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American Presidency: Still nice

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Posts

  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    TheMarshal wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Jebu wrote: »
    Which is why the parents have the option to opt their child out of the sex education if they'd rather take care of it themselves.

    So then if I opt out of the public school system in general, then I should receive a credit voucher for the private education I chose to give my kid, right?

    Absolutely. AND for every day that the fire department doesn't come to your house, you get a tax rebate added to your next return.

    I wish. Sometimes, I start fires just so I can feel like I'm getting my money's worth.

    Robos A Go Go on
  • Armored GorillaArmored Gorilla Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think thats a rather subjective argument.

    This random link from the UK says we're 24th.

    Are you going to dispute that the Vatican is more prosperous? C'mon. :lol:

    Biased because it's not from the United States.

    Armored Gorilla on
    "I'm a mad god. The Mad God, actually. It's a family title. Gets passed down from me to myself every few thousand years."
  • Raiden333Raiden333 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Lawndart wrote: »
    With pleasure..

    You're claiming Obama is more of a hypocrite because his campaign has done, at worst, exactly the same thing McCain's campaign has done.

    Technically I said "more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy". Meaning, you can apply the "hypocrite" label to him with less airtight evidence. So, really, I never implied he was worse than McCain.

    You're getting harder and harder to comprehend.

    WHY is he 'more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy', when McCain made the exact same claims that he wanted to run a clean, honorable campaign that you claim Obama has broken, when McCain's ads are even worse?

    From your position, it would seem to follow that they are both 'equally vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy', not that Obama is MORE vulnerable.

    Raiden333 on
    There was a steam sig here. It's gone now.
  • The Raging PlatypusThe Raging Platypus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Gosling wrote: »
    So Morgan Stanley's the next domino to fall. Wachovia's going to slurp them up.

    Jesus Christ.

    I have a bunch of old friends from Morgan Stanley, too. =(

    The Raging Platypus on
    Quid wrote: »
    YOU'RE A GOD DAMN PLATYPUS.
    PSN Name: MusingPlatypus
  • TheMarshalTheMarshal Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    TheMarshal wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Jebu wrote: »
    Which is why the parents have the option to opt their child out of the sex education if they'd rather take care of it themselves.

    So then if I opt out of the public school system in general, then I should receive a credit voucher for the private education I chose to give my kid, right?

    Absolutely. AND for every day that the fire department doesn't come to your house, you get a tax rebate added to your next return.

    I wish. Sometimes, I start fires just so I can feel like I'm getting my money's worth.

    Nothing quite like that feeling of reaching for the phone to call 911 and thinking "shit, did I remember to pay my fire department bill this month?"

    TheMarshal on
  • AstraphobiaAstraphobia Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt! Root! Sleep! Death!Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think thats a rather subjective argument.

    This random link from the UK says we're 24th.

    Are you going to dispute that the Vatican is more prosperous? C'mon. :lol:

    Biased because it's not from the United States.

    They DO drive on the wrong side of the road.

    Not to be trusted I say.

    Astraphobia on
  • HozHoz Cool Cat Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm not quite getting how someone breaking into Palin's e-mail account is bigger news than three neo-nazis plotting to assassinate Barack Obama. And for that matter it seems to be taken more seriously by the authorities.

    Hoz on
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Tach wrote: »
    Actually, zerg has committed to record his reasons for supporting McCain, as has Deacon. Because these threads move so fast, a LOT of people have missed them, and some have glossed over them.
    Thanks for the help.

    It just seems every time a McCain supporter calls something out on Obama, the discussion devolves into a, "Oh yeah, well why don't you just point on in detail, exactly why you support McCain".

    And when we don't, the conversation further devolves into a series of swearing and personal attacks.

    I don't want to have to rehash my complete stance on McCain and why I support him over Obama every single time I call Obama and his campaign out on something.
    I fully support this.

    He believes in McCain. Most of us believe in Obama. I would hate to be put on the spot to try and defend why I support my candidate in the broader sense every time I disagreed with a McCain supporter.

    That said, zerg/deacon/whoever, if you are asked to specifically defend a direct issue related to the campaign that you brought up, it would be totally cool if you did it in a levelheaded and awesome way. I don't think you have to answer to the bridge to nowhere every time a non-related social issue or economic crisis topic comes up, or how McCain is Liar McLiarson when it is not directly related to the conversation at hand.

    syndalis on
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  • RustRust __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2008
    Hoz wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting how someone breaking into Palin's e-mail account is bigger news than three neo-nazis plotting to assassinate Barack Obama. And for that matter it seems to be taken more seriously by the authorities.

    The Neo-Nazi thing might have gone nowhere because an A.G. appointed by Rove put his boot down on further litigation against the three.

    America.

    Rust on
  • Armored GorillaArmored Gorilla Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Hoz wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting how someone breaking into Palin's e-mail account is bigger news than three neo-nazis plotting to assassinate Barack Obama. And for that matter it seems to be taken more seriously by the authorities.

    It's cool, I don't get it either.

    Armored Gorilla on
    "I'm a mad god. The Mad God, actually. It's a family title. Gets passed down from me to myself every few thousand years."
  • tuxkamentuxkamen really took this picture. Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Hoz wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting how someone breaking into Palin's e-mail account is bigger news than three neo-nazis plotting to assassinate Barack Obama. And for that matter it seems to be taken more seriously by the authorities.

    Meth makes your aim lousy?

    tuxkamen on

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  • MatrijsMatrijs Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Raiden333 wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    With pleasure..

    You're claiming Obama is more of a hypocrite because his campaign has done, at worst, exactly the same thing McCain's campaign has done.

    Technically I said "more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy". Meaning, you can apply the "hypocrite" label to him with less airtight evidence. So, really, I never implied he was worse than McCain.

    You're getting harder and harder to comprehend.

    WHY is he 'more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy', when McCain made the exact same claims that he wanted to run a clean, honorable campaign that you claim Obama has broken, when McCain's ads are even worse?

    From your position, it would seem to follow that they are both 'equally vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy', not that Obama is MORE vulnerable.

    Because McCain is a Republican and everybody knows that Republicans are scummy dirtbags. He's expected to talk about running a clean, honorable campaign, while simultaneously pulling all sorts of dirty shenanigans. We simply have lower standards for Republican politicians. They're like the idiot younger brother who gets a pat on the head for getting a C because you can't expect anything better out of him.

    Matrijs on
  • AstraphobiaAstraphobia Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt! Root! Sleep! Death!Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Hoz wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting how someone breaking into Palin's e-mail account is bigger news than three neo-nazis plotting to assassinate Barack Obama. And for that matter it seems to be taken more seriously by the authorities.

    'Cause Hackers was such a great movie and how could you not be afraid of that guy from Early Edition haxing your computer?

    Or Angelina Jolie inserting her viruses into your hardware..

    Astraphobia on
  • TheBlackWindTheBlackWind Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    God damn, I'm just tired of this. Why the fuck is calling McCain out on not using a computer a purely personal attack? He didn't call him out on not liking apple pie or baseball or some other shit that won't play any part into presidency. But we're talking about a man who doesn't use the device that pretty much dominates and controls the age in which we live. The world is changing so fast in regards to the Internet that normal people can barely keep up when they try, yet we're okay with a man who won't try at all?

    Ignoring any issues with not using the Internet as a source for information or email correspondance, we're still faced with the issue that the Internet plays a huge part in our society and our personal lives. Legislature in the coming years and decisions about the direction of our country will need to take the Internet and computers heavily into account.

    You can claim that not using computers isn't automatic grounds to not be president and there are ways to compensate for it, but it's certainly not just a personal preference issue. It's a legitimate issue that needs addressing I feel.

    it's not an attack on his policy or anything he wants to do as president. it's a personal attack. period. how valid it is or how much you personally are affected by it is another story. just like when something is a distortion of a quote it's a distortion, period. then you can talk about how big or dangerous of a distortion it is.

    the thing about this thread is we don't get to those details because with this many people we just keep having the same first step of each conversation over and over again for 30 pages and then move onto a new topic.

    It IS an attack on what he wants to do as president. That's precisely what I'm calling it. I'm saying complete inexperience and lack of interest in computers creates huge bias. Bias that will impact his decisions about how he wants America to look in 4 years and the lives he wants Americans to live. The Internet and computers are an influence that's growing at an exponential rate and now permeate nearly every facet of our everyday lives.
    If you want to be making plans about the country, trying to govern the lives of 300 million Americans, you need some basic grasp of the lives they live. One of the few things that binds all Americans together other than having 2 legs (most of them anyway) is that we're like 90%+ users of computers and the Internet. And that's huge, from shopping to information to media to correspondance to a hundred other things.

    If you don't know computers, you don't know Americans, and if you don't know Americans, don't try to govern their lives.

    i really doubt its 90%.... maybe something like 60%.

    if you have any actual data on people who use computers as part of their daily lives thatd be nice.

    http://www.census.gov/population/www/socdemo/computer.html

    Most recent solid information I could find was from 2003 for people who had a computer in their homes. It was 62%, up from 56% in 2001. Pretty decent jump, and it 5 years, it has surely climbed further.

    Also, since it's just people who OWN a computer, that doesn't really calculate people who might use one often at work, but not have one in the household.



    http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0921872.html has some numbers in the lower 70 percentile, but I haven't actually verified anything there. Still, that info was also from 4 years ago, so take that as you will.

    TheBlackWind on
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  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Lawndart wrote: »
    With pleasure..

    You're claiming Obama is more of a hypocrite because his campaign has done, at worst, exactly the same thing McCain's campaign has done.

    Technically I said "more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy". Meaning, you can apply the "hypocrite" label to him with less airtight evidence. So, really, I never implied he was worse than McCain.

    So being "more vulnerable to claims of hypocrisy than any other candidate", which again is a bullshit claim you completely fail to back up, doesn't actually make one candidate worse than another?

    Lawndart on
  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    syndalis wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Tach wrote: »
    Actually, zerg has committed to record his reasons for supporting McCain, as has Deacon. Because these threads move so fast, a LOT of people have missed them, and some have glossed over them.
    Thanks for the help.

    It just seems every time a McCain supporter calls something out on Obama, the discussion devolves into a, "Oh yeah, well why don't you just point on in detail, exactly why you support McCain".

    And when we don't, the conversation further devolves into a series of swearing and personal attacks.

    I don't want to have to rehash my complete stance on McCain and why I support him over Obama every single time I call Obama and his campaign out on something.
    I fully support this.

    He believes in McCain. Most of us believe in Obama. I would hate to be put on the spot to try and defend why I support my candidate in the broader sense every time I disagreed with a McCain supporter.

    That said, zerg/deacon/whoever, if you are asked to specifically defend a direct issue related to the campaign that you brought up, it would be totally cool if you did it in a levelheaded and awesome way. I don't think you have to answer to the bridge to nowhere every time a non-related social issue or economic crisis topic comes up, or how McCain is Liar McLiarson when it is not directly related to the conversation at hand.

    I appreciate the response, but you have to keep in mind, too, that a lot of the times all we can offer up are different facts or perspectives.

    That doesn't mean you're still not going to disagree with us, but spare me the, "I'm not being levelheaded" because the Obama camp doesn't agree with my defense.

    It's totally cool to end one of these arguments with, "I disagree".

    ironzerg on
  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Outgoing congressman Wayne Gilchrest, Republican from Maryland, endorses Obama: http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0908/Republican_Congressman_endorses_Obama.html

    Also, Chuck Hagel keeping it real on Palin: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/18/hagel-on-palin/

    wwtMask on
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  • NarianNarian Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    Prosperous for who? The top 1% who over the past decade (IIRC) has received 80% of the growth of wealth? Yeah, sorry I'm not jumping onto the pro-Corporation bandwagon which gives CEOs who fucking bomb a company out of business leaving bonuses while laying off personnel left and right.

    Narian on
    Narian.gif
  • DelzhandDelzhand Hard to miss. Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.

    Delzhand on
  • ElJeffeElJeffe Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Tach wrote: »
    Actually, zerg has committed to record his reasons for supporting McCain, as has Deacon. Because these threads move so fast, a LOT of people have missed them, and some have glossed over them.
    Thanks for the help.

    It just seems every time a McCain supporter calls something out on Obama, the discussion devolves into a, "Oh yeah, well why don't you just point on in detail, exactly why you support McCain".

    And when we don't, the conversation further devolves into a series of swearing and personal attacks.

    I don't want to have to rehash my complete stance on McCain and why I support him over Obama every single time I call Obama and his campaign out on something.

    This is reasonable. But what often happens is that someone says, "Okay, you're decrying Obama for this, but McCain did it times, like, a million, so what's the deal? Are you okay with that?" And then we wind up in the retarded, "Well, Obama said he'd be a new kind of politician, so that makes every transgression of his a hundred times worse, and since McCain only has 50 times as many transgressions, Obama is actually twice is bad" zone and we bicker for awhile before something shiny distracts us.

    So let's drop it, agree to disagree, and talk issues.

    Like Palin. Whoa Nelly, is she crazy.

    ElJeffe on
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  • Professor PhobosProfessor Phobos Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.
    Actually you mean the reverse. We're definitely the wealthiest, but living standards are higher in several other countries. This is because the US has a pretty huge variance in quality of life across geography.

    Professor Phobos on
  • TaramoorTaramoor Storyteller Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Medopine wrote: »
    SyphonBrue wrote: »
    “Give us some details and examples of your strategies and plan for economic empowerment for women,” she said.

    McCain signaled for Palin to answer the question.

    “Well first let me take a shot at that, and I’ll tell ya, I’m a product of Title IX in our schools, where equal education and equal opportunities in sports really helped propel me into the—I guess into the position that I’m in today where,” Palin said.

    McCain then interjected, “Could I mention she was a point guard on a state championship basketball team.”

    After the crowd’s applause died down, Palin continued: “Sports were very, very important to me growing up, you know just learning about self discipline and healthy competition and about what it takes to win and even how to graciously lose sometimes. But how to win, that’s what it teaches ya. Now, I was a product of Title IX where legislation allowed that equal opportunity. Now if we have to still keep going down that road to create more legislation, to get with it in the 21st century, to make sure that women do have equality especially in the work place, then we’re there because we understand that in this age we have all got to be working together. I respect you so much that you are a Democrat recognizing that John McCain and me as a team of mavericks understand where you’re coming from, and we can work together on these issues. But yup, equality for women, for all, that’s going to be part of the agenda and I thank you for that question.”

    Yup....her response to a question about what she will do for female economic empowerment? She played sports.

    Eh, she mentioned Title IX which is actually quite important. Sports scholarships get a lot of people into school.

    McCain was the one who went "HEY GUYS SHE WAS A POINT GUARD~!!"

    EDIT: I mean, the rest of her response was pretty lame but it wasn't just "oh hey I played sports!"

    While it's a pretty vague response, she almost comes close to discussing what they'll do.

    Summarized: "I, Sarah Palin, am a product of Title IX. I hope more legislation isn't necessary to create equality between men and women, but if it is then you can be sure John McCain and Myself will make it happen."

    Taramoor on
  • ElJeffeElJeffe Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited September 2008
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    The fundamentals of our failing are strong. We have some of the biggest and most prominent failures in the world, and I challenge any other nation to fail as spectacularly as us.

    ElJeffe on
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  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Tach wrote: »
    Actually, zerg has committed to record his reasons for supporting McCain, as has Deacon. Because these threads move so fast, a LOT of people have missed them, and some have glossed over them.
    Thanks for the help.

    It just seems every time a McCain supporter calls something out on Obama, the discussion devolves into a, "Oh yeah, well why don't you just point on in detail, exactly why you support McCain".

    And when we don't, the conversation further devolves into a series of swearing and personal attacks.

    I don't want to have to rehash my complete stance on McCain and why I support him over Obama every single time I call Obama and his campaign out on something.

    This is reasonable. But what often happens is that someone says, "Okay, you're decrying Obama for this, but McCain did it times, like, a million, so what's the deal? Are you okay with that?" And then we wind up in the retarded, "Well, Obama said he'd be a new kind of politician, so that makes every transgression of his a hundred times worse, and since McCain only has 50 times as many transgressions, Obama is actually twice is bad" zone and we bicker for awhile before something shiny distracts us.

    So let's drop it, agree to disagree, and talk issues.

    Like Palin. Whoa Nelly, is she crazy.

    My father's position on Palin is that McCain's parents both lived well into their nineties, and that even if he does die and she does become President, she'll be surrounded by people who basically say "No don't do that." Pointing out that eschatological Christians don't much give a fuck about the opinions of anyone but other eschatological Christians was met with what amounted to "Meh."

    Salvation122 on
  • NarianNarian Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    The fundamentals of our failing are strong. We have some of the biggest and most prominent failures in the world, and I challenge any other nation to fail as spectacularly as us.

    Post + Avatar = <3

    Narian on
    Narian.gif
  • KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.
    Actually you mean the reverse. We're definitely the wealthiest, but living standards are higher in several other countries. This is because the US has a pretty huge variance in quality of life across geography.

    Apparently the standard of living in Qatar is through the roof.

    KalTorak on
  • TachTach Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Tach wrote: »
    Actually, zerg has committed to record his reasons for supporting McCain, as has Deacon. Because these threads move so fast, a LOT of people have missed them, and some have glossed over them.
    Thanks for the help.

    It just seems every time a McCain supporter calls something out on Obama, the discussion devolves into a, "Oh yeah, well why don't you just point on in detail, exactly why you support McCain".

    And when we don't, the conversation further devolves into a series of swearing and personal attacks.

    I don't want to have to rehash my complete stance on McCain and why I support him over Obama every single time I call Obama and his campaign out on something.
    That's cool.

    I just think that this particular line of criticism of Obama is a bit belabored, especially considering the attitudes of most posters here. Yeah, Obama has had some ads that we don't like/agree with, but we do feel that his campaign has been more focused on the issues, rather than the personal and sometimes slanderous attacks we've seen from McCain.

    Continuing to point out how Obama isn't living up to an arbitrary standard that we feel doesn't exist is more tilting at windmills than effective argument.

    Tach on
  • AstraphobiaAstraphobia Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt! Root! Sleep! Death!Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.

    Highest infant mortality rate.

    Highest incarceration rate.

    One of the highest obesity rates.

    Once again.. pretty much a subjective argument for how you define "prosperity" or the like. This isn't Zimbabwe.. but we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking we're a stones throw from Utopia here.

    Astraphobia on
  • Armored GorillaArmored Gorilla Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    wwtMask wrote: »
    Outgoing congressman Wayne Gilchrest, Republican from Maryland, endorses Obama: http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0908/Republican_Congressman_endorses_Obama.html

    Also, Chuck Hagel keeping it real on Palin: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/18/hagel-on-palin/

    Gilchrest is my Congressman and he voted against Mother's Day. I have nothing else to say about him.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/08/AR2008050802999_pf.html

    Armored Gorilla on
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  • DeaconBluesDeaconBlues __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    And then we wind up in the retarded, "Well, Obama said he'd be a new kind of politician, so that makes every transgression of his a hundred times worse, and since McCain only has 50 times as many transgressions, Obama is actually twice is bad" zone and we bicker for awhile before something shiny distracts us.

    Comparisons aside, isn't pointing out ways in which Obama is "buisness as usual" a valid tactic? You yourself admitted that part of his draw was the ability to somehow fundamentally change things.

    DeaconBlues on
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  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    edited September 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    So let's drop it, agree to disagree, and talk issues.

    Like Palin. Whoa Nelly, is she crazy.
    ... Like a fox!

    Actually, Palin scares me because of the energy that exists behind her.

    Take her background into consideration slightly... but look more at his issues and social leanings. She is the evolution of the current Republican party. In fact, I think that most of the pubs/conservatives would agree with me on this. She represents the face of the new republican party. For some, that is fine.

    But a Pentecostal fundamentalist with a literalist interpretation of biblical scripture coupled with very harsh social intervention on the government level and a bulldog-style approach to foreign policy discussion scares the shit out of me. Throw all the possible lies on her part out the window. Just that first sentence. That is enough.

    syndalis on
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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Audio (in English) of that interview wherein McCain gives a baffling answer on Spain. First question she says "Spain" quite clearly. Her pronunciation of "Europe" leaves his "What about me, what?" answer explained though, as she puts a serious stress on the first syllable and barely pronounces the last one at all.

    Spain stuff is the last third or so of the interview.

    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
  • CauldCauld Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.

    Highest infant mortality rate.

    Highest incarceration rate.

    One of the highest obesity rates.

    Once again.. pretty much a subjective argument for how you define "prosperity" or the like. This isn't Zimbabwe.. but we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking we're a stones throw from Utopia here.

    Oh please, we don't have the highest Infant Mortality rate, I'd be surprised if we weren't in the top 20 (top being better). Also, we're definitely the most prosperous if your measure is straight GDP, if you go with GDP per capita, then we're really not.

    Cauld on
  • Dunadan019Dunadan019 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Dunadan019 wrote: »

    i really doubt its 90%.... maybe something like 60%.

    if you have any actual data on people who use computers as part of their daily lives thatd be nice.

    http://www.census.gov/population/www/socdemo/computer.html

    Most recent solid information I could find was from 2003 for people who had a computer in their homes. It was 62%, up from 56% in 2001. Pretty decent jump, and it 5 years, it has surely climbed further.

    Also, since it's just people who OWN a computer, that doesn't really calculate people who might use one often at work, but not have one in the household.



    http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0921872.html has some numbers in the lower 70 percentile, but I haven't actually verified anything there. Still, that info was also from 4 years ago, so take that as you will.

    ok cool, im not gonna debate but just know that having a computer in your house doesnt mean you use it. in a family of mom/dad/13 year old son with 1 computer who is most likely using it?

    still 60% "feels" right to me.

    Dunadan019 on
  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.

    Highest infant mortality rate.

    Highest incarceration rate.

    One of the highest obesity rates.

    Once again.. pretty much a subjective argument for how you define "prosperity" or the like. This isn't Zimbabwe.. but we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking we're a stones throw from Utopia here.

    Infant mortality rate actually occurs because of better care for premature births, and incarceration is due mostly to longer average sentencing. One is due to statistical weirdness, the other is (in no small part) because of the federal system of government. Neither are really representative of quality of life.

    Salvation122 on
  • Armored GorillaArmored Gorilla Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    wwtMask wrote: »
    Outgoing congressman Wayne Gilchrest, Republican from Maryland, endorses Obama: http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0908/Republican_Congressman_endorses_Obama.html

    Also, Chuck Hagel keeping it real on Palin: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/18/hagel-on-palin/

    Gilchrest is my Congressman and he voted against Mother's Day. I have nothing else to say about him.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/08/AR2008050802999_pf.html

    Oh, he also has endorsed Frank Kratovil, the Democrat running to take his seat. Apparently the Pub that was offered up to run is a mega-ultra-neo-con and even Gilchrest doesnt' want him. I'll vote for Kratovil, but all of his ads refer to him as an independent and it feels like he's shirking the Democrat label, even though he is a member of the party. Though I can't blame him, MD-01 is redneck central and votes Republican every time out.

    Armored Gorilla on
    "I'm a mad god. The Mad God, actually. It's a family title. Gets passed down from me to myself every few thousand years."
  • NarianNarian Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Cauld wrote: »
    Delzhand wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Litejedi wrote: »
    As far as I can tell, the pro-Corporate rhetoric hasn't done a whole lot for the prosperity of America so far.

    You have a very prosperous failing economy.

    Really? I hate to break it to you, but despite the recent troubles, America is still the most prosperous country in the world....

    I think it would be more accurate to say we have the highest standard of living in the world.

    Highest infant mortality rate.

    Highest incarceration rate.

    One of the highest obesity rates.

    Once again.. pretty much a subjective argument for how you define "prosperity" or the like. This isn't Zimbabwe.. but we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking we're a stones throw from Utopia here.

    Oh please, we don't have the highest Infant Mortality rate, I'd be surprised if we weren't in the top 20 (top being better). Also, we're definitely the most prosperous if your measure is straight GDP, if you go with GDP per capita, then we're really not.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_infant_mortality_rate_(2005)

    U.S.A. is 163rd.

    Narian on
    Narian.gif
  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    syndalis wrote: »
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    So let's drop it, agree to disagree, and talk issues.

    Like Palin. Whoa Nelly, is she crazy.
    ... Like a fox!

    Actually, Palin scares me because of the energy that exists behind her.

    Take her background into consideration slightly... but look more at his issues and social leanings. She is the evolution of the current Republican party. In fact, I think that most of the pubs/conservatives would agree with me on this. She represents the face of the new republican party. For some, that is fine.

    But a Pentecostal fundamentalist with a literalist interpretation of biblical scripture coupled with very harsh social intervention on the government level and a bulldog-style approach to foreign policy discussion scares the shit out of me. Throw all the possible lies on her part out the window. Just that first sentence. That is enough.

    One-hundred percent agreed, as a Republican-in-limbo.

    Salvation122 on
  • QinguQingu Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    And then we wind up in the retarded, "Well, Obama said he'd be a new kind of politician, so that makes every transgression of his a hundred times worse, and since McCain only has 50 times as many transgressions, Obama is actually twice is bad" zone and we bicker for awhile before something shiny distracts us.

    Comparisons aside, isn't pointing out ways in which Obama is "buisness as usual" a valid tactic? You yourself admitted that part of his draw was the ability to somehow fundamentally change things.
    His fundamental draw for me is his ability to fundamentally change Republican things into Democratic things.

    Talking about ending politics is usual is politics as usual. Bush did it, McCain did it, Obama did it; I wouldn't be surprised if every presidential candidate has done it in an attempt to appeal to the segment of independent voters in swing states that essentially decides every single election.

    Qingu on
  • SithDrummerSithDrummer Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    ironzerg wrote: »
    Medopine wrote: »
    tuxkamen wrote: »

    This has been bugging me for a while.

    America. I don't know why you're doing it, but it's weird. Please stop.
    Are you an American, or are you an American't??

    Oops! Typo.

    You're right. That typo complete invalidates anything I stand for.
    Not that it does, but I've counted you using that typo at least half a dozen times in this thread and the last. It is a little weird.

    SithDrummer on
This discussion has been closed.