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Thinking of getting a Gaming Laptop
italianranma
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Hey PA Community. Whenever I have any sort of question, this is the first place I come. You guys have been pretty awesome to me so far so here's my latest. I'm deploying in a little while, and I want to have a nice gaming rig while I'm there. I built my own PC (with your help!) and that's been working really well, but I don't think I'll have the space to get it there (in one piece anyway). Previously I bought a gaming laptop (from Toshiba I think) and it got outdated pretty quickly. I remember it absolutely shit itself playing oblivion, not to mention how hot it got. This time around I'm a little smarter, and I did some cursory window shopping and here's what I found.
Now the goal here is to be able to play Dragon Age: Origins and any other new games that will be out in 2010 at medium to high graphic settings with good framerates (50FPS). As a wag I'm looking to spend somewhere between $1500 to $2250 on just the laptop (I'll also buy a laptop messenger bag, and an external cooler, but those aren't factored in to the cost). I understand that gaming laptops use a lot of power, and so run hotter and noisier than my little travel netbook. But at the same time I want to be able to hear the game and any movies I watch without a headset (I remember the fan in my last gaming laptop being so loud that even with the volume turned up I couldn't even hear the background music of WoW). 15" sounds about right to me: I think the last laptop I had was that size. 22" or greater probably won't even fit in my travel pod. Now I've only been looking since yesterday: I checked out what Amazon and Newegg had, and because it got mentioned on the front page of PA I checked out Alienware too.
Manufacturer [size]" [resolution] [price]
CPU
Memory
GPU
HD space
fill-ins
Alienware 15" (1920X1080) $1,974
Intel Core i7 720QM 1.6GHz (2.8 GHz Turbo Mode, 6MB Cache)
NVIDIA GTX 260M
4GB DDR 3 (1033) (1333 +$100)
320GB SATAII
Windows Vista Home Premium + Windows 7 coupon, LED screen
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?
c=us&cs=19&l=en&oc=DKCWFW1&s=dhs&~lt=alienware
AMNB 15.4" [1200x 800] $849.99 (other version +$50 for built in webcam)
AMD Mobile Athlon X2 QL62A (2.0GHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 2000 FSB)
4GB DDR2 800Hz
NVIDIA GT 130M 512MB
320GB SATA
Windows Vista Home, free Windows 7 upgrade
http://www.amazon.com/AMNB-P1082-Display-Notebook-802-11b-
Windows/dp/B002SQRPKM/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1255630945&sr=1-13
Asus 14" [1366 x 768] $999.99
Intel Core 2 Duo P8700 (2.53GHz) 3mb cache
NVIDIA GeForce GT 120M 1GB
4GB SO-DIMM (wtf is that?)
320GB
Windows Vista, LED backlight, good customer reviews
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220565
Asus 15.4" [1366 x 768] $949.99
Intel Core 2 Duo P8700 (2.53GHz) 3mb cache
NVIDIA GeForce GT 240M 1GB
4GB
320GB
Windows Vista, Like reviews to above product: LED vs. LCD and GPU are only differences.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220566
Asus 15.6" [1920 x 1080] $1,599.99
Intel Core 2 Duo T9600 2.8GHz
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260M 1GB
4GB
320GB
Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit, Complaints about heat.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220577
Here are some specific questions I have:
1) I've got rudimentary understanding of graphics cards: Is the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260M 1GB going to provide those expectations I have above? Can I get away with something less powerful? and would I want to (I do want to use this rig for at least a whole year)
2) I've heard a little discussed on LED v LCD technology: as I understand it LED runs cooler and takes less power. Has anyone noticed a difference in power consumption or any other factors? Or should this be a non-issue in my decision.
3) I know that I want DDR2 RAM, I've never heard of DDR3 (but I'm assuming it's better) The alienware has the option for DDR3 1333GHz, when I rarely see the speed of the RAM discussed. Is there a significant improvement, and would I want that option if I take the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260m to get the most out of it.
4) finally what other manufacturers/options are out there for the barely computer literate consumer?
Thanks again PA. I make no claims about my understand of computers, so if there are other issues I need to consider, please by all means educate me.
Now the goal here is to be able to play Dragon Age: Origins and any other new games that will be out in 2010 at medium to high graphic settings with good framerates (50FPS). As a wag I'm looking to spend somewhere between $1500 to $2250 on just the laptop (I'll also buy a laptop messenger bag, and an external cooler, but those aren't factored in to the cost). I understand that gaming laptops use a lot of power, and so run hotter and noisier than my little travel netbook. But at the same time I want to be able to hear the game and any movies I watch without a headset (I remember the fan in my last gaming laptop being so loud that even with the volume turned up I couldn't even hear the background music of WoW). 15" sounds about right to me: I think the last laptop I had was that size. 22" or greater probably won't even fit in my travel pod. Now I've only been looking since yesterday: I checked out what Amazon and Newegg had, and because it got mentioned on the front page of PA I checked out Alienware too.
Manufacturer [size]" [resolution] [price]
CPU
Memory
GPU
HD space
fill-ins
Alienware 15" (1920X1080) $1,974
Intel Core i7 720QM 1.6GHz (2.8 GHz Turbo Mode, 6MB Cache)
NVIDIA GTX 260M
4GB DDR 3 (1033) (1333 +$100)
320GB SATAII
Windows Vista Home Premium + Windows 7 coupon, LED screen
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?
c=us&cs=19&l=en&oc=DKCWFW1&s=dhs&~lt=alienware
AMNB 15.4" [1200x 800] $849.99 (other version +$50 for built in webcam)
AMD Mobile Athlon X2 QL62A (2.0GHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 2000 FSB)
4GB DDR2 800Hz
NVIDIA GT 130M 512MB
320GB SATA
Windows Vista Home, free Windows 7 upgrade
http://www.amazon.com/AMNB-P1082-Display-Notebook-802-11b-
Windows/dp/B002SQRPKM/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1255630945&sr=1-13
Asus 14" [1366 x 768] $999.99
Intel Core 2 Duo P8700 (2.53GHz) 3mb cache
NVIDIA GeForce GT 120M 1GB
4GB SO-DIMM (wtf is that?)
320GB
Windows Vista, LED backlight, good customer reviews
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220565
Asus 15.4" [1366 x 768] $949.99
Intel Core 2 Duo P8700 (2.53GHz) 3mb cache
NVIDIA GeForce GT 240M 1GB
4GB
320GB
Windows Vista, Like reviews to above product: LED vs. LCD and GPU are only differences.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220566
Asus 15.6" [1920 x 1080] $1,599.99
Intel Core 2 Duo T9600 2.8GHz
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260M 1GB
4GB
320GB
Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit, Complaints about heat.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220577
Here are some specific questions I have:
1) I've got rudimentary understanding of graphics cards: Is the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260M 1GB going to provide those expectations I have above? Can I get away with something less powerful? and would I want to (I do want to use this rig for at least a whole year)
2) I've heard a little discussed on LED v LCD technology: as I understand it LED runs cooler and takes less power. Has anyone noticed a difference in power consumption or any other factors? Or should this be a non-issue in my decision.
3) I know that I want DDR2 RAM, I've never heard of DDR3 (but I'm assuming it's better) The alienware has the option for DDR3 1333GHz, when I rarely see the speed of the RAM discussed. Is there a significant improvement, and would I want that option if I take the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260m to get the most out of it.
4) finally what other manufacturers/options are out there for the barely computer literate consumer?
Thanks again PA. I make no claims about my understand of computers, so if there are other issues I need to consider, please by all means educate me.
飛べねぇ豚はただの豚だ。
italianranma on
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Posts
Here is the best place I know of to look up comparisons of all those mobile GPUs: notebookcheck.net
One thing to keep in mind is that the lower rez your screen is, the longer your video card will be able to keep up with new games.
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
Also, you can just lower the resolution if need be.
Don't buy Alienware, as it's overpriced. You might want to look at Dell's and HP's websites, as you'll be able to customize the processor/GPU to fit what you're looking for. I can't speak for the reliability of Dell's laptops, but my HP is on it's 4th year and running fine.
SO-DIMM RAM is what's included in all laptops, as it's a smaller form factor.
The laptop you linked only has an LED backlight, it still uses an LCD screen. I've no idea what the benefits to that are, you might want to do some research.
It's not a significant enough improvement to require DDR3. However, as PCs are moving to DDR3, you'll likely see the price of DDR2 rise and the price of DDR3 fall, which might be something to keep in mind.
Thanks for the advice: I totally didn't know that. The article mentioned using two GTX 260 in SLI. As I understand it, it's pretty difficult to modify laptops in that way, so I'd have to find it in that configuration to start with. Is that right?
Also from my limited understanding if I were to spring for two, it wouldn't necessarily increase my performance (the link stated 0-40% faster).
Actually from rereading it, upgrading to a GTX 280 would significantly increase performance. That wasn't an option on the Alienware page, is that something I could install myself?
Finally I don't understand what it means when chips are 'clocked higher'.
Correct, it isn't really worth the price.
Doubtful at best. You can click on the description of the chip, and it will link you to laptops that have that GPU.
You probably do: it's the GHz/MHz of a chip. The clock rate is the speed at which the CPU or GPU performs it's calculations.
EDIT: Oh, and they're sold through sites like XoticPC.com. Go there and look at the specs and prices to see if any of that works for you, if you want.
How can it be that no domestic brands have the NVIDIA 280M?
I did go to the Sager website though, and for the same price as the alienware laptop, I got the equivelent size and spec Sager but with the better 280M GPU. So it's very tempting.
How is the heat and noise of your Sager?
About four years ago I bought the best alienware laptop available (it cost roughly four thousand dollars). It needed an external cooler just to run wow at more than ten fps (which you have wisely opted for), and it broke down repeatedly. The graphics card fused after about 5 months of use, whereupon customer support mailed me the wrong card three times to replace it myself. Eventually I made them replace it. About five months later, the entire computer failed and when I sent it back to repair they tried to charge me 1400 pounds (roughly 2800 dollars) for the repairs, as I was about a week out of warranty.
It wasn't worth it, the computer was terribly designed, the customer service was dreadful and the computer was available elsewhere for a much lower price. Please take this into consideration before buying alienware - at the least check to see other people's experiences with that particular model.
Intel Core 2 Duo P8600 (2.4GHz, 1066MHz FSB, 3MB L2 Cache)
4GB DDR3
Geforce 9800M GTS with 1GB GDDR3
320GB 7200RPM
http://www.gateway.com/systems/product/529668240.php
There's also one with a faster processor (P8700) and a 500GB HDD for $150 more
I tried a Gateway laptop at a recent LAN party, and it felt pretty solid. It was relatively new, but it seemed like it would hold up well.
It's not loud at all, and while it gets a little hot underneath, it stays cool inside, and it never gets so hot that you can't keep it on your lap. I opted for a SSD drive instead of a HD with moving parts, mostly to avoid heat issues, but I don't know if it made a huge difference. In any case, the thing flies, and it doesn't get nearly as hot as my 12" Dell XPS used to (that thing would absolutely fry my skin). I recommend heading to the forums over at NotebookReview and asking around, just to get some more opinions. I too was a bit nervous about getting something from a company that wasn't domestic, but I chatted with some reps at XoticPC and they were all really nice and knowledgeable guys, and the thing shipped quickly and safely. I was assured by forum-goers that customer service is solid, because you actually deal with the seller and their support centers, rather than the company (Clevo?) that builds the laptops overseas.
IRT the post above mine, I also looked at a Gateway - I used to hate their desktops, but they seem to be making some strides in budget-priced gaming laptops.
Not saying all Sagers are like that now, I just know I won't be buying any gaming laptops from now on.
Get a Sager 900F, its by fare the best laptop on the market right now. It backs a DESKTOP i7 processor, and an nVidia 280m 1gb for graphics. For me, it's golden. I'm running 6 gigs of 1333 ram with 3x intel x25m g2 drives in a raid-0. The entire setup FLIES through games. I can run anything out there right now maxed out, with no AA of course. Of course, this doesnt include crysis.
Couple of links:
Amazon.com
Gentech Computers
XOTICPC
Newegg
Anyways, it comes with:
15.6" FHD LED WUXGA Glossy (1920x1080)
Intel® Mobile Core i7 720QM
4096 MB DDR3 1066MHz
640GB 7200RPM (2x320GB)
Super Multi DVD±R/RW / CDRW
Built In WIFI & Bluetooth
and Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit
They are for preorder right now, and release on 10/22.
Ive got one on preorder now.
Oh yeah, the price is the best part: $1450 US
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834114705
What does the community think of this laptop?
caffron said: "and cat pee is not a laughing matter"
Unless you need the 18.4" screen or the SSD, don't waste your money.
I'll let you know how it is.
caffron said: "and cat pee is not a laughing matter"
This might just be my experience, but a 17" inch screen is larger than I thought it was. 18.4" is kinda absurd.
Going 18 just makes sense to me.
caffron said: "and cat pee is not a laughing matter"
I took Martini's advice and just sat on my thumbs for a few weeks waiting for the newest releases. I don't want to wait too much longer: I need to have this computer in my hands by Dec 20th, or I'm just not going to get one at all.
The reason I'm getting this laptop is because I want to be able to play upcoming releases while I'm deployed. I've had a small change of heart: I don't need a laptop that will last a specified amount of time, instead I'm looking for something that's going to be a good buy. That being said, I don't want to pay anything over $2,000. I think I should be able to find something closer to the $1,000 range. Heat will be an issue, as will noise and overall durability. I'm not backpacking this thing around, so weight isn't a primary concern as I imagine a desktop replacement is going to be my best bet.
I've looked at the best that Newegg, Toshiba, Dell, Sager, and Amazon had to offer and came up with these choices:
Toshiba 18.4" Intel Core i7, 4GB, GeForce 250M $1450
Asus 16" Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB, GeForce GT 220M, $800 - this is obviously the step down, but it comes with two versions of Windows 7 which I imagine I'd be able to install one copy of on my desktop at home. The question is whether this will meet my needs and how long before I'd need to upgrade.
Sager NP8690 15.6", Intel Core i7, 4GB, GeForce GTX 280M, $2000. There was a lot of talk before about Sager, and to me the only advantage here is the graphics card which I can't seem to find on any domestic models. Still it seems like I'm paying a lot extra compared to that Toshiba model above.
Alienware 17" Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB, GeForce 260M $1950 - for $50 more I can get that Sager. I was just experimenting with the site: This build gets me about what I get with the Toshiba above...only that Toshiba is still better in just about every category.
Toshiba 16" Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB, GeForce 230M - $1100. This I guess would be the step down model from the first toshiba. It's got everything I need, I think. Would this meet my needs and when would I have to upgrade?
With that I've reached my limit for how much I can shop online today. Any suggestions are welcome.
I currently have a Sager, and I really like it. Mine's several years old now, it has one of the first Merom Core 2 mobile CPU's in it. The reason to pay a little more for a Sager (or Clevo really, as that's who builds the machines), if you have the budget, is that these guys are really good at building gaming laptops. They understand airflow and how to put their shells together such that you don't end up with a miniature sun on your hands.
The reason to buy an Asus is because they are solid and cheap. If you're going to go big money, get a Sager. If you want to stick to a budget, get an Asus, as they have the best bang for buck value.
Thirded!
I want to be able to play, in a nutshell, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, and the Sims 3 and have them run smoothly. Perfectly? Maybe not, but my desktop now is aging fast and continuous returns and purchasings of new graphics cards is getting boring. So I'm looking for about 2.0ghz, 2GB of ram, dual layer/DVD rom, and like 300gbs or so of hard drive space. I have no idea what I'm talking about, but this seems to be a reasonable average of optimal system reqs of aforementioned games. For example, I don't know what DDR2 means or how NVIDIA/GeForce ranks its designs. I assume 1600X whatever is better than 1500X2 whatever but wtf is all this Also, a 15 inch screen is perfect.
Here's some of the things I'm looking at:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Gateway+-+Laptop+with+AMD+Athlon%26%23153%3B+II+Dual-Core+Processor+-+Cherry+Red/9605152.p?id=1218130501411&skuId=9605152
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Gateway+-+Laptop+with+Intel%26%23174%3B+Core%26%23153%3B2+Duo+Processor+-+NightSky+Black/9548661.p?id=1218122908891&skuId=9548661
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Gateway+-+Laptop+with+Intel%26%23174%3B+Pentium%26%23174%3B+Processor+-+Burgundy/9614836.p?id=1218131338798&skuId=9614836
I need to have a macro for posting that link.
500 bucks will buy you a powerful gaming desktop computer but I don't know how much luck you'll have finding a laptop. Maybe you should check out the build thread sticky. We could hook you up, especially if you can salvage some parts from your current computer.
[edit] Also Dragon Age seems to rely on the CPU a lot. So that's another problem for a cheap laptop.
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
Over the next couple of weeks, I'll be looking into getting something gamey and laptop-like in the $1,500 range. I already have notebookcheck's benchmarks and most of the big-name manufacturers bookmarked, so I at least have a framework for the shopping with the clicking and the second-guessing.
What I'm looking for is, the deal. You know the one. The one that you just happened upon the other day and really wish you had the money to pick up.
If you have seen the deal, please report the deal here, so that I may buy the deal and bask in its goodness.
I've been poking around a couple of other threads, so if this is a retread to you...I dunno, go call your mother instead of reading this nonsense. She worries herself sick about you.
With that kind of money I am definitely going to advocate strongly that you buy a $800 desktop and a $400 netbook.
I forgot to mention (I did in another thread, but in my haste to not just copy-paste...) that this isn't an option for a few reasons.
Right now I'm looking for a laptop of average speed. I plan on gaming on it, but it won't be my primary gaming machine (Mostly I'd just use it at impromptu lan parties that I don't want to drag my tower to.)
The idea is to replace my current laptop, which is using a chinese replacement power supply that overheats so badly it cracked open the plastic. Plus the hinges are completely disintigrated so the screen needs to be proped up with a box or something. Also, it's missing the panel above the keyboard because the power switch broken. This is is a "well used" laptop.
I would perfer it to have have 4 gigs of ram, a good dedicated video card of at least 256mb and what passes for an adaquate cpu. It doesn't need to be cutting edge, but I'd perfer to avoid "budget' where possible, but I'd like it to be able to run, say, Source engine games at medium or higher settings. About how much would I be looking at spending here for that list of items? At what CPU and video card would people recommand. (I'm completely nuetral on the AMD vs Intel debate and ATI vs Nvidia debate)
Yes. 256mb is quickly becoming the minimum for new games.
And this is why I asked in the thread.
Nvidia cards will have less noticeable screen tearing without vsync than ATI, but ATI will usually have less of a performance hit with vsync enabled. My ATI 4650 has really sporadic stuttering problems with TF2. My Nvidias had a whole lot of problems, mostly in stability and (back in the day) adjusting to 4:3 format.
If you can, I'd highly suggest underclocking, or rather undervolting, the mainboard components in BIOS, if possible. All laptops run very hot when the graphics card is put under load, and so this is pretty much required for longterm stability. If your laptop suddenly starts stuttering or crashing for no good reason on games it could run fine before, that means you broke something from all that heat. Using the latest version video card drivers with a modded inf usually lets you overclock the graphics card after that and either help your laptop keep up with new games or turn it into a george foreman grill.
There are new laptops coming out with swappable graphics cards, but I've seen the prices on the cards themselves and they're really harsh.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
An Acer Aspire AS5739G-6959 NoteBook
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo T6600(2.20GHz)
15.6" 16:9 screen
4GB Memory DDR3 1066
320GB HDD 5400rpm
DVD Super Multi
NVIDIA GeForce GT 130M 1 Gig
Normally $799, but it's $649 ATM.
The cache on the CPU is only 2MB, but the rest of the machine looks pretty good for the price. What do you guys think?
But if that price is incentive enough for you...
Well, any machine with a 250M is wildly out of my price range.
I'm not looking for a top of the line gaming laptop here (that's what my PC is for) but something I can take on the go and do some good mid-range graphics with.
Even going to a 240M sends up the price 150 bucks. Though there's an open box laptop http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834115681R for roughly the same price as the 130M, though I'm guessing it has no warranty.
EDIT: Nevermind, they say that it might be missing accessories, such as the power supply
There's a machine with a 240m with a bigger screen (18.4) and a bigger harddive (500gigs) for $800.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834115681
Ugh, I hate this. This always happens. I find a machine I think is good, but for only $150 more I can get a better components, but I have no way in my mind to not only determine if the new components are worth $150 more, but if those components iare worth a 25% increase of price on the item.