Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

[Let's Read] Rifts: A Wide Wide World of Weirdness

1235720

Posts

  • totallytotally Registered User
    edited January 2011
    As a owner of the TMNT and Robotech RPG books I strongly approve of this thread. Thank you.

    GT: totallyrobot GSID: totallytotally
  • Xenogear_0001Xenogear_0001 Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I once found conversions online for all of the Macross (not Robotech) veritechs, cruisers, and battleships so they could be used in the Rifts Megaverse. And it went across all of the various series. So awesome. Had color pictures and everything.

    steam_sig.png
  • The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    The only person I've ever seen with my own eyes GM a Rifts game that wasn't me decided that psi-swords ignored physical armor because they were basically Psylocke's psiblade.

    Cue the party cyber-knight killing 4 SAMAS in one round.

    lulz

    Must've been awfully messy work trying to get those suits re-purposed for other players. :P


    As a side tangent, use of the word 'Psylocke' conjures images in my head of a stealthily super-hot girl I knew who did a Psylocke cosplay that was so right, and causes me to drool uncontrollably.


    You owe me a new keyboard.

    TOG Solid wrote:
    If that guy wasn't white he would have gotten popped by so many tasers simultaneously that Marvel could use that as the new origin for Electro.
  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I loved Robotech/Macross. My love for the setting overcame a lot of Palladium rules grief.

    Games & Characters:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I played a lot of Robotech back in the day. Mostly REF/Sentinels, though. Zentran Cyclone Ryder 4 Lyfe.

    Saber, obviously.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • Momento MoriMomento Mori Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Original Macross forever. I remember having to memorize the welcome to Macross Island speech from the airshow in episode 1 "Booby trap" for my first session, good times.

    Also my group removed a lot of the ridiculous stuff, like the GODS from the conversion books. Anything that clearly was not an enemy Boss-Fight (i.e. Dragons, Powerful Demons, Great Old Ones, etc.) but was on a divergent power scale was removed. In the fancy RPG terminology of today it pretty severely de-protagonized the players. Actually we went further and made alot of the "Cool" PC O.C.C.s more rare so that you could say "Shit, is that a.......Glitter Boy!" Much better for my experience than oh, you guys are from Quebec then eh?

    Spoiler:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Cyber-Knights: Cyber Armor is Sexay

    What do you get when you combine a circa-1880 Texas Ranger, the Dhali Lama, Psylocke and a tin can?

    This guy;

    cyberknight.jpg
    Penis helmet not standard.

    This crusader for truth, justice and comprehensive Sex Ed is a Cyber-Knight. Trained at the foot of an elder, a la Kung Fu, and set loose on the world to do right and good, and to smite evil and bad. Part soldier, part folk hero, part ninja assassin, Cyber-Knights are associated with free humanity (that unaffiliated with the Coalition) and basically just righting wrongs for anyone anywhere that they happen to come across in their travels. They are the Knight Errants of Rifts earth.

    Historically, Cyber-Knights were the second group to step up and defend people, human and otherwise, after the cataclysm. The first were the Glitter Boys, operated by the remnants of the old earth militaries, then passed on to heirs through the generations. Where the Glitter Boys were the leveraging of the old world against the new, the Cyber-Knights were the result of a few good souls embracing the realities of the new world and using them to help carve a place for peaceful people in it. Unlike either the Glitter Boys or the Coalition, Cyber-Knights never had a human-centric mandate, instead defending and bringing aid to any who needed it, be they human or D-Bee. In the main book, Cyber-Knights are the only class that really screams "if you play this you're signing up to be one of the good guys."

    The typical Cyber-Knight is human (though smart players will try to find a way around this to grab a set of juicy R.C.C. bonuses), and began training at an early age. Would-be Cyber-Knights are apprenticed to an established Knight, and put through a rigorous series of training regimens and tests to determine their worthiness of the title. These include days-long meditation, combat training, philosophical instruction, etc. A squired Cyber-Knight finally becomes a full Knight on the day he first conjures his Psi-Sword, the glowing omni-directional blade that acts as the symbol of the Knighthood.

    Sound familiar? At all?
    Spoiler:

    Come on. How could you not see that?

    Pretty obviously, the Cyber-Knights are a blatant Jedi clone. In fairness, though, they are a Jedi clone with a distinctly Rifts twist. Rather than a mechanomagical sword, they craft one out of raw mental energy. Instead of deflecting incoming fire with it, they're implanted with extra-dermal cyber armor to absorb attacks. Unlike the originals, who can routinely move things with their mind, heal themselves or others using magical powers and shoot lightning should the need arise, Cyber-Knights get to pick from a very limited set of powers, and only then if they pass one of the common "percentile roll for psionics" that we'll see over and over again in this thread.

    Here are the powers they can pick from;

    Empathy
    Mind block
    Object read
    See the invisible
    Sense evil
    Sense magic
    Sixth sense
    Speed reading
    Summon inner strength

    Those readers that are familiar with both the Palladium psionics system and the various iterations of the D&D Paladin will notice some similarities here. One has to imagine that's intentional. While much of the inspiration for the Cyber-Knight was obviously drawn from the Jedi Knights, a similar amount was pulled from popular consciousness regarding the same mythical mystical Christian Knights that gave rise to the Paladin from D&D, or indeed directly from that class itself.

    In the main book, Cyber-Knights were a passable combat class when compared with most of the book. They paled in comparison to Juicers, for reasons we'll be covering a few entries down the road. They were right on line with Crazies, without the inherent insanity, with their bonus attack, and comparable to Borgs in that they were a mega damage creature thanks to their cyber armor, even if they weren't nearly as durable as a full conversion cyborg. Whether you wanted a Cyber-Knight or a Glitter Boy in the party really boiled down to how obvious of a target you wanted to make the group.

    Appropriately, the Cyber-Knight fit a similar mold to that of the Paladin in most D&D groups, that of front-line warrior and moral compass. In true Rifts style, though, Cyber-Knights were rarely as stodgy as their D&D counterparts, and they had some SUPER KEWL AWESUM POWERZ to make them more than just a Fighter with a stick lodged firmly in the rectum.

    horseback.jpg
    Robo-Horsie optional.

    Later, as with so many other things that gained a fan following in Rifts, the Cyber-Knights got their own sourcebook. One in which they got considerably sexier.

    sexay.jpg
    Scarred up badass beefcake for all!

    Mostly they got sexier mechanically, though. In their first appearance, Cyber-Knights got 1d4 to most attributes, +1 Attack per Melee, cyber armor, the Psi-Sword and that was about it. The new book introduced alternate psionics for them, fleshed out their place in the world and made them masters of hand to hand combat with their Psi-Swords. It even gave them the ability to dual wield them, because that's how all the cool kids do it.

    knightvjuicer.jpg
    Fightin' Juicers like a boss.

    Moreso than any other class we've explored so far, Cyber-Knights are woven right into the fabric of the setting. Though their influences are obvious, the execution is pure Rifts, and strides have been taken to differentiate them from their inspiration.

    Cyber-Knights are also the most obvious result of Greyhawkism in the core book. The founder of the Cyber-Knights is one Lord Coake, a mysterious man from another dimension who in his time on earth taught a number of close followers the virtues of knighthood and gave them the mission of defending the weak and destroying evil. That Lord Coake was a player character in one of Kevin Siembieda's campaigns, and he wound up being rifted to earth and worked into the overplot for the setting.

    Cyber-Knight has always been one of my favorite classes, both mechanically (because yay for extra attacks!) and in terms of flavor. The one PC that I ever played in an in-person Rifts game was a Cyber-Knight, and he was a lot of fun. I only regretted not going Juicer one time that campaign, but it wound up killing me. I guess that's how it goes.

    Next Time:

    We finally break out the big guns;

    glitter_boy.png

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    They paled in comparison to Juicers

    Cyber-Knights were comparable to Juicers so long as you let them use the projectile parrying rules from the Conversion books and gave them some stupid broken R.C.C. (roll-up an Armored Slayer Cyber-Knight. Fucking one bajillion attacks per melee; see how your GM like those apples).

    TOG Solid wrote:
    If that guy wasn't white he would have gotten popped by so many tasers simultaneously that Marvel could use that as the new origin for Electro.
  • skyknytskyknyt Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2011
    I always loved how Cyber Knights got the absolute worst possible MDC you could ever have - fuckin' MDC with ARMOR CLASS.

    "Yeah I can take that laser shot, just don't roll over 16 or I'll die."

    Tycho wrote:
    [skyknyt's writing] is like come kind of code that, when comprehended, unfolds into madness in the mind of the reader.
    PSN: skyknyt, Steam: skyknyt
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    MDC weapons ignore his AR, though. It's there in case he gets into a fight with someone who only has SDC weapons. Lasers and plasma missiles always hit the armor.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • skyknytskyknyt Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2011
    Is that a recent ruling change, or have I just been terrible at playing rifts for two decades?

    Tycho wrote:
    [skyknyt's writing] is like come kind of code that, when comprehended, unfolds into madness in the mind of the reader.
    PSN: skyknyt, Steam: skyknyt
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Armor Ratings do not apply to combat robots, bionics, power armor, or any Mega-Damage Capacity (M.D.C.) structures. Either you strike and do damage, or you miss.

    Armor Ratings apply only to conventional S.D.C. combat. Armor ratings do not apply when struck/attacked by a weapon that inflicts mega-damage. Of course, one can always attempt to dodge or roll with an attack to avoid or minimize damage.

    It's at the beginning of the combat chapter, right after the silly "dude with bazooka vs tank" combat example. It's pretty easy to miss if you're not looking for it.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • skyknytskyknyt Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2011
    Welp, I never realized that that applied to Cyber Armor.

    Tycho wrote:
    [skyknyt's writing] is like come kind of code that, when comprehended, unfolds into madness in the mind of the reader.
    PSN: skyknyt, Steam: skyknyt
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Yep. As I recall there were some body armors in Robotech or one of its offshoots that were MDC with ARs, just like cyber armor.

    That's probably where I figured out how that rule worked, honestly.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • skyknytskyknyt Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2011
    Well, that would have been nice to know back then, assuming I wasn't playing one of a thousand better RCCs than a human. Ah Rifts, how I still love you even now.

    One of my favorite nerd party games is "Design the most overpowered Rifts character."

    Aside from Scarecrow Burster, that's been disqualified.

    Tycho wrote:
    [skyknyt's writing] is like come kind of code that, when comprehended, unfolds into madness in the mind of the reader.
    PSN: skyknyt, Steam: skyknyt
  • Descendant XDescendant X Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    My brother in law plays Rifts.

    I played (read: rolled characters and did nothing with them) Rifts back in the day.

    This thread has inspired me to call up my brother in law and give it another try.

    steam_sig.png
    3DS: 0533-6031-0948 Feel free to add me.
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    My brother in law plays Rifts.

    I played (read: rolled characters and did nothing with them) Rifts back in the day.

    This thread has inspired me to call up my brother in law and give it another try.
    Spoiler:

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • Momento MoriMomento Mori Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Cyber-Knight has always been one of my favorite classes, both mechanically (because yay for extra attacks!) and in terms of flavor. The one PC that I ever played in an in-person Rifts game was a Cyber-Knight, and he was a lot of fun. I only regretted not going Juicer one time that campaign, but it wound up killing me. I guess that's how it goes.

    Would you mind fleshing that story out, because I really am rather curious. Also though I refrained from weighing in earlier, as long as you included the Triax or Warlords of Russia I always remember the 'Borgs being equal if not a half step above non power armor piloting Juicers. Is my memory broken or did I just game with badly played Juicers?

    Spoiler:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Cyber-Knight has always been one of my favorite classes, both mechanically (because yay for extra attacks!) and in terms of flavor. The one PC that I ever played in an in-person Rifts game was a Cyber-Knight, and he was a lot of fun. I only regretted not going Juicer one time that campaign, but it wound up killing me. I guess that's how it goes.

    Would you mind fleshing that story out, because I really am rather curious. Also though I refrained from weighing in earlier, as long as you included the Triax or Warlords of Russia I always remember the 'Borgs being equal if not a half step above non power armor piloting Juicers. Is my memory broken or did I just game with badly played Juicers?
    I'll be going into more detail when we hit Juicer (hopefully sometime this week). But basically;

    Two extra attacks plus auto-dodge > anything you can do with bionics. Especially once you add in the rocket boots and an M.D. chainsaw.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • ForarForar #432 Already prepping for Toronto Fan Expo!Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    There are ways in the books other than being a Juicer to get an auto-dodge, and if you're a psychic with sixth sense it's basically as good or better for at least the first melee, and I believe the directional danger sense applies for the entire first minute as well.

    >.>

    I may or may not have broken the shit out of anything that could possibly given an auto-dodge to psychics. Including Saber Cyclone piloting for one of my characters.

    The Robotech Saber Cyclone's arm blades being one of the few things (if not the only thing) in any Rifts books with "MDC: Yes." As in, while active, they functionally have no limit to the amount of punishment they can withstand.

    That said, my group treated Rifts like wargaming with RP interludes, so while often toe'ing the edge of our power line, I was rarely far beyond the slew of Mystic Knights (I swear we had every Order of the White Rose in existance in our groups at some point), Lord Magus', Anti-Monsters and Rifts conversions for things like The Predator.

    sigone.png
  • Momento MoriMomento Mori Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    I'll be going into more detail when we hit Juicer (hopefully sometime this week). But basically;

    Two extra attacks plus auto-dodge > anything you can do with bionics. Especially once you add in the rocket boots and an M.D. chainsaw.

    Hmmmm there are a few ways to get more attacks with Bionics, and if auto-parrying with a MD shield doesn't work then just use the extra actions from dual-wield or take Aikido/Kendo. But really I just remember a few occasions where a 'Borg managed to grapple a Juicer and prove why organic insides are not optimal for super-human wrestling matches. Maybe my 'Borg players were just the most power-gamey of the bunch?

    Spoiler:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I know there are ways to get auto-dodge, but there's only one that works with Bionics, and it's incredibly hard to get. Hand to Hand: Commando, level 5. Basically requires the character start as a member of the Coalition expeditionary force. I mean, you could do it, but it's a very specific thing. Edit: I guess there are a couple of martial arts from Japan that have it too.

    As for the psychic means; Sixth Sense doesn't allow auto-dodge. It has some big bonuses associated with it, especially for Initiative, but no mention of an automatic dodge. I can't find Danger Sense or any directional version of it in my books, where did that come from?

    I will agree with you that virtually everyone is better if they're wearing a Saber, though. Those things were crazy awesome.
    Hmmmm there are a few ways to get more attacks with Bionics, and if auto-parrying with a MD shield doesn't work then just use the extra actions from dual-wield or take Aikido/Kendo. But really I just remember a few occasions where a 'Borg managed to grapple a Juicer and prove why organic insides are not optimal for super-human wrestling matches. Maybe my 'Borg players were just the most power-gamey of the bunch?
    You could get more attacks with tiny little arms or tentacles, but those didn't translate well into attacks of any real value unless you had an incredibly powerful handgun or your GM was willing to look the other way and whistle while you made that extra railgun attack with limbs that couldn't lift it and lacked the digits to pull the trigger.

    Being grappled by anything is a Juicer's worst nightmare, not least of which because the grapple rules were terrible. But losing their mobility, their ability to apply two defenses to any attack (auto-parry, auto-dodge) without losing any of their own and basically just being locked in that close of quarters with something they literally couldn't hurt with their bare hands is a terrible situation.

    In a grapple, the borg wins. But that's just about the only situation.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Sure, the Cyclone arm blades may have been able to parry and soak up the hits...but missile splash damage would have killed a dude eventually.

    Remember kids: rediculous does not equal munchkin.

    Games & Characters:
  • ForarForar #432 Already prepping for Toronto Fan Expo!Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    As for the psychic means; Sixth Sense doesn't allow auto-dodge. It has some big bonuses associated with it, especially for Initiative, but no mention of an automatic dodge.

    I never said it did. I believe it's in the text for Sixth Sense which notes that at least during the first melee of a fight the psychic will be aware of all incoming attacks, which is as good as or better than the auto-dodge that Juicers get. Perhaps I wasn't clear, I was just saying that a psychic with 6th sense AND an auto-dodge (through said hand to hands) was thus as good or better than a Juicer in some regards.
    Steelhawk wrote: »
    Sure, the Cyclone arm blades may have been able to parry and soak up the hits...but missile splash damage would have killed a dude eventually.

    Remember kids: rediculous does not equal munchkin.

    Eh, that was something Palladium struggled with throughout the system. Did you apply splash damage to every spot on a mech/power armour? Most pilots would be dead long before you actually punched through the main body if that were the case. Regular armour wearers would likely be in even worse condition.

    But yes, we did note that if someone shot a Cyclone rider with a beam or explosion larger than the couple of feet the blades protected, you were still screwed. Like, the Sabers could withstand a blast from the SDF-1's main cannon (MDC Damage: "Yes. All of it.") for an infintessimal fraction of a second longer than anything else, until the beam obliterated the power source and the blades got vapourized along with everything else.

    Now, if you got a whole bunch of Cyclones and lined up their blades perfectly with no gaps... >.>

    sigone.png
  • Momento MoriMomento Mori Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    You could get more attacks with tiny little arms or tentacles, but those didn't translate well into attacks of any real value unless you had an incredibly powerful handgun or your GM was willing to look the other way and whistle while you made that extra railgun attack with limbs that couldn't lift it and lacked the digits to pull the trigger.

    Being grappled by anything is a Juicer's worst nightmare, not least of which because the grapple rules were terrible. But losing their mobility, their ability to apply two defenses to any attack (auto-parry, auto-dodge) without losing any of their own and basically just being locked in that close of quarters with something they literally couldn't hurt with their bare hands is a terrible situation.

    In a grapple, the borg wins. But that's just about the only situation.

    You could buy integrated weapon systems for +1 Attack period or a totally not dinky real second third or sixteenth set of arms, which I realize all need weapons which in a real campaign just isn't feasible. So on average your still one attack down on the juicer, but you have way more MDC and as long as you are a Heavy Can, took Cyberjet Nodes, or took a Cyborg Jet-pack you put rocket jet boots mobility to shame. Plus infinite ammo is awesome.

    Oddly I have no idea why I am debating this I always played Ley Line Walkers, whose godlike power/laughable fragility was directly proportionate to how scared of you getting XP or stuff the GM was.

    Spoiler:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Forar wrote: »
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    As for the psychic means; Sixth Sense doesn't allow auto-dodge. It has some big bonuses associated with it, especially for Initiative, but no mention of an automatic dodge.

    I never said it did. I believe it's in the text for Sixth Sense which notes that at least during the first melee of a fight the psychic will be aware of all incoming attacks, which is as good as or better than the auto-dodge that Juicers get. Perhaps I wasn't clear, I was just saying that a psychic with 6th sense AND an auto-dodge (through said hand to hands) was thus as good or better than a Juicer in some regards.
    Ah, then it was a misunderstanding on my part. Sorry.

    Though I do believe that both Delphi Juicers and Psycho-Stalkers (the juiced up psi-stalkers) came stock with Sixth Sense. Which usually resulted in total Initiative and Parry/Dodge bonuses in the low teens for the first round of combat.
    Forar wrote: »
    Steelhawk wrote: »
    Sure, the Cyclone arm blades may have been able to parry and soak up the hits...but missile splash damage would have killed a dude eventually.

    Remember kids: rediculous does not equal munchkin.

    Eh, that was something Palladium struggled with throughout the system. Did you apply splash damage to every spot on a mech/power armour? Most pilots would be dead long before you actually punched through the main body if that were the case. Regular armour wearers would likely be in even worse condition.

    But yes, we did note that if someone shot a Cyclone rider with a beam or explosion larger than the couple of feet the blades protected, you were still screwed. Like, the Sabers could withstand a blast from the SDF-1's main cannon (MDC Damage: "Yes. All of it.") for an infintessimal fraction of a second longer than anything else, until the beam obliterated the power source and the blades got vapourized along with everything else.

    Now, if you got a whole bunch of Cyclones and lined up their blades perfectly with no gaps... >.>
    As I recall, there was an RDF Destroid model that went into limited production with retractable forearm blades like those on the cyclone. Energy blast parrying ability and all. It also had a bank of missile launchers specifically designed to throw chaff so that it could escape and hide if necessary. Because a 40 foot, 30 ton robot is obviously the best option for stealth.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    You could get more attacks with tiny little arms or tentacles, but those didn't translate well into attacks of any real value unless you had an incredibly powerful handgun or your GM was willing to look the other way and whistle while you made that extra railgun attack with limbs that couldn't lift it and lacked the digits to pull the trigger.

    Being grappled by anything is a Juicer's worst nightmare, not least of which because the grapple rules were terrible. But losing their mobility, their ability to apply two defenses to any attack (auto-parry, auto-dodge) without losing any of their own and basically just being locked in that close of quarters with something they literally couldn't hurt with their bare hands is a terrible situation.

    In a grapple, the borg wins. But that's just about the only situation.

    You could buy integrated weapon systems for +1 Attack period or a totally not dinky real second third or sixteenth set of arms, which I realize all need weapons which in a real campaign just isn't feasible. So on average your still one attack down on the juicer, but you have way more MDC and as long as you are a Heavy Can, took Cyberjet Nodes, or took a Cyborg Jet-pack you put rocket jet boots mobility to shame. Plus infinite ammo is awesome.

    Oddly I have no idea why I am debating this I always played Ley Line Walkers, whose godlike power or laughable fragility was directly proportionate to how scared of you getting XP or stuff the GM was.
    When did they add the integrated weaponry attack? I guess I'm not familiar with that.

    I probably made a mistake in promoting Juicer superiority across the board. Especially given that Juicers got their (completely unnecessary) power-up in like the 10th world book, but Borgs get shiny new stuff every time they print something. I also think my impression of Juicer dominance relies a lot on sensible GM interpretation of things like extra arms and such, which may or may not have a place in online discussions about a system as ridiculous as this one.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • Momento MoriMomento Mori Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    When did they add the integrated weaponry attack? I guess I'm not familiar with that.

    I probably made a mistake in promoting Juicer superiority across the board. Especially given that Juicers got their (completely unnecessary) power-up in like the 10th world book, but Borgs get shiny new stuff every time they print something. I also think my impression of Juicer dominance relies a lot on sensible GM interpretation of things like extra arms and such, which may or may not have a place in online discussions about a system as ridiculous as this one.
    Nah, I am a big fan of sensible interpretation as a career GM that's what I go for generally. It's just in Rifts that pragmatism is often met by players who buy the extra arms and a set of super cheap MDC shields for each pair giving them 4 active Parries above and beyond their normal combat stats. So I think the system rewarded ridiculous no matter the GMs attempt at sanity.

    Oh, the integrated weapon system is in Warlords of Russia as I recall I know the Holocaust Borg had it.

    Spoiler:
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    When did they add the integrated weaponry attack? I guess I'm not familiar with that.

    I probably made a mistake in promoting Juicer superiority across the board. Especially given that Juicers got their (completely unnecessary) power-up in like the 10th world book, but Borgs get shiny new stuff every time they print something. I also think my impression of Juicer dominance relies a lot on sensible GM interpretation of things like extra arms and such, which may or may not have a place in online discussions about a system as ridiculous as this one.
    Nah, I am a big fan of sensible interpretation as a career GM that's what I go for generally. It's just in Rifts that pragmatism is often met by players who buy the extra arms and a set of super cheap MDC shields for each pair giving them 4 active Parries above and beyond their normal combat stats. So I think the system rewarded ridiculous no matter the GMs attempt at sanity.
    I'm pretty sure it's just a single parry roll, regardless of number of arms. The first set of arms gives a +1 to parry, I know that for sure. But I don't think you can parry ranged attacks unless you specifically have some way to do it, like the Saber Blades or such. Usually these sorts of things came on power armor, I think.

    I was always the GM, so it's possible that my memories of what is or isn't busted at the table are colored by whether or not I let them be busted. ;-)

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • ForarForar #432 Already prepping for Toronto Fan Expo!Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Yeah, in the books I think only certain classes / abilities allowed you to attempt to parry ranged attacks. I think we allowed people to attempt it at -10 (same as dodging) but you were less "parrying" than you were "putting something else in the way", so usually a shield or some such. Or a Power Armour pilot taking a hit to the arms rather than the weakened main body, etc (which actually has a basis in the rules, tied to a rule in the Robotech rpg which was at least somewhat tied to a moment in the series where a character did that against a missile volley that probably would've killed him had he not done so. And had massive amounts of plot armour... err, was piloting an Armoured Veritech).

    We also house ruled that parrying was not an option in some cases, particularly massive differences in strength or mass. No matter how strong or skilled a person one, a regular human just wasn't "parrying" a (figurative or literal) freight train. Yes yes, force redirection, etc, look, my suspension of disbelief only goes so far! :P

    sigone.png
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I always allowed a parry, even if it just basically amounted in-world to a melee dodge.

    Otherwise the guy who is wearing 2 tons of metal is going to just crush anyone else in hand to hand combat. And if that was supposed to be the case, why did they give me this kewl brain sword?

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • RingoRingo Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    You're all insane

    ceres wrote: »
    I'm just going to go ahead and lock this thread before I feel any worse about humanity.
    AUGMENTOS - Edcrab's Exigency RPG
  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Hey! Don't knock Rick Hunter for being awesome. That ain't cool.

    Games & Characters:
  • ForarForar #432 Already prepping for Toronto Fan Expo!Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    As long as recognition is given for Roy being an absolute badass, until he was too stubborn to actually get medical treatment for a mortal wound. Dude to flat out walked away to play his guitar one last time.

    But Max was my favourite character. Laid back, unassuming, the baddest of them all.

    I always wanted to get a pair of characters into Rifts flying an Alpha and a Beta Veritech, but I couldn't even convince my group to try a squad of Coalition giant robot/power armour pilots.

    sigone.png
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I need to get that glitterboy entry up.

    Technical limitations are a pain, yo.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • Edith_Bagot-DixEdith_Bagot-Dix Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    The Ender wrote: »
    They paled in comparison to Juicers

    Cyber-Knights were comparable to Juicers so long as you let them use the projectile parrying rules from the Conversion books and gave them some stupid broken R.C.C. (roll-up an Armored Slayer Cyber-Knight. Fucking one bajillion attacks per melee; see how your GM like those apples).

    This sounds a lot like what I remember from Rifts - my group was always chock full off Asgardian Dwarf Juicers and Demigod Special Forces dudes.

    steam_sig.png

    Also on PSN: twobadcats
  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Of course Roy is the best! He didn't get a skull motif on his fighter for nothing. The dorky kid in me still wonders who would win in a duel. Roy or Max? Experience vs. Talent. And he didn't want to play the guitar one last time...he wanted a piece of Claudia's sweet Pineapple salad, if you know what I mean, before he died.

    But anyway....we were talking about Rifts...

    Games & Characters:
  • Xenogear_0001Xenogear_0001 Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    When I wasn't GM'ing, I always used a Sea Titan RCC for just about anything. It was like being a human, but better! I mean, natural MDC that heals paired with supernatural strength--it was just badass.

    And don't get me started on the Cosmic (Cosmo?) Knights from the Phaseworld dimension books. They were like if you took the Green Lantern and mixed it with Silver Surfer and a Jedi. Fucking nuts.

    steam_sig.png
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    It was like being a <something>, but better! I mean, natural MDC that heals paired with supernatural strength--it was just badass.
    This right here is like 50% of the problems with Rifts.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • Xenogear_0001Xenogear_0001 Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    It was like being a <something>, but better! I mean, natural MDC that heals paired with supernatural strength--it was just badass.
    This right here is like 50% of the problems with Rifts.

    Oh, I ran a game of straight vagabonds once. They were members of a small village toward the expanding outskirts of the CS Empire--one where magic-users and d-bees were accepted as equals, so long as they were peaceful and contributed to the good of the town. You can imagine where things went from there. Kind of a people's uprising thing, but with a not-so-happy ending.

    EDIT: Damn totp.

    steam_sig.png
Sign In or Register to comment.