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Spore Thread: A Massive Singleplayer Online Banning Experience

2456763

Posts

  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I have the terrible problem of never being able to tell the difference between will wright and sid meiers

    Yeah I get that too.

    You know, even I switch their names all the damn time.

    Defender on
  • DruhimDruhim Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2008
    yeah, like you can put wings on a creature's head to make them look like leaves or something decorative instead of where they actually should be to provide lift, yet they'll still be functional in spite of the nonsensical placement

    personally that takes the fun and challenge out of it

    but I haven't actually played the game so maybe they've addressed that in the final build

    Druhim on
    belruelotterav-1.jpg
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    oh no! people can have fun designing creatures?! call the fun police, defender! thank god you were here!

    Randall_Flagg on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Yeah I think it has to be option 3 if the game's actually going to use creature design as a meaningful mechanic, but looking at Wright's work, I seriously doubt that this will happen.

    Defender on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    oh no! people can have fun designing creatures?! call the fun police, defender! thank god you were here!

    Read it again, you stupid faggot. Not that you're going to realize what I'm saying the second time.

    Defender on
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    WEEE OOOO WEEEE OOOOO

    CHEESE IT! THE FUNFUZZ!

    Randall_Flagg on
  • JayKaosJayKaos Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    The creature creator seems to imply case 2, judging by the way the abilities/stats are affected by claws and wings and whatnot- one pair of tiny wings in the armpits gives the same effects as the same as a pair of wings that could actually be used.

    JayKaos on
    Steam | SW-0844-0908-6004 and my Switch code
  • Tweaked_Bat_Tweaked_Bat_ Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Ahah.

    Tweaked_Bat_ on
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I get the feeling that they've gone with your Case #2, Defender. You're right, in that from a gameplay perspective that takes a lot of challenge out of it, but a lot of people will still take the 15 minutes to adjust minor details because they take pride in creating a cool looking creature rather than a creature that is purely for 'winning' the game.

    But looking at it from purely a gameplay perspective, you're probably right and that will limit the depth of the game for those who want more than just creating creatures that look cool.

    Personally I'm kind of in between, I will have a lot of fun creating interesting looking creatures (no matter how they play), and I will have a lot of fun creating creatures that play well (no matter how they look), but I won't be the guy who's still making new creatures in 2 years long after the novelty of the gameplay has worn off.

    If it's anything like the Sims, I'll be the guy who reinstalls it every time an expansion pack comes out, plays for an hour or two and then forgets about it until the next one.

    Edit: Man, I took too long to write that, look at all those posts

    Ten on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    JayKaos wrote: »
    The creature creator seems to imply case 2, judging by the way the abilities/stats are affected by claws and wings and whatnot- one pair of tiny wings in the armpits gives the same effects as the same as a pair of wings that could actually be used.

    OK. And 2 isn't a bad case, but it does essentially mean that actual creature design will be something better left to the creator than the actual game. After all, in the game, you have to balance your creation's stats and shit to do what you want, and you get no bonus for clever arrangement, plus you have to spend all the time to earn all those accessories. In the creator, you get the parts for free and don't have to worry about stats.

    So that clearly makes the distinction between "I want to make a creature that looks like X" and "I want to make a viable creature so I can actually play."

    Defender on
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    UNTIL THE NEXT TIME SOMEONE TRIES TO HAVE FUN, VALIANT CITIZENS! I MUST AWAY!

    Randall_Flagg on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Ten wrote: »
    I get the feeling that they've gone with your Case #2, Defender. You're right, in that from a gameplay perspective that takes a lot of challenge out of it, but a lot of people will still take the 15 minutes to adjust minor details because they take pride in creating a cool looking creature rather than a creature that is purely for 'winning' the game.

    But looking at it from purely a gameplay perspective, you're probably right and that will limit the depth of the game for those who want more than just creating creatures that look cool.

    Exactly. Players do that shit the first time they play, but then when they start to realize that they get nothing for it and it's easier to do in the $10 creator program, they stop doing it. If that's what they bought the game for, they go back to the creator. Then they generally realize that they're creating playing pieces for a game that they can't play with the pieces they've created. Those who are purely in it for creating creatures realize that they don't care about the game and whoops they wasted $60 and continue to play with the creator. Most, though, are discouraged at having to retreat to the earlier stages and the knowledge that the game isn't what they thought and abandon it altogether. Will Wright still has their dollars.
    Ten wrote: »
    Personally I'm kind of in between, I will have a lot of fun creating interesting looking creatures (no matter how they play), and I will have a lot of fun creating creatures that play well (no matter how they look), but I won't be the guy who's still making new creatures in 2 years long after the novelty of the gameplay has worn off.

    If it's anything like the Sims, I'll be the guy who reinstalls it every time an expansion pack comes out, plays for an hour or two and then forgets about it until the next one.

    Edit: Man, I took too long to write that, look at all those posts

    Yeah, that's pretty much the market right there. People who will impulse-buy something and play with it for an hour, just click through every option one time, and then forget about it and who will be ready to buy the next expansion or two.

    Defender on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    UNTIL THE NEXT TIME SOMEONE TRIES TO HAVE FUN, VALIANT CITIZENS! I MUST AWAY!

    Yeah, you really don't understand what's being discussed here. What's disappointing is that this isn't some arcane corner of game development that only seasoned professionals will get. This is something that just requires basic familiarity with how people consume interactive entertainment.

    Defender on
  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I had to come check this thread because I saw Defender posting

    Balefuego on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    this is so meta

    I'm making silly jokes about you hating fun and you are getting all mad about them

    Randall_Flagg on
  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm not sure what we are arguing about but I would bet 1000 dollars that Randall Fagg is wrong

    Balefuego on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    this is so meta

    I'm making silly jokes about you hating fun and you are getting all mad about them

    How is this meta? You're providing me with a certain type of input and I am reacting to it in the same way I have for like four years.

    Do you ever find yourself eating a steak and being like "this is so meta! I cut pieces of this thing and put them in my mouth, and then I experience good flavors and my hunger goes away!"

    Defender on
  • DruhimDruhim Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2008
    Balefuego wrote: »
    I'm not sure what we are arguing about but I would bet 1000 dollars that Randall Fagg is wrong

    Druhim on
    belruelotterav-1.jpg
  • Tweaked_Bat_Tweaked_Bat_ Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I don't think there is any arguing here...

    Tweaked_Bat_ on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Balefuego wrote: »
    I'm not sure what we are arguing about but I would bet 1000 dollars that Randall Fagg is wrong

    You win!

    Although I think he is at the minimum making the claim that he is doing this purposely.

    Defender on
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    but there's nothing for me to be wrong about! I'm not actually offering up any sort of substantive argumentation here

    hell, I'm not even saying things related to the conversation

    Randall_Flagg on
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Defender, I think there'll be a lot of people who will it fun creating a cool looking creature within the bounds of the game, taking it as a challenge to make their creature look good as it evolves. It's disappointing that the layout itself has no impact on gameplay but that would probably restrict the creative possibilities quite a bit.

    I know you're talking from a strict game design standpoint, but I think the two types of players you've outlines are a bit too black and white, there are going to be hundreds of thousands of people in the gray area in between.

    Ten on
  • Randall_FlaggRandall_Flagg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    oh no, defender's one weakness: someone who isn't actually arguing with him!

    Randall_Flagg on
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    oh no, defender's one weakness: someone who isn't actually arguing with him!

    I think I'm actually the only one arguing with him

    Ten on
  • No Great NameNo Great Name FRAUD DETECTED Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm pretty sure the creature creator is akin to the genetic fun making you get to do in the space age end game.

    As for the actual evolution of your creature, or the main part of the game, I don't think armpit wings are going to be useful.


    edit: The problem here is that people don't really know.

    edit2: Oh wait I bothered to read defender's posts. No, no, we know enough to call bullshit on what you're saying.

    No Great Name on
    PSN: NoGreatName Steam:SirToons Twitch: SirToons
    sirtoons.png
  • ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    is this where we bicker about the merits of a game none of us have played yet

    Projeck on
  • No Great NameNo Great Name FRAUD DETECTED Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    It's almost like no one has any idea what they're talking about in this thread.

    Go watch some stuff on the actual game. Jesus.

    No Great Name on
    PSN: NoGreatName Steam:SirToons Twitch: SirToons
    sirtoons.png
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    It's almost like no one has any idea what they're talking about in this thread.

    Go watch some stuff on the actual game. Jesus.

    What has Defender said wrong? He's right in that it looks like where you place bits on your creature has no effect on gameplay. All I've been arguing is how much that's going to matter to how fun it is.

    Ten on
  • Tweaked_Bat_Tweaked_Bat_ Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Don't worry, I'll give you all a solid review on Thursday, because I'll already have it whilst you guys will still be hanging out for it 2 days later ahahahahahahaha

    Tweaked_Bat_ on
  • DruhimDruhim Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2008
    Ten wrote: »
    It's almost like no one has any idea what they're talking about in this thread.

    Go watch some stuff on the actual game. Jesus.

    What has Defender said wrong? He's right in that it looks like where you place bits on your creature has no effect on gameplay. All I've been arguing is how much that's going to matter to how fun it is.
    exactly
    for me it would matter a lot
    for others, it will probably matter much less

    Druhim on
    belruelotterav-1.jpg
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Druhim wrote: »
    Ten wrote: »
    It's almost like no one has any idea what they're talking about in this thread.

    Go watch some stuff on the actual game. Jesus.

    What has Defender said wrong? He's right in that it looks like where you place bits on your creature has no effect on gameplay. All I've been arguing is how much that's going to matter to how fun it is.
    exactly
    for me it would matter a lot
    for others, it will probably matter much less

    Hopefully Spore 2 will be more in depth in that area. I wonder how much extra smarts it would need to actually determine things like 'all your limbs are too short to reach your mouth, your creature is not capable of eating'

    Ten on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Ten wrote: »
    Defender, I think there'll be a lot of people who will it fun creating a cool looking creature within the bounds of the game, taking it as a challenge to make their creature look good as it evolves. It's disappointing that the layout itself has no impact on gameplay but that would probably restrict the creative possibilities quite a bit.

    I know you're talking from a strict game design standpoint, but I think the two types of players you've outlines are a bit too black and white, there are going to be hundreds of thousands of people in the gray area in between.

    The two types of players I've described have no real gray area in between. Maybe I need to refine how I phrased it, but two types I mentioned were differentiated only by whether or not they're satisfied purely with the creator. They either are or are not.

    Defender on
  • Tweaked_Bat_Tweaked_Bat_ Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Ten wrote: »
    Druhim wrote: »
    Ten wrote: »
    It's almost like no one has any idea what they're talking about in this thread.

    Go watch some stuff on the actual game. Jesus.

    What has Defender said wrong? He's right in that it looks like where you place bits on your creature has no effect on gameplay. All I've been arguing is how much that's going to matter to how fun it is.
    exactly
    for me it would matter a lot
    for others, it will probably matter much less

    Hopefully Spore 2 will be more in depth in that area. I wonder how much extra smarts it would need to actually determine things like 'all your limbs are too short to reach your mouth, your creature is not capable of eating'

    Spore 2? The first one isn't even out yet...

    Tweaked_Bat_ on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Ten wrote: »
    Hopefully Spore 2 will be more in depth in that area. I wonder how much extra smarts it would need to actually determine things like 'all your limbs are too short to reach your mouth, your creature is not capable of eating'

    It really isn't that much "extra smarts" (if you mean AI code) to do simple tests like that, the main issue would be coming up with a comprehensive set of tests. I mean, sharks have arms...sorta...that don't reach their mouths, and they are apparently really damn good at eating, if Spielberg's movies are to be trusted. Or look at dogs, for example. They can reach their mouths with their hands, but they really don't have to do that in order to eat. So the question would be to come up with a comprehensive set of tests that actually make sense. The raw tests themselves would be easy; in the case of "do the arms reach the mouth, the test is a simple pass at the game's IK animation system followed by a distance check.

    Defender on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm pretty sure the creature creator is akin to the genetic fun making you get to do in the space age end game.

    As for the actual evolution of your creature, or the main part of the game, I don't think armpit wings are going to be useful.


    edit: The problem here is that people don't really know.

    edit2: Oh wait I bothered to read defender's posts. No, no, we know enough to call bullshit on what you're saying.

    No you don't, fucker. Nothing I've said is bullshit. Nothing is misrepresented. It's all fucking theoretical in the first place! You're a goddamn idiot.

    Defender on
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Defender wrote: »
    Ten wrote: »
    Defender, I think there'll be a lot of people who will it fun creating a cool looking creature within the bounds of the game, taking it as a challenge to make their creature look good as it evolves. It's disappointing that the layout itself has no impact on gameplay but that would probably restrict the creative possibilities quite a bit.

    I know you're talking from a strict game design standpoint, but I think the two types of players you've outlines are a bit too black and white, there are going to be hundreds of thousands of people in the gray area in between.

    The two types of players I've described have no real gray area in between. Maybe I need to refine how I phrased it, but two types I mentioned were differentiated only by whether or not they're satisfied purely with the creator. They either are or are not.

    I guess the player I'm talking about is one who is not satisfied with just the creator then, as they also enjoy creating aesthetically pleasing creatures within the bounds of the gameplay restrictions (complexity, DNA points, etc).

    Ten on
  • RaneadosRaneados police apologist you shouldn't have been there, obviouslyRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    defender you have no art in your soul

    I will tell you that I will make my creature look how I want and I will ruin your day with it

    Raneados on
  • TenTen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Defender wrote: »
    Ten wrote: »
    Hopefully Spore 2 will be more in depth in that area. I wonder how much extra smarts it would need to actually determine things like 'all your limbs are too short to reach your mouth, your creature is not capable of eating'

    It really isn't that much "extra smarts" (if you mean AI code) to do simple tests like that, the main issue would be coming up with a comprehensive set of tests. I mean, sharks have arms...sorta...that don't reach their mouths, and they are apparently really damn good at eating, if Spielberg's movies are to be trusted. Or look at dogs, for example. They can reach their mouths with their hands, but they really don't have to do that in order to eat. So the question would be to come up with a comprehensive set of tests that actually make sense. The raw tests themselves would be easy; in the case of "do the arms reach the mouth, the test is a simple pass at the game's IK animation system followed by a distance check.

    Yeh, the 'extra smarts' I was talking about was those rules you mentioned. And that example was a bit simplistic I guess, it would have to take into account the placement of the mouth as well.

    Ten on
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Raneados wrote: »
    defender you have no art in your soul

    I will tell you that I will make my creature look how I want and I will ruin your day with it

    On the contrary, games are exactly the art that I have in my soul.

    Defender on
  • ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    hey defender check out this creature aint he cool
    500002457528.png

    Projeck on
This discussion has been closed.