Woo. Finished the Crippled God today. Pretty good conclusion. I'll probably make some posts about my thoughts on the series as a whole in the next several days, but it certainly was a fun ride.
It's currently still ongoing, he's taking a break from answering, but seems hellbent on addressing every single post in the thread, so if you want your questions, get 'em in while it's hot.
There's a fair mix of game characters and novel characters. I think I've given brief lists in other interviews, but for the main ones: I was Dancer and Cam was Kellanved (though in the game he called himself Dr Wu): I was Anomander and Caladan and Cam was Whiskeyjack, K'azz, Greymane. I was Kruppe and Rallick; Cam was Baruk and Coll. A bunch of guys got in on things later, making up Fiddler's squad in the Bonehunters (barring Corabb and Cuttle). A good friend was Karsa Orlong and went through the hell that was Book One in House of Chains.
So finished reading Orb Sceptre Throne and im kind of underwhelmed. There will be spoilers
I'll start with things I like:
Picker Blend and the other people at Kruls Bar. there always entertaining and some of my favourite characters.
Turning their bar into a homemade fortress is pretty funny and we get answers about the pickled Seguleh in the basement.
Studious Lock. He's funny in a Tehol/Bugg way, constantly coming up with potions for things that are't needed.
Raest is still good, still has Fluffy the cat
The Moranth. They just get shit done, we find out why in one of the earlier books someone said the treaty with them is breaking down.
Because they think everyone of the Malazans who signed it is dead so the treaty is no longer valid. Turns out they thought wrong.
Also why they developed bombs and its not just because
they have a history of every culture on Genabackis being out to kill them
Seguleh versus Seguleh fight
(Studious Lock's 2 helper guys who had renounced being Seguleh fighting regular Seguleh)
Now things I didn't like:
The new Tyrant of Darujhistan and his magical teleporting minions manage to
undo most of the Malazan conquest of Genabackis within a few pages simply by assassinating a few mages, this causes the Malazan army to shit themselves and run into the countryside giving up everything that took them years to get.
Teleporting.
So Vorcans daughter Taya just straight up teleports around Genabackis assassinating mages left right and center, previously jounreys by Warren actually take time!
The main bad guy of the book starts off pretty menacing but at the end
he gets defeated first by Scorch and Leff accidentally shooting him then Kruppe dancing around him like a matador? I wasn't sure what he was meant to be doing.
Lady Envy just hanging around in Daujhistan
for no real reason, decides to join the Tyrant, does nothing and then her final bit is her thinking perhaps i'll visit Unta
Most of the Seguleh bits, they are verging into invincible badasses beyond belief.
The bit where 400 of them take on 10000 malazans and cripple or kill 40% in a few minutes is a bit far fetched, yes they great swordsmen but its too unlikely, the seguleh don't wear armour and everyone knows that Malazans love crossbows, at least some of the Seguleh would've been killed beforehand. Then again in this book they seem immune to mortal wounds from bombs (unless outright killed) and can sword fight while silmultaneously climbing up a wall.
Speaking of the Seguleh I thought they already had a 2nd (granted he was undead) and a 3rd (who was still alive) and the revelation that there
is no 1st (as the Mask was in Moon's Spawn - How did it get there? Rake only got to 7th he didn't get to meet the 1st and therefore take the mask off him)
But the book leaves a whole bunch of questions and changes some things.
Whats going to happen with Orchid
she disappears once Antsy and co return to Darujhistan. I assume shes going to head to Coral and join up with the other Andii/Elient people
About the bad guy
So there was a invicible awesome tyrant no-one had heard of before who made Darujhistan rule most of Genabackis. Why had no-one ever remembered this and what gave the Tyrant such powers
.
Whats the deal with the silver metal
that formed the impervious barrier and gave powers to Taya (I think)
where did it come from again never been mentioned before.
Why are the Rhyvi now suddenly a horse based culture like mongols when previously they weren't.
Kruppe
is a god? obviously theres always been something up with Kruppe but in this book he really seems like hes actually a god. Also owns the Phoenix Inn?
Humble Measure.
I thought in this books there would be a showdown between the ex-bridgeburners and him given that they had learned he hired the assassins guild to kill them. Instead he has a plan to make a new Legate and supply him with arms to make Darujhistan strong only to get pissed when he isn't needed because Seguleh are around. is the bridgeburner/humble measure plot over?
Vorcan
spends the book tied up with that aforementioned silver metal only to just break free and tie up her daughter instead of allowing Topper to get some vengeance for Laseen. Instead Topper threatens her daughter with "if i ever see you again i'll kill you" its like Topper shes right there all tied up, just stab her already
Leoman and his constant my mustache brings all the girls to the yard,
Doesn't come out until May 22 in the States, I'll be able to discuss it then.
I am slowly catching up to the Tor reread. I'm near the end of Memories of Ice.
Knowing what's coming up, I'm filled with dread, again. Slowing down and reading Deadhouse Gates at a less breakneck pace made the end of the Chain of Dogs feel like hammer blows to the chest. I think MoI will be almost as bad.
The Tor reread is really good. Each post is 1 chapter, they give a synopsis, then a newbie reader's reactions along with a veteran reader's reactions and analysis. The comments are generally pretty good too. They've managed to have a Q&A with Erikson at the end of each book, too. It slows down my reading speed to alternate between the book and the blog, which helps things sink in better. I normally read Malazan books pretty fast, which doesn't work real well for remembering everything.
So finished reading Orb Sceptre Throne and im kind of underwhelmed. There will be spoilers
Just finished it on my vacation. I rather enjoyed it, and found it to be ICE's most consistent offering, but I appear to be easily pleased with these things. :P
I'll start with things I like:
Picker Blend and the other people at Kruls Bar. there always entertaining and some of my favourite characters.
Turning their bar into a homemade fortress is pretty funny and we get answers about the pickled Seguleh in the basement.
Studious Lock. He's funny in a Tehol/Bugg way, constantly coming up with potions for things that are't needed.
Raest is still good, still has Fluffy the cat
The Moranth. They just get shit done, we find out why in one of the earlier books someone said the treaty with them is breaking down.
Because they think everyone of the Malazans who signed it is dead so the treaty is no longer valid. Turns out they thought wrong.
Also why they developed bombs and its not just because
they have a history of every culture on Genabackis being out to kill them
Seguleh versus Seguleh fight
(Studious Lock's 2 helper guys who had renounced being Seguleh fighting regular Seguleh)
Agreed across most of the stuff - I really enjoyed basically everything having to do with the Seguleh or the Moranth, bar none.
Now things I didn't like:
The new Tyrant of Darujhistan and his magical teleporting minions manage to
undo most of the Malazan conquest of Genabackis within a few pages simply by assassinating a few mages, this causes the Malazan army to shit themselves and run into the countryside giving up everything that took them years to get.
Teleporting.
So Vorcans daughter Taya just straight up teleports around Genabackis assassinating mages left right and center, previously jounreys by Warren actually take time!
The main bad guy of the book starts off pretty menacing but at the end
he gets defeated first by Scorch and Leff accidentally shooting him then Kruppe dancing around him like a matador? I wasn't sure what he was meant to be doing.
It wasn't just taking out the mages - the mages being taken out was only those who were left in central command itself, which happened to be the only ones which were used to communicate across the continent, as they were the only ones left. Basically, there were three primary military installations remaining - central, North (which was around Pale, I believe), and South (which we didn't really run into in the course of the book?). Everyone else was either very small local garrisons or governing bodies. It wasn't just the mages who were taken out, it was the military heads of each of these installations and/or the governors - when the visage went around demanding capitulation, for those who did not either respond the way Pale did or immediately promise to capitulate, the tops of each installation were taken out - so you have a bunch of soldiers with no officers, no real military command or governing bodies, and the actual core of the militaries in other cities. That's how things were thrown into chaos across the continent. Now, as to the "usually you have to travel by warren" bit, I agree. You can hand-wave a bit by saying that they did have to travel and since all the mages were taken out ANYWAY, any other real means of communicating across distance would have happened slowly enough that warren travel would have been instantaneous, but it was a bit rough.
The Scorch/Leff thing, I think had more to do with the crossbow bolts which were used - they're some special way to be able to damage it when normally physical attacks would have been useless, but I didn't really get where they came from other than Kruppe being involved. It wasn't well explained. Kruppe's dancing was simply keeping him from putting the mask on someone else, but once more, not terribly well explained. I think that what we were to take from it is that the bolts damaged it enough that it was unable to actually do the sort of "suffocation" bit it did at the beginning of the book, which allowed them to trap it within the sarcophagus (?) that Barathol made and that was lowered into the random well outside of Daru
Lady Envy just hanging around in Daujhistan
for no real reason, decides to join the Tyrant, does nothing and then her final bit is her thinking perhaps i'll visit Unta
Most of the Seguleh bits, they are verging into invincible badasses beyond belief.
The bit where 400 of them take on 10000 malazans and cripple or kill 40% in a few minutes is a bit far fetched, yes they great swordsmen but its too unlikely, the seguleh don't wear armour and everyone knows that Malazans love crossbows, at least some of the Seguleh would've been killed beforehand. Then again in this book they seem immune to mortal wounds from bombs (unless outright killed) and can sword fight while silmultaneously climbing up a wall.
Lady Envy was just being Lady Envy. The weird thing which got dropped there was....didn't she see her father at some point? Or did I just imagine that? I read the last third of the book or so while sick so maybe I did :P
The Seguleh bit...meh. I just kinda accepted that stuff because the majority of the time swordsmen wouldn't be anywhere near what we see in this series ANYWAY, so you kinda have to take it in stride.
Speaking of the Seguleh I thought they already had a 2nd (granted he was undead) and a 3rd (who was still alive) and the revelation that there
is no 1st (as the Mask was in Moon's Spawn - How did it get there? Rake only got to 7th he didn't get to meet the 1st and therefore take the mask off him)
But the book leaves a whole bunch of questions and changes some things.
Yeah, how the 1st mask was in Moon's Spawn is beyond me, too. for some reason I had it in my head that the Seguleh First was the Soldier of Death that we saw way back when, but nope...he was another Second. With a streak in a different place, amusingly enough. ....actually, yeah. Just glanced at ME and that appears to be an inconsistency between Erikson and ICE - from MoI "...yet with the Second missing, and with Mok's growing prowess, no doubt the First had his reasons." So the First was supposed to be around, the Second was the Soldier of Death, and Mok was third at the time. Whoops. Anyway, yeah. Disappointingly sloppy.
Whats going to happen with Orchid
she disappears once Antsy and co return to Darujhistan. I assume shes going to head to Coral and join up with the other Andii/Elient people
That was my assumption as well. They all ended up in Kurald Galain, and then got back to Daru through the temple thanks to Orchid.
About the bad guy
So there was a invicible awesome tyrant no-one had heard of before who made Darujhistan rule most of Genabackis. Why had no-one ever remembered this and what gave the Tyrant such powers
.
They made it clear that while the Tyrants were remembered, the most recent one had been systemically erased from history thanks to the Torud Cabal folks, in an attempt to have security through obscurity - if no one knows he/it exists, no one goes searching for it and could potentially revive it. The Moranth were the only people who otherwise remembered. And, I suppose, the previous First who chose not to impart the knowledge onto the Second. As for what gave the Tyrant his powers, it appears that it was locked within the Mask, and the only people it was actually able to compel were, once more that same group of people - most of whom were dead (aside from Vorcan and Baruk and....didn't one other survive? What happened to her anyway? I seem to remember her being in the Dramatis Personae for OST, but I don't remember her scenes. Hm.
Whats the deal with the silver metal
that formed the impervious barrier and gave powers to Taya (I think)
where did it come from again never been mentioned before.
Taya's powers were her own, and the silver metal was silver but invested with something via the runes/warren which were used by Baruk and the one shade - Aman, I think it was - to make them impervious to Moranth munitions, as they were the only "real" enemy/
Why are the Rhyvi now suddenly a horse based culture like mongols when previously they weren't.
They were always nomadic herders, and there are plenty of references to horseflesh and such in previous novels. We just never really saw them "go to war" proper in the past. This one's not really a problem so much as not picking up on subtext in previous novels since we never saw them fight.
Kruppe
is a god? obviously theres always been something up with Kruppe but in this book he really seems like hes actually a god. Also owns the Phoenix Inn?
To the former, I have absolutely no idea where you picked that up from. He's not. To the latter, I think so, yeah.
Humble Measure.
I thought in this books there would be a showdown between the ex-bridgeburners and him given that they had learned he hired the assassins guild to kill them. Instead he has a plan to make a new Legate and supply him with arms to make Darujhistan strong only to get pissed when he isn't needed because Seguleh are around. is the bridgeburner/humble measure plot over?
I would assume so. I thought his plotline was nicely tied up where he was a rich man terrified of oppression from the percieved enemy outside, so he sought to make his current place of residence stronger, but in the process created something worse. I doubt he likes the Malazans at this point, but I don't think that he's going to see them as the terrible threat that they he previously did.
Vorcan
spends the book tied up with that aforementioned silver metal only to just break free and tie up her daughter instead of allowing Topper to get some vengeance for Laseen. Instead Topper threatens her daughter with "if i ever see you again i'll kill you" its like Topper shes right there all tied up, just stab her already
Leoman and his constant my mustache brings all the girls to the yard,
Vorcan spends the book tied up in otataral chains to prevent herself from being summoned/controlled by the Tyrant. My only real question with it is why Taya wouldn't be able to break out of it the way that Vorcan did, but....oh well? I think that Topper realized that Taya would effectively be tortured for the rest of her life, which seemed sufficient punishment for killing off the Empress.
Only real stuff I thought was off about the book:
Taya previously working with Mallick Rel and now she's all up with the Tyrant and Humble Measure because....? It really just seemed like ICE went "well, here's an established character from a previous book which I can use." Mind you, it made more sense for her in this book than in RotCG, where there was no real rhyme or reason for her being with Mallick Rel, but that's neither here nor there.
K'rul being a female all of a sudden for no apparent reason. It was out of the blue and purposeless, and frankly could have been done without.
The whole "Shores of Creation" thing was neat, but just...didn't seem to "fit" with the rest of the series' mythos. Mind you, it's not like there's not plenty of random stuff cribbed together to begin with, but adding something like that at this late stage felt a tad off. Similarly, how the hell did Kiska get back there at the end?
At any rate, I thought that the quality of writing was by far ICE's best offering. There didn't seem to be the requisite unrelated character plotline this time - everything tied together rather nicely by the end of things. There's just some stuff which didn't really mesh with what we knew from previous books and that's just disappointing.
So, picked up my mail and the Subterranean Press copy of Deadhouse Gates also arrived. I felt compelled to get it as I had a copy of Gardens of the Moon as a gift from my folks (and could build a numbered set), but I'm feeling kinda underwhelemed.
The build of the novel, quality of paper, font, etc is all excellent. The cover image is supurb, as has been posted here before. But while GotM had 6 images excluding the cover (7 for the lettered, where the additional image is quite neat - not sure if it's been posted here before. The Siege atPale:)
DG only has 4. The quality of the four are decent, although their placement is a tad off - the first one is spot on:
directly opposite the scene, the others are a tad more haphazardly chosen and are placed a good 5/6 pages after the scene in question - Icarium choking Iskrael Pust, the
scene with butterflies taking Sormo's soul at the river battle, but not actually showing that - rather, showing a charge of Wickans at some spears in the midst of butterflies....I'll have to check to see if they're around for the entire thing or I just remembered the bit with Sormo's soul, in which case the scene is the charge in the midst of the butterflies, obviously
, and the image which no one seems to be able to place with the random assassin girl who could by any number of people but which doesn't seem to fit any particular scene which is placed rather jarringly in the midst of a certain particular climax. You know the one. Not -quite- the worst place possible (ie, it's not at the climax of the climax) but damn close.
So yeah. Feeling rather underwhelmed, particularly given the wait.
e: Found what must be the lettered version's additional image in this case, which is actually quite excellent. Doesn't help me any, though. :P
e2: Wait, there's also this image of the Silanda.
which I didn't see. Now I'm confused and perhaps a bit irritated if there were supposed to be more
Realize I'm stringing a lot in a row here, but browsing Malazan Empire and someone mentioned something which seems to make perfect sense for one of the things that bothered both of us, Gary.
Crossbow bolts were probably forged by Barathol, and invested with the shards of Dragnipur. There's a few lines which can be easily overlooked which points to Kruppe having stolen them from Baruk's estate after Baruk is....taken.
The Tyrant being taken down by those shards feels more satisfactory
Today was the US release date for Orb, Sceptre, Throne. I read a little of my copy already. Makes me wish I had paid more attention to Toll the Hounds and Stonewielder.
Forge of Darkness: Now is the time to tell the story of an ancient realm, a tragic tale that sets the stage for all the tales yet to come and all those already told...
It's a conflicted time in Kurald Galain, the realm of Darkness, where Mother Dark reigns. But this ancient land was once home to many a power… and even death is not quite eternal. The commoners' great hero, Vatha Urusander, is being promoted by his followers to take Mother Dark's hand in marriage, but her Consort, Lord Draconus, stands in the way of such ambitions. The impending clash sends fissures throughout the realm, and as the rumors of civil war burn through the masses, an ancient power emerges from the long dead seas. Caught in the middle of it all are the First Sons of Darkness, Anomander, Andarist, and Silchas Ruin of the Purake Hold...
Steven Erikson entered the pantheon of great fantasy writers with his debut Gardens of the Moon. Now he returns with the first novel in a trilogy that takes place millennia before the events of the Malazan Book of the Fallen and introduces readers to Kurald Galain, the warren of Darkness. It is the epic story of a realm whose fate plays a crucial role in shaping the world of the Malazan Empire.
Is there a date for that one yet? I am pretty interested. The Kurald Galain stuff late in the series was pretty interesting, but pretty confusing. It will be nice to get some backstory.
I am steaming through Orb, Sceptre, Throne. Got about 100 pages to go. I feel like Esselmont's Kruppe is a little off from Erikson's. Maybe that's why he is used quite sparingly in this book. I do like his take on Spindle, Antsy, and Scorch and Leff though.
Darujhistan just makes every book set there hard to follow. So many plots. Some thoughts:
Didn't understand K'rul becoming a she. Don't know why that happened.
Kruppe was keeping Derudan neutralized with some mega-durhang I think. She never 'turned'. Were all there Torrud Cabal immortal former servants of the Tyrant then?
Lady Envy did nothing comprehensible.
Is Studious Lock some kind of Assail or demon? He doesn't seem to be human, or Andii, or any other known race.
Why was Tayschrenn replacing K'rul? Is this some plot from TCG that I don't remember? The Scimitar in the sky makes this book concurrent with DoD and TCG, right?
Do we know what happened to the old First or is that supposed to be mysterious?
Basically no one dies in this book, unusual for a Malazan book. The Second, I guess. I also thought it was a little odd that everyone is suddenly horrified by Moranth munitions. Maybe our POVs weren't hardened vets like most of the Bridgeburners.
Overall it was good. Think I liked Stonewielder better but I'm not sure yet.
The generally accepted theory seems to be that all of the Cabal are not actually humans/sorcerers/whatever, but rather are demons or something along those lines who were servants of the Tyrant. They were the ones in the other tombs (which were broken outward, if you recall) and were simply living "free" because the Tyrant was still entombed. There's a few hints dropped in this direction but I can't recall them offhand. As they were his servants, when he was freed, they were compelled, etc.
Other stuff:
First/Second thing was a SNAFU from the earlier books. The Second was the one who was supposed to be missing, the First was the one getting concerned about Mok which is why he was sent away. I think that Death's Soldier (who was the Second) in MBotF was supposed to be the "missing" one. How the First's mask ended up on Moon's Spawn is....damned if I know. It's really a giant "wouldn't it be cool if..." and doesn't mesh with the previous stuff in the slightest.
Folks are split on whether T'renn is replacing K'rul as Maker of Paths (potentially with Icarium's new warrens?) or replacing D'rek (which didn't occur to me at first and makes a LOT more sense). As to the why.....it's an ICE novel. Seems like we never get any whys from him
The generally accepted theory seems to be that all of the Cabal are not actually humans/sorcerers/whatever, but rather are demons or something along those lines who were servants of the Tyrant. They were the ones in the other tombs (which were broken outward, if you recall) and were simply living "free" because the Tyrant was still entombed. There's a few hints dropped in this direction but I can't recall them offhand. As they were his servants, when he was freed, they were compelled, etc.
Other stuff:
First/Second thing was a SNAFU from the earlier books. The Second was the one who was supposed to be missing, the First was the one getting concerned about Mok which is why he was sent away. I think that Death's Soldier (who was the Second) in MBotF was supposed to be the "missing" one. How the First's mask ended up on Moon's Spawn is....damned if I know. It's really a giant "wouldn't it be cool if..." and doesn't mesh with the previous stuff in the slightest.
Folks are split on whether T'renn is replacing K'rul as Maker of Paths (potentially with Icarium's new warrens?) or replacing D'rek (which didn't occur to me at first and makes a LOT more sense). As to the why.....it's an ICE novel. Seems like we never get any whys from him
So Baruk, Vorcan, Derudan, and Mammot were demons all along, huh? I guess some of them were trying to be nice and atone for their sins? Was Taya one of the 12 or is she Vorcan's more recent daughter?
I do think Jan mentioned the previous Second going away, and his replacing him. We never met the previous second before he was Death's Soldier, right? So that could have happened any time in the past, really. I agree about the First though, this book makes it seem like he has been gone a long time, but others make it seem like he was around.
I think T'ren is replacing K'rul just because they did all that in the depths of K'rul's temple, and because at the very end we see him meet Kruppe in Kruppe or K'rul's dreamworld that those two met in several times in GOTM. The only problem is there is no apparent reason to replace K'rul.
I guess we did see Tayschrenn jump into D'rek's lair/hole, and have some kind of conversation. All her priests are dead, so maybe he's supposed to restart a new cult? Still, I think it's K'rul.
Any word on an Encyclopedia Malaz? The setting is so fucking dense and confusing, yet awesome, I'd love a companion book.
Asked Erikson about that in his AMA on reddit.
We just haven't yet got to putting together an encyclopedia. The fact is, with Cam working on his new novel and me on mine, it's a question of choosing what's more important to us ... so, do you want more novels from us or the encyclopedia?
So has anyone in the UK picked up Forge of Darkness yet? I'm curious to know how it differs from the original series tonally and in terms of scope and such.
I'm dredging up this thread because I am partway through Forge of Darkness. It is portraying the early times of Kurald Galain completely differently from what I had in my head. Which is good, I guess. Makes it more than a fill-in history book. But still, there's a surprise every few pages so far.
Spoilers through chapter 8ish
The most significant one is probably that so many people are alive back then. A lot of them don't know each other yet. I knew it would be about Anomander Rake and his brothers, I didn't know it would involve Draconus, Sandalath Drukolat, Spinnock Durav, Osserc, Grizzin Farl, Scabandari, and so on.
The biggest awesome moment was witnessing Rake and Caladan Brood's binding oath. I figured out who that was just before he said he name.
And all the Tiste seem to just be Tiste? Apparently they haven't divided into Andii/Edur/Liosan yet. There are hints of how that may happen, but as it is they all seem to be one race, one nation.
And I guess there are no gods, Elder or otherwise yet. Mother Dark is the closest thing, but she's really just Queen at this point. Grizzin Farl, Draconus, and I've heard snippets about K'rul and Errastas. They all just seem to be dudes hangin' out. I wonder if Mael will show up.
I have the book, but decided to close the chapter on the wot portion of my life, so I've been rereading that series and am choosing to do it all in one shot. Forge of Darkness will come after
I feel compelled to share this for a single quote.
There’s a significant encounter in Toll the Hounds between one of Erikson’s characters and one of Esslemont’s characters (fans who have read TtH will know the encounter I speak of) that was decided, in true RPG-nerd fashion, by a good ol’ fashion roll of a twenty-sided die. Erikson suggested that the end of that novel would have been much different if the die had rolled differently.
I am kind of interested in returning to the Malazan world, but the books are so dense and sort of non-relaxing to read that I still can't convince myself to get into them unless they are telling a story of one of the characters I really like. Give me an Icarium book, or even a Karsa book and I'm there. A whole cast of new characters, I'm still ehh. Maybe in 6 months or a year I will feel like reading the Esslemont books and Erickson's new one.
I am kind of interested in returning to the Malazan world, but the books are so dense and sort of non-relaxing to read that I still can't convince myself to get into them unless they are telling a story of one of the characters I really like. Give me an Icarium book, or even a Karsa book and I'm there. A whole cast of new characters, I'm still ehh. Maybe in 6 months or a year I will feel like reading the Esslemont books and Erickson's new one.
Erickson's second new trilogy will apparently follow Karsa. But that's 2+ years from now.
It's the image which the Seer projected, not the Seer itself.
Pannion had the image of a talking corpse for the Seer. Both to protect the fact that it was a Jaghut, and one would assume for the purpose of instilling fear.
Stolen from the reread:
Toc meets the Seer. He sees “a corpse, yet a creature dwelt within the husk, animating it . . . Two beings, the living hiding behind the dead.”
ah that would explain it. For some reason I always pictured The Seer wearing the skin of an old man like the giant cockroach in Men in Black. which is close but wrong
Just got done reading Forge of Darkness and damn this is going to be such a good trilogy.
I loved all the explanations it provided for what the "elder gods" are actually, and how magic was born into the world.
So K'Rul showing up as a an old woman in OST makes sense, seeing as the Azanthai can become just about anything.
It's going to be interesting in seeing how much he shows, like I wonder just which Azanthai creates humanity,Imass,or K'Chain Che'Malle as they don't seem to exist yet.
Or if it will get to shadow being shattered and why that happened.
and my greatest hope is that Kallor is around somewhere, but I doubt it as he seems to be a bit younger then the events of this trilogy
Forge of Darkness threw me in how different it was from the prehistory I had envisioned reading MBotF. But I liked it a lot! Is another one coming this year? I think Esselmont is due with another book fairly soon as well.
Blood and Bone by Esslemont was just released on dec 10th, at least in canada anyway i think you guys down south wait a little longer. Was going to start that tonight.
The next book in the Kharkanas trilogy Fall of Light doesnt have a set release yet, but i expect it this year sometime.
And then i need to track down a copy of Worms of blearmouth, i forgot it was coming out and didnt preorder, might have to wait till it gets a rerelease.
Blood and Bone by Esslemont was just released on dec 10th, at least in canada anyway i think you guys down south wait a little longer. Was going to start that tonight.
The next book in the Kharkanas trilogy Fall of Light doesnt have a set release yet, but i expect it this year sometime.
And then i need to track down a copy of Worms of blearmouth, i forgot it was coming out and didnt preorder, might have to wait till it gets a rerelease.
May 21 The US publisher had gotten good with nearly simultaneous releases for Erikson's stuff, guess Esselmont doesn't get that treatment.
Just started this series, it's great. Already on the 3rd book, fun times.
Well you got over the hardest bit of the very slow start in the first book, now your in for one crazy ride. Don't forget to also check out the books by Ian. C. Esslemont and the short stories by Erikson are also quite excellent.
and then when your all done, you get to read the whole thing over again and catch all the foreshadowing and little side bits that only make sense when you know the whole story and world. It's almost better then the first time reading it.
WulfDisciple of TzeentchThe Void... (New Jersey)Registered Userregular
I have to say that I have been enjoying the hell out of these books. Why they haven't gotten as much attention as the Game of Thrones boggles my mind :P
Posts
It's currently still ongoing, he's taking a break from answering, but seems hellbent on addressing every single post in the thread, so if you want your questions, get 'em in while it's hot.
I'll start with things I like:
Picker Blend and the other people at Kruls Bar. there always entertaining and some of my favourite characters.
Raest is still good, still has Fluffy the cat
The Moranth. They just get shit done, we find out why in one of the earlier books someone said the treaty with them is breaking down.
Now things I didn't like:
The new Tyrant of Darujhistan and his magical teleporting minions manage to
Whats going to happen with Orchid
Whats the deal with the silver metal
Why are the Rhyvi now suddenly a horse based culture like mongols when previously they weren't.
Kruppe
I am slowly catching up to the Tor reread. I'm near the end of Memories of Ice.
The Tor reread is really good. Each post is 1 chapter, they give a synopsis, then a newbie reader's reactions along with a veteran reader's reactions and analysis. The comments are generally pretty good too. They've managed to have a Q&A with Erikson at the end of each book, too. It slows down my reading speed to alternate between the book and the blog, which helps things sink in better. I normally read Malazan books pretty fast, which doesn't work real well for remembering everything.
Just finished it on my vacation. I rather enjoyed it, and found it to be ICE's most consistent offering, but I appear to be easily pleased with these things. :P
Agreed across most of the stuff - I really enjoyed basically everything having to do with the Seguleh or the Moranth, bar none.
Now things I didn't like:
The Scorch/Leff thing, I think had more to do with the crossbow bolts which were used - they're some special way to be able to damage it when normally physical attacks would have been useless, but I didn't really get where they came from other than Kruppe being involved. It wasn't well explained. Kruppe's dancing was simply keeping him from putting the mask on someone else, but once more, not terribly well explained. I think that what we were to take from it is that the bolts damaged it enough that it was unable to actually do the sort of "suffocation" bit it did at the beginning of the book, which allowed them to trap it within the sarcophagus (?) that Barathol made and that was lowered into the random well outside of Daru
The Seguleh bit...meh. I just kinda accepted that stuff because the majority of the time swordsmen wouldn't be anywhere near what we see in this series ANYWAY, so you kinda have to take it in stride.
They were always nomadic herders, and there are plenty of references to horseflesh and such in previous novels. We just never really saw them "go to war" proper in the past. This one's not really a problem so much as not picking up on subtext in previous novels since we never saw them fight.
To the former, I have absolutely no idea where you picked that up from. He's not. To the latter, I think so, yeah.
Only real stuff I thought was off about the book:
K'rul being a female all of a sudden for no apparent reason. It was out of the blue and purposeless, and frankly could have been done without.
The whole "Shores of Creation" thing was neat, but just...didn't seem to "fit" with the rest of the series' mythos. Mind you, it's not like there's not plenty of random stuff cribbed together to begin with, but adding something like that at this late stage felt a tad off. Similarly, how the hell did Kiska get back there at the end?
At any rate, I thought that the quality of writing was by far ICE's best offering. There didn't seem to be the requisite unrelated character plotline this time - everything tied together rather nicely by the end of things. There's just some stuff which didn't really mesh with what we knew from previous books and that's just disappointing.
The build of the novel, quality of paper, font, etc is all excellent. The cover image is supurb, as has been posted here before. But while GotM had 6 images excluding the cover (7 for the lettered, where the additional image is quite neat - not sure if it's been posted here before. The Siege atPale:)
DG only has 4. The quality of the four are decent, although their placement is a tad off - the first one is spot on:
directly opposite the scene, the others are a tad more haphazardly chosen and are placed a good 5/6 pages after the scene in question - Icarium choking Iskrael Pust, the
So yeah. Feeling rather underwhelmed, particularly given the wait.
e: Found what must be the lettered version's additional image in this case, which is actually quite excellent. Doesn't help me any, though. :P
e2: Wait, there's also this image of the Silanda.
which I didn't see. Now I'm confused and perhaps a bit irritated if there were supposed to be more
The Tyrant being taken down by those shards feels more satisfactory
Cover art for the Forge of Darkness, and blurb:
I am steaming through Orb, Sceptre, Throne. Got about 100 pages to go. I feel like Esselmont's Kruppe is a little off from Erikson's. Maybe that's why he is used quite sparingly in this book. I do like his take on Spindle, Antsy, and Scorch and Leff though.
Forge of Darkness comes out in September, I think.
Didn't understand K'rul becoming a she. Don't know why that happened.
Kruppe was keeping Derudan neutralized with some mega-durhang I think. She never 'turned'. Were all there Torrud Cabal immortal former servants of the Tyrant then?
Lady Envy did nothing comprehensible.
Is Studious Lock some kind of Assail or demon? He doesn't seem to be human, or Andii, or any other known race.
Why was Tayschrenn replacing K'rul? Is this some plot from TCG that I don't remember? The Scimitar in the sky makes this book concurrent with DoD and TCG, right?
Do we know what happened to the old First or is that supposed to be mysterious?
Basically no one dies in this book, unusual for a Malazan book. The Second, I guess. I also thought it was a little odd that everyone is suddenly horrified by Moranth munitions. Maybe our POVs weren't hardened vets like most of the Bridgeburners.
Overall it was good. Think I liked Stonewielder better but I'm not sure yet.
Other stuff:
Folks are split on whether T'renn is replacing K'rul as Maker of Paths (potentially with Icarium's new warrens?) or replacing D'rek (which didn't occur to me at first and makes a LOT more sense). As to the why.....it's an ICE novel. Seems like we never get any whys from him
I think T'ren is replacing K'rul just because they did all that in the depths of K'rul's temple, and because at the very end we see him meet Kruppe in Kruppe or K'rul's dreamworld that those two met in several times in GOTM. The only problem is there is no apparent reason to replace K'rul.
I guess we did see Tayschrenn jump into D'rek's lair/hole, and have some kind of conversation. All her priests are dead, so maybe he's supposed to restart a new cult? Still, I think it's K'rul.
The K'rul thing was kind of weird but
It kind of made me question whether I was just inferring it wrong all this time but nooope, just some weird thing.
Asked Erikson about that in his AMA on reddit.
Spoilers through chapter 8ish
The biggest awesome moment was witnessing Rake and Caladan Brood's binding oath. I figured out who that was just before he said he name.
And all the Tiste seem to just be Tiste? Apparently they haven't divided into Andii/Edur/Liosan yet. There are hints of how that may happen, but as it is they all seem to be one race, one nation.
And I guess there are no gods, Elder or otherwise yet. Mother Dark is the closest thing, but she's really just Queen at this point. Grizzin Farl, Draconus, and I've heard snippets about K'rul and Errastas. They all just seem to be dudes hangin' out. I wonder if Mael will show up.
In other news, Malazan audiobooks are finally getting released. First novel clocking in at 26 hours. Means we might be seeing the last couple books in the series clock over 50 hours. Heh.
I feel compelled to share this for a single quote.
That's fantastic.
Erickson's second new trilogy will apparently follow Karsa. But that's 2+ years from now.
Stolen from the reread:
So K'Rul showing up as a an old woman in OST makes sense, seeing as the Azanthai can become just about anything.
It's going to be interesting in seeing how much he shows, like I wonder just which Azanthai creates humanity,Imass,or K'Chain Che'Malle as they don't seem to exist yet.
Or if it will get to shadow being shattered and why that happened.
and my greatest hope is that Kallor is around somewhere, but I doubt it as he seems to be a bit younger then the events of this trilogy
The next book in the Kharkanas trilogy Fall of Light doesnt have a set release yet, but i expect it this year sometime.
And then i need to track down a copy of Worms of blearmouth, i forgot it was coming out and didnt preorder, might have to wait till it gets a rerelease.
May 21
I really need to get around to reading Forge of Darkness, but I've got so many other stuff I'm reading which keeps making me push it off.
In other news, interior art for MoI has been released.
It's goddamn perfect, if a tad larger than I imagined.
Well you got over the hardest bit of the very slow start in the first book, now your in for one crazy ride. Don't forget to also check out the books by Ian. C. Esslemont and the short stories by Erikson are also quite excellent.
and then when your all done, you get to read the whole thing over again and catch all the foreshadowing and little side bits that only make sense when you know the whole story and world. It's almost better then the first time reading it.