Christ I'm old. March of '89 was when my younger brother turned eight.
Anyway, Sims makes a pretty clear argument as to why he didn't like Action #775. He's very much a show-don't-tell person, and this does not sounds like that kind of a book.
It's a confrontational and weirdly defensive story that's based around the idea that Superman's morality needs to be defended, and when that's your starting point, you've already pretty much lost whatever argument it is you're having. The best Superman stories don't attempt to justify his actions, they let the actions themselves provide the justification. The fact that this is a story where Superman essentially lectures a proxy version of the Authority, another group of equally fictional characters -- and by extension, the fans who preferred their comic -- makes it read like the worst kind of fan-fiction, to the point where you'd half expect the next issue to include Superman giving a stern talking-to to the guy who picked on Kelly in the third grade. And to make matters worse, those characters never left. The Elite kept showing up, eventually turning into a covert black-ops arm of the Justice League in a comic that was also created by Kelly and Mahnke. Like Lobo, they actually became the thing they were created to parody.
I hate Superman 4, but I do love the scene when he asks to address the UN General Assembly because that's exactly what should happen.
Sims is changing the issue for the sake of fitting his argument, and he acts like there isn't a large portion of people out there who don't like Superman because he's a boy scout who doesn't kill, that is who Kelly is really addressing, not the Authority fans (to them he basically says you have your stories, Superman has his, they do not need to be one in the same). Heck, this was one of DC's big points during the reboot. The story is about Superman being beaten to the punch by the Elite in a few battles and not only that, having the situation be wrapped up a lot quicker than he would have done, at the expense of being more violent. Superman fights villains like a full course meal, helping innocent people and making sure as little damage as possible. The Elite, on the other hand, are like fast food heroics, just going in, shoot the bad guy with lasers or fireballs and move one, let someone else save the family trapped in the burning building. And the public actually liked seeing that, which is more a statement on the industry at the time when the Authority was one of DC/Wildstorm's best sellers. And then in the end Superman does let his actions do the talking and he shows up the Elite, which goes right against Sims' point.
The book is 60% show, 40% tell, mainly because Clark spends a fair amount of time talking to his family and Lois about whether he needs to even acknowledge the Elite or have them follow the usual superhero rulebook, because when someone serves you you get right back in their face and serve them. And to be fair it doesn't mess with the story because it was a double sized issue.
You also have to realize Sims hates Joe Kelly's JLA run with a passion, to the point where I wonder if Kelly bullied him in third grade and he's just taking revenge in a different manner, and I can't help wonder if that carries over here.
When I said I liked the idea of Luthor=Kryptonian, I assumed it was unknown to him, like it would manifest itself eventually or something. That's got a more interesting dynamic than "I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS" double agent nonsense.
But I agree with the guy who wrote the article on it: that script has some amazing scenes in it.
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spookymuffin( ° ʖ ° )Puyallup WA Registered Userregular
Whenever I hear about bad Superman movies, I always watch this:
Christ I'm old. March of '89 was when my younger brother turned eight.
Anyway, Sims makes a pretty clear argument as to why he didn't like Action #775. He's very much a show-don't-tell person, and this does not sounds like that kind of a book.
It's a confrontational and weirdly defensive story that's based around the idea that Superman's morality needs to be defended, and when that's your starting point, you've already pretty much lost whatever argument it is you're having. The best Superman stories don't attempt to justify his actions, they let the actions themselves provide the justification. The fact that this is a story where Superman essentially lectures a proxy version of the Authority, another group of equally fictional characters -- and by extension, the fans who preferred their comic -- makes it read like the worst kind of fan-fiction, to the point where you'd half expect the next issue to include Superman giving a stern talking-to to the guy who picked on Kelly in the third grade. And to make matters worse, those characters never left. The Elite kept showing up, eventually turning into a covert black-ops arm of the Justice League in a comic that was also created by Kelly and Mahnke. Like Lobo, they actually became the thing they were created to parody.
I hate Superman 4, but I do love the scene when he asks to address the UN General Assembly because that's exactly what should happen.
Sims is changing the issue for the sake of fitting his argument, and he acts like there isn't a large portion of people out there who don't like Superman because he's a boy scout who doesn't kill, that is who Kelly is really addressing, not the Authority fans (to them he basically says you have your stories, Superman has his, they do not need to be one in the same). Heck, this was one of DC's big points during the reboot. The story is about Superman being beaten to the punch by the Elite in a few battles and not only that, having the situation be wrapped up a lot quicker than he would have done, at the expense of being more violent. Superman fights villains like a full course meal, helping innocent people and making sure as little damage as possible. The Elite, on the other hand, are like fast food heroics, just going in, shoot the bad guy with lasers or fireballs and move one, let someone else save the family trapped in the burning building. And the public actually liked seeing that, which is more a statement on the industry at the time when the Authority was one of DC/Wildstorm's best sellers. And then in the end Superman does let his actions do the talking and he shows up the Elite, which goes right against Sims' point.
The book is 60% show, 40% tell, mainly because Clark spends a fair amount of time talking to his family and Lois about whether he needs to even acknowledge the Elite or have them follow the usual superhero rulebook, because when someone serves you you get right back in their face and serve them. And to be fair it doesn't mess with the story because it was a double sized issue.
You also have to realize Sims hates Joe Kelly's JLA run with a passion, to the point where I wonder if Kelly bullied him in third grade and he's just taking revenge in a different manner, and I can't help wonder if that carries over here.
Did Kelly realize Ellis considers the Authority villains from the beginning? Well meaning villains, but villains just the same.
The first test for the flying sequences involved simply catapulting a crash test dummy out of a cannon. Another technique had a remote control cast of Superman flying around. Both were discarded due to lack of movement. High quality, realistic-looking animation was tried, with speed trails added to make the effect more convincing.
Sims is changing the issue for the sake of fitting his argument, and he acts like there isn't a large portion of people out there who don't like Superman because he's a boy scout who doesn't kill, that is who Kelly is really addressing, not the Authority fans (to them he basically says you have your stories, Superman has his, they do not need to be one in the same). Heck, this was one of DC's big points during the reboot. The story is about Superman being beaten to the punch by the Elite in a few battles and not only that, having the situation be wrapped up a lot quicker than he would have done, at the expense of being more violent. Superman fights villains like a full course meal, helping innocent people and making sure as little damage as possible. The Elite, on the other hand, are like fast food heroics, just going in, shoot the bad guy with lasers or fireballs and move one, let someone else save the family trapped in the burning building. And the public actually liked seeing that, which is more a statement on the industry at the time when the Authority was one of DC/Wildstorm's best sellers. And then in the end Superman does let his actions do the talking and he shows up the Elite, which goes right against Sims' point.
I think it's weird that Sims rags on Kingdom Come and What's So Funny, for using the idea of classic superheroes v.s. grim n' gritty superheroes, but has praised JLA: Classified by Morrison. He even singled out the denouement of that story as something he enjoyed, wherein the JLA essentially gives the same, "Hey, killing supervillains doesn't work," lecture, to the Ultramarine Corps.
If Magneto's a well-meaning villain, then so's Apocalypse.
Apocalypse wants to rule or kill everyone for hell of it. Magneto wants to protect mutantkind from being oppressed by humanity. What with Senator Kelly, the Redeemers, Stryker, Sentinels etc Erik has a point.
Doom sees himself as a benevolent dictator, which is to say that he believes that the world would be a better place under his rule.
And he's not necessarily wrong about that.
Depends on which version. He's either a cackling super-villain dictator or a well meaning douchebag. His behavior and motives are far less coherent than Magneto's have been.
I've always seen him as a cackling super-villain. I almost kind of prefer him that way.
I don't mind one-note characters if they're interesting. Like Deadpool and his Looney Toons antics. If it's entertaining, that's all I want.
Doom's a character with surprising complexity. Which makes it easier for me to grasp that he can switch between both, depending on the circumstances. Whenever Reed's around he's less logical than he can be, that's why I liked it when he was in that special with Dr. Strange where they rescued Doom's mother from Mephisto.
If Magneto's a well-meaning villain, then so's Apocalypse.
Apocalypse wants to rule or kill everyone for hell of it. Magneto wants to protect mutantkind from being oppressed by humanity. What with Senator Kelly, the Redeemers, Stryker, Sentinels etc Erik has a point.
Doom sees himself as a benevolent dictator, which is to say that he believes that the world would be a better place under his rule.
And he's not necessarily wrong about that.
Depends on which version. He's either a cackling super-villain dictator or a well meaning douchebag. His behavior and motives are far less coherent than Magneto's have been.
I think Doomwar showed a pretty coherent version of how Doom sees himself, and it is kind of validated in a way since he's not struck down immediately when he explains his motives to a god.
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If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten in your presence.
If Magneto's a well-meaning villain, then so's Apocalypse.
Apocalypse wants to rule or kill everyone for hell of it. Magneto wants to protect mutantkind from being oppressed by humanity. What with Senator Kelly, the Redeemers, Stryker, Sentinels etc Erik has a point.
Doom sees himself as a benevolent dictator, which is to say that he believes that the world would be a better place under his rule.
And he's not necessarily wrong about that.
Depends on which version. He's either a cackling super-villain dictator or a well meaning douchebag. His behavior and motives are far less coherent than Magneto's have been.
I think Doomwar showed a pretty coherent version of how Doom sees himself, and it is kind of validated in a way since he's not struck down immediately when he explains his motives to a god.
I think part of the series' charm was that you didn't know for sure if this Doom was the real deal or not. He certainly didn't doubt himself though as best as I can recall. Or didn't care much anyway.
If Magneto's a well-meaning villain, then so's Apocalypse.
Apocalypse wants to rule or kill everyone for hell of it. Magneto wants to protect mutantkind from being oppressed by humanity. What with Senator Kelly, the Redeemers, Stryker, Sentinels etc Erik has a point.
No, he doesn't. Apocalypse's whole schtick is survival of the fittest and seeing that the best descendants of humans reach the peak of evolution. Apocalypse is really just Magneto's philosophy on mutants amped up 1000% - the exact role he was created to fill for Cyclop's X-Fact. Apocalypse has even saved the Earth on occasion and was one of the founders of Shield.
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- Marvel knows how much fans hate the show. They know, that they messed up when they could have brought both kids and adults fans together, instead of focusing on the children. Regardless of what their PR BS makes it sound, the reason Ultimate Spider-man has been renewed for a second season, is that the network ordered the second season WAY before the series debut. The publicity stunt Marvel pulled by stating the show has been renewed by popular demand, is just a strategy to try and tell fans that people like this show maybe you should give it a second chance.
- Ratings for the show are not good. He then gave me the following example: If you have 10 people watching a channel, then you introduce a new show, and instantly 200 are watching, but after 2 weeks the number goes down to 60 you still have bad ratings drop, yet its way better than the original 10 they had before the show. Agent X wants you to look at that statement carefully and you will know the “TRUE” meaning of Marvel ratings PR stunt.
- Chances are more than high that Ultimate Spider-man will conclude after season 2. There will be some minor changes to the show during its 2013 season (a bit less in your face humor, a tiny bit more drama, and less scripts from “man of action” while more from Bendis and Dini). If by chance, the fans embrace the show in its second season it will be renewed, otherwise a new Spider-man show will replace it. Early talk about a series in the same tone as the upcoming movie reboot have been discussed, but nothing more than just that: discussion. Agent X also still urges the fans to show their disapproval of the show, since Marvel is listening, although it takes months and years for the company to answer the cries.
No, he doesn't. Apocalypse's whole schtick is survival of the fittest and seeing that the best descendants of humans reach the peak of evolution. Apocalypse is really just Magneto's philosophy on mutants amped up 1000% - the exact role he was created to fill for Cyclop's X-Fact. Apocalypse has even saved the Earth on occasion and was one of the founders of Shield.
So what happens if/when someone points out that the end point of his philosophy is "there can only be one?"
No, he doesn't. Apocalypse's whole schtick is survival of the fittest and seeing that the best descendants of humans reach the peak of evolution. Apocalypse is really just Magneto's philosophy on mutants amped up 1000% - the exact role he was created to fill for Cyclop's X-Fact. Apocalypse has even saved the Earth on occasion and was one of the founders of Shield.
So what happens if/when someone points out that the end point of his philosophy is "there can only be one?"
That's not true, unless you think that evolution has an end-point.
Otherwise he'd expect the fittest to reproduce, rear superior children, and then by killed by their children.
Kind of like wanting the mutants to kill their human fore bearers, which is what Magneto wants when he's a villain.
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And Superman Returns.
I loved Justice League Unlimited's take on him.
And Lex Luthor was a secret Kryptonian.
well that first part already happened, sort of
I almost sort of like the idea of Lex Luthor as a Kryptonian.
I certainly wouldn't pay money for anything involving the idea. I just like it in a "What if?" sort of way.
XBL: JyrenB ; Steam: Jyren ; Twitter
Sims is changing the issue for the sake of fitting his argument, and he acts like there isn't a large portion of people out there who don't like Superman because he's a boy scout who doesn't kill, that is who Kelly is really addressing, not the Authority fans (to them he basically says you have your stories, Superman has his, they do not need to be one in the same). Heck, this was one of DC's big points during the reboot. The story is about Superman being beaten to the punch by the Elite in a few battles and not only that, having the situation be wrapped up a lot quicker than he would have done, at the expense of being more violent. Superman fights villains like a full course meal, helping innocent people and making sure as little damage as possible. The Elite, on the other hand, are like fast food heroics, just going in, shoot the bad guy with lasers or fireballs and move one, let someone else save the family trapped in the burning building. And the public actually liked seeing that, which is more a statement on the industry at the time when the Authority was one of DC/Wildstorm's best sellers. And then in the end Superman does let his actions do the talking and he shows up the Elite, which goes right against Sims' point.
The book is 60% show, 40% tell, mainly because Clark spends a fair amount of time talking to his family and Lois about whether he needs to even acknowledge the Elite or have them follow the usual superhero rulebook, because when someone serves you you get right back in their face and serve them. And to be fair it doesn't mess with the story because it was a double sized issue.
You also have to realize Sims hates Joe Kelly's JLA run with a passion, to the point where I wonder if Kelly bullied him in third grade and he's just taking revenge in a different manner, and I can't help wonder if that carries over here.
When I said I liked the idea of Luthor=Kryptonian, I assumed it was unknown to him, like it would manifest itself eventually or something. That's got a more interesting dynamic than "I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS" double agent nonsense.
But I agree with the guy who wrote the article on it: that script has some amazing scenes in it.
Wii U NNID: MegaSpooky
Did Kelly realize Ellis considers the Authority villains from the beginning? Well meaning villains, but villains just the same.
Haha.
And Magneto.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Or does it have to do with the whole "my mom's in hell" thing?
And he's not necessarily wrong about that.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
I think it's weird that Sims rags on Kingdom Come and What's So Funny, for using the idea of classic superheroes v.s. grim n' gritty superheroes, but has praised JLA: Classified by Morrison. He even singled out the denouement of that story as something he enjoyed, wherein the JLA essentially gives the same, "Hey, killing supervillains doesn't work," lecture, to the Ultramarine Corps.
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Apocalypse wants to rule or kill everyone for hell of it. Magneto wants to protect mutantkind from being oppressed by humanity. What with Senator Kelly, the Redeemers, Stryker, Sentinels etc Erik has a point.
Depends on which version. He's either a cackling super-villain dictator or a well meaning douchebag. His behavior and motives are far less coherent than Magneto's have been.
I don't mind one-note characters if they're interesting. Like Deadpool and his Looney Toons antics. If it's entertaining, that's all I want.
Doom's a character with surprising complexity. Which makes it easier for me to grasp that he can switch between both, depending on the circumstances. Whenever Reed's around he's less logical than he can be, that's why I liked it when he was in that special with Dr. Strange where they rescued Doom's mother from Mephisto.
Read this.
Read Infinite Gauntlet, Triumph & Torment and watch "The Private War of Dr. Doom" on Avengers: EMH.
Heh, catching up on the thread, about four posts up I was thinking "I should re-read Doomwar."
I think Doomwar showed a pretty coherent version of how Doom sees himself, and it is kind of validated in a way since he's not struck down immediately when he explains his motives to a god.
Haven't read that.
It also uses Deadpool really well.
Though the art wasn't my cup of tea
I liked this Doom.
Let's Play Final Fantasy 'II' (Ch10 - 5/17/10)
Let's Play Final Fantasy 'II' (Ch10 - 5/17/10)
No, he doesn't. Apocalypse's whole schtick is survival of the fittest and seeing that the best descendants of humans reach the peak of evolution. Apocalypse is really just Magneto's philosophy on mutants amped up 1000% - the exact role he was created to fill for Cyclop's X-Fact. Apocalypse has even saved the Earth on occasion and was one of the founders of Shield.
Specifically talking about the show's season 2 renewal:
So what happens if/when someone points out that the end point of his philosophy is "there can only be one?"
Loved this series.
Did they ever decide if he was the real deal or not?
I'd almost like for him to show up in the 616 Marvel universe but imagine he'd be quickly killed off, disproven as the real deal etc.
That's not true, unless you think that evolution has an end-point.
Otherwise he'd expect the fittest to reproduce, rear superior children, and then by killed by their children.
Kind of like wanting the mutants to kill their human fore bearers, which is what Magneto wants when he's a villain.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation