I'm still not convinced by Temeraire. It sounds like a solid Hornblower with Dragons, but I'm not convinced that it's for me.
I was just coming in here to talk about this. I've recently started going through them and while the first wasn't particularly impressive, the series overall goes from the general Napoleonic adventures in the beginning to strong themes centered around slavery, person hood, duty in the face of atrocity, etc. It is definitely not where I expected the books to go.
They also cease being historical retelling with the inclusion of dragons and move in to full on alternative history.
Well, the Napoleonic wars in general is my very favorite historic era by far, I am SUCH a nerd for that time period. You don't even want to know how much time I've put into Empire: Total War, it's ridiculous.
So really i'm less interested for the dragons than just another story styled after that era.
Kana on
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
I'm still not convinced by Temeraire. It sounds like a solid Hornblower with Dragons, but I'm not convinced that it's for me. Mind you, if you want a decent historical adventure tale in the period, with a (deeply) unreliable narrator, you might like the Flashman series. Apparently they borrowed the style for the 'Ciaphas Cain' 40k books, as an example.
Working on Mary Gentle's Ash at the moment, which starts off as a 15th century story about a mercenary company, framed in correspondence for a historical text, before becoming...something else. Sex, violence, brutality, strong women, filth, battles, harsh language, and some...deep oddness. What's not to love?
Mary Gentle is one of my favourite writers, though she doesn't publish much nowadays and she was never famous, so she gets ignored nowadays.
The Temeraire books are actually really good. They're not cheesy - they're light, but as Quid says, tackle some hard themes with sensitivity. A lot of political stuff and examination of other cultures in a very open-minded way.
It's the premise that's cheesy, but the writing and thought behind the books makes it work.
I'm still not convinced by Temeraire. It sounds like a solid Hornblower with Dragons, but I'm not convinced that it's for me. Mind you, if you want a decent historical adventure tale in the period, with a (deeply) unreliable narrator, you might like the Flashman series. Apparently they borrowed the style for the 'Ciaphas Cain' 40k books, as an example.
Working on Mary Gentle's Ash at the moment, which starts off as a 15th century story about a mercenary company, framed in correspondence for a historical text, before becoming...something else. Sex, violence, brutality, strong women, filth, battles, harsh language, and some...deep oddness. What's not to love?
Mary Gentle is one of my favourite writers, though she doesn't publish much nowadays and she was never famous, so she gets ignored nowadays.
Rats and Gargoyles is another one you should try.
I knew at least one other person in the world was reading her work. And now I know who it is. Hurrah! Yes, I can only say good things about Rats&Gargoyles as well, though I got it in her White Crow collection, because...italics. Though it is a bit...esoteric, I suspect, for many people. Cartomancy is rather good as well, and Ilario, and...look, if you're reading this, go get a used copy of Ash off Amazon for under $1, and you'll (probably) consider it money well spent. Goodness knows my copy is heartily worn out from repeated lendings and re-reads.
Small warning: Gentle's work isn't for everyone. It can get a bit gruseome, a bit graphic, and a bit rude. But that's life.
@poshniallo : I didn't know this, but apparently she's doing a new book for 2012, "The Black Opera". It looks...interesting.
The whole "aviators are socially shunned" thing in the Temeraire books, and how Laurence deals with it is pretty interesting too.
Yup, and the feminist stuff with the female aviators, and Temeraire's whole 'Thomas Mann wrote for dragons too' thing.
Excellent really.
I just love Laurence's personality. He's cool and awesome and dutiful and brave without being brash, arrogant, fearless, headstrong or a Gary Stu. He's the ultimate Napoleonic British Naval Gentleman Officer, and then everything he believes proper and adequate is chalenged on a very visceral and basic level, and he's willing to not only evaluate those new truths, but also to keep the older values he deems still worthy. Hes open minded and open hearted without being spineless and inconsistent.
I also loved Wise Man's Fear. Most of the criticisms of it seem to be that Kvothe is good at everything and that 'nothing happens'. Kvothe was good at everything in Name of the Wind, too, and the book is, literally, a legendary hero boasting about his life, so I'm not sure why anyone would expect otherwise. And I felt like just as much stuff happened as in the first book, in terms of events/page-count density. So I dunno what people's problem with it is. It's not the best book I've ever read or anything, but it's still up there in the ranks of the best high fantasy novels I've ever read.
In the first book, Kvothe was good at a lot of things but had significant flaws, but in the second book I felt like the impact of the flaws were reduced and Kvothe is way to lucky in general. The other thing that bugs me is that the present day Kvothe doesn't seem like someone who would boast about his past which then leads me to believe that he's telling the truth but the story is just to ridiculous to be believable. Also while I do agree that stuff happens I wish the story would focus a little more on the mythical beings, the Chandrin if that's spelled correctly.
Meh, I guess the luck thing is either something that bugs you or not. I can't think of any instances of him being lucky that seemed more egregious than the lucky shenanigans that nearly every fictional character gets up to.
And while modern-Kvothe, 'Kote' or whatever his name is, isn't a braggart, he was raised as a story-teller and entertainer, which is the life that he drops back into when he's telling his story. The bit with fighting in the bar during the interlude was, I think, meant to illustrate that. He briefly forgets that he's not the man he used to be, then either remembers or is reminded. While telling the story he's the same guy who (to one extent or another) pulled off all of the ridiculous feats of bravado and bullshittery that he's describing. Bast even calls him out on embellishing how hot all the women in his life were at one point. He's not exactly an unreliable narrator in that we aren't given reason to doubt that the things he's describing happened, but it seems safe to assume that he's describing them in the best light possible while still maintaining the tone of light self-deprecation necessary to make telling tales of his own heroism not immediately sound like boasting to the listener.
I stopped in at a nice used book store the other day, and picked up some stuff.
1984. I've read it twice, and my roomie already owns it, but it is such an important book, I need it for my collection. Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde by Robert Louis Stevenson. Kinda got it on a whim. I've been reading HG Wells and this seems to fit. I'll be reading Frankenstein at some point as well.
And finally James Clavell's Tai-Pan. I recently re-read Shogun and loved it. And even though I'm currently reading like 4 books already, I couldn't help but read a bit into Tai-Pan. Its great so far. It is also extremely informative and interesting; I suspect I'll come out of this book with not only more knowledge of the Opium Wars, but also China and the region in general.
I don't allow myself to go into used bookstores anymore.
It's like a recovering alcoholic hanging out in a bar.
Kana on
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
Took a break from the oh so tedious start of the Dragon Reborn and started reading Armistead Maupin's Tales of the City and immediately got hooked. They're all silly stories about silly people, but they're strangely compelling. Finished the first book in no time and immediately bought and started the sequel (a kindle makes this way too easy). Now that I'm in the flow of it they're really fun, I'm reading through trying to anticipate whatever the next unexpected connection between the stories will be. They almost feel like episodes of Seinfeld in a strange way.
0
Options
lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
I have made it to book 13 of the WoT.
Book 12 was not nearly as painful as I remembered it being.
I need more fantasy novels. I loved Mistborn, Elantris, Name of the Wind, and stuff like Ready Player One. With that in mind, any fun reads in the sci fi or fantasy veins you can recommend?
I need more fantasy novels. I loved Mistborn, Elantris, Name of the Wind, and stuff like Ready Player One. With that in mind, any fun reads in the sci fi or fantasy veins you can recommend?
I rather liked Richard Morgan's fantasy debut, The Steel Remains. Haven't read part 2 yet.
I need more fantasy novels. I loved Mistborn, Elantris, Name of the Wind, and stuff like Ready Player One. With that in mind, any fun reads in the sci fi or fantasy veins you can recommend?
I rather liked Richard Morgan's fantasy debut, The Steel Remains. Haven't read part 2 yet.
Yeah. Morgan does excellent sci-fi, and The Steel Remains was a nice bit of genre-subverting fantasy. Can be a bit graphic here and there though. I'll also second The Lies of Locke Lamorra, because it is excellently done.
Also might be worth checking out (darker, gritter side), Joe Abercrombie's The Blade Itself, which is also very good at breaking up your expectations in a genre which seems more..defined than others a lot of the time.
For pure adventureous swashbuckling fun, Chris Wooding's Retribution Falls and Stephen Hunt's The Court of the Air would be excellent options.
My favourite of Joe Abercrombie's books is by far The Heroes - and it's a self-contained read, not part of a trilogy, so perhaps easier to get into.
I'm a big fan of The Heroes, but I think that whilst it's a solid self contained text, it works so much better if assessed in the context of the work that precedes it. If nothing else, there's spoiler potential - some of the events and characters in Heroes spoil the preceding trilogy a little if you haven't read it previously.
As @SniperGuy indicated a preference for Mistborn/Name of the Wind, I figure another trilogy won't hurt...though really, you can't go wrong with Abercrombie.
Seconded. I read this recently and was super mad when the following book was out of the library.
Alternatively, check out The Warded Man by Peter V. Brett.
Anyone going to recommend Brent Weeks to round out the current bloc of fantasy writers du jour?
Weeks is a fine author; if you liked Sanderson and Rothfuss, you'll probably like Weeks.
I quite like Kristin Cashore, and I don't think she gets mentioned much around here. Graceling and Fire, with Bitterblue coming out next month, as I recall. Interesting world (without dedicating half the book to it, Sanderson-style), strong characters, plot that moves quickly. Highly recommended, especially the first novel.
Also, I recently read Melina Marchetta's Finnikin of the Rock, and Jay Lake's Green. I spent both of these books cringing at the actions or circumstances of the main characters (for various reasons), which was definitely something different in ostensibly YA fantasy. On the one hand, it makes it hard to recommend either, but at the same time, it speaks to the quality of the storytelling that I was drawn in enough to care. So, while I won't say "read these books", I will say "give them a look and see if they sound interesting".
Is it worth reading Trudi Canavan's Rogue series without reading the Black Magician trilogy first? I've seen her books at the library a few times and picked up a couple this trip because they actually had the first book in the trilogy in, but I didn't realize it was a sequel trilogy. Do I need to read the other ones first to appreciate them or does it stand alone? I haven't touched any of her stuff before.
Just started reading Meat: A Benign Extravagance by Simon Fairlie which has been recommended on a few nutrition blogs I read for its critique of the environmental impact of various farming methods, and the problems with arguments made by different ideologies, (vegan, industrial, pasture-centered). Vegans in general seem to hate it since it criticizes vegan-based systems for being being heavily fossil-fuel based and for needlessly wasting usable animal products that will be there regardless. Also, if environmental impact was truly important, then they shouldn't eat other plant-based luxuries like strawberries, asparagus, coffee, wine, etc. that have a greater environmental impact than meat. The author's position seems to be that a "default livestock" system is probably the best, and is essentially a system where the meat comes from livestock that are already in use on the farms, and not feeding food to animals for the purpose of just food. We can't eat nearly as much meat as we do now, but we can still eat some meat, and those who really like their meat can probably get a bigger share from the meat the vegans don't eat.
started reading Temeraire. Laurence's faithful lieutenant is named Tom and the surgeon knows all about exotic animals dragons. So it's nice to see I'm reading a book written by an Aubrey/Maturin lover.
Also it made me laugh twice that he describes watching the Orient get burned by a dragon at the Nile. 1) because the Orient burned and exploded at the real battle of the Nile, and 2) because goddamnit I'm such a nerd and I remembered that off the top of my head.
Kana on
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
Although the admiral says the captured enemy frigate will be brought into the service, it should really be "bought into the service"
Uuuugggh can't help myself
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
Surprisingly in depth in some areas, slightly lax in others. Pretty hefty, and quick, read so I suppose it's not terrible that he didn't bog it down with minutiae.
0
Options
jakobaggerLO THY DREAD EMPIRE CHAOS IS RESTOREDRegistered Userregular
Although the admiral says the captured enemy frigate will be brought into the service, it should really be "bought into the service"
Uuuugggh can't help myself
Huh, really? Guess it's one of those archaic expressions where people forgot the original meaning and change it to something they feel makes more sense (I forget what the term for this is). Care to explain the phrase? I'm guessing it has something to do with the navy paying prize money to the crew that captured the ship.
Yeah the english navy was utterly bizarre, basically if you captured a ship and brought it back the navy would then (if they wanted it) buy it through a prize-agent, and the captain, crew, and admiral will all get a slice of the appraised value. You'd also get a share of the selling value of the cargo.
Not to mention what ships would and wouldn't get 'bought into the service' and how much they were appraised for was often more about the political pull of the people who would profit from it than the actual usefulness of the ship.
Shit got really crazy early during the Napoleonic wars when England was at war with Spain and their treasure galleons.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
Yeah the english navy was utterly bizarre, basically if you captured a ship and brought it back the navy would then (if they wanted it) buy it through a prize-agent, and the captain, crew, and admiral will all get a slice of the appraised value. You'd also get a share of the selling value of the cargo.
Not to mention what ships would and wouldn't get 'bought into the service' and how much they were appraised for was often more about the political pull of the people who would profit from it than the actual usefulness of the ship.
Shit got really crazy early during the Napoleonic wars when England was at war with Spain and their treasure galleons.
Interesting. Guess someone got very rich when almost our entire fleet was captured.
Yeah the english navy was utterly bizarre, basically if you captured a ship and brought it back the navy would then (if they wanted it) buy it through a prize-agent, and the captain, crew, and admiral will all get a slice of the appraised value. You'd also get a share of the selling value of the cargo.
Not to mention what ships would and wouldn't get 'bought into the service' and how much they were appraised for was often more about the political pull of the people who would profit from it than the actual usefulness of the ship.
Shit got really crazy early during the Napoleonic wars when England was at war with Spain and their treasure galleons.
Interesting. Guess someone got very rich when almost our entire fleet was captured.
Maybe. The institution of Prizes certainly was an important part of the overall remuneration package for sailors during conflicts, which would have been helpful given the lack of a pensions system, half pay outside of conflicts, badly delayed pay being common and the like.
I need more fantasy novels. I loved Mistborn, Elantris, Name of the Wind, and stuff like Ready Player One. With that in mind, any fun reads in the sci fi or fantasy veins you can recommend?
In addition to what has been said with regards to Abercrombie and Lynch, I'd heartily recommend Chris Wooding's Ketty Jay series, which is about a small band of Steampunk air pirates; Retribution Falls being the first of three.
Posts
I was just coming in here to talk about this. I've recently started going through them and while the first wasn't particularly impressive, the series overall goes from the general Napoleonic adventures in the beginning to strong themes centered around slavery, person hood, duty in the face of atrocity, etc. It is definitely not where I expected the books to go.
They also cease being historical retelling with the inclusion of dragons and move in to full on alternative history.
So really i'm less interested for the dragons than just another story styled after that era.
Mary Gentle is one of my favourite writers, though she doesn't publish much nowadays and she was never famous, so she gets ignored nowadays.
Rats and Gargoyles is another one you should try.
It's the premise that's cheesy, but the writing and thought behind the books makes it work.
Yup, and the feminist stuff with the female aviators, and Temeraire's whole 'Thomas Mann wrote for dragons too' thing.
Excellent really.
I knew at least one other person in the world was reading her work. And now I know who it is. Hurrah! Yes, I can only say good things about Rats&Gargoyles as well, though I got it in her White Crow collection, because...italics. Though it is a bit...esoteric, I suspect, for many people. Cartomancy is rather good as well, and Ilario, and...look, if you're reading this, go get a used copy of Ash off Amazon for under $1, and you'll (probably) consider it money well spent. Goodness knows my copy is heartily worn out from repeated lendings and re-reads.
Small warning: Gentle's work isn't for everyone. It can get a bit gruseome, a bit graphic, and a bit rude. But that's life.
@poshniallo : I didn't know this, but apparently she's doing a new book for 2012, "The Black Opera". It looks...interesting.
Goodreads
SF&F Reviews blog
I just love Laurence's personality. He's cool and awesome and dutiful and brave without being brash, arrogant, fearless, headstrong or a Gary Stu. He's the ultimate Napoleonic British Naval Gentleman Officer, and then everything he believes proper and adequate is chalenged on a very visceral and basic level, and he's willing to not only evaluate those new truths, but also to keep the older values he deems still worthy. Hes open minded and open hearted without being spineless and inconsistent.
Meh, I guess the luck thing is either something that bugs you or not. I can't think of any instances of him being lucky that seemed more egregious than the lucky shenanigans that nearly every fictional character gets up to.
And while modern-Kvothe, 'Kote' or whatever his name is, isn't a braggart, he was raised as a story-teller and entertainer, which is the life that he drops back into when he's telling his story. The bit with fighting in the bar during the interlude was, I think, meant to illustrate that. He briefly forgets that he's not the man he used to be, then either remembers or is reminded. While telling the story he's the same guy who (to one extent or another) pulled off all of the ridiculous feats of bravado and bullshittery that he's describing. Bast even calls him out on embellishing how hot all the women in his life were at one point. He's not exactly an unreliable narrator in that we aren't given reason to doubt that the things he's describing happened, but it seems safe to assume that he's describing them in the best light possible while still maintaining the tone of light self-deprecation necessary to make telling tales of his own heroism not immediately sound like boasting to the listener.
1984. I've read it twice, and my roomie already owns it, but it is such an important book, I need it for my collection.
Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde by Robert Louis Stevenson. Kinda got it on a whim. I've been reading HG Wells and this seems to fit. I'll be reading Frankenstein at some point as well.
And finally James Clavell's Tai-Pan. I recently re-read Shogun and loved it. And even though I'm currently reading like 4 books already, I couldn't help but read a bit into Tai-Pan. Its great so far. It is also extremely informative and interesting; I suspect I'll come out of this book with not only more knowledge of the Opium Wars, but also China and the region in general.
It's like a recovering alcoholic hanging out in a bar.
Book 12 was not nearly as painful as I remembered it being.
Onwards to anticipation!
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
I rather liked Richard Morgan's fantasy debut, The Steel Remains. Haven't read part 2 yet.
Yeah. Morgan does excellent sci-fi, and The Steel Remains was a nice bit of genre-subverting fantasy. Can be a bit graphic here and there though. I'll also second The Lies of Locke Lamorra, because it is excellently done.
Also might be worth checking out (darker, gritter side), Joe Abercrombie's The Blade Itself, which is also very good at breaking up your expectations in a genre which seems more..defined than others a lot of the time.
For pure adventureous swashbuckling fun, Chris Wooding's Retribution Falls and Stephen Hunt's The Court of the Air would be excellent options.
Goodreads
SF&F Reviews blog
Jesus, yes. Go forth and do this thing, Echo!
I'm a big fan of The Heroes, but I think that whilst it's a solid self contained text, it works so much better if assessed in the context of the work that precedes it. If nothing else, there's spoiler potential - some of the events and characters in Heroes spoil the preceding trilogy a little if you haven't read it previously.
As @SniperGuy indicated a preference for Mistborn/Name of the Wind, I figure another trilogy won't hurt...though really, you can't go wrong with Abercrombie.
Goodreads
SF&F Reviews blog
Alternatively, check out The Warded Man by Peter V. Brett.
I quite like Kristin Cashore, and I don't think she gets mentioned much around here. Graceling and Fire, with Bitterblue coming out next month, as I recall. Interesting world (without dedicating half the book to it, Sanderson-style), strong characters, plot that moves quickly. Highly recommended, especially the first novel.
Also, I recently read Melina Marchetta's Finnikin of the Rock, and Jay Lake's Green. I spent both of these books cringing at the actions or circumstances of the main characters (for various reasons), which was definitely something different in ostensibly YA fantasy. On the one hand, it makes it hard to recommend either, but at the same time, it speaks to the quality of the storytelling that I was drawn in enough to care. So, while I won't say "read these books", I will say "give them a look and see if they sound interesting".
I actually re-read my mid-90s Swedish copy of Count Zero a while back and oh god.
Switch: US 1651-2551-4335 JP 6310-4664-2624
MH3U Monster Cheat Sheet / MH3U Veggie Elder Ticket Guide
Switch: US 1651-2551-4335 JP 6310-4664-2624
MH3U Monster Cheat Sheet / MH3U Veggie Elder Ticket Guide
Also it made me laugh twice that he describes watching the Orient get burned by a dragon at the Nile. 1) because the Orient burned and exploded at the real battle of the Nile, and 2) because goddamnit I'm such a nerd and I remembered that off the top of my head.
Uuuugggh can't help myself
Surprisingly in depth in some areas, slightly lax in others. Pretty hefty, and quick, read so I suppose it's not terrible that he didn't bog it down with minutiae.
Huh, really? Guess it's one of those archaic expressions where people forgot the original meaning and change it to something they feel makes more sense (I forget what the term for this is). Care to explain the phrase? I'm guessing it has something to do with the navy paying prize money to the crew that captured the ship.
Not to mention what ships would and wouldn't get 'bought into the service' and how much they were appraised for was often more about the political pull of the people who would profit from it than the actual usefulness of the ship.
Shit got really crazy early during the Napoleonic wars when England was at war with Spain and their treasure galleons.
Have you read any Wodehouse?
Interesting. Guess someone got very rich when almost our entire fleet was captured.
Maybe. The institution of Prizes certainly was an important part of the overall remuneration package for sailors during conflicts, which would have been helpful given the lack of a pensions system, half pay outside of conflicts, badly delayed pay being common and the like.
In addition to what has been said with regards to Abercrombie and Lynch, I'd heartily recommend Chris Wooding's Ketty Jay series, which is about a small band of Steampunk air pirates; Retribution Falls being the first of three.
So much fun to read.
What with all the Gibson talk here lately.