As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/

State of the Union thread - Tuesday (January 25th) at 9 PM

12324252628

Posts

  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Especially when it means we always fucking lose and nothing ever fucking changes, so the same damn thing can happen several months later. But have fun there on your immobile high horse.

    Captain Carrot on
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Democrats must be cautious and respectful about suggesting that when someone shoots several people, including a federal judge and a member of Congress, and has deranged rants on youtube and paper, maybe we should think about doing something about mental health care in this country. Republicans take a couple of days off, then immediately scream that we should speak just as we have been, and the bitch deserved it, and shame on those Democrats for exploiting this tragedy.

    What would really have helped in this case? Should he have been involuntarily commited, did he just need more help available to him, what?

    HamHamJ on
    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Especially when it means we always fucking lose and nothing ever fucking changes, so the same damn thing can happen several months later. But have fun there on your immobile high horse.

    Neither of these are true.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Especially when it means we always fucking lose and nothing ever fucking changes, so the same damn thing can happen several months later. But have fun there on your immobile high horse.

    Neither of these are true.

    Really? So we haven't had several shootings inspired by right-wing ideologues in the past few years? Something has been done about the root causes of those deaths? News to me.

    Captain Carrot on
  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I'd be willing to bet that a moderately-sized, and very vocal, portion of Americans would stand up and throw a fucking shit-fit if you try to take away anything that has to do with guns. Extended magazines included.

    Extended magazines were already banned under the (admittedly flawed) assault weapons ban.

    Nobody outside of the NRA and their sockpuppets threw a fucking shit-fit.

    Dick Motherfucking Cheney has recently gone on record saying that a ban on extended magazines makes sense.

    Of course, with the GOP in control of the house, no gun control legislation at all will ever become law unless it weakens gun control even further.

    Lawndart on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Especially when it means we always fucking lose and nothing ever fucking changes, so the same damn thing can happen several months later. But have fun there on your immobile high horse.

    Neither of these are true.

    Really? So we haven't had several shootings inspired by right-wing ideologues in the past few years? Something has been done about the root causes of those deaths? News to me.

    I'm assuming by thing you mean national policy and by always lose you mean elections?

    Because this simply isn't the case.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Especially when it means we always fucking lose and nothing ever fucking changes, so the same damn thing can happen several months later. But have fun there on your immobile high horse.

    Neither of these are true.

    Really? So we haven't had several shootings inspired by right-wing ideologues in the past few years? Something has been done about the root causes of those deaths? News to me.

    I'm assuming by thing you mean national policy and by always lose you mean elections?

    Because this simply isn't the case.

    Actually, no, I don't mean either of those.

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Then you're being specific about gun control?

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Gun control and mental health care in this case, infrastructure spending in Minnesota. Liberals suggest that we should fix something, and conservatives trumpet that this is the greatest nation on Earth and we don't need to fix anything ever, merely implying that something is wrong is treasonous.

    Captain Carrot on
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    You're not getting a magazine restriction through this House anyway. Republicans lost the ability to be reasonable on gun control somewhere around the 2000 elections.

    OptimusZed on
    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Gun control in this case, infrastructure spending in Minnesota. Liberals suggest that we should fix something, and conservatives trumpet that this is the greatest nation on Earth and we don't need to fix anything ever, merely implying that something is wrong is treasonous.

    Well of course we always lose and nothing changes when you only include issues we lost on.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Gun control in this case, infrastructure spending in Minnesota. Liberals suggest that we should fix something, and conservatives trumpet that this is the greatest nation on Earth and we don't need to fix anything ever, merely implying that something is wrong is treasonous.

    Well of course we always lose and nothing changes when you only include issues we lost on.

    Then name something where we won.

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Gun control in this case, infrastructure spending in Minnesota. Liberals suggest that we should fix something, and conservatives trumpet that this is the greatest nation on Earth and we don't need to fix anything ever, merely implying that something is wrong is treasonous.

    Well of course we always lose and nothing changes when you only include issues we lost on.

    Then name something where we won.

    DADT

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Lawndart wrote: »
    I'd be willing to bet that a moderately-sized, and very vocal, portion of Americans would stand up and throw a fucking shit-fit if you try to take away anything that has to do with guns. Extended magazines included.

    Extended magazines were already banned under the (admittedly flawed) assault weapons ban.

    Nobody outside of the NRA and their sockpuppets threw a fucking shit-fit.

    Dick Motherfucking Cheney has recently gone on record saying that a ban on extended magazines makes sense.

    Of course, with the GOP in control of the house, no gun control legislation at all will ever become law unless it weakens gun control even further.

    Is this the same Cheney that voted against banning things such as plastic guns? I didn't think he had received his heart transplant yet...

    Tomanta on
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Gun control in this case, infrastructure spending in Minnesota. Liberals suggest that we should fix something, and conservatives trumpet that this is the greatest nation on Earth and we don't need to fix anything ever, merely implying that something is wrong is treasonous.

    Well of course we always lose and nothing changes when you only include issues we lost on.

    Then name something where we won.

    DADT

    Healthcare
    Stimulus
    Saving GM
    Financial regulation
    Extending unemployment benefits
    Drawdown in Iraq
    START treaty
    Fair Pay Act
    Student Loan reform
    Reduction of disparity between crack and powder cocaine sentencing
    9/11 healthcare
    Civilian trial of Terrorists

    Speaker on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    And that's like two years with huge republican resistance.

    We win all the time, its just D&D is a massive fucking gloom generator that sees doom written on every wall.

    I think this is because its dark and dank in mother's basement.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    Captain Carrot on
  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Those were all actually losses Styro, because they didn't happen exactly the way Jane Hampshire, Paul Krugman and Kos wanted them to happen.

    Our defeats are unending.

    Speaker on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    By all means clarify which hoops I should jump through.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    By all means clarify which hoops I should jump through.
    We were talking about tragedies where people were killed, Democrats tried to fix what went wrong, conservatives ARGLBARGLed about everything being fine, and Democrats were not able to fix anything. So please name something where the last part went differently, because apparently I need to hold your hand to make sure you don't forget what you said ten minutes ago.

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    By all means clarify which hoops I should jump through.
    We were talking about tragedies where people were killed, Democrats tried to fix what went wrong, conservatives ARGLBARGLed about everything being fine, and Democrats were not able to fix anything. So please name something where the last part went differently, because apparently I need to hold your hand to make sure you don't forget what you said ten minutes ago.

    Is health care reform narrow enough to fit your mold?

    And gun control isn't going to stop random acts of violence.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    By all means clarify which hoops I should jump through.
    We were talking about tragedies where people were killed, Democrats tried to fix what went wrong, conservatives ARGLBARGLed about everything being fine, and Democrats were not able to fix anything. So please name something where the last part went differently, because apparently I need to hold your hand to make sure you don't forget what you said ten minutes ago.

    Is health care reform narrow enough to fit your mold?
    No, because it's not like what happened in Tucson or Minnesota at all.
    Sammich wrote:
    And gun control isn't going to stop random acts of violence.
    It will ameliorate them.

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    How is that similar to the collapsed bridge or Tucson?
    Then name something where we won.
    So you decided to ignore the previous context of the discussion. Gotcha.

    By all means clarify which hoops I should jump through.
    We were talking about tragedies where people were killed, Democrats tried to fix what went wrong, conservatives ARGLBARGLed about everything being fine, and Democrats were not able to fix anything. So please name something where the last part went differently, because apparently I need to hold your hand to make sure you don't forget what you said ten minutes ago.

    Is health care reform narrow enough to fit your mold?
    No, because it's not like what happened in Tucson or Minnesota at all.

    Its shame the GOP has such a lock on reactionary politics. And things like the Minnesota bridge collapse are what are driving the current efforts to expand infrastructure spending.
    It will ameliorate them.

    Maybe, maybe not.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Sammich wrote:
    And things like the Minnesota bridge collapse are what are driving the current efforts to expand infrastructure spending.
    Given that it happened multiple years ago, I kinda doubt this is in response to that.
    Sammich wrote:
    Maybe, maybe not.
    If Loughner had not been able to get a gun, he would not have shot twenty people. Is that really a controversial statement?

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Sammich wrote:
    And things like the Minnesota bridge collapse are what are driving the current efforts to expand infrastructure spending.
    Given that it happened multiple years ago, I kinda doubt this is in response to that.
    Sammich wrote:
    Maybe, maybe not.
    If Loughner had not been able to get a gun, he would not have shot twenty people. Is that really a controversial statement?

    No, the bridge collapse and things like it are what are fueling it. Sorry it wasn't fast enough for you.

    Sure he might not have, but the guy after him who wanted to kill people might make a bomb, or modify another gun or etc. etc. etc.

    Reactionary policy decisions are bad.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • OctoparrotOctoparrot Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Sammich wrote:
    And things like the Minnesota bridge collapse are what are driving the current efforts to expand infrastructure spending.
    Given that it happened multiple years ago, I kinda doubt this is in response to that.
    Sammich wrote:
    Maybe, maybe not.
    If Loughner had not been able to get a gun, he would not have shot twenty people. Is that really a controversial statement?

    No, the bridge collapse and things like it are what are fueling it. Sorry it wasn't fast enough for you.

    Sure he might not have, but the guy after him who wanted to kill people might make a bomb, or modify another gun or etc. etc. etc.

    Reactionary policy decisions are bad.

    This is the exact same reason we're all pissed off about TSA.
    ...you have absolutely no evidence that scanning or groping does anything at all.

    Octoparrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    This is the exact same reason we're all pissed off about TSA.

    Yup. I don't mind reasonable screening of course, metal detectors or what have you but its gotten overboard as a result of reactionary policy decisions.

    I think one of the democrats strongest features is their lack of support for reactionary measures compared to the GOP.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Sammich wrote:
    And things like the Minnesota bridge collapse are what are driving the current efforts to expand infrastructure spending.
    Given that it happened multiple years ago, I kinda doubt this is in response to that.
    Sammich wrote:
    Maybe, maybe not.
    If Loughner had not been able to get a gun, he would not have shot twenty people. Is that really a controversial statement?

    Is buying a gun from an authorized vendor the only way to injure or kill people milling around in a crowd?

    Speaker on
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    It's certainly the easiest way. Last I checked, making dangerous things less accessible for mentally ill people was a good thing, not a "Meh, he'll just get it somewhere, why bother?".

    Captain Carrot on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    You're essentially advocating using a tragedy to further a political goal that may or may not have anything to do with the actual event.

    This is no less shitty when democrats do it than when the GOP does it.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    A mentally ill young man with no technical expertise is not constructing a viable bomb. At least not on with a reasonable chance of exploding when he wants it to.

    A mentally ill young man with a knife gets a couple of people before the rest scatter.

    The amount of damage he did can be traced straight back to the tools he had access to.

    OptimusZed on
    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    It's certainly the easiest way. Last I checked, making dangerous things less accessible for mentally ill people was a good thing, not a "Meh, he'll just get it somewhere, why bother?".

    One wonders whether Jared had a driver's license.

    Or perhaps a credit card and the ability to walk to a store and buy chemicals.

    Speaker on
  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    when was the last hit and run you've heard of that killed 6 people?

    nexuscrawler on
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    when was the last hit and run you've heard of that killed 6 people?
    And injured 20.

    And managed to get that close to a crowd without someone screaming a warning.

    OptimusZed on
    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    You're essentially advocating using a tragedy to further a political goal that may or may not have anything to do with the actual event.
    No, I'm advocating that when something shitty happens, we try to fix what caused it. Not something unrelated.

    Captain Carrot on
  • FyreWulffFyreWulff YouRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    when was the last hit and run you've heard of that killed 6 people?
    And injured 20.

    And managed to get that close to a crowd without someone screaming a warning.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akihabara_massacre

    FyreWulff on
  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    when was the last hit and run you've heard of that killed 6 people?

    I guy having a schizophrenic episode drove a car into the first floor of a house two towns over from me about three months ago.

    Does that count?

    Speaker on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    You're essentially advocating using a tragedy to further a political goal that may or may not have anything to do with the actual event.
    No, I'm advocating that when something shitty happens, we try to fix what caused it. Not something unrelated.

    Pretty sure access to extended magazines didn't cause this.

    A seriously unbalanced man who didn't get the treatment he needed caused this.

    But really, all you're saying is the GOP is better at reactionary law making. I'm ok with this. We get plenty of good things done, things that solve or alleviate real problems, not feel good legislation that may or may not do something about nationally prominent event X

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
This discussion has been closed.