I enjoyed the first act. But I hear there's apparently a forty-minute long cutscene.
So, there's that.
A couple of the longer cutscenes (even in MGS2 it does this) it will ask if you want to save in the middle of them and then you can go off and do other stuff if you're bored.
I enjoyed the first act. But I hear there's apparently a forty-minute long cutscene.
So, there's that.
A couple of the longer cutscenes (even in MGS2 it does this) it will ask if you want to save in the middle of them and then you can go off and do other stuff if you're bored.
Very thoughtful of them.
I don't recall and MGS game hitting a 40 minute cutscene. I thought only the Xenosaga games transcend to that level of non-interactivity.
If you are not completely enthralled by each story moment you are playing the wrong fucking series and should pack it in now.
I enjoyed the first act. But I hear there's apparently a forty-minute long cutscene.
So, there's that.
A couple of the longer cutscenes (even in MGS2 it does this) it will ask if you want to save in the middle of them and then you can go off and do other stuff if you're bored.
Very thoughtful of them.
I don't recall and MGS game hitting a 40 minute cutscene. I thought only the Xenosaga games transcend to that level of non-interactivity.
If you are not completely enthralled by each story moment you are playing the wrong fucking series and should pack it in now.
Major MGS4 spoiler here:
The sequence with Big Boss in MGS4 alone is a half hour, not including the rest of the game's ending (from defeating Liquid to the credits) so that is most definitly over 40 minutes.
Aside from that, I don't think any other cutscene reaches close to that.
Isn't 4 when the controls of the game finally resembled something like decent?
I mean 1's were okay but by 3 it was ridiculous. To shoot while holding a human shield, you hold O to CQC grab, hold R1 to go into first person, aim with the right stick, hold Square to point the gun, release quickly to fire. If I remember right.
Portable Ops' controls would be great if not for the damn camera.
But I'd argue that MGS2 is the most important experience in the series, if not the best. If nothing else, it's my favorite.
Hmm. Explain
I didn't hate MGS2, but it seemed too nonsensical for me (nonsense in MGS.. say what!?).
I'm not gonna speak for him, but personally I think the whole thing was a really important experimentation with what you could do with video games as a storytelling medium. It wasn't necessarily a successful experiment, but I think it deserves a lot of credit for charting those waters.
Did not see that post. But yes, that. There's just, on a conceptual level, some very clever things going on in the design of that game. It plays with stuff specific to the medium that nobody else really did until Shadow of the Colossus. And SotC is still in pretty exclusive company as far as its design goes. If you've played through it, this analysis is a good showpiece for why MGS2 is noteworthy.
It's also just goddamn weird. And that's never a bad thing.
Holy crap that's a good analysis. Wow, I just want to go back and play MGS2 again.
I recently played MGS3 again. It is my favorite video game ever, and I cry at the end every time I beat it. It it is a whole experience, like a long, thick, novel.
It made me want to play MGS2 again, and when I did, I loved it. I remembered it being long and dull and without any real flavor or excitement, but I was wrong. I think its easier to enjoy 2 after playing 3. 2 spoofs 1 and turn the expectations of 1 on its head, so it doesn't sit well with some people. But 3 is delightful, adventurous, and did a good job opening my mind for anything I'd find in 2.
I remember playing through MGS2 as a 10 (?) year-old, and while I didn't particularly undesrstand it back then, I still thought it was awesome and one fo the most engaging things I'd ever played.
I played it again a few weeks ago, and it may e the only game I remember playing from then that's anywhere near as good as I rememeber it being, especially if you understand what you're doing this time around.
But I'd argue that MGS2 is the most important experience in the series, if not the best. If nothing else, it's my favorite.
Hmm. Explain
I didn't hate MGS2, but it seemed too nonsensical for me (nonsense in MGS.. say what!?).
I'm not gonna speak for him, but personally I think the whole thing was a really important experimentation with what you could do with video games as a storytelling medium. It wasn't necessarily a successful experiment, but I think it deserves a lot of credit for charting those waters.
Did not see that post. But yes, that. There's just, on a conceptual level, some very clever things going on in the design of that game. It plays with stuff specific to the medium that nobody else really did until Shadow of the Colossus. And SotC is still in pretty exclusive company as far as its design goes. If you've played through it, this analysis is a good showpiece for why MGS2 is noteworthy.
It's also just goddamn weird. And that's never a bad thing.
Holy crap that's a good analysis. Wow, I just want to go back and play MGS2 again.
I recently played MGS3 again. It is my favorite video game ever, and I cry at the end every time I beat it. It it is a whole experience, like a long, thick, novel.
It made me want to play MGS2 again, and when I did, I loved it. I remembered it being long and dull and without any real flavor or excitement, but I was wrong. I think its easier to enjoy 2 after playing 3. 2 spoofs 1 and turn the expectations of 1 on its head, so it doesn't sit well with some people. But 3 is delightful, adventurous, and did a good job opening my mind for anything I'd find in 2.
I maintain that 2 is almost completely understandable after you play 3.
I actually did this last year. Had a very good time doing it, and Renzo is very accurate in that 4 practically coasts on fan-service to the franchise. The ambition of MGS4 circumscribes the appalling limitations, explaining the relative non-penetration into the mainstream, of narrative gaming.
My own tips:
MS3 must be played with the Subsistence version. The anthology collection has that (but not the bonus disk from Subsistence which you don't need unless you want to go ridiculously completest and play accurate versions of Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2).
MGS1 should be played on the GameCube/Wii if possible. The negative things this brings into the equation do not matter in the sligtest to someone in your position. The positives are huge - looks nicers, plays easier.
If there is a difficulty selector - and honestly I can't remember if there is or not - play on Easy. This series is about the spectacle. Aside from 3, they are barely good games anyway. Consume them ravenously, like you would eat all you can eat ribs.
The MGS4 encyclopedia is required reading after you've done all 4.
Portable Ops on PSP can be skipped unless you really want something portable. It fits in series canon, but plays like garbage, and has a much lamer storytelling style. The spectacle is greatly reduced, thus its impact is lessened.
I have access to a copy of Twin Snakes. Is it really the way to do it? I've heard a lot of people say that putting the controls from the second one into the first one doesn't work.
I also already own 3, or at the very least have a copy in the house. Is it really worth getting hold of a copy of Subsistence, or should I just go ahead with what I have?
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I actually did this last year. Had a very good time doing it, and Renzo is very accurate in that 4 practically coasts on fan-service to the franchise. The ambition of MGS4 circumscribes the appalling limitations, explaining the relative non-penetration into the mainstream, of narrative gaming.
My own tips:
MS3 must be played with the Subsistence version. The anthology collection has that (but not the bonus disk from Subsistence which you don't need unless you want to go ridiculously completest and play accurate versions of Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2).
MGS1 should be played on the GameCube/Wii if possible. The negative things this brings into the equation do not matter in the sligtest to someone in your position. The positives are huge - looks nicers, plays easier.
If there is a difficulty selector - and honestly I can't remember if there is or not - play on Easy. This series is about the spectacle. Aside from 3, they are barely good games anyway. Consume them ravenously, like you would eat all you can eat ribs.
The MGS4 encyclopedia is required reading after you've done all 4.
Portable Ops on PSP can be skipped unless you really want something portable. It fits in series canon, but plays like garbage, and has a much lamer storytelling style. The spectacle is greatly reduced, thus its impact is lessened.
I have access to a copy of Twin Snakes. Is it really the way to do it? I've heard a lot of people say that putting the controls from the second one into the first one doesn't work.
I also already own 3, or at the very least have a copy in the house. Is it really worth getting hold of a copy of Subsistence, or should I just go ahead with what I have?
Having completed both Snake Eater and Subsistence multiple times, my opinion is that it's perfectly possible to play with the Snake Eater camera, if a little annoying in places.
And as for Twin Snakes it's not so much that the controls don't work as the original game wasn't designed with the abilities you inherit from 2 in mind (first person shooting and hanging, primarily)
Sir CarcassI have been shown the end of my worldRound Rock, TXRegistered Userregular
edited January 2010
Metal Gear Solid was the reason I bought a PS1. I saw it at a friend's house and just had to have it. I must have played through that thing 10 times over the years. I have Twin Snakes but I never got far in it since I bought a bunch of Gamecube games at once and moved on to stuff that was new. I may give it another go soon.
I've played through 2 once and thought it was alright. It took me 2 tries to get through 3, but man, once I got hooked, it was awesome. I have the original versions of 2 and 3, so I don't know anything about the re-issues.
I'd like to play 4, but it will be a long time before I get a PS3.
I'd love to join you guys in this, but I'm going to be busy all of this Monday. Well, I guess I'll just start a Monday late since I've already beaten 1 and 2 multiple times, and I've also beaten 3, 4, and the original Metal Gear once each, so I should be able to "catch up" quickly. Hell, maybe I'll actually get around to finishing Portable Ops and Metal Gear 2 before Peace Walker comes out.
Anyways, I'm in agreement that 3 is, by far, the best game in the series. 1 is quite the experience, too. 2 is fun, but a mindfuck and occasionally frustrating and 4 is just a giant love letter to all Metal Gear fans. Regardless, this ought to be a pretty entertaining thread!
Oh MGS. I got the demo for the first one from Pizza Hut and played it and played it and replayed it until I got a copy of the whole game for xmas. I was weary of playing a Metal Gear game as I have the original for NES (starring Michael Biehn as Kyle Reese as Solid Snake) and as a child it was basically impossible. Goddamn dogs. I may have to participate in this, it has been years since I've played any of these games.
I played MGS2 in a marathon session after Christmas 2001. My girlfriend at the time (early high school) was having some kind of family crisis at the time and I was on the phone with her during the big long cut scene at the end right before the last bit of the game. I just set the phone down at some point so I could pay attention to whatever the hell was going on. That relationship didn't last much longer, but I think I made the right decision anyway.
Oh MGS. I got the demo for the first one from Pizza Hut and played it and played it and replayed it until I got a copy of the whole game for xmas. I was weary of playing a Metal Gear game as I have the original for NES (starring Michael Biehn as Kyle Reese as Solid Snake) and as a child it was basically impossible. Goddamn dogs. I may have to participate in this, it has been years since I've played any of these games.
I played MGS2 in a marathon session after Christmas 2001. My girlfriend at the time (early high school) was having some kind of family crisis at the time and I was on the phone with her during the big long cut scene at the end right before the last bit of the game. I just set the phone down at some point so I could pay attention to whatever the hell was going on. That relationship didn't last much longer, but I think I made the right decision anyway.
Guys, no Twin Snakes/Original discussion. It always shits up the thread.
Best advice I can give people is to play both and make your own decision. If you can't, just play whichever one is more convenient to play for you. Because, honestly, they're both great games and I'd rather us all bask in the awesome that is Metal Gear without it turning into two groups of monkeys flinging shit at each other.
On a more personal note, holy shit, I forgot about Ghost Babel (AKA Metal Gear Solid GBC in the States). Fantastic game, it's just a shame that it's not canon.
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HedgethornAssociate Professor of Historical Hobby HorsesIn the Lions' DenRegistered Userregular
I played MGS2 in a marathon session after Christmas 2001. My girlfriend at the time (early high school) was having some kind of family crisis at the time and I was on the phone with her during the big long cut scene at the end right before the last bit of the game. I just set the phone down at some point so I could pay attention to whatever the hell was going on. That relationship didn't last much longer, but I think I made the right decision anyway.
Hahaha, that's awesome.
This wouldn't be nearly as fitting if you had done this while playing MGS1 or MGS3. It's simply perfect that you ignored your girlfriend to play MGS2, just so you could watch (small MGS2 spoilers)
On a more personal note, holy shit, I forgot about Ghost Babel (AKA Metal Gear Solid GBC in the States). Fantastic game, it's just a shame that it's not canon.
You can work it to being canon, in an unusual way.
Ghost Babel spoilers:
After completing all the Mission stages, Mr. X makes a cryptic reference to the unknown participant taking part in the VR missions, referring to them as "Jack".
On a more personal note, holy shit, I forgot about Ghost Babel (AKA Metal Gear Solid GBC in the States). Fantastic game, it's just a shame that it's not canon.
You can work it to being canon, in an unusual way.
Ghost Babel spoilers:
After completing all the Mission stages, Mr. X makes a cryptic reference to the unknown participant taking part in the VR missions, referring to them as "Jack".
I forgot about that. I just always took it as non-canon because, well, that's what Kojima said it was. But, thinking of it as a VR mission for Jack/Raiden is a pretty neat way to keep it 'canon'.
But I'd argue that MGS2 is the most important experience in the series, if not the best. If nothing else, it's my favorite.
Hmm. Explain
I didn't hate MGS2, but it seemed too nonsensical for me (nonsense in MGS.. say what!?).
Spoilered for MGS2 stuff
There are a few bits to it that actually are really unique compared to the other games story wise. It takes everything you knew from the first game and politely continues you on...until the tanker incident. Then it turns you on your head and says, "OK Chump, lets relearn the wheel!" with the story, you end up being a new character, in a new world, and you follow him through the story to the end where he is turned so upside down by the events that it breaks him and he looses all that childlike innocence he had at the beginning.
On the surface, Riaden sucks, hes naive, dumb, whiny, and has a lot of "real life" baggage holding him back from understanding the world around him. By the time you finish the game he has realized that the world around him is such a gigantic lie that he nearly goes insane (illustrated by the weird codec calls and snake's "infinite ammo" trick) while he tries to cope. The game ends up being more of a philosophical and mental dance than the strict action title that was the first game. Its just so subtle that you dont realize it until a second full playthrough.
tldr, Raiden is mope mope, then hes mister fancy pants with less mope mope
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
edited January 2010
When the MGS collection came out on PS2, I did this. I thought to myself, "Dammit, people love these games, here they all are for cheap, I'm going to try them out."
So I popped in MGS1, started playing, and I couldn't stop myself until the credits ended on MGS3.
MGS3 is definitely the best, though I still haven't had a chance to play MGS4, and thankfully I've avoided pretty much all spoilers for it.
Forever Zefiro on
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When the MGS collection came out on PS2, I did this. I thought to myself, "Dammit, people love these games, here they all are for cheap, I'm going to try them out."
So I popped in MGS1, started playing, and I couldn't stop myself until the credits ended on MGS3.
MGS3 is definitely the best, though I still haven't had a chance to play MGS4, and thankfully I've avoided pretty much all spoilers for it.
Your opinion on best game probably won't change after playing 4, but if you enjoyed the first three, you'll almost definitely enjoy 4.
If there is a difficulty selector - and honestly I can't remember if there is or not - play on Easy. This series is about the spectacle. Aside from 3, they are barely good games anyway. Consume them ravenously, like you would eat all you can eat ribs.
Note that you really shouldn't play 3 on the easiest difficulty. You start with the EZ Gun, which pretty much breaks the game. It's a silent, infinite ammo tranqualizer gun that makes it so that if you're standing still in the open, you recieve the same degree of camoflage as if you were crawling through brush.
I think that's for Very Easy difficulty, though, so Easy should be fine.
The Subsistance camera is what you should be using to play the game, but if you're having trouble moving around and observing guards at first with it, try using the original camera until you get the hang of the controls. Once you start to be frustrated by the inability to see distant guards instead of your inability to perform actions correctly, switch to the new camera and you'll probably be fine from that point forward.
The only people that hate MGS4 are those who have no soul.
Yes, yes, I have no soul for hating backward, semi-interactive movie with a plot so bad that even Michael Bay would turn it down for being low-quality.
4 is great. Its the definitive MGS story. Its grand, over the top, 60% gong show, 30% action, 10% mind altering drugs.
People take different things out of the different games. One of the reasons I so like Twin Snakes is it adjusts MGS1 away from a credible thriller into the same ridiculousness of MGS4. Video game narratives are often...well...really stupid is the best way to word it. I love video games to death, but their narratives have this ridiculous quality that you only see in bad direct-to-DVD films and terrible genre novels. MGS is the ultimate expression of this lunacy.
See I like TTS over the top and hate MGS4 for it. I think the cutscenes in 4 are just too long. Act III in particular is 10 minutes of gameplay, boss, 25 minutes of talking, 5 minutes of gamplay, 50 minute movie, end of act.
That and most of the bosses were stupid, both game play and story wise.
I think the balance is too far in the action and not enough in the stealth.
3 got it all right. Story is easy to follow. Cutscenes are long, but not too long. Bosses are epic, but don't go on all day about their ridiculous circumstances. Action is doable with plenty of guns but not 8000 of them, and it takes a lot of work to run and gun through the higher difficulties.
4 they seemed to leave the fun at home, they forgot the wink and the nod to the camera.
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A couple of the longer cutscenes (even in MGS2 it does this) it will ask if you want to save in the middle of them and then you can go off and do other stuff if you're bored.
Very thoughtful of them.
I don't recall and MGS game hitting a 40 minute cutscene. I thought only the Xenosaga games transcend to that level of non-interactivity.
If you are not completely enthralled by each story moment you are playing the wrong fucking series and should pack it in now.
猿も木から落ちる
Major MGS4 spoiler here:
Aside from that, I don't think any other cutscene reaches close to that.
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Because you want to watch it, you just don't want to watch it now. Maybe dinner's ready? Maybe you have a bus to catch? The wonderful rainbow of life!
http://www.audioentropy.com/
That's one thing about movies that they SHOULD emulate. Not the length, the ability to choose to watch something.
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I mean 1's were okay but by 3 it was ridiculous. To shoot while holding a human shield, you hold O to CQC grab, hold R1 to go into first person, aim with the right stick, hold Square to point the gun, release quickly to fire. If I remember right.
Portable Ops' controls would be great if not for the damn camera.
Holy crap that's a good analysis. Wow, I just want to go back and play MGS2 again.
I recently played MGS3 again. It is my favorite video game ever, and I cry at the end every time I beat it. It it is a whole experience, like a long, thick, novel.
It made me want to play MGS2 again, and when I did, I loved it. I remembered it being long and dull and without any real flavor or excitement, but I was wrong. I think its easier to enjoy 2 after playing 3. 2 spoofs 1 and turn the expectations of 1 on its head, so it doesn't sit well with some people. But 3 is delightful, adventurous, and did a good job opening my mind for anything I'd find in 2.
I played it again a few weeks ago, and it may e the only game I remember playing from then that's anywhere near as good as I rememeber it being, especially if you understand what you're doing this time around.
I maintain that 2 is almost completely understandable after you play 3.
I have access to a copy of Twin Snakes. Is it really the way to do it? I've heard a lot of people say that putting the controls from the second one into the first one doesn't work.
I also already own 3, or at the very least have a copy in the house. Is it really worth getting hold of a copy of Subsistence, or should I just go ahead with what I have?
@gamefacts - Totally and utterly true gaming facts on the regular!
Having completed both Snake Eater and Subsistence multiple times, my opinion is that it's perfectly possible to play with the Snake Eater camera, if a little annoying in places.
And as for Twin Snakes it's not so much that the controls don't work as the original game wasn't designed with the abilities you inherit from 2 in mind (first person shooting and hanging, primarily)
Plus other goodies.. i dunno.
But the camera in MGS3 is just fine to me.
2 is also kinda bland setting wise, and is in the running with 4 for having the most disappointing bosses.
3 is the best game though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xt7hd0kpDE
I've played through 2 once and thought it was alright. It took me 2 tries to get through 3, but man, once I got hooked, it was awesome. I have the original versions of 2 and 3, so I don't know anything about the re-issues.
I'd like to play 4, but it will be a long time before I get a PS3.
Anyways, I'm in agreement that 3 is, by far, the best game in the series. 1 is quite the experience, too. 2 is fun, but a mindfuck and occasionally frustrating and 4 is just a giant love letter to all Metal Gear fans. Regardless, this ought to be a pretty entertaining thread!
I played MGS2 in a marathon session after Christmas 2001. My girlfriend at the time (early high school) was having some kind of family crisis at the time and I was on the phone with her during the big long cut scene at the end right before the last bit of the game. I just set the phone down at some point so I could pay attention to whatever the hell was going on. That relationship didn't last much longer, but I think I made the right decision anyway.
My Little Game Blog - http://profundospielen.blogspot.com/
Hahaha, that's awesome.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_Gear_Solid:_The_Twin_Snakes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_Gear_Solid_%28Game_Boy%29 Yes. Twin Snakes is fantastic.
Best advice I can give people is to play both and make your own decision. If you can't, just play whichever one is more convenient to play for you. Because, honestly, they're both great games and I'd rather us all bask in the awesome that is Metal Gear without it turning into two groups of monkeys flinging shit at each other.
On a more personal note, holy shit, I forgot about Ghost Babel (AKA Metal Gear Solid GBC in the States). Fantastic game, it's just a shame that it's not canon.
This wouldn't be nearly as fitting if you had done this while playing MGS1 or MGS3. It's simply perfect that you ignored your girlfriend to play MGS2, just so you could watch (small MGS2 spoilers)
You can work it to being canon, in an unusual way.
Ghost Babel spoilers:
Spoilered for MGS2 stuff
On the surface, Riaden sucks, hes naive, dumb, whiny, and has a lot of "real life" baggage holding him back from understanding the world around him. By the time you finish the game he has realized that the world around him is such a gigantic lie that he nearly goes insane (illustrated by the weird codec calls and snake's "infinite ammo" trick) while he tries to cope. The game ends up being more of a philosophical and mental dance than the strict action title that was the first game. Its just so subtle that you dont realize it until a second full playthrough.
tldr, Raiden is mope mope, then hes mister fancy pants with less mope mope
So I popped in MGS1, started playing, and I couldn't stop myself until the credits ended on MGS3.
MGS3 is definitely the best, though I still haven't had a chance to play MGS4, and thankfully I've avoided pretty much all spoilers for it.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Prepare to be disappointed.
Your opinion on best game probably won't change after playing 4, but if you enjoyed the first three, you'll almost definitely enjoy 4.
1 is great.
2 is...well it's quite a fun game, but everything else is pretty wretched.
I bought a PS3 for 4. Worst money I ever spent.
Overall, though, I felt that it was a worthy end to the series, it was just really difficult to follow MGS3.
Note that you really shouldn't play 3 on the easiest difficulty. You start with the EZ Gun, which pretty much breaks the game. It's a silent, infinite ammo tranqualizer gun that makes it so that if you're standing still in the open, you recieve the same degree of camoflage as if you were crawling through brush.
I think that's for Very Easy difficulty, though, so Easy should be fine.
The Subsistance camera is what you should be using to play the game, but if you're having trouble moving around and observing guards at first with it, try using the original camera until you get the hang of the controls. Once you start to be frustrated by the inability to see distant guards instead of your inability to perform actions correctly, switch to the new camera and you'll probably be fine from that point forward.
Yes, yes, I have no soul for hating backward, semi-interactive movie with a plot so bad that even Michael Bay would turn it down for being low-quality.
People take different things out of the different games. One of the reasons I so like Twin Snakes is it adjusts MGS1 away from a credible thriller into the same ridiculousness of MGS4. Video game narratives are often...well...really stupid is the best way to word it. I love video games to death, but their narratives have this ridiculous quality that you only see in bad direct-to-DVD films and terrible genre novels. MGS is the ultimate expression of this lunacy.
I love it so much.
猿も木から落ちる
That and most of the bosses were stupid, both game play and story wise.
I think the balance is too far in the action and not enough in the stealth.
3 got it all right. Story is easy to follow. Cutscenes are long, but not too long. Bosses are epic, but don't go on all day about their ridiculous circumstances. Action is doable with plenty of guns but not 8000 of them, and it takes a lot of work to run and gun through the higher difficulties.
4 they seemed to leave the fun at home, they forgot the wink and the nod to the camera.