Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

Cut Party Subsidies? We cut you real bad maan. Canadian Politics within.

TheCrumblyCrackerTheCrumblyCracker Registered User
edited December 2008 in Debate and/or Discourse
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/08/29/election-october.html

Also it should be noted that we have a Prime Minister, not a President. Oh Obama!

Too long? Did not read?
"Harper is set to trigger an election call for Oct 14th"

To my knowledge, Harper wants to get rid of this silly Minority Government and show Canada what he can do as his party will sweep everyone else away, turning Canada into a FEAROCRACY RUN WITH TERROR BY THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY OF CANADA!

THE MAJOR CONTENDERS ( All Information shamelessly stolen from the Internet, mostly Wikipedia)

The Major Contenders are the ones that actually own seats in the House of Commons; all other parties have absolutely no say in Canadian politics on the Federal level. Or something.

The Conservative Party of Canada
( Formerly Progressive Conservative Party of Canada)
Formed in 2003 when The Canadian Alliance (Redneck Farmer Westies, formerly the Canadian Reform Conservative Alliance) joined up with the Progressive Conservatives. Kind of Centre Right on Economic issues, kind of center with Social issues.

The new Conservative Party is an amalgam of two contrasting views about conservatism in Canada. Historically, the Progressive Conservatives touted traditional Red Tory ideals like state funded social programs, rejected closer ties with the United States and attempted to model Canada after centuries-old British institutions. Western Canadian conservatism, embodied in the Canadian Alliance party, was more inspired by U.S.-based conservatism; it espoused closer ties with the United States, Blue Tory conservatism, privatization, smaller government as well as reform and overhaul of political institutions (on the American/Australian model) and a decentralized federalism (a limited government in Ottawa with stronger provinces, as also advocated by Brian Mulroney). The new party generally supports a market economy approach to the economic sphere. The Conservative Party also provides a home for a multitude of other conservatives, such as libertarian conservatives, environmental conservatives, Canadian republicans, monarchists, and many others.

Since most of the MPs for the new party as well as the grassroots supporters come from the western provinces, its policy has significant influence from Reform Party of Canada(Who then turned into the Alliance)

000047-stephen_harper.jpg

Liberals
The only party cool enough to keep the same name for over 100 years, the Liberals have pretty much dominated the last 20 years of Canadian Politics. I guess they could be considered the "leftist" party in Canada, although sometimes I can't tell where the Liberals start and the Progressive Alliance for Conservatives in Canada begin.
“
The Liberal Party of Canada (French: Parti libéral du Canada), colloquially known as the Grits (originally "Clear Grits"), is a major Canadian political party. The organization is located in the centre of the Canadian political spectrum, combining a liberal social policy with moderate economic policies. Starting with Wilfrid Laurier in 1896 every non-interim leader of the party (excepting current leader Stéphane Dion) has served as Prime Minister of Canada. The party has formed the Official Opposition in the Parliament of Canada since February 2006. “

Also the most famous Canadian politician was from this party.

trudeau-300.jpg

Currently being led by this guy.

StephaneDion.jpg

(The guy receiving the sacred Canadian Beverage)

Bloc Quebecquois

"The Bloc Québécois (BQ) is a federal political party in Canada that defines itself as devoted to the promotion of sovereignty for Quebec. As such, it contests elections only in constituencies in Quebec. It holds as its goal the "defence of the interests of all Québécois in Ottawa"[citation needed] (notably by promoting, in the federal parliament, the consensus of the National Assembly of Quebec). This is complicated when the federalist Quebec Liberals form the government in Quebec."

I mean cmon? Their major political ideal is for Quebec to separate from Canada, and two referendums have already been voted on this issue, both obviously unsuccessful. They are the only Major Political Player in the Western world that is actively trying to get a portion of the landmass to separate from the rest of the country. In 1995 they held a Referendum to see if the people of Quebec wanted to separate from Canada (It wasn’t a real separation, more like we get to keep all the perks also fuck you guys) ( more info here at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_referendum,_1995 ) Basically, 50.58% "No" to 49.42% "Yes". Was a close call for Quebec, PQ blamed immigrants and non French speaking Qubecers.

NDP: New Democratic Party


“The NDP has policies that include..
• sweeping environmental protection [1]
• national water safety standards
• not reducing corporate taxes[2]
• reducing poverty in Canada[3]
• human rights protection
• expanded high-quality public transportation
• affordable and accessible high-quality post-secondary education
• public health care including expanded dental and prescription drug coverage,
• progressive taxation reform
• social assistance policies that reflects citizens' needs and assists their re-entry to the work force
• gender equality and equal rights for gays, lesbians, and minorities
• electoral reform that abolishes the current un-elected Senate and ensures more proportional representation [4]
• workers' rights including raising the minimum wage to at least keep up with the cost of living
• Aboriginal treaty, land, and constitutional rights
• balanced budgets [5]
• a foreign policy that emphasizes diplomacy, peacekeeping and humanitarian aid instead of offensive military action
• renegotiating the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) “

Basically the Left Wing Socialists of the bunch, they have never controlled Parliament, but due to the nature of Canadian politics, they have been able to have some influence in minority governments. Its first leader was Tommy Douglas, the founder of UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE IN CANADA WOOO
jack_layton.jpg


Green Party! http://www.greenparty.ca/
May_Elizabeth.jpg
Sex, drugs, rock and roll, weed, speed birth control.. minus the rock and roll.

After getting an independent to turn over a new leaf (HOHOHOHO I AM SO FUNNY), the Green party was able to secure a place in the national debates.
Shamelessly stolen from wikipedia.
"The GPC had originally adopted a form of the Ten Key Values originally authored by the United States Green Party.

The August 2002 Convention adopted the Six Principles of the Charter of the Global Greens, as stated by the Global Greens Conference held in Canberra, Australia in 2001. These principles are the only ones included in the GPC constitution.

An emphasis on a green tax shift in the 2004 platform, which favoured partially reducing income and corporate taxes (while increasing taxes on polluters and energy consumers), created questions as to whether the Green Party was still on the left of the political spectrum, or was taking a more eco-capitalist approach by reducing progressive taxation in favour of regressive taxation. Green Party policy writers have challenged this interpretation by claiming that any unintended "regressive" tax consequences from the application of a Green Tax Shift would be intentionally offset by changes in individual tax rates and categories as well as an 'eco-tax" refund for those who pay no tax.

The Green Party of Canada platform does promote some policies usually associated with the left. It calls for an end to homelessness via subsidized housing, promotes a guaranteed livable income, and opposes private sector involvement in public health, education and prison services.

As early as 2000, the party had published platform comparisons indicating the reasons why supporters of any of the five other Canadian federal political parties should consider voting Green. The Greens have always had right-wing, leftist and centrist factions that have been ascendant at different times in the party's history. Many Greens also claim that this traditional left-right political spectrum analysis does not accurately capture the pragmatic ecological orientation of an evolving Green Party.[13]

The ecumenical approach (expressing affinities with all Canadian political tendencies and making cases to voters on all parts of the left-right spectrum) has been advocated by those who believe their success can be measured by the degree to which other parties adopt Green Party policies. It has however not been discerned the degree to which this process has contributed to phenomena like the Liberal Party of Canada adopting several key items which also appear in the Green program, such as accelerated Capital Cost Allowance deductions restricted to sustainable technology only, and the adoption of the ecological and social indicators and green procurement rules Greens have long advocated. Neither have the relative degrees of influence been discerned which non-partisan environmental groups and the party's own Green wing have in developing the policies of the Green Party.

Under Elizabeth May's leadership, the Green Party has begun to receive more mainstream media attention on other party policy not directly related to the environment - for example, supporting labour rights[14] and poppy legalization in Afghanistan.[15]"
Other Political Parties Include:
( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_federal_political_parties_in_Canada )

• Animal Alliance Environment Voters Party of Canada (founded in 2005) - environmentalist, animal liberationist
• Canadian Action Party (founded in 1997) - Progressive, Canadian Nationalist
• Christian Heritage Party of Canada (founded in 1987) - Social conservative
• Communist Party of Canada (founded in 1921) - Communist
• Communist Party of Canada (Marxist-Leninist) (founded in 1970) - Communist/Marxist-Leninist influenced by Maoism and the ideas of Enver Hoxha
• First Peoples National Party of Canada (founded in 2005) - Aboriginal rights advocacy
• Green Party of Canada (founded in 1983) - Green
• Libertarian Party of Canada (founded in 1975) - Libertarian
• Marijuana Party of Canada (founded in 2000) - pro-marijuana legalization
• Neorhino.ca (founded in 2007) - Joke party.
• Newfoundland and Labrador First Party (founded in 2007) - Newfoundland and Labrador advocation
• People's Political Power of Canada (founded in 2006)- Social Conservative, Populist
• Progressive Canadian Party (founded in 2004) - progressive conservative, Red Tory
• Western Block Party (founded 2005) - western separatist and ultraconservative
• Work Less Party (founded in 2007) - Labour rights


Why should you give a shit?

You, Americans, literally buy like half of all our shit.

Also, we have an oil deposit that makes us the holder of the Second Largest Oil Deposit in the WORLD

Fellow Canadians, how will you vote this year?

TheCrumblyCracker on
«13456759

Posts

  • ProtoProto Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Asiina wrote: »
    Proto wrote: »
    Asiina wrote: »
    I used to live in Ottawa-South so it was a given that a McGuinty was going to win every election there. Then I moved to a different part of Ottawa and now I'm in John Baird's riding.

    John. Baird.

    I don't like Stephen Harper's policies but I can respect him as a person. John Baird, on the other hand, has no soul. The propaganda that gets left in my mailbox by him is sickening. I live in an area with a lot of seniors and all of the leaflets (I get one at least every other day) are fear mongering, hate filled notices designed to frighten seniors into thinking that hoodlums and immigrants are going to kill them in the night. It's truly disgusting.

    I am a true NDP dirty socialist at heart, but I'm voting liberal because screw John Baird.

    HA! You are totally in my riding. (Pinecrest/Baseline)

    I hate Baird with a passion. Such a douchebag.

    It wasn't anything I considered when moving here (Richmond/Carling) but when I started getting these leaflets I was like....fuck.

    At least it'll feel good to vote against him.

    It feels so awesome to write him a letter about some issue and get back a form letter in 5 months, let me tell you.

    and her knees up on the glove compartment
    took out her barrettes and her hair spilled out like rootbeer
  • DeciusDecius Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Albertan.

    Anarchist.

    Voting Green.

    Should be fun.

    camo_sig2.png
    I never finish anyth
  • ProtoProto Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Richy wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure income splitting for seniors went through. As for gay marriage, I never saw it as more than lip-service to the social conservative segment of his voter base. I mean, he promised a free vote, knowing full well that most of his MPs are for gay marriage and that even if, somehow, the anti-gay-marriage side won, there'd be no way for Parliament to ban it short of completely eliminating all marriages in Canada.

    oh, I thought you meant the spouse income splitting thing that was going around a year or so ago. That would have been sweet.


    I found the whole idea that Harper would threaten to take rights away from citizens just to appease his backwards, ignorant base a really horrible thing to do. Plus he opposed it the first time around too.

    and her knees up on the glove compartment
    took out her barrettes and her hair spilled out like rootbeer
  • Andrew_JayAndrew_Jay Registered User
    edited August 2008
    saggio wrote: »
    I'll be voting Green. Mostly because I'm a member of the party, but also because I think Elizabeth May is the best leader out there right now.

    I really hope they let her on the debates this time.
    I hope they pick up some votes too - if only to take the piss out of the NDP who coast on non-existent environmental record. Funny story - I got some junk mail from the Conservatives the other day and they included May and the Greens right along side the other major parties. Kind of surprised me - if they're taking them seriously, maybe it means they expect them to see some gains (probably at their expense too).

    Depends on where I get to vote, I might toss mine their way. Strong Liberal myself, but if my registration is screwed up and I'm voting in St. Paul's (one of the safest Liberal ridings in the country), Carolyn Bennett isn't going to need me - but if it's St. John's South the local Liberal has my support.

    Seriously, to continue my first point, fuck the NDP on the environment. Their Cap-and-Trade program is crap and Layton has so far gotten away lying about how consumers won't be affected. They will. At least Dion (note - I'm a strong Liberal but for God's sake, Dion has been useless so far - selling the Carbon Tax is his last chance) has admitted that it will cost consumers and has implemented measures to offset its regressive effects with reduced income taxes on lowest brackets and increased transfers to low-income earners.

  • TubularLuggageTubularLuggage Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    In spite of being a Libertarian, and really not liking Jack Layton, I'm probably going to be voting for my incumbent MP, Peter Stoffer, who's from the NDP (I'm in Sackville-Eastern Shore in Nova Scotia btw). My reasons include;

    - There's no Libertarian candidate in my riding, and the Canadian Libertarian party itself is a small, unorganized mess.
    - Dion seems like an indecisive pussy, which was confirmed when he kept getting his party to skip votes to avoid bringing down the government, allowing some outright scary legislation move on.
    - Harper's government was behind said scary legislation. Just look up bills C-51 and C-61 for examples.
    - Peter Stoffer is fucking awesome. I've personally met him, and he's a good man. He also does a hell of a job representing his constituents, and actually personally called me back when I wrote to him about legislation I was concerned about (again, see C-51 and C-61, both of which he opposes). We could use more MPs like him.
    - Stoffer is going to win by a landslide regardless of how I vote, like he did in 2000, 2004, and 2006. Again, he's awesome, and people love him.

  • saggiosaggio Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Andrew_Jay wrote: »
    saggio wrote: »
    I'll be voting Green. Mostly because I'm a member of the party, but also because I think Elizabeth May is the best leader out there right now.

    I really hope they let her on the debates this time.
    I hope they pick up some votes too - if only to take the piss out of the NDP who coast on non-existent environmental record. Funny story - I got some junk mail from the Conservatives the other day and they included May and the Greens right along side the other major parties. Kind of surprised me - if they're taking them seriously, maybe it means they expect them to see some gains (probably at their expense too).

    Depends on where I get to vote, I might toss mine their way. Strong Liberal myself, but if my registration is screwed up and I'm voting in St. Paul's (one of the safest Liberal ridings in the country), Carolyn Bennett isn't going to need me - but if it's St. John's South the local Liberal has my support.

    Seriously, to continue my first point, fuck the NDP on the environment. Their Cap-and-Trade program is crap and Layton has so far gotten away lying about how consumers won't be affected. They will. At least Dion (note - I'm a strong Liberal but for God's sake, Dion has been useless so far - selling the Carbon Tax is his last chance) has admitted that it will cost consumers and has implemented measures to offset its regressive effects with reduced income taxes on lowest brackets and increased transfers to low-income earners.

    If you are in a safe Liberal or Conservative riding, I encourage everyone to vote for the Greens. Every vote gives the party $1.50 in funding from Elections Canada after 1 million votes, which happened for the first time in the last election. By increasing our total number of votes, even if there isn't a breakthrough in seats, will go a long way to making the party a better contender in the future.

    Also: I'm glad we're all in agreement about the NDP. Fuck those guys.

    3DS: 0232-9436-6893
  • TubularLuggageTubularLuggage Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    saggio wrote: »
    Andrew_Jay wrote: »
    saggio wrote: »
    I'll be voting Green. Mostly because I'm a member of the party, but also because I think Elizabeth May is the best leader out there right now.

    I really hope they let her on the debates this time.
    I hope they pick up some votes too - if only to take the piss out of the NDP who coast on non-existent environmental record. Funny story - I got some junk mail from the Conservatives the other day and they included May and the Greens right along side the other major parties. Kind of surprised me - if they're taking them seriously, maybe it means they expect them to see some gains (probably at their expense too).

    Depends on where I get to vote, I might toss mine their way. Strong Liberal myself, but if my registration is screwed up and I'm voting in St. Paul's (one of the safest Liberal ridings in the country), Carolyn Bennett isn't going to need me - but if it's St. John's South the local Liberal has my support.

    Seriously, to continue my first point, fuck the NDP on the environment. Their Cap-and-Trade program is crap and Layton has so far gotten away lying about how consumers won't be affected. They will. At least Dion (note - I'm a strong Liberal but for God's sake, Dion has been useless so far - selling the Carbon Tax is his last chance) has admitted that it will cost consumers and has implemented measures to offset its regressive effects with reduced income taxes on lowest brackets and increased transfers to low-income earners.

    If you are in a safe Liberal or Conservative riding, I encourage everyone to vote for the Greens. Every vote gives the party $1.50 in funding from Elections Canada after 1 million votes, which happened for the first time in the last election. By increasing our total number of votes, even if there isn't a breakthrough in seats, will go a long way to making the party a better contender in the future.

    Also: I'm glad we're all in agreement about the NDP. Fuck those guys.

    Or, if you're in a safe riding, and there's a Libertarian candidate on the ballot, vote for them. We are in serious need of funding.

  • Bryse EayoBryse Eayo Registered User
    edited August 2008
    Asiina wrote: »
    I used to live in Ottawa-South so it was a given that a McGuinty was going to win every election there. Then I moved to a different part of Ottawa and now I'm in John Baird's riding.

    John. Baird.

    I don't like Stephen Harper's policies but I can respect him as a person. John Baird, on the other hand, has no soul. The propaganda that gets left in my mailbox by him is sickening. I live in an area with a lot of seniors and all of the leaflets (I get one at least every other day) are fear mongering, hate filled notices designed to frighten seniors into thinking that hoodlums and immigrants are going to kill them in the night. It's truly disgusting.

    I am a true NDP dirty socialist at heart, but I'm voting liberal because screw John Baird.


    Hey. Hey.

    I live in Gordon O'Conner's riding.

    I have to carry that shame every day.

    But yeah the election should be fun, seeing as it *should* be illegal. Hopefully that fact comes and bites Harper in the ass, though it won't be through any action of Dion.

  • Chake99Chake99 Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Or, if you're in a safe riding, and there's a Libertarian candidate on the ballot, vote for them. We are in serious need of funding

    Unless of course you think libertarianism is dumb.

    If there's an election I'm hoping for either a conservative or liberal minority. I actually fear what will happen if we get a conservative majority.

    But seriously, usually I'm a staunch liberal, and for the life of my I can't figure out why the fuck they picked Stephane Dion. Am I the only one who thinks he would be a miserable Prime Minister?

    Hell actually I'd hope for another conservative minority. Stephen Harper is by far a more party-head than any of the other candidates.

    Hic Rhodus, Hic Salta.
  • TubularLuggageTubularLuggage Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Chake99 wrote: »
    Or, if you're in a safe riding, and there's a Libertarian candidate on the ballot, vote for them. We are in serious need of funding

    Unless of course you think libertarianism is dumb.

    Well I was just jokingly playing off what the last guy said about Green Party candidates, but thanks for ruining the light hearted atmosphere for everyone.

  • LaOsLaOs Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Chake99 wrote: »
    Or, if you're in a safe riding, and there's a Libertarian candidate on the ballot, vote for them. We are in serious need of funding

    Unless of course you think libertarianism is dumb.

    Well I was just jokingly playing off what the last guy said about Green Party candidates, but thanks for ruining the light hearted atmosphere for everyone.

    I do not find the atmosphere ruined.
    Spoiler:

  • ZoolanderZoolander Registered User
    edited August 2008
    I think the Liberals would be running away with this election if it wasn't for Stephane Dion. Seriously, this guy speaks English worse than Chretien. What the fuck! He's just terrible all around.

    As it is, I'm expecting status quo. Hopefully Dion steps down and Ignatieff or somebody not-terrible becomes Liberal leader.

  • Chake99Chake99 Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Ignatieff is still pretty terrible, look up any of Rick Mercer's comments on the guy and he pretty much gets heaped with scorn for relatively good reason.

    Paul Martin was stronger than anyone the liberals have currently running in their midst in terms of prime-ministeryness... akthough he was a terrible campaigner (imho). I think its sort of a pity his liberals didn't form another government.

    Hic Rhodus, Hic Salta.
  • OberonOberon Registered User
    edited August 2008
    Here's hoping for a Conservative minority. Best Government Ever; tackling economic issues, too frightened to mess with social issues, and creating debate (such as it is) followed by compromise. I'll vote Lib again but since I'm in Calgary it's not going to matter much.

    Sorry Greens, but the Libs have years of experience successfully managing a deceitful, corrupt organization, which pretty much defines the political system.

  • oldmankenoldmanken Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I'll be voting either Green or Liberal, which will depend on the local candidate here. If the candidate here is appealing enough, I may even volunteer for the Greens.

    I think we'll see another Conservative minority though, unless Dion somehow develops a personality and runs a strong campaign. As others have mentioned, I fear the idea of a Conservative majority.... though I am not bothered by having them in a minority situation.

  • AzioAzio Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    At this point I would be willing to tolerate a Liberal/NDP coalition if it meant preventing another Harper government. The Conservatives need to be stopped before they can do any more damage.

  • DeciusDecius Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Oberon wrote: »
    Here's hoping for a Conservative minority.

    This. This is why I like our political system. A minority government keeps parties like the Reform-Cons from doing some really batshit insane things. Plus it makes for some entertaining television. Unfortunately it also stalls the government on pushing through good and decent bills, and pretty well means were guaranteed more elections then we need.

    Unfortunately with Dion having all the charisma of a cantaloupe, I'm worried that we are going to end up with a Conservative majority.

    camo_sig2.png
    I never finish anyth
  • CorvusCorvus Caw? VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Decius wrote: »
    Oberon wrote: »
    Here's hoping for a Conservative minority.

    This. This is why I like our political system. A minority government keeps parties like the Reform-Cons from doing some really batshit insane things. Plus it makes for some entertaining television. Unfortunately it also stalls the government on pushing through good and decent bills, and pretty well means were guaranteed more elections then we need.

    Unfortunately with Dion having all the charisma of a cantaloupe, I'm worried that we are going to end up with a Conservative majority.

    Man.

    Thats kind of mean to cantaloupes.

  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    [quote=Decius;6874015Plus it makes for some entertaining television. [/quote]
    The comments about the U.S.A. D.M.C.A. are N.D.P. B.S.
    Hehehe. I wonder how long he practiced to get it out right :P

    RichyFlag.gifsig.gif
  • Andrew_JayAndrew_Jay Registered User
    edited August 2008
    Chake99 wrote: »
    Ignatieff is still pretty terrible, look up any of Rick Mercer's comments on the guy and he pretty much gets heaped with scorn for relatively good reason.
    I know it's popular to see Ignatieff as some kind of crypto-fascist, but I kind of like him (voted for him in the leadership race two years ago). He's my kind of liberal - socially liberal and an internationalist.

    But if Dion can keep the party together through this election and make a good case for the Liberals (even if he doesn't get a minority government) all is forgiven. Though I guess it's kind of sad that all I can do is hope he doesn't wreck the party.

  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    The sad thing is that Dion is not a bad candidate. He's just unimpressive and boring. And as someone mentioned, he's got all the charisma of a cantaloupe.

    RichyFlag.gifsig.gif
  • Andrew_JayAndrew_Jay Registered User
    edited August 2008
    Richy wrote: »
    The sad thing is that Dion is not a bad candidate. He's just unimpressive and boring. And as someone mentioned, he's got all the charisma of a cantaloupe.
    The Green Shift is a pretty decent policy, and the few times I saw him promoting it were the first times I ever saw him really come alive and engaging. He's literally our Al Gore - all policy, no inspiration.

  • SerpentSerpent Sometimes Vancouver, BC, sometimes Brisbane, QLDRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    A similar tax to the 'green shift' is out in BC and is pretty unpopular.

    If BC doesn't like it, who will?

    I think it's great.

  • JamesJames Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Considering my Conservative MP is a fucking shithead, I'll be voting Liberal.

    Though I was never planning to vote Conservative anyway, I just thought I'd point that out.

  • oldmankenoldmanken Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    James wrote: »
    Considering my Conservative MP is a fucking shithead

    I think that is the general consensus about most of the Conservative MPs... except Jim Prentice, who is actually pretty cool. Would have been nice if he had won the party leadership over Harper, but he's not enough of a social conservative...

  • JamesJames Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I must be the only person in BC who likes the carbon tax.

  • AegisAegis Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Any chance that you Americans will loan Barack to us for a little while so we can vote for him?

    I was originally for the liberals, but ever since Chretien left the party's been one gigantic clusterfuck of ineptitude. So I looked at the NDP and was alright with them for a while, but their CAW bloc plus some rather unreponsiveness on some issues (even if they champion for some issues I like, for instance, the Copyright Bill recently) is making me like them less.

    I'd consider the Green Party, but I'm uncomfortable supporting a party who is so centered on one issue and one issue only. They also neglect any mention of their stance on Nuclear power (all the parties seem to, which pisses me off) aside from their bloggers being apeshit NIMBY, and their use of 'Fair Tax' on their policy listings on their website makes me cringe.

    So, yeah. Way to go Canadian political system for getting me excited about our politics. Woo.

    Edit: On second reading, the Green Party wants to phase out all nuclear power. So yea, no support for me on that one.

  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    You should try following Québec politics. I can't vote for any of our three parties without feeling like I need to shower and scrub for 18 days straight.

    RichyFlag.gifsig.gif
  • AegisAegis Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Richy wrote: »
    You should try following Québec politics. I can't vote for any of our three parties without feeling like I need to shower and scrub for 18 days straight.

    Yes, but watching it on Radio-Canada, your politicians seem so much more animated.

  • Chake99Chake99 Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Andrew_Jay wrote: »
    Chake99 wrote: »
    Ignatieff is still pretty terrible, look up any of Rick Mercer's comments on the guy and he pretty much gets heaped with scorn for relatively good reason.
    I know it's popular to see Ignatieff as some kind of crypto-fascist, but I kind of like him (voted for him in the leadership race two years ago). He's my kind of liberal - socially liberal and an internationalist.

    But if Dion can keep the party together through this election and make a good case for the Liberals (even if he doesn't get a minority government) all is forgiven. Though I guess it's kind of sad that all I can do is hope he doesn't wreck the party.

    I don't think Ignatieff is crypto-fascist I just think he looks like he would make an ineffective gaffe-prone prime minister. Like Stephane Dion but slightly less boring. I don't really want either representing Canada on the international stage.

    Yeah it is. I'll be happy if Stephane and the NDP manage to prevent the Conservatives from getting a majority through.

    Hic Rhodus, Hic Salta.
  • PicardathonPicardathon Registered User
    edited August 2008
    Aegis wrote: »
    Any chance that you Americans will loan Barack to us for a little while so we can vote for him?

    In eight years. Only he'll look like he's 65 and he'll be really tired out.

  • oldmankenoldmanken Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Aegis wrote: »
    Any chance that you Americans will loan Barack to us for a little while so we can vote for him?

    In eight years. Only he'll look like he's 65 and he'll be really tired out.

    We'll take that...

  • Chake99Chake99 Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    srsly.

    Hic Rhodus, Hic Salta.
  • AzioAzio Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Richy wrote: »
    The sad thing is that Dion is not a bad candidate. He's just unimpressive and boring. And as someone mentioned, he's got all the charisma of a cantaloupe.
    Yes, and Stephen Harper is just so exciting and charismatic.

  • Metal Gear Solid 2 DemoMetal Gear Solid 2 Demo Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Azio wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    The sad thing is that Dion is not a bad candidate. He's just unimpressive and boring. And as someone mentioned, he's got all the charisma of a cantaloupe.
    Yes, and Stephen Harper is just so exciting and charismatic.

    I don't think he mentioned Harper


    But yes, overall Canadian politics is as bland as white beard right now (pun?)

    Spoiler:
  • an_altan_alt Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I really have trouble seeing the Green Shift as anything other than wealth redistribution under the guise of environmentalism. It's a $15-16 billion dollar tax when up and running and is designed to have a "significant reduction" in greenhouse gas emissions. So 5%, 10%, 20%? No estimate whatsoever? Awesome.

    The national energy program back in the 80s was sold as a way to make Canada self sufficient in terms of oil. Later, Trudeau's energy minister Marc Lalonde admitted the whole plan was just designed to take money out of Alberta and move it to vote rich central Canada. "The major factor behind the NEP wasn't Canadianization or getting more from the industry or even self-sufficiency. The determinant factor was the fiscal imbalance between the provinces and the federal government. Our proposal was to increase Ottawa's share appreciably, so that the share of the producing provinces would decline significantly and the industry's share would decline somewhat."

    The green shift is estimated to put 40% of the tax burden on the 13% of the population that is located in Alberta and Saskatchewan. Quebec's energy production, being mainly hydro-electric, will be untaxed. It's also fortunate for Quebec that non-fossil fuel based sources of green house gas emissions are untaxed.

    Even Liberal MF Ken Boshcoff said, "The Liberal Party’s Green Shift announced on June 19th marked the most aggressive anti-poverty program in 40 years. The ‘shift’ will transfer wealth from rich to poor, from the oil patch to the rest of the country, and from the coffers of big business to the pockets of low-income Canadians."

    The Green Shift isn't an environmental program.

    Pony wrote:
    I think that the internet has been for years on the path to creating what is essentially an electronic Necronomicon: A collection of blasphemous unrealities so perverse that to even glimpse at its contents, if but for a moment, is to irrevocably forfeit a portion of your sanity.
    Xbox - PearlBlueS0ul, Steam
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I just moved last year from Quebec to Alberta and learned that if you say that you thought the NEP was not such a bad idea you will get spit at.

    steam_sig.png
    gamertag: Canadianllama
  • Al_watAl_wat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Disco11 wrote: »
    I just moved last year from Quebec to Alberta and learned that if you say that you thought the NEP was not such a bad idea you will get spit at.

    The other day, this truck driver I was working with near Edmonton looks at my car with its Ontario license plate, and instantly goes on some huge retarded rant about how everyone from Ontario is coming over and "fucking everything up and voting liberal". Nevermind that I would probably vote conservative anyways (heres hoping for another minority); he was a tool.

  • Andrew_JayAndrew_Jay Registered User
    edited August 2008
    an_alt wrote: »
    The Green Shift isn't an environmental program.
    It's premised on basic economics - as the price of carbon emissions goes up, demand will go down. When there is a price attached to their pollution firms will cut back on waste or invest in cleaner technologies which will reduce their emissions and in turn reduce their tax burden.

    Yes, it does have a substantial wealth redistribution aspect to it, because that's necessary for it to work. However, its redistributional effects are only noteworthy because the other party with a similar plan - the NDP - has decided to ignore the blatantly obvious, that this will increase consumer prices, and make no allowances for this (instead Layton just blathers about "making the corporations pay").

    Any tax that increase prices is generally regressive and effects lower-income earners most. To make the Green Shift work while not hurting lower-income earners it needs to be accompanied by tax breaks for the lowest brackets and increased cash transfers.

    I will admit though that the NEP was a terrible plan and just flew in the face of basic economic sense.
    oldmanken wrote: »
    James wrote: »
    Considering my Conservative MP is a fucking shithead
    I think that is the general consensus about most of the Conservative MPs... except Jim Prentice, who is actually pretty cool. Would have been nice if he had won the party leadership over Harper, but he's not enough of a social conservative...
    Hey, I just saw a recap on the news tonight of Williams' press conference about the cuts in funding for the arts. Awesome. I really, really hope this finally means that Conservatives Manning, Hearn and Doyle are out this election - seeing how they'll have the local "conservative" party campaigning against the lot of them.

  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I will be a typical American by not reading any of the OP's background on Canadian politics, but instead demand the title of this thread be changed to "Cold Country For Old White Men".

«13456759
This discussion has been closed.