After craploads of terribad groups for HHoR... I ran into a premade from another realm. Two Ret Paladins, Resto Druid, and a ... something, DK or Rogue I think.
They were all a very steady 4k DPS. I was in heaven.
We got the achievement at the end for the Lich King "escape", and I got a pretty bitchin' tank helm. I kept joking with them that they're good enough for me to consider buying a realm-swap about halfway through :P
A healer friend and I went into the random heroic and got a group with a 4k DPS ret pally, and two of his FRESH 80 friends. They topped out at a staggering 700 dps. He argued that he makes up for the difference, and that I shouldn't complain. I argue that fresh 80's don't belong in Heroics (they've never touched ToC5), and just hold the group back, and it's unfair to the rest of the people in it.
I've run into a lot of people taking advantage of the new LFG to get into Heroics that they shouldn't be in... but in this case, I don't care how much DPS this guy did, he said he would bring them to HHoR, or any other Heroic. Called him a liar, we finished the group, etc...
I can have a gearscore of over 9000 and be in all caster cloth on my warrior.
Where does your GS addon show you that I make actual choices in what i use, and not just pick the thing with the highest ilvl. GS shows nothing but ilvl + if its enchanted or not. It doesn't take into effect any stats. You can have everything enchanted with spell power and spirit on your deathknight and get the exact same gearscore as another DK who enchants/gems properly.
It shows nothing but how many badges they've farmed basically, or if they are a fresh 80. If you need an addon to tell you the guy in greens and blues is fresh, then really, there should be an addon to keep you out of other peoples groups.
(you in the general sense, not you specifically Wolfman)
...if you've scanned someone with gearscore you can look at their gear. So that is what kind of tells you if they've farmed badges or not.
Oh, I'm sorry-I'm not going to do H HoL with a group of people in all blues. Just not going to happen.
Call me elitist, call me what you want-I'm just not going to fork over 100g on a repair bill for a heroic.
I have to laugh at this. This isn't elitism, its just foolish. I've tanked, healed, and dps H. HoL in nothing but quest blues. I've tanked in a set that was 5 DEF from Cap with a healer who hit 80 -that day-; and we didn't wipe. Not once.
Seriously what's your problem with HoL? I would think the tribunal would be a bigger PUG wrecker.
You seem to have some statistics problems. You assume correllation proves causation; and you've found a correllation between gear and skill. This is patently false, and really just laughable.
It is worth noting, though, that with pugging more popular than ever, there should be ways of deciding who just is or isn't geared enough to perform up to par. They do have at least some infrastructure at work, as when I was gearing my deathknight I was queuing for specific heroics, only to find the Icecrown 5 mans excluded from the list because my gear wasn't good enough.
I just don't understand why though. I mean for raids, sure, you don't want mouth breathers. But heroics were balanced, for the most part, around a total group dps of maybe 7k (three 1,500 dps and 1k from a tank), a healer with a mana pool that maybe broke 15k, and a tank who is def capped and sitting on perhaps 22k hp. The levels of pug elitism for heroics just boggles my mind.
Frankly, I would lay the blame squarely at heroics dropping conquest badges, because I suspect that change brought a lot of raiders into the pug pool who wouldn't otherwise have been there who raised standards for idiots who now refuse to do heroics with people who still have some blues and greens.
The launch heroics, sure. But the icecrown dungeons were not meant for fresh 80s. Not even trial of the champion.
Yes, but that's a small pool of instances a terrible noob can doom you. As an example, the other day I was tanking a violet hold with a DK friend of mine. We pugged a priest, a warlock, and a hunter. Right off the bat, the priest starts giving the 2 pugs shit for having scrub gear. The instance goes on and the priest says, "awesome, if there's one thing I love it's a dungeon where the tank is top dps." Which I was, barely ahead of my dk friend by maybe 100 dps on the overall, and nowhere near her on bosses. The hunter was doing 1500 dps, as I expect of fresh 80's, and the warlock was doing a staggering 400 dps. Not afk or anything, I saw him casting, he was doing things. I think by the end he had pushed his dps up to 700.
At any rate, we got through the instance, no wipes, took all of 20 minutes, but this priest was giving all the dps shit. Why? The instance went fine, you're never going to see these people again, and telling a complete stranger, hey you suck!" has never changed any minds. All you're doing is being a jerk, really. I mean, if we were wiping or the instance was taking forever, sure that's worth being mad over. Beind mad because I guess it wasn't going fast enough? What the hell ever.
Though I probably should have kicked tje lock. I was just too busy being blown away that somebody could put out those numbers unironicaly. Also he was a gnome with a lime green mohawk and facial hair, there was just something sureral about the whole thing. Like I was living some kind of internet meme.
< 1000 DPS indicates a massive gear shortage (DKs with spellpower gear) or someone that's mostly AFK or perhaps even a bot. The issue becomes the fact that for the most part now, random heroics consist of a tank/healer who carry 3 terrible DPS through for badges. I don't tell people they suck, but it doesn't give you the right to roll into a heroic in all quest greens and waste everyone's time by turning 8-10 min heroic runs into 30 min. Get some crafted BoEs and show some effort.
I can have a gearscore of over 9000 and be in all caster cloth on my warrior.
Where does your GS addon show you that I make actual choices in what i use, and not just pick the thing with the highest ilvl. GS shows nothing but ilvl + if its enchanted or not. It doesn't take into effect any stats. You can have everything enchanted with spell power and spirit on your deathknight and get the exact same gearscore as another DK who enchants/gems properly.
It shows nothing but how many badges they've farmed basically, or if they are a fresh 80. If you need an addon to tell you the guy in greens and blues is fresh, then really, there should be an addon to keep you out of other peoples groups.
(you in the general sense, not you specifically Wolfman)
...if you've scanned someone with gearscore you can look at their gear. So that is what kind of tells you if they've farmed badges or not.
Oh, I'm sorry-I'm not going to do H HoL with a group of people in all blues. Just not going to happen.
Call me elitist, call me what you want-I'm just not going to fork over 100g on a repair bill for a heroic.
I have to laugh at this. This isn't elitism, its just foolish. I've tanked, healed, and dps H. HoL in nothing but quest blues. I've tanked in a set that was 5 DEF from Cap with a healer who hit 80 -that day-; and we didn't wipe. Not once.
Seriously what's your problem with HoL? I would think the tribunal would be a bigger PUG wrecker.
You seem to have some statistics problems. You assume correllation proves causation; and you've found a correllation between gear and skill. This is patently false, and really just laughable.
So a DK in +900 spell power gear lacks absolutely no skill at playing this game? An ENH sham with mp5 gems?
I can have a gearscore of over 9000 and be in all caster cloth on my warrior.
Where does your GS addon show you that I make actual choices in what i use, and not just pick the thing with the highest ilvl. GS shows nothing but ilvl + if its enchanted or not. It doesn't take into effect any stats. You can have everything enchanted with spell power and spirit on your deathknight and get the exact same gearscore as another DK who enchants/gems properly.
It shows nothing but how many badges they've farmed basically, or if they are a fresh 80. If you need an addon to tell you the guy in greens and blues is fresh, then really, there should be an addon to keep you out of other peoples groups.
(you in the general sense, not you specifically Wolfman)
...if you've scanned someone with gearscore you can look at their gear. So that is what kind of tells you if they've farmed badges or not.
Oh, I'm sorry-I'm not going to do H HoL with a group of people in all blues. Just not going to happen.
Call me elitist, call me what you want-I'm just not going to fork over 100g on a repair bill for a heroic.
I have to laugh at this. This isn't elitism, its just foolish. I've tanked, healed, and dps H. HoL in nothing but quest blues. I've tanked in a set that was 5 DEF from Cap with a healer who hit 80 -that day-; and we didn't wipe. Not once.
Seriously what's your problem with HoL? I would think the tribunal would be a bigger PUG wrecker.
You seem to have some statistics problems. You assume correllation proves causation; and you've found a correllation between gear and skill. This is patently false, and really just laughable.
So a DK in +900 spell power gear lacks absolutely no skill at playing this game? An ENH sham with mp5 gems?
Ahh this old trope, taking an argument and assuming it extends infinitely. Theres a difference between poor gear and wrong gear. Gear Score sure as shit won't tell you this.
A quick inspect tells when you've got the scenario you describe, where as I'm talking about taking people in epics and rejecting people in blues on the assumption that the people in Blues do not know what they are doing. If you've got a DK wearing Holy Pally Plate, yes you've got someone that is utterly clueless.
I had somebody tell me I didn't belong in heroics and that I should farm normals on my lock, someone asked to show dps meters and when they did I was not only higher then him in full epics, but I was also buff spec helping the group out.
Also while doing a random toc when he first hit 80 I had 0 epics, and was called an idiot by the priest who was fully epicced and couldnt heal an ulduar geared tank through regular black knight.
Gear is in no way a point of skill since you can die on a boss and still collect gear while never learning anything.
I'm not really sure I get with all the gearscore hate. Yes, it's just a number. No, it doesn't take into account all the other subtleties of gemming, enchanting or appropriate gear choices. But in the end, doesn't it give you a sort of *broad* ballpark idea of where someone is on the gear ladder?
All of the people that claim to hate gs, seem to then go on to describe their gear as:
mostly naxx-25 with some ToTC pieces or
a mix of quest blues and easy badge gear or
4-piece T9 with i245 for everything else
or something like that. How is any of that different from gearscore? We make an assumption that you have chosen gear that is appropriate to your class and role and you tell us how shiny that gear is. Now, you will tell me that this is an unwarranted assumption for anyone using gearscore because anyone using gearscore is retarded so they will definitely have made retarded gear choices and that makes the gs number completely irrelevant.
But I dunno, that seems unnecessarily elitist to me. We all look for shorthand ways of describing how awesome our gear is and whether it's spellpower, unbuffed HP or average iLevel, I think we're all really doing much the same thing.
A healer friend and I went into the random heroic and got a group with a 4k DPS ret pally, and two of his FRESH 80 friends. They topped out at a staggering 700 dps. He argued that he makes up for the difference, and that I shouldn't complain. I argue that fresh 80's don't belong in Heroics (they've never touched ToC5), and just hold the group back, and it's unfair to the rest of the people in it.
I've run into a lot of people taking advantage of the new LFG to get into Heroics that they shouldn't be in... but in this case, I don't care how much DPS this guy did, he said he would bring them to HHoR, or any other Heroic. Called him a liar, we finished the group, etc...
I will say that after having 3 and 4 manned so many of the WoTLK heroics, the ret pally was probably right. One dude in ToTC-level gear can make a joke out of most of the heroics, and it gets stupid when you add more people with high-level gear. I would, however, like to give a o_O to his friends...
I am level 72 and have pulled higher DPS. Hell I've already broken 1k. In fact, I did a nexus run last night where EVERYONE (and we were all between 70-72) broke 1k dps.
If you're running Heroics, you should be doing it because you need the gear drops, otherwise, you're just farming badges. Yet, if you're farming badges, it's because you're a "noob" who can't earn real gear in 10 and 25 man raids. But, you still get the right to complain about people showing up in blues to heroic runs, because they need the gear drops. Which you're running so you can get the badges, that you need for gear, which means you're a "noob" who's gear score is all welfare and no skill. But that still gives you the right to complain about...wait a minute...
The reality is, the people farming badges want to do it with over geared folks like themselves, so the run is a faceroll, while the people who really need the gear drops in Heroic want to run with over geared folks unlike themselves, so the run is a faceroll.
Apparently having to work now to earn your badges or heroic level gear is a concept unknown to the PUGgers of 3.3.
So, does that imply that there's some formula by which you CAN mathematically rate someone's gear? Something that looks at the class, the spec, the gear, the gems, the enchants, rolls it all around through a series of EJ spreadsheets and comes out with a good number?
We did that for our EP/GP system in BC. Our resident OCD guy made formulas for each class and each spec, putting a score on how much they gained from each stat and each socket.
For loot purposes we then calculated a score for each class/spec for each epic from raids, and used the lowest score from all 21 calculations as the cost for that particular item.
In Wrath we just skipped to cost = ilvl with some modifiers for certain slots. :P
I'm not really sure I get with all the gearscore hate. Yes, it's just a number. No, it doesn't take into account all the other subtleties of gemming, enchanting or appropriate gear choices. But in the end, doesn't it give you a sort of *broad* ballpark idea of where someone is on the gear ladder?
I do that by hovering the mouse over them, pressing I, seeing the purple items with Fizzle, and going "yep, good enough."
Arbitrary numbers are arbitrary.
Echo on
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HalfmexI mock your value systemYou also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered Userregular
I'm not really sure I get with all the gearscore hate. Yes, it's just a number. No, it doesn't take into account all the other subtleties of gemming, enchanting or appropriate gear choices. But in the end, doesn't it give you a sort of *broad* ballpark idea of where someone is on the gear ladder?
On the gear ladder, sure. The problem with GearScore doesn't really have anything to do with gear; it has to do with ignorant people's reliance on it as an indicator of skill. "Oh, this person's GS is 5600, he's good, let's grab him". Lots of people want to latch onto GS as a quick and dirty 'should I invite this guy or not' notification, so they don't have to A) take a chance on them or do a quick cursory glance of the Armory themselves and see what that person's been up to.
This issue is further compounded by the fact that in about a month's time, maybe less, pretty much everyone will be sporting baseline full T9 gear, so now, even if you subscribed to the 'gear=skill' line of thought, that concept is destroyed. So then we're back to square one. Do your own research or just invite the guy and take a chance. The skilled people will still be skilled, the bads will still be bad, no kind of arbitrary number is going to be able to discern that for you.
Halfmex on
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GrobianWhat's on sale?Pliers!Registered Userregular
A healer friend and I went into the random heroic and got a group with a 4k DPS ret pally, and two of his FRESH 80 friends. They topped out at a staggering 700 dps. He argued that he makes up for the difference, and that I shouldn't complain. I argue that fresh 80's don't belong in Heroics (they've never touched ToC5), and just hold the group back, and it's unfair to the rest of the people in it.
I've run into a lot of people taking advantage of the new LFG to get into Heroics that they shouldn't be in... but in this case, I don't care how much DPS this guy did, he said he would bring them to HHoR, or any other Heroic. Called him a liar, we finished the group, etc...
The problem I have with this is the 700dps. The Warlock/priest duo I play with my girlfriend dinged 80 on Saturday. She was doing 1400 dps in the first instance we entered (with some drops, she is now up to 2000). While she is trying, and I do help her with specs/glyphs/gems she doesn't really care for the number crunching/using the perfect rotation so is probably not doing as much dps as someone else could with that character. Below 1000dps is just unacceptable for any 80.
On the other hand the Pally does make up for it, so I probably wouldn't complain if they at least get out of the fire etc.
I guess the answer to people complaining about PUGs is this:
You get 2 Badges of Frost for your first daily PUG. That's nearly the equivalent of downing an ICC boss. If you do a random PUG once a day, that's 14 extra badges a week, or about 5 ICC kills. And I'm willing to bet those groups will be a lot quicker and less painful for your average raider than earning your badge in ICC.
If you get in a geared faceroll, congrats. If you have to walk a couple fresh 80's through a heroic, well, that's a small price to pay.
ironzerg on
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HalfmexI mock your value systemYou also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered Userregular
Huh. That sounds like it would make the game 100000% more fun.
If you're not a raider, the game just went from "you don't have shit to do now that you're level capped" to "holy shit, groups all day and night, whee!"
It's really the best idea they've had in a very long time. Possibly ever. Can we say ever?
Interestingly, a friend of mine is/was a hardcore raider, and has had to go casual due to time constraints. I recently assembled something that resembles a tank set for my Pally.
When go instancing, she heals, I tank, she prefers I tank on my Pally (and at some point my warrior when he's got the set put together) as opposed to my DK who is geared up to ICC10. She says its more fun when she actually has to do something.
I guess the answer to people complaining about PUGs is this:
You get 2 Badges of Frost for your first daily PUG. That's nearly the equivalent of downing an ICC boss. If you do a random PUG once a day, that's 14 extra badges a week, or about 5 ICC kills. And I'm willing to bet those groups will be a lot quicker and less painful for your average raider than earning your badge in ICC.
If you get in a geared faceroll, congrats. If you have to walk a couple fresh 80's through a heroic, well, that's a small price to pay.
Fun fact- you get those badges even if you do a random instance on a non-80 character. Any northrend random gives you badges.
A healer friend and I went into the random heroic and got a group with a 4k DPS ret pally, and two of his FRESH 80 friends. They topped out at a staggering 700 dps. He argued that he makes up for the difference, and that I shouldn't complain. I argue that fresh 80's don't belong in Heroics (they've never touched ToC5), and just hold the group back, and it's unfair to the rest of the people in it.
I've run into a lot of people taking advantage of the new LFG to get into Heroics that they shouldn't be in... but in this case, I don't care how much DPS this guy did, he said he would bring them to HHoR, or any other Heroic. Called him a liar, we finished the group, etc...
I will say that after having 3 and 4 manned so many of the WoTLK heroics, the ret pally was probably right. One dude in ToTC-level gear can make a joke out of most of the heroics, and it gets stupid when you add more people with high-level gear. I would, however, like to give a o_O to his friends...
I am level 72 and have pulled higher DPS. Hell I've already broken 1k. In fact, I did a nexus run last night where EVERYONE (and we were all between 70-72) broke 1k dps.
Cripes I'm only 70 and still only have greens and blues save for my Lionheart Executioner and I was doing 800 in heroic MgT. Mind you that was the best group I've ever been in and it was a random heroic comprised of lvl 70-71 folks.
I don't think I've had a DPS class yet that I've been unable to break 2k dps with either right when I hit 80 or shortly thereafter. If someone is doing 700 dps at 80, it's a knowledge/skill/effort problem, not a function of their gear being blues.
Shit my hunter was doing 1700 dps on boss fights in SSC o.O
I guess the answer to people complaining about PUGs is this:
You get 2 Badges of Frost for your first daily PUG. That's nearly the equivalent of downing an ICC boss. If you do a random PUG once a day, that's 14 extra badges a week, or about 5 ICC kills. And I'm willing to bet those groups will be a lot quicker and less painful for your average raider than earning your badge in ICC.
If you get in a geared faceroll, congrats. If you have to walk a couple fresh 80's through a heroic, well, that's a small price to pay.
Fun fact- you get those badges even if you do a random instance on a non-80 character. Any northrend random gives you badges.
I think my level 72 death knight has like eight.
Which is equally sweet, because you can start piecing together some Frost Badge gear, and when you hit 80, you'll be able to start hitting raid content with your friends, and not have to bore them to death slogging through content they cleared months ago.
I'm 100% in-line with Blizzard's philosophy of challenging the elite players, but sliding the gear scale as content progress to maximizes the number of people who can play together and experience content, and I think the 3.3 PUG system was a great move.
EDIT: Guess not that sweet. Oh well, at least it's sweet for us geared 80's who get extra cracks at Frost Badges
You know, I try to stay away from being an elitist prick about certain things. I know not everyone is gonna read EJ, or TankSpot, or even here and know about min/maxing. I know this. But there are some things are inexcusable. I mean, it doesn't take any thinking to figure out that as a Hunter, spell power isn't for you. Or as a Mage, that maybe you don't need that +defense gem. Or that as a Warrior, spamming Rend isn't going to boost your DPS.
But I see people do this shit.
And I wonder how they function in their daily lives. Do they put water in their toaster to make hot coffee? Do they bring the towel into the shower with them so it's more convenient?
I wish I had the patience to learn and play the AH, since I'm too lazy for conventional farming. I just also have no interest in sitting in one place for 20 minutes looking at auctions every day /shrug
I've been doing pretty well with cooking lately, but there's a pretty limited amount that I can sell. Still, I was happy to buy northern spices for 40g per 100 yesterday.
Posts
They were all a very steady 4k DPS. I was in heaven.
We got the achievement at the end for the Lich King "escape", and I got a pretty bitchin' tank helm. I kept joking with them that they're good enough for me to consider buying a realm-swap about halfway through :P
I have 18000 gold, so it's no problem for me.
Why did you put an s after g?
A healer friend and I went into the random heroic and got a group with a 4k DPS ret pally, and two of his FRESH 80 friends. They topped out at a staggering 700 dps. He argued that he makes up for the difference, and that I shouldn't complain. I argue that fresh 80's don't belong in Heroics (they've never touched ToC5), and just hold the group back, and it's unfair to the rest of the people in it.
I've run into a lot of people taking advantage of the new LFG to get into Heroics that they shouldn't be in... but in this case, I don't care how much DPS this guy did, he said he would bring them to HHoR, or any other Heroic. Called him a liar, we finished the group, etc...
I have to laugh at this. This isn't elitism, its just foolish. I've tanked, healed, and dps H. HoL in nothing but quest blues. I've tanked in a set that was 5 DEF from Cap with a healer who hit 80 -that day-; and we didn't wipe. Not once.
Seriously what's your problem with HoL? I would think the tribunal would be a bigger PUG wrecker.
You seem to have some statistics problems. You assume correllation proves causation; and you've found a correllation between gear and skill. This is patently false, and really just laughable.
< 1000 DPS indicates a massive gear shortage (DKs with spellpower gear) or someone that's mostly AFK or perhaps even a bot. The issue becomes the fact that for the most part now, random heroics consist of a tank/healer who carry 3 terrible DPS through for badges. I don't tell people they suck, but it doesn't give you the right to roll into a heroic in all quest greens and waste everyone's time by turning 8-10 min heroic runs into 30 min. Get some crafted BoEs and show some effort.
So a DK in +900 spell power gear lacks absolutely no skill at playing this game? An ENH sham with mp5 gems?
Ahh this old trope, taking an argument and assuming it extends infinitely. Theres a difference between poor gear and wrong gear. Gear Score sure as shit won't tell you this.
A quick inspect tells when you've got the scenario you describe, where as I'm talking about taking people in epics and rejecting people in blues on the assumption that the people in Blues do not know what they are doing. If you've got a DK wearing Holy Pally Plate, yes you've got someone that is utterly clueless.
Also while doing a random toc when he first hit 80 I had 0 epics, and was called an idiot by the priest who was fully epicced and couldnt heal an ulduar geared tank through regular black knight.
Gear is in no way a point of skill since you can die on a boss and still collect gear while never learning anything.
All of the people that claim to hate gs, seem to then go on to describe their gear as:
mostly naxx-25 with some ToTC pieces or
a mix of quest blues and easy badge gear or
4-piece T9 with i245 for everything else
or something like that. How is any of that different from gearscore? We make an assumption that you have chosen gear that is appropriate to your class and role and you tell us how shiny that gear is. Now, you will tell me that this is an unwarranted assumption for anyone using gearscore because anyone using gearscore is retarded so they will definitely have made retarded gear choices and that makes the gs number completely irrelevant.
But I dunno, that seems unnecessarily elitist to me. We all look for shorthand ways of describing how awesome our gear is and whether it's spellpower, unbuffed HP or average iLevel, I think we're all really doing much the same thing.
I will say that after having 3 and 4 manned so many of the WoTLK heroics, the ret pally was probably right. One dude in ToTC-level gear can make a joke out of most of the heroics, and it gets stupid when you add more people with high-level gear. I would, however, like to give a o_O to his friends...
I am level 72 and have pulled higher DPS. Hell I've already broken 1k. In fact, I did a nexus run last night where EVERYONE (and we were all between 70-72) broke 1k dps.
If you're running Heroics, you should be doing it because you need the gear drops, otherwise, you're just farming badges. Yet, if you're farming badges, it's because you're a "noob" who can't earn real gear in 10 and 25 man raids. But, you still get the right to complain about people showing up in blues to heroic runs, because they need the gear drops. Which you're running so you can get the badges, that you need for gear, which means you're a "noob" who's gear score is all welfare and no skill. But that still gives you the right to complain about...wait a minute...
The reality is, the people farming badges want to do it with over geared folks like themselves, so the run is a faceroll, while the people who really need the gear drops in Heroic want to run with over geared folks unlike themselves, so the run is a faceroll.
Apparently having to work now to earn your badges or heroic level gear is a concept unknown to the PUGgers of 3.3.
We did that for our EP/GP system in BC. Our resident OCD guy made formulas for each class and each spec, putting a score on how much they gained from each stat and each socket.
For loot purposes we then calculated a score for each class/spec for each epic from raids, and used the lowest score from all 21 calculations as the cost for that particular item.
In Wrath we just skipped to cost = ilvl with some modifiers for certain slots. :P
I do that by hovering the mouse over them, pressing I, seeing the purple items with Fizzle, and going "yep, good enough."
Arbitrary numbers are arbitrary.
This issue is further compounded by the fact that in about a month's time, maybe less, pretty much everyone will be sporting baseline full T9 gear, so now, even if you subscribed to the 'gear=skill' line of thought, that concept is destroyed. So then we're back to square one. Do your own research or just invite the guy and take a chance. The skilled people will still be skilled, the bads will still be bad, no kind of arbitrary number is going to be able to discern that for you.
The problem I have with this is the 700dps. The Warlock/priest duo I play with my girlfriend dinged 80 on Saturday. She was doing 1400 dps in the first instance we entered (with some drops, she is now up to 2000). While she is trying, and I do help her with specs/glyphs/gems she doesn't really care for the number crunching/using the perfect rotation so is probably not doing as much dps as someone else could with that character. Below 1000dps is just unacceptable for any 80.
On the other hand the Pally does make up for it, so I probably wouldn't complain if they at least get out of the fire etc.
You get 2 Badges of Frost for your first daily PUG. That's nearly the equivalent of downing an ICC boss. If you do a random PUG once a day, that's 14 extra badges a week, or about 5 ICC kills. And I'm willing to bet those groups will be a lot quicker and less painful for your average raider than earning your badge in ICC.
If you get in a geared faceroll, congrats. If you have to walk a couple fresh 80's through a heroic, well, that's a small price to pay.
It's really the best idea they've had in a very long time. Possibly ever. Can we say ever?
When go instancing, she heals, I tank, she prefers I tank on my Pally (and at some point my warrior when he's got the set put together) as opposed to my DK who is geared up to ICC10. She says its more fun when she actually has to do something.
Fun fact- you get those badges even if you do a random instance on a non-80 character. Any northrend random gives you badges.
I think my level 72 death knight has like eight.
Frost badges (tier10) are only for the first random heroic. All other heroics then reward 2 triumph badges.
/edit: this was @Arch
You're still dealing with that guy? Are you still racing with him to the mailbox?
Yea, I typed frost and thought it was wrong...but still. Badges means at 80 I can jump into some gear a lot quicker.
Cripes I'm only 70 and still only have greens and blues save for my Lionheart Executioner and I was doing 800 in heroic MgT. Mind you that was the best group I've ever been in and it was a random heroic comprised of lvl 70-71 folks.
Shit my hunter was doing 1700 dps on boss fights in SSC o.O
Which is equally sweet, because you can start piecing together some Frost Badge gear, and when you hit 80, you'll be able to start hitting raid content with your friends, and not have to bore them to death slogging through content they cleared months ago.
I'm 100% in-line with Blizzard's philosophy of challenging the elite players, but sliding the gear scale as content progress to maximizes the number of people who can play together and experience content, and I think the 3.3 PUG system was a great move.
EDIT: Guess not that sweet. Oh well, at least it's sweet for us geared 80's who get extra cracks at Frost Badges
He's a paladin. Crusader aura. :P
He's literally out of the AH and back again in under five seconds.
I like to try and make a bit of gold on ah but I couldn't imagine it being a main source of income, or to the level that pally is going. That's crazy.
But I see people do this shit.
And I wonder how they function in their daily lives. Do they put water in their toaster to make hot coffee? Do they bring the towel into the shower with them so it's more convenient?
I hope he doesn't mean another VoA boss and it's really Mecha Drakkuru, no troll raids has made me a sad panda.
As long as it sells, of course. It's why Transmute Alchemist / Jewelcrafter is the most profitable profession combo right now.
The mob propensity to grab ass hopefully.
Edit: wait gustav isn't a paladin, is this a new person?
No idea. But I sold another Massacre right under his nose, so nyaaaaah.
I read about a hotfix to a DK ice spell only being able to work on one target at a time. Might be that.