Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

Cry Havok and let loose the dogs of the [Military Thread]

145791067

Posts

  • Rocket SurgeryRocket Surgery Registered User
    edited April 2011
    I'm a little confused about PCS for a single Soldier.

    Do I get charged leave for the days it takes me to drive to my next duty station?

    If not, what if I drive home first?

  • ZeroFillZeroFill Feeling much better. A nice, green leaf.Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    No. Travel time and proceed time are both free days of leave. They can be taken in concurrence with regular leave...

    i.e. you can take 30 days in between duty stations, be granted 6 days of travel time, and 3 days of proceed time for a total of 39 days, with 9 of those being free.

  • TaranisTaranis Must be the feeling, it brings to you That makes you do what you doRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    If you're PCSing from a CONUS post to another CONUS post, then I would recommend at least doing a DItY move. It's possible to make money doing a DItY move, and you can ensure PPSO doesn't lose/break your shit.

    nerosig_zps80ae1f48.png
  • godmodegodmode Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Turkson wrote: »
    I've been here over a year and didn't know we had a military thread.

    I'll go ahead and throw my hat in too.

    USMC Sergeant (E5) Intelligence, now a civilian going to school.

    Oh, it's you.

  • TurksonTurkson Near the mountains of ColoradoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    godmode wrote: »
    Turkson wrote: »
    I've been here over a year and didn't know we had a military thread.

    I'll go ahead and throw my hat in too.

    USMC Sergeant (E5) Intelligence, now a civilian going to school.

    Oh, it's you.

    Indeed.

    Pistols at dawn sir?

    "You. Poet. Be sure to write this down."
  • godmodegodmode Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Sure...In fact, you can pick the place!

    I only require that you pick somewhere with a grassy hill with a view nearby, about 800-1000 yds away?

  • YoshuaYoshua Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Zenitram wrote: »
    Finished up with Basic Training and just got home for Hometown Recruiting. I was expecting only two weeks of leave but I don't have to go to my unit until May 17th, woo!

    Unfortunately my unit is in Leonard Wood, the hellhole that I just left. They deployed in February so I'm kinda curious what I'll be doing when I arrive and how long I will be in Missouri.

    You will be on rear detachment. I assume you're junior enlisted, this pretty much means lot's of details. Mostly depends on what the unit has for you to do. Depending how long your unit has been deployed, they may start getting you ready to catch up with them.

    When I first got to my unit in 2007 they were deployed. It was long days of nothing to do with the odd detail here and there, usually ending with the daily cleaning of battalion before we were cut loose for the day. During this, the leadership was trying to get us pushed forward to catch up with the unit. So we drew gear and fought to get slots for IRT (Individual Readiness Training, it's supposed to get you ready for deployment, in truth it's probably more of a CYA thing for the higher ups), and a couple months later we deployed (for a whole three months).

    steam_sig.png
  • Iceman.USAFIceman.USAF Captain East CoastRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    So, a bit OT (please don't beat me Ceres...<3) but is anyone planning on going to PAX in Seattle? If so drop me a PM!



  • WaffenWaffen Ours is the Fury Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Well I'm heading to Fort Knox next Monday for Air Assault. Not gonna lie, I'm starting to get that nervousness about zero day. It doesn't help the ROTC Cadets that have done Air Assault (Two Pass and One Fail) aren't very positive about it. For some reason I get the vibe that they want me to fail. Any last minute advice before I head out? I know once zero day is over it'll be smooth sailing. Its the initial zero day, the packing list perfection stuff, and the fear of failing that's really starting to get me atm.

  • EvigilantEvigilant Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Waffen wrote: »
    Well I'm heading to Fort Knox next Monday for Air Assault. Not gonna lie, I'm starting to get that nervousness about zero day. It doesn't help the ROTC Cadets that have done Air Assault (Two Pass and One Fail) aren't very positive about it. For some reason I get the vibe that they want me to fail. Any last minute advice before I head out? I know once zero day is over it'll be smooth sailing. Its the initial zero day, the packing list perfection stuff, and the fear of failing that's really starting to get me atm.

    Other than know your shit, be in double the required health. That is, if they ask for 25 pushups, be able to do 50. That's no where near what they'll ask, but that's the mentality and physical ability you should have on zero day.

    Be ready to deal with a lot of shit and a lot of fatigue exercises. Remember, it's just one day, take it step by step, tell yourself not to give up, and keep at it.

    If you can do that and not let the little mental games and doubt get to you, you'll be fine.

    "I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its futility, its stupidity." Dwight D. Eisenhower
    Google+ Profile Origin: 13Evigilant Steam: Evigilant
  • Rocket SurgeryRocket Surgery Registered User
    edited May 2011
    Anyone have anything to say about Fort Stewart? I report in about a month.

  • godmodegodmode Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Sooo the reserve recruiter called me yesterday and wants to talk to me about joining the active reserve forces for the rest of my contract. Decisions, decisions...

  • Limp mooseLimp moose Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I took and passed the DLAB today. I am so hoping my next set of orders is an exchange program with the Spanish Navy where i go and fly for them for 3 years!

    Live in Spain
    Non competitive fitrep
    Fly an aircraft I have over 1000 hours in model for a foreign navy
    Live on the MED in sunny southern Spain
    Get COLA and BAH that will put me in a mansion on the riviera.

    I can't really think of a better way to finish out my contract...

    Oh and they pay me to go to DLI and learn Spanish for 6 months...

  • spookymuffinspookymuffin ( ° ʖ ° ) Speicher, GermanyRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Wow. That sounds like a dream.

    XBL: Mega Spooky // 3DS: 3797-6276-7138
  • ruzkinruzkin Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    KqOm9Bt.jpg
  • Pirate ViperPirate Viper Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Well, US Military is seperated by age and gender, but for an 18-21 year old male, the requirements are 42 push ups in 2 minutes, 53 situps in 2 minutes and a 2 mile run in 15:56. However the pt test is set to change in a few months I believe.

    Hope that helps.

    PS. Keep in mind that these are the bare minimums and that in most units if all your accomplishing is the minimum you will be thought of as a shitbag.

  • YoshuaYoshua Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Anyone have anything to say about Fort Stewart? I report in about a month.

    I am stationed there. It will depend whether you go to Ft Stewart itself or to Hunter.

    Stewart has all the basics, a commissary, PX, gyms (Newman is the largest and has an indoor pool). The PX area has some shops including a Gamestop. Nothing really stands out as awesome, but nothing is terrible either.

    Hunter is where the MI (mostly, some go to Stewart to work the S2 shops and the like), CAB, and Rangers are, as well as their support elements. It is a smaller post than Stewart but the barracks and on post housing are much nicer. Also Savannah is right outside which is hands down a better place to go find stuff to do than Hinesville. Their PX and Commissary are much smaller but still servicable.

    If you qualify for BAH, I would recommend trying to find something off post. You can usually find something nicer than on post. It might not save much money, but it is less hassle. YMMV

    Anyways, if there is something specific you'd like to know about, ask away. It would help if you knew what unit/brigade you were going to.

    steam_sig.png
  • Feels Good ManFeels Good Man Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    ruzkin wrote: »
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    is that simply for joining or the minimum standards once you're in?


    the US Army standards for simply getting in are lower than the standards to maintain while you're in


    in fact I don't know if there are any really? I remember having to do really easy PT tests before being sent to basic but I'm in the national guard so yeah

    something like a mile in 8 and a half minutes or some such

    51955327.jpg
  • godmodegodmode Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    ruzkin wrote: »
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    The standards vary between services, as well. The minimum requirements for Marines are 3 Chin-ups, 60-something situps, and a 3-mile run in under 28 minutes. But if you only do the minimum, most units make it a point to make you do better, so the average is something like 10 chin-ups, 100 situps, and about a 22-24-minute 3-mile.

  • Iceman.USAFIceman.USAF Captain East CoastRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    godmode wrote: »
    ruzkin wrote: »
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    The standards vary between services, as well. The minimum requirements for Marines are 3 Chin-ups, 60-something situps, and a 3-mile run in under 28 minutes. But if you only do the minimum, most units make it a point to make you do better, so the average is something like 10 chin-ups, 100 situps, and about a 22-24-minute 3-mile.

    Air Force (for males < 30) are about 13:30 1.5 mile run, 42 situps and I think 33 pushups. There's also a waist measurement, I think 40" is the max. Not 100% sure though.

    anyway you've got to score a "pass" in all 4 events plus total over 75/100 points. Not super hard, but the waist measurement screws a lot of people who are big as all hell but healthy and score perfectly otherwise. Ok so not a lot but at least a percentage.



  • godmodegodmode Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Yeah, that's a big problem in the Marine Corps as well - gigantic dudes getting hit for body fat percentage even though they can pass a PFT just fine. It's all pretty subjective as well because of the way they measure: Neck size versus waist size as well as weight versus height. So a short, average weight dude might be screwed if he has a tiny neck, and a big fat fattie might be okay because he has a huge neck and an average-ish waist.

    Edit: Rereading this post, it's kind of nonsensical. Let me sum up by saying "The Marine Corps' Body Composition Standards need review".

  • CabezoneCabezone Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    When I joined the US Army in 98 I think there was some sort of minimum standard that my recruiter didn't even bother having me do. It wasn't anywhere near the actual standard once you're in.

  • Rocket SurgeryRocket Surgery Registered User
    edited May 2011
    Yoshua wrote: »
    Anyone have anything to say about Fort Stewart? I report in about a month.

    I am stationed there. It will depend whether you go to Ft Stewart itself or to Hunter.

    Stewart has all the basics, a commissary, PX, gyms (Newman is the largest and has an indoor pool). The PX area has some shops including a Gamestop. Nothing really stands out as awesome, but nothing is terrible either.

    Hunter is where the MI (mostly, some go to Stewart to work the S2 shops and the like), CAB, and Rangers are, as well as their support elements. It is a smaller post than Stewart but the barracks and on post housing are much nicer. Also Savannah is right outside which is hands down a better place to go find stuff to do than Hinesville. Their PX and Commissary are much smaller but still servicable.

    If you qualify for BAH, I would recommend trying to find something off post. You can usually find something nicer than on post. It might not save much money, but it is less hassle. YMMV

    Anyways, if there is something specific you'd like to know about, ask away. It would help if you knew what unit/brigade you were going to.

    I'm 11B going to 2nd BDE. No BAH for me. Will I at least get my own room?

  • KyanilisKyanilis Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    ruzkin wrote: »
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    is that simply for joining or the minimum standards once you're in?


    the US Army standards for simply getting in are lower than the standards to maintain while you're in


    in fact I don't know if there are any really? I remember having to do really easy PT tests before being sent to basic but I'm in the national guard so yeah

    something like a mile in 8 and a half minutes or some such

    Yeah, there's some super simple tests to get in and go to basic at all. But yeah, that's pretty much it, it's like half a PT test. I can't remember what the exact numbers I needed back when I joined, but it's basically a starting point to ensure you won't die during basic training.

  • YoshuaYoshua Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Yoshua wrote: »
    Anyone have anything to say about Fort Stewart? I report in about a month.

    I am stationed there. It will depend whether you go to Ft Stewart itself or to Hunter.

    Stewart has all the basics, a commissary, PX, gyms (Newman is the largest and has an indoor pool). The PX area has some shops including a Gamestop. Nothing really stands out as awesome, but nothing is terrible either.

    Hunter is where the MI (mostly, some go to Stewart to work the S2 shops and the like), CAB, and Rangers are, as well as their support elements. It is a smaller post than Stewart but the barracks and on post housing are much nicer. Also Savannah is right outside which is hands down a better place to go find stuff to do than Hinesville. Their PX and Commissary are much smaller but still servicable.

    If you qualify for BAH, I would recommend trying to find something off post. You can usually find something nicer than on post. It might not save much money, but it is less hassle. YMMV

    Anyways, if there is something specific you'd like to know about, ask away. It would help if you knew what unit/brigade you were going to.

    I'm 11B going to 2nd BDE. No BAH for me. Will I at least get my own room?

    Nope, you will have a room mate. I think 2nd BDE is in the new barracks though, those were pretty nice compared to the older ones. Lemme know when you get here, I can show you around a bit.

    steam_sig.png
  • ZeroFillZeroFill Feeling much better. A nice, green leaf.Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    The Navy uses the same ridiculous body composition standards.

    Shorter guys get hosed unless they have no neck, though it's not as bad a problem as the huge fatties that have an enormous neck and get told they're at 17% body fat.

  • MrIamMeMrIamMe Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    ruzkin wrote: »
    Hello, US military folk. Aussie here, just looking at the physical requirements for joining the Australian army. I was kind of appaled - 15 pushups, 45 situps and the ability to run a kilometre in around 6 minutes. Seriously? My highschool PE coach held us to better standards. For comparison's sake, what are the basic physical requirements for the US army?

    That is the bare basics - if that is all you can do, you are going to hurt during basic.

    Kapooka will build you up to be more than decently fit, they start out reasonably gently and build it up to a good standard, and teach you good PT habits along the way. This was one of the reasons they extended basic was to give the PTIs more time to train soldiers in fitness.

    You always get the lazy asses however, who never really put in and fail basic as they cannot pass the basic fitness test at the end, that being 40 push ups, 100 sit ups, 2.4km run in 10:48 or less. If you are an arms corp, say infantry, armour, artillery or going to be posted to support a unit that comprises primarily of an arms corp and thats all you can do, you will struggle when it comes to your IETs.

    In the end your personal fitness is completely up to you, even though there is unit PT every morning. Its your result, and everyone around you will take note.

    The entire fitness system is about to change within the next 2 years or so anyway, as it has been proven that sit ups, push ups, distance runs do no reflect what each soldier needs for his/her trade. The university of new south wales and the PTIs have been working for some time now on a trade specific fitness assessment and they are going to be much harder.

    According to the guys who I know participated in the trials, its fairly full on just to pass.

    EDIT: TLDR: Its an entry test, less than half of a real fitness test. Basic pass standard after basic is 40 pushups in 2 min, 100 situps to cadence, 2.4km in under 10:48

    The enemy of my enemy is my cannon-fodder, we are NOT friends.
  • Ziac45Ziac45 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I just started looking into the military and after doing some basic glancing over the branches figured this would be a good place to ask my questions.

    I'm a US resident 20 years old currently enrolled in College and I am really just looking for a way to pay for school without being neck deep in debt. I was looking at the coast guard reserve as I would like to continue going to school and it seems that would still give me access to the GI Bill. So my questions are:

    Does the Coast guard Reserve get access to the Bill or did I misread that section?

    What is the best branch for not going out of country as I am really not interested in leaving the US?

    Also what are the odds of getting a non combat job as I am equally not interested in getting shot at.

    And finally is this a decent idea or am I better off just getting into debt? I really just started looking into this so any advice would be helpful.

  • ZeroFillZeroFill Feeling much better. A nice, green leaf.Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Sounds like you're not really interested in the military at all, and are just looking for school money.

    You'd be better off looking into various scholarship programs.

  • VeritasVRVeritasVR Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Ziac45 wrote: »
    I just started looking into the military and after doing some basic glancing over the branches figured this would be a good place to ask my questions.

    I'm a US resident 20 years old currently enrolled in College and I am really just looking for a way to pay for school without being neck deep in debt. I was looking at the coast guard reserve as I would like to continue going to school and it seems that would still give me access to the GI Bill. So my questions are:

    Does the Coast guard Reserve get access to the Bill or did I misread that section?

    What is the best branch for not going out of country as I am really not interested in leaving the US?

    Also what are the odds of getting a non combat job as I am equally not interested in getting shot at.

    And finally is this a decent idea or am I better off just getting into debt? I really just started looking into this so any advice would be helpful.

    Are you an engineering, science, or mathematics major? Do you have more than two years from graduation? Are you physically fit and mentally tough? Do you have a rudimentary understanding of military stuff?

    If you answered yes to all of these questions, then you might be able to get yourself into an Air Force ROTC program. Go after the possibility of being a science, engineering, or acquisitions officer.

    If you have less than two years and are ineligible for ROTC, start applying for Air Force OTS so you can go when you graduate. It typically takes about two years from the start of the application to actually going to OTS. Selection rate right now is 10% for non-flying positions.

    These positions are desk jobs with a >0.1% chance of being deployed in your first 10 years (yes I have the numbers). You will be leading groups of contractors and civilians on creating a new war fighter or something important to the military. Business education is a plus, but science education will much more likely get you in.

    If you're good enough, you might apply for a masters through the Air Force Institute of Technology, who will pay for you to be a student full-time at many different universities while you go for free. Very competitive though. Officers usually go to the best schools. If not, go to school on your own time or online by combining financial aid, the Post 9/11 GI bill, and other scholarships.

    I don't know about other services, but let me know if you have any questions.

    CoH_infantry.jpg
    Let 'em eat fucking pineapples!
  • programjunkieprogramjunkie Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Limp moose wrote: »
    I took and passed the DLAB today. I am so hoping my next set of orders is an exchange program with the Spanish Navy where i go and fly for them for 3 years!

    Live in Spain
    Non competitive fitrep
    Fly an aircraft I have over 1000 hours in model for a foreign navy
    Live on the MED in sunny southern Spain
    Get COLA and BAH that will put me in a mansion on the riviera.

    I can't really think of a better way to finish out my contract...

    Oh and they pay me to go to DLI and learn Spanish for 6 months...

    DLI is a sweet gig. If you are good at your language you are looking at 6 hours of instruction + 1 hour lunch + whatever the Navy wants you to do (based on your rank it might be nothing).

    The weather is perfect (Monterey has no seasons), but the area is a little expensive.

  • Iceman.USAFIceman.USAF Captain East CoastRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    Ziac45 wrote: »
    I just started looking into the military and after doing some basic glancing over the branches figured this would be a good place to ask my questions.

    I'm a US resident 20 years old currently enrolled in College and I am really just looking for a way to pay for school without being neck deep in debt. I was looking at the coast guard reserve as I would like to continue going to school and it seems that would still give me access to the GI Bill. So my questions are:

    Does the Coast guard Reserve get access to the Bill or did I misread that section?

    What is the best branch for not going out of country as I am really not interested in leaving the US?

    Also what are the odds of getting a non combat job as I am equally not interested in getting shot at.

    And finally is this a decent idea or am I better off just getting into debt? I really just started looking into this so any advice would be helpful.

    Are you an engineering, science, or mathematics major? Do you have more than two years from graduation? Are you physically fit and mentally tough? Do you have a rudimentary understanding of military stuff?

    If you answered yes to all of these questions, then you might be able to get yourself into an Air Force ROTC program. Go after the possibility of being a science, engineering, or acquisitions officer.

    If you have less than two years and are ineligible for ROTC, start applying for Air Force OTS so you can go when you graduate. It typically takes about two years from the start of the application to actually going to OTS. Selection rate right now is 10% for non-flying positions.

    These positions are desk jobs with a >0.1% chance of being deployed in your first 10 years (yes I have the numbers). You will be leading groups of contractors and civilians on creating a new war fighter or something important to the military. Business education is a plus, but science education will much more likely get you in.

    If you're good enough, you might apply for a masters through the Air Force Institute of Technology, who will pay for you to be a student full-time at many different universities while you go for free. Very competitive though. Officers usually go to the best schools. If not, go to school on your own time or online by combining financial aid, the Post 9/11 GI bill, and other scholarships.

    I don't know about other services, but let me know if you have any questions.

    I'd like to see where you got that deployment info. From my own experience, acquisitions (Contracting), Engineering (CE) are two of the most heavily tasked career fields for officers.



  • VeritasVRVeritasVR Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ... science, engineering, or acquisitions officer.

    These positions are desk jobs with a >0.1% chance of being deployed in your first 10 years (yes I have the numbers).

    I'd like to see where you got that deployment info. From my own experience, acquisitions (Contracting), Engineering (CE) are two of the most heavily tasked career fields for officers.

    From the Military Officer Development for Acquisition Officers, "Overseas 61S/62E/63A (Combined) – 1.5%." (Remember, that's for all ranks.)

    From GAO-06-908 DEFENSE SPACE ACTIVITIES, Management Actions Are Needed to Better Identify, Track, and Train Air Force Space Personnel, Pg 33, "Acquisition personnel, who generally do not deploy and are therefore less likely to have operational or warfighting experience,"

    From the Institute for Defense Analyses Comparative Costs of Air Force Military and Civilians in Selected Science and Engineering Specialties, Pg 51, "In the 32E career field, overseas deployments are common."

    AMS says there are currently zero 2LTs and one 1LT in 63A that are overseas. You must apply to be selected for either deployment or overseas tour. The Acquisitions FIELD (61, 62, and 63) are not in the deployment "bands" since they typically perform unique missions. Civil Engineering, Contracting, and Finance (32, 64, and 65) are in a band, and do deploy.

    I hope that clears up where I got the information. It's not >0.1%, but as of 2007, there were a total of 39 63A Acquisitions officers (out of about 2,700) that were overseas.

    Of course, this situation could always change. You must be prepared to take that as a possibility, since you would be an officer first and a whatever second.

    CoH_infantry.jpg
    Let 'em eat fucking pineapples!
  • EvigilantEvigilant Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Ziac45 wrote: »
    I just started looking into the military and after doing some basic glancing over the branches figured this would be a good place to ask my questions.

    I'm a US resident 20 years old currently enrolled in College and I am really just looking for a way to pay for school without being neck deep in debt. I was looking at the coast guard reserve as I would like to continue going to school and it seems that would still give me access to the GI Bill. So my questions are:

    Does the Coast guard Reserve get access to the Bill or did I misread that section?

    What is the best branch for not going out of country as I am really not interested in leaving the US?

    Also what are the odds of getting a non combat job as I am equally not interested in getting shot at.

    And finally is this a decent idea or am I better off just getting into debt? I really just started looking into this so any advice would be helpful.

    ZeroFill wrote: »
    Sounds like you're not really interested in the military at all, and are just looking for school money.

    You'd be better off looking into various scholarship programs.

    I agree with Zero on this. It looks like you just want the school money with none of the risks. Understandable, but there are far better, easier, and more lucrative ways to obtain school money than joining the military.

    If you don't want to leave the US and don't want to get shot at, don't join the military. Even the coast guard can be sent overseas, and was sent overseas in 2003 to the Persian Gulf to provide shore and waterway security, since that's what they do best.

    If you aren't ready or prepared to commit to a contract, signing your life away for 8 years (8 is always the magic number), don't join the military.

    The school money the military provides is a dangling carrot. The catch is, you can only go to school when the military allows you time to go to school. I've been in the Army for 10 years, 7 in the NG and 3 in the Reserves, a month after enlisting I was enrolled at my college, back in August 2001. I'm still attending, still trying to get my bachelor's and just now getting close to graduating. That's the military for you and if you aren't prepared for the sacrifice, don't join.

    "I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its futility, its stupidity." Dwight D. Eisenhower
    Google+ Profile Origin: 13Evigilant Steam: Evigilant
  • Iceman.USAFIceman.USAF Captain East CoastRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ... science, engineering, or acquisitions officer.

    These positions are desk jobs with a >0.1% chance of being deployed in your first 10 years (yes I have the numbers).

    I'd like to see where you got that deployment info. From my own experience, acquisitions (Contracting), Engineering (CE) are two of the most heavily tasked career fields for officers.

    From the Military Officer Development for Acquisition Officers, "Overseas 61S/62E/63A (Combined) – 1.5%." (Remember, that's for all ranks.)

    From GAO-06-908 DEFENSE SPACE ACTIVITIES, Management Actions Are Needed to Better Identify, Track, and Train Air Force Space Personnel, Pg 33, "Acquisition personnel, who generally do not deploy and are therefore less likely to have operational or warfighting experience,"

    From the Institute for Defense Analyses Comparative Costs of Air Force Military and Civilians in Selected Science and Engineering Specialties, Pg 51, "In the 32E career field, overseas deployments are common."

    AMS says there are currently zero 2LTs and one 1LT in 63A that are overseas. You must apply to be selected for either deployment or overseas tour. The Acquisitions FIELD (61, 62, and 63) are not in the deployment "bands" since they typically perform unique missions. Civil Engineering, Contracting, and Finance (32, 64, and 65) are in a band, and do deploy.

    I hope that clears up where I got the information. It's not >0.1%, but as of 2007, there were a total of 39 63A Acquisitions officers (out of about 2,700) that were overseas.

    Of course, this situation could always change. You must be prepared to take that as a possibility, since you would be an officer first and a whatever second.


    Interesting stuff! Also, ROTC commitment for non-rated (IE not pilots) officers for the Air Force is 4 years. I'm sure it varies wildly by branch and specialty.



  • slackersupremeslackersupreme Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I know this is getting tangential to Ziac45's question, but I wanted to chime in on Air Force Acquisition Officer (referring to 61, 62, and 63 AFSCs) deployment rates as I think Veritas is missing part of the picture.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...AMS says there are currently zero 2LTs and one 1LT in 63A that are overseas. ...

    AMS (Assignment Management System) only shows requirements/allocations for *assignments*. Those folks deploying on CED deployment orders remain officially assigned to their home unit and don't appear as overseas in AMS.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...You must apply to be selected for either deployment or overseas tour. The Acquisitions FIELD (61, 62, and 63) are not in the deployment "bands" since they typically perform unique missions. Civil Engineering, Contracting, and Finance (32, 64, and 65) are in a band, and do deploy...

    Last summer AFMC directed acquisition personnel be listed as "Institutional Forces" and be assigned to the "X-band", with a 1-to-4 deploy-to-dwell time (*if* tasked to deploy). Deployment assignments to acquisition officers are *regularly* assigned on a non-voluntary basis and that has been true the last several years, though it does seem to be getting more common.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...I hope that clears up where I got the information. It's not >0.1%, but as of 2007, there were a total of 39 63A Acquisitions officers (out of about 2,700) that were overseas.

    There has been a notable increase in Acquisition Officer deployment taskings since 2007. Among other duties, I've been the alternate Unit Deployment Manager for my program office this past year. Of ~60 military (mostly 61/62/63 career field), we currently have 3 deployed with 2 others tasked to deploy this summer. In my immediate office, 3 out of 7 have deployed (including myself). Taskings are usually for Captains or Majors.

    These certainly aren't huge deployment rates, especially compared to other services and career fields, but I don't want a 61/62/63 thinking it unlikely they will ever deploy.

  • Ziac45Ziac45 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Looking over the advice in this thread it appears I need to rethink things. I am not actually opposed to doing the military as a career and wouldn't mind deployment (I would like to avoid getting shot at though) but I want to get through my undergraduate first. From what I read on the website it said I would just be working one weekend a month and two weeks in the summer which didn't sound like it would interfere with my degree and it would let me see if I wanted to make a career out of that.

  • VeritasVRVeritasVR Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I know this is getting tangential to Ziac45's question, but I wanted to chime in on Air Force Acquisition Officer (referring to 61, 62, and 63 AFSCs) deployment rates as I think Veritas is missing part of the picture.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...AMS says there are currently zero 2LTs and one 1LT in 63A that are overseas. ...

    AMS (Assignment Management System) only shows requirements/allocations for *assignments*. Those folks deploying on CED deployment orders remain officially assigned to their home unit and don't appear as overseas in AMS.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...You must apply to be selected for either deployment or overseas tour. The Acquisitions FIELD (61, 62, and 63) are not in the deployment "bands" since they typically perform unique missions. Civil Engineering, Contracting, and Finance (32, 64, and 65) are in a band, and do deploy...

    Last summer AFMC directed acquisition personnel be listed as "Institutional Forces" and be assigned to the "X-band", with a 1-to-4 deploy-to-dwell time (*if* tasked to deploy). Deployment assignments to acquisition officers are *regularly* assigned on a non-voluntary basis and that has been true the last several years, though it does seem to be getting more common.
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    ...I hope that clears up where I got the information. It's not >0.1%, but as of 2007, there were a total of 39 63A Acquisitions officers (out of about 2,700) that were overseas.

    There has been a notable increase in Acquisition Officer deployment taskings since 2007. Among other duties, I've been the alternate Unit Deployment Manager for my program office this past year. Of ~60 military (mostly 61/62/63 career field), we currently have 3 deployed with 2 others tasked to deploy this summer. In my immediate office, 3 out of 7 have deployed (including myself). Taskings are usually for Captains or Majors.

    These certainly aren't huge deployment rates, especially compared to other services and career fields, but I don't want a 61/62/63 thinking it unlikely they will ever deploy.

    It appears I may have formed a conclusion without all the data. Thank you for that correction. There used to be a guy here with a lot of info that could explain the situation as well, but your understanding seems very adept.
    Ziac45 wrote: »
    Looking over the advice in this thread it appears I need to rethink things. I am not actually opposed to doing the military as a career and wouldn't mind deployment (I would like to avoid getting shot at though) but I want to get through my undergraduate first. From what I read on the website it said I would just be working one weekend a month and two weeks in the summer which didn't sound like it would interfere with my degree and it would let me see if I wanted to make a career out of that.

    That sounds like the Reserves.

    CoH_infantry.jpg
    Let 'em eat fucking pineapples!
  • EvigilantEvigilant Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    VeritasVR wrote: »
    Ziac45 wrote: »
    Looking over the advice in this thread it appears I need to rethink things. I am not actually opposed to doing the military as a career and wouldn't mind deployment (I would like to avoid getting shot at though) but I want to get through my undergraduate first. From what I read on the website it said I would just be working one weekend a month and two weeks in the summer which didn't sound like it would interfere with my degree and it would let me see if I wanted to make a career out of that.

    That sounds like the Reserves.
    I'm not trying to dissuade you from joining the military, but save you the heart and headache of a misunderstanding.

    If all you want is the school money with none of the risks, don't join the military. Even the Coast Guard get's deployed overseas. The benefit of joining the military so they pay for school is nil, because you can only attend when the military deems it appropriate that you have enough time to attend college. It may be the reserves, but when you deploy it's all active duty, and the military will straight fuck you over in active duty.

    School? HAH! We pay for that, so we're going to pull you out and put you on 18month orders to bum fuck nowhere. Don't like it? Well you shouldn't have signed that contract. Country first, personal needs second.

    You're better off going into debt and finding a job to pay off that debt than joining the military if you aren't willing to commit to the sacrifices. That's the military, country first, needs second. You want to go to school, that's all fine and dandy, but it's on the military's dime and the military's time. When you have enough free time to attend school, whether it be night school or what not, that's when you can go and the military can pay for it. Do not think for a second that just because you are joining the reserves or national guard you will never be called up. It's actually the opposite, you're one of the first to be called up (since the reserves make up more than 50+% of the military).

    You need to understand that, in order for you to get that school money, it's a giant leap. You need to understand that you're at the minimum signing 8 years of your life away in order to obtain money for 4 years of school. If you take into consideration everything that will and can happen to you, and you still want to be in the military, THEN join.

    But if you can't take it, if you can't tolerate it, if you don't want it, don't join the military. Simple as that. You'll save everyone, including you, a headache. But don't for the love of god, sign the paper and join the military under a false pretense that they're paying for you to go to school. Oh they'll pay alright, but they'll pay when they feel like you have enough time to go to school. The other 364 days of the year, you're on their dime, their time, their patience and their control. If they deploy you or send you on duty, you can't complain.

    You signed that contract, and that's what it boils down to. Like I said, I'm not trying to dissuade you from joining the military, but I will dispel any false pretense of false ideas you have on it to save both you and I the headache.

    You want the pay? Accept the sacrifices involved. Don't want the sacrifices, then don't join.

    Simple as that.

    "I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its futility, its stupidity." Dwight D. Eisenhower
    Google+ Profile Origin: 13Evigilant Steam: Evigilant
  • spookymuffinspookymuffin ( ° ʖ ° ) Speicher, GermanyRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Evigilant wrote: »
    you shouldn't have signed that contract.

    This is the most retarded phrase that I keep hearing. So many people use this as a blanket to say that it's ok that you're being fucked over.

    XBL: Mega Spooky // 3DS: 3797-6276-7138
145791067
Sign In or Register to comment.