A good article about how absurd this trial is/was and how I won't be going to Italy anytime soon
Spoilered for long
In just a few days, a verdict is expected in the trial of Amanda Knox, the 22-year-old Seattle exchange student on trial in Italy for the throat-slashing murder of her British roommate two years ago. Her ex-boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito, is also being tried.
The trial in the Umbrian college town of Perugia has dragged on just short of a year. As this week’s closing arguments showed once again, the case has very little to do with actual evidence and much to do with the ancient Italian code of saving face.
In closing arguments, Knox was described as a “Luciferina” and “a dirty-minded she-devil.” Preposterous, made-up sexual motives were ascribed to her. One prosecutor speculated before the jury what Knox may have said to Meredith Kercher before, he claimed, forcing an orgy that resulted in her death:
“You are always behaving like a little saint. Now we will show you. Now we will make you have sex.”
Nobody alleges that Knox said this to Kercher. But prosecutors asked the jury to imagine her saying such a thing.
What century is this? Didn’t Joan of Arc, the Inquisition and our own American Salem witch trials teach civilized nations a thing or two about contrived sexual hysteria with a devil twist?
On top of everything else, just a few days ago, the parents of Amanda Knox — a schoolteacher and an out-of-work retail accounts manager who’ve maxed out their retirement funds and mortgaged their home to pay for a legal defense — were served with legal papers by the authorities prosecuting their daughter.
Now the parents are under investigation for “defamation,” stemming from a long-ago interview with a British paper, in which they recounted their daughter’s tale of being mistreated while she was questioned all night by police without an attorney.
The timing is suspect, to say the least. This jury is not sequestered. By casting doubt outside the courtroom on Knox’s account of mistreatment, the authorities can hope to influence the outcome inside the courtroom.
But let’s stick with the core of the case. As I’ve written earlier, there is no physical evidence placing Amanda Knox at the blood-splattered crime scene, the room where the killing took place. Zero.
But there is abundant evidence linking a drifter named Rudy Guede to the scene — blood, DNA, prints and his own admission. Little wonder he fled to Germany just after the killing, while Knox went to the police voluntarily, without an attorney. Little wonder that he was found guilty, last year, of sexual assault and conspiracy to kill Kercher. He’s serving a 30-year sentence and appealing the case.
There is no motive for Knox and Sollecito; they have no criminal record, no history of violent group sexual encounters. E-mails show Knox and her roommate got along fine, except for the typical college-student disputes over bathroom and household chores.
The one bit of physical evidence from the scene that ties Sollecito — not Knox — to the crime is a bra clasp from Kercher. Prosecutors claim they found some of his DNA on this. But it was not “discovered” until 46 days after the murder, making it subject to contamination and manipulation.
Prosecutors also say a knife found at Sollecito’s house links Knox to the crime. But numerous forensic experts have said the blade size of that knife did not match the wounds, and the DNA on it was such a trace amount that it could not be accurately tested.
So, why has Knox been jailed for two years? As near as I can tell, she is on trial for inappropriate behavior. A widely shown video showed her kissing her boyfriend and cuddling just days after the murder. An athlete, she did cartwheels — cartwheels! — while in the midst of a long interrogation. This was evidence of her “contempt” of authorities, prosecutors said.
And she wore t-shirts with Beatles lyrics to court — “an alt Holly Golightly from Seattle,” as Time magazine called her.
In her closing argument, the highly acclaimed Italian defense attorney, Giulia Bongiorno, who is also a member of Parliament, tried to address this guilt-by-inappropriate-behavior argument.
“She is not Amanda the Ripper,” Bongiorno told the jury. “She is a little crazy, extravagant. She does the cartwheels in the police station because reality for her is too strong to deal with. She is spontaneous, immediate and imprudent.” She compared her to Amelie, the spacey naïf in the French movie of the same name.
The prosecutorial pride issue dates to the arrest two years ago. Shortly after the killing, after days of interrogation produced suspect stories from Knox and Sollecito, the authorities publicly pronounced the case closed. They had the killers — two college lovers.
Except, they didn’t. Guede was still at large, and not even named. And later, the Italian Supreme court threw out much of the results of the long interrogation. With abundant evidence tied to Guede, prosecutors should have dropped the case against Sollecito and Knox. Instead, they simply added him to the pair of college students, and changed the story to fit. Guede himself did not testify in the Knox trial, after making statements so inconsistent a school child could trip him up.
And once the prosecutors had fastened on to this bizarre narrative of a sex-crazed thrill killing, to the delight of the European tabloid press, they had to stick to it. Their honor was at stake, no small thing in Italy.
To many Americans, this trial is an outrage. “It’s probably the most egregious international railroading of two innocent young people I’ve ever seen,” said John Q. Kelly, a former prosecutor known for getting a civil verdict against O.J. Simpson for the murder of his ex-wife. Speaking on CNN last month, he called it “a public lynching based on rank speculation.”
Italians see it differently, of course. I was in Italy last month, and found that public opinion had shifted somewhat. There was more skepticism about the case. Still, to many Italians, Amanda Knox is a spoiled, amoral American college girl who has not shown sufficient remorse for the death of her roommate. The narrative of the manipulative she-devil is widespread.
How this happened was explained by Peter Popham, writing last week in The Independent, a British paper.
In Italy, “prosecutors regularly leak their theories to the newspapers, often in extraordinary detail,” he wrote. “As a result, by the time a trial comes around, the public already knows what they think about a case, and why. This makes miscarriages of justice horribly likely.”
As with the American system, the Italian jury will be asked to find guilt beyond a reasonable doubt this week. Their verdict is not supposed to be about medieval superstitions, sexual projections, Satan fantasies or the honor of a prosecution team. If they simply apply the standard that the law calls for, the verdict will be obvious.
A great parallel is the OJ Simpson murder trial, except this time the prosecution dominated in setting the media narrative, and the idea of exotic, villainous foreign woman (a sexual devil!) plays perfectly into the sensational Italian media.
A judge assigned to the case read the pathology report at a bail hearing for the suspects and ruled that Kercher's carotid artery had not been ruptured in the attack, and that she likely died a "relatively slow and agonising death."[24] Italian prosecutors allege that the lethal wound was inflicted by Knox while Kercher was held down by Guede and Sollecito. The prosecution points to violent literature, such as comic books, that they found in Sollecito’s apartment.[25][26] Prosecutors allege that manga comics found in Sollecito's apartment recounted tales of killing female vampires on Halloween night and that many of the details in the comics were similar to the scene police discovered. Kercher had attended a number of Halloween parties dressed as a vampire the night of 31 October. Defence lawyers for Knox have dismissed the allegations of the prosecution, claiming that they are a "huge fantasy".[27]
so goddamn retarded.
Couscous on
0
Options
Casually HardcoreOnce an Asshole. Trying to be better.Registered Userregular
edited December 2009
See, this is what I mean. All the sources is supporting one extreme or the other. She's either a saint or a demon. I mean, what the hell is going on here?
See, this is what I mean. All the sources is supporting one extreme or the other. She's either a saint or a demon. I mean, what the hell is going on here?
I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
Oh Italy, worst country which I'd still be inclined to call first world.
Although at this point I think I'd call it a second world nation, given how absolutely fucked and corrupt their government is to the point that basic services can break down (garbage collection).
A good article about how absurd this trial is/was and how I won't be going to Italy anytime soon
Spoilered for long
In just a few days, a verdict is expected in the trial of Amanda Knox, the 22-year-old Seattle exchange student on trial in Italy for the throat-slashing murder of her British roommate two years ago. Her ex-boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito, is also being tried.
The trial in the Umbrian college town of Perugia has dragged on just short of a year. As this week’s closing arguments showed once again, the case has very little to do with actual evidence and much to do with the ancient Italian code of saving face.
In closing arguments, Knox was described as a “Luciferina” and “a dirty-minded she-devil.” Preposterous, made-up sexual motives were ascribed to her. One prosecutor speculated before the jury what Knox may have said to Meredith Kercher before, he claimed, forcing an orgy that resulted in her death:
“You are always behaving like a little saint. Now we will show you. Now we will make you have sex.”
Nobody alleges that Knox said this to Kercher. But prosecutors asked the jury to imagine her saying such a thing.
What century is this? Didn’t Joan of Arc, the Inquisition and our own American Salem witch trials teach civilized nations a thing or two about contrived sexual hysteria with a devil twist?
On top of everything else, just a few days ago, the parents of Amanda Knox — a schoolteacher and an out-of-work retail accounts manager who’ve maxed out their retirement funds and mortgaged their home to pay for a legal defense — were served with legal papers by the authorities prosecuting their daughter.
Now the parents are under investigation for “defamation,” stemming from a long-ago interview with a British paper, in which they recounted their daughter’s tale of being mistreated while she was questioned all night by police without an attorney.
The timing is suspect, to say the least. This jury is not sequestered. By casting doubt outside the courtroom on Knox’s account of mistreatment, the authorities can hope to influence the outcome inside the courtroom.
But let’s stick with the core of the case. As I’ve written earlier, there is no physical evidence placing Amanda Knox at the blood-splattered crime scene, the room where the killing took place. Zero.
But there is abundant evidence linking a drifter named Rudy Guede to the scene — blood, DNA, prints and his own admission. Little wonder he fled to Germany just after the killing, while Knox went to the police voluntarily, without an attorney. Little wonder that he was found guilty, last year, of sexual assault and conspiracy to kill Kercher. He’s serving a 30-year sentence and appealing the case.
There is no motive for Knox and Sollecito; they have no criminal record, no history of violent group sexual encounters. E-mails show Knox and her roommate got along fine, except for the typical college-student disputes over bathroom and household chores.
The one bit of physical evidence from the scene that ties Sollecito — not Knox — to the crime is a bra clasp from Kercher. Prosecutors claim they found some of his DNA on this. But it was not “discovered” until 46 days after the murder, making it subject to contamination and manipulation.
Prosecutors also say a knife found at Sollecito’s house links Knox to the crime. But numerous forensic experts have said the blade size of that knife did not match the wounds, and the DNA on it was such a trace amount that it could not be accurately tested.
So, why has Knox been jailed for two years? As near as I can tell, she is on trial for inappropriate behavior. A widely shown video showed her kissing her boyfriend and cuddling just days after the murder. An athlete, she did cartwheels — cartwheels! — while in the midst of a long interrogation. This was evidence of her “contempt” of authorities, prosecutors said.
And she wore t-shirts with Beatles lyrics to court — “an alt Holly Golightly from Seattle,” as Time magazine called her.
In her closing argument, the highly acclaimed Italian defense attorney, Giulia Bongiorno, who is also a member of Parliament, tried to address this guilt-by-inappropriate-behavior argument.
“She is not Amanda the Ripper,” Bongiorno told the jury. “She is a little crazy, extravagant. She does the cartwheels in the police station because reality for her is too strong to deal with. She is spontaneous, immediate and imprudent.” She compared her to Amelie, the spacey naïf in the French movie of the same name.
The prosecutorial pride issue dates to the arrest two years ago. Shortly after the killing, after days of interrogation produced suspect stories from Knox and Sollecito, the authorities publicly pronounced the case closed. They had the killers — two college lovers.
Except, they didn’t. Guede was still at large, and not even named. And later, the Italian Supreme court threw out much of the results of the long interrogation. With abundant evidence tied to Guede, prosecutors should have dropped the case against Sollecito and Knox. Instead, they simply added him to the pair of college students, and changed the story to fit. Guede himself did not testify in the Knox trial, after making statements so inconsistent a school child could trip him up.
And once the prosecutors had fastened on to this bizarre narrative of a sex-crazed thrill killing, to the delight of the European tabloid press, they had to stick to it. Their honor was at stake, no small thing in Italy.
To many Americans, this trial is an outrage. “It’s probably the most egregious international railroading of two innocent young people I’ve ever seen,” said John Q. Kelly, a former prosecutor known for getting a civil verdict against O.J. Simpson for the murder of his ex-wife. Speaking on CNN last month, he called it “a public lynching based on rank speculation.”
Italians see it differently, of course. I was in Italy last month, and found that public opinion had shifted somewhat. There was more skepticism about the case. Still, to many Italians, Amanda Knox is a spoiled, amoral American college girl who has not shown sufficient remorse for the death of her roommate. The narrative of the manipulative she-devil is widespread.
How this happened was explained by Peter Popham, writing last week in The Independent, a British paper.
In Italy, “prosecutors regularly leak their theories to the newspapers, often in extraordinary detail,” he wrote. “As a result, by the time a trial comes around, the public already knows what they think about a case, and why. This makes miscarriages of justice horribly likely.”
As with the American system, the Italian jury will be asked to find guilt beyond a reasonable doubt this week. Their verdict is not supposed to be about medieval superstitions, sexual projections, Satan fantasies or the honor of a prosecution team. If they simply apply the standard that the law calls for, the verdict will be obvious.
yeesh
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
Oh Italy, worst country which I'd still be inclined to call first world.
Although at this point I think I'd call it a second world nation, given how absolutely fucked and corrupt their government is to the point that basic services can break down (garbage collection).
I'm not sure what would make them first world, their economy has been fucked since like forever and their entire political systems seems to be consisting of either criminals or just people taking money from criminals.
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
I have literally know only what has been posted in this thread about this case, and everything about it stinks. I mean, the only thing they really have on Knox is the supposed murder weapon, which apparently wasn't even the murder weapon. And there's apparently substantial evidence against this Guede (sp) guy, who was allowed to flee the country and subsequently convicted of another violent crime in germany.
and that BBC article reads like a fucking gossip column. what the hell bbc
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Oh Italy, worst country which I'd still be inclined to call first world.
Although at this point I think I'd call it a second world nation, given how absolutely fucked and corrupt their government is to the point that basic services can break down (garbage collection).
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
Thanks for proving my point, they must be totally innocent!
Here's the thing, they got found guilty by a jury not the prosecution.. at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty. I personally don't know whether she and her Italian boyfriend are innocent or guilty.. but you know what? I haven't seen all the evidence and neither have you.
You know what I was complaining about? The frankly ridiculous almost comical reporting online by sites like Boing Boing and your post saying "Are you fucking retarded or something" proves my point, complete with all uppercase text. There's this kneejerk reaction going on that borders on the ridiculous.
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
Thanks for proving my point, they must be totally innocent!
Here's the thing, they got found guilty by a jury not the prosecution.. at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty. I personally don't know whether she and her Italian boyfriend are innocent or guilty.. but you know what? I haven't seen all the evidence and neither have you.
You know what I was complaining about? The frankly ridiculous almost comical reporting online by sites like Boing Boing and your post saying "Are you fucking retarded or something" proves my point, complete with all uppercase text. There's this kneejerk reaction going on that borders on the ridiculous.
It doesn't matter if they were guilty or not in this case. The fact remains they were convicted by imagination and comic books. It's not fucking knee jerk, you twat.
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
Thanks for proving my point, they must be totally innocent!
Here's the thing, they got found guilty by a jury not the prosecution.. at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty. I personally don't know whether she and her Italian boyfriend are innocent or guilty.. but you know what? I haven't seen all the evidence and neither have you.
You know what I was complaining about? The frankly ridiculous almost comical reporting online by sites like Boing Boing and your post saying "Are you fucking retarded or something" proves my point, complete with all uppercase text. There's this kneejerk reaction going on that borders on the ridiculous.
The jury was not sequestered in a media market saturated with the demonization of this person.
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
Yea but a Colorado court ruled that our imaginations are real, so it's okay
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder. This isn't fricking CSI people.
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
Thanks for proving my point, they must be totally innocent!
Here's the thing, they got found guilty by a jury not the prosecution.. at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty. I personally don't know whether she and her Italian boyfriend are innocent or guilty.. but you know what? I haven't seen all the evidence and neither have you.
You know what I was complaining about? The frankly ridiculous almost comical reporting online by sites like Boing Boing and your post saying "Are you fucking retarded or something" proves my point, complete with all uppercase text. There's this kneejerk reaction going on that borders on the ridiculous.
More like, even a cursory reading about the trial finds various instances of misconduct that would never have been allowed in the U.S. Whether they were actually guilty or not, it sounds like this trial was a huge mess.
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty
Let's all just ignore the stupid troll.
I'm not the one resorting to personal insults buddy. I'm merely saying this knee jerk reaction going on is so damn silly.
You're absolutely right. We should sit back and let people get convicted via imagination.
Next up: Someone in Idaho gets convicted of murder in Italy because the jury was told to "imagine he was actually cutting somebody up with a pizza cutter".
So, in other words it went like most trials where there isn't clean cut evidence of a murder.
Unlike most trials, there isn't clean cut evidence of who committed the murder combined with a bunch of retarded unfairly prejudicial fuckups.
There's this idea that justice is blind everywhere, simple fact is it isn't.. let me give you an example a couple of years ago we had a cleaner thieving from work. We setup a webcam that recorded movement and caught her in the act of stealing.. long story short through in court the company lost.
In the US for example there's plenty of people on death row and plenty of instances of where the evidence is less than stellar.
There's this ridiculous frothing at the mouth rabidness going on and some frankly silly reporting going on.
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
There's this idea that justice is blind everywhere, simple fact is it isn't.. let me give you an example a couple of years ago we had a cleaner thieving from work. We setup a webcam that recorded movement and caught her in the act of stealing.. long story short through in court the company lost.
So? I'm not sure what that has to do with a murder trial.
In the US for example there's plenty of people on death row and plenty of instances of where the evidence is less than stellar.
Your point being? I don't see how this excuses utter fuckmuppetry in a foreign case and means we shouldn't get outraged about it.
at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty
Let's all just ignore the stupid troll.
I'm not the one resorting to personal insults buddy. I'm merely saying this knee jerk reaction going on is so damn silly.
You're absolutely right. We should sit back and let people get convicted via imagination.
Next up: Someone in Idaho gets convicted of murder in Italy because the jury was told to "imagine he was actually cutting somebody up with a pizza cutter".
You've got this idea that somehow I think this person is guilty or something? I honestly don't care either way.
Again, i'm not talking about someone being convicted whether it's on imagination or whether the tooth fairy did it. What i'm saying is that this knee jerk reaction going on is just silly, you haven't seen the evidence and neither have I yet there are a lot of people going on as if she's the guildford four all rolled into one.
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty
Let's all just ignore the stupid troll.
I'm not the one resorting to personal insults buddy. I'm merely saying this knee jerk reaction going on is so damn silly.
You're absolutely right. We should sit back and let people get convicted via imagination.
Next up: Someone in Idaho gets convicted of murder in Italy because the jury was told to "imagine he was actually cutting somebody up with a pizza cutter".
You've got this idea that somehow I think this person is guilty or something? I honestly don't care either way.
Again, i'm not talking about someone being convicted whether it's on imagination or whether the tooth fairy did it. What i'm saying is that this knee jerk reaction going on is just silly, you haven't seen the evidence and neither have I yet there are a lot of people going on as if she's the guildford four all rolled into one.
that you keep calling this a "knee-jerk" reaction is dumb
you should stop trying to use that as a way to minimize what other people are saying
the public has a pretty clear picture of what the evidence presented was
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty
Let's all just ignore the stupid troll.
I'm not the one resorting to personal insults buddy. I'm merely saying this knee jerk reaction going on is so damn silly.
You're absolutely right. We should sit back and let people get convicted via imagination.
Next up: Someone in Idaho gets convicted of murder in Italy because the jury was told to "imagine he was actually cutting somebody up with a pizza cutter".
You've got this idea that somehow I think this person is guilty or something? I honestly don't care either way.
Again, i'm not talking about someone being convicted whether it's on imagination or whether the tooth fairy did it. What i'm saying is that this knee jerk reaction going on is just silly, you haven't seen the evidence and neither have I yet there are a lot of people going on as if she's the guildford four all rolled into one.
that you keep calling this a "knee-jerk" reaction is dumb
you should stop trying to use that as a way to minimize what other people are saying
the public has a pretty clear picture of what the evidence presented was
It's precisely knee jerk, there's a big thing going on in the media.. the post on BoingBoing (which I linked) is a prime example of this. Here's the thing, the only evidence you or I have seen is directly from the media themselves unless you're telling me you're a juror and took part in the case?
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
It's precisely knee jerk, there's a big thing going on in the media.. the post on BoingBoing (which I linked) is a prime example of this. Here's the thing, the only evidence you or I have seen is directly from the media themselves unless you're telling me you're a juror and took part in the case?
So you think the media, including those Italian sources who feel Knox is guilty, collectively decided to ignore damning evidence for some reason?
Surely, anyone convicted without an eyewitness or photographic evidence is convicted based on imagination? The actual evidence might tend more towards one imaginary scenario than another, but essentially it's whether or not this scenario is beyond all reasonable doubt.
Posts
Spoilered for long
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
The BBC has it laid out pretty well.
I hear she played Doom once, too.
And listened to Marilyn Manson
Although at this point I think I'd call it a second world nation, given how absolutely fucked and corrupt their government is to the point that basic services can break down (garbage collection).
yeesh
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
From what i've been reading and watching from Americans you'd think this woman was a fucking saint. Simple fact is her and her Italian boyfriend both got found guilty, this isn't a fucking conspiracy against some innocent American.
For example, Boing Boings write up on it is the epitome of retarded stupidity.
This is on the same level of Americans moaning and griping when the EU slapped down the fine on Microsoft saying "see! that'd never happen to a European company!" and when someone promptly lists out the even larger fines metered out to European companies proceed to put their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala".
Yeah, pretty much everyone in Europe regards Italy as the stupid cousin and I don't doubt there is political corruption going on in that country. But what the hell does that have to do with their independent judiciary?
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
Are you fucking retarded or something? Have you even read the articles? The police and prosecution changed their stories multiple times and told the jury to "imagine what might have happened".
They got convicted ON A FUCKING IMAGINATION.
This isn't some Americans going, "Oh those Italians have it out for us!"
THEY GOT CONVICTED ON IMAGI-FUCKING-NATION
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
I'm not sure what would make them first world, their economy has been fucked since like forever and their entire political systems seems to be consisting of either criminals or just people taking money from criminals.
I hear its a great place to visit though.
I have literally know only what has been posted in this thread about this case, and everything about it stinks. I mean, the only thing they really have on Knox is the supposed murder weapon, which apparently wasn't even the murder weapon. And there's apparently substantial evidence against this Guede (sp) guy, who was allowed to flee the country and subsequently convicted of another violent crime in germany.
and that BBC article reads like a fucking gossip column. what the hell bbc
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Thanks for proving my point, they must be totally innocent!
Here's the thing, they got found guilty by a jury not the prosecution.. at the end of the day you can bet your arse if a jury of your peers finds you guilty then chances are they're guilty. I personally don't know whether she and her Italian boyfriend are innocent or guilty.. but you know what? I haven't seen all the evidence and neither have you.
You know what I was complaining about? The frankly ridiculous almost comical reporting online by sites like Boing Boing and your post saying "Are you fucking retarded or something" proves my point, complete with all uppercase text. There's this kneejerk reaction going on that borders on the ridiculous.
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
It doesn't matter if they were guilty or not in this case. The fact remains they were convicted by imagination and comic books. It's not fucking knee jerk, you twat.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
is fucking stupendously naive.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
The jury was not sequestered in a media market saturated with the demonization of this person.
Yea but a Colorado court ruled that our imaginations are real, so it's okay
Give me N for 200, please.
More like, even a cursory reading about the trial finds various instances of misconduct that would never have been allowed in the U.S. Whether they were actually guilty or not, it sounds like this trial was a huge mess.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
You know, i'm not quite sure whether that's a joke or not but it's unintentionally funny because of the kneejerk insult.. ergo...
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Let's all just ignore the stupid troll.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
I'm not the one resorting to personal insults buddy. I'm merely saying this knee jerk reaction going on is so damn silly.
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
It's not knee jerk.
You're absolutely right. We should sit back and let people get convicted via imagination.
Next up: Someone in Idaho gets convicted of murder in Italy because the jury was told to "imagine he was actually cutting somebody up with a pizza cutter".
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
No see everyone in prison is guilty. We never find out years later that they're actually innocent.
That is the issue we take with this
There's this idea that justice is blind everywhere, simple fact is it isn't.. let me give you an example a couple of years ago we had a cleaner thieving from work. We setup a webcam that recorded movement and caught her in the act of stealing.. long story short through in court the company lost.
In the US for example there's plenty of people on death row and plenty of instances of where the evidence is less than stellar.
There's this ridiculous frothing at the mouth rabidness going on and some frankly silly reporting going on.
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
Your point being? I don't see how this excuses utter fuckmuppetry in a foreign case and means we shouldn't get outraged about it.
You've got this idea that somehow I think this person is guilty or something? I honestly don't care either way.
Again, i'm not talking about someone being convicted whether it's on imagination or whether the tooth fairy did it. What i'm saying is that this knee jerk reaction going on is just silly, you haven't seen the evidence and neither have I yet there are a lot of people going on as if she's the guildford four all rolled into one.
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
that you keep calling this a "knee-jerk" reaction is dumb
you should stop trying to use that as a way to minimize what other people are saying
the public has a pretty clear picture of what the evidence presented was
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
It's precisely knee jerk, there's a big thing going on in the media.. the post on BoingBoing (which I linked) is a prime example of this. Here's the thing, the only evidence you or I have seen is directly from the media themselves unless you're telling me you're a juror and took part in the case?
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
So you think the media, including those Italian sources who feel Knox is guilty, collectively decided to ignore damning evidence for some reason?
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation