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Sherlock Holmes

SaigaSaiga Registered User regular
edited January 2010 in Debate and/or Discourse
Didn't see a thread for the film so I decided to go ahead and start one.

I just got back from a press screening here in San Antonio, my hype doubled back in July when I saw the cast at the WB panel at San Diego Comic-Con and this film certainly beat even my hype and expectations. The cast chemistry was spot on, especially with Downey Jr. and Law, the dialogue was fantastic and the story carried it self perfectly from start to finish, I honestly didn't feel like it lost it's charm for a second.

I'm already getting ready to get tickets for the midnight screening later this week.

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Saiga on
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Oh shit it's out Friday?

    Yes. Best Christmas ever.

    Quid on
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    SaigaSaiga Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    When I realized we had passes it was truly a Christmas miracle, even more so when we actually gotten in because the theater was PACKED with people and they didn't exactly accommodate everyone with a pass.

    Saiga on
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    BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm pretty excited for this. Downey Jr. looks like he makes a great Sherlock Holmes.

    BloodySloth on
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    JoolanderJoolander Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    out friday?



    Well there isn't any time to waste then

    Joolander on
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    Wet BanditWet Bandit Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm torn. I love Sherlock Holmes, but I have an irrational hatred of Robert Downey Jr.

    Wet Bandit on
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    JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited December 2009
    Wet Bandit wrote: »
    I have an irrational hatred of Robert Downey Jr.

    How on earth does that happen?

    Jacobkosh on
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    see317see317 Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    Wet Bandit wrote: »
    I have an irrational hatred of Robert Downey Jr.

    How on earth does that happen?

    Show us on this Iron Man action figure where the bad man touched you.

    see317 on
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    Fatboy RobertsFatboy Roberts Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    My review over at Cracked.com

    http://www.cracked.com/article/18348_new-sherlock-holmes-lethal-weapon-2-in-victorian-clothes/

    My only real problem is that Rachel MacAdams, who I like, doesn't work in this movie. And I wish there were more moments where Holmes and Watson got to just talk at each other. The interplay was pretty golden.

    Fatboy Roberts on
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    Wet BanditWet Bandit Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    Wet Bandit wrote: »
    I have an irrational hatred of Robert Downey Jr.

    How on earth does that happen?

    I don't think I've ever enjoyed a movie he's been in. Keep in mind, though, that I was born in '83, so I missed out on his movies before his career tanked. And since his return, his most notable movies have been Iron Man and Tropic Thunder, and let's just say that playing Iron Man and taking part in the latest Ben Stiller movie, those aren't gonna exactly win me over.

    But like I said, it's really irrational. There's a lot of actors I don't particularly like, but few that actively turn me off from their movies, but Downey does.

    Wet Bandit on
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    ClipseClipse Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I want to be excited about this movie, but the one trailer I've seen made it look like a generic action film in which the protagonist happens to be named Sherlock Holmes.

    Clipse on
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    Fatboy RobertsFatboy Roberts Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I don't think it's generic. It's very specifically a Buddy Cop action film.

    Another review that sheds some light on how faithful the movie is to the source (and how it's not in some places, as well) is Drew McWeeny's over at HitFix:

    http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/2008-12-6-motion-captured/posts/the-m-c-review-sherlock-holmes-gives-robert-downey-jr-room-to-play

    Fatboy Roberts on
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    FremFrem Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I don't think it's generic. It's very specifically a Buddy Cop action film.

    Another review that sheds some light on how faithful the movie is to the source (and how it's not in some places, as well) is Drew McWeeny's over at HitFix:

    http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/2008-12-6-motion-captured/posts/the-m-c-review-sherlock-holmes-gives-robert-downey-jr-room-to-play

    McWeeny says it's not a drastic departure from the books, but then Fatboy says he wishes there was more dialog between Holmes and Watson. From what I remember of the original stories, there was a lot of dialog between the two. Then there's this almost Lovecraftian premise and Holmes in the nude, and some sort of bizarre James Bond element in that trailer. It's almost as if they're intentionally trying to alienate anyone who really enjoyed the books. I want 1887 pulp, not 2009 pulp. :-(

    Frem on
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    BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    a Holmes movie starring Downey and Law? Thats way too good to be true, there has to be a catch.
    The catch is it was directed by Guy Ritche

    Balefuego on
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    BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I have only one question:

    Does Downey's Holmes stay true to the literary figure, and do enough blow to kill a small horse?

    BlackDragon480 on
    No matter where you go...there you are.
    ~ Buckaroo Banzai
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    AlectharAlecthar Alan Shore We're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Frem wrote: »
    I don't think it's generic. It's very specifically a Buddy Cop action film.

    Another review that sheds some light on how faithful the movie is to the source (and how it's not in some places, as well) is Drew McWeeny's over at HitFix:

    http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/2008-12-6-motion-captured/posts/the-m-c-review-sherlock-holmes-gives-robert-downey-jr-room-to-play

    McWeeny says it's not a drastic departure from the books, but then Fatboy says he wishes there was more dialog between Holmes and Watson. From what I remember of the original stories, there was a lot of dialog between the two. Then there's this almost Lovecraftian premise and Holmes in the nude, and some sort of bizarre James Bond element in that trailer. It's almost as if they're intentionally trying to alienate anyone who really enjoyed the books. I want 1887 pulp, not 2009 pulp. :-(

    That's the dumbest fucking review I've ever read. The Holmes stories were somewhat formulaic, essentially all mysteries follow a formula, but calling them "pulp" is idiotic. Certainly, they were short stories printed in magazines, but they don't occupy the same lurid world pulp inhabits. The Holmes stories are deeply Victorian, a period piece in every sense.

    Regardless, the real travesty isn't that they've created a wholly new action-movie story that completely ignores the actual stories ACD wrote, but rather that they've created a Holmes and Watson who are far more juvenile then gentlemanly, and in doing so have reduced one of the most brilliant relationships in literature to a series of "I'm not touching you" jokes.

    I'm going to see this movie, if only to verify that what the trailers indicate is true, but my expectations couldn't be lower.

    Additionally, Guy Ritchie is terrible, I hope Madonna gave him herpes.

    Edit: And reading it again, that guy has a terrible grasp of the Holmes stories. It's never, ever, stated that Sherlock Holmes has a background in Brazilian martial arts. ACD has Sherlock Holmes saying he has knowledge of the art of Japanese wrestling, or Baritsu, which doesn't exist but was probably taken from "Bartitsu."

    Alecthar on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    My review over at Cracked.com

    http://www.cracked.com/article/18348_new-sherlock-holmes-lethal-weapon-2-in-victorian-clothes/

    My only real problem is that Rachel MacAdams, who I like, doesn't work in this movie. And I wish there were more moments where Holmes and Watson got to just talk at each other. The interplay was pretty golden.

    that's awesome, it doesn't suck then?

    you've cheered me up substantially sir.

    edit - opening paragraph could have probably used a nod to the fact that House is directly based on holmes. unless that's something you assume everyone who reads it will know.

    Variable on
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    SaigaSaiga Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I was just discussing that with someone earlier, it occurred to me a long time ago and when I realized it I wondered how many others had picked up on it.

    Saiga on
    28je138.png
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    AlectharAlecthar Alan Shore We're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Saiga wrote: »
    I was just discussing that with someone earlier, it occurred to me a long time ago and when I realized it I wondered how many others had picked up on it.

    Despite the fact that I'm predisposed toward hating this movie, I'm astonished you didn't find room for "The Game is Afoot!" in the subject or the OP.

    For shame, sir, for shame.

    Alecthar on
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    Fatboy RobertsFatboy Roberts Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, it's fun, a little overlong, and disposable, but it's well made.

    About that opening paragraph: That line was actually rewritten by my editor. I don't watch House, and I had no idea House was based on Holmes. Although I guess that goes along with my upfront admission that I'm totally ignorant of all things Holmes before I enter the theater :) So it ended up working anyway. The comments section corrected me on that pretty quickly.
    Alecthar wrote:
    but rather that they've created a Holmes and Watson who are far more juvenile then gentlemanly,

    I'd disagree with that sentiment. I don't think they act very juvenile in the film at all.

    Fatboy Roberts on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, it's fun, a little overlong, and disposable, but it's well made.

    About that opening paragraph: That line was actually rewritten by my editor. I don't watch House, and I had no idea House was based on Holmes. Although I guess that goes along with my upfront admission that I'm totally ignorant of all things Holmes before I enter the theater :) So it ended up working anyway. The comments section corrected me on that pretty quickly.

    I'll let you go THIS TIME. but only because I liked your other articles.

    Variable on
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    AlectharAlecthar Alan Shore We're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, it's fun, a little overlong, and disposable, but it's well made.

    About that opening paragraph: That line was actually rewritten by my editor. I don't watch House, and I had no idea House was based on Holmes. Although I guess that goes along with my upfront admission that I'm totally ignorant of all things Holmes before I enter the theater :) So it ended up working anyway. The comments section corrected me on that pretty quickly.
    Alecthar wrote:
    but rather that they've created a Holmes and Watson who are far more juvenile then gentlemanly,

    I'd disagree with that sentiment. I don't think they act very juvenile in the film at all.

    To be fair to the film, that sentiment is largely based on the trailer, which prominently features a scene with Watson complaining about Holmes cane being in his face.

    Alecthar on
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    Fatboy RobertsFatboy Roberts Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Variable wrote: »
    Yeah, it's fun, a little overlong, and disposable, but it's well made.

    About that opening paragraph: That line was actually rewritten by my editor. I don't watch House, and I had no idea House was based on Holmes. Although I guess that goes along with my upfront admission that I'm totally ignorant of all things Holmes before I enter the theater :) So it ended up working anyway. The comments section corrected me on that pretty quickly.

    I'll let you go THIS TIME. but only because I liked your other articles.

    Thanks. I'm certain I'll take enough shit for that artificially induced gaffe to make up for it over there :)
    that sentiment is largely based on the trailer, which prominently features a scene with Watson complaining about Holmes cane being in his face.

    I'd imagine that's just good old fashioned trailer-magic at work. I'm not saying there aren't comedic interactions that play out a little broader than one might expect, but they're spread out. Most of their shared dialog is great.

    The most modernized aspect of the adaptation comes in the sleuthing: the puzzles are solved pretty easily, and the ones that aren't turn into action setpieces. If Holmes doesn't figure something out in the same scene it's introduced, the scene ends up having something explode or catch fire or it turns into a donnybrook.

    Fatboy Roberts on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    when you say puzzles do you also mean anything unknown? or is there a quality mystery at work here?

    sorry if that's been addressed, and I should say I didn't really read the review, afraid of spoilers.

    Variable on
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    SaigaSaiga Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Alecthar wrote: »
    Saiga wrote: »
    I was just discussing that with someone earlier, it occurred to me a long time ago and when I realized it I wondered how many others had picked up on it.

    Despite the fact that I'm predisposed toward hating this movie, I'm astonished you didn't find room for "The Game is Afoot!" in the subject or the OP.

    For shame, sir, for shame.

    I was really tempted to, but every time I make a thread and use a witty thread title I get told there is already another thread. :( I was in a rush to make sure this was the first thread.

    Saiga on
    28je138.png
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    Fatboy RobertsFatboy Roberts Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Variable wrote: »
    when you say puzzles do you also mean anything unknown? or is there a quality mystery at work here?

    sorry if that's been addressed, and I should say I didn't really read the review, afraid of spoilers.

    There are elements of the supernatural introduced. How they are dealt with, I leave for you to discover upon watching the film.

    Fatboy Roberts on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I didn't even mean that necessarily, just curious if it's a proper holmesian mystery.
    edit - but thanks that actually has me more interested.


    also you can edit the thread title.

    Variable on
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    DVGDVG No. 1 Honor Student Nether Institute, Evil AcademyRegistered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm super excited for this. Already have my ticket for Friday night.

    As to the people who are already disappointed without having seen the movie, there are loads of more conservative takes on holmes out there on video already. Let these guys play in the sandbox too.

    DVG on
    Diablo 3 - DVG#1857
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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Ffffffuck yeah, can't wait to see this.

    KalTorak on
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    SaigaSaiga Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm for sure going back on Thursday night now, I also got the soundtrack off of iTunes this morning and I am loving it.

    Saiga on
    28je138.png
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    Wet Bandit wrote: »
    I have an irrational hatred of Robert Downey Jr.

    How on earth does that happen?

    Clearly he hates all that is good and pure in this world.

    This movie looks like cinemacrack for me and starts my going to see a movie a weekend for like 4 weeks straight (Sherlock holmes, Solomon Kane, Daybreakers, Book of Eli).

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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    emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    I'm going to wait and see what you guys think of it. My young mind thought Wild, Wild West with Will Smith had a fun trailer back in the day so once bitten, twice shy, y'know?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUE9j2v9A-E&feature=related

    emnmnme on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Yes but see this Holmes movie comes after the tragedy that was wild wild west and Richies other horribly forgetable movies.

    As far as not remaining true to the Holmes of ACD about fucking time. Brett already did the best holmes, so why screw with perfection? Let us enjoy RDJ fucking around. Purists are the worst sort of bore.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    see317see317 Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    emnmnme wrote: »
    I'm going to wait and see what you guys think of it. My young mind thought Wild, Wild West with Will Smith had a fun trailer back in the day so once bitten, twice shy, y'know?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUE9j2v9A-E&feature=related[url][/url]
    You've only been bitten once?
    My ass has been mauled repeatedly by movie trailers since the mid 1980's, how have you managed to escape?

    see317 on
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    AlectharAlecthar Alan Shore We're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Preacher wrote: »
    Yes but see this Holmes movie comes after the tragedy that was wild wild west and Richies other horribly forgetable movies.

    As far as not remaining true to the Holmes of ACD about fucking time. Brett already did the best holmes, so why screw with perfection? Let us enjoy RDJ fucking around. Purists are the worst sort of bore.

    You know, you've actually convinced me with this single statement. You're totally right, RDJ was never going to equal Brett in my eyes, so why not just take what we get and enjoy it? It's not like I can't watch Jeremy Brett whenever I want.

    Thanks for that, though I still feel a bit unhappy, because I think RDJ would have also been a fantastic traditional Holmes.

    Alecthar on
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    SliderSlider Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    ...except that isn't Sherlock Holmes out there: It's some Hollywood perversion of what they thought Sherlock Holmes would be like if he was on steriods and crack...and had absolutely no idea who Sherlock Holmes was.

    Slider on
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    AlectharAlecthar Alan Shore We're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Slider wrote: »
    ...except that isn't Sherlock Holmes out there: It's some Hollywood perversion of what they thought Sherlock Holmes would be like if he was on steriods and crack...and had absolutely no idea who Sherlock Holmes was.

    Yeah, but if I want genuine Holmes, I'll just go watch the Brett series. I think I can enjoy the movie a lot more with that in mind.

    Alecthar on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Alecthar wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Yes but see this Holmes movie comes after the tragedy that was wild wild west and Richies other horribly forgetable movies.

    As far as not remaining true to the Holmes of ACD about fucking time. Brett already did the best holmes, so why screw with perfection? Let us enjoy RDJ fucking around. Purists are the worst sort of bore.

    You know, you've actually convinced me with this single statement. You're totally right, RDJ was never going to equal Brett in my eyes, so why not just take what we get and enjoy it? It's not like I can't watch Jeremy Brett whenever I want.

    Thanks for that, though I still feel a bit unhappy, because I think RDJ would have also been a fantastic traditional Holmes.

    I could see it, but honestly I don't mind a new fresh actiony holmes with RDJ. If only because trying to do a traditional could be wrought with "Brett did this better," where as this one you can turn off any notion it'll be a traditional holmes and just enjoy the explosions and gay overtones. Well and watch RDJ bitch slapping people.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited December 2009
    Slider wrote: »
    ...except that isn't Sherlock Holmes out there: It's some Hollywood perversion of what they thought Sherlock Holmes would be like if he was on steriods and crack...and had absolutely no idea who Sherlock Holmes was.

    Whatev. You do realize this is hardly the first time, right? Basil Rathbone's Holmes lived in the 1930s and fought Nazis, for god's sake. There is a long history of pulp adventure stories featuring Holmes fighting Dracula or Cthulhu or Jack the Ripper or whatever. Casting RDJ as an action hero Holmes in a more explosion-prone Victorian England is a step back from some of that.

    Jacobkosh on
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    emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    Alecthar wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Yes but see this Holmes movie comes after the tragedy that was wild wild west and Richies other horribly forgetable movies.

    As far as not remaining true to the Holmes of ACD about fucking time. Brett already did the best holmes, so why screw with perfection? Let us enjoy RDJ fucking around. Purists are the worst sort of bore.

    You know, you've actually convinced me with this single statement. You're totally right, RDJ was never going to equal Brett in my eyes, so why not just take what we get and enjoy it? It's not like I can't watch Jeremy Brett whenever I want.

    Thanks for that, though I still feel a bit unhappy, because I think RDJ would have also been a fantastic traditional Holmes.

    Wasn't there a cartoon where Sherlock Holmes fell through time, landed in the future, and could shoot lightning out of his hands?

    emnmnme on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited December 2009
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    Slider wrote: »
    ...except that isn't Sherlock Holmes out there: It's some Hollywood perversion of what they thought Sherlock Holmes would be like if he was on steriods and crack...and had absolutely no idea who Sherlock Holmes was.

    Whatev. You do realize this is hardly the first time, right? Basil Rathbone's Holmes lived in the 1930s and fought Nazis, for god's sake. There is a long history of pulp adventure stories featuring Holmes fighting Dracula or Cthulhu or Jack the Ripper or whatever. Casting RDJ as an action hero Holmes in a more explosion-prone Victorian England is a step back from some of that.

    Also for the time Holmes was the Pulp character of Doyle's that's why he was originally killed off so that Doyle could move on to more serious works.

    Much the same way Shakespere's works survived because they appealed to the common man as well as the academic.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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