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Video Game Industry Thread: transfarrin' to a new thread

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    JihadJesusJihadJesus Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Ruins wrote: »
    I wonder why Gamestop emailed me a coupon for $100 off a PS3 recently? I can't imagine why they'd need to boost sales of the system...

    Here's a dumb question - I recently grabbed Borderlands for the 360. Gamestop accidentally gave me the Game of the Year edition which I noticed later sells for $15 more used. However, it seems from the packaging that all the GOTY addon stuff was one time downloads which my copy didn't include - so exactly why would they charge more it in theory? Is there some other content I don't know about?
    Later copies of the GOTY come with the extra bonus content on the disc. Unless you bought it used, in which case the dude probably used all the codes and Gamestop screwed you.

    Is there any way to tell them apart until you've already shelled out the original $15 extra, though?

    JihadJesus on
  • Options
    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    What can I say about Sony that others haven't said already? Goddamn clown shoes.

    Henroid on
  • Options
    SheepSheep Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2011
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    So I was checking to see if I won the Microsoft "We fucked up your console" lottery

    How?

    Sheep on
  • Options
    The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Sheep wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    So I was checking to see if I won the Microsoft "We fucked up your console" lottery

    How?

    The problem is with specific DVD drives. The model no of the console indicates exactly whether you have that drive or not. And the model no of your console is tied to your Xbox Live account.

    Therefore, Microsoft know already whether or not your console has the problem. They are sending out emails for people to claim a replacement before they even realize they have it.

    You can also look up the model no of your console and check whether it has the problem on their site.

    It's not a random issue, it is a very specific manufactured device in the console that exhibits a predictable and reproducible fault.

    Note: The number of consoles with this fault is miniscule. In the thousands rather than the tens or hundreds of thousands. You almost certainly don't have the problem, and definitely don't if your console was bought in the last 2 years.

    The_Scarab on
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    Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Ruins wrote: »
    I wonder why Gamestop emailed me a coupon for $100 off a PS3 recently? I can't imagine why they'd need to boost sales of the system...

    Here's a dumb question - I recently grabbed Borderlands for the 360. Gamestop accidentally gave me the Game of the Year edition which I noticed later sells for $15 more used. However, it seems from the packaging that all the GOTY addon stuff was one time downloads which my copy didn't include - so exactly why would they charge more it in theory? Is there some other content I don't know about?
    Later copies of the GOTY come with the extra bonus content on the disc. Unless you bought it used, in which case the dude probably used all the codes and Gamestop screwed you.


    Gamestop didn't "screw" him, the codes got used. It's printed right on the package that they're just one use codes.

    Magic Pink on
  • Options
    LilnoobsLilnoobs Alpha Queue Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Magic Pink wrote: »
    Ruins wrote: »
    I wonder why Gamestop emailed me a coupon for $100 off a PS3 recently? I can't imagine why they'd need to boost sales of the system...

    Here's a dumb question - I recently grabbed Borderlands for the 360. Gamestop accidentally gave me the Game of the Year edition which I noticed later sells for $15 more used. However, it seems from the packaging that all the GOTY addon stuff was one time downloads which my copy didn't include - so exactly why would they charge more it in theory? Is there some other content I don't know about?
    Later copies of the GOTY come with the extra bonus content on the disc. Unless you bought it used, in which case the dude probably used all the codes and Gamestop screwed you.


    Gamestop didn't "screw" him, the codes got used. It's printed right on the package that they're just one use codes.

    So gamestop knows all of the GOTY stuff is not re-sellable stuff on the disc, yet they sell it for a higher used price than the regular edition of Borderlands and this is somehow not screwing the customer, how?

    Doesn't the higher price mislead the customer into thinking there's something more to the GOTY edition than the regular edition? If Gamestop is selling the GOTY edition and the reg. edition used at different prices, then how is that ethically defensible?

    In short, why else would Gamestop sell the GOTY used edition for more than the reg. edition other than to mislead the customer into paying more but not getting more? It's disgusting someone can defend this practice.

    Lilnoobs on
  • Options
    Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Lilnoobs wrote: »
    Magic Pink wrote: »
    Ruins wrote: »
    I wonder why Gamestop emailed me a coupon for $100 off a PS3 recently? I can't imagine why they'd need to boost sales of the system...

    Here's a dumb question - I recently grabbed Borderlands for the 360. Gamestop accidentally gave me the Game of the Year edition which I noticed later sells for $15 more used. However, it seems from the packaging that all the GOTY addon stuff was one time downloads which my copy didn't include - so exactly why would they charge more it in theory? Is there some other content I don't know about?
    Later copies of the GOTY come with the extra bonus content on the disc. Unless you bought it used, in which case the dude probably used all the codes and Gamestop screwed you.


    Gamestop didn't "screw" him, the codes got used. It's printed right on the package that they're just one use codes.

    So gamestop knows all of the GOTY stuff is not re-sellable stuff on the disc, yet they sell it for a higher used price than the regular edition of Borderlands and this is somehow not screwing the customer, how?

    Doesn't the higher price mislead the customer into thinking there's something more to the GOTY edition than the regular edition? If Gamestop is selling the GOTY edition and the reg. edition used at different prices, then how is that ethically defensible?

    In short, why else would Gamestop sell the GOTY used edition for more than the reg. edition other than to mislead the customer into paying more but not getting more? It's disgusting someone can defend this practice.

    Because it's a newer version, that's it. They do that with all games. The pricing is completely, massively stupid, granted, but they're hardly ripping anyone off. If they promised the DLC with it and then didn't, that would be screwing the customer.

    Magic Pink on
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    SheepSheep Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2011
    My console is three to four years old.

    What model number has the defective drive?

    Sheep on
  • Options
    DunxcoDunxco Should get a suit Never skips breakfastRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    The_Scarab wrote: »
    Sheep wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    So I was checking to see if I won the Microsoft "We fucked up your console" lottery

    How?

    The problem is with specific DVD drives. The model no of the console indicates exactly whether you have that drive or not. And the model no of your console is tied to your Xbox Live account.

    Therefore, Microsoft know already whether or not your console has the problem. They are sending out emails for people to claim a replacement before they even realize they have it.

    You can also look up the model no of your console and check whether it has the problem on their site.

    It's not a random issue, it is a very specific manufactured device in the console that exhibits a predictable and reproducible fault.

    Note: The number of consoles with this fault is miniscule. In the thousands rather than the tens or hundreds of thousands. You almost certainly don't have the problem, and definitely don't if your console was bought in the last 2 years.

    Can you perhaps provide us with the route to or a direct link to the page wherein, on their site, you can check to see if your console will be affected by this firmware update?

    Dunxco on
  • Options
    Brainiac 8Brainiac 8 Don't call me Shirley... Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    darleysam wrote: »
    JihadJesus wrote: »
    They're past the point of praying. I think by now they've moved on to animal sacrifice; only blood will appease the demons that infest PSN now.

    Is there a new God of War on the way?

    Is there anyone else left for Kratos to kill? :P

    Brainiac 8 on
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    RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Brainiac 8 wrote: »
    darleysam wrote: »
    JihadJesus wrote: »
    They're past the point of praying. I think by now they've moved on to animal sacrifice; only blood will appease the demons that infest PSN now.

    Is there a new God of War on the way?

    Is there anyone else left for Kratos to kill? :P

    814155141_3dnYd-L.jpg

    RainbowDespair on
  • Options
    Lindsay LohanLindsay Lohan Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    JihadJesus wrote: »
    Ruins wrote: »
    I wonder why Gamestop emailed me a coupon for $100 off a PS3 recently? I can't imagine why they'd need to boost sales of the system...

    Here's a dumb question - I recently grabbed Borderlands for the 360. Gamestop accidentally gave me the Game of the Year edition which I noticed later sells for $15 more used. However, it seems from the packaging that all the GOTY addon stuff was one time downloads which my copy didn't include - so exactly why would they charge more it in theory? Is there some other content I don't know about?
    Later copies of the GOTY come with the extra bonus content on the disc. Unless you bought it used, in which case the dude probably used all the codes and Gamestop screwed you.

    Is there any way to tell them apart until you've already shelled out the original $15 extra, though?

    I'm thinking maybe they see the codes missing from that particular version and maybe sell it as normal - at least I hope that's the case...obviously I paid for the normal version so the end result is the same for me. Except now I feel oddly obligated to buy the DLC to make the box be true...

    Lindsay Lohan on
  • Options
    AutomaticzenAutomaticzen Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    The fact that special editions come with codes for the DLC rather than the actual DLC on the disk is just damned silly.

    Is there some sort of agreement with the publishers to keep downloads flowing through their services? Or are they just too lazy to alter the disks slightly?

    Sometimes DLC is finished after the game has gone gold. Also, people throw a hissyfit if DLC is on the disc.
    So gamestop knows all of the GOTY stuff is not re-sellable stuff on the disc, yet they sell it for a higher used price than the regular edition of Borderlands and this is somehow not screwing the customer, how?

    Doesn't the higher price mislead the customer into thinking there's something more to the GOTY edition than the regular edition? If Gamestop is selling the GOTY edition and the reg. edition used at different prices, then how is that ethically defensible?

    In short, why else would Gamestop sell the GOTY used edition for more than the reg. edition other than to mislead the customer into paying more but not getting more? It's disgusting someone can defend this practice
    .

    A valid used GOTY Edition would probably include the codes. The original poster in this case received a GOTY copy at the correct non-GOTY price. How did he get screwed?

    If you can produce someone who purchased a used GOTY edition at the higher price, but received no codes, then yes Gamestop screwed them.

    Automaticzen on
    http://www.usgamer.net/
    http://www.gamesindustry.biz/
    I write about video games and stuff. It is fun. Sometimes.
  • Options
    JihadJesusJihadJesus Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Well duh. That's why I'm asking - if it's priced higher, it's because there's supposedly additional value. There's additional value if the DLC is included as advertised on the box, but the GotY edition doesn't necessarily come with that added value on the disk. Considering we're talking about Gamestop I'm not holding my breath that they've double checked that the disk has the DLC on it before pocketing the extra $15. I'm sure they'd happily sell you the disk only GotY edition in their own empy shell of a case without so much as a manual let alone the DLC codes (which were almost certainly used already anyway).

    JihadJesus on
  • Options
    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    It just doesn't stop.
    Social game mega-publisher Zynga today announced the acquisition of San Francisco-based Casino City developer DNA Games, the 14th such acquisition in the last 12 months.

    Founded in 2009, DNA Games has attracted over 1.5 million monthly players to its Casino City Facebook game, heading a three-title lineup with a combined 2.35 million monthly users, according to AppData.

    The company's web site describes its goal of creating hits consistently and repeatedly. The studio said it is "one piece game design 'art,' another piece user recruiting optimization 'science' and a third piece top-flight software engineering."

    Founder and CEO Jonathan Lee will serve as general manager of the studio under Zynga, reporting to senior VP Mark Skaggs.

    "DNA Games has a proven track record developing highly engaging social games and a technology platform that enables rapid iteration and optimization of game features and design," Zynga said in announcing the move. "Their expertise will be a valuable asset in next-generation game development for Zynga."

    Zynga's worldwide acquisition spree has included New York's Area/Code, Texas' Newtoy Inc., Tokyo's Unoh Games and Beijing's XPD, among many other social game developers.

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34722/Zynga_Acquires_Casino_City_Maker_DNA_Games.php

    Are they just going to buy up every single competing Facebook developer or what?

    Also, Gamasutra has a fascinating article on what the potential fallout of the MW3 leak-fest will be on Activision here:

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34703/Opinion_Loose_Lips_Sink_Ships.php

    cloudeagle on
    Switch: 3947-4890-9293
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    The_SpaniardThe_Spaniard It's never lupines Irvine, CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    I saw a commercial for a movie that I'm pretty sure is an adaption of Rockem Sockem Robots.

    You did. It's called Real Steel, has Hugh Jackman in it, and will either be horrible or hilarious.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei5l3r1dV4I
    RedRage.jpg

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel_%28The_Twilight_Zone%29

    The_Spaniard on
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    GyralGyral Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Okay really?
    PS3s shutting themselves off while playing L.A. Noire

    Rockstar Support
    posted this on May-17 18:21

    Question: My PS3 turns itself off when I am playing L.A. Noire. What can I do?

    Answer: We have received some reports of PS3s overheating while playing L.A. Noire or beeping three times before shutting down/turning themselves off, mostly on older 60GB and 80GB fat models.

    Primary reports seem to be that updating to firmware 3.61 will cause PlayStations to overheat. There have been various reports of this on a few different games now, all reporting their PS3s turning off or "Red Lighting" after having installed 3.61. This can range from games randomly freezing to PS3s turning off anywhere between 30 mins use to 2 hours. We have confirmed locally that multiple games (Rockstar and non-Rockstar) overheat or freeze only when 3.61 is installed.

    At this time we are recommending contacting Sony directly to report the overheating issue. However, this is not the end of our support; we are continuing to test L.A. Noire on all firmware versions and hardware models to isolate the issues and see what can be done. As always, we will update this article as soon as we have updates.

    Gyral on
    25t9pjnmqicf.jpg
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    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Gyral wrote: »
    Okay really?
    PS3s shutting themselves off while playing L.A. Noire

    Rockstar Support
    posted this on May-17 18:21

    Question: My PS3 turns itself off when I am playing L.A. Noire. What can I do?

    Answer: We have received some reports of PS3s overheating while playing L.A. Noire or beeping three times before shutting down/turning themselves off, mostly on older 60GB and 80GB fat models.

    Primary reports seem to be that updating to firmware 3.61 will cause PlayStations to overheat. There have been various reports of this on a few different games now, all reporting their PS3s turning off or "Red Lighting" after having installed 3.61. This can range from games randomly freezing to PS3s turning off anywhere between 30 mins use to 2 hours. We have confirmed locally that multiple games (Rockstar and non-Rockstar) overheat or freeze only when 3.61 is installed.

    At this time we are recommending contacting Sony directly to report the overheating issue. However, this is not the end of our support; we are continuing to test L.A. Noire on all firmware versions and hardware models to isolate the issues and see what can be done. As always, we will update this article as soon as we have updates.

    See thread title.

    cloudeagle on
    Switch: 3947-4890-9293
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    V FactionV Faction Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34722/Zynga_Acquires_Casino_City_Maker_DNA_Games.php

    Are they just going to buy up every single competing Facebook developer or what?

    I think this actually deserves to be called ridiculous.

    V Faction on
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  • Options
    GyralGyral Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    Gyral wrote: »
    Okay really?
    PS3s shutting themselves off while playing L.A. Noire

    Rockstar Support
    posted this on May-17 18:21

    Question: My PS3 turns itself off when I am playing L.A. Noire. What can I do?

    Answer: We have received some reports of PS3s overheating while playing L.A. Noire or beeping three times before shutting down/turning themselves off, mostly on older 60GB and 80GB fat models.

    Primary reports seem to be that updating to firmware 3.61 will cause PlayStations to overheat. There have been various reports of this on a few different games now, all reporting their PS3s turning off or "Red Lighting" after having installed 3.61. This can range from games randomly freezing to PS3s turning off anywhere between 30 mins use to 2 hours. We have confirmed locally that multiple games (Rockstar and non-Rockstar) overheat or freeze only when 3.61 is installed.

    At this time we are recommending contacting Sony directly to report the overheating issue. However, this is not the end of our support; we are continuing to test L.A. Noire on all firmware versions and hardware models to isolate the issues and see what can be done. As always, we will update this article as soon as we have updates.

    See thread title.

    I know. At this point it almost seems like a farce that can't be true or real anymore.

    Gyral on
    25t9pjnmqicf.jpg
  • Options
    ColorlessGreenColorlessGreen Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I posted this exact same thing like four hours ago, but:

    You have got to be fucking kidding me.

    ColorlessGreen on
    Hearthstone (NA, EU, Asia): Ceegee#1473 - spectators welcome.
  • Options
    Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I gotta say it:

    Sony is doomed.

    And honestly? I actually believe it now.

    Magic Pink on
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Lolsony.

    Couscous on
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    dbrock270dbrock270 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    You know what will be better? If PSN went down the day of E3...god help us all from the hilarity at the lolsony press conference.

    dbrock270 on
  • Options
    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Santa should probably skip right over this post:

    No one's downloading iPhone games.
    A new survey of iOS device owners in the U.S. and six European countries shows 63 million iOS gamers downloading over 5 million games a day, outperforming all other app categories combined.

    The March 2011 study, a joint effort between analytics companies Distimo and Newzoo, looked at downloads for the top 300 games available in the free and paid categories. The average iOS gamer downloaded 2.5 such games each month, with the vast majority of those downloads (88 percent) being free games.

    Such games helped drive the growth of in-game spending, which now represents 40 percent of iOS revenues across all games, according to the study. In-game spending is expected to generate the majority of iOS gaming revenue by the second half of 2011.

    Between 50 and 75 percent of iPhone owners across the U.S., UK, Germany, France, Spain, The Netherlands and Belgium play games, according to the study.


    While nearly 15 million Americans and 7 million Europeans play games on an iPad -- more than play on Sony's PlayStation Portable, according to the study -- the tablet device represented only 10 percent of all iOS gaming purchases.

    Success for iOS games was concentrated heavily among a few top performers in the study, with games ranking in the top 25 bringing five to six times more downloads and revenue than the next 25 top-selling games.

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34720/Study_63M_iOS_Gamers_Downloading_5M_Games_Daily.php

    Also, Monster Hunter's coming to iPhone.

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34723/Capcom_Bringing_Monster_Hunter_Spinoff_To_Japanese_iPhone_In_June.php

    And Microsoft is doing a big promotion to remind people that Windows 7 phones can in fact play games. If you can't name one of the games in the promotion before clicking the link, you're sure going to feel silly when you find out.

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/34725/Microsoft_Sets_Schedule_For_Windows_Phone_7_Must_Have_Games_Promotion.php

    cloudeagle on
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  • Options
    CadeCade Eppur si muove.Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    No what's funny is if someone hacks their presentation and mocks them.

    Now that would be funny.

    Cade on
  • Options
    Lindsay LohanLindsay Lohan Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I'm actually started to feel bad for Sony. My son recently got a PS2 for his bedroom as a hand me down from my mother and the quality of the PS2 slim and the games for it is just outstanding. I find it incredibly interesting just sitting back and watching the difference in how MS and Sony have handled terrible issues (the red ring issue vs this hacking issue). For a company that people call M$, they've really handled the majority of things in a much more customer focused way.

    Lindsay Lohan on
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    dbrock270dbrock270 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    What cloudeagle? You say no one's buying iPhone games, yet that article you posted just says how strong the market is doing?

    dbrock270 on
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    Brainiac 8Brainiac 8 Don't call me Shirley... Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    dbrock270 wrote: »
    What cloudeagle? You say no one's buying iPhone games, yet that article you posted just says how strong the market is doing?

    Sarcasm detector broken? O_o

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    dbrock270dbrock270 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Brainiac 8 wrote: »
    dbrock270 wrote: »
    What cloudeagle? You say no one's buying iPhone games, yet that article you posted just says how strong the market is doing?

    Sarcasm detector broken? O_o

    yes...

    dbrock270 on
  • Options
    LednehLedneh shinesquawk Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Yeah for all the natural hate on Microsoft, at least they have their shit relatively together. Sony... just doesn't, at least as far as the PS3/PSN is concerned.

    I'm gonna have to think long and hard about buying their next console, that's for damned sure

    Ledneh on
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    CadeCade Eppur si muove.Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I'm actually started to feel bad for Sony. My son recently got a PS2 for his bedroom as a hand me down from my mother and the quality of the PS2 slim and the games for it is just outstanding. I find it incredibly interesting just sitting back and watching the difference in how MS and Sony have handled terrible issues (the red ring issue vs this hacking issue). For a company that people call M$, they've really handled the majority of things in a much more customer focused way.

    I would feel bad for Sony if not for the fact they handled things in a poor way, kept their customers from knowing what was really going on and basically they need to learn some hubris. When a company gets too big they tend to think they can do everything no matter what, some times they need to be smacked around some to remind them hey they better do their best because they are not the only game in town.

    Cade on
  • Options
    dbrock270dbrock270 Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Guys I made a daring voyage into the Gametrailers forums. What I found was a bunch of lolsony fanboys and apologists.

    http://forums.gametrailers.com/thread/guys-i-have-a-problem/1212994
    http://forums.gametrailers.com/forum/ps3/28

    Oh yeah, and then there's this guy
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrd_VXk23Kc

    I hope you had fun watching him, he's a genius.

    dbrock270 on
  • Options
    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    I'm not sure the freemium market is that sustainable for anybody but the people at the top of the market.

    The great reliance on in game sales with the game being free or close enough to free is why comparisons in total number of games sold/downloaded are stupid.

    Couscous on
  • Options
    spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Kor wrote: »
    Sigtyr wrote: »
    Sony's E3 is going to be fantastic.

    I'm willing to wager currency that one of their bullet points at E3 will be the new stability/security of an updated PSN.

    They should have a section of their booth where you get to shoot actual bullets at the PSN.

    spool32 on
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    RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Since I'm going to E3 this year, I'm tempted to go to the Sony booth at E3 with my unused PSN cards in hand and see if I can get a refund.

    RainbowDespair on
  • Options
    The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    If you're going to e3 you should be camped day and night at the Uncharted 3 booth so I can live vicariously through you six-thousand miles away.

    The_Scarab on
  • Options
    The_SpaniardThe_Spaniard It's never lupines Irvine, CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited May 2011
    Since I'm going to E3 this year, I'm tempted to go to the Sony booth at E3 with my unused PSN cards in hand and see if I can get a refund.

    Depending on what happens with my getting in, we should meet up.

    The_Spaniard on
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    RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    The_Scarab wrote: »
    If you're going to e3 you should be camped day and night at the Uncharted 3 booth so I can live vicariously through you six-thousand miles away.

    Sorry. I don't own a PS3 (yet) so a sequel to a sequel to a game that I haven't played yet isn't high on my list of targets. I'll be checking out the Sony section to find out more about the NGP, but that's about it.

    RainbowDespair on
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    The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    edited May 2011
    The_Scarab wrote: »
    If you're going to e3 you should be camped day and night at the Uncharted 3 booth so I can live vicariously through you six-thousand miles away.

    Sorry. I don't own a PS3 (yet) so a sequel to a sequel to a game that I haven't played yet isn't high on my list of targets. I'll be checking out the Sony section to find out more about the NGP, but that's about it.

    Right, that's it. You're on my list.

    The_Scarab on
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