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[Shields Up] Computer Security Thread

TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
Computer Security Thread
Dear Malware: We Hate You


It's a dangerous internet out there. In this thread, let's discuss questions, recommendations, and techniques related to computer security.

Dealing with a nasty infection? Make a post and see if anyone has any advice. Need some recommendations on which anti-virus to use, or just have a quick question about what MBAM is? Check out the software list and ask around for testimonials. The thread's really intended to be a catch-all for any information you might need for security related issues. The OP will be updated as more information fills out, recommendations are made, news breaks, or errors are caught.

On that note, please feel free to contribute to the OP! If you know of a piece of security software overlooked, or take issue with the advice given, post it in the thread and the OP will be modified accordingly. As a major disclaimer I personally am not a security expert, but many people on the forums are very skilled in this field. I plan to give as much help as I can, but hopefully this thread can become a useful info-dump. With luck we can avoid numerous redundant threads on the forum about the same problems, and have a quick-access reference for a variety of questions.

Most of the assembled links and advice are offered for Windows systems, but discussion for all OS flavors are invited.


Big `lo List of Dang-Useful Security Software:
Spoiler:

Other Protective Measures
Spoiler:

I'm Infected! What do I do?
Spoiler:



General Tips:
Spoiler:


News

  • News Refresh Inbound. Please hold


More will be added to the list as time goes on. Until then, be safe!

TetraNitroCubane on
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BouwsT
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Posts

  • stigweardstigweard Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Needs more ComboFix. Also, another good, free option for sandboxing is to use a vmware browser appliance.

  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    stigweard wrote: »
    Needs more ComboFix. Also, another good, free option for sandboxing is to use a vmware browser appliance.

    Very good ideas. Combofix is offline for the moment, thanks to a system-breaking bug. I'll be sure to add it into the OP once the author gets the issues sorted out. Their main link explicitly warns against using other versions hosted elsewhere. I gather it's something rather serious.

    I admit that I'm unfamiliar with vmware for sandboxing, but I'll gladly add it in!

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  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I added in the vmware links, but ComboFix is still out of commission for the time being, unfortunately.

    I also added a news section, which I'll try to keep up to date without spamming the thread to severely. For the time being, everyone should be aware of the recent exploits to Adobe products and PDF viewers which utilize Javascript. There's more information in the OP.

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  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Run Linux?

    *ducks*

    In all seriousness, I've kept a Linux router/firewall set up between the Internet and any Windows PCs I've had set up, and I have never picked up anything nasty. No viruses, no hacks, etc. Bottom line, I don't trust Microsoft in the slightest to keep their own product secure, and will never connect a Windows box direct to the 'net if I can ever avoid it.

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Houn wrote: »
    Run Linux?

    *ducks*

    In all seriousness, I've kept a Linux router/firewall set up between the Internet and any Windows PCs I've had set up, and I have never picked up anything nasty. No viruses, no hacks, etc. Bottom line, I don't trust Microsoft in the slightest to keep their own product secure, and will never connect a Windows box direct to the 'net if I can ever avoid it.

    That's one off the list. Now all we need is someone saying 'Buy a Mac!'

    I kid, I kid. Your reasoning is sound in my opinion. Running Linux (or OS X) is a viable solution to many of the ailments that Windows boxes are prone to. I'm not making any accusations otherwise - Windows machines are a prime target in a way that other OS options are not, for a variety of reasons. Unfortunately, it's not everyone knows how to set up a Linux router / can escape to OS X, etc.

    qwlru.png
  • FodderFodder Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Linux is almost getting to the point that it's mainstream enough for the average consumer, though probably not quite there yet. If it wasn't for games I would probably have switched exclusively to linux a while ago. I have plans to try to get my grandparents using it when I'm back home.

    I'm using avast now on my laptop windows partition which doesn't get used more than a month at a time or so, so I'm not terribly concerned about it, but does microsoft security essentials do as good a job or better than it? It'd be nice to use that instead just to keep things somewhat consistent, and I don't think I really need an antivirus that badly anyways, but avast doesn't seem bad so I'm ok with keeping it until something better comes along.

    steam_sig.png
  • DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Far more important that browser security (frankly, IE8 is basically up to bar with the rest of the modern browsers, finally) is website security, i.e. if you stay away from your shady warez and porn sites and don't open e-mail viruses, you'll have a far lower chance of infection than otherwise. This isn't foolproof, of course; legitimate sites get compromised all the time and then used as a vector for viruses, but it sure helps.
    Spoiler:

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  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Oh, don't get me wrong; my days of "Anti-M$ Zealotry" are far behind me. I recognize that Windows is an inevitability for most people; I've had Windows around for gaming for ever, and have a Windows box at work for Outlook/Internal Apps. At the same time, only a fool would deny that Windows and IE are, if not just insecure, definitely the juiciest target for virus and malware writers due to it's penetration.

    Taking the simple steps of a seperate firewall, and using ANYTHING other than IE (really, please, pretty please) can reduce your chances of contracting something by, what, 99%?

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • undeinPiratundeinPirat Registered User
    edited December 2009
    Hi! I was wondering, my father decided to purchase as a christmas gift a token bundle of software that included Norton 360; I am currently using that for antivirus. Would you recommend I renew the subscription? Or are the free tools good enough that I could switch to them and get the same protection? I'm not worried about Norton being bad, it seems to do its job, I just don't know if it is the best protection that I could get; I have been hearing magic things about MSE.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] steam: undeinpirat
  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I haven't used Norton in years, but last I did, it angered me greatly with how much of a memory hog it was. I've been using Symantec at work, and it seems to run ok, and AVG at home.

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Norton can be charitably considered to be "not worth the money" and uncharitably considered to be "worse than some viruses". Get yourself MSE or AVG or something.

    edit: oh, and the Norton uninstall program doesn't actually remove it entirely, last I checked. Fun fun.

    vvvvvv-dithw.png
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    MSE is a lot better than AVG. AVG has been sucking for awhile now.

    I would also suggest that Zonealarm be removed from the list of Firewalls. That thing is garbage and should not even be acknowledged.

  • AyulinAyulin Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Been running Norton since the 2009 version here, although I'm going to switch to MSE once it expires. It's gotten a lot better in terms of memory use and performance; quick check of Task Manager shows it's running two processes with ~8MB of memory in use.

    I'd still say ditch it and switch to MSE, though :P

    steam_sig.png
  • Desert_Eagle25Desert_Eagle25 Registered User
    edited December 2009
    Eset's Nod32 wins over most anti-virus software, hands down.

  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    On the topic of Norton - A few years back it was widely considered horrible for it's bloated footprint and ineffective detection. I've been hearing that Symantec really cleaned things up with their latest releases, but honestly, I don't think it can compare to MSE. Mostly because MSE is free.

    And heck, MSE is doing really well with detections at the moment. It's picking up stuff that NOD's been missing lately, according to VirusTotal.
    Eset's Nod32 wins over most anti-virus software, hands down.

    I'll certainly agree with this, to a degree. I've been using it for years now, and been pretty happy thanks to the low resource usage and good protection. Unfortunately they seem to be 'slipping' a bit. Most of the latest 'comparatives' studies seem to rank it low against Day-0 threats... but still, the really snappy and repeated signature updates are a big plus. I get two, if not three a day.
    I would also suggest that Zonealarm be removed from the list of Firewalls. That thing is garbage and should not even be acknowledged.

    If this is consensus, consider it gone. The Firewall list is a little brief right now, but I'll try to fill it out soon. I admit I don't have much experience with Zonealarm.

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  • Desert_Eagle25Desert_Eagle25 Registered User
    edited December 2009
    On the topic of Norton - A few years back it was widely considered horrible for it's bloated footprint and ineffective detection. I've been hearing that Symantec really cleaned things up with their latest releases, but honestly, I don't think it can compare to MSE. Mostly because MSE is free.

    And heck, MSE is doing really well with detections at the moment. It's picking up stuff that NOD's been missing lately, according to VirusTotal.
    Eset's Nod32 wins over most anti-virus software, hands down.

    I'll certainly agree with this, to a degree. I've been using it for years now, and been pretty happy thanks to the low resource usage and good protection. Unfortunately they seem to be 'slipping' a bit. Most of the latest 'comparatives' studies seem to rank it low against Day-0 threats... but still, the really snappy and repeated signature updates are a big plus. I get two, if not three a day.
    I would also suggest that Zonealarm be removed from the list of Firewalls. That thing is garbage and should not even be acknowledged.

    If this is consensus, consider it gone. The Firewall list is a little brief right now, but I'll try to fill it out soon. I admit I don't have much experience with Zonealarm.

    I'm personally glad for you that you have no experience with ZoneAlarm, cause you're a lucky man. I'd definitely go as far as to say that ZA is a p.o.s.

  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Unfortunately, AVG is the only free AV that is approved by my company's VPN. So, if I want remote access... AVG, or buy Symmantec.

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Houn wrote: »
    Oh, don't get me wrong; my days of "Anti-M$ Zealotry" are far behind me. I recognize that Windows is an inevitability for most people; I've had Windows around for gaming for ever, and have a Windows box at work for Outlook/Internal Apps. At the same time, only a fool would deny that Windows and IE are, if not just insecure, definitely the juiciest target for virus and malware writers due to it's penetration.

    Taking the simple steps of a seperate firewall, and using ANYTHING other than IE (really, please, pretty please) can reduce your chances of contracting something by, what, 99%?

    You are so far behind the times. Only Windows has security functions like ASLR (Address Space Layout Randomization). IE is also very secure now, more so by default than most every other browser. In fact only Chrome comes close to all the little settings options that IE has. Chrome is the only other browser to follow IE's example and add a sand box mode. IE also runs at a lower privilege level than any other browser.

    Nothing can install through IE without the user's permission. In the chance that something does slip through it still can't make any changes to the system thanks to the sand box mode.

    Microsoft becomes high priest of secure software development

    OPINION: Pigs Fly! Microsoft Leads in Security

  • Shorn Scrotum ManShorn Scrotum Man Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    ZoneAlarm has been a POS for years now. I was surprised to see it on the list.

    I tried AVG a while back, didn't like how it auto-installed a Firefox addon that added a bunch of useless shit.

    I am very happy with MSE.

    steam_sig.png
  • AegisAegis Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    ZoneAlarm always worked fine for me on XP. Though, having moved to Vista and finding that ZoneAlarm and Vista don't get along well I ended up switching to Commodo. I'm not necessarily sad that I don't use ZA anymore as Commodo is much better.

  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Houn wrote: »
    Oh, don't get me wrong; my days of "Anti-M$ Zealotry" are far behind me. I recognize that Windows is an inevitability for most people; I've had Windows around for gaming for ever, and have a Windows box at work for Outlook/Internal Apps. At the same time, only a fool would deny that Windows and IE are, if not just insecure, definitely the juiciest target for virus and malware writers due to it's penetration.

    Taking the simple steps of a seperate firewall, and using ANYTHING other than IE (really, please, pretty please) can reduce your chances of contracting something by, what, 99%?

    You are so far behind the times. Only Windows has security functions like ASLR (Address Space Layout Randomization). IE is also very secure now, more so by default than most every other browser. In fact only Chrome comes close to all the little settings options that IE has. Chrome is the only other browser to follow IE's example and add a sand box mode. IE also runs at a lower privilege level than any other browser.

    Nothing can install through IE without the user's permission. In the chance that something does slip through it still can't make any changes to the system thanks to the sand box mode.

    Microsoft becomes high priest of secure software development

    OPINION: Pigs Fly! Microsoft Leads in Security

    I assume you're talking about IE 8, which no one will install, because it's not supported by anything?

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    ZA would seem to do a good job as long as you didn't have any problems and you weren't file sharing. I remember 10 years ago having trouble with ZA & Kazaa, this is when Kazaa was still good. In short ZA cannot handle large scale traffic and gets a lot of false positives.

    ZA modified the Windows tcp/ip stack. It did this in 98SE, 2000, & XP. ZA has problems with Vista & Win7 because they use a different tcp/ip stack and a lot more security & system hardening so programs in general can't just mess with the system.

    Then there is the little issues of ZA not disabling, as in you would "disable" it the program would say ok and tell you it's disabled and then keep on running. So if you were trying to diagnose a connection problem you had to uninstall ZA to get proper network info.

    And lastly ZA would leave a lot of trash in your system when you did uninstall the thing.

    So yes the Windows Firewall is just fine, if you want something more use Comodo. I've also had good resutls with McAfee's firewall, I just don't feel like paying for it.

  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm fond of my custom iptables setup myself; perfect firewall. Not recommended for everyone, though.

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    The people have spoken: ZoneAlarm is now dead to us.

    On another note, has anyone had any experience with Prevx? It's supposed to be cloud-based malware recognition that doesn't conflict with A/V software, but I'm at a loss as to what it actually does (i.e. if it's signature based, heuristics based, system monitor based). Their website is a little too flashy for my taste, and I can't find any real info there, but it's been recommended to me by word-of-mouth.

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  • travathiantravathian Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Houn wrote: »
    In all seriousness, I've kept a Linux router/firewall set up between the Internet and any Windows PCs I've had set up, and I have never picked up anything nasty. No viruses, no hacks, etc. Bottom line, I don't trust Microsoft in the slightest to keep their own product secure, and will never connect a Windows box direct to the 'net if I can ever avoid it.

    lolz, no, just no, please god no. Stop spouting stupid shit. You can have the best fucking stand alone firewall in the world and it doesn't mean shit when a trusted site is delivering the payload to your web browser, or you open that file from a trusted source, or view that attachment from a trusted email. Secondly, there's that whole cause/effect thing going on, and claiming that your precious firewall has prevented you from getting anything is a joke. But hey if we are trading useless anecdotes, guess what, I don't have a fancy linux firewall and I too haven't picked up anything nasty!

    Oh hey, more stupid shit:
    Houn wrote: »
    I assume you're talking about IE 8, which no one will install, because it's not supported by anything?

    lolz, yeah, not supported by anything, except one of the most popular internet applications around: Steam, maybe you've heard of it? Oh, and here's another shocker, Win7 comes with IE8 by default, so I am guessing there are just a few people using it as their default browser. Really dude, if you want to bury your head in the sand, that's fine, but keep the stupid inside your head.


    Tetra, I totally agree about the client firewall and blocking outbound connections. It is mostly a privacy/control thing and less a security thing. I use one because I want to know what apps are phoning home and decide whether or not to let them out. The other useful aspect is isolating infections to a single computer within your trusted zone. Sure my laptop may get infected, but the hope is that the client side firewall will prevent the virus from accessing trusted resources before I can kill its network access and deal with the infection.

  • Desert_Eagle25Desert_Eagle25 Registered User
    edited December 2009
    travathian wrote: »
    Houn wrote: »
    In all seriousness, I've kept a Linux router/firewall set up between the Internet and any Windows PCs I've had set up, and I have never picked up anything nasty. No viruses, no hacks, etc. Bottom line, I don't trust Microsoft in the slightest to keep their own product secure, and will never connect a Windows box direct to the 'net if I can ever avoid it.

    Stop spouting stupid shit.

  • Shorn Scrotum ManShorn Scrotum Man Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, can we chill on the Linux zealotry?

    steam_sig.png
  • stigweardstigweard Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    You are so far behind the times. Only Windows has security functions like ASLR (Address Space Layout Randomization).

    ASLR wasn't even coined by Microsoft. It has existed in OpenBSD, and patched into Linux (now core iirc) for nearly a decade. Like most good parts of Windows, it was licensed, purchased, or otherwise ripped from other operating systems.

  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    travathian wrote: »
    Spoiler:

    1. Obviously no firewall in the world can prevent a trusted client from doing something stupid. I am not stupid. A good firewall will, however, protect you from all manner of worms and scans looking for running services with known exploits. But yes, it's only one piece of the puzzle.

    2. I can't use IE8 due to several of my employer's internal WebApps being completely broken in it; and they are designed to work in IE7. Hell, some of the products we sell still don't have IE8 support. It's growing, sure, and I admit I was exaggerating when I said "anything", but I know I am not incorrect when I say that there are a large number of people out there with non-public applications that will not run in IE8 yet.

    3. Up until last weekend, I was running a Vista64 machine with AVG and Firefox, behind the aforementioned Linux router/firewall. I've been running variants on this setup for, oh, 7 or 8 years now. Combined with good browsing habits and a bit of caution, I have never picked up a virus.

    So, you can stop getting so defensive. I'll trust Windows the day I hook it up straight to the 'net and don't get a worm infection within the first 10 minutes. And for the record, no, I don't trust Linux either, but I DO trust my firewall rules, and I do trust that far, far less malware targets it.

    Operating systems are tools. They each have their strengths and weaknesses. Anything I relate is opinion based on my personal experience; it may not be your experience that Windows is insecure, but it has been mine. I also admit this is colored by my time spent fixing Windows PC, and then my time spent working with Linux servers.

    Steam: DigitalArcanist | PSN: DigitalArcanist | NNID: DigitalArcanist | Backloggery: Houn
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I've been running variations on a directly-connected Windows setup for, oh, 7 or 8 years now. Combined with good browsing habits and a bit of caution, I have never picked up a virus.

    Can we quit with the zealotry now? :P

    Windows breaks a lot because a lot of Windows users are complete morons when it comes to security or computers in general. That is why you spend so much time fixing Windows boxes.

  • Desert_Eagle25Desert_Eagle25 Registered User
    edited December 2009
    Phoenix-D wrote: »

    Windows breaks a lot because a lot of Windows users are complete morons when it comes to security or computers in general. That is why you spend so much time fixing Windows boxes.

    P.S. Putting up your own security measures and then berating Windows for lacking their own proper security, without even allowing the Microsoft software an opportunity, is a horrible logic.

  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    While I do think that Windows platforms are undeniably more vulnerable that other OS solutions available right now, I have no idea if that's due to developer negligence or just simple market saturation. Regardless of the events of the past, though, I think Microsoft is certainly taking notice in a big way. They know that the Windows reputation of 'Least Secure OS' is damaging their brand, and they're moving to fix it in some ways. MSE is really evidence of that, particularly since it's free.

    Minor Thread Alteration: I've moved Prevx and added Threatfire to a new Anti-Malware category, 'Behavior Blockers'. I'm really torn on these programs, particularly Prevx. After doing some research, they seem like invaluable tools that can run alongside current A/V solutions without much issue, and cloud-based recognition makes them appealing. Prevx in particular has some glowing reviews from sources I usually trust.

    However, I just can't get over the fact that Prevx just feels shady. Their website looks like a scareware site, and apparently the free version of their software may or may not engage in scareware tactics. There have been a number of odd news releases about them, too, including accusations that they've created their own malware to boost sales. These developments, combined with their recent behavior during the 'Black Screen of Death' debacle (details) makes me consider removing Prevx from the list.

    I don't want the list being a collection of my personal opinions, though, and I have no experience with the actual software. Any input on the matter would be greatly appreciated. The problem I always have when researching security issues is the rampant fanboyism that paralyzes some of the discussion venues like Wilder's.

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  • TychoCelchuuuTychoCelchuuu ___________PIGEON _________San Diego, CA Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'd like to add Dr. Web's free CureIt! as a stupendous option for scanning for viruses if you're not going the nuke from orbit route. That thing catches a ton of stuff. Thank you Russia.

  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'd like to add Dr. Web's free CureIt! as a stupendous option for scanning for viruses if you're not going the nuke from orbit route. That thing catches a ton of stuff. Thank you Russia.

    Consider it done!

    Also, ComboFix is back online, so I added it to the recommended links for reactive malware removal as per Stigweard's suggestion. It's a potent program, and not to be used lightly, but it's very good at what it does.

    qwlru.png
  • GreenishGreenish Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'd like to add Dr. Web's free CureIt! as a stupendous option for scanning for viruses if you're not going the nuke from orbit route. That thing catches a ton of stuff. Thank you Russia.

    Consider it done!

    Also, ComboFix is back online, so I added it to the recommended links for reactive malware removal as per Stigweard's suggestion. It's a potent program, and not to be used lightly, but it's very good at what it does.

    Great to see ComboFix is back. Its my current favorite last resort tool.

    Take Tetra's word that ComboFix is not to be taken lightly. This thing will root out even the most stealthy of rootkits but it can give you major problems with your system files if you aren't careful. See, in the process of removing these rootkits some system files might get caught up in the crossfire and get purged along with the rootkit because of Combofix's detection algorithm. This can turn a hijacked system into an unbootable one quick. Im sure the recent outage was because of this very reason. A new kit was being purged along with system files and it was trashing systems.

    Id also like it if Smitfraudfix were on the list. This little prog is a dynamo when it comes to getting rid of browser hijacks and those fake anti-virus programs. But like Combofix, do your homework and know exactly what you are getting rid of before you use these tools.

  • theSquidtheSquid Sydney, AustraliaRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    While I do think that Windows platforms are undeniably more vulnerable that other OS solutions available right now, I have no idea if that's due to developer negligence or just simple market saturation. Regardless of the events of the past, though, I think Microsoft is certainly taking notice in a big way. They know that the Windows reputation of 'Least Secure OS' is damaging their brand, and they're moving to fix it in some ways. MSE is really evidence of that, particularly since it's free.

    Thank you for the only adult pro-MS response to the Linux users in this thread.

    I had sex with the Ecumenical Patriarch and he infected me with syphilis
  • TofystedethTofystedeth veni, veneri, vamoosi Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, saying IE8 doesn't work with anything is pretty hyperbolic where "anything" consists of companies intranet webapps. They never got those working with IE7 either. But for your average consumer (ie, someone reading this thread who is actually in a position to choose what browser he uses) most sites should work just fine, and those that don't you can try compatibility mode. I've not seen a site that didn't work right in IE8 (with the ironic exception of the PA forums, which for some reason say require me to log in twice.)

    edit: Firefox 3.5 user here.

    steam_sig.png
  • NackmatholnNackmatholn Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, saying IE8 doesn't work with anything is pretty hyperbolic where "anything" consists of companies intranet webapps. They never got those working with IE7 either. But for your average consumer (ie, someone reading this thread who is actually in a position to choose what browser he uses) most sites should work just fine, and those that don't you can try compatibility mode. I've not seen a site that didn't work right in IE8 (with the ironic exception of the PA forums, which for some reason say require me to log in twice.)

    edit: Firefox 3.5 user here.

    I do tech support for a major national bank's web site. Basically I take calls from consumers and explain to them why they screwed up their passwords, etc. One thing that we have noticed since the release of Internet Explorer 8 is it produces many unexplained errors. One of it's favored errors tells us, through an error code, that the IE 6 user needs to apply hotfix to properly use the javascripting of our website. It identifies as I E 6... Most of the time the only way to get IE 8 to 'work' for our site is to get the consumer to find the compatibility button. These are the very same consumers that take 20 minutes to find the address bar. IE 8 is still not supported by my financial institution, and the main response when a consumer has an issue with the site, and they are using IE 8 is to install Firefox, Opera, or Safari.

  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm not as tinfoil-hatish as I used to be, but one place I would frequent quite a bit was Wilders Security Forum. I used to use a lot of DiamondCS software as well. These days, I just run MSE and use webmail so I don't download something I don't want.

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, saying IE8 doesn't work with anything is pretty hyperbolic where "anything" consists of companies intranet webapps. They never got those working with IE7 either. But for your average consumer (ie, someone reading this thread who is actually in a position to choose what browser he uses) most sites should work just fine, and those that don't you can try compatibility mode. I've not seen a site that didn't work right in IE8 (with the ironic exception of the PA forums, which for some reason say require me to log in twice.)

    edit: Firefox 3.5 user here.

    I do tech support for a major national bank's web site. Basically I take calls from consumers and explain to them why they screwed up their passwords, etc. One thing that we have noticed since the release of Internet Explorer 8 is it produces many unexplained errors. One of it's favored errors tells us, through an error code, that the IE 6 user needs to apply hotfix to properly use the javascripting of our website. It identifies as I E 6... Most of the time the only way to get IE 8 to 'work' for our site is to get the consumer to find the compatibility button. These are the very same consumers that take 20 minutes to find the address bar. IE 8 is still not supported by my financial institution, and the main response when a consumer has an issue with the site, and they are using IE 8 is to install Firefox, Opera, or Safari.

    IE has "quirks mode" commands that can be added to a site's code/templates. Basically sites can tell IE8 to open them in compatibility automatically. They could also add a little info bar telling people with IE6 to either upgrade to IE8 or to install the hotfix.

    Example site: http://ie6update.com/#

    I personally do not care for Firefox, a big part of that is the User base. I have no qualms admitting that I'm a MS fanboy. When it comes to web surfing I use IE & Opera in tandem. When IE7 came out I was trying to spread the message, whether you use IE or not you should still upgrade PCs to IE7 even if you install an alternate browser. The moment I mentioned IE I would immediately be cut off with some phrase involving the word Fuck. This was always Directly followed by the proclamation “I use Firefox” like it’s a badge of honor.

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