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I know what you did last summer

ChubblyChubbly Registered User regular
edited October 2009 in Debate and/or Discourse
Alternatively, psychic murder body searchers are huge dicks:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10602927&ref=rss
NZ Herald wrote:
Psychic wrong on Aisling, sceptics say

A television psychic who claimed to have seen where the body of Aisling Symes was last week was not only wrong, but she should be ashamed of exploiting a family's pain, says the head of a sceptics group.

Two-year-old Aisling was discovered last night in a drain in a property next door to where she went missing a week ago.

Police are now investigating exactly how she got into the drain and how long she had been there for.

On a Facebook page dedicated to finding Aisling, a Symes family spokesperson said they were not interested in hearing from psychics.

"Please do not suggest psychics, the family are a strong Christian family, and will not consider this under any circumstances," they said.

"I know you are all just trying to think of anything to help but it's not helpful for us to see that on here, sorry," the message said.

But last Wednesday, Sensing Murder medium Deb Webber said she had details about the case during an interview on TVNZ's Breakfast programme.

"I was walking past the television and [Aisling] popped up, and I went, 'Oh, she's in a ditch, hole, in West Auckland'," she said.

"That's what I got instantly."

NZ Skeptics (crrct) chair Vicki Hyde said Webber's prediction was wrong.

"Well a ditch is not a drain," she told NZPA.

"It's not sensing murder, it's sensing opportunity, sensing exploitation and there's nothing worse than exploiting parents who are under such strain and stresses."

TVNZ were not blameless either, Ms Hyde said.

They were guilty of using the situation as a marketing ploy, both for the station and the psychics, she said.

"There's really no entertainment value in watching a family go through this sort of agony over a week wondering what's happening to their missing child. And nor should there be."

There had been numerous examples of psychics making claims that were incorrect, she said.

"There was a missing guy in Wellington who was said to have been abducted by a bunch of Maori in a beaten up car, when in fact he had fallen down a skylight after a night on the town.

Psychic Margaret Birkin was also convinced she could find the bodies of Olivia Hope and Ben Smart between Maud Island and Dart Rock in Pelorus Sound.

She was accompanied by four other psychics and three divers, but the search came to nothing.

"That must have been terrible for the parents," Ms Hyde said.

"Everyone always says 'Oh well it doesn't harm, they're just trying to help'.

"They know damn well there's harm."

- NZPA

Standard story about psychic mediums claiming to know where body is located, wrong as usual. However, more interesting to me is the final part: Family makes it very clear they do not want a psychic having anything to do with this, yet this ass comes forward anyway, claiming knowledge about the whereabouts of the body.

Skeptic group jumps in and calls psychic on her bullshit, and media fracas ensues. Who holds the rights here? And what is this harm in the practical sense? Besides trampling over the victims, is there any harm being caused by a massive dick trying to bolster her own image?

Chubbly on

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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Chubbly wrote: »
    Besides trampling over the victims, is there any harm being caused by a massive dick trying to bolster her own image?

    What do you mean besides? That's kind of a problem if they don't want crazy people trying to use crazy magic to help.

    Quid on
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Perpetuating this bullshit is harmful to society as a whole, in that it gets people believing in things like homeopathic medicine, psychic healing, etc., who then decide to skip out on chemotherapy or radiation for their cancer in favor of "law of attraction"-style bullshit.

    Thanatos on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited October 2009
    The problem is really only when the gullible take the psychics seriously and devote time and energy to their claims when that time and energy could better be spent using non-crazy means of solving a case.

    I mean, aside from the part where the psychics are huge dicks exploiting a grieving family for personal gain.

    ElJeffe on
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    ChubblyChubbly Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    The problem is really only when the gullible take the psychics seriously and devote time and energy to their claims when that time and energy could better be spent using non-crazy means of solving a case.

    I mean, aside from the part where the psychics are huge dicks exploiting a grieving family for personal gain.
    Article wrote:
    She was accompanied by four other psychics and three divers, but the search came to nothing.

    4 other psychics, who gives a shit. But three divers? I guess the question is, do these people cause enough harm that they should be actively silenced (i.e laws) or is it more a harmful nuisance (yeah...) but still not worthy of some sort of active restraint?

    Edit: While this article doesn't make it clear, I suppose some of these ventures are supported by public money. I don't know if this is the case, but is this another case of harm?

    Chubbly on
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    RingoRingo He/Him a distinct lack of substanceRegistered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Divers love to dive. My dive instructor was a Search and Rescue Diver who gets called in by the police mostly to perform Search and Recovery for things like sunk evidence or drowning victims. He does it because he loves being underwater, and I'm sure if any 'psychics' were convincing enough, he'd probably dive for them too.

    Ringo on
    Sterica wrote: »
    I know my last visit to my grandpa on his deathbed was to find out how the whole Nazi werewolf thing turned out.
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    MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Well I mean, just because you put something on your Facebook page doesn't mean everyone will read it.

    I'm not a fan of psychics though, especially when they prey on people who have lost someone.

    Malkor on
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    Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Yeah, even when psychics/other crackpots fail, the simple act of showing them consideration in the first place legitimizes them in the eyes of public as a potential source of hope, especially in cases where all other possibilities have been exhausted. After all, if consulting a psychic in spite of their prior failures is a legitimate choice, then what's one more failure going to do to change a person's mind?

    Robos A Go Go on
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    Dunadan019Dunadan019 Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    wait, the prediction was wrong because a ditch is not a drain?

    what kind of drain are they talking about here?

    not that psychics do anything more than educated guess work.

    Dunadan019 on
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    JandaruJandaru New ZealandRegistered User regular
    edited October 2009
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    wait, the prediction was wrong because a ditch is not a drain?

    what kind of drain are they talking about here?

    An underground pipe, just big enough for a 2-year-old to crawl through. There was an improperly secured manhole in a neighbour's driveway.

    Hearing a child has gone missing and blurting out "oh, she's lying in a ditch somewhere," is perhaps the least helpful statement a 'psychic' could make.

    Jandaru on
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    Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    My dad actually claims to be psychic as well, though he isn't the sort that tries to solve murders. As far as I can tell, being psychic just means having an unusual amount of confidence in your guesses and also doing something here and there to confirm your own predictions. In his case, he's sustained his belief in himself through predictions of his own future which he himself feels compelled to fulfill. If he "sees" himself doing something in the future for reasons that seem unclear, he'll do just that with the expectation that something important will happen. Right off the bat, he's made sure that his prediction comes by putting him in the exact situation he envisioned, and from there the only thing standing in the way of complete vindication is whether or not something interesting happens. When something does happen, it feeds his notions, and when something doesn't he can chalk it up to the universe being a mysterious thing. In short, he's constructed a psychic fantasy that, due to its design, can never be refuted to his satisfaction.

    Now this murder psychic obviously can't fulfill her own predictions, but I do think she gears them in a way that leads to false positives. All you need to do to achieve that is a passing knowledge of how missing person's cases usually end. Guess the most likely scenario and you'll be right at least a few times, which is all you need to appear legitimate in the eyes of the gullible and bereft of hope.

    Robos A Go Go on
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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited October 2009
    "Psychics" waste the time and resources of authorities and the families of those missing, as well as trying their emotions.

    DarkPrimus on
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