Apparently it is late-summer early fall now, which just sends me into a spiral of sadness. I just don't understand this at all: If the game was almost done last October, how the fuck does it suddenly need an extra year development time? It's not like when your planning this stuff out you "miss" a year that is needed, especially when all the reviewers are saying "This looks finished, Let us review it now!". I guess the only logical choice is Valve is delaying it for strategic reasons, but it is still maddening and ultimately saddening.
Edit: Didn't see the previous post about the delay, however the rest of my post remains valid.
Because Game Reviewers aren't developers, and more specifically, they aren't the developers of the particular game they're reviewing. Just because they think it's complete doesn't mean it is. Obviously Valve would show off the most polished portion to the reviewers but that doesn't meant he whole game is done. Especially now that Valve has control over the project. Their iterative process takes a lot damn time.
Fun Fact: I remember people saying Spore looked fairly complete when they showed it off at GDC 2005 when it was first announced.
Apparently it is late-summer early fall now, which just sends me into a spiral of sadness. I just don't understand this at all: If the game was almost done last October, how the fuck does it suddenly need an extra year development time? It's not like when your planning this stuff out you "miss" a year that is needed, especially when all the reviewers are saying "This looks finished, Let us review it now!". I guess the only logical choice is Valve is delaying it for strategic reasons, but it is still maddening and ultimately saddening.
Edit: Didn't see the previous post about the delay, however the rest of my post remains valid.
Well Undead Scottsman did pretty much cover all the bases I'll also chime in. The game comes with 4 campaigns and we have only seen one, and just now have screenshots of a second. (Which looks awsome!) So they can't be that close to finishing. Also I think they are still ironing out the zombie hud and other zombie type stuff. There is a reason that only human side was playable during those showcases. Also links for sweet cornfields with zombies.
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
Actually, they made a point of emphasising that they'll be showing stuff like that. Things like if you're a regular TK'er or shoot your teammates a lot and stuff. It's a way for them to combat griefers, because they acknowledged early on that griefers would pretty much target this game just to ruin your fun.
Of course, whether you get kicked or not is probably going to be an admin thing, but it'll at least give people an idea as to whether or not you're a major jerk.
Then of course there's the other stats it'll be tracking (and that they're mainly emphasising), like how many times you help out teammates, give away your only medikit, stuff like that.
this game looks pretty cool. eh, shoots zombies and doesn't afraid of anything.
I just wish I had friends to play it with
Psht. Steam means you don't need Real Life Friends, only Internet Friends.
Joking aside, I expect that we'll be gaming this stuff ON as soon as it hits. Most of my RL friends don't play Team Fortress 2 either, but that doesn't stop me playing with a regular bunch of people who aren't complete jerks.
this game looks pretty cool. eh, shoots zombies and doesn't afraid of anything.
I just wish I had friends to play it with
Psht. Steam means you don't need Real Life Friends, only Internet Friends.
Joking aside, I expect that we'll be gaming this stuff ON as soon as it hits. Most of my RL friends don't play Team Fortress 2 either, but that doesn't stop me playing with a regular bunch of people who aren't complete jerks.
I imagine it'll be pretty similar here.
I love being in the nerdiest dorm on campus. Every day is like a LAN war that you pay, like, $13,000 a year for.
this game looks pretty cool. eh, shoots zombies and doesn't afraid of anything.
I just wish I had friends to play it with
Psht. Steam means you don't need Real Life Friends, only Internet Friends.
Joking aside, I expect that we'll be gaming this stuff ON as soon as it hits. Most of my RL friends don't play Team Fortress 2 either, but that doesn't stop me playing with a regular bunch of people who aren't complete jerks.
I imagine it'll be pretty similar here.
I love being in the nerdiest dorm on campus. Every day is like a LAN war that you pay, like, $13,000 a year for.
Yeah Dorm's are the best for Lan's, unfortuantly I didn't get into res next year so I'm sad now this game would of been awesome to lan!
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
Reputation is a system that Turtle Rock have incorporated into Left 4 Dead to prevent certain people from ruining the games for others. In all basics, almost everything you do in-game apart from walking will show up on your permanent record as a merit or a demerit. This system differs between the Infected players and the Survivor players. There are three kinds of reputation affectors for the Survivors:
Achievements - These are difficult goals to achieve, and show your skill/luck while playing.
Awards - Good things you do that help the team and show your dedication to the core game mechanics
Demerits/Faults - Mistakes, faults, bad things. Generally anything that can be counted as bad is stuck here. Do not hurt your mates.
Survivor
As the survivor, teamwork is key, and the reputation system works around that. Examples of what will show up on your permanent record as a survivor are shown below.
Achievements
- Surviving a map without being knocked down into 'bleed out'
- Expert Headhunter
- Killing a Tank without any damage done by it to anyone on the team
- Completing a campaign without using the flashlight at all
- Finishing a map where no members of your team got a demerit
Awards
- Reviving a teammate
- Giving your health kit away to a mate in need
- Stopping a Boomer from vomiting with a melee attack
- Saving someone from a zombie attack from behind
Demerits/Faults
- Friendly Fire
- Jumping in front of someone's line of fire (reckless)
- Blocking a teammates escape, which results in them taking damage
- Angering the witch
- Leaving a teammate to die without helping them
- Blowing up the Boomer near teammates/yourself
- Letting infected into a checkpoint
- Having a medkit, but forgetting to use it ("Forgetful")
Infected
Infected gameplay is completely different to that of the Survivors, and their reputation system mirrors this. As an infected, it is much harder to rack up a kill, due to your weakness, thus the system works along the lines of how much damage and mayhem you cause amongst the survivors. It is broken down very much into base achievements because the infected are a difficult side to play. Below is some examples of what you can get merits for:
- Kill a survivor
- Explode on a survivor
- Taking out the entire team with a Boomer explosion
- Successful pounce-kill
- etc. etc.
It may seem unnecessary but, because of the relatively meager kill count that you get as an infected compared to a survivor, it is stupid to base the infected merits on kills alone. Mayhem and damage is the infected way, and thus that is what the merits revolve around.
Another feature is that while you're playing, and you earn yourself a merit/demerit, it pops up next to your name on the UI. Meaning that everyone knows who to thank/blame for who saved/shot them.
Also at the end of each map, at the checkpoint, a list of the survivors and what merits/demerits they have received so far show up on a scoreboard-type table on the screen. You can also switch between that scoreboard for each particular person and their permanent record.
The way this works is that, if you get those occasional players that just join to annoy and ruin the game for everyone, you can do something about it. Every time they do it, it shows on their record. So you always have the option of kicking the pesky bugger with 30 team kills and nothing else next to his name before the game starts, and thus before he can cause any trouble.
While they may not be as detailed stats as TF2 it seems it will give enough information that you can be able to tell if the guy thats going to be covering your back will actually cover it. However it does seem that it will give some interesting stats. How would you give a number to the amount of chaos the player creates as an infected?
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
While they may not be as detailed stats as TF2 it seems it will give enough information that you can be able to tell if the guy thats going to be covering your back will actually cover it. However it does seem that it will give some interesting stats. How would you give a number to the amount of chaos the player creates as an infected?
( (player speech volume) X (profanity levels) ) / time
I was really looking forward to this when they were talking about cross platform multiplayer, as most of my friends don't bother with PC gaming and only play 360. I'm still interested, but disappointed that I won't be able to play with/against my console buddies. Seems like a really fun idea for a game.
I just looked at a few new interviews (not much new info but some new videos) and I am getting excited. I was thinking about different tactics to use as the infected to cause chaos within the survivors group. I hope it doesn't get delayed anymore since it gives me something to look forward to this fall.
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
While they may not be as detailed stats as TF2 it seems it will give enough information that you can be able to tell if the guy thats going to be covering your back will actually cover it. However it does seem that it will give some interesting stats. How would you give a number to the amount of chaos the player creates as an infected?
( (player speech volume) X (profanity levels) ) / time
would be a good indicator.
That would be a good indicator for one moment but what about for an entirety of a game? How would you measure the fear created in the survivors from them simply knowing the player who has taken control of one of the infected is by far one of the most skilled infected players? They probably wont be screaming waiting for that player to strike, but there will be some fear like "when is it going to strike? It should have done something when that small horde of infected rushed us." Thats one thing that really interests me is that there might be players which survivors just are afraid to play against because of how they play. Like a player who doesn't attacl but keeps leading the survivors closer and closer to the witch and getting them to shoot close to the witch making it attack them. "What does this infected know about this area that we dont?" type thing.
Oh playing both survivor and infected sound so good and different.
Every time I hear someone talk about this game I get depressed because it's not out yet.
You should know well by now, no matter how cool Valve will ever be, their shit will always be released no earlier than 6 months after they first stated.
I haven't been too into the previews so far. I prefer Romero's headshots to the shoot-em-anywhere concept of 28 Days Later. However, watching the video clips show that it takes a ton of body shots to drop a zombie compared to a headshot which is enough to give me faith. I hope this game rocks.
I was really looking forward to this when they were talking about cross platform multiplayer, as most of my friends don't bother with PC gaming and only play 360. I'm still interested, but disappointed that I won't be able to play with/against my console buddies. Seems like a really fun idea for a game.
I wouldn't count on cross platform play. I read in an interview that they wanted to do cross platform play for TF2, but Microsoft said that they would have to use Games for Windows Live to do that.
I was really looking forward to this when they were talking about cross platform multiplayer, as most of my friends don't bother with PC gaming and only play 360. I'm still interested, but disappointed that I won't be able to play with/against my console buddies. Seems like a really fun idea for a game.
I wouldn't count on cross platform play. I read in an interview that they wanted to do cross platform play for TF2, but Microsoft said that they would have to use Games for Windows Live to do that.
I did some reading up a few days ago, definitely no cross platform. They were thinking about it, but it's confirmed that isn't going to be done. I do look forward to playing BIA:HH with my one buddy that has a PS3, though.
This game seems like such a truly cool idea. I hope they manage to pull it off and add new campaigns fairly regularly.
I was really looking forward to this when they were talking about cross platform multiplayer, as most of my friends don't bother with PC gaming and only play 360. I'm still interested, but disappointed that I won't be able to play with/against my console buddies. Seems like a really fun idea for a game.
I wouldn't count on cross platform play. I read in an interview that they wanted to do cross platform play for TF2, but Microsoft said that they would have to use Games for Windows Live to do that.
"Hi, we're Microsoft, and we'd like to intentionally CRIPPLE your internet gameplay so that people can pay us a monthly fee for the stuff everyone else allows for free."
Gah, no. Screw that crap.
Besides which there's always the whole balance issue, and in a game like this, I'd prefer it if they didn't hamstring the mouse controls alongside the internet functionality.
I was really looking forward to this when they were talking about cross platform multiplayer, as most of my friends don't bother with PC gaming and only play 360. I'm still interested, but disappointed that I won't be able to play with/against my console buddies. Seems like a really fun idea for a game.
I wouldn't count on cross platform play. I read in an interview that they wanted to do cross platform play for TF2, but Microsoft said that they would have to use Games for Windows Live to do that.
"Hi, we're Microsoft, and we'd like to intentionally CRIPPLE your internet gameplay so that people can pay us a monthly fee for the stuff everyone else allows for free."
Gah, no. Screw that crap.
Besides which there's always the whole balance issue, and in a game like this, I'd prefer it if they didn't hamstring the mouse controls alongside the internet functionality.
Y'know, I've been thinking about that. The best way to combat this issue is how Epic handled UT3 on the PS3 (which allows m&k). They have it set up so that servers can have m&k only, joypad only, or both. Of course, MS refuses to support m&k peripherals for actual gaming. I hated the idea of Shadowrun gimping PC players and boosting joypad players. I thought that was cheap. However, if MS made it so that the only way you could play with 360 users was if you were using a joypad, then that would fix things. You can call that gimping if you want, but it sets everyone on a level playing field without crippling or bossting aspects for either side. I imagine the UT3 method is what will be used for BIA:HH, since it is allowing PS3 and PC players to do multiplayer.
To be clear, I think the Games for Windows - Live service is a joke. They should get rid of Silver and only have Gold. If you just wanna play PC to PC then things should be as they always have been. If you wanna play 360 players, then a fee is reasonable. The thing is, I can't imagine anyone wanting to buy Gold service. The only draw for me is cross-platform, and I'm not interested if they gimp my play. MS should really consider the UT3 route for cross platform. Besides, there's, what? 3 games right now? Shadowrun, Earth Assualt, and Lost Planet? None of which I care for and none of which I'd be willing to pay a monthly fee to play online.
Anyways, I don't really want to derail this thread into cross-platform discussion. It was dumb of me to even bring it up. Just thought I'd throw this solution/idea out there to illustrate how it can be done without ruining anyone's gameplay.
Back on track, I saw that expected retail is $20-$40! :shock: If it was between $20-$30 I would pick this game up without question. $40, I'd like to try a demo first then make a decision. I find that pricing to be extremely accessible.
Posts
Because Game Reviewers aren't developers, and more specifically, they aren't the developers of the particular game they're reviewing. Just because they think it's complete doesn't mean it is. Obviously Valve would show off the most polished portion to the reviewers but that doesn't meant he whole game is done. Especially now that Valve has control over the project. Their iterative process takes a lot damn time.
Fun Fact: I remember people saying Spore looked fairly complete when they showed it off at GDC 2005 when it was first announced.
Well Undead Scottsman did pretty much cover all the bases I'll also chime in. The game comes with 4 campaigns and we have only seen one, and just now have screenshots of a second. (Which looks awsome!) So they can't be that close to finishing. Also I think they are still ironing out the zombie hud and other zombie type stuff. There is a reason that only human side was playable during those showcases. Also links for sweet cornfields with zombies.
http://www.gamestar.de/aktuell/screenshots/left_4_dead/52945/left_4_dead.html
Also the permanent record that players have is going to be great! "Oh look that newb loves to TK people, <kick>"
Valve are pretty much the only company I can think of that took 10 years to make a game (TF2) and still made it worth the wait.*
*Sorry Duke, wait your turn then we'll see.
I doubt that it's going to have stats that are much more detailed than TF2, so it's probably not going to show stuff like that.
Actually, they made a point of emphasising that they'll be showing stuff like that. Things like if you're a regular TK'er or shoot your teammates a lot and stuff. It's a way for them to combat griefers, because they acknowledged early on that griefers would pretty much target this game just to ruin your fun.
Of course, whether you get kicked or not is probably going to be an admin thing, but it'll at least give people an idea as to whether or not you're a major jerk.
Then of course there's the other stats it'll be tracking (and that they're mainly emphasising), like how many times you help out teammates, give away your only medikit, stuff like that.
I just wish I had friends to play it with
Psht. Steam means you don't need Real Life Friends, only Internet Friends.
Joking aside, I expect that we'll be gaming this stuff ON as soon as it hits. Most of my RL friends don't play Team Fortress 2 either, but that doesn't stop me playing with a regular bunch of people who aren't complete jerks.
I imagine it'll be pretty similar here.
I love being in the nerdiest dorm on campus. Every day is like a LAN war that you pay, like, $13,000 a year for.
Yeah Dorm's are the best for Lan's, unfortuantly I didn't get into res next year so I'm sad now this game would of been awesome to lan!
this game will probably take over my TF2 obsession as of now.
This is from http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=535896
While they may not be as detailed stats as TF2 it seems it will give enough information that you can be able to tell if the guy thats going to be covering your back will actually cover it. However it does seem that it will give some interesting stats. How would you give a number to the amount of chaos the player creates as an infected?
( (player speech volume) X (profanity levels) ) / time
would be a good indicator.
Steam ID - BewilderedRonin
That would be a good indicator for one moment but what about for an entirety of a game? How would you measure the fear created in the survivors from them simply knowing the player who has taken control of one of the infected is by far one of the most skilled infected players? They probably wont be screaming waiting for that player to strike, but there will be some fear like "when is it going to strike? It should have done something when that small horde of infected rushed us." Thats one thing that really interests me is that there might be players which survivors just are afraid to play against because of how they play. Like a player who doesn't attacl but keeps leading the survivors closer and closer to the witch and getting them to shoot close to the witch making it attack them. "What does this infected know about this area that we dont?" type thing.
Oh playing both survivor and infected sound so good and different.
2013
I wouldn't count on cross platform play. I read in an interview that they wanted to do cross platform play for TF2, but Microsoft said that they would have to use Games for Windows Live to do that.
I did some reading up a few days ago, definitely no cross platform. They were thinking about it, but it's confirmed that isn't going to be done. I do look forward to playing BIA:HH with my one buddy that has a PS3, though.
This game seems like such a truly cool idea. I hope they manage to pull it off and add new campaigns fairly regularly.
Steam ID - BewilderedRonin
"Hi, we're Microsoft, and we'd like to intentionally CRIPPLE your internet gameplay so that people can pay us a monthly fee for the stuff everyone else allows for free."
Gah, no. Screw that crap.
Besides which there's always the whole balance issue, and in a game like this, I'd prefer it if they didn't hamstring the mouse controls alongside the internet functionality.
Y'know, I've been thinking about that. The best way to combat this issue is how Epic handled UT3 on the PS3 (which allows m&k). They have it set up so that servers can have m&k only, joypad only, or both. Of course, MS refuses to support m&k peripherals for actual gaming. I hated the idea of Shadowrun gimping PC players and boosting joypad players. I thought that was cheap. However, if MS made it so that the only way you could play with 360 users was if you were using a joypad, then that would fix things. You can call that gimping if you want, but it sets everyone on a level playing field without crippling or bossting aspects for either side. I imagine the UT3 method is what will be used for BIA:HH, since it is allowing PS3 and PC players to do multiplayer.
To be clear, I think the Games for Windows - Live service is a joke. They should get rid of Silver and only have Gold. If you just wanna play PC to PC then things should be as they always have been. If you wanna play 360 players, then a fee is reasonable. The thing is, I can't imagine anyone wanting to buy Gold service. The only draw for me is cross-platform, and I'm not interested if they gimp my play. MS should really consider the UT3 route for cross platform. Besides, there's, what? 3 games right now? Shadowrun, Earth Assualt, and Lost Planet? None of which I care for and none of which I'd be willing to pay a monthly fee to play online.
Anyways, I don't really want to derail this thread into cross-platform discussion. It was dumb of me to even bring it up. Just thought I'd throw this solution/idea out there to illustrate how it can be done without ruining anyone's gameplay.
Back on track, I saw that expected retail is $20-$40! :shock: If it was between $20-$30 I would pick this game up without question. $40, I'd like to try a demo first then make a decision. I find that pricing to be extremely accessible.
Steam ID - BewilderedRonin
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/35433.html
They've said several times the game is complete they are just getting lots of people to play it before release so they can get feedback and tweak it.