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Video Game Industry Thread: 300+ people lose their jobs. Curt Schilling still rich.

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Posts

  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    http://www.joystiq.com/2012/05/02/might-and-delight-renting-xbla-spot-to-sell-pid-there/
    Pid is a new platformer being put together by Might and Delight, and when it arrives, it'll be available on PSN, Steam, and XBLA. But while Might and Delight will be self-publishing on PSN and Steam (because both platforms have plans in place for devs to do that), it won't be self-publishing on the Xbox Live Arcade. They won't have another publisher, either -- instead, Might and Delight is "renting" an XBLA game slot.

    The PA Report explains how it all works: When Microsoft agrees to allow devs to publish on XBLA, those devs get a set number of slots to sell games with. Not all of the publishers who get these slots use them and some of those publishers are now selling their slots, usually for a share of the game's profits, to other developers. That's the case with Pid: Might and Delight is "borrowing" another publisher's game slot and in return sharing part of Pid's profits.

    Anyone publishing a game on XBLA needs to give Microsoft a cut of the profits as well, so both Microsoft and the publisher are taking money away from Might and Delight here. But on the plus side, Might and Delight doesn't need to make a traditional publishing deal at all, so there's no issue with exclusivity or long-term rights. If the game does well, they're much more likely to make sure they see the rewards directly.
    So what, it works like the old fashioned limited allowance of games on the NES or something?

  • BeltaineBeltaine BOO BOO DOO DE DOORegistered User regular
    Peewi wrote: »
    Spoit wrote: »
    The difficulty computing it is the whole "register on steam" part, right?

    It was found in the Steam registry a couple of days ago. As of yesterday, they're selling it.

    $20.98?

    They couldn't go another 99 cents to make it under $20?

    XdDBi4F.jpg
    PSN: Beltaine-77 | Steam: beltane77 | Battle.net BadHaggis#1433
  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    Back to the Max Payne 3/Diablo 3 thing, Diablo 3 is only launching on PC, right? While MP3 will be, on that day, launching on 360 and PS3? Because I know that D3 is going to drop like a OMGKILLERTONMEGABOMB and shatter gaming sales numbers for all time, but, I'm really not convinced they'll conflict that much. If you've got a PC that can run it, you'll probably get Diablo 3. If you, like a great many people, don't have a PC that'll take it, aren't interested in it, or just want to shoot things instead? You'll probably get MP3. If they were launching on the same day on the same platforms, then there might be cause for concern. As it stands, I think there won't be many people having to choose.

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  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    darleysam wrote: »
    Back to the Max Payne 3/Diablo 3 thing, Diablo 3 is only launching on PC, right? While MP3 will be, on that day, launching on 360 and PS3? Because I know that D3 is going to drop like a OMGKILLERTONMEGABOMB and shatter gaming sales numbers for all time, but, I'm really not convinced they'll conflict that much. If you've got a PC that can run it, you'll probably get Diablo 3. If you, like a great many people, don't have a PC that'll take it, aren't interested in it, or just want to shoot things instead? You'll probably get MP3. If they were launching on the same day on the same platforms, then there might be cause for concern. As it stands, I think there won't be many people having to choose.

    I suspect there will be more people that can run Diablo 3 over those that can run Max Payne 3... Blizzard has always been super good about system requirements.

    Switch: 2143-7130-1359 | 3DS: 4983-4927-6699 | Steam: warlock82 | PSN: Warlock2282
  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    Yes, but on the day that they both launch, one game is on one platform, the other game is on a different platform. I really don't think they'll be competing, not least because I doubt everybody with a PC is going to buy Diablo 3 and no other games will sell. I'm not saying it'll crash, but I think it's being seen as some kind of all-destroying, titanic gravity well that will crush all other games in its vicinity. I'm not convinced that's the case.

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  • SheepSheep Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    I'm really having trouble with the idea that MP3 is gonna be a major seller. The first two games were good and well liked, but did they really set the world on fire? Is the new game doing anything other than bullet time?

  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    it has apparently awesome multiplayer, and i mean, it's a rockstar game. it'll sell like gangbusters.

    i know i'm getting it.

  • RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    Sheep wrote: »
    I'm really having trouble with the idea that MP3 is gonna be a major seller. The first two games were good and well liked, but did they really set the world on fire? Is the new game doing anything other than bullet time?

    From what I've been able to find online the Max Payne series has sold about 7.5 million copies with about 60-70% of those sales being the first game. MP3 will probably do decently but I doubt it'll be a huge megahit.

  • Xenogears of BoreXenogears of Bore Registered User regular
    The consolization of PC games has really schewed the numbers this gen. Fallout 3 and Skyrim and Bioshock have blown away the earlier series titles in sales.

    3DS CODE: 3093-7068-3576
  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    Max Payne 1 and 2 were a while ago now (certainly in games industry years) and by Remedy, I doubt they had the publicity campaign that Rockstar are giving to MP3, nor does the name 'Remedy' carry as much clout as putting 'Rockstar' on the box, the guys you know from Grand Theft Auto and Red Dead Redemption. It won't blow the roof off anything, but just like Diablo 3 has this inflated weight of expectation on it, I think you're all underestimating MP3 if you're basing your expectations on the performance of the previous two games.

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  • Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    Sheep wrote: »
    I'm really having trouble with the idea that MP3 is gonna be a major seller. The first two games were good and well liked, but did they really set the world on fire? Is the new game doing anything other than bullet time?

    Its running on that sweet sweet euphoria engine. But also, like Local said, it has some surprisingly awesome(looking) multiplayer. I dunno, I think there's enough there that alot of people are looking into MP3. Plus Rockstar is ad blitzing pretty hard, I believe there's going to be a Max Payne 3 car running in a Nascar race this weekend even.

    Also, being a Rockstar game never hurts :P

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
  • AZChristopherAZChristopher Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    http://www.joystiq.com/2012/05/02/might-and-delight-renting-xbla-spot-to-sell-pid-there/
    Pid is a new platformer being put together by Might and Delight, and when it arrives, it'll be available on PSN, Steam, and XBLA. But while Might and Delight will be self-publishing on PSN and Steam (because both platforms have plans in place for devs to do that), it won't be self-publishing on the Xbox Live Arcade. They won't have another publisher, either -- instead, Might and Delight is "renting" an XBLA game slot.

    The PA Report explains how it all works: When Microsoft agrees to allow devs to publish on XBLA, those devs get a set number of slots to sell games with. Not all of the publishers who get these slots use them and some of those publishers are now selling their slots, usually for a share of the game's profits, to other developers. That's the case with Pid: Might and Delight is "borrowing" another publisher's game slot and in return sharing part of Pid's profits.

    Anyone publishing a game on XBLA needs to give Microsoft a cut of the profits as well, so both Microsoft and the publisher are taking money away from Might and Delight here. But on the plus side, Might and Delight doesn't need to make a traditional publishing deal at all, so there's no issue with exclusivity or long-term rights. If the game does well, they're much more likely to make sure they see the rewards directly.
    So what, it works like the old fashioned limited allowance of games on the NES or something?

    Sounds more like the reporter is twisting something that seems like it would be the normal process.

    Game is made by an indie developer.

    Indie developer needs a publisher to put the game on XBLA.

    A publisher is found that has an open spot and is willing to put its name on the game.

    Game is scheduled to release on XBLA.

  • Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    I don't think the publisher's name is going to be attached to the game though. I think its more like renting space at a strip mall.

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
  • AZChristopherAZChristopher Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    I don't think the publisher's name is going to be attached to the game though. I think its more like renting space at a strip mall.

    I wonder then. Do we have examples of indie devs who have put games on XBLA but don't have a publisher listed? The article makes this sound like something that is common. I assumed that the name of the publisher was on the game to maintain the appearance of the policy.

  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    edited May 2012
    The publisher's name will probably appear in the splash at the start, but it won't be a traditional publishing agreement. The PA Report article explains it pretty clearly, it's worth reading. It sounds like:
    Publisher has an agreed-upon number of slots for games in a given year
    Publisher doesn't have enough of its own games to fill those slots
    Developer contacts publisher to ask about using one of those slots for their game
    Instead of paying lump sum to developer for the game, publisher gets a cut of the profits from the sales (which are also split with Microsoft, as per the terms of XBLA)

    edit: so the game appears on XBLA Developed By Indie Studio and Published By Publisher, but the contracts in the backround run differently. No real risk for the publisher, unless they pass up a better game to put an underperforming one in their slot.

    darleysam on
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  • SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    The consolization of PC games has really schewed the numbers this gen. Fallout 3 and Skyrim and Bioshock have blown away the earlier series titles in sales.
    Previous bethesda games have been on consoles since at least morrowind

    steam_sig.png
  • Xenogears of BoreXenogears of Bore Registered User regular
    Since Morrowind, which by the way was a decent sales success on the OXBOX.

    Oblivion did well for a launch period sort of title but it wasn't until Skyrim that it exploded, and that's largely due to the consolification of the series.

    3DS CODE: 3093-7068-3576
  • SheepSheep Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Consolification?

    It's practically an expansion of Oblivion. Not much different.

  • DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    Skyrim did well for a lot of reasons

    the hype machine, a much more compelling setting than Oblivion, positive buzz after FO3/NV(regardless of the fact that NV wasn't bethesda), the hype machine, an ideal launch window, vikings, the hype machine, etc.

  • skeldareskeldare Gresham, ORRegistered User regular
    Behold Wikipad's Android 4.0 gaming tablet

    wikipad-tablet-gaikai-1335973286.jpg
    GAIKAI AND WIKIPAD PARTNER TO DELIVER CLOUD GAMING ON THE WORLD'S FIRST GAMING TABLET

    (Cision (English) Via Acquire Media NewsEdge) Innovative Tablet Maker Wikipad Partners with Gaikai as the Provider for Streaming High-end Console Quality Games Directly onto its State-of-the -Art Media Tablet LOS ANGELES, CA – May 2, 2012 - Gaikai (http://www.gaikai.com/) the innovative cloud gaming service, today announces the signing of a partnership with Wikipad Inc., makers of the first tablet to offer an attachable, console-quality gamepad controller. The partnership will see the Gaikai client integrated into the tablet, making game streaming available to Wikipad users.

    Cloud gaming is changing the way video games are consumed. Today gamers have to either drive to a store, wait for games to arrive in the mail, or download games, which can take as long as visiting the store itself. Cloud gaming removes the friction and makes games -- no matter how large -- appear instantly. The Wikipad is capable of running games locally but will also offer extremely high performance games from Gaikai's cloud gaming platform. Without cloud gaming, many incredible console quality games could never appear on tablets.

    "We chose to partner with Gaikai's game streaming service for its leading performance, graphics, and content," stated Fraser Townley, President of Sales for Wikipad. "It is the leading game streaming solution with the best library of AAA games and we are thrilled to offer these high quality experiences to our users where Gaikai's network is deployed." "The Wikipad is one of the most exciting devices for gaming to date. The tablet was designed with the needs of gamers in mind, enhancing the mobile gaming experience with a set of controls on par with today's consoles and PC gamepads, enabling gameplay mechanics that have been previously unavailable with just touchscreen controls," said Robert Stevenson, EVP of Business Development & Strategic Partnerships at Gaikai. The Wikipad concept was announced earlier this year with an enthusiastic response from gamers and press at CES 2012. The tablet offers the first-of-its-kind combination of HD graphics, optional 3G module and game console style controls that feature dual-analog sticks as well as a d-pad and video game buttons. Wikipad also features a unique Wifi-Direct optional accessory which will allow games to be played on HDTV monitors or televisions, allowing players to use the tablet as a portable console gamepad as well as a premium Android tablet.

    Wikipad has listened to feedback from gamers worldwide since CES and will launch its tablet with a full suite of the latest immersive entertainment features and enhanced specifications including replacing the 8.1" version with a premium 10.1" screen, ultra-light chassis, optional 3G antenna for mobile provider subscriptions and a quad core processor. The official launch date for the enhanced Wikipad has yet to be announced.

    Nintendo Console Codes
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  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    Notch needs to calm down.
    http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/notch-ea-are-cynical-bastards-who-are-methodically-destroying-gam/095466
    Minecraft creator Markus ‘Notch’ Persson has unleashed a vicious verbal assault on leading global publisher EA.

    He was seemingly provoked by EA’s new Indie Bundle on Steam which includes indie titles EA has previously digitally published such as Shank and DeathSpank.

    “EA releases an ‘indie bundle’? That's not how that works, EA,” he said.

    “Stop attempting to ruin everything, you bunch of cynical bastards.

    “I don't even call Mojang indie any more. Vlambeer is indie. Polytron is indie. Stephen, Ed, Terry, Derek, Tommy and Chris are indie. Indies are saving gaming. EA is methodically destroying it.”

  • DecoyDecoy Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Edit: Beaten by RD!!

    Decoy on
  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Lehi, UTRegistered User regular
    "I can't say I'm not surprised"...

    So you can say you are surprised?

    I'm confused :lol:

    Either way this interests me. Not that I need/want another MMO, but I'm genuinely curious what they're going to bring to the table with this.

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  • Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Couscous wrote: »
    Notch needs to calm down.
    http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/notch-ea-are-cynical-bastards-who-are-methodically-destroying-gam/095466
    Minecraft creator Markus ‘Notch’ Persson has unleashed a vicious verbal assault on leading global publisher EA.

    He was seemingly provoked by EA’s new Indie Bundle on Steam which includes indie titles EA has previously digitally published such as Shank and DeathSpank.

    “EA releases an ‘indie bundle’? That's not how that works, EA,” he said.

    “Stop attempting to ruin everything, you bunch of cynical bastards.

    “I don't even call Mojang indie any more. Vlambeer is indie. Polytron is indie. Stephen, Ed, Terry, Derek, Tommy and Chris are indie. Indies are saving gaming. EA is methodically destroying it.”

    I think he knows that all the morons over at Reddit masturbate furiously to anything Notch related, so he's just giving his fans what they want.

    OMG Notch hates EA too! *SPLOOOGE*



    Skull2185 on
    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Everybody wants those online gaming dollars. Over/under on them taking the safe path of World of Warcraft knockoff?

    I'm not sure whether the kind of people who play MMOs will care about the Elder Scrolls name much.

    Couscous on
  • slash000slash000 Registered User regular
    Huh. I saw the EA indie bundle and thought, hey that's interesting.

    I don't quite see how EA is 'destroying' how Indie bundling has worked in the past.

    Ideally the indie devs involved are getting some reasonable royalty out of this. But honestly it's not all that different than EA putting a few of its low-end (price-wise) games on sale all at once.


    I guess the beef is that EA is taking away from the marketing presence or push that the "real" indie bundles have by kind of diluting the concept. I can see why there might be rage over that. But even so, I don't really think this EA bundle is really that big of a thing or really setting things on fire.

  • skeldareskeldare Gresham, ORRegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Notch needs to calm down.
    http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/notch-ea-are-cynical-bastards-who-are-methodically-destroying-gam/095466
    Minecraft creator Markus ‘Notch’ Persson has unleashed a vicious verbal assault on leading global publisher EA.

    He was seemingly provoked by EA’s new Indie Bundle on Steam which includes indie titles EA has previously digitally published such as Shank and DeathSpank.

    “EA releases an ‘indie bundle’? That's not how that works, EA,” he said.

    “Stop attempting to ruin everything, you bunch of cynical bastards.

    “I don't even call Mojang indie any more. Vlambeer is indie. Polytron is indie. Stephen, Ed, Terry, Derek, Tommy and Chris are indie. Indies are saving gaming. EA is methodically destroying it.”

    I think he knows that all the morons over at Reddit masturbate furiously to anything Notch related, so he's just giving his fans what they want.

    OMG Notch hates EA too! *SPLOOOGE*

    God I am so tired of Notch.

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  • slash000slash000 Registered User regular
    Notch just says what he thinks, either on his site or typically on twitter. He can't help it if he has a giant following that takes up the pitchforks and torches when he speaks!

  • vsovevsove ....also yes. Registered User regular
    Notch is, of course, free to say whatever he wants, but I'm of the opinion that professionalism is a better path to take.

    Still. He can say what he likes, but it is rather disappointing every time he descends into the name-calling eRage.

    WATCH THIS SPACE.
  • LegendofLinkLegendofLink Registered User regular
    Oh man. That ES MMO is has a lot of potential. The most interesting thing about this, though, is that it is announced for both PC and Macs. I think WoW is the only big MMO that supports both platforms like that ATM. Still, good news for me, because that means I can actually play this one. :p

  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    darleysam wrote: »
    Back to the Max Payne 3/Diablo 3 thing, Diablo 3 is only launching on PC, right? While MP3 will be, on that day, launching on 360 and PS3? Because I know that D3 is going to drop like a OMGKILLERTONMEGABOMB and shatter gaming sales numbers for all time, but, I'm really not convinced they'll conflict that much. If you've got a PC that can run it, you'll probably get Diablo 3. If you, like a great many people, don't have a PC that'll take it, aren't interested in it, or just want to shoot things instead? You'll probably get MP3. If they were launching on the same day on the same platforms, then there might be cause for concern. As it stands, I think there won't be many people having to choose.

    The initial conflation was started because the ad I saw on a bus simply said "May 15th". If there was an asterisk and/or subtext that noted the PC edition would be available later, I didn't see it, so I initially thought the PC edition would release at the same time as the console edition. That has been clarified, and I stand corrected.

    That said, even if I know why they do it, I don't like the seperate release dates.

    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    Here's something I thought was interesting.

    The Sega Genesis Collection 5 came out on Steam today. Probably the strongest collection yet. 10 games for $7.50. Phantasy Star 2-4, Beyond Oasis, Dynamite Heady, Golden Axe 3, Revenge of the Shinobi, Streets of Rage 3, Vectorman 2, and Wonder Boy in Monster World.

    Even with the collection offering such a great deal, Phantasy Star IV at $3 is in the Top 10 Best Sellers under $5.

    I think the audience for JRPGs on Steam is being drastically underestimated.

  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    edited May 2012
    slash000 wrote: »
    Huh. I saw the EA indie bundle and thought, hey that's interesting.

    I don't quite see how EA is 'destroying' how Indie bundling has worked in the past.

    Ideally the indie devs involved are getting some reasonable royalty out of this. But honestly it's not all that different than EA putting a few of its low-end (price-wise) games on sale all at once.


    I guess the beef is that EA is taking away from the marketing presence or push that the "real" indie bundles have by kind of diluting the concept. I can see why there might be rage over that. But even so, I don't really think this EA bundle is really that big of a thing or really setting things on fire.

    Ben Kuchera's been making some good points on Twitter, about it being good indie games getting more exposure on Steam at a reduced price. And yet this is somehow seen as a bad thing, because EA. I'm assuming EA didn't fund the development of these games, they seem to be more published under the 'partners' label, so.. they're.. not indie somehow?

    As for Notch, he was just giving his opinion on Twitter and obviously it became LOOK HOW ANGRY INDIE DEV IS HE RENOUNCES HIS INDIE STATUS AND PROCLAIMS DEATH TO EA! When that's not really the case at all. It's getting as bad as political reporting, where every single thing has to be an Us vs Them war story with gaffes and blasts and over-inflated click-grabbing headlines over the tiniest, most innocuous comment.

    darleysam on
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  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Other than kind of a weird choice of name, I don't see what's wrong with the "EA Indie Bundle"

    (also I support giving money to Ron Gilbert in all forms :D)

    Warlock82 on
    Switch: 2143-7130-1359 | 3DS: 4983-4927-6699 | Steam: warlock82 | PSN: Warlock2282
  • DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    It's because EA, pretty much. People didn't throw a fit when Bastion used the "indie" label. Shank's been in a Humble Indie Bundle before without any backlash.


    RE: TES MMO Kinda feels like the wheel will fall off the wagon if they attempt a game that feels like TES but in a MMO environment. Like, half the fun for me is being a total dick and stealing everything out from people's houses (and/or the clothes off their bodies). If they allow that sort of behavior, what stops the game landscape from being changed? If they just instance everything I don't see the point. Their games are structured such that your character is essentially the arbiter of all change in the world, it'll be really interesting to see how they manage to reconcile that with many players.

  • vsovevsove ....also yes. Registered User regular
    The thing is, if you're someone on Twitter who has an incredibly large number of followers, you have to understand that your tweets are reaching an absurd number of people - and that's going to mean that whatever you say is, to a large degree, 'news'.

    Were it Notch's first faux pas on Twitter, I would likely not even have commented. But he has a habit of running his mouth, and then when people comment on it he tends to act offended that anyone's taking offense.

    I don't know, I'm probably just hypersensitive to these sorts of things as of late.

    WATCH THIS SPACE.
  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    So TES MMO - are we finally allowed to complain about crippling bugs in a Bethesda game or is it still "it's ok because the game is huge"? :)

    Edit: Also doesn't making it an MMO kind of defeat the appeal of those games? Like, I imagine most people like TES because it's so open and you are free to do what you want. Not necessarily because they are enamored with the universe/story... Seems like an MMO is going to take away some of the unique aspects of the brand since they can't exactly have you murdering NPCs left and right or any number of other things that only work because it's single player.

    Warlock82 on
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  • darleysamdarleysam On my way to UKRegistered User regular
    vsove wrote: »
    The thing is, if you're someone on Twitter who has an incredibly large number of followers, you have to understand that your tweets are reaching an absurd number of people - and that's going to mean that whatever you say is, to a large degree, 'news'.

    Were it Notch's first faux pas on Twitter, I would likely not even have commented. But he has a habit of running his mouth, and then when people comment on it he tends to act offended that anyone's taking offense.

    I don't know, I'm probably just hypersensitive to these sorts of things as of late.

    No, that's fair, he's got a whole tonne of followers and yet doesn't use a private account to voice these kinds of opinions, so I guess he should realise that there's a responsibility there, that the things he's saying will be read by many and treated as a public statement. But at the same time, I think people are still coming to terms with exactly what Twitter is and what it can do, and treat it like a global text message. Which is why you get footballers making stupid comments that get printed in tomorrow's papers, and why some game developers (who should be more savvy about this) saying things about other companies that would be better kept in private. I think both sides should take a step back and think about things.

    forumsig.png
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Notch needs to calm down.
    http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/notch-ea-are-cynical-bastards-who-are-methodically-destroying-gam/095466
    Minecraft creator Markus ‘Notch’ Persson has unleashed a vicious verbal assault on leading global publisher EA.

    He was seemingly provoked by EA’s new Indie Bundle on Steam which includes indie titles EA has previously digitally published such as Shank and DeathSpank.

    “EA releases an ‘indie bundle’? That's not how that works, EA,” he said.

    “Stop attempting to ruin everything, you bunch of cynical bastards.

    “I don't even call Mojang indie any more. Vlambeer is indie. Polytron is indie. Stephen, Ed, Terry, Derek, Tommy and Chris are indie. Indies are saving gaming. EA is methodically destroying it.”

    I think he knows that all the morons over at Reddit masturbate furiously to anything Notch related, so he's just giving his fans what they want.

    OMG Notch hates EA too! *SPLOOOGE*

    Must you do this every time EA is mentioned in even a potentially negative light? This schtick is very, very tiresome.

    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
This discussion has been closed.