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Video Game Industry Thread: December's done, time for the next one

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Posts

  • SyphyreSyphyre A Dangerous Pastime Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Brainiac 8 wrote:
    I think the man behind this is really Troy Mcclure. :shock:

    Hello. My name is Troy McClure. You may remember me from other PA internet drama such as "Jack Thompson, you're insane" and "Gabe and a radio DJ have words."

    Syphyre on
    Steam ID - Syphyreal --- 3DS Friend Code: 2723-9387-1002
  • Skull2185Skull2185 Smile Puddin'! Registered User regular
    cloudeagle wrote:
    Okay. Can anyone answer for sure whether there are actually any other people involved in the Avenger controller other than this guy?

    I attempted to visit the official Avenger PS3 website, but I guess its getting hammered like Penny-Arcade.

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
    3DS FC: 5129-0946-8305
    PSN: DrSkullnumbers
  • MHYoshimitzuMHYoshimitzu Registered User regular
    cloudeagle wrote:
    Okay. Can anyone answer for sure whether there are actually any other people involved in the Avenger controller other than this guy?

    Previous correspondence on another website indicates this guy is the president of the company.

    Spoiler:
  • Brainiac 8Brainiac 8 Registered User regular
    He won the company in a card game.

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  • expendableexpendable Silly Goose Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote:
    I say Khoo extends an invite to PAX for the makers of the Avenger controller, both for spite and for a means for them to connect with a resource that isn't pants-on-head dumb.

    So, on the Avenger website itself, the mainpage refers to Kotkin Enterprises, LLC, but other pages refer to iControl Enterprises, LLC. Yet every method of contact goes straight to Paul Christofoeros (or however his name is spelled) of Ocean Marketing Inc, of which he seems to be the sole employee.

    I'm trying to dig up anything on Kotkin or iControl Enterprises (the s at the end is important), but not finding anything so far.

    Spoiler:
    Steam
  • cloudeaglecloudeagle Zhu-Li, do the thing! Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote:
    cloudeagle wrote:
    Okay. Can anyone answer for sure whether there are actually any other people involved in the Avenger controller other than this guy?

    I attempted to visit the official Avenger PS3 website, but I guess its getting hammered like Penny-Arcade.

    I managed to sneak in, and based on the (non-) quality of the site and the fact that there's only one phone number and email address I'm guessing this guy is either the creator of the thing or more intimately involved in it than simply being a PR gun for hire.

    3DS: 0344-9335-6762
  • Ragnar DragonfyreRagnar Dragonfyre Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    No. Not at all.

    People pre-order things all the time with no specific release date even announced.

    As long as they weren't miss-sold such a service, which this guy wasn't, it's perfectly reasonable to get annoyed when a customer keeps on asking about something that had no set date to begin with.

    Both parties in this ridiculous affair, including Mike, have done stupid things. The only reason this is a Thing is that the marketing guy was wrong and crazy, instead of just stupid.

    I'm not too keen on Mike's 'just google me' attitude either. I mean, he could have handled that better.

    Penny-Arcade bases their business on being edgy. I'd expect Mike to act that way. Besides, if buddy has such amazing connections he should know who Mike is.

    I honestly hope this guy gets shunned by the entire industry and ends up with a factory full of a product he can't sell to anyone.

    steam_sig.png
  • MHYoshimitzuMHYoshimitzu Registered User regular
    Brainiac 8 wrote:
    He won the company in a spelling bee.

    Spoiler:
  • MalReynoldsMalReynolds The Hunter S Thompson of incredibly mild medicines Registered User regular
    Brainiac 8 wrote:
    He won the company in a speeling beee.

    "A new take on the epic fantasy genre... Darkly comic, relatable characters... twisted storyline."
    "Readers who prefer tension and romance, Maledictions: The Offering, delivers... As serious YA fiction, I’ll give it five stars out of five. As a novel? Four and a half." - Liz Ellor
    My new novel: Maledictions: The Offering. Now in Paperback!
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    expendable wrote:
    Paul Christofoeros (or however his name is spelled)

    Don't worry about it, he probably doesn't know either.

  • CadeCade Registered User regular
    XpTJo.jpg

    Maybe this is where he met the mayor?

  • DeebaserDeebaser Lead Frog Rammer Fake Board GamerRegistered User regular
  • Skull2185Skull2185 Smile Puddin'! Registered User regular
    Bobble wrote:
    expendable wrote:
    Paul Christofoeros (or however his name is spelled)

    Don't worry about it, he probably doesn't know either.

    I almost spit my gum out at this one... haha

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
    3DS FC: 5129-0946-8305
    PSN: DrSkullnumbers
  • shosarshosar Registered User
    edited December 2011
    The Business Development Director for N-control, they guys who make the Avenger, is at @Tatterr and he seems as unhappy about this as everyone else

    shosar on
  • CadeCade Registered User regular
    Deebaser wrote:
    Is that the guy?

    Can't you tell by all his majesty!

  • The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    No. Not at all.

    People pre-order things all the time with no specific release date even announced.

    As long as they weren't miss-sold such a service, which this guy wasn't, it's perfectly reasonable to get annoyed when a customer keeps on asking about something that had no set date to begin with.

    Both parties in this ridiculous affair, including Mike, have done stupid things. The only reason this is a Thing is that the marketing guy was wrong and crazy, instead of just stupid.

    I'm not too keen on Mike's 'just google me' attitude either. I mean, he could have handled that better.

    Penny-Arcade bases their business on being edgy. I'd expect Mike to act that way. Besides, if buddy has such amazing connections he should know who Mike is.

    I honestly hope this guy gets shunned by the entire industry and ends up with a factory full of a product he can't sell to anyone.

    But you see this is the worst thing. He should be able to sell the product. Even the customer in the email exchange wants it. It's of value.

    Which is why tarring the entire enterprise in this childish fashion may well be cathartic and pleasing, but it's also of no use whatsoever other than to ruin the fortunes of one guy only.

    You know, maybe this guy has been pulling 20 hour days for two weeks trying to get the product shipped. Maybe the guy doesn't speak English as a first language. Maybe he's just a dick and responded in a ludicrous manner to someone he felt was pestering.

    We've all got drawn into internet arguments well beyond the point when we should have called it quits. It's fairly easy to do so, to make shit up and just play the aloof, superior person card.

    Is all of that, all those bad things this guy said and did, worth damning a product that even the guy who was slighted has said he wants and needs.

    I'm of the belief that no matter how heinous the offense, no matter how stupid or dumb or annoying or hateful and criminal the person on the other end of an email exchange behaves and is. That still doesn't justify the weasely act of sounding the Internet Alarm and posting said email exchange all over the internet, on several sites and forums - like reddit or 4chan or even Penny Arcade. Because that is a complete reversal, it erodes all sympathy I had for the customer beforehand and actually gets nothing done at all.

    This guy is no closer to getting his product delivered on time, or his money refunded, now that the Internet Detectives are ruining one idiot marketeers life. It serves no purpose. It's childish, ineffectual and pathetic.

    Again, I must say that I'm not apologizing for the Ocean guy's actions. I am condemning him as strongly as anyone else. However, the customer could have handled it better. So much better.

    scarab you have mental problems
  • UltimanecatUltimanecat Registered User regular
    I can only speculate about the corporate structure going on here, but it's not uncommon in the small-scale tech industry for a device to be designed and manufactured overseas (usually in China), with the manufacturer having a corporation here in the US for import purposes, and then leaving the matter of distribution (getting the product into stores) up to another company altogether.

    Basically, overseas company wants to sell something in US stores but hires a go-between since they are not confident in their ability to directly market it to retailers, nor perhaps in this case to provide direct customer support. All they are interested in is getting it over the ocean.

    Given the name-dropping and playing up of his connections, it sounds like that's his (purported) schtick anyway.

    SteamID : same as my PA forum name
  • PenumbraPenumbra Registered User regular
    Brainiac 8 wrote:
    He one the company inn a speeling beee.

    steam_sig.png
    3DS Friend Code: 5386-8399-1472
  • Skull2185Skull2185 Smile Puddin'! Registered User regular
    shosar wrote:
    The Business Development Director for N-control, they guys who make the Avenger, is at @Tatterr and he seems as unhappy about this as everyone else

    He seems like a cool, laid back gamer guy too. I feel pretty confident that this problem will be rectified now.

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
    3DS FC: 5129-0946-8305
    PSN: DrSkullnumbers
  • LilnoobsLilnoobs Alpha Queue Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    The_Scarab wrote:
    snip.

    You're right. People should just let douche bags be douche bags because the product is so great. Who cares how bad I've been treated as long as I get my product?

    :rotate:

    And just because you say you're not apologizing doesn't mean you are in fact not apologizing because the whole post reads as an apology blaming the customer.

    Lilnoobs on
  • MHYoshimitzuMHYoshimitzu Registered User regular
    Penumbra wrote:
    Brainiac 8 wrote:
    He one the company inn a speeling beee I DEAD SERIOUS.

    Spoiler:
  • SageinaRageSageinaRage Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    However, the customer could have handled it better. So much better.

    The customer didn't do anything wrong. Don't blame it on him when you're really mad at the internet.

  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    expendable wrote:
    cloudeagle wrote:
    Bizazedo wrote:
    Now I feel like the dumb one for being naive and going "well, it's probably OceanMarketting because OceanMarketing was taken or something".

    [edit]

    Oh, dear god..

    http://www.copyscape.com/view.php?o=82948&u=http://www.rubikzcube.com/services&t=1324998212&s=http://oceanmarketinginc.com/services.php&w=121&i=2&r=7

    Sweet zombie Jesus. This could get a lot worse for him than simply seeing his joystick go down in flames.

    I thought this whole time that he was just the head of the marketing/pr/distribution company that the joysticks guys contracted, but everything seems to point back to this one guy. I don't think there are other employees, period.

    What am I looking at here?

    steam_sig.png
  • MHYoshimitzuMHYoshimitzu Registered User regular
    MuddBudd wrote:
    expendable wrote:
    cloudeagle wrote:
    Bizazedo wrote:
    Now I feel like the dumb one for being naive and going "well, it's probably OceanMarketting because OceanMarketing was taken or something".

    [edit]

    Oh, dear god..

    http://www.copyscape.com/view.php?o=82948&u=http://www.rubikzcube.com/services&t=1324998212&s=http://oceanmarketinginc.com/services.php&w=121&i=2&r=7

    Sweet zombie Jesus. This could get a lot worse for him than simply seeing his joystick go down in flames.

    I thought this whole time that he was just the head of the marketing/pr/distribution company that the joysticks guys contracted, but everything seems to point back to this one guy. I don't think there are other employees, period.

    What am I looking at here?

    Everything about his website, down to the "About Us" section, was plagiarized from somewhere else.

    Spoiler:
  • cloudeaglecloudeagle Zhu-Li, do the thing! Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Skull2185 wrote:
    shosar wrote:
    The Business Development Director for N-control, they guys who make the Avenger, is at @Tatterr and he seems as unhappy about this as everyone else

    He seems like a cool, laid back gamer guy too. I feel pretty confident that this problem will be rectified now.
    Frank Shephard
    Business Development Director for N-control. These tweets belong to me

    @StewartMS no official statement yet. All "I" can say is that "I" apologize to anyone who has been treated poorly by him. More to come soon

    And there we go.

    Edit: Scarab, looks like this whole thing just might get results after all.

    cloudeagle on
    3DS: 0344-9335-6762
  • expendableexpendable Silly Goose Registered User regular
    I am on the phone with the avenger creator right now.

    Spoiler:
    Steam
  • Brainiac 8Brainiac 8 Registered User regular
    Good, the dude needs to realize that he cannot treat customers like that. I'm glad a rep from the company in question is stepping in.

    3DS Friend Code - 1032-1293-2997
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  • cherylharrisoncherylharrison Registered User
    From the always-insightful Ocean Market(t)ing blog:

    "You social media marketing should be handled by a permanent employee (or outside agency) that truly understands your brand, business model and online marketing goals. They will be in charge of your online voice and personality, so they better know what they are talking about. Effectively managing a social media marketing strategy takes countless hours, because it has to constantly be monitored and updated. They have to understand the goal of each social networking profile, as well as the audience that uses that medium. Messages have to be tweaked to fit the style and format of each site, but the overall strategy has to work towards the same end goal. Back in March, an employee at New Media Strategies (who was Chrysler’s social media agency at the time) dropped the F-bomb in a tweet from the @ChryslerAuto account, taking a shot at Detroit drivers. After deleting the tweet, Chrysler quickly fired New Media Strategies. Chances are the employee thought he was using his personal account to send the tweet, but accidentally posted from @ChryslerAuto. If a professional agency can make such a big mistake, what can happen when you hand the social media reigns over to someone who isn’t qualified to drive? Social media allows you to directly interact with your consumers, so who is going to be doing the talking?"

    And how.

  • CadeCade Registered User regular
    The guy had a Myspace page too which is nuts.

    He sounds like a roid rage kind of guy.

  • Belasco32Belasco32 Registered User regular
    Lilnoobs wrote:

    You're right. People should just let douche bags be douche bags because the product is so great. Who cares how bad I've been treated as long as I get my product?

    :rotate:

    And just because you say you're not apologizing doesn't mean you are in fact not apologizing because the whole post reads as an apology blaming the customer.

    I've gotta agree. I think you're missing the boat on this one, Scarab. Customer service is incredibly important and it's on the company providing that service to, well, provide it. "The customer is always right." That isn't B.S., that's good business sense. It's not on the customer to not be difficult, it's on the PR guy to smile and take and be unfailingly professional then go back to the proverbial water cooler and go off about the dick customer he just had to deal with.

    Yes, we should all strive to be kind to each other and respectful of one another on any side of a transaction or interaction, but that's not always how things go in real life so there are social rules in place (and often corporate rules in place) to deal with when things go off the rails. In this particular instance, I think the customer is completely blameless where the PR guy is entirely culpable. As for how Mike handled it, I fully support that, as well. He saw someone being treated horribly by, for all intensive purposes, a bully and stepped in. And, frankly, it would be nice to see more people step up when people are being bullied.

    I've got a ton of experience on both ends of the customer service thing, and I've been the boss who had to enforce the "the customer is always right" rule. I can't agree with you in finding fault with either the customer or his champion in this thing. Is the interaction low-brow? Yes. Does that make it lose its validity? Not at all.

  • amnesiasoftamnesiasoft Thick Creamy Furry Registered User regular
    SpeedNut wrote:
    And for the Copyscape link, did anyone let Rubikzcube know they got plagarized? Especially since they operate in the same space?
    I dropped off a message about it for them on their contact page.

    steam_sig.png
  • The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    However, the customer could have handled it better. So much better.

    The customer didn't do anything wrong. Don't blame it on him when you're really mad at the internet.

    The customer doing something wrong is literally the only reason we are talking about this.

    If you are jilted by poor company decisions, it is not just OK to simply post your conversations on the internet knowing full well what the response will be.

    When you post personal contact details on 4chan, no matter how poorly you have been treated by what is obviously a crazy, cruel and stupid man, you are not an innocent. Stop dismissing thse things as justifiable.

    If you have been screwed by a company, you have a dozen legal responses that you can afford yourself of. Even more so in America where customer's rights are well protected and easily defended.

    Your first response is not to floor the internet with this information as an act of revenge. That can only be justified as a last resort.

    scarab you have mental problems
  • DeebaserDeebaser Lead Frog Rammer Fake Board GamerRegistered User regular
    Regardless of what a contemptuous toolbox this Ocean Marketting guy is, the customer is not always right.
    HATE
    THAT
    EXPRESSION


    http://positivesharing.com/2006/07/why-the-customer-is-always-right-results-in-bad-customer-service/

  • FeldornFeldorn Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    @the_scarab i'm curious to find out what you think the customer should have done? i mean, this dong has a history if treating customers this way. what you're basically saying is, you think it's alright to just leave this guy in charge? he obviously has no oversight here, he is a one man company who doesn't think that an individual customer matters, but you think that it's ok, because the customers should just suck it up and deal, huh?

    and to say that you shouldn't damn a company because of what one goose does, remember that he is an employee of that company (even if it's just by contract), and he is the face of that company to all customers. if you're going to have a company, one bad hire can ruin it all, that is called a risk, which is part of doing business. and n-logic (or whatever the actual company is) hasn't exactly been quick to deal with this situation, saying "we're looking into it" could just mean we're cleaning out the bank accounts and going to mexico.

    Feldorn on
    steam_sig.png
  • Brainiac 8Brainiac 8 Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    The_Scarab wrote:
    However, the customer could have handled it better. So much better.

    The customer didn't do anything wrong. Don't blame it on him when you're really mad at the internet.

    The customer doing something wrong is literally the only reason we are talking about this.

    If you are jilted by poor company decisions, it is not just OK to simply post your conversations on the internet knowing full well what the response will be.

    When you post personal contact details on 4chan, no matter how poorly you have been treated by what is obviously a crazy, cruel and stupid man, you are not an innocent. Stop dismissing thse things as justifiable.

    If you have been screwed by a company, you have a dozen legal responses that you can afford yourself of. Even more so in America where customer's rights are well protected and easily defended.

    Your first response is not to floor the internet with this information as an act of revenge. That can only be justified as a last resort.

    But word of mouth, whether positive or negative has been a staple in customer relations for generations. This dude just went that route, it's just the internet makes it more widespread than it used to.

    And if I'm not mistaken, he didn't post anything until after the dude acted like a huge jerk to him...correct?

    3DS Friend Code - 1032-1293-2997
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  • taliosfalcontaliosfalcon Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    The_Scarab wrote:
    However, the customer could have handled it better. So much better.

    The customer didn't do anything wrong. Don't blame it on him when you're really mad at the internet.

    The customer doing something wrong is literally the only reason we are talking about this.

    If you are jilted by poor company decisions, it is not just OK to simply post your conversations on the internet knowing full well what the response will be.

    When you post personal contact details on 4chan, no matter how poorly you have been treated by what is obviously a crazy, cruel and stupid man, you are not an innocent. Stop dismissing thse things as justifiable.

    If you have been screwed by a company, you have a dozen legal responses that you can afford yourself of. Even more so in America where customer's rights are well protected and easily defended
    .

    Your first response is not to floor the internet with this information as an act of revenge. That can only be justified as a last resort.

    That wont' cost you huge amounts of lost time and fee's for a 50$ purchase? ehh....

    WII U NNID- talios
    steam-taliosfalcon
    XBL-AdeptPenguin
  • LilnoobsLilnoobs Alpha Queue Registered User regular
    It seems like Scarab thinks the customer should just take it and wait for the product, and then vent his anger and frustration out on his wife or kids. People who deserve it, obviously.

  • cloudeaglecloudeagle Zhu-Li, do the thing! Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    @scarab: Then what do you make of this?



    After posting that, the CEO of Fedex personally apologized to the guy and bought him a new monitor. In fact there's a major website out there, www.consumerist.com, that is in large part dedicated to customers griping about exceptionally bad service to the Internet as a whole... and often times the companies will respond and make things right.

    In fact people do this all the time through Yelp and other Internet review sites. People gripe... and savvy companies go through the complaints, respond to the legitimate ones, and offer to make them better.

    Though the customer did get a little testy in light of the bad service he was getting, the fact remains that he was getting some truly bad service. And as a result of his griping to the Internet as a whole, he's going to get better service from the people who run the company.

    cloudeagle on
    3DS: 0344-9335-6762
  • Skull2185Skull2185 Smile Puddin'! Registered User regular
    The_Scarab wrote:
    If you are jilted by poor company decisions, it is not just OK to simply post your conversations on the internet knowing full well what the response will be.

    Yes.

    Yes it is.

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
    3DS FC: 5129-0946-8305
    PSN: DrSkullnumbers
  • Belasco32Belasco32 Registered User regular
    Deebaser wrote:
    Regardless of what a contemptuous toolbox this Ocean Marketting guy is, the customer is not always right.
    HATE
    THAT
    EXPRESSION


    http://positivesharing.com/2006/07/why-the-customer-is-always-right-results-in-bad-customer-service/

    It's worked a treat for several generations of my family. Maybe it's too simplistic a term for what is really a very complicated series of careful interactions that require a great deal of support on the back end so you don't burn out your employees, but, at least in this case, it's applicable.

    Scarab: I still can't agree with you :/

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