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Where art thou D&D games?

Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
edited October 2010 in Games and Technology
I guess this is sort of a niche topic that doesn't fit in any one thread, but where the goose are all the D&D games / games set in that universe?

So, in the golden age of PC gaming we had Baldurs Gate, Baldurs Gate 2, Neverwinter Nights etc...

Then, we got the horrible NWN2, with it's poor optimization and lack of quality custom campaigns (with some exeptions).

And then what? Dragon Age? do me a favour, it's not got one ounce of the charm of a D&D universe, it's so generic it's not even funny.

I am thinking of games where you pick a beautifully illustrated portrait, create a character from a massive amount of class combinations and go on adventures. Games with custom content made by the devs and the community rather than paid DLC.

Why has no game managed, even with all our tech, to re-create the table top game in any meaningfull way? the closest I saw (in spirit) was D&D tactics on the PSP but the UI was fail and it had no community. Why can't somone make a turn based D&D game for the iPhone? it would be so well suited to the interface.

I know the NW game is on the horizon but we all know full well it will be limited (only 3 classes iirc) and just a Dragon age clone.

I wouldn't mind so much if NWN Diamond was on Steam, but I lost my CD keys (and even CD's probably now) so I can't even go retro with it, but with todays PC's I should be able to play D&D online with friends in a turn based oil painting of a game...

/rant over

Anyone else hark for D&D RPG's of old?

Venkman90 on

Posts

  • Xenogears of BoreXenogears of Bore Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    That is not what I'd consider the golden age of PC gaming.

    The real golden age of PC gaming did contain a bunch of great D&D games though, so I'll forgive you for that.

    I also agree with you completely on the quality of DA. It's generic as all hell.

    They've announced a game based on 4th edition. It's got a lot of detractors though.

    3DS CODE: 3093-7068-3576
  • Captain KCaptain K Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Didn't Bioware try and fail to make another game with a D&D license? And it instead became Dragon Age?

  • Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    They've announced a game based on 4th edition. It's got a lot of detractors though.

    Yeah I think that's the NW one, but from what I have seen so far it's got 3 classes and is a real time ARPG.

  • JintorJintor Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

  • EchoEcho very gravitas Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited October 2010
    Jintor wrote: »
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

    Yeah, I quickly browsed through the new stuff and it really felt like someone tried to cram MMO concepts into the new class designs.

  • CherrnCherrn Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Really, just copy-pasting the ruleset from 4E into a game would make a better MMO than D&D Online.

    I don't really have high hopes for that new Neverwinter thing. It's probably just going to be another hack 'n' slash whose only redeeming factor is co-op.

    All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
  • KlatuKlatu Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Echo wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

    Yeah, I quickly browsed through the new stuff and it really felt like someone tried to cram MMO concepts into the new class designs.

    I thought exactly the same thing when I read over the 4E ruleset the first time.

    Also, I'd be happy seeing Pool of Radiance / Curse of the Azure Bonds etc on the ipad/iphone... :)

    Steam id:Klatu - PS3 id: Klatu_PA - 3DS FC: 0920-0528-6680
  • XagarathXagarath Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    To be honest, 2E was actually the best ruleset of D&D for videogame purposes. The clunky rules were hidden, and the much more open approach to scaling made for a less linear experience, where battles in BG2 came down to tactics rather than to character level.
    3E and 4E are so utterly rigidly tied to their level structure that producing anything except an MMO-type experience with them is next to impossible.

  • EvilBadmanEvilBadman DO NOT TRUST THIS MAN Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Xagarath wrote: »
    To be honest, 2E was actually the best ruleset of D&D for videogame purposes. The clunky rules were hidden, and the much more open approach to scaling made for a less linear experience, where battles in BG2 came down to tactics rather than to character level.
    3E and 4E are so utterly rigidly tied to their level structure that producing anything except an MMO-type experience with them is next to impossible.

    I disagree, a well maintained crew of characters working smartly can defeat foes beyond their "level" even in the current D&D incarnation.

    As such, I'd buy the fuck out of a 4E non-mmo tactical RPG. And I'm sure I'm not the only one on that boat.

    FyreWulff wrote: »
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  • SimpsonsParadoxSimpsonsParadox Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Echo wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

    Yeah, I quickly browsed through the new stuff and it really felt like someone tried to cram MMO concepts into the new class designs.

    Not really. Yes, they use concepts from video games to help describe classes, but that usually only goes skin deep, and is mostly for familiarizing people new to DnD with how stuff works. I don't think it'd really work well as a video game, as alot of the huge customization having large effects and such was toned heavily down for 4E, which focuses much more on interaction with the DM and things of that manner.

  • kaleeditykaleedity Sometimes science is more art than science Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Xagarath wrote: »
    To be honest, 2E was actually the best ruleset of D&D for videogame purposes. The clunky rules were hidden, and the much more open approach to scaling made for a less linear experience, where battles in BG2 came down to tactics rather than to character level.
    3E and 4E are so utterly rigidly tied to their level structure that producing anything except an MMO-type experience with them is next to impossible.

    "tactics" meaning ridiculously overpowered shit for the level

  • zerg rushzerg rush Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Temple of Elemental Evil is the trump card of perfect PnP-to-computer DnD translation. It's also like 4 hours long and buggy as shit.

    Storm of Zehir is also fairly faithful to PnP DnD. It too is like 4 hours long.

  • SyrionusSyrionus Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Venkman90 wrote: »
    They've announced a game based on 4th edition. It's got a lot of detractors though.

    Yeah I think that's the NW one, but from what I have seen so far it's got 3 classes and is a real time ARPG.

    Where can I get information on this game? Sounds almost like Demon Stone. Anyway, I think it would at least be interesting to check out.

  • lostcawzlostcawz Registered User
    edited October 2010
    Temple of Elemental Evil is the trump card of perfect PnP-to-computer DnD translation. It's also like 4 hours long and buggy as shit.

    Incidentally, ToEE just came out on GoG. And with the Circle of Eight mod it is pretty much brilliant. All the major concerns with bugs and whatnot are modded away. I don't recall it being short either. It is heavy on the tactical battles (in a good way) and has an odd interface. Also, its very faithful to the original PnP module for those old enough to remember it.

    Vantheron: Captain on Landroval
  • EggPuppetEggPuppet Registered User
    edited October 2010
    kaleedity wrote: »
    Xagarath wrote: »
    To be honest, 2E was actually the best ruleset of D&D for videogame purposes. The clunky rules were hidden, and the much more open approach to scaling made for a less linear experience, where battles in BG2 came down to tactics rather than to character level.
    3E and 4E are so utterly rigidly tied to their level structure that producing anything except an MMO-type experience with them is next to impossible.

    "tactics" meaning ridiculously overpowered shit for the level

    Lightning Bolt!

  • PolloDiabloPolloDiablo Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    lostcawz wrote: »
    Temple of Elemental Evil is the trump card of perfect PnP-to-computer DnD translation. It's also like 4 hours long and buggy as shit.

    Incidentally, ToEE just came out on GoG. And with the Circle of Eight mod it is pretty much brilliant. All the major concerns with bugs and whatnot are modded away. I don't recall it being short either. It is heavy on the tactical battles (in a good way) and has an odd interface. Also, its very faithful to the original PnP module for those old enough to remember it.

    Interesting. I've still got my disc version, maybe I'll try the mod. I remember the first time I played, I wandered into this place, inspected some chair, and a demon burst out screaming I had outwitted him and I won the game. Then I uninstalled it.

    Be excellent to each other you stupid cunts.
  • Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Syrionus wrote: »
    Venkman90 wrote: »
    They've announced a game based on 4th edition. It's got a lot of detractors though.

    Yeah I think that's the NW one, but from what I have seen so far it's got 3 classes and is a real time ARPG.

    Where can I get information on this game? Sounds almost like Demon Stone. Anyway, I think it would at least be interesting to check out.

    Well:

    http://crypticstudios.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=299&Itemid=31

    Actually this sounds not too bad:
    In Neverwinter, players choose to become one of five classic D&D classes and team up with friends or computer-controlled allies to form five-person co-op groups. Players also create their own storylines and quests utilizing an extremely user-friendly content generation system, tentatively codenamed Forge.

    “Wizards of the Coast is excited to invite millions of fans back to Neverwinter with the launch of R.A. Salvatore’s Gauntlgrym,” said Liz Schuh, Brand Director for Dungeons & Dragons at Wizards of the Coast. “And we’re excited about the prospects for great digital gaming experiences based on this epic world.”

    Neverwinter for PC is scheduled to release in Q4 2011 and is part of a multi-platform event, including a book trilogy from New York Times best-selling author R. A. Salvatore and a tabletop roleplaying game from Wizards of the Coast. Book one in Salvatore’s Neverwinter trilogy, titled Gauntlgrym, releases on October 5 of this year and lays the groundwork for the Neverwinter storyline. The novel previews the settings, characters and monsters from the PC game and details the events that lead up to this highly anticipated PC gaming experience.

    But I was sure I read it was for consoles too and was just an ARPG, so go figure, it might actually be good....

  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Klatu wrote: »
    Echo wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

    Yeah, I quickly browsed through the new stuff and it really felt like someone tried to cram MMO concepts into the new class designs.

    I thought exactly the same thing when I read over the 4E ruleset the first time.

    These are goosily bass-ackwards opinions, and you should be ashamed for having them.

    Where do you think MMOs got the concept of Tank / Healer / DPS from? That's right, D&D, with its Fighter / Cleric / Wizard / Thief archetypical party. He'll we even called our Fighters and Paladins "Tanks" long before any meaningfully large MMO came out.

    All 4E did was acknowledge that those terms had entered the more common lexicon, and then actually build in mechanical support for the various class roles to actually do what they were supposed to. It has *always* been the Fighter's job to be a heavy-armor-wearing meat-shield and protect the wizard. Now the class actually has abilities which let him do that beyond the DM decided to be a nice guy.

  • MKRMKR Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Dungeons & Dragons Online is decent if you've got a group to play with.

  • descdesc the '87 stick up kids Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    I want an srpg/tactics-y game based on 4E. If you gave me the equivalent of FF:T or Tactics Ogre built on 4E, I'd go insane on it.

    Why this doesn't exist is baffling to me.

  • EshEsh Sunshine! Kittens! Rainbows! Smiles! Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited October 2010
    That is not what I'd consider the golden age of PC gaming.

    The real golden age of PC gaming did contain a bunch of great D&D games though, so I'll forgive you for that.

    Came in to say this. The Gold Box games came out when I was in my early teens and they just about ruled my world. Playing them in order and transferring characters through them was the best.

    "At first he thought it might be a natural occurrence - maybe a rabbit. But upon closer inspection, it was clear a knife had been used. And rabbits don't carry knives."
  • corky842corky842 Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    desc wrote: »
    I want an srpg/tactics-y game based on 4E. If you gave me the equivalent of FF:T or Tactics Ogre built on 4E, I'd go insane on it.

    Why this doesn't exist is baffling to me.

    There was Dungeons and Dragons Tactics (based on 3.5E) for the PSP, but the non-battle interface was horrible and killed it.

    Darmak wrote: »
    Something is wrong with me
  • kaleeditykaleedity Sometimes science is more art than science Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Elvenshae wrote: »
    Klatu wrote: »
    Echo wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    4E seems built for videogaming, man. Dunno why nobody's levereging that stuff.

    Yeah, I quickly browsed through the new stuff and it really felt like someone tried to cram MMO concepts into the new class designs.

    I thought exactly the same thing when I read over the 4E ruleset the first time.

    These are goosily bass-ackwards opinions, and you should be ashamed for having them.

    Where do you think MMOs got the concept of Tank / Healer / DPS from? That's right, D&D, with its Fighter / Cleric / Wizard / Thief archetypical party. He'll we even called our Fighters and Paladins "Tanks" long before any meaningfully large MMO came out.

    All 4E did was acknowledge that those terms had entered the more common lexicon, and then actually build in mechanical support for the various class roles to actually do what they were supposed to. It has *always* been the Fighter's job to be a heavy-armor-wearing meat-shield and protect the wizard. Now the class actually has abilities which let him do that beyond the DM decided to be a nice guy.
    mmos were directly based on d&d. They stratified those group archetypes so you could have shitloads of classes and/or program things easily in a sort-of-maybe balanced fashion. d&d definitely initialized those concepts, but 4e definitely borrowed from the stratifications present in the mmo market. Concepts like "The tank should do less damage than the dps/striker" wasn't something present in older editions of d&d where barbarians basically instagibbed everything (while wearing heavy mithril fullplate) that didn't kill or disable them instantly while the rogue cried on 60-70% of encounters

    there's nothing wrong with this.

  • CindersCinders Man, this is some Cinderella bullshit, man Estrogen, Depilation, ZoroastrianismRegistered User regular
    edited October 2010
    The D&D beat-em-ups were the best D&D games.

  • MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    The old SSI games are/were perfection in my eyes. I don't know how much of that is straight-up nostalgia though. Eye of the Beholder and Dungeon Hack remain some of my favorite games.

    14271f3c-c765-4e74-92b1-49d7612675f2.jpg
  • EshEsh Sunshine! Kittens! Rainbows! Smiles! Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Malkor wrote: »
    The old SSI games are/were perfection in my eyes. I don't know how much of that is straight-up nostalgia though. Eye of the Beholder and Dungeon Hack remain some of my favorite games.

    The only disappointing D&D SSI game for me was Hillsfar. That was a big pile of "Meh".

    "At first he thought it might be a natural occurrence - maybe a rabbit. But upon closer inspection, it was clear a knife had been used. And rabbits don't carry knives."
  • Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    corky842 wrote: »
    desc wrote: »
    I want an srpg/tactics-y game based on 4E. If you gave me the equivalent of FF:T or Tactics Ogre built on 4E, I'd go insane on it.

    Why this doesn't exist is baffling to me.

    There was Dungeons and Dragons Tactics (based on 3.5E) for the PSP, but the non-battle interface was horrible and killed it.

    See, the idea was solid, an updated version on the iOS platform with modules as in app purchases would roll fucking twenty's.

  • PolloDiabloPolloDiablo Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Malkor wrote: »
    The old SSI games are/were perfection in my eyes. I don't know how much of that is straight-up nostalgia though. Eye of the Beholder and Dungeon Hack remain some of my favorite games.

    They should just do a straight-up remake of one or many of them. I don't know why they don't. Actually, is it just my memory, or did Eye of the Beholder get ported to something modern not long ago?

    Be excellent to each other you stupid cunts.
  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Malkor wrote: »
    The old SSI games are/were perfection in my eyes. I don't know how much of that is straight-up nostalgia though. Eye of the Beholder and Dungeon Hack remain some of my favorite games.

    They should just do a straight-up remake of one or many of them. I don't know why they don't. Actually, is it just my memory, or did Eye of the Beholder get ported to something modern not long ago?

    There's a GBA EotB game with 3rd Edition rules. It was ... I'm not a huge fan.

  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous WALK 3X FASTER New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Cherrn wrote: »
    Really, just copy-pasting the ruleset from 4E into a game would make a better MMO than D&D Online.

    It really wouldn't, since the meat of the system is pretty much based around tactical positioning and movement, and that's not exactly something that translates to real-time particularly well.


    Consequently, it would make an amazing FFT-style game.

    zaku.png
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: WaffleMous#1483
  • Silas BrownSilas Brown Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    I'd play 4E videogame where the battles transitioned to a SRPG format so hard. Bonus points if it featured a toolset to create and run your own scenarios. Basically NWN for 4E, without trying to hide the fact that battles are clearly turn-based.

    Mmmmm.

    CmgpQ.jpg
  • tofutofu Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Dragon Age is a lot of fun. The setting wasn't really more generic than most of D&D

  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous WALK 3X FASTER New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    The Setting was unique enough, being set in whats meant to be a backwater shithole country, with jewish elves, evil byzantine dwarves, and attitudes towards magic that make Warhammer's old world look like a shining beacon of tolerance.

    zaku.png
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: WaffleMous#1483
  • Ain SophAin Soph Registered User
    edited October 2010
    WotC doesn't like to work with competent video game devs. Thus no SRPG version of 4e, which people have been asking for since 4e came out.

    However, If you can be satisfied with the old school CRPG feel, then I'd recommend Eschalon: Book 1 & 2. I had a lot of fun with both.

    :whistle:
  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous WALK 3X FASTER New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Can't really give it to competant devs since Atari has a death-grip on those rights.


    I'm pretty sure they're only doing Neverwinter so they don't lose the license, as evidenced by giving the project to Cryptic.

    zaku.png
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  • AntimatterAntimatter if you want to talk to me look elsewhere.Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Why the devil isn't there a Fire Emblem-esque 4th Edition game? The emphasis on grid based gameplay is begging for it.

  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    lostcawz wrote: »
    Temple of Elemental Evil is the trump card of perfect PnP-to-computer DnD translation. It's also like 4 hours long and buggy as shit.

    Incidentally, ToEE just came out on GoG. And with the Circle of Eight mod it is pretty much brilliant. All the major concerns with bugs and whatnot are modded away. I don't recall it being short either. It is heavy on the tactical battles (in a good way) and has an odd interface. Also, its very faithful to the original PnP module for those old enough to remember it.

    Interesting. I've still got my disc version, maybe I'll try the mod. I remember the first time I played, I wandered into this place, inspected some chair, and a demon burst out screaming I had outwitted him and I won the game. Then I uninstalled it.

    Did this really happen? You accidentally beat the game by finding the secret first thing, or because it bugged?

    Brave Frontier for Android and iOS. Final Fantasy-ish graphics/basic gameplay with a Puzzles & Dragons/Rage of Bahamut collection model.
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  • takyristakyris Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Antimatter wrote: »
    Why the devil isn't there a Fire Emblem-esque 4th Edition game? The emphasis on grid based gameplay is begging for it.

    Yesssssssss. I would buy that so hard.

    And then miss with my daily on every mission.

    Dox the PI wrote:
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  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered User regular
    edited October 2010
    Can't really give it to competant devs since Atari has a death-grip on those rights.


    I'm pretty sure they're only doing Neverwinter so they don't lose the license, as evidenced by giving the project to Cryptic.

    I do belive Hasbro (owners of WotC, and ergo, the D&D lisence) is try to end thier deal with Atari...

    Fake Edit: Yep, They are... or at least, they were trying a year ago...

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