Are you reading CRIMINAL? (Issue #2 on sale 4/9/2008 - Maybe?)

wwtMask · March 2008

My pull list at the LCS is shrinking to just three titles a month by the end of the summer, and Criminal is one of those three. I might not even be able to buy those three, but god damn it I will figure out some way to affor $3.50 a month for this book.

Robos A Go Go · March 2008

wwtMask wrote: »

My pull list at the LCS is shrinking to just three titles a month by the end of the summer, and Criminal is one of those three. I might not even be able to buy those three, but god damn it I will figure out some way to affor $3.50 a month for this book.

You could save $3.50 a month by switching to generic cereal and generic toilet paper, or unplugging all your electronics whenever they're not in use. That last one's also good for the environment!

And if destroying the planet is more important to you than reading comics, then you're just not the man I thought you were.

wwtMask · March 2008

Doesn't quite work that way. Any money that isn't going to bills and food and other necessities is going straight to buying things for my little girl. I think I'll actually have to decrease the amount of money I'm allowed to spend on eating out at lunch once a week (about 5 or 6 dollars) to afford the $10 a month I'd need to buy these comics. Comics or food, that is the question.

Robos A Go Go · March 2008

wwtMask wrote: »

Doesn't quite work that way. Any money that isn't going to bills and food and other necessities is going straight to buying things for my little girl. I think I'll actually have to decrease the amount of money I'm allowed to spend on eating out at lunch once a week (about 5 or 6 dollars) to afford the $10 a month I'd need to buy these comics. Comics or food, that is the question.

Peanut Butter and Jelly with fresh fruit and whole carrots on the side until your daughter goes to college! It'll probably be healthier than anything that costs five or six dollars a day too. You'll be leaner and well read.

Crimsondude · March 2008

Marvel.com has the release date for Criminal 2 #2 as "IN STORES: April 9, 2008".

Plan accordingly.

Lux · March 2008

They didn't have #2 today so I just bought #1.

It's pretty cool!

jkylefulton · April 2008

10 page colored/lettered preview of issue #2, on sale next week:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=preview&id=42&disp=table

JRosey · April 2008

Can't wait.

Sars_Boy · April 2008

okay if I pick up Criminal 2 without having read anything else will I be good?

I plan on picking up the trades but I can't find 1 anywhere, so I'm gonna order it from Amazon soon

jkylefulton · April 2008

Yep, you'll be fine.

Sars_Boy · April 2008

awesome

mugginns · April 2008

I picked up Criminal trade #1 and loved it. If the store still has trade #2 I'll pick it up this week when I go to get my comics and hopefully the new issue of Criminal!

jkylefulton · April 2008

http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/03/31/marvel-month-to-month-sales-february-2008/

02/07 —
03/07 Criminal #5 - 16,389 ( -2.6%)
04/07 —
05/07 Criminal #6 - 15,720 ( -4.1%)
06/07 Criminal #7 - 15,214 ( -3.2%)
07/07 —
08/07 Criminal #8 - 15,169 ( -0.3%)
09/07 Criminal #9 - 14,768 ( -2.6%)
10/07 —
11/07 Criminal #10 - 14,539 ( -1.6%)
12/07 —
01/08 —
02/08 Criminal #1 - 18,655 (+28.3%)
6 mnth (+23.0%)
1 year ( — )

02/08 Kick-Ass #1 - 47,841

Crimsondude · April 2008

Motherfucker.

jkylefulton · April 2008

It's not a bad little bump, but I really don't understand what Brubaker and Phillips have to do. I mean, it's probably wrong to expect similar numbers, since JRJR is a more popular artist than Phillips, and since it's a superhero book instead of a crime book, but....c'mon! A 30k gap?

Looking at numbers like that, or fuck, looking at the numbers that shit like COUNTDOWN does - I really don't know how creators handle it. I'd go crazy if my financial well-being rested in the hands of people that order 280,000 copies of COUNTDOWN in a month (or40-50k copies of each COUNTDOWN spinoff).

Crimsondude · April 2008

It's the genre. And people just sucking.

jkylefulton · April 2008

Oh, my WOWIO guy asked me if you were able to forward his contact information to Bru.

Munch · April 2008

You know, 18k really isn't bad. At all. It's basically an indie book that just happens to be published by Marvel, so for it to be doing numbers comparable to Hellboy and Invincible (which are considered smashing successes for their publishers), and outselling virtually the entire Vertigo line (excluding Fables) is quite a feat. It'd probably have to fall to around 6k to get axed, if Vertigo's cancellations are anything to go by.

Sure it sucks that KICK ASS is outselling it, but Millar's a one man hype machine working within a known genre, so it's to be expected.

jkylefulton · April 2008

Vertigo's cancellations are not anything to go by, since ICON and Vertigo have radically different deals - ICON pays for everything entirely out of the creator's pockets, whereas Vertigo is still under the financial umbrella of DC for marketing, printing, and everything else.

Crimsondude · April 2008

Oh, crap. I totally spaced on that. It was about the time I was earning the ring, so it just slipped through the cracks.

Anyway, the book wouldn't be cancelled by Marvel as far as I can tell. It'd be cancelled by Brubaker, et al. because they can't personally afford to publish it.

And God bless that volume 2 bump, but when I got that e-mail from Ed I nearly shit. "Oh, great. We get the last one-shot and then *poof*." Now, Criminal 2 #4 is solicited for June as part 1 of a 4-part arc. So things may have changed since that e-mail. I haven't contacted him since then to ask. A bump like that may, may, have been enough to keep Phillips paid. Close as I can tell, it'd take at least 20k a month just for Brubaker to make money.

jkylefulton · April 2008

Ah, I'll let my WOWIO guy know that you'll be forwarding the info shortly - he seemed very keen on CRIMINAL, and I know it's proving to be a viable distribution model for lots of creators (plus, you can find lots of stuff there, like the complete Alan Moore SUPREME run, all free, all legal).

Crimsondude · April 2008

Damn.

jkylefulton · April 2008

http://www.wowio.com

He's looking into getting a lot of out-of-print creator owned stuff from the 70s-now up on there as well - I mean, even if the downloads only translate into additional revenue equivalent to 1000 copies / month, it's basically free money for the creators (ie a way for creators to reap the benefits of back issues by cutting out the middle man).

Crimsondude · April 2008

Sent.

Munch · April 2008

jkylefulton wrote: »

Vertigo's cancellations are not anything to go by, since ICON and Vertigo have radically different deals - ICON pays for everything entirely out of the creator's pockets, whereas Vertigo is still under the financial umbrella of DC for marketing, printing, and everything else.

I would say Vertigo is even less lenient on books than Image, Icon, etc. Because like you said, DC has a lot more overhead to cover with promotion and such. As long as Criminal generates enough revenue for them to publish and distribute it, they won't cancel it. Books published by Marvel/DC under their main banners aren't afforded that luxury, as they're expected to not only generate enough money to cover printing, distribution, and the retailers, but they also have to make enough money to pay the creators and generate enough revenue to make the book profitable for the company.

Once again, look at books like Invincible, Astounding Wolf-Man, Atomic Robo, Powers, Dynamo 5, Noble Causes, Walking Dead, and others that operate under a similar publishing scheme as Icon. These books are selling 5-20k and are looked at as massive successes by both their creators and the companies that publish them. Unless Brubaker and Phillips have a serious addiction to gold-plated whores, the book should be generating enough revenue to pay them a decent wage. Even if it wasn't, Brubaker is writing a few high tier books that guarantee him regular pay and allow him to afford a pay cut on Criminal. Maybe Phillips demands more money than other indie comics guys like Mike Oeming or Ryan Ottley. I don't know. But going purely off the numbers, Criminal would appear to be a mild success, and certainly not the doomed, flaming ship sinking into the ocean that some people would seem to think it is.

jkylefulton · April 2008

You should probably read one of the Brubaker interviews posted in this thread, Munch. For example, the one on the first page, where Bru mentions that he doesn't get paid at all, and that they barely make enough to pay Phillips and the colorist for their time.

jkylefulton · April 2008

Brubaker wrote:

People think that because we're coming out of Marvel, that somehow that makes it successful. But it doesn't work that way. It really is based on sales. If the book doesn't sell, Sean and [colorist] Val [Staples] don't get paid. I mean, I still have not taken a dime on Criminal. I've either given it all to those guys or set it aside in, like, a rainy day fund for anytime the book doesn't make enough money to pay them. I just want the book to exist. I'm happy to write it for free.

Robos A Go Go · April 2008

Wow, Brubaker sounds like a stand-up guy.

Crimsondude · April 2008

He was a cartoonist. In theory he could do the art himself. But it pays to have a real art team onboard.

I'm not being pessimistic just because I am. It's mainly because this is the e-mail he sent me when I asked him about sales:

Me
Some friends and online acquaintances wanted me to ask you if there were any numbers on how well Criminal vol.2 no. 1 has sold since its release.

I hope it's been selling well.

Ed Brubaker to me

We've been getting decent reorders, but it's still an uphill battle, sadly. Have to see what the orders are for the next few issues to really know how it's doing.

Wildcat · April 2008

Wowio wrote:

Do I have to be a United States resident to sign up to WOWIO?
For now, WOWIO is only available to people living in the United States. Copyright laws vary by country and currently our licensing restrictions limit distribution to U.S. residents.

Dammnit!

jkylefulton · April 2008

http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=1719

Week-long Q&A with Brubaker at Ellis' WHITECHAPEL site. Check it out and participate!

Robos A Go Go · April 2008

I bought the first Criminal trade. Is the story found within meant to be self-contained, or are the loose ends revisited in subsequent issues?

jkylefulton · April 2008

I'd say both - you get a full story during an arc, but Brubaker revisits the characters later. For example, characters from COWARD show up in LAWLESS, and Bru has said that he has plans on following up on COWARD soon (one more self contained issue (#3), an arc with the cripple from LAWLESS, and then the COWARD follow-up).

tl:dr - It's very similar to the way Miller weaves characters in and out of various SIN CITY arcs. I hope that answers the question.

jkylefulton · April 2008

And an answer from Brubaker himself:

Bru wrote:

You can read them in any order. All the Criminal books stand on their own. That said, if you read Coward before Lawless, you get a few Easter Eggs in Lawless, basically. The main plan for Criminal was that each book would be completely new-reader friendly. If you're going to do crime comics, we figured, you need to keep them uncluttered for new eyes.

mugginns · April 2008

I actually won $30 from the comic store for guessing the right team in the NCAA tourney, so I picked up the 2nd trade of this. Look forward to reading it this weekend. Coward was really good, and I also have the 2nd monthly issue to read, but I don't want to mix up the two so I'll read the trade first.

jkylefulton · April 2008

You can read the new series before you read the trade, it won't mess anything up for you.

Personally, I think the latest issue is the strongest CRIMINAL story he's told yet.

mugginns · April 2008

jkylefulton wrote: »

You can read the new series before you read the trade, it won't mess anything up for you.

Personally, I think the latest issue is the strongest CRIMINAL story he's told yet.

Yeah what I meant is I don't want to get the two stories confused. I might actually go back and read Criminal #1 issue beforehand, because I read so much sometimes I confuse stories

jkylefulton · April 2008

Ah, right on. I understand completely.

Crimsondude · April 2008

Remember when I mentioned REAL ownership and control a minute ago? If I had done Sleeper creator-owned, I'd be a multimillionaire by now.

!!

I love the title in this Q:

Ed,
I really enjoyed "A Complete Lowlife" (with thanks to ye olde artbomb for pointing me towards it). Will there ever be a continuation of your pseudo-autobiography? Perhaps "A Comic Highlife" (lame, I know), which would chronicle your outstanding success?

The Geebs That Is A Pony · April 2008

Success is kind of boring, so I bet he won't!

Penny Arcade

Are you reading CRIMINAL? (Issue #2 on sale 4/9/2008 - Maybe?)

Posts