It's a pretty terrible review? I'm not really sure what a lot of his complaints are about. Old Sonic games have always had a sort of flashy, surreal flat puzzle-game look. Beyond the first two acts of the first zone the game is very, very platforming heavy and very light on the running. And the bosses are not cheap in any way. Hard, sure, but they all follow simple patterns.
It sounds to me like he came in having not played the old Sonic games in 10 years, with some nebulous idea of the great joy he was expecting, and then got mad when the game wasn't the second coming of christ. It's a good game. The stage design is excellent, the music is bitchin', the bosses are clever twists on old designs, and the special stages are probably a better mix of fun and infuriatingly hard than any previous ones.
See, that's the sort of thinking that makes me think the game is getting a pass by most. Emulating the old style to a tee is nice but in today's world of video games it needs to feel fresh, which is why NSMB is a perfect game to compare it to. Sonic 4 definitely doesn't do that. It's an okay game (I would say good might be a bit too strong for my taste). It's definitely a good Sonic game, but that really isn't saying much.
If anything, they'll need to do something interesting so that Episode 2 (and 3?) doesn't feel like part of a whole game. I kind of don't see that happening.
Sega stated outright that Sonic 4 was targeted specifically at older Sonic fans (i.e. the nostalgic folk). And after so long, this audience was ready to pounce on ANYTHING that wasn't quite the same.
The one major game-altering addition in Sonic 4?
The homing attack.
The addition that takes up at least twenty pages of bitching in this very thread?
The homing attack.
It seems like Sega and Dimps did a solid job catering to the impossible expectations of their audiences. If you want something different, just wait for Colors. That's the game Sega's making for you.
Then get Sonic Colours? I don't see a problem with them having both a more retro game and another where they experiment.
I've always felt the mark of a great game is one that can do both in the same game and not have to dilute a franchise in such a way. Maybe that's just me though.
Sega stated outright that Sonic 4 was targeted specifically at older Sonic fans (i.e. the nostalgic folk). And after so long, this audience was ready to pounce on ANYTHING that wasn't quite the same.
The one major game-altering addition in Sonic 4?
The homing attack.
The addition that takes up at least twenty pages of bitching in this very thread?
The homing attack.
It seems like Sega and Dimps did a solid job catering to the impossible expectations of their audiences. If you want something different, just wait for Colors. That's the game Sega's making for you.
I'm no nostalgia fan honestly. I'm going off what other 2D Sonic games have done in the last 10 years. I'm not going to judge this game in some kind of vacuum for the sake of Sega's marketing department.
I got the cheevo for finishing Splash Hill Zone Act 1 in under a minute. That was not easy to do by any stretch!
For me it was just learning the right route (basically, you have to get to the top of the zone and stay there), but the pain in the ass part was that any mistake you make will remove your chance, which is pretty irritating with the way the lock on doesn't always work the way you expect it to.
frankly i dont care much for episode 1. but if theres one thing i like about this project its the episodic nature. by the time episode 2 comes out they can work all that feedback into the game and maybe it will result in a better expierience. i GUESS its best to just wait out until sonic 4 is one complete game and grab that anyway.
carmofin on
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Then get Sonic Colours? I don't see a problem with them having both a more retro game and another where they experiment.
I've always felt the mark of a great game is one that can do both in the same game and not have to dilute a franchise in such a way. Maybe that's just me though.
Welcome to the world of Sonic fandom, where you have a rabid fanbase that's going to rip anything apart that's not a remake of their rose-tinted memories of the genesis games and flipping the fuck out if he doesn't quite jump like he used to.
I still maintain that it's a very solid game on its own combating everyone's entirely different definitions of what their ideal sonic game is.
Psycho Internet Hawk on
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited October 2010
I actually did it by going the lower route and upper. I did 2/3 up and 1/3 down, the speed shoes really helped out. I would have done a better time if I hadn't cocked up a homing attack.
Edit: I like the game because it is fun. Something that other recent sonic games have not been. Only the daytime levels of unleashed (and even then, certain ones in particular while others can DIAF) have reminded me why I enjoy Sonic.
I actually did it by going the lower route and upper. I did 2/3 up and 1/3 down, the speed shoes really helped out. I would have done a better time if I hadn't cocked up a homing attack.
Down... and then up?
I'm gonna have to give that a shot.
I took the spring on the upper path right after the first fish waterfall, homing attacked the pile of rocks after the quarter-pipe, took that spring up, then the spring that was on the left next to the item boxes, held right for a while, blasted through the wall, did a huge springjump, homed into some floating badniks, took another spring, and then held right for a while.
Then get Sonic Colours? I don't see a problem with them having both a more retro game and another where they experiment.
I've always felt the mark of a great game is one that can do both in the same game and not have to dilute a franchise in such a way. Maybe that's just me though.
Yeah well, unfortunately Sega has the Sonic fandom to contend with, which for the most part wants conflicting things out of the game. The very same game that you feel is too much of a retread has people complaining that it's not exactly like the original games. In this very thread. How the hell do you make a game for such a market.
Then get Sonic Colours? I don't see a problem with them having both a more retro game and another where they experiment.
I've always felt the mark of a great game is one that can do both in the same game and not have to dilute a franchise in such a way. Maybe that's just me though.
Welcome to the world of Sonic fandom, where you have a rabid fanbase that's going to rip anything apart that's not a remake of their rose-tinted memories of the genesis games and flipping the fuck out if he doesn't quite jump like he used to.
As an old school fan, I LOVED SA1, but after that it was just a huge downward spiral (with the exception of the Advance games). SEGA just kept shitting out THOUSANDS of bad ideas that simply did not work with the series. I honestly feel that Sonic 4 and Colors are a step in the right direction.
With all this being said, I can't quite shake off the feeling that you seem to think this series is incapable of making a bad game, and that any criticism directed towards any of the recent games is just "rabid fanboyism". It's probably just me, though.
As an old school fan, I LOVED SA1, but after that it was just a huge downward spiral (with the exception of the Advance games). SEGA just kept shitting out THOUSANDS of bad ideas that simply did not work with the series. I honestly feel that Sonic 4 and Colors are a step in the right direction.
With all this being said, I can't quite shake off the feeling that you seem to think this series is incapable of making a bad game, and that any criticism directed towards any of the recent games is just "rabid fanboyism". It's probably just me, though.
Uh....are you mistaking me for TSR? Because I never said I like the recent Sonic games.
Unleashed is 50% of a good game and 50% of a bad one, 2006 is....well, 2006, and I even maintain that secret rings was pretty alright but mostly a missed opportunity, unlike most of Sonic fandom who really like it. Oh yeah, and Black Knight, which I played the demo of and then never wanted to touch again.
Hell, I don't even like Rush that much. I can't think of a Sonic game I've seriously enjoyed since SA2 10 years ago....and I love Sonic 4
As an old school fan, I LOVED SA1, but after that it was just a huge downward spiral (with the exception of the Advance games). SEGA just kept shitting out THOUSANDS of bad ideas that simply did not work with the series. I honestly feel that Sonic 4 and Colors are a step in the right direction.
With all this being said, I can't quite shake off the feeling that you seem to think this series is incapable of making a bad game, and that any criticism directed towards any of the recent games is just "rabid fanboyism". It's probably just me, though.
Are we including SA2 here, because that game was pretty good, and gets far more flak then it deserves.
At the very least, a game where people have so much argument about the quality is a step up from the usual sonic game where absolutely everyone hates it
Sonic's been abused for a long time now, it's gonna take a lot if therapy before he's back to his old self again
This is pretty much all of what Colours consists of from what I played, and it breaks my heart that it's not on HD platforms.
What would the game gain on the HD platforms that it doesn't already do on the Wii?
Well here's a question that contains it's own answer. HD. If there was a PS360 version that played the same but in 720p, why the hell wouldn't you want that instead?
Secondly, not everyone owns a Wii. Maybe he's heartbroken over not being able to play it at all due to not owning one.
Dirty on
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Waka LakaRiding the stuffed UnicornIf ya know what I mean.Registered Userregular
Only the daytime levels of unleashed (and even then, certain ones in particular while others can DIAF) have reminded me why I enjoy Sonic.
This is pretty much all of what Colours consists of from what I played, and it breaks my heart that it's not on HD platforms.
What would the game gain on the HD platforms that it doesn't already do on the Wii?
Also I freaking love Sonic Unleashed. All of it.
None, I just don't have a Wii.
Nothing to do with power -> More about the exclusivity cloudeagle.
DS it is then.
Then why not buy a Wii this Christmas? It's dirt cheap these days and there's a ton of great games available for it.
Yeah, it's really tempting now with Metroid Prime Trilogy, Galaxy 1 and 2,NSMB, Sonic Colours and GoldenEye, but I've got a few debts to clear up before I do that.
I am staunchly anti-homing attack, so this basically killed it for me
Then don't use the homing attack?
But the game was designed around including the homing attack which is dumb because that's a 3D thing for the stupid 3D games and
ugh
I don't care for it
I'm watching the video, and for the most part it's just Jeff (he's the player right?) being his usual incompetent self when it comes to playing. I love the website and most of their content, but they can't play for shit.
Only the daytime levels of unleashed (and even then, certain ones in particular while others can DIAF) have reminded me why I enjoy Sonic.
This is pretty much all of what Colours consists of from what I played, and it breaks my heart that it's not on HD platforms.
What would the game gain on the HD platforms that it doesn't already do on the Wii?
Also I freaking love Sonic Unleashed. All of it.
None, I just don't have a Wii.
Nothing to do with power -> More about the exclusivity cloudeagle.
DS it is then.
Then why not buy a Wii this Christmas? It's dirt cheap these days and there's a ton of great games available for it.
Yeah, it's really tempting now with Metroid Prime Trilogy, Galaxy 1 and 2,NSMB, Sonic Colours and GoldenEye, but I've got a few debts to clear up before I do that.
Dunno your location, but there's also the Mario Wii bundle coming down the pipe. (Heh) It hasn't been announced for the US yet but I'd imagine it'll be here before Christmas.
That and Toys R Us is doing their Buy 2 Get 1 Free sale this week on both games and accessories, so it's a good time to start your library of games and your collection of accessories if you're interested. Best Buy usually has one around this time of year as well.
Dunno your location, but there's also the Mario Wii bundle coming down the pipe. (Heh) It hasn't been announced for the US yet but I'd imagine it'll be here before Christmas.
That and Toys R Us is doing their Buy 2 Get 1 Free sale this week on both games and accessories, so it's a good time to start your library of games and your collection of accessories if you're interested. Best Buy usually has one around this time of year as well.
Australia, dunno if the TR'U here will do it.
That Mario LE Wii is pretty damn sexy though. God I'm on the edge here.
Not going to touch Black Knight or Secret Rings, but if Colours ends up being good, I'm going to have to Credit card this bastard.
Like, what is even the purpose of the spin dash if you can just do an air dash and instantly be going fast
I just don't understand it
There's no air-dash, it's just the homing attack being done without an enemy.
And you use the spin dash if you're on an incline or want to make sure you don't nail an enemy. Homing attack is for platforming/mid-air speed. It works very well.
The only problem I could see with a no homing attack run (based on the demo) is that Sonic refuses to stay in a ball when he goes off the end of a ramp.
Dunno your location, but there's also the Mario Wii bundle coming down the pipe. (Heh) It hasn't been announced for the US yet but I'd imagine it'll be here before Christmas.
That and Toys R Us is doing their Buy 2 Get 1 Free sale this week on both games and accessories, so it's a good time to start your library of games and your collection of accessories if you're interested. Best Buy usually has one around this time of year as well.
Australia, dunno if the TR'U here will do it.
That Mario LE Wii is pretty damn sexy though. God I'm on the edge here.
Not going to touch Black Knight or Secret Rings, but if Colours ends up being good, I'm going to have to Credit card this bastard.
Black Knight is fairly terrible but Secret Rings has its moments, and you can find it on the dirt cheap these days so I'd say grab it, personally.
For me, the thing that made me less inclined to buy the game in that video were the areas where it looked like a chore to actually progress. Which goes beyond the player sucking; it looked like there were a few areas where you HAD to go through some weirdly complicated maneuvers just to get out rather than just saying "screw it, I'll take my chances on the bottom" and proceeding from there. It's the same kind of thing that annoyed me on, say, the airship and pyramid levels of Sonic and Knuckles.
For me, the thing that made me less inclined to buy the game in that video were the areas where it looked like a chore to actually progress. Which goes beyond the player sucking; it looked like there were a few areas where you HAD to go through some weirdly complicated maneuvers just to get out rather than just saying "screw it, I'll take my chances on the bottom" and proceeding from there. It's the same kind of thing that annoyed me on, say, the airship and pyramid levels of Sonic and Knuckles.
There's, like, one puzzle in the whole game. The solution to it is in this very thread. Don't let that dissuade you!
Posts
It's a pretty terrible review? I'm not really sure what a lot of his complaints are about. Old Sonic games have always had a sort of flashy, surreal flat puzzle-game look. Beyond the first two acts of the first zone the game is very, very platforming heavy and very light on the running. And the bosses are not cheap in any way. Hard, sure, but they all follow simple patterns.
It sounds to me like he came in having not played the old Sonic games in 10 years, with some nebulous idea of the great joy he was expecting, and then got mad when the game wasn't the second coming of christ. It's a good game. The stage design is excellent, the music is bitchin', the bosses are clever twists on old designs, and the special stages are probably a better mix of fun and infuriatingly hard than any previous ones.
If anything, they'll need to do something interesting so that Episode 2 (and 3?) doesn't feel like part of a whole game. I kind of don't see that happening.
The one major game-altering addition in Sonic 4?
The homing attack.
The addition that takes up at least twenty pages of bitching in this very thread?
The homing attack.
It seems like Sega and Dimps did a solid job catering to the impossible expectations of their audiences. If you want something different, just wait for Colors. That's the game Sega's making for you.
I've always felt the mark of a great game is one that can do both in the same game and not have to dilute a franchise in such a way. Maybe that's just me though.
I'm no nostalgia fan honestly. I'm going off what other 2D Sonic games have done in the last 10 years. I'm not going to judge this game in some kind of vacuum for the sake of Sega's marketing department.
For me it was just learning the right route (basically, you have to get to the top of the zone and stay there), but the pain in the ass part was that any mistake you make will remove your chance, which is pretty irritating with the way the lock on doesn't always work the way you expect it to.
___
NNID: carmofin
3DS: 2852 6971 9745
Throw me a PM if you add me
Welcome to the world of Sonic fandom, where you have a rabid fanbase that's going to rip anything apart that's not a remake of their rose-tinted memories of the genesis games and flipping the fuck out if he doesn't quite jump like he used to.
I still maintain that it's a very solid game on its own combating everyone's entirely different definitions of what their ideal sonic game is.
Edit: I like the game because it is fun. Something that other recent sonic games have not been. Only the daytime levels of unleashed (and even then, certain ones in particular while others can DIAF) have reminded me why I enjoy Sonic.
This is pretty much all of what Colours consists of from what I played, and it breaks my heart that it's not on HD platforms.
Tumblr
Down... and then up?
I'm gonna have to give that a shot.
I took the spring on the upper path right after the first fish waterfall, homing attacked the pile of rocks after the quarter-pipe, took that spring up, then the spring that was on the left next to the item boxes, held right for a while, blasted through the wall, did a huge springjump, homed into some floating badniks, took another spring, and then held right for a while.
As an old school fan, I LOVED SA1, but after that it was just a huge downward spiral (with the exception of the Advance games). SEGA just kept shitting out THOUSANDS of bad ideas that simply did not work with the series. I honestly feel that Sonic 4 and Colors are a step in the right direction.
With all this being said, I can't quite shake off the feeling that you seem to think this series is incapable of making a bad game, and that any criticism directed towards any of the recent games is just "rabid fanboyism". It's probably just me, though.
TWITTER TWATS
Uh....are you mistaking me for TSR? Because I never said I like the recent Sonic games.
Unleashed is 50% of a good game and 50% of a bad one, 2006 is....well, 2006, and I even maintain that secret rings was pretty alright but mostly a missed opportunity, unlike most of Sonic fandom who really like it. Oh yeah, and Black Knight, which I played the demo of and then never wanted to touch again.
Hell, I don't even like Rush that much. I can't think of a Sonic game I've seriously enjoyed since SA2 10 years ago....and I love Sonic 4
TWITTER TWATS
Are we including SA2 here, because that game was pretty good, and gets far more flak then it deserves.
Sonic's been abused for a long time now, it's gonna take a lot if therapy before he's back to his old self again
http://www.audioentropy.com/
What would the game gain on the HD platforms that it doesn't already do on the Wii?
Also I freaking love Sonic Unleashed. All of it.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
Inflate your e-peen.
Watch it if you are on the fence
I am staunchly anti-homing attack, so this basically killed it for me
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Well here's a question that contains it's own answer. HD. If there was a PS360 version that played the same but in 720p, why the hell wouldn't you want that instead?
Secondly, not everyone owns a Wii. Maybe he's heartbroken over not being able to play it at all due to not owning one.
None, I just don't have a Wii.
Nothing to do with power -> More about the exclusivity cloudeagle.
DS it is then.
Tumblr
This, pretty much.
Tumblr
Then why not buy a Wii this Christmas? It's dirt cheap these days and there's a ton of great games available for it.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
Yeah, it's really tempting now with Metroid Prime Trilogy, Galaxy 1 and 2,NSMB, Sonic Colours and GoldenEye, but I've got a few debts to clear up before I do that.
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But the game was designed around including the homing attack which is dumb because that's a 3D thing for the stupid 3D games and
ugh
I don't care for it
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
I'm watching the video, and for the most part it's just Jeff (he's the player right?) being his usual incompetent self when it comes to playing. I love the website and most of their content, but they can't play for shit.
Twitter
Dunno your location, but there's also the Mario Wii bundle coming down the pipe. (Heh) It hasn't been announced for the US yet but I'd imagine it'll be here before Christmas.
That and Toys R Us is doing their Buy 2 Get 1 Free sale this week on both games and accessories, so it's a good time to start your library of games and your collection of accessories if you're interested. Best Buy usually has one around this time of year as well.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
This is a pretty terrible reason to not play a really good game.
Like, what is even the purpose of the spin dash if you can just do an air dash and instantly be going fast
I just don't understand it
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Australia, dunno if the TR'U here will do it.
That Mario LE Wii is pretty damn sexy though. God I'm on the edge here.
Not going to touch Black Knight or Secret Rings, but if Colours ends up being good, I'm going to have to Credit card this bastard.
Tumblr
There's no air-dash, it's just the homing attack being done without an enemy.
And you use the spin dash if you're on an incline or want to make sure you don't nail an enemy. Homing attack is for platforming/mid-air speed. It works very well.
Black Knight is fairly terrible but Secret Rings has its moments, and you can find it on the dirt cheap these days so I'd say grab it, personally.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
There's, like, one puzzle in the whole game. The solution to it is in this very thread. Don't let that dissuade you!