We would've had to do nothing else that night, since we were down to 4 goblins, and we'd have to expose ourselves, since we always had at least one and often two people in the work schedule.
of course, as Bremen pointed out, we twice exposed ourselves anyway by not paying enough attention.
The work orders exposure wasn't as definite as you think. No one was sure who was a dwarf, you probably could of gotten away with it.
We would've had to do nothing else that night, since we were down to 4 goblins, and we'd have to expose ourselves, since we always had at least one and often two people in the work schedule.
of course, as Bremen pointed out, we twice exposed ourselves anyway by not paying enough attention.
The work orders exposure wasn't as definite as you think. No one was sure who was a dwarf, you probably could of gotten away with it.
That was, of course, the whole point; if the person who didn't work was named in the narration, no goblin would have ever done it (intentionally, at least :P). By having the goblin revealed as one of 3 possible players, it made it a calculated risk if they wanted to act or not.
The opposite was true as well. One thing I expected but never saw was, on a night with no goblins on assignment, the goblins doing only actions that didn't show up in the narration in order to cast doubt on the 6 dwarves on assignment. Of course, most people didn't seem to think there was a relationship between kills and the work assignments, so it might not have worked.
yeah, i understand the mechanics behind it all. What i was trying to say was that, being flagged as one of three possibles, wasn't so much of the death sentence as they might of feared, especially as the "network" wasn't actually a network.
Soooo many times i was freaking out over who was a goblin. At separate points, i strongly considered both Ahava and Savant as one.
yeah, i understand the mechanics behind it all. What i was trying to say was that, being flagged as one of three possibles, wasn't so much of the death sentence as they might of feared, especially as the "network" wasn't actually a network.
Soooo many times i was freaking out over who was a goblin. At separate points, i strongly considered both Ahava and Savant as one.
I often thought the same about the two. Savant because he was way too accusing towards folks, and Ahava because, well, she was in the perfect position for a goblin to be, if you assume that giving the daily orders doesn't count as an action.
I'll be honest, after last night's new 'if this number drops below 5 without either goblins or dwarves achieving their victory condition, the settlement will be abandoned' rule, I was hoping to see someone try and propose a mutual destruction plan between the goblins and the dwarves.
After all, since a goblin being on food duty was almost guaranteed, there was no reason to think that a dwarf wasn't going to starve tonight. Which meant that unless the dwarves could kill off every free goblin that night, killing anyone else would have lost the game. And the goblins weren't going to win unless they stole the jobs of some more nobles (I had assumed at least one of you three were probably goblins), which would require that the game keep going so that more election could take place.
Would have been the worst thing for the dwarves to do, it turns out, as Malkor wasn't a dwarf, and I didn't even consider that there would be such a restriction with just five dwarves left and one about to die. But still, would have been hilarious to see.
We we're never going to take a bargain. At best, the goblins could have forced an abandonment. I was fairly sure on the last day they weren't in a position to win.
Ahava assigning duties, DID count as an action, but would still be a good position for a goblin to be in. As mentioned in the proboards though, a goblin as sheriff would be a much better position.
We we're never going to take a bargain. At best, the goblins could have forced an abandonment. I was fairly sure on the last day they weren't in a position to win.
Ahava assigning duties, DID count as an action, but would still be a good position for a goblin to be in. As mentioned in the proboards though, a goblin as sheriff would be a much better position.
Oh, I realize that neither side would actually stop working to destroy the other side. That's what would make such a scenario so funny.
And yeah, it makes sense that her duties did use up the actions now, but both the goblin mechanic stuff in the OP and the expedition leader info in the Day one post both emphasized nightly actions being exclusive, which lead me to wonder if there were some sort of special goblin day time actions that might still be available. And since she admitted that she wasn't calling her own shots at one point, there would have been no reason to suspect her as she continued committing various acts of skulduggery.
Really though, all nobles were prime suspects of suspicious, due to noble positions being so vital for a goblin victory. I'm kinda shocked that the game didn't come down to someone with the mechanic role hooking up magma pipes to the room of nobles suspected of being goblins. After all, goblins make dwarves miserable, and nobles make dwarves miserable, so any dwarf worth this beard ought to know that's the most natural disguise for a goblin to take.
It was fun to be playing after a long break. Joining in mid-game leaves you a bit disoriented, but at least it gave me the incentive to take a risk (I'm not a great risk-taker in Phallas) and get in touch with Roman. Getting myself elected as Manager seemed like a mistake at first because I couldn't use my kill and the Manager ability on the same night, but since it also protected me from becoming sober, I guess it was a good decision in hindsight.
yeah, i understand the mechanics behind it all. What i was trying to say was that, being flagged as one of three possibles, wasn't so much of the death sentence as they might of feared, especially as the "network" wasn't actually a network.
Soooo many times i was freaking out over who was a goblin. At separate points, i strongly considered both Ahava and Savant as one.
I was worried you might be one on occasion, but once you told me she was the Gem Cutter I never suspected her. Because someone had to be a gem cutter or jeweler or something.
yeah, i understand the mechanics behind it all. What i was trying to say was that, being flagged as one of three possibles, wasn't so much of the death sentence as they might of feared, especially as the "network" wasn't actually a network.
Soooo many times i was freaking out over who was a goblin. At separate points, i strongly considered both Ahava and Savant as one.
I was worried you might be one on occasion, but once you told me she was the Gem Cutter I never suspected her. Because someone had to be a gem cutter or jeweler or something.
I had this line of thinking to. It also nearly lost us the game with the armorsmith. However, i also considered the possibility that one of the possessed dwarves had been it, before they had gone insane.
@EZ, i thought the majority knew how possessed dwarves work? I certainly did, i think?
hey roman, next time you become an unconfirmed elected official and demand that doing your job makes you 'confirmed' take a step back and hit yourself in the head. then you should try to figure out that trusting some other unconfirmed elected official is also a bad Idea. then you should take your head out of your ass and figure out that if you want information while being the head of an unconfirmed 'network' while heavily trusting other unconfirmed people in an obvious way, you should ask the person you want information from instead of waiting for them to trust you. OR, you could have talked to Ahava who knew exactly who I was and what I was building. instead, you were a fucking silly goose and almost cost us the game by killing people who didn't trust your unconfirmed ass. savant, that goes for you double, you should at least know better. the only reason you had any kind of network was luck and the fact that Bliss101 is a trusting lamb and ahava didn't want to run things at all. I blame you too ahava, you were the only confirmed person in the game and were taking orders from an silly goose.
in short, you should stop patting yourself on the back and smarten up for next game.
I was told that Krata claimed to be the artifact creator, which is why I didn't push matters much further.
I warned Krata that the artifact creator was likely one of the dwarves we didn't know about, and "we" included the confirmed Dwarf champion. If you thought I was suspicious enough not to trust, you should have tested me somehow and tried to get in more direct contact with the Champion. Or tested roman. At least do something to make sure the vig didn't kill you.
Instead, the Champion kills you because they didn't know you were the artifact creator. At least a majority of that blame rests on your shoulders, because you were so paranoid that you thought people who knew who the Champion was were goblins who would rather kill the artifact creator than the confirmed vig. Especially when we didn't even know what the artifact did, if anything.
@Duna, For starters this game had no way to confirm anything, so your solution was to turst no one? That seems awfully stupid considering the only thing we had going for us was information and individually, no one had the complete picture. Again, we had no network what so ever, just me and Savant sharing information and a whole bunch of PM's from people. We made a judgement call to trust each other and it worked out well. I'm not saying it was the holy grail savior of the village, but i think it was the best call at the time, and given the exact same information, i'd do it again. Phalla is about choosing who to trust, i don't think that you could of been successful in this one by trusting no one.
I never had any illusions that you would participate at all, hence why i ordered the vig only once i'd ran out of easily available options. I did not forsee the goblins being given fake roles to impersonate, had i known that, i wouldn't have role called at all. Note, I DID ask ahava about you and others, and she said she'd deleted her PMs and couldn't exactly remember who had contacted her but knew it was two people. We settled on the fact that it was likely Erich Zahn and Krata.
In hindsight, we did get a little lucky that things went the way that they did. It could of very easily gone astray from us. However, i still maintain that what i did was much better than just letting things take their course as things we're going to shit rather quickly.
If anyone else has an opinion on whether the role call was the right move or what a better option would be, speak up. I was thinking about it for a while, it wasn't just a whim i had.
Anyways, jackisreal told me he was a miner yesterday, which is why I was trying to subtly get the wagon off of him. That's also why I was yelling for a miner to contact me, in case he was lying about what his abilities were. Unfortunately, he revealed this information left and right and people weren't trying very hard to cover up for jackisreal, so the goblins put 2 and 2 together.
Just FYI you and Hippie were the only ones I told my role information to after it became clear I was going to eat the vote. And hey, you were both good. Woo!
@Duna, For starters this game had no way to confirm anything, so your solution was to turst no one? That seems awfully stupid considering the only thing we had going for us was information and individually, no one had the complete picture. Again, we had no network what so ever, just me and Savant sharing information and a whole bunch of PM's from people. We made a judgement call to trust each other and it worked out well. I'm not saying it was the holy grail savior of the village, but i think it was the best call at the time, and given the exact same information, i'd do it again. Phalla is about choosing who to trust, i don't think that you could of been successful in this one by trusting no one.
I never had any illusions that you would participate at all, hence why i ordered the vig only once i'd ran out of easily available options. I did not forsee the goblins being given fake roles to impersonate, had i known that, i wouldn't have role called at all. Note, I DID ask ahava about you and others, and she said she'd deleted her PMs and couldn't exactly remember who had contacted her but knew it was two people. We settled on the fact that it was likely Erich Zahn and Krata.
In hindsight, we did get a little lucky that things went the way that they did. It could of very easily gone astray from us. However, i still maintain that what i did was much better than just letting things take their course as things we're going to shit rather quickly.
If anyone else has an opinion on whether the role call was the right move or what a better option would be, speak up. I was thinking about it for a while, it wasn't just a whim i had.
there is no right person to trust in phalla. it is people's trust in their friends that often times gets them killed. Ahava was cleared to be not the elephant and not a goblin by day 2, she should have been running things more forcefully and organizing the kills.
How was Ahava cleared? and yes, had there seemed to be any sort of organization to the village, i would of just participated. As there was apparently none, i tried to instigate some.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
I agree she couldn't have been the elephant, thats a given.
I like how Ahava gets confirmed by just using her ability once or twice, yet i am still totally untrustworthy after actually picking out goblins.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
I agree she couldn't have been the elephant, thats a given.
I like how Ahava gets confirmed by just using her ability once or twice, yet i am still totally untrustworthy after actually picking out goblins.
because if you had've been a goblin, you would have done the same thing. heck, as it turns out, whitewolf wasn't a goblin so if you had been a goblin, you would have had no problem jailing him and then using the results to 'confirm' yourself. there is no way ahava would have purposefully gotten 2 team members killed when she could have avoided it so very easily.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
I agree she couldn't have been the elephant, thats a given.
I like how Ahava gets confirmed by just using her ability once or twice, yet i am still totally untrustworthy after actually picking out goblins.
because if you had've been a goblin, you would have done the same thing. heck, as it turns out, whitewolf wasn't a goblin so if you had been a goblin, you would have had no problem jailing him and then using the results to 'confirm' yourself. there is no way ahava would have purposefully gotten 2 team members killed when she could have avoided it so very easily.
Ahava only really smoked out Zellpher, whose the second? Even if you didn't trust that i was calling the vig kills, or that Malkor was a goblin, i still bandwagoned Jaenther. Late in the game, that would have been a stupid goblin move, especially as i had already proved i wasn't infallible by bandwagoning some dwarves previously?
Edit: Also, claiming the vig kill too. If i'd claimed it falsely, i surely would of been vigged the very next day, again not a smart move.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
I agree she couldn't have been the elephant, thats a given.
I like how Ahava gets confirmed by just using her ability once or twice, yet i am still totally untrustworthy after actually picking out goblins.
because if you had've been a goblin, you would have done the same thing. heck, as it turns out, whitewolf wasn't a goblin so if you had been a goblin, you would have had no problem jailing him and then using the results to 'confirm' yourself. there is no way ahava would have purposefully gotten 2 team members killed when she could have avoided it so very easily.
Ahava only really smoked out Zellpher, whose the second? Even if you didn't trust that i was calling the vig kills, or that Malkor was a goblin, i still bandwagoned Jaenther. Late in the game, that would have been a stupid goblin move, especially as i had already proved i wasn't infallible by bandwagoning some dwarves previously?
Edit: Also, claiming the vig kill too. If i'd claimed it falsely, i surely would of been vigged the very next day, again not a smart move.
zellpher, whitewolf. it would have been easily avoidable for zellpher and I would have done the exact same thing she did by using the food and drink to find baddies.
claiming the vig kill was what made me switch my vote to jaenther on day 7 (because if you were lying, I trusted the vig to kill you or out you). unfortunately I DIDN'T LIVE PAST JAENTHER GETTING VOTED OUT.
i probably would have trusted you after that and then shot savant on the last day (if there was even a last day as the only other people you could have killed were zandracon and krata)
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The work orders exposure wasn't as definite as you think. No one was sure who was a dwarf, you probably could of gotten away with it.
I was the pretty public face.
You know, the vapid female.
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
That was, of course, the whole point; if the person who didn't work was named in the narration, no goblin would have ever done it (intentionally, at least :P). By having the goblin revealed as one of 3 possible players, it made it a calculated risk if they wanted to act or not.
The opposite was true as well. One thing I expected but never saw was, on a night with no goblins on assignment, the goblins doing only actions that didn't show up in the narration in order to cast doubt on the 6 dwarves on assignment. Of course, most people didn't seem to think there was a relationship between kills and the work assignments, so it might not have worked.
Soooo many times i was freaking out over who was a goblin. At separate points, i strongly considered both Ahava and Savant as one.
I often thought the same about the two. Savant because he was way too accusing towards folks, and Ahava because, well, she was in the perfect position for a goblin to be, if you assume that giving the daily orders doesn't count as an action.
I'll be honest, after last night's new 'if this number drops below 5 without either goblins or dwarves achieving their victory condition, the settlement will be abandoned' rule, I was hoping to see someone try and propose a mutual destruction plan between the goblins and the dwarves.
After all, since a goblin being on food duty was almost guaranteed, there was no reason to think that a dwarf wasn't going to starve tonight. Which meant that unless the dwarves could kill off every free goblin that night, killing anyone else would have lost the game. And the goblins weren't going to win unless they stole the jobs of some more nobles (I had assumed at least one of you three were probably goblins), which would require that the game keep going so that more election could take place.
Would have been the worst thing for the dwarves to do, it turns out, as Malkor wasn't a dwarf, and I didn't even consider that there would be such a restriction with just five dwarves left and one about to die. But still, would have been hilarious to see.
Ahava assigning duties, DID count as an action, but would still be a good position for a goblin to be in. As mentioned in the proboards though, a goblin as sheriff would be a much better position.
Thanks for running this, Bremen! It was a lot of fun, and in addition I'm now totally hooked on Dwarf Fortress. Good times...
Also, nobody understood what a posessed dorf does? FOR SHAME
Oh, I realize that neither side would actually stop working to destroy the other side. That's what would make such a scenario so funny.
And yeah, it makes sense that her duties did use up the actions now, but both the goblin mechanic stuff in the OP and the expedition leader info in the Day one post both emphasized nightly actions being exclusive, which lead me to wonder if there were some sort of special goblin day time actions that might still be available. And since she admitted that she wasn't calling her own shots at one point, there would have been no reason to suspect her as she continued committing various acts of skulduggery.
Really though, all nobles were prime suspects of suspicious, due to noble positions being so vital for a goblin victory. I'm kinda shocked that the game didn't come down to someone with the mechanic role hooking up magma pipes to the room of nobles suspected of being goblins. After all, goblins make dwarves miserable, and nobles make dwarves miserable, so any dwarf worth this beard ought to know that's the most natural disguise for a goblin to take.
It was fun to be playing after a long break. Joining in mid-game leaves you a bit disoriented, but at least it gave me the incentive to take a risk (I'm not a great risk-taker in Phallas) and get in touch with Roman. Getting myself elected as Manager seemed like a mistake at first because I couldn't use my kill and the Manager ability on the same night, but since it also protected me from becoming sober, I guess it was a good decision in hindsight.
I was worried you might be one on occasion, but once you told me she was the Gem Cutter I never suspected her. Because someone had to be a gem cutter or jeweler or something.
I had this line of thinking to. It also nearly lost us the game with the armorsmith. However, i also considered the possibility that one of the possessed dwarves had been it, before they had gone insane.
@EZ, i thought the majority knew how possessed dwarves work? I certainly did, i think?
in short, you should stop patting yourself on the back and smarten up for next game.
I warned Krata that the artifact creator was likely one of the dwarves we didn't know about, and "we" included the confirmed Dwarf champion. If you thought I was suspicious enough not to trust, you should have tested me somehow and tried to get in more direct contact with the Champion. Or tested roman. At least do something to make sure the vig didn't kill you.
Instead, the Champion kills you because they didn't know you were the artifact creator. At least a majority of that blame rests on your shoulders, because you were so paranoid that you thought people who knew who the Champion was were goblins who would rather kill the artifact creator than the confirmed vig. Especially when we didn't even know what the artifact did, if anything.
I never had any illusions that you would participate at all, hence why i ordered the vig only once i'd ran out of easily available options. I did not forsee the goblins being given fake roles to impersonate, had i known that, i wouldn't have role called at all. Note, I DID ask ahava about you and others, and she said she'd deleted her PMs and couldn't exactly remember who had contacted her but knew it was two people. We settled on the fact that it was likely Erich Zahn and Krata.
In hindsight, we did get a little lucky that things went the way that they did. It could of very easily gone astray from us. However, i still maintain that what i did was much better than just letting things take their course as things we're going to shit rather quickly.
If anyone else has an opinion on whether the role call was the right move or what a better option would be, speak up. I was thinking about it for a while, it wasn't just a whim i had.
Just FYI you and Hippie were the only ones I told my role information to after it became clear I was going to eat the vote. And hey, you were both good. Woo!
there is no right person to trust in phalla. it is people's trust in their friends that often times gets them killed. Ahava was cleared to be not the elephant and not a goblin by day 2, she should have been running things more forcefully and organizing the kills.
she wouldn't have put goblins on the list while they were caught for using their kills. especially not two days in a row.
the elephant still made kills while she was clearly choosing each day who would gather food and drink (as opposed to it being random) and you can only do one action a night.
I agree she couldn't have been the elephant, thats a given.
I like how Ahava gets confirmed by just using her ability once or twice, yet i am still totally untrustworthy after actually picking out goblins.
because if you had've been a goblin, you would have done the same thing. heck, as it turns out, whitewolf wasn't a goblin so if you had been a goblin, you would have had no problem jailing him and then using the results to 'confirm' yourself. there is no way ahava would have purposefully gotten 2 team members killed when she could have avoided it so very easily.
Ahava only really smoked out Zellpher, whose the second? Even if you didn't trust that i was calling the vig kills, or that Malkor was a goblin, i still bandwagoned Jaenther. Late in the game, that would have been a stupid goblin move, especially as i had already proved i wasn't infallible by bandwagoning some dwarves previously?
Edit: Also, claiming the vig kill too. If i'd claimed it falsely, i surely would of been vigged the very next day, again not a smart move.
zellpher, whitewolf. it would have been easily avoidable for zellpher and I would have done the exact same thing she did by using the food and drink to find baddies.
claiming the vig kill was what made me switch my vote to jaenther on day 7 (because if you were lying, I trusted the vig to kill you or out you). unfortunately I DIDN'T LIVE PAST JAENTHER GETTING VOTED OUT.
i probably would have trusted you after that and then shot savant on the last day (if there was even a last day as the only other people you could have killed were zandracon and krata)