Nebula "The Veil of Peace" in the last open spot. On my phone so the map is very very tiny.
The south end looks pretty appetizing at the moment. If Yssaril is given room to expand things will go well for the goblins.
Whilst we share this sentiment, we can't help but be distracted by the glorious might of the supernova placed in that direction. Maybe if the gods had deigned to help us resist the Nekros by placing it the other side of us, we may have been able to proselytise them sooner.
Hey Muaat- that reminds me. we should probably draw our borders as well. I honestly have no intention of opening hostilities with yourself and your very scary battlestation, and I'm not looking for your home system. If you wanted to head over and crush the very scary virus people before they attack you and steal your War Sun teachnology, I'd be happy to ally with you and provide material support (trade goods, my formidable influence etc).
I would take over no farther than the Tsion spaceport, and never have more than one space unit present there for so long as you remain friendly with me. And you would keep the war sun(s) away from our border and move it towards the Virus' border?
Nebula "The Veil of Peace" in the last open spot. On my phone so the map is very very tiny.
The south end looks pretty appetizing at the moment. If Yssaril is given room to expand things will go well for the goblins.
Whilst we share this sentiment, we can't help but be distracted by the glorious might of the supernova placed in that direction. Maybe if the gods had deigned to help us resist the Nekros by placing it the other side of us, we may have been able to proselytise them sooner.
That occurred to me a bit after the fact. However, as the only race that can fly through a Supernova, the Muaat must see that there are inherent tactical possibilities in the situation as it stands.
The Nekro Virus would like to suggest a far more valuable counteroffer to the Embers. Your insistance on clinging to a philosophy constructed by inferior flesh entertains the Virus and it would not entertaining to smother your light. The Nekro Virus would like you to consider an alliance with it instead of the untrustworthy Yssaril. We will acknowledge that our own borders will end at Garbozia and Dal Bootha/Xxehan and we will not encroach further onto any system you stake a claim to.
In return all we ask is for safe passage of our vessels through your space and we will likewise leave yours unmolested to travel through ours as long as our planets are left alone. We also pledge our aid in wartime should you need it, we need no planets only the occasional enemy vessel to plunder for their unique technological innovations.
We believe this can be a far more mutually profitable arrangement than what the Yssaril are offering.
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
The virus are scary and have every reason to double cross you as you are next to them and have the most formidable tech in the game to steal with a single victory. I, on the other hand, can provide goods, influence, and a knowledge of their action cards (followed swiftly by a stealing of their action cards).
I can give you my word I will not attack you unless you reneg on your alliance with me, along with that same word that I intend you no harm through my victory conditions. I believe you phallaed some, so you may remember my word, which I never broke (though I did weasel using silly promises), and I assure you I wouldn't break it here. I am open to discussions- feel free to take a seat at the table.
The virus are scary and have every reason to double cross you as you are next to them and have the most formidable tech in the game to steal with a single victory.
Keep in mind the Nekro don't need to win to steal a technology, they just need to destroy an enemy ship (even a single fighter), or an enemy ground unit. (They can also steal two in one activation if they win a space battle and follow on with a successful ground invasion against an enemy unit.)
And since we're discussing alliances, Naalu would like to propose a non aggression pact with the Nekro, sealed with Trade exchange. We don't have the most interesting tech in the world and we hope you go prowling elsewhere for your advancement.
-Naalu
We would like to express our confusion over "Technology" and the multiple different research charts expressed in the codex which seem both unintelligible and contradictory. Do we have only one research choice? How far are we to 2 movement War Suns? Which order are the technologies researched in? These are all questions to which we have no answer. So we take Warfare and let Vegnash sort it all out We also find the Yssarill claim of our outermost propaganda station as laughable as it is sad.
We do have these free brochures and accompanying boxes of matches if you wish to get started on your own system. There is no need to squander all the light.
We would be more willing to consider these offerings if they didn't seem as just supplications to not be burned. This runs counter to Muaat philosophy, and would require adequate recompense before we would consider.
El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
edited March 2014
They are specifically supplications to go burn the Nekro Virus before they devour everything. I can handle you if I really have to, but I'd much rather not be fighting with you while the virus is able to build up and then steal your death stars.
We fail to see why running straight into the flame would prevent the taper from burning faster. Surely a fighter loss to them in early battle just gets them the technology even faster?
We fail to see why running straight into the flame would prevent the taper from burning faster. Surely a fighter loss to them in early battle just gets them the technology even faster?
Good point.
GrimmyTOA on
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
edited March 2014
If you hit them before they get the production capacity to build war suns, then this is irrelevant. If you let them build up, they will become unstoppable. This is why I am bringing this up now instead of in a few turns, when it becomes less relevant.
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
edited March 2014
Basically, I am coming to this conclusion based on a few things:
- Nekro Virus don't need to research technology, so have a ton more resources to spend on murdering.
- Nekro Virus started this game beside the Muaat, which is basically worst case because they are trivially able to get the best technology in the game free and immediately be better at it then the Muaat themselves are until they research more.
- Nekro Virus is somewhat hemmed in in their starting spot. If a warsun were to move in their direction, they'd have to expand carefully. If a warsun were to go directly at them, they wouldn't be able to expand much at all.
- I am perfectly happy to support you and have no designs on any of your worlds (barring maybe the trade station), and am willing to compensate you for that (we haven't talked specifics yet)
I've never even seen this race before, so maybe I am overreacting. But I don't really think given the three things above that my offer of an alliance to at least slow them down is worth dismissing out of hand.
We would like to express our confusion over "Technology" and the multiple different research charts expressed in the codex which seem both unintelligible and contradictory. Do we have only one research choice? How far are we to 2 movement War Suns? Which order are the technologies researched in? These are all questions to which we have no answer.
[/b][/color]
The tech tree in the Shattered Empire rule book supersedes the one in the base rulebook, as it makes a few changes to the prerequisites. The final expansion adds 4 more technologies, one of each color but it does not change any prerequisites. You can find good fan made tech trees on BGG. To get movement 2 War Suns you need Deep Space Cannons, and the prerequisite for that is Hylar 5, the basic red technology that has no prerequisite. So, you are two techs away.
When researching tech you can take any tech you have the prerequisite for, or any tech without a prerequisite. The "basic" techs are Antimass Deflector (blue) Hylar 5 (red) and Enviro Compensator (yellow). You have the last one. The green techs start with Stasis Capsules, although that tech has prerequisites.
Hope this helps. If we're playing with tech alternatives can @MrBody point me to what we're using? I may have missed that in the setup post.
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
For the tech tree I'm just looking at the original post in the tech tree link. I assume this is the one we're using, with no additional info required.
MrBlarney linked our current techs in this post. Click on the current technologies link, find your race's colour, and the circle with a dot inside indicates your owned techs. You can research anything that follows from an owned tech (using a blue arrow -- orange arrows indicate multiple prereqs).
@discrider -- you, for example, currently know Enviro Compensator, Sarween Tools, and War Sun. That means that you could research any of Micro Technology (follows from Sarween), Stasis Capsules (from Enviro), Transfabrication, Hylar V Assault Laser, or Antimass Deflectors (none of which have any prereqs). For full movement war suns you need to go Hylar V -> Deep Space Cannon. We also each have a pair of racial techs we can research. These cost a premium above and beyond what we'd usually have to pay for a tech.
Yep. We're using the Standard Tech Tree for this game, and this image contains your starting technologies, indicated by racial colors. A blue arrow indicates a single or "OR" prerequisite technology to unlock (e.g. Cybernetics requires either Stasis Capsules OR Antimass Deflectors); an orange arrow indicates a multiple or "AND" prerequisite technologies (e.g. War Sun requires Sarween Tools and Deep Space Cannon). The bright symbols show which Technologies are currently known, while the faint symbols show which technologies a race can acquire.
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
If the Embers require additional assurances of the Virus' intention to honor any potential alliance then Virus will happily do so. The Virus understands that you are flesh and thus subject to fallibility unlike superior molycircs and alloy. However, surely the Embers can see the value of an Trade agreement to keep them flush with trade goods to make their continuing efforts to proselytize even more effective.
On a second note, the Virus agrees to the pact and the terms set forward by the Naalu Collective. Your sectors hold very little interest to us at this time and peaceful coexistance will be quite profitable to the both of us.
The Naalu Collective: Select the (5) Trade II Strategy Card. The Nekro Virus: Select the (4) Production Strategy Card. The Embers of Muaat: Select the (6) Warfare II Strategy Card. The Yssaril Tribes: Select the (7) Technology II Strategy Card. The Mentak Coalition: Select the (3) Assembly Strategy Card. The Xxcha Kingdom: Select the (1) Leadership Strategy Card.
One bonus counter is placed on each of the (2) Diplomacy II and (8) Bureaucracy Strategy Cards.
Order of Play
The Naalu Collective: (0) Trade II Current Player The Xxcha Kingdom: (1) Leadership The Mentak Coalition: (3) Assembly The Nekro Virus: (4) Production The Embers of Muaat: (6) Warfare II The Yssaril Tribes: (7) Technology
We offer our 2 for the Nekro 2. We offer our 1 to any race willing to offer their 2 in exchange. The Nekro, and whatever willing race offers us their 2 may also seek trade partners of their own and will not have to pay any tariff to the trade master for whatever trades they can secure.
Other trades can be proposed, and we will consider compelling offers.
We can offer one of our 2s to the Naalu for their 1 (as we realize that we firmed up our southern borders but didn't do the same to our north - and wish to establish peaceful relations) and our other 2 to someone willing to offer a 2 in return.
We would be willing to exchange 2s Xxcha, if we are unable to complete the aforementioned offer (Nekro/Naalu).
We would like to stress to the Nekro that our trade offer is accompanied by the previously suggested terms of non-combat.
Sorry got confused with who is who, if you guys would include something indicating which race you are it would help me out!
Naalu will conditionally approve Xxcha 2 for Naalu 1, which would allow Xxcha to freely trade 2 for 2 with the Embers if they desire, pending adequate and fair time for other players to speak their peice. If the Nekro go ahead and agree to the 2 for 2 with Naalu they would have permission to trade 1 for 2 with the Embers, and this would complete the Trade Phase.
The Nekro Virus is intrigued by the offer set forward by the Muaat and would like to propose an counter offer to the Naalu's where we would accept the Muaat's offer and in exchange offer our 1 to the Naalu in exchange for their 1 with an additional 2 Trade Goods to given to the Naalu at a later turn when possible.
The Nekro Virus is intrigued by the offer set forward by the Muaat and would like to propose an counter offer to the Naalu's where we would accept the Muaat's offer and in exchange offer our 1 to the Naalu in exchange for their 1 with an additional 2 Trade Goods to given to the Naalu at a later turn when possible.
No thank you. That offer is too risky for our taste.
-Naalu
Edit: If Muaat agrees, you're welcome to trade 1:2 with them. This would dovetail nicely with the Xxcha's proposed trades, and is the most lucrative deal the Embers can expect to have approved.
faintpremonition on
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El SkidThe frozen white northRegistered Userregular
The Yssaril offer the Muaat our 2 for their 2. We also offer the mentak our 1 for their 1.
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jakobaggerLO THY DREAD EMPIRE CHAOS IS RESTOREDRegistered Userregular
I'll go for that, @El Skid . I will trade my other 1 for 1 with anyone willing. @faintpremonition what would you want for approving this? I'm unlikely to agree to anything higher than a 1 trade good fee per agreement, to be paid when I'm first able. Maybe you have some ideas though.
Whilst we do not feel that the Naalu's offerings stand particularly straight in the light of Vegnash, if the Nekros cannot bend their will, we will be forced to accept Muaat [2,2] --> Xxcha[2], Nekros[1] should the other parties wish it.
The Xxcha have no issues with accepting the proposed deals involving us.
To wit:
Xxcha 2 <=> Muaat 2
Xxcha 2 <=> Naalu 1
Our acceptance of the second is predicated on the Naalu approving the first (and Naalu's approval of the first is, we think, predicated on our presentation of the second).
It's complicated.
Also, the races in this game have an odd predilection for double lettered names.
Posts
Whilst we share this sentiment, we can't help but be distracted by the glorious might of the supernova placed in that direction. Maybe if the gods had deigned to help us resist the Nekros by placing it the other side of us, we may have been able to proselytise them sooner.
Hey Muaat- that reminds me. we should probably draw our borders as well. I honestly have no intention of opening hostilities with yourself and your very scary battlestation, and I'm not looking for your home system. If you wanted to head over and crush the very scary virus people before they attack you and steal your War Sun teachnology, I'd be happy to ally with you and provide material support (trade goods, my formidable influence etc).
I would take over no farther than the Tsion spaceport, and never have more than one space unit present there for so long as you remain friendly with me. And you would keep the war sun(s) away from our border and move it towards the Virus' border?
What do you say?
That occurred to me a bit after the fact. However, as the only race that can fly through a Supernova, the Muaat must see that there are inherent tactical possibilities in the situation as it stands.
The Nekro Virus would like to suggest a far more valuable counteroffer to the Embers. Your insistance on clinging to a philosophy constructed by inferior flesh entertains the Virus and it would not entertaining to smother your light. The Nekro Virus would like you to consider an alliance with it instead of the untrustworthy Yssaril. We will acknowledge that our own borders will end at Garbozia and Dal Bootha/Xxehan and we will not encroach further onto any system you stake a claim to.
In return all we ask is for safe passage of our vessels through your space and we will likewise leave yours unmolested to travel through ours as long as our planets are left alone. We also pledge our aid in wartime should you need it, we need no planets only the occasional enemy vessel to plunder for their unique technological innovations.
We believe this can be a far more mutually profitable arrangement than what the Yssaril are offering.
I can give you my word I will not attack you unless you reneg on your alliance with me, along with that same word that I intend you no harm through my victory conditions. I believe you phallaed some, so you may remember my word, which I never broke (though I did weasel using silly promises), and I assure you I wouldn't break it here. I am open to discussions- feel free to take a seat at the table.
Keep in mind the Nekro don't need to win to steal a technology, they just need to destroy an enemy ship (even a single fighter), or an enemy ground unit. (They can also steal two in one activation if they win a space battle and follow on with a successful ground invasion against an enemy unit.)
And since we're discussing alliances, Naalu would like to propose a non aggression pact with the Nekro, sealed with Trade exchange. We don't have the most interesting tech in the world and we hope you go prowling elsewhere for your advancement.
-Naalu
So we take Warfare and let Vegnash sort it all out
We also find the Yssarill claim of our outermost propaganda station as laughable as it is sad.
We do have these free brochures and accompanying boxes of matches if you wish to get started on your own system. There is no need to squander all the light.
Muaat, we did not make our offer lightly. We "claim" nothing, but wish to negotiate. Are you willing to talk?
Good point.
- Nekro Virus don't need to research technology, so have a ton more resources to spend on murdering.
- Nekro Virus started this game beside the Muaat, which is basically worst case because they are trivially able to get the best technology in the game free and immediately be better at it then the Muaat themselves are until they research more.
- Nekro Virus is somewhat hemmed in in their starting spot. If a warsun were to move in their direction, they'd have to expand carefully. If a warsun were to go directly at them, they wouldn't be able to expand much at all.
- I am perfectly happy to support you and have no designs on any of your worlds (barring maybe the trade station), and am willing to compensate you for that (we haven't talked specifics yet)
I've never even seen this race before, so maybe I am overreacting. But I don't really think given the three things above that my offer of an alliance to at least slow them down is worth dismissing out of hand.
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_minisite_sec.asp?eidm=21&esem=4
The tech tree in the Shattered Empire rule book supersedes the one in the base rulebook, as it makes a few changes to the prerequisites. The final expansion adds 4 more technologies, one of each color but it does not change any prerequisites. You can find good fan made tech trees on BGG. To get movement 2 War Suns you need Deep Space Cannons, and the prerequisite for that is Hylar 5, the basic red technology that has no prerequisite. So, you are two techs away.
When researching tech you can take any tech you have the prerequisite for, or any tech without a prerequisite. The "basic" techs are Antimass Deflector (blue) Hylar 5 (red) and Enviro Compensator (yellow). You have the last one. The green techs start with Stasis Capsules, although that tech has prerequisites.
Hope this helps. If we're playing with tech alternatives can @MrBody point me to what we're using? I may have missed that in the setup post.
@discrider -- you, for example, currently know Enviro Compensator, Sarween Tools, and War Sun. That means that you could research any of Micro Technology (follows from Sarween), Stasis Capsules (from Enviro), Transfabrication, Hylar V Assault Laser, or Antimass Deflectors (none of which have any prereqs). For full movement war suns you need to go Hylar V -> Deep Space Cannon. We also each have a pair of racial techs we can research. These cost a premium above and beyond what we'd usually have to pay for a tech.
@GrimmyTOA
@MrBlarney
On a second note, the Virus agrees to the pact and the terms set forward by the Naalu Collective. Your sectors hold very little interest to us at this time and peaceful coexistance will be quite profitable to the both of us.
The Naalu Collective: Select the (5) Trade II Strategy Card.
The Nekro Virus: Select the (4) Production Strategy Card.
The Embers of Muaat: Select the (6) Warfare II Strategy Card.
The Yssaril Tribes: Select the (7) Technology II Strategy Card.
The Mentak Coalition: Select the (3) Assembly Strategy Card.
The Xxcha Kingdom: Select the (1) Leadership Strategy Card.
One bonus counter is placed on each of the (2) Diplomacy II and (8) Bureaucracy Strategy Cards.
Order of Play
The Naalu Collective: (0) Trade II Current Player
The Xxcha Kingdom: (1) Leadership
The Mentak Coalition: (3) Assembly
The Nekro Virus: (4) Production
The Embers of Muaat: (6) Warfare II
The Yssaril Tribes: (7) Technology
Naalu play trade and collect 3 trade goods.
We offer our 2 for the Nekro 2. We offer our 1 to any race willing to offer their 2 in exchange. The Nekro, and whatever willing race offers us their 2 may also seek trade partners of their own and will not have to pay any tariff to the trade master for whatever trades they can secure.
Other trades can be proposed, and we will consider compelling offers.
We counter-offer the Nekro our 2 for their own, and offer Naalu the other 2 for their 2.
We would like to stress to the Nekro that our trade offer is accompanied by the previously suggested terms of non-combat.
Naalu will conditionally approve Xxcha 2 for Naalu 1, which would allow Xxcha to freely trade 2 for 2 with the Embers if they desire, pending adequate and fair time for other players to speak their peice. If the Nekro go ahead and agree to the 2 for 2 with Naalu they would have permission to trade 1 for 2 with the Embers, and this would complete the Trade Phase.
-Naalu
A single 1-good deal does me no benefit.
No thank you. That offer is too risky for our taste.
-Naalu
Edit: If Muaat agrees, you're welcome to trade 1:2 with them. This would dovetail nicely with the Xxcha's proposed trades, and is the most lucrative deal the Embers can expect to have approved.
Yssaril [1] <--> Mentak [1]: Proposed, pending approval by Naalu
Xxcha [2] <--> Naalu [1]: Approved by Naalu, pending approval by Xxcha
Muaat [2] --> Naalu [2]: Offered
Xxcha [2] --> ??? [2]: Offered
Muaat [2] --> Xxcha [2]: Offered
Ysaaril [2] --> Muaat [2]: Offered
Mentak [1] --> ??? [1]: Offered
Muaat [2] <--> Nekro [2]: Rejected
Nekro [1] --> Naalu [1]: Rejected
To wit:
Xxcha 2 <=> Muaat 2
Xxcha 2 <=> Naalu 1
Our acceptance of the second is predicated on the Naalu approving the first (and Naalu's approval of the first is, we think, predicated on our presentation of the second).
It's complicated.
Also, the races in this game have an odd predilection for double lettered names.