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Crazy people protesting funerals

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Posts

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I don't understand "Fag troops" in the context of this. Was the soldier that was dead homosexual?

  • ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    urahonky wrote: »
    I don't understand "Fag troops" in the context of this. Was the soldier that was dead homosexual?

    No, the nutjobs are saying that US soldiers get killed because America as a whole is a godless country and the Lord is getting payback in this manner.

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  • Orochi_RockmanOrochi_Rockman __BANNED USERS
    edited March 2010
    Yes, they believe God made 9/11 happen because he's punishing the US for tolerating homosexuality.

  • CorehealerCorehealer Tynarial I had it. I grasped the spark. I held it in my hands...Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Yes, they believe God made 9/11 happen because he's punishing the US for tolerating homosexuality.

    Pat Robertson would love these people.

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  • ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Corehealer wrote: »
    Yes, they believe God made 9/11 happen because he's punishing the US for tolerating homosexuality.

    Pat Robertson would love these people.

    I doubt Pat Robertson likes being out-Pat-Robertsoned. I imagine it's like when you try to take over/destroy the world without including The Joker. He just wants to shoot you in the face for it, not become your buddy.

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  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    He was in the middle of a war zone. Chances are something bad is going to happen to him... There's no way that God would kill this one man just to "punish" America for being tolerant of gays.

    Wait why am I trying to rationalize this...?

  • ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    urahonky wrote: »
    He was in the middle of a war zone. Chances are something bad is going to happen to him... There's no way that God would kill this one man just to "punish" America for being tolerant of gays.

    Wait why am I trying to rationalize this...?

    DINGDINGDINGDINGDING

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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    JebusUD wrote: »
    JebusUD wrote: »

    We make a point as a society to allow parades on a case by case basis in strictly supervised settings.

    We don't do the same thing with funeral protests. Again I say, if you're going to buy the premise that leads them to protesting and shouting obscenities at grieving parents, why not buy the whole hog and argue for the eradication of gays, browns, fornicators, heathens, communists, socialists, and the intelligent.

    The content of their belief isn't the issue here. I do not support any of the premises they are arguing. That part is irrelevant. What I am saying is that considering what they believe, I do not think their actions are extreme in the context of tort law on emotional distress.

    These protests take place in supervised settings. They go out and get permits. That is why the police are generally there to keep people from hurting them. But even if they didn't could we ban a planned gay rally outside a church? That offends those inside and going inside at what many consider a sacred and emotional time.

    So then the question becomes: If we have a permit system to organize and control, why can the local community simply not vote to ban the issuing of protest permits for sensitive areas?

    I don't buy the "If they can't do it at a funeral than you can't do it at a church" argument. Because you're right, neither of those things should happen. This isn't a matter of government control'n the people, this is a matter of people coming together and agreeing on a baseline of human decency.

    The supreme court has ruled that permit or ordinance laws must meet these requirements.

    “must not be based on the content of the message, must be narrowly
    tailored to serve a significant governmental interest, and must leave open
    ample alternatives for communication.” It also cannot place an undue burden on the first amendment rights.

    What you are talking about is banning speech from a public place. Outside of XYZ private place is not sufficient reason to do so under the law.

    This is from a couple pages back, but:

    If you find out that the WBC or some other group is planning on protesting a special event of yours (funeral, gay marriage, etc). Couldnt you just file for your own protest/form of free speech for the areas that your attendees will be able to see, and then just have the police remove anyone not affiliated with you that is trying to protest in an area that you have the permit to.

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  • EnigEnig a.k.a. Ansatz Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    That seems like it is sort of moving outside of the spirit of the supposed law. They might as well make a law that allows you to request a public area be free of people you do not wish to be there, provided you schedule it ahead of time.

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  • ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010

    This is from a couple pages back, but:

    If you find out that the WBC or some other group is planning on protesting a special event of yours (funeral, gay marriage, etc). Couldnt you just file for your own protest/form of free speech for the areas that your attendees will be able to see, and then just have the police remove anyone not affiliated with you that is trying to protest in an area that you have the permit to.

    You probably could do something along those lines, but I don't think your average grieving family will plan for that sort of thing.

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  • RandomEngyRandomEngy Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I would just like to inform you all that Evil_Reaver is the winner of the thread.

    Profile -> Signature Settings -> Hide signatures always. Then you don't have to read this worthless text anymore.
  • Evil_ReaverEvil_Reaver Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    RandomEngy wrote: »
    I would just like to inform you all that Evil_Reaver is the winner of the thread.

    You knew you'd be sig'd forever for that glorious statement, right?

    Also, I spoke to one of my law professors today about this case and the discussion that we are having about it.

    I specifically asked, "Why does IIED not infringe on the First Amendment?"

    Her answer (basically):

    - The Constitution and First Amendment are not static. They have to be flexible and are subject to interpretation.
    - IIED is basically anti-asshole insurance. It doesn't infringe on the First Amendment because your right to say whatever you want has limitations when it comes to my emotional needs.
    - The court is well within its right to say that you have to be X yard away from a funeral, but as long as you are, you can say/do whatever you want.
    - It's cases like this that make sure attorneys have jobs.

    Also, she knew exactly what case I was talking about without me even specifically saying what this was about.

    So there you go. She seemed to agree with me that the appellate court should have just said, "This isn't IIED, go away," but she did point out that cases like these are why we need SCOTUS to interpret and help us understand what the law means.

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  • JihadJesusJihadJesus Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Zampanov wrote: »
    urahonky wrote: »
    He was in the middle of a war zone. Chances are something bad is going to happen to him... There's no way that God would kill this one man just to "punish" America for being tolerant of gays.

    Wait why am I trying to rationalize this...?

    DINGDINGDINGDINGDING

    You know what's really, really awesome? These bigotted fucktwads will get a punishment far worse than we could ever give them for protesting: they get to live over the course of the next several decades watching gay rights become more and more normalized and their insanity become more and more fringe, and finally have to face the painful realization, as they lie dying, that their God isn't coming to put those dirty gays back in their place.

    Or they could just be dellusional fruitbags and think it'll be more to their liking in heaven. Probably that. [tiny]but my version is better[/tiny]

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  • Lord YodLord Yod Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Lord Yod wrote: »
    Zampanov wrote: »
    My problem with this entire situation is that they overturned it because apparently IIED infringes on the right to free speech which doesn't make any sense because IIED has been a valid tort since forever. To me, it seems like they should either say it is IIED or it's not IIED and leave the free speech part out.

    Bolded part: Good point. I'm also too lazy to read the decision. We're boned by our inability to care more than an internet thread's worth.

    The appellate decision explains it pretty clearly I think. The IIED damages were overturned because he appellate court found the protest didn't satisfy the 'intentional' part, basically saying that because their signs say 'God hates fags' instead of 'Mr. Snyder is an asshole' they weren't talking specifically about him. And they weren't, they were using his son's death as a vehicle to promote their message, which isn't the same thing at all. It's an incredibly shitty way to exercise their rights but it's within their rights to do it.

    Basically they're not saying that IIED isn't valid, they're saying that what the WBC did (in this instance) wasn't IIED.

    Does it not matter at all that on their website under the picket times they do specifically call the deceased the same things they write on their signs? I don't see how "Yeah we called him a fag, but that was like, before we got here man" is a defense.

    In this particular case they did not say specific things about the deceased that were not clearly hyperbolic rhetoric. At least, that's what the appellate decision concluded.

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  • The ScribeThe Scribe Registered User
    edited March 2010
    I do not take the Westboro Baptist Church seriously enough to worry about it. I think it is hilarious. Then again, I have never lost a friend or relative in Afghanistan or Iraq.

    Westboro Baptist Church sings "God Hates the World."

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWMxUsTjhY0&feature=related

    Evil world, you’ve come together as one
    See your soldiers dying
    Oh, you claim God’s blessing you
    That lie, the greatest lie of all
    You can’t go on, pretending day by day
    That the God of judgment is dead and gone
    You are all a part of the Devil’s family
    And the truth, you’re all headed straight to hell
    God hates the world, and all her people
    You, everyone, face a fiery day for your proud sinning
    It’s too late to change His mind; you lived out your vain lives
    Storing up God’s wrath for all eternity

  • CervetusCervetus Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    JihadJesus wrote: »
    Zampanov wrote: »
    urahonky wrote: »
    He was in the middle of a war zone. Chances are something bad is going to happen to him... There's no way that God would kill this one man just to "punish" America for being tolerant of gays.

    Wait why am I trying to rationalize this...?

    DINGDINGDINGDINGDING

    You know what's really, really awesome? These bigotted fucktwads will get a punishment far worse than we could ever give them for protesting: they get to live over the course of the next several decades watching gay rights become more and more normalized and their insanity become more and more fringe, and finally have to face the painful realization, as they lie dying, that their God isn't coming to put those dirty gays back in their place.

    Or they could just be dellusional fruitbags and think it'll be more to their liking in heaven. Probably that. [tiny]but my version is better[/tiny]

    Mostly I hate them, then I laugh at them, but on some level I really do pity them. To be so afraid and angry all the time must be miserable.

    The libertarian response to anything is, "Sure, that works fine in practice, but it doesn't fly in theory."
  • The ScribeThe Scribe Registered User
    edited March 2010
    Cervetus wrote: »
    JihadJesus wrote: »
    Zampanov wrote: »
    urahonky wrote: »
    He was in the middle of a war zone. Chances are something bad is going to happen to him... There's no way that God would kill this one man just to "punish" America for being tolerant of gays.

    Wait why am I trying to rationalize this...?

    DINGDINGDINGDINGDING

    You know what's really, really awesome? These bigotted fucktwads will get a punishment far worse than we could ever give them for protesting: they get to live over the course of the next several decades watching gay rights become more and more normalized and their insanity become more and more fringe, and finally have to face the painful realization, as they lie dying, that their God isn't coming to put those dirty gays back in their place.

    Or they could just be dellusional fruitbags and think it'll be more to their liking in heaven. Probably that. [tiny]but my version is better[/tiny]

    Mostly I hate them, then I laugh at them, but on some level I really do pity them. To be so afraid and angry all the time must be miserable.

    The impression I get of them is that they are very happy because they enjoy thinking that the rest of the world is going to Hell.

  • JHunzJHunz Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    The Scribe wrote: »
    I do not take the Westboro Baptist Church seriously enough to worry about it. I think it is hilarious. Then again, I have never lost a friend or relative in Afghanistan or Iraq.

    Westboro Baptist Church sings "God Hates the World."
    Spoiler:
    That's actually rather a catchy tune.

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