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Claimants to the [chat]

EddyEddy Gengar the BittersweetRegistered User regular
edited May 2015 in Debate and/or Discourse
We as chatters are intimately familiar with succession crises, as foul pig-dog pretenders scramble over the dead OP's body to make the new chat.

Here are some of my favorites:

1066 - ENGLISH THRONE [The Norman Invasion]
CAST
Tostig Godwinson (by jealousy?)
Harold Godwinson (by council election)
Harald Hardrade (by right of conquest)
William II of Normandy (by papal allowance; by being a favorite of Edward the Confessor)

Wherein an early death of a childless king leads to claimants from all portions of Northwest Europe.

129 AC - IRON THRONE [The Dance of the Dragons]
CAST
Aegon II Targaryen (by being the strongest male claimant)
Rhaenyra Targaryen (by being the designated heir)

Wherein the practical concerns of agnatic-cognatic primogeniture are exposed.

1700 - HABSBURGS [The Spanish Succession]
CAST
Louis XIV of France (by hereditary right)
Joseph Ferdinand (technically second...ish in line)

Wherein inbreeding, promising not to inherit claims, and a giant empire can only lead to good things.

1455 - ENGLISH THRONE [The Wars of the Roses]
CAST
Lots

Wherein we learn that you should not legitimize your bastards, and that deposing your older brother may lead to a loss of stability in keeping your own line on the throne.

"and the morning stars I have seen
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
Eddy on
«134567100

Posts

  • simonwolfsimonwolf i can feel a difference today, a differenceRegistered User regular
    may your [chat] continue for a thousand, eight thousand pages

    until the chatters grow into boulders lush with moss

  • knitdanknitdan In ur base Killin ur guysRegistered User regular
    The [chat] is dead.

    Long live the [chat].

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    I think I cracked the code

    i might have randomly realized why the pa comics have slowly become oddly unsettling to me recently

    Gabe has used increasingly thin vertical oblongs for pupils over the last few months and the result is creepy

  • simonwolfsimonwolf i can feel a difference today, a differenceRegistered User regular
    Stannis Baratheon is the one true king of Westeros, also

    all hail his Mannis-ness

  • knitdanknitdan In ur base Killin ur guysRegistered User regular
    ...fewer

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
  • Apothe0sisApothe0sis Have you ever questioned the nature of your reality? Registered User regular
    Stannis King!

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Harald Hardråde for lyfe

    ftOqU21.png
  • Apothe0sisApothe0sis Have you ever questioned the nature of your reality? Registered User regular
    simonwolf wrote: »
    may your [chat] continue for a thousand, eight thousand pages

    until the chatters grow into boulders lush with moss

    May it be long and ever full of new posts

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    knitdan wrote: »
    ...fewer

    Pardon, your grace?

    ftOqU21.png
  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    Suriko wrote: »
    I reject your empires and substitute my own

    r-NAPOLEON-BONAPARTE-large570.jpg

    look the Russian winter

  • emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    How did Napoleon get the support of the French people and become emperor after the French mobs did the whole 'kill all emperors' thing less than a decade prior?

  • Apothe0sisApothe0sis Have you ever questioned the nature of your reality? Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote: »
    How did Napoleon get the support of the French people and become emperor after the French mobs did the whole 'kill all emperors' thing less than a decade prior?

    Stylish hat

    The French cannot help themselves.

  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    But from these countless evils we have been set free, by the help of Him Who though He afflicts yet heals and restores, by our most tireless Prince, King and Lord, the Lord Robert.

    He, that his people and his heritage might be delivered out of the hands of our enemies, met toil and fatigue, hunger and peril, like another Macabaeus or Joshua and bore them cheerfully.

    Him, too, divine providence, his right of succession according to or laws and customs which we shall maintain to the death, and the due consent and assent of us all have made our Prince and King.

    To him, as to the man by whom salvation has been wrought unto our people, we are bound both by law and by his merits that our freedom may be still maintained, and by him, come what may, we mean to stand.

    Yet if he should give up what he has begun, and agree to make us or our kingdom subject to the King of England or the English, we should exert ourselves at once to drive him out as our enemy and a subverter of his own rights and ours, and make some other man who was well able to defend us our King; for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule.

  • HaphazardHaphazard Registered User regular
    Ser Davos should be king.

  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Apothe0sis wrote: »
    emnmnme wrote: »
    How did Napoleon get the support of the French people and become emperor after the French mobs did the whole 'kill all emperors' thing less than a decade prior?

    Stylish hat

    The French cannot help themselves.

    This is like 90% of how it happened, absolutely

  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    Many succession problems seem to stem from unfulfilled promises not to inherit any claims on the throne

    Turkish succession and harem plotting seems to be the most fun way to go about all this

    "and the morning stars I have seen
    and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
  • cB557cB557 voOOP Registered User regular
    45d.jpg

  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    The fall of constantinople was an inside job, they say, what with a sally door being left open

    "and the morning stars I have seen
    and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
  • simonwolfsimonwolf i can feel a difference today, a differenceRegistered User regular
    edited May 2015
    Haphazard wrote: »
    Ser Davos should be king.

    He'd rule with a padded velvet glove

    what the realm needs is an iron fist

    Stannis for President 2016

    simonwolf on
  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote: »
    How did Napoleon get the support of the French people and become emperor after the French mobs did the whole 'kill all emperors' thing less than a decade prior?

    the entirety of the European Royalty freaked out when French went all Republic.

    Napoleon had been a kickass military commander and started winning some actual influence and power and money during the first and second coalition war.

    He became more popular than the current government at the time and pulled a coup. No one seemed to mind at the time because he was basically the best military man France had at the time and everyone wanted to kick the shit out of France.

  • SurikoSuriko AustraliaRegistered User regular
    edited May 2015
    emnmnme wrote: »
    How did Napoleon get the support of the French people and become emperor after the French mobs did the whole 'kill all emperors' thing less than a decade prior?

    Winning wars
    Bringing the (war) booty
    Fucking up Austria (the hatred of Marie Antoinette was partly because she was Austrian, they really did not like Austria)
    Good economy from enhanced trade networks within the empire, plus generous policies towards liberalisation of industry (before he got too big for his boots and tried to blockade English goods)
    Hilariously rigged referendums on his decisions (the plebiscite over whether he should become emperor was something like 95% in favour., even within Germanic areas he'd conquered)

    Edit: He also ran an extensive network of secret police, had dissidents frequently killed, utilised propaganda mills, and repressed any conquered states that so much as looked at him a bit funny. As laudible as his attitudes towards common law, infrastructure, and freeing of many germanic areas from the feudal system was, he was pretty much the leader of a harsh military junta in all but name.

    Suriko on
  • simonwolfsimonwolf i can feel a difference today, a differenceRegistered User regular
    When your options are either a half-mad follower of a fire and brimstone god who'll burn his enemies alive, or Stannis Baratheon, would you really choose Ted Cruz?

    Stannis for President 2016

  • HaphazardHaphazard Registered User regular
    simonwolf wrote: »
    Haphazard wrote: »
    Ser Davos should be king.

    He'd rule with a padded velvet glove

    what the realm needs is an iron fist

    Stannis for President 2016

    Brittle iron...

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Harald's epithet translates to "Hard-rule"

    He was first co-king with Magnus the Good for a year, when Magnus died Harald went about strengthening his position. He was rich enough to buy the support of most, and brutal enough to get those who would not be bought out of the way permanently.

    A veteran of the Varangian guard, he was a brutally effective commander. After a wark with denmark - he thought that there was no good reason why he should not also be king of denmark - he went about securing norwegian dominion of eastern norway, which was dominated by the danes who made good money from the trade there, very brutally. Hs small but highly competent army went through Viken (the areas west and east of the oslo fjord and skagerrak) and Opplandene (the Uplands, the lands... up from viken) beating down all resistance and, as the skalds put it, left the plows in the fields, meaning his men burnt all the grain and slaughtered all the cattle, so that the people there would have a hard time making it through winter, and if they did, they'd have no animals to work the fields with come spring. It's in this campaign that Oslo comes under norwegian control, having existed for about a century as a trading town, dominated by the danish.

    When later the english throne stood empty he thought, there's no good reason why he should not also be the king of england, and so he sailed over with 300 ships. It didn't go so well for him, but defeating him didn't go so well for Godwinsson either, as the victory was dearly bought.

    ftOqU21.png
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Napoleon knew style

    his plain greatcoat and plain hat made him stand out among his generals, gilded to the teeth, more than any amount of brocade would have

    ftOqU21.png
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    After a brief exile at the island of Elba, Napoleon escaped, with a ship, a few men, and four cannons. The King sent Marshal Ney to arrest Napoleon. Upon meeting the army sent to arrest him, Napoleon dismounted and walked into firing range, saying "If one of you wishes to kill his Emperor, here I am!" But instead of firing, they went to join Napoleon's side shouting "Vive l'Empereur!"

    What the hell? How did the people love him like that?

  • SurikoSuriko AustraliaRegistered User regular
    emnmnme wrote: »
    After a brief exile at the island of Elba, Napoleon escaped, with a ship, a few men, and four cannons. The King sent Marshal Ney to arrest Napoleon. Upon meeting the army sent to arrest him, Napoleon dismounted and walked into firing range, saying "If one of you wishes to kill his Emperor, here I am!" But instead of firing, they went to join Napoleon's side shouting "Vive l'Empereur!"

    What the hell? How did the people love him like that?

    Soldiers love a general who wins wars.

  • zepherinzepherin Russian warship, go fuck yourself Registered User regular
    hqdefault.jpg

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote: »
    After a brief exile at the island of Elba, Napoleon escaped, with a ship, a few men, and four cannons. The King sent Marshal Ney to arrest Napoleon. Upon meeting the army sent to arrest him, Napoleon dismounted and walked into firing range, saying "If one of you wishes to kill his Emperor, here I am!" But instead of firing, they went to join Napoleon's side shouting "Vive l'Empereur!"

    What the hell? How did the people love him like that?

    The people is one thing, the soldiers would have carried him on their backs barefoot to china. He was their man.

    ftOqU21.png
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Sending anyone but soldiers to arrest napoleon would have been a much better idea.

    ftOqU21.png
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Suriko wrote: »
    emnmnme wrote: »
    After a brief exile at the island of Elba, Napoleon escaped, with a ship, a few men, and four cannons. The King sent Marshal Ney to arrest Napoleon. Upon meeting the army sent to arrest him, Napoleon dismounted and walked into firing range, saying "If one of you wishes to kill his Emperor, here I am!" But instead of firing, they went to join Napoleon's side shouting "Vive l'Empereur!"

    What the hell? How did the people love him like that?

    Soldiers love a general who wins wars.

    See Caesar, Julius

    And a long list of Emperors thereafter :P

    Soldiers fight for a lot of reasons, but mostly to get paid and not die while trying to get paid more

  • SurikoSuriko AustraliaRegistered User regular
    For a third time a plebiscite is held to confirm another of Napoleon's changing roles at the head of state. Again the result, announced on 6 November 1804, is overwhelming (3,572,329 saying Yes and only 2569 registering No). It is fortunate, though predictable, that the result is so clear - because preparations are already almost complete for the great event of the coronation in Notre Dame.
    http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/PlainTextHistories.asp?ParagraphID=mek#543

    History being so kind to Napoleon isn't really an accident.

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    "vivre la france" is a good thing to repeat as you march grimly towards the enemy

    (I had a Fenrik who was a bit of a history nerd who got bored with making us practice standing at attention and marching up and down the square and decided to seize the opportunity to play with tin soldiers, with real soldiers)

    ftOqU21.png
  • zepherinzepherin Russian warship, go fuck yourself Registered User regular
    Suriko wrote: »
    For a third time a plebiscite is held to confirm another of Napoleon's changing roles at the head of state. Again the result, announced on 6 November 1804, is overwhelming (3,572,329 saying Yes and only 2569 registering No). It is fortunate, though predictable, that the result is so clear - because preparations are already almost complete for the great event of the coronation in Notre Dame.
    http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/PlainTextHistories.asp?ParagraphID=mek#543

    History being so kind to Napoleon isn't really an accident.
    Also French Conqueror, makes it sound more romantic, especially considering the recent French proclivities.

  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    anytime someone goes "France WW2 lol"

    I just go

    "And not to long before that a little Corsican guy used French units as the core of his army and conquered the majority of the world that mattered at that time."

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Suriko wrote: »
    For a third time a plebiscite is held to confirm another of Napoleon's changing roles at the head of state. Again the result, announced on 6 November 1804, is overwhelming (3,572,329 saying Yes and only 2569 registering No). It is fortunate, though predictable, that the result is so clear - because preparations are already almost complete for the great event of the coronation in Notre Dame.
    http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/PlainTextHistories.asp?ParagraphID=mek#543

    History being so kind to Napoleon isn't really an accident.

    History loves him because he made so much of it

    ftOqU21.png
  • bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Casa GrandeRegistered User regular
    Guilty Gear and its names

    QHmjjm4.jpg

    but we got Johnny yaaaaaaay

    lOJSYgP.jpg

  • zepherinzepherin Russian warship, go fuck yourself Registered User regular
    edited May 2015
    Trace wrote: »
    anytime someone goes "France WW2 lol"

    I just go

    "And not to long before that a little Corsican guy used French units as the core of his army and conquered the majority of the world that mattered at that time."
    I was actually talking about the last 15-20 years. WW2 is not recent. Except to @Chanus

    In WW2 France wanted to jump bad at Germany from the get, but Neville Chamberlain was a fucking pussy. Them getting steamrolled was just simply a byproduct of industrialization and superior production capacity.

    Recently though their attitude of appeasement and putting their heads in the sand is what annoys me.

    zepherin on
  • SurikoSuriko AustraliaRegistered User regular
    Trace wrote: »
    anytime someone goes "France WW2 lol"

    I just go

    "And not to long before that a little Corsican guy used French units as the core of his army and conquered the majority of the world that mattered at that time."

    If Charlemagne counts, they really did it twice. But it's arguable.

This discussion has been closed.