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Legend of Korra: PANIC!!!! Episode 4 Is Uploaded!!!!

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Posts

  • DichotomyDichotomy Registered User regular
    episode 4
    Spoiler:

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    The Council represents the four nations, right

    aren't all their leaders generally Benders

    Earth King and both Water Tribe chiefs were non-benders

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    and don't forget "capitalist pig" Hiroshi Sato is a non-bender

    it's almost like Amon is full of shit

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  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer I'm Speed Racer and I drive real fast. I drive real fast, I'm gonna last.Registered User regular
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

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  • PharezonPharezon Struggle is an illusion. Victory is in the Qun.Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    as Plinkett said

    if someone starts talking about moral relativism related to terrorists, mass murderers, etc.

    alarms should be going off

    Remove terrorists from that because that's an incredibly subjective term~

    Pharezon on
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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

    how so

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  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer I'm Speed Racer and I drive real fast. I drive real fast, I'm gonna last.Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

    how so

    because one is a conflict that is nuanced and complex

    and one is a conflict that is black and white but has a villain pretending like it isn't

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

    how so

    because one is a conflict that is nuanced and complex

    and one is a conflict that is black and white but has a villain pretending like it isn't

    how did you feel about the conflict in the last series

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  • SwissLionSwissLion We are beside ourselves! Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Smug-chin definitely addressed the "Us Benders" at the other members of the council, and they're all in traditional Four nation garb, except for the classy suit he's in.

    It's a very clear implication, and Sato is definitely the exception rather than the standard.

    Quit bein' Dumb.

    SwissLion on
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  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer I'm Speed Racer and I drive real fast. I drive real fast, I'm gonna last.Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

    how so

    because one is a conflict that is nuanced and complex

    and one is a conflict that is black and white but has a villain pretending like it isn't

    how did you feel about the conflict in the last series

    like they did a black-and-white conflict so well that there's no sense retreading that ground

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  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    Dichotomy wrote: »
    bad guys often think they are good guys

    in other shocking revelations, the character Sokka of the previous Avatar series often threw his boomerang with the understanding that it would return to him

    BULLSHIT

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    and I broke parole just to get to you
  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    edited May 2012
    SwissLion wrote: »
    Smug-chin definitely addressed the "Us Benders" at the other members of the council, and they're all in traditional Four nation garb, except for the classy suit he's in.

    It's a very clear implication, and Sato is definitely the exception rather than the standard.

    Quit bein' Dumb.

    traditional nation garb does not mean or even imply that they're benders

    the line "Amon is not going to stop at the bending triads. Eventually he will come for all us benders, our friends, our families." can quite easily be interpreted to mean "benders in general that are not criminals, such as myself" rather than "everybody in this room, because we're all benders" and that's how I heard it the first time

    -Tal on
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  • ZayZay Registered User regular
    I took it to mean those in the room because he was pretty obviously trying to rile them up and get them to agree with him

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    it is a far less interesting conflict if Amon is full of shit and isn't just taking a reasonable point too far

    how so

    because one is a conflict that is nuanced and complex

    and one is a conflict that is black and white but has a villain pretending like it isn't

    how did you feel about the conflict in the last series

    like they did a black-and-white conflict so well that there's no sense retreading that ground

    fair enough

    they're clearly trying to go for a villain more nuanced than Ozai, but I wouldn't be disappointed at all if it turns out, no, he is in fact a jerkbender

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  • SwissLionSwissLion We are beside ourselves! Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    SwissLion wrote: »
    Smug-chin definitely addressed the "Us Benders" at the other members of the council, and they're all in traditional Four nation garb, except for the classy suit he's in.

    It's a very clear implication, and Sato is definitely the exception rather than the standard.

    Quit bein' Dumb.

    traditional nation garb does not mean or even imply that they're benders

    the line "Amon is not going to stop at the bending triads. Eventually he will come for all us benders, our friends, our families." can quite easily be interpreted to mean "benders in general that are not criminals, such as myself" rather than "everybody in this room, because we're all benders" and that's how I heard it the first time

    Having just rewatched it, when those lines are spoken the camera cuts to a shot of the council members looking worriedly at one another. It is not really a hard subtext to pick up on. He is using their personal fear as benders to get his way. The argument "They're going to take our kids' bending away" isn't going to work on people who have perfectly functional non-bending families.

    My point with the traditional garb is that as benders you have much more reason to identify with and represent a particular nation.

    When it comes down to it there is probably not so much meaningful difference between one non-bending citizen of republic city and another anymore.

    As for the first series there was a lot of nuance in how the people of the Earth and Fire nations are depicted. Apart from like Ozai and Azula and I suppose Zhao, you have all the gang's journeys through the fire nation meeting lots of people with many different perspectives.

    And when they're in the Earth kingdom you run into issues with the corrupt soldiers, the crazy misguided General, the Dai Li and their police state taking advantage of the insularity and isolation caused by the war.

    The discontented masses having huge holes in their complaints would prevent any kind of low-level interesting elements like that from developing. There are much more effective and interesting ways of showing that the bad guy is wrong in what he's doing it than making his arguments objectively and very obviously bullshit. It serves no purpose and I just don't see why you have any reason for arguing it might be the case?

    SwissLion on
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  • ZayZay Registered User regular
    really though

    Korra still has a lot to learn before she's ready to save anyone

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  • VeretasVeretas Registered User regular
    Just watched episode 4

    oh my god oh my god oh my god

    please does someone have a gif of Tenzin going all 'What?' when his wife is lookin all angry at him

  • mizd89mizd89 Registered User
    Spoiler:

    That would probably be the spiritual training her teachers have been trying to hammer into her thick skull.

  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    looking worriedly at each other means they're worried about a large number of their city's population being attacked, because as far as we know the Council are not jerks who just think about themselves

    it has never been shown that benders and non-benders have any more or less national pride than each other. Republic City is a nation unto itself, the Council representatives wear national colors because they're chosen from each nation. that's all it means.

    my point is that Jerkbending has never been exclusive to or even significantly preferred by benders or non-benders. I completely agree with your point about nuance, that's what I'm saying. The Equalists are trying to make people forget about that nuance. Amon is creating a false barrier between benders and non-benders that we never saw in the first series, or have really seen in Korra either. Unless it's a situation involving the Equalists, benders and non-benders seem to generally get along fine.

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  • Helpless RockHelpless Rock Registered User regular
    I thought that the fact there were 5 people on council was because it was one from each nation/element/bending type and the 5th being a nonebending Representative. Though, looking back on it, it could just be two Water tribe people since there is a north and south tribe for them, who knows.

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    North and South tribe are literally on the opposite ends of the world. Though they share a cultural heritage, they're effectively separate nations.

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  • PonyPony Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    North and South tribe are literally on the opposite ends of the world. Though they share a cultural heritage, they're effectively separate nations.

    yeah tarrlok explicitly states he is the representative of the Northern water tribe

  • mizd89mizd89 Registered User
    When has a person of high political status ever NOT been afraid for their own life/safety? Its not uncommon for politicians to pass bills or make decisions based on their own fears or ideas. Yes, they're supposed to be representatives of a particular group of peoples that were elected to their office by said people, but everyone has different ideas on how things should be done. What Amon probably doesn't realize is that with our without Jerkbending, there will ALWAYS be JERKS. Jerkbenders simply don't have to carry around a rifle or a knife in order to bully others or start gang wars. We realize that because we live in a world that never had bending in the first place. Zolt will probably find SOME way to continue to bully non-bending citizens even without bending. That's just how it is with power-hungry individuals. If you take away a gangster's gun, he'll probably go out and find another.

    The bigger question would be...WHY are there SO many gangs in Republic City? After only (I'm assuming) 80-ish years, why did gangs pop up so quickly and why are they so numerous? And they're going after technically small game. The real money lies in illegal stuff, not pushing around penniless non-bending shopkeepers. If the police have such a handle on things, why is crime SO rampant in Republic City?

  • Helpless RockHelpless Rock Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    North and South tribe are literally on the opposite ends of the world. Though they share a cultural heritage, they're effectively separate nations.

    Yeah, that is definitely the likely make up of the Council but when I was first watching it my original thought was the 5th was a non-bender. But, yes, definitely one for each North and South water tribes. Regardless everyone in that room is a bender or not.

    Though I will say it is probably more likely that a nation would choice a bender as their nations Representative for the tradition of it, but that has certainly not been confirmed. (Except Tenzin [Who, I won't say was really chosen] and Tarlok, of course)

    Helpless Rock on
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  • Binary SquidBinary Squid We all make choices Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    "wouldn't it be better if everyone were the same" is a dangerous line of thinking

    diversity rules

    this is coming from a bona fide spacist

    Diversity is indeed rad. But in the context that it doesn't cause one group of people to have an innate social advantage over another. When one group consistantly is determining the direction of a society, based soley on their physical attributes, that becomes a problem the society needs to address.

    It's not like bending makes someone wiser, or more intelligent, or more capable of making decisions than non benders.

    The problem is when the powerful group goes from saying that what they do makes them special, to saying that what they can do makes them better. Because then you get those same people considering anyone without the abilities to be inferior. and they have the power to back up their beliefs.

    I'd even say that the problem in Republic City might be just a more extreme example of bender and non bender relations throughout the world as a whole. Even the fact that the nations themselves are named for the elements doesn't help. Sure a non bender can achieve success (though does it happen as much as benders who achieve success?), but when the nation itself is named for the element that unique individuals in the society use, it would be pretty hard to have the focus of those societies be anything less than on the benders.

    Amon may be a dick and the revolution may be going about it the wrong way, but the non benders are looking for something or someone to fill a need that's already there. It just so happens that the one they got is probably using the movement for their own ends and may be a bender themselves.
    -Tal wrote: »
    and don't forget "capitalist pig" Hiroshi Sato is a non-bender

    it's almost like Amon is full of shit

    What is mere money compared to the power of the force...er bending.

    Binary Squid on
  • GoatmonGoatmon AHOY! I'M ADMIRAL ZHAO!Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    The Council represents the four nations, right

    aren't all their leaders generally Benders

    Earth King and both Water Tribe chiefs were non-benders

    Yeah but the Earth King was a pawn.

    The Dai Li was really in charge. You know, the badass earthbenders.

    Goatmon on
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Yeah I'm certain that
    Spoiler:

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    thing is no bender is actually saying benders are superior. they aren't just born wielding fireballs, it's an art that has to be learned

    we have not seen any particular imbalance between benders and non-benders, Amon is creating an artificial conflict

    2/3 of the extant nations in the first series were led by non-benders. There were tons of non-bending characters on equal footing with other benders. The entire Southern Tribe including Sokka with the sole exception of Katara, Northern Chief, Earth King, Yu Yan Archers, Kyoshi Warriors including Suki, Ty Lee, Mai, Li and Lo, Zuko's mom, Piandao, Jet and his gang, Toph's parents, June, Mechanist and his followers, etc. etc.

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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    thing is no bender is actually saying benders are superior. they aren't just born wielding fireballs, it's an art that has to be learned

    we have not seen any particular imbalance between benders and non-benders, Amon is creating an artificial conflict

    2/3 of the extant nations in the first series were led by non-benders. There were tons of non-bending characters on equal footing with other benders. The entire Southern Tribe including Sokka with the sole exception of Katara, Northern Chief, Earth King, Yu Yan Archers, Kyoshi Warriors including Suki, Ty Lee, Mai, Li and Lo, Zuko's mom, Piandao, Jet and his gang, Toph's parents, June, Mechanist and his followers, etc. etc.

    Privilege.

    Just because there are some non-benders in the Nobility does not necessarily mean that Benders do not have a leg up on non-benders.

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  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    thing is no bender is actually saying benders are superior. they aren't just born wielding fireballs, it's an art that has to be learned

    we have not seen any particular imbalance between benders and non-benders, Amon is creating an artificial conflict

    2/3 of the extant nations in the first series were led by non-benders. There were tons of non-bending characters on equal footing with other benders. The entire Southern Tribe including Sokka with the sole exception of Katara, Northern Chief, Earth King, Yu Yan Archers, Kyoshi Warriors including Suki, Ty Lee, Mai, Li and Lo, Zuko's mom, Piandao, Jet and his gang, Toph's parents, June, Mechanist and his followers, etc. etc.

    Privilege.

    Just because there are some non-benders in the Nobility does not necessarily mean that Benders do not have a leg up on non-benders.

    okay, where is the evidence of this

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  • SeriouslySeriously ˈpɛrɪ ˌdɒt Registered User regular
    I am thinking the part where the very elements do their bidding

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  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Regardless of Who sits on the Throne authority has always been linked to the power of elemental bending.
    In the earth kingdom none of the 5 generals or court officials were benders (or at least they didn't seem to be), but the ruling power was the Dai Li.
    Among the water tribes, in the northern watertribe the benders were the reason they lived in Ice Palaces and not Ice Huts.
    In the fire nation the leaders were among the strongest fire benders ever.
    Among the air nomads bending was standard, but all of the members of the council had airbending arrows (and that means they were airbending masters and had, among other things, invented a new airbending technique).

    Fiendishrabbit on
  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    thing is no bender is actually saying benders are superior. they aren't just born wielding fireballs, it's an art that has to be learned

    we have not seen any particular imbalance between benders and non-benders, Amon is creating an artificial conflict

    2/3 of the extant nations in the first series were led by non-benders. There were tons of non-bending characters on equal footing with other benders. The entire Southern Tribe including Sokka with the sole exception of Katara, Northern Chief, Earth King, Yu Yan Archers, Kyoshi Warriors including Suki, Ty Lee, Mai, Li and Lo, Zuko's mom, Piandao, Jet and his gang, Toph's parents, June, Mechanist and his followers, etc. etc.

    Privilege.

    Just because there are some non-benders in the Nobility does not necessarily mean that Benders do not have a leg up on non-benders.

    okay, where is the evidence of this

    Mostly its inference, honestly.

    It seems very clear that being a Fire-bender is/was a requirement to be Firelord.

    The Avatar by virtue of being the Benderiest bender is given a huge amount of power basically from birth.

    Triads. Both the name and what we've seen of them. The triads are made of teams of Benders. As far as we can see there might not be non-bender organized crime at all.

    Jobs. No matter how you slice it benders have a leg up on jobs. they can do all the jobs normals can do plus jobs for benders.

    Most of all though, Amon is building an army. You can't pray on fears that don't exist. If Benders don't really hold as much power as he claims the polulous still thinks they do.

    Quire.jpg
  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Regardless of Who sits on the Throne authority has always been linked to the power of elemental bending.
    In the earth kingdom none of the 5 generals or court officials were benders (or at least they didn't seem to be), but the ruling power was the Dai Li.
    Among the water tribes the northern watertribe the benders were the reason they lived in Ice Palaces and not Ice Huts.
    In the fire nation the leaders were among the strongest fire benders ever.
    Among the air nomads bending was standard, but all of the members of the council had airbending arrows (and that means they were airbending masters and had, among other things, invented a new airbending technique).

    Yes, bending is an important part of every culture in the world. That does not mean benders are oppressing non-benders.
    -Tal wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    thing is no bender is actually saying benders are superior. they aren't just born wielding fireballs, it's an art that has to be learned

    we have not seen any particular imbalance between benders and non-benders, Amon is creating an artificial conflict

    2/3 of the extant nations in the first series were led by non-benders. There were tons of non-bending characters on equal footing with other benders. The entire Southern Tribe including Sokka with the sole exception of Katara, Northern Chief, Earth King, Yu Yan Archers, Kyoshi Warriors including Suki, Ty Lee, Mai, Li and Lo, Zuko's mom, Piandao, Jet and his gang, Toph's parents, June, Mechanist and his followers, etc. etc.

    Privilege.

    Just because there are some non-benders in the Nobility does not necessarily mean that Benders do not have a leg up on non-benders.

    okay, where is the evidence of this

    Mostly its inference, honestly.

    It seems very clear that being a Fire-bender is/was a requirement to be Firelord.

    The Avatar by virtue of being the Benderiest bender is given a huge amount of power basically from birth.

    Triads. Both the name and what we've seen of them. The triads are made of teams of Benders. As far as we can see there might not be non-bender organized crime at all.

    Jobs. No matter how you slice it benders have a leg up on jobs. they can do all the jobs normals can do plus jobs for benders.

    Most of all though, Amon is building an army. You can't pray on fears that don't exist. If Benders don't really hold as much power as he claims the polulous still thinks they do.

    There has been no indication that firebending is a requirement for Fire Lord.

    The avatar is, beyond being a powerful bender, the spirit of the planet incarnate and the bridge between the human world and the spirit world.

    I would be shocked if there was no non-bender crime. You know, like the Equalists.

    Yes, benders have a leg up because they get to do shitty jobs like redirecting electricity for a company that's owned by a non-bender.

    Amon is building an army because he's charismatic. Some non-benders buy into his crap, but they do not represent the majority. You admit most of this perceived imbalance is based on inference, while the show has not actually shown such an imbalance and has in fact given many examples to the contrary. Amon's conflict is artificial and he really smells like dog buns.

    -Tal on
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    It has been heavily implied that being a great Firebender is a requirement to be Firelord. Or at least was.

    Do you really think the average citizen knows/cares?

    Gangs. I meant Gangs.

    As well as as builders and craftsmen , Probenders, various special Military positions.

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  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    It has been heavily implied that being a great Firebender is a requirement to be Firelord. Or at least was.

    Considering that before it was made hereditary the position of Firelord was the leader of a spiritual order of firebenders. Yeah. Pretty heavily implied.

  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    This I did not know.

    Was it mentioned in the show?

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  • PonyPony Registered User regular
    This I did not know.

    Was it mentioned in the show?

    yeah when they get into all the stuff about Sozin and the Fire Sages

    used to be the Firelord was just the head of the Fire Sages and the Fire Nation was basically a theocracy

    Sozin's lineage changed that into a hereditary monarchy

  • -Tal-Tal I'm not doing it the same, man I'm doing it betterRegistered User regular
    The Fire Nation is a monarchy. Power is inherited with firstborn sons taking priority. Since bending is partially genetic, that means a lot of the Royal Family will be benders. Nothing says bending is a requirement for the throne. Hell, we don't even know if Lu Ten was a bender or not.

    Yeah, actually. The avatar is highly respected, and not just cause she can shoot rocks and fireballs.

    What are the Equalists if not a glorified chi-blocking gang?

    We have seen no economic imbalance between benders and non-benders. We've seen plenty of rich non-benders and poor benders, and the other way around. We have seen high-ranking military non-benders. Everybody seemed to have worked this stuff out until Amon decided there was a problem.

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  • GoatmonGoatmon AHOY! I'M ADMIRAL ZHAO!Registered User regular
    Pony wrote: »
    This I did not know.

    Was it mentioned in the show?

    yeah when they get into all the stuff about Sozin and the Fire Sages

    used to be the Firelord was just the head of the Fire Sages and the Fire Nation was basically a theocracy

    Sozin's lineage changed that into a hereditary monarchy

    Speaking of Monarchies in Avatar

    I did some reading about the Earth Kingdom, and learned that the Dai Li were actually made in response to a peasant uprising, centuries ago, during Kiyoshi's time. Apparently the people were so unhappy with their king that Chin was able to amass a rebel army, which led to the creation of Kiyoshi island and all that.

    But afterwards, there was still a lot of problems inland. Kiyoshi had to put down a peasant uprising, but only after chewing him out (In one form or another) when he tried to arrest her for not automatically obeying him. She agreed to help keep him safe, but only as long as he straightened up and started leading his people properly.

    She held up her end of the bargain by training the original Dai Li, who were tasked with protecting the King's interests, and supposedly to protect Ba Sing Se's cultural heritage.

    Sad irony how that turned out in Aang's time.

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