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Video game sales thread: September's done. Use the new thread.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
Retailers who sell the iPod probably have a sizable CD/music section anyway... So you can still buy content directly from them.
Never said they were. But as a carrot to get retailers to get enthused about the Go, they ain't working.
Do you need to provide a carrot to the retailers? For general purpose retailers like Walmart, Target, Best Buy and Toys'R'Us, I imagine they're fine with the Go - it's a high margin item that doesn't take up a lot of shelf space. And for specialty gaming stores, the Go is a direct attack against their livelihood so no matter what you do there's not a whole lot you can do to change the fact that they hate you (just look at the rigged poll on Game Informer's website where 3 of the 4 choices are anti-PSP Go and it automatically votes for you and gives you one of the negative choices).
Actually yes, you need a carrot to the retailers when you sell a product that's not tied to the really high-margin games. The Go cuts them off from that revenue stream, and not just Gamestop. Sony runs the risk of annoying, well, pretty much every retailer.
Emphasis on general purpose stores. Walmart sells plenty of stuff for its own sake. If the PSP Go makes Walmart a decent amount of money per unit sold, then they should be fine with it, just like they're fine with selling MP3 players even though they're not getting the money for MP3 downloads.
In other news, Q Games (those dudes who shoehorn the word "Pixeljunk" in the name of all their games for no apparent reason) is getting pissed at the PSP. Reason? Piracy.
Q Games founder Dylan Cuthbert has said he is unlikely to port any more games to the PSP following large amounts of piracy surrounding the company's most recent title, PixelJunk Monsters Deluxe.
"I don't think we'll port anything else to the PSP," Cuthbert said on his Twitter (thanks vg247), "we have to see how [PixelJunk Monsters Deluxe] does as there's a 'lot' of piracy."
The PixelJunk series has become near synonymous with the PlayStation Network, and PixelJunk Monster Deluxe has been the high-water mark to date, grabbing a 9.0 earlier this month.
Sony's PSP has been plagued by piracy since soon after its launch in 2005, with the illegitimate games market just one of the reasons that it has traditionally lacked third party support.
The funny thing is that this is an example of an instance where having a UMD version of the game may have hurt sales overall. Thanks to the UMD's existence in Asia, pirates were able to get a hold of the game easily, hence all the pirating. If it had been exclusively DD, they probably would have gotten more sales.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
The key difference is that the iPod still allows you to rip your OWN music from CDs that you bought at said retailer.
Edit: Beat'd, hard.
Another factor is those accessories, though. Have you SEEN how many accessories are available for iPods? Best Buy usually has an entire aisle's worth. Now compare how many accessories are available (at retail) for the PSP. The popularity of the iPod allows them to make more on accessories than the PSP.
Cameron_Talley on
Switch Friend Code: SW-4598-4278-8875
3DS Friend Code: 0404-6826-4588 PM if you add.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
The iPod is popular...
lowlylowlycook on
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
So, after 17 months and 6.67 million sold in the US, Mario Kart Wii fell off the list. Not only did it fall off from the top 10, it fell off from the top 20 as well, though admittedly, its sales last month (120k) were below the sales for this month's #20 (132.4k).
I would bet that Mario Kart Wii (and Wii Play and New SMB DS) consistently sell in the same range month to month, so their appearance on the Top X charts depends entirely on how well or poor other games perform. They're probably still there behind the scenes, quietly chugging away, printing money.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
The iPod is popular...
But the point still stands. There are many products being sold at general purpose retail stores that are sold purely on their own merit and not through hope of any additional source of revenue down the line.
In a hypothetical future where all video games are available purely through DD, I can't imagine Walmart, Target, and other general purpose stores losing out on much. Heck, they might actually be better off because the hardware companies will be offering bigger margins on the hardware and they can use the space that would have been dedicated to game software for other things.
In other words, the iPod is popular. Music is popular and mainstream and widespread in appeal. So even if stores didn't make tons of money selling the absolute flood of first and third party ipod accessories like they do, there's still an extremely large and consistent market for music and the ipods themselves, and this market seems to constantly be getting reinvigorated with new stuff to keep interest and demand up.
Secondly the iPod allows you to buy CDs, and transfer them to your iPod. Stores sell CDs, and some people, even those with iPods, still like to buy CDs. Even I do. I will buy a CD to keep in my car and then put those songs on my iPod, as I don't always have my ipod with me in my car. I don't have to buy the same CDs again in order to do this.
The PSP, however, is already a kind of stumbling device in terms of sales. Jacking up the MSRP isn't going to help. It isn't a device in a major mainstream market like music. Everyone wants an ipod because everyone likes music, and it's a great music device. And the iPod is one of the most significant music playing devices around. It's popular and has major mainstream mindshare. The PSP dose not. It does a bunch of shit but most people see it as a gaming device. The market for that is tiny by comparison. And it doesn't have the major mainstream market mindshare that the iPod does. Hell the NDS is closer to having that than the PSP. And the PSP doesn't have the shitloads of accessories to sell with it; and even if it did, I'm not sure they'd ever take off the way all the junk accessories that retailers can sell to Ipod or Mac fanatics. Finally, the UMD situation is kind of messed up. For one, consumers can't buy UMDs then transfer them to the Go, so it is non-analogous to the iPod in that respect as far as retailers go. Secondly, supporting the Go is kind of like incentivizing not buying UMDs to their customers; and yet, retailers may want to keep stocking UMD games to stay competitive with selection.
More NPD Thread GAF hilarity. Guy used to post here.
You weren't very descriptive yourself.
I've made this argument hundreds of times; how can we point to a model where the top 5 percent of gamemakers prosper and say that it's sustainable? Repeatedly the top 10 for NPD consists of the same 8-10 companies; Nintendo, Sony, MS, Epic, Capcom, EA, Ubisoft, and Activision, with odd appearances by companies with higher budgets yet lower game yields like Bethesda and Sega. It would be all well and good if the market only consisted of these publishers, yet it's only been reduced to that. Good luck sniffing the top 10 if your budget can't compete with that of any of these devs, and if it can, but bombs anyway? Shutter your doors.
What of the Mid and lower tier games? Would smaller developers like Atlus, Marvelous, or Majesco survive for one minute if they had to compete with these companies and play with the same budgets? We constantly talk about the success of companies in the NPD threads because that's what we see; yet for some reason (most likely because the average GAFer doesn't care about these games) no one asks, "where are the smaller titles on the 360 and PS3?"
No doubt someone will shout XBLA/PSN in retort, however both services aren't exactly a haven for mid tier devs as they've been lauded. Show me the explosion of support on XBLA, PSN, or even WiiWare for devs that are bigger than indies, but smaller than mega companies like Activision?
Basically if you're not a huge budget title/publisher or don't make plans to be one, you're DOOOOOOOMED.
I just thought of something interesting, what makes the PSP Go any different to retailers than the iPod?
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
The iPod is popular...
But the point still stands. There are many products being sold at general purpose retail stores that are sold purely on their own merit and not through hope of any additional source of revenue down the line.
In a hypothetical future where all video games are available purely through DD, I can't imagine Walmart, Target, and other general purpose stores losing out on much. Heck, they might actually be better off because the hardware companies will be offering bigger margins on the hardware and they can use the space that would have been dedicated to game software for other things.
The point doesn't stand. When the ipod initially launched, the response from retailers was the same. It was a untested market and thought to be an nonviable product. Its immense success validated the cost to retailers.
The PSP Go doesn't and probably won't ever have that kind of reach.
Comparing anything to an ipod is a total misnomer because in almost every sense of a product, the ipod is an outlier. An anomaly.
The response from retailers was low because it was an Apple product back when they were still clawing themselves out of the hell they called The Nineteen Nineties.
MP3 players, on the other hand, were a niche but decent market. I think the Rio was the big hit back then.
The iPod was a success because Apple sold the illusion that it was easier to use and put it all in a hip looking package.
But the point still stands. There are many products being sold at general purpose retail stores that are sold purely on their own merit and not through hope of any additional source of revenue down the line.
You're right, except, most of the products you are referring to did not go from being one type of revenue source model to a completely different type in the middle of their product life cycle.
In a hypothetical future where all video games are available purely through DD, I can't imagine Walmart, Target, and other general purpose stores losing out on much. Heck, they might actually be better off because the hardware companies will be offering bigger margins on the hardware and they can use the space that would have been dedicated to game software for other things.
Maybe in the future, yes, but the problems for retailers with the Go isn't a problem of the future, is a problem of Sony making a clusterfuck of matters regarding the PSP right now.
More NPD Thread GAF hilarity. Guy used to post here.
You weren't very descriptive yourself.
I've made this argument hundreds of times; how can we point to a model where the top 5 percent of gamemakers prosper and say that it's sustainable? Repeatedly the top 10 for NPD consists of the same 8-10 companies; Nintendo, Sony, MS, Epic, Capcom, EA, Ubisoft, and Activision, with odd appearances by companies with higher budgets yet lower game yields like Bethesda and Sega. It would be all well and good if the market only consisted of these publishers, yet it's only been reduced to that. Good luck sniffing the top 10 if your budget can't compete with that of any of these devs, and if it can, but bombs anyway? Shutter your doors.
What of the Mid and lower tier games? Would smaller developers like Atlus, Marvelous, or Majesco survive for one minute if they had to compete with these companies and play with the same budgets? We constantly talk about the success of companies in the NPD threads because that's what we see; yet for some reason (most likely because the average GAFer doesn't care about these games) no one asks, "where are the smaller titles on the 360 and PS3?"
No doubt someone will shout XBLA/PSN in retort, however both services aren't exactly a haven for mid tier devs as they've been lauded. Show me the explosion of support on XBLA, PSN, or even WiiWare for devs that are bigger than indies, but smaller than mega companies like Activision?
I've always liked Deacon.
Haven't seen him around here in forever.
He's pretty level-headed.
Basically if you're not a huge budget title/publisher or don't make plans to be one, you're DOOOOOOOMED.
Not quite what he's saying.
He's saying that the market is heavily focused on the blockbuster sales model. So publishers think they have to spend a shitload and strike it rich. But with only a few companies ever succeeding in this model, because they can afford it, it leaves out the mid to small guys.
The small guys have very few avenues. They can't afford the blockbuster model on the PS3 and 360, and the Wii has its own issues with getting niche games to sell.
The PSN/XBLA/WW are great for itsy bitsy devs, but not for the mid-tier publishers. That avenue is too small for them, but the blockbuster model is too dangerous for them.
This is why we still see the mid tier guys like Atlus supporting the handhelds so much (and why they supported the PS2 for so long), and why they are willing to take risks on the Wii. Because there's less risk and they can maintain their budgets more conservatively.
That is what Deacon is saying.
In answer to Deacon's rhetorical question, "Where are the smaller games on 360/PS3, besides the XBLA/PSN games?" The answer is: on the handhelds, Wii, and in fewer and fewer instances, the PS2.
More NPD Thread GAF hilarity. Guy used to post here.
You weren't very descriptive yourself.
I've made this argument hundreds of times; how can we point to a model where the top 5 percent of gamemakers prosper and say that it's sustainable? Repeatedly the top 10 for NPD consists of the same 8-10 companies; Nintendo, Sony, MS, Epic, Capcom, EA, Ubisoft, and Activision, with odd appearances by companies with higher budgets yet lower game yields like Bethesda and Sega. It would be all well and good if the market only consisted of these publishers, yet it's only been reduced to that. Good luck sniffing the top 10 if your budget can't compete with that of any of these devs, and if it can, but bombs anyway? Shutter your doors.
What of the Mid and lower tier games? Would smaller developers like Atlus, Marvelous, or Majesco survive for one minute if they had to compete with these companies and play with the same budgets? We constantly talk about the success of companies in the NPD threads because that's what we see; yet for some reason (most likely because the average GAFer doesn't care about these games) no one asks, "where are the smaller titles on the 360 and PS3?"
No doubt someone will shout XBLA/PSN in retort, however both services aren't exactly a haven for mid tier devs as they've been lauded. Show me the explosion of support on XBLA, PSN, or even WiiWare for devs that are bigger than indies, but smaller than mega companies like Activision?
Basically if you're not a huge budget title/publisher or don't make plans to be one, you're DOOOOOOOMED.
I've always liked Deacon.
Haven't seen him around here in forever.
He's pretty level-headed.
I dunno. Couple of weeks ago, all of the delays to not compete with Modern Warfare 2 also spelled DOOOOOM for the industry.
He completely ignores the companies that do well in a niche and small market and ignores the companies that have started targeting Live.
I dunno. Couple of weeks ago, all of the delays to not compete with Modern Warfare 2 also spelled DOOOOOM for the industry.
To be fair, I haven't read any of his stuff outside this forum, and while he was here, he rarely said anything. When he did, though, it wasn't really all that crazy or out-there.
His MW2 comment, which I haven't read, probably is this argument:
Publishers are afraid of competing in the Fall, since last fall was so horrible for everyone with so much competition. The result is that they all delay until Spring of the next year. But the problem with that is since they've all done it, the competition is now just as bad, except, there's not as much money being spent post-holiday season. And thus, publishers have made the situation worse for themselves than the one they were trying to avoid in the first place.
I have to wonder how much money Mass Effect 2 is going to lose from releasing their game at the end of January instead of before Christmas. I know for myself personally, it would have been an easy purchase for Christmas, but at the end of January, I'm probably still going to be content with all my Christmas/Birthday games and by the time I'm looking to buy new games, other stuff will be out at which point, I might just decide to wait for Mass Effect 2 to hit the bargain bins.
I wonder how much money the industry is going to lose because of the massive amount of games that have been shunted over to a period of time when sales have traditionally been exceptionally weak. It's a break for games like us because we buy games frequently and don't like droughts, but we disregard the humongous number of people that just pick up a title at the holiday season.
I'll agree, January is a pretty awful time to release a new game, since everyone's got hangovers from Christmas buying sprees, as Rainbow said. But it seems like there's a bunch of relatively big-name January releases this year thanks to the stampede from Christmas. Hang on, lemme check.
Edit: Here we go. Bayonetta, Army of Two II, Dark Void, The Licensed Name of Tom Clancy Presents Splinter Cell, No More Heroes 2, Mass Effect 2 and MAG all hit in January. That's absurd.
I'm also still amazed that Guitar Hero: Sammy Who? drop Dec. 20. Other than that, it's nothing but pure shovelware for most of the rest of the month. Activision really is treating it like a red-headed stepchild.
Wordherder on
Why the crap did I ever make my original name "cloudeagle?"
0
Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
Releasing games in January isn't as bad as releasing a game the week after Christmas. *Yes I'm looking at your Crystal Bearers* :x
January is also a period of post-Christmas cash influx. Either due to people exchanging shit or just simply gaining new monies squirreled away.
There will never be a 'perfect' time period to release anything and any bunching of releases is going to have the same effect. Christmas was just always seen as the optimal time since that's when everybody is out buying worthless crap anyway... That this period of the year has been doing worse and worse over the years for everybody, not just video games, probably shouldn't be considered, right?
Videogames industry analyst Michael Pachter says that Borderlands has been 'sent to die'.
"Sent to die... I think Borderlands is the definition of a game that should have had its own window and not be up against all this stuff," Pachter explains.
"It's absolutely the same audience. I don't think it's as much an RPG as they would like us to believe. If it's an RPG, Dragon Age is going to kick its butt; and if it's a shooter, Call of Duty or something else is going to kick its butt."
Yeah, January you can get people with gift cards and Xmas cash...
..but you really miss out on that opportunity for gamers to have their friends and family buy them games straight away. With so few games to buy their gamer friends, they're left to buy them other stuff. When that money might have otherwise gone to games.
Sure, some of these people will give the gamer cash instead of a game as a gift, but I tend to think that family and friends want to actually give them something, instead of just cash; outside of like Parents and maybe Grandparents.
And so, missing out on Holiday spending doesn't just "push" over the same amount of money that would have been spent into January in the form of gift cards and cash. A fair amount of spending will be done in January, sure, but I don't think it'll make up for what was "lost" by moving Fall competition into post-holiday season. Not for all publishers, but for many, there are going to be some games that get seriously overlooked in a time when there's fewer dollars going around. And if not overlooked, simply not bought due to having games/buying other games or not spending after having already spent a shitload of money in the holidays.
Any early word how Brutal Legend is doing? Curious, as people seemed to have been really hyped for it, then it just kinda landed with a meh it seems. Also wondering how Uncharted 2 may had affected it.
Nah, it's good to hear his take on things. Sometimes he can be sensible, other times he can make statements that are utterly absurd, but it's still interesting to talk about why he may be right or may be wrong.
I really don't get the internet lingo he's been using a lot of lately, though. I think he should kind of try and avoid doing that when speaking in more ... professional environments.. or whatever.
Any early word how Brutal Legend is doing? Curious, as people seemed to have been really hyped for it, then it just kinda landed with a meh it seems. Also wondering how Uncharted 2 may had affected it.
It landed #7 spot for the week in the UK on release.
Uncharted kicked its butt at #2 though.
Fifa, Uncharted, Flashpoint, Wii Sports Resort, Mario *& Sonic, seem to all have beaten it out on its release week.
The PSN/XBLA/WW are great for itsy bitsy devs, but not for the mid-tier publishers. That avenue is too small for them, but the blockbuster model is too dangerous for them.
Also, I largely disagree with this. A quick look at the released and upcoming list of Live titles on Wiki has a pretty decent selection of mid sized developers and publishers and the support is growing.
Check out the recently announced Hydrophobia. Cro Team are porting Serious Sam. Epic purchased Chair Entertainment. Etc.
Videogames industry analyst Michael Pachter says that Borderlands has been 'sent to die'.
"Sent to die... I think Borderlands is the definition of a game that should have had its own window and not be up against all this stuff," Pachter explains.
"It's absolutely the same audience. I don't think it's as much an RPG as they would like us to believe. If it's an RPG, Dragon Age is going to kick its butt; and if it's a shooter, Call of Duty or something else is going to kick its butt."
I dunno. I don't think it will do major. 400K was my estimate. Which is also my estimate for Dragon Age.
Yeah, January you can get people with gift cards and Xmas cash...
..but you really miss out on that opportunity for gamers to have their friends and family buy them games straight away. With so few games to buy their gamer friends, they're left to buy them other stuff. When that money might have otherwise gone to games.
Sure, some of these people will give the gamer cash instead of a game as a gift, but I tend to think that family and friends want to actually give them something, instead of just cash; outside of like Parents and maybe Grandparents.
And so, missing out on Holiday spending doesn't just "push" over the same amount of money that would have been spent into January in the form of gift cards and cash. A fair amount of spending will be done in January, sure, but I don't think it'll make up for what was "lost" by moving Fall competition into post-holiday season. Not for all publishers, but for many, there are going to be some games that get seriously overlooked in a time when there's fewer dollars going around. And if not overlooked, simply not bought due to having games/buying other games or not spending after having already spent a shitload of money in the holidays.
That's the thing though... This all comes down to whatever else is available at the time. If you release your game during a period where there is a lot of cash floating around, you have a better chance of picking some of that up for yourself. But around Christmas, that extra cash is also going to things other than video games.
Releasing during any other period will always mean less available money, but more focus on your particular brand of entertainment. Gamers buy games year round, they just don't seem to release games year round...
This Christmas is probably going to be worse than last year's, in terms of the raisins or something. In spite of all the rosy, glowing news reports you'll hear claiming it to be a wonderful period for the shops. Worrying about potential lost sales because you decided to release during a time when you could actually get more exposure compared to everything else possible is the least of it.
A game that was meant to succeed will succeed no matter when it's released.
The PSN/XBLA/WW are great for itsy bitsy devs, but not for the mid-tier publishers. That avenue is too small for them, but the blockbuster model is too dangerous for them.
Also, I largely disagree with this. A quick look at the released and upcoming list of Live titles on Wiki has a pretty decent selection of mid sized developers and publishers and the support is growing.
Check out the recently announced Hydrophobia. Cro Team are porting Serious Sam. Epic purchased Chair Entertainment. Etc.
Croteam's really a PC developer, though, and bringing an older title (with revamped graphics) isn't out of the realm of other old games getting remix ports on the services..
I guess my main point was that people like Atlus are doing most of their business on the handhelds these days (and to lesser extent the Wii and a gradually disappating support for PS2), because there's less risk and less need of a huge budget as required by the HD systems, or the potential difficulty of cracking the Wii market.
Times might be changing, although I don't see stuff like the Shin Megami Tensei series, for example, coming out on XBLA.
Yeah, SMT probably isn't coming to XBLA, but Atlus has released stuff on XBLA (Droplitz) & has something coming out for XBLA next year (Zeno Clash). True, they didn't develop either game, but they're definitely putting their toe in the water so to speak.
Well balls, I was planning to get Borderlands before Dragon Age or MW2. I figure the 'all co-op, all the time' should be a pretty large defining feature, but we'll overlook that.
Yeah, SMT probably isn't coming to XBLA, but Atlus has released stuff on XBLA (Droplitz) & has something coming out for XBLA next year (Zeno Clash). True, they didn't develop either game, but they're definitely putting their toe in the water so to speak.
Oh lots of publishers, small and large, put little projects out for all of the services.
But right now a lot of the smaller publishers have jumped from the PS2 to the NDS/PSP/Wii this generation, for certain kinds of games, because the 360/PS3 are cost prohibitive and risky by comparison.
So we might see little puzzle games or ports of other stuff from these people on XBLA/PSN/WW. Small stuff like Bomberman, or puzzle games, or whatever.
But for games that are outside the current 'scope' of the XBLA/PSN/WW, we're going to be seeing those on the handhelds and/or Wii for a while. With some periodic exceptions.
January's place within the whole year flip-flops. In '08, Jan had the second-lowest sw revenue for the whole year. In '09, it'll be the 6th highest (I'm assuming Oct-Dec will best $.67b).
Posts
PSP Go downloads games from an online store
iPod downloads music from an online store
Both really don't offer retailers anything extra for revenue outside of accessories, which I'm sure Sony and third parties will be glad to start making and selling.
Retailers who sell the iPod probably have a sizable CD/music section anyway... So you can still buy content directly from them.
Do not engage the Watermelons.
Actually, people were pissed because GH5 turned Kobain's body into a veritable marionnette of extremely absurd and often disturbing displays.
I'd link to youtube but Actiblizz has removed all of the most hilarious videos of Kobain's corpse being desecrated in GH5.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Emphasis on general purpose stores. Walmart sells plenty of stuff for its own sake. If the PSP Go makes Walmart a decent amount of money per unit sold, then they should be fine with it, just like they're fine with selling MP3 players even though they're not getting the money for MP3 downloads.
The funny thing is that this is an example of an instance where having a UMD version of the game may have hurt sales overall. Thanks to the UMD's existence in Asia, pirates were able to get a hold of the game easily, hence all the pirating. If it had been exclusively DD, they probably would have gotten more sales.
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire,
The key difference is that the iPod still allows you to rip your OWN music from CDs that you bought at said retailer.
Edit: Beat'd, hard.
Another factor is those accessories, though. Have you SEEN how many accessories are available for iPods? Best Buy usually has an entire aisle's worth. Now compare how many accessories are available (at retail) for the PSP. The popularity of the iPod allows them to make more on accessories than the PSP.
3DS Friend Code: 0404-6826-4588 PM if you add.
The iPod is popular...
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
I would bet that Mario Kart Wii (and Wii Play and New SMB DS) consistently sell in the same range month to month, so their appearance on the Top X charts depends entirely on how well or poor other games perform. They're probably still there behind the scenes, quietly chugging away, printing money.
But the point still stands. There are many products being sold at general purpose retail stores that are sold purely on their own merit and not through hope of any additional source of revenue down the line.
In a hypothetical future where all video games are available purely through DD, I can't imagine Walmart, Target, and other general purpose stores losing out on much. Heck, they might actually be better off because the hardware companies will be offering bigger margins on the hardware and they can use the space that would have been dedicated to game software for other things.
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire,
Secondly the iPod allows you to buy CDs, and transfer them to your iPod. Stores sell CDs, and some people, even those with iPods, still like to buy CDs. Even I do. I will buy a CD to keep in my car and then put those songs on my iPod, as I don't always have my ipod with me in my car. I don't have to buy the same CDs again in order to do this.
The PSP, however, is already a kind of stumbling device in terms of sales. Jacking up the MSRP isn't going to help. It isn't a device in a major mainstream market like music. Everyone wants an ipod because everyone likes music, and it's a great music device. And the iPod is one of the most significant music playing devices around. It's popular and has major mainstream mindshare. The PSP dose not. It does a bunch of shit but most people see it as a gaming device. The market for that is tiny by comparison. And it doesn't have the major mainstream market mindshare that the iPod does. Hell the NDS is closer to having that than the PSP. And the PSP doesn't have the shitloads of accessories to sell with it; and even if it did, I'm not sure they'd ever take off the way all the junk accessories that retailers can sell to Ipod or Mac fanatics. Finally, the UMD situation is kind of messed up. For one, consumers can't buy UMDs then transfer them to the Go, so it is non-analogous to the iPod in that respect as far as retailers go. Secondly, supporting the Go is kind of like incentivizing not buying UMDs to their customers; and yet, retailers may want to keep stocking UMD games to stay competitive with selection.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Basically if you're not a huge budget title/publisher or don't make plans to be one, you're DOOOOOOOMED.
The point doesn't stand. When the ipod initially launched, the response from retailers was the same. It was a untested market and thought to be an nonviable product. Its immense success validated the cost to retailers.
The PSP Go doesn't and probably won't ever have that kind of reach.
Comparing anything to an ipod is a total misnomer because in almost every sense of a product, the ipod is an outlier. An anomaly.
MP3 players, on the other hand, were a niche but decent market. I think the Rio was the big hit back then.
The iPod was a success because Apple sold the illusion that it was easier to use and put it all in a hip looking package.
You're right, except, most of the products you are referring to did not go from being one type of revenue source model to a completely different type in the middle of their product life cycle.
Maybe in the future, yes, but the problems for retailers with the Go isn't a problem of the future, is a problem of Sony making a clusterfuck of matters regarding the PSP right now.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I've always liked Deacon.
Haven't seen him around here in forever.
He's pretty level-headed.
Not quite what he's saying.
He's saying that the market is heavily focused on the blockbuster sales model. So publishers think they have to spend a shitload and strike it rich. But with only a few companies ever succeeding in this model, because they can afford it, it leaves out the mid to small guys.
The small guys have very few avenues. They can't afford the blockbuster model on the PS3 and 360, and the Wii has its own issues with getting niche games to sell.
The PSN/XBLA/WW are great for itsy bitsy devs, but not for the mid-tier publishers. That avenue is too small for them, but the blockbuster model is too dangerous for them.
This is why we still see the mid tier guys like Atlus supporting the handhelds so much (and why they supported the PS2 for so long), and why they are willing to take risks on the Wii. Because there's less risk and they can maintain their budgets more conservatively.
That is what Deacon is saying.
In answer to Deacon's rhetorical question, "Where are the smaller games on 360/PS3, besides the XBLA/PSN games?" The answer is: on the handhelds, Wii, and in fewer and fewer instances, the PS2.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I dunno. Couple of weeks ago, all of the delays to not compete with Modern Warfare 2 also spelled DOOOOOM for the industry.
He completely ignores the companies that do well in a niche and small market and ignores the companies that have started targeting Live.
To be fair, I haven't read any of his stuff outside this forum, and while he was here, he rarely said anything. When he did, though, it wasn't really all that crazy or out-there.
His MW2 comment, which I haven't read, probably is this argument:
Publishers are afraid of competing in the Fall, since last fall was so horrible for everyone with so much competition. The result is that they all delay until Spring of the next year. But the problem with that is since they've all done it, the competition is now just as bad, except, there's not as much money being spent post-holiday season. And thus, publishers have made the situation worse for themselves than the one they were trying to avoid in the first place.
IT's a reasonable suggestion.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Do not engage the Watermelons.
Despite Slash being here longer!
lols; nice edit :P
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire,
And XSeed for that matter.
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Edit: Here we go. Bayonetta, Army of Two II, Dark Void, The Licensed Name of Tom Clancy Presents Splinter Cell, No More Heroes 2, Mass Effect 2 and MAG all hit in January. That's absurd.
I'm also still amazed that Guitar Hero: Sammy Who? drop Dec. 20. Other than that, it's nothing but pure shovelware for most of the rest of the month. Activision really is treating it like a red-headed stepchild.
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There will never be a 'perfect' time period to release anything and any bunching of releases is going to have the same effect. Christmas was just always seen as the optimal time since that's when everybody is out buying worthless crap anyway... That this period of the year has been doing worse and worse over the years for everybody, not just video games, probably shouldn't be considered, right?
Do not engage the Watermelons.
..but you really miss out on that opportunity for gamers to have their friends and family buy them games straight away. With so few games to buy their gamer friends, they're left to buy them other stuff. When that money might have otherwise gone to games.
Sure, some of these people will give the gamer cash instead of a game as a gift, but I tend to think that family and friends want to actually give them something, instead of just cash; outside of like Parents and maybe Grandparents.
And so, missing out on Holiday spending doesn't just "push" over the same amount of money that would have been spent into January in the form of gift cards and cash. A fair amount of spending will be done in January, sure, but I don't think it'll make up for what was "lost" by moving Fall competition into post-holiday season. Not for all publishers, but for many, there are going to be some games that get seriously overlooked in a time when there's fewer dollars going around. And if not overlooked, simply not bought due to having games/buying other games or not spending after having already spent a shitload of money in the holidays.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
If he's going to do that, I'd kill to hear him use the term "moneyhat."
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I really don't get the internet lingo he's been using a lot of lately, though. I think he should kind of try and avoid doing that when speaking in more ... professional environments.. or whatever.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
It landed #7 spot for the week in the UK on release.
Uncharted kicked its butt at #2 though.
Fifa, Uncharted, Flashpoint, Wii Sports Resort, Mario *& Sonic, seem to all have beaten it out on its release week.
That's all i got.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Also, I largely disagree with this. A quick look at the released and upcoming list of Live titles on Wiki has a pretty decent selection of mid sized developers and publishers and the support is growing.
Check out the recently announced Hydrophobia. Cro Team are porting Serious Sam. Epic purchased Chair Entertainment. Etc.
I dunno. I don't think it will do major. 400K was my estimate. Which is also my estimate for Dragon Age.
That's the thing though... This all comes down to whatever else is available at the time. If you release your game during a period where there is a lot of cash floating around, you have a better chance of picking some of that up for yourself. But around Christmas, that extra cash is also going to things other than video games.
Releasing during any other period will always mean less available money, but more focus on your particular brand of entertainment. Gamers buy games year round, they just don't seem to release games year round...
This Christmas is probably going to be worse than last year's, in terms of the raisins or something. In spite of all the rosy, glowing news reports you'll hear claiming it to be a wonderful period for the shops. Worrying about potential lost sales because you decided to release during a time when you could actually get more exposure compared to everything else possible is the least of it.
A game that was meant to succeed will succeed no matter when it's released.
Do not engage the Watermelons.
Croteam's really a PC developer, though, and bringing an older title (with revamped graphics) isn't out of the realm of other old games getting remix ports on the services..
I guess my main point was that people like Atlus are doing most of their business on the handhelds these days (and to lesser extent the Wii and a gradually disappating support for PS2), because there's less risk and less need of a huge budget as required by the HD systems, or the potential difficulty of cracking the Wii market.
Times might be changing, although I don't see stuff like the Shin Megami Tensei series, for example, coming out on XBLA.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire,
Oh lots of publishers, small and large, put little projects out for all of the services.
But right now a lot of the smaller publishers have jumped from the PS2 to the NDS/PSP/Wii this generation, for certain kinds of games, because the 360/PS3 are cost prohibitive and risky by comparison.
So we might see little puzzle games or ports of other stuff from these people on XBLA/PSN/WW. Small stuff like Bomberman, or puzzle games, or whatever.
But for games that are outside the current 'scope' of the XBLA/PSN/WW, we're going to be seeing those on the handhelds and/or Wii for a while. With some periodic exceptions.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
06 Dec --> 07 Jan
$1.7b in sw --> $0.55b in sw
07 Dec --> 08 Jan
$2.37b in sw --> $0.55b in sw
08 Dec --> 09 Jan
$2.75b in sw --> $0.67b in sw
January's place within the whole year flip-flops. In '08, Jan had the second-lowest sw revenue for the whole year. In '09, it'll be the 6th highest (I'm assuming Oct-Dec will best $.67b).