Your initial reaction was fanfiction and then you made a comparison to BttF2. I'm still not sure where that movie fits into the 'ludicrous' part beyond being futuristic.
0:40
video
i've already gotten past the part of the game shown in the video, but isn't that a fairly huge ME3 spoiler? the youtube thumbnail alone is pretty bad.
@fightinfilipino I think most of us have made it past that point, and there isn't anything excessively spoilery in that video.
Still, I see your point, and better safe than sorry, so I'll spoiler it.
the whole reaper code means becoming "I" thing is kinda slimy
like apart from the whole reaper code thing
legion was constituted of a thousand different entities that all demonstrated sufficient individual agency that they could argue for different actions and attempt to reach consensus
and then they all melt into one personality?
how many geth programs does it take to distill down into one "self"?
also
they had a thousand "selves" already
maybe it was meant to be tragic?
priority: rannoch
well that's not quite a thing because the whole geth not being sapient until they're hanging around with bunches of other geth thing
they don't really have "selves" in the sense that we do, because if you isolate a geth program it's like a .gif of a guy getting a football in the groin or whatever and not an independent intelligence
but groups of geth can all individually think just like people
and apparently all along every geth wanted to discard everything that made them geth and become just like everybody else?
the more I think about this reaper code thing the more it seems massively out of character for everything for basically no real reason other than to be a contrivance to further justify killing all geth and add some element of controversy to the peace option
This bothered the hell out of me, too
Moreover: The whole point of the Dyson Sphere was to allow the Geth to "end our isolation from each other." It was pretty much the end goal towards which their entire civilization had been working. And then
the whole reaper code means becoming "I" thing is kinda slimy
like apart from the whole reaper code thing
legion was constituted of a thousand different entities that all demonstrated sufficient individual agency that they could argue for different actions and attempt to reach consensus
and then they all melt into one personality?
how many geth programs does it take to distill down into one "self"?
also
they had a thousand "selves" already
maybe it was meant to be tragic?
priority: rannoch
well that's not quite a thing because the whole geth not being sapient until they're hanging around with bunches of other geth thing
they don't really have "selves" in the sense that we do, because if you isolate a geth program it's like a .gif of a guy getting a football in the groin or whatever and not an independent intelligence
but groups of geth can all individually think just like people
and apparently all along every geth wanted to discard everything that made them geth and become just like everybody else?
the more I think about this reaper code thing the more it seems massively out of character for everything for basically no real reason other than to be a contrivance to further justify killing all geth and add some element of controversy to the peace option
This bothered the hell out of me, too
Moreover: The whole point of the Dyson Sphere was to allow the Geth to "end our isolation from each other." It was pretty much the end goal towards which their entire civilization had been working. And then
they choose to become individuals instead?
The thing is that the geth weren't individuals up until that point; they were basically one big collective consciousness, split across multiple physical platforms, which compromised their individual intelligence.
I'm assuming that for them, becoming individuals was another way to go about retaining sapience, and a method that they found as viable as the Dyson Sphere. Maybe they even preferred it; after all, the quarians annihilated a couple billion individual programs at least when they blew the sphere to bits. Maybe they saw individuality as a way to guarantee their survival, without compromising their intelligence.
As far as the whole "Collective Consciousness Becoming Individual Sapience" thing goes, I'm assuming the Reaper upgrades either caused individual programs to evolve into sapient beings, or it consolidated multiple programs to create one sapient individual capable of operating independently of other geth. It basically turned every geth into a version of Legion, at least on a physical level.
the whole reaper code means becoming "I" thing is kinda slimy
like apart from the whole reaper code thing
legion was constituted of a thousand different entities that all demonstrated sufficient individual agency that they could argue for different actions and attempt to reach consensus
and then they all melt into one personality?
how many geth programs does it take to distill down into one "self"?
also
they had a thousand "selves" already
maybe it was meant to be tragic?
priority: rannoch
well that's not quite a thing because the whole geth not being sapient until they're hanging around with bunches of other geth thing
they don't really have "selves" in the sense that we do, because if you isolate a geth program it's like a .gif of a guy getting a football in the groin or whatever and not an independent intelligence
but groups of geth can all individually think just like people
and apparently all along every geth wanted to discard everything that made them geth and become just like everybody else?
the more I think about this reaper code thing the more it seems massively out of character for everything for basically no real reason other than to be a contrivance to further justify killing all geth and add some element of controversy to the peace option
This bothered the hell out of me, too
Moreover: The whole point of the Dyson Sphere was to allow the Geth to "end our isolation from each other." It was pretty much the end goal towards which their entire civilization had been working. And then
they choose to become individuals instead?
The thing is that the geth weren't individuals up until that point; they were basically one big collective consciousness, split across multiple physical platforms, which compromised their individual intelligence.
I'm assuming that for them, becoming individuals was another way to go about retaining sapience, and a method that they found as viable as the Dyson Sphere. Maybe they even preferred it; after all, the quarians annihilated a couple billion individual programs at least when they blew the sphere to bits. Maybe they saw individuality as a way to guarantee their survival, without compromising their intelligence.
As far as the whole "Collective Consciousness Becoming Individual Sapience" thing goes, I'm assuming the Reaper upgrades either caused individual programs to evolve into sapient beings, or it consolidated multiple programs to create one sapient individual capable of operating independently of other geth. It basically turned every geth into a version of Legion, at least on a physical level.
and making each program a true AI doesn't prevent them from networking together like they used to
it just means their collective consciousness will be even smarter
Your initial reaction was fanfiction and then you made a comparison to BttF2. I'm still not sure where that movie fits into the 'ludicrous' part beyond being futuristic.
0:40
video
i've already gotten past the part of the game shown in the video, but isn't that a fairly huge ME3 spoiler? the youtube thumbnail alone is pretty bad.
@fightinfilipino I think most of us have made it past that point, and there isn't anything excessively spoilery in that video.
Still, I see your point, and better safe than sorry, so I'll spoiler it.
Sorry about that.
no biggie. i've just gotten around to putting some actual time in the SP, so i'm a bit sensitive to possible spoilers. i'm sure there are a few folks out there in the same boat.
and i've played through some pretty awesome moments already where i was extremely glad i hadn't seen spoilers accidentally.
the whole reaper code means becoming "I" thing is kinda slimy
like apart from the whole reaper code thing
legion was constituted of a thousand different entities that all demonstrated sufficient individual agency that they could argue for different actions and attempt to reach consensus
and then they all melt into one personality?
how many geth programs does it take to distill down into one "self"?
also
they had a thousand "selves" already
maybe it was meant to be tragic?
priority: rannoch
well that's not quite a thing because the whole geth not being sapient until they're hanging around with bunches of other geth thing
they don't really have "selves" in the sense that we do, because if you isolate a geth program it's like a .gif of a guy getting a football in the groin or whatever and not an independent intelligence
but groups of geth can all individually think just like people
and apparently all along every geth wanted to discard everything that made them geth and become just like everybody else?
the more I think about this reaper code thing the more it seems massively out of character for everything for basically no real reason other than to be a contrivance to further justify killing all geth and add some element of controversy to the peace option
This bothered the hell out of me, too
Moreover: The whole point of the Dyson Sphere was to allow the Geth to "end our isolation from each other." It was pretty much the end goal towards which their entire civilization had been working. And then
they choose to become individuals instead?
The thing is that the geth weren't individuals up until that point; they were basically one big collective consciousness, split across multiple physical platforms, which compromised their individual intelligence.
I'm assuming that for them, becoming individuals was another way to go about retaining sapience, and a method that they found as viable as the Dyson Sphere. Maybe they even preferred it; after all, the quarians annihilated a couple billion individual programs at least when they blew the sphere to bits. Maybe they saw individuality as a way to guarantee their survival, without compromising their intelligence.
As far as the whole "Collective Consciousness Becoming Individual Sapience" thing goes, I'm assuming the Reaper upgrades either caused individual programs to evolve into sapient beings, or it consolidated multiple programs to create one sapient individual capable of operating independently of other geth. It basically turned every geth into a version of Legion, at least on a physical level.
and making each program a true AI doesn't prevent them from networking together like they used to
it just means their collective consciousness will be even smarter
That's the assumption I was working on to reconcile it with my previous understanding of the Geth. It really isn't explained very well, though.
Also, speaking from a meta-perspective
certain ancient sages once said that the guy who wrote Legion in Me2 didn't work on Me3, so I guess that also explains inconsistencies in his characterization.
it will actually feature vorchafied reaper enemies
I love the idea of an organic race just too stubborn and belligerant and prolific to get Reaped. The usual few hundred years of destruction gets prolonged by millenia, Reapers flying around pulling their tentacles out in frustration because even a smear of Vorcha left in a smoking crater will result in thousands of the fuckers in a few decades. Vorcha themselves barely notice a difference in their day-to-day.
Hobnail on
Broke as fuck in the style of the times. Gratitude is all that can return on your generosity.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
do the rules of customer service say anything about unfair expectations for things provided entirely for free
to be clear, i'm not upset about this. more like shaking my head at the whole mess. i've already voiced my opinion on this and won't rehash. suffice it to say, i've just come to accept this as regular practice from Bioware, and this is going to be the last Bioware game i buy for a long time.
but, well, even when something is free, it's a matter of managing customer expectations and all that.
an example: PA does a great job of serving up free .jpegs three times a week. when there are delays or late comics, Khoo and company have done a great job in letting people know that, hey, Mike and Jerry are human beings, too, and delays happen. at the same time, they've done a great job letting people know that they're working hard to stick to a schedule. good communication + honesty = loyal fans.
i'll agree that it's pretty unreasonable for folks to hulk rage at Bioware/EA for not getting free stuff. but Bioware and EA aren't exactly doing themselves any favors by building up fan expectations and spectacularly failing to meet them. same thing with the ME3 ending crap and the Shep face import problems. businesses have "goodwill" as a part of their assets, and nowadays you can actually assign a monetary value to that goodwill. like any asset, goodwill can be expended as an investment or as a waste.
right now, Bioware/EA is taking a lot of goodwill and setting it on fire.
the kind of people who would consider this to significantly compromise their goodwill towards bioware likely had little to offer in the first place and would cast it aside at the earliest opportunity
do the rules of customer service say anything about unfair expectations for things provided entirely for free
Dude don't be silly, the commendation packs are a way of keeping fan interest up in the multiplayer, which means more people spending bioware bucks on packs, and more people buying MP DLC when it eventually comes out. They're not doing this out of the goodness of their hearts, and I wouldn't expect them to.
But currently I've owned ME3 for about 4 days, and 2 of those days I've been unable to connect to the MP servers, and I've had a ridiculous number of packs fail to purchase. AND all the gameplay bugs that made the demo feel like playing a beta are still floating around. While I'd love to think Bioware's working on fixing those bugs, most of their efforts feel like they're just creating new ones.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
(it's not that I care that the commendation packs are late, it's that I can't even play the damn multiplayer)
Kana on
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
since when do minor bonuses being one day late equal "spectacularly failing to meet fan expectations"?
if they're doing it regularly, then possibly. seems that's what happened with the previous two MP events?
add that to the other things (re: ending snafu, face import, Origin-exclusivity).
@Dichotomy : it's less about not getting free stuff and more about promising things they can't possibly give. all of the butthurt and anger could be easily mitigated by simply not making it a repeated practice of making promises and then breaking them.
there's a reason companies like Blizzard and Valve don't release their games "until they're done." they test extensively. they tweak and polish. they're very careful about what they can and cannot deliver and what they tell the public about what they can and cannot deliver. like i said, managing customer expectations.
Man I'm pretty sure Valve is notorious for giving out release dates they clearly don't give a fuck about meeting
valve promised to shortly release paid DLC to the xbox live marketplace that would bring three campaigns from Left 4 Dead and one new community campaign to Left 4 Dead 2
I was eager to buy that DLC
that promise was last summer, and since then that DLC has remained "coming soon"
companies like blizzard and valve don't release games "until they're done" because they have tons of cash and can afford to do so
and EA doesn't? gaming megacorp? bought both Popcap and Bioware out?
besides, having huge bankrolls and managing expectations are not mutually exclusive. i'm not sure what your point is, honestly. i'm saying that Bioware/EA need to do a better job of managing expectations and not promising the moon.
Man I'm pretty sure Valve is notorious for giving out release dates they clearly don't give a fuck about meeting
well, yes, but Valve has somehow convinced the majority of people that that's just normal, and that the end product is worth it. it's just another way of managing expectations :P
Posts
As for the last...well, everyone's been hit by that, and a lot were hit by the one before due to some douchebags cheating the system.
I don't give a shit about Victory packs.
Don't look gift horses in the mouth
@fightinfilipino I think most of us have made it past that point, and there isn't anything excessively spoilery in that video.
Still, I see your point, and better safe than sorry, so I'll spoiler it.
Sorry about that.
This bothered the hell out of me, too
Moreover: The whole point of the Dyson Sphere was to allow the Geth to "end our isolation from each other." It was pretty much the end goal towards which their entire civilization had been working. And then
I'm assuming that for them, becoming individuals was another way to go about retaining sapience, and a method that they found as viable as the Dyson Sphere. Maybe they even preferred it; after all, the quarians annihilated a couple billion individual programs at least when they blew the sphere to bits. Maybe they saw individuality as a way to guarantee their survival, without compromising their intelligence.
As far as the whole "Collective Consciousness Becoming Individual Sapience" thing goes, I'm assuming the Reaper upgrades either caused individual programs to evolve into sapient beings, or it consolidated multiple programs to create one sapient individual capable of operating independently of other geth. It basically turned every geth into a version of Legion, at least on a physical level.
it just means their collective consciousness will be even smarter
no biggie. i've just gotten around to putting some actual time in the SP, so i'm a bit sensitive to possible spoilers. i'm sure there are a few folks out there in the same boat.
and i've played through some pretty awesome moments already where i was extremely glad i hadn't seen spoilers accidentally.
steam | Dokkan: 868846562
That's the assumption I was working on to reconcile it with my previous understanding of the Geth. It really isn't explained very well, though.
Also, speaking from a meta-perspective
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
Or was that "complete one extraction on gold" just a silly rumor?
They're "working on it"
cool. your. jets.
not sure why Bioware even bothers to make promises like this if they can't deliver.
rule 1 of customer service: don't make promises you can't keep.
steam | Dokkan: 868846562
I'm ok with these sorts of teething problems given that it's a new system.
I'd be right pissed if ME3 was multiplayer only.
surely waiting a little longer for your eagle II can't be that onerous
I waited two weeks to get my Commendation Pack from the previous operation (the one where they found out about the pack exploit).
It was annoying, but it's just one fake weapon.
I can deal.
I love the idea of an organic race just too stubborn and belligerant and prolific to get Reaped. The usual few hundred years of destruction gets prolonged by millenia, Reapers flying around pulling their tentacles out in frustration because even a smear of Vorcha left in a smoking crater will result in thousands of the fuckers in a few decades. Vorcha themselves barely notice a difference in their day-to-day.
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
The network must stay up at all times!
to be clear, i'm not upset about this. more like shaking my head at the whole mess. i've already voiced my opinion on this and won't rehash. suffice it to say, i've just come to accept this as regular practice from Bioware, and this is going to be the last Bioware game i buy for a long time.
but, well, even when something is free, it's a matter of managing customer expectations and all that.
an example: PA does a great job of serving up free .jpegs three times a week. when there are delays or late comics, Khoo and company have done a great job in letting people know that, hey, Mike and Jerry are human beings, too, and delays happen. at the same time, they've done a great job letting people know that they're working hard to stick to a schedule. good communication + honesty = loyal fans.
i'll agree that it's pretty unreasonable for folks to hulk rage at Bioware/EA for not getting free stuff. but Bioware and EA aren't exactly doing themselves any favors by building up fan expectations and spectacularly failing to meet them. same thing with the ME3 ending crap and the Shep face import problems. businesses have "goodwill" as a part of their assets, and nowadays you can actually assign a monetary value to that goodwill. like any asset, goodwill can be expended as an investment or as a waste.
right now, Bioware/EA is taking a lot of goodwill and setting it on fire.
steam | Dokkan: 868846562
Dude don't be silly, the commendation packs are a way of keeping fan interest up in the multiplayer, which means more people spending bioware bucks on packs, and more people buying MP DLC when it eventually comes out. They're not doing this out of the goodness of their hearts, and I wouldn't expect them to.
But currently I've owned ME3 for about 4 days, and 2 of those days I've been unable to connect to the MP servers, and I've had a ridiculous number of packs fail to purchase. AND all the gameplay bugs that made the demo feel like playing a beta are still floating around. While I'd love to think Bioware's working on fixing those bugs, most of their efforts feel like they're just creating new ones.
if they're doing it regularly, then possibly. seems that's what happened with the previous two MP events?
add that to the other things (re: ending snafu, face import, Origin-exclusivity).
@Dichotomy : it's less about not getting free stuff and more about promising things they can't possibly give. all of the butthurt and anger could be easily mitigated by simply not making it a repeated practice of making promises and then breaking them.
there's a reason companies like Blizzard and Valve don't release their games "until they're done." they test extensively. they tweak and polish. they're very careful about what they can and cannot deliver and what they tell the public about what they can and cannot deliver. like i said, managing customer expectations.
steam | Dokkan: 868846562
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
valve promised to shortly release paid DLC to the xbox live marketplace that would bring three campaigns from Left 4 Dead and one new community campaign to Left 4 Dead 2
I was eager to buy that DLC
that promise was last summer, and since then that DLC has remained "coming soon"
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
I just shake my head and go "oh you!"
Isn't a big problem with the multiplayer the fact that they made it so people could edit their ini files and just fuck up the entire system
and EA doesn't? gaming megacorp? bought both Popcap and Bioware out?
besides, having huge bankrolls and managing expectations are not mutually exclusive. i'm not sure what your point is, honestly. i'm saying that Bioware/EA need to do a better job of managing expectations and not promising the moon.
well, yes, but Valve has somehow convinced the majority of people that that's just normal, and that the end product is worth it. it's just another way of managing expectations :P
steam | Dokkan: 868846562
doesn't Valve usually just not give a release date until they're fairly certain they're going to hit it (like a few months before)?
at least on major stuff
I know that Valve Time is well-documented but that's mostly for small stuff
XBox LIVE: Bogestrom | Destiny
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