as a remix, a R&B or hip-hop or dance or whatever remix. Never a "mashup."
As much as I would love to purchase something like this, there's a "collection" out there with most of the mixes ripped from the game to hold you over for now. It is however missing 3 songs as of right now, but it's ripped directly of the game disc.
Incidentally, in the UK (where sales data comes out weekly rather than monthly as here) DJ Hero debuted at number 32 for the 360 version. That's pretty worrying, since club-style music is more popular there than here. Then again Beatles Rock Band bombed horribly over there while it actually beat Guitar Hero 5 here, so who knows.
The only collection I knew of had a little over half of the soundtrack split across 3 rar files on Mediafire. Has the rest been put up, or is this a different collection?
Different.
Sounds like you might have a wonky unit. I can stop short of center from the left side, for example, and it will reigster as center. Might need to exchange it?
As for the video in question:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSatr_umpoA&fmt=18
The difficulty/learning curve is also quite different from how it ramps up in GH/RB. I find that Medium is a bit too easy, but Hard gets complex VERY quickly. Even though I'm somewhat comfortable on Hard, and getting better all the time, I feel like I need to finish the whole setlist on Medium anyway, if for no other reason than to become more familiar with the mixes and have some idea of what to expect on a harder difficulty.
All in all, though, I can't really say I regret checking it out at all, and I've had a few of the mixes stuck in my head for days!
XBL/PSN-Polaris314/Twitter/DJ P0LARI5
But I am very hesitant (any may be even if I try it and like it). Some of it is the expense, along with the sheer amount of games coming out that I may be interested in in the next couple of months. Another part is that as a fan of electronic music the lack of even big name electronic artists in the track list is more than a little disappointing. It seems like hip-hop got really great representation from very old-school to recent stuff (great to see Afrika Bambataa on that list), but electronic music got very sidelined---I mean, I understand things I like that are kind of obscure like Leftfield or Chicane not being on there, but no Crystal Method, no Armin Van Buuren, no Chemical Brothers? Glad they got in Tiesto, and good to see a lot of Daft Punk in there, but it seems sparse otherwise in terms of non hip-hop music. DJ Shadow is something I would have been happier about if his last two albums hadn't been so disappointing.
I mean, I get that the relative popularity of the two genres meant that it was going to be skewed (in addition to hip-hop being the origin of the DJ, obviously) but it was disappointing to see the only music game where a mostly neglected genre I really love had a chance to have some representation ultimately get very little.
I'm also not sure I'm a huge fan of the majority of the tracks being mash-ups.
Its fun, its very different from other music games I've played. I'm still getting used to the crossfader, but its coming. It's fun to feel challenged in a way that RB/GH hasn't in a while.
Music is pretty good, some of the mixes I'm not super into it, but most of the ones I've heard are good.
PSN: Corbius
Is ther a "Freestyle" option availible or not? I mean the preselected mixes sound nice but it seams like it would be a whole lot of fun to make up your own mixes on the fly.
Unfortunately not - that's the biggest flaw of this game IMO. There is only one game mode, even in multiplayer: play a song straight through.
I'm thinking once I get good enough at Expert to 5 star/FC most of the songs well, I'll switch the turntable to the other side and try and do the same from the lefty side. Since FSG did mention they'd like to have double turntable support in the future, I figure it wouldn't be a bad idea to try.
I'm wondering if Scratch (if it ever comes out) will have some sort of freestyle option. I've got a feeling I might've read something along those lines, but there's a high chance I may have been very tired and making things up.
As far as I know, you don't have to flip the mixer upside down at all. You just detach the turntable and connect it to the other side.
Isn't Scratch a really different game? From what I've seen, it's more of a Beatmania clone, so it's more of a button tapper. No crossfader, etc. Unless I'm confusing it with a different game.
Ahhh, I wasn't aware the whole thing came apart. I guess it has to for left handed people to be able to use the unit properly.
Plus having a connection port on the other side gives upgradeability if we do get double turntables in the future. C'mon Expert+!
Say there's a long blue scratch bar. At the beginning, a down scratch. At the end, up scratch. Nothing in between. Is there something I should be doing in that blank area in between?
Technically, you're supposed to keep the button held in between with no movement. Though I believe you can let go of the button during blank sections in a long directional scratch as long as you scratch correctly/on-time when the next symbol goes by.
There actually was a DJing arcade game by the name of Crackin' DJ that made use of two turntables. There are videos of it up on Youtube. It's an interesting thing to see, considering that the only controls are two turntables and a crossfader.
No you don't. The section of the unit with the fader pops off, and can be rotated 180deg and reconnected. Thus, you end up with the fader still close you you and the table on the left. Flip it over and take a look.
*edit* Must refresh more often... beat'd so, so badly.
Just confirming that yes, you can let go of the button and do anything you want.
How do you guys do multiple quick directional scratches in a row pointing the same direction? I have been switching between either constantly moving the turntable in the direction of the scratch while tapping the button or trying to basically do a normal scratch but letting off the button when I move the turntable backwards. Neither has been particularly successful, heh.