I'm playing a Civ 4 game myself and I realized I cut down trees if they give me 30 little hammers to productivity. A video game has helped me realize how easy it is to be worked into a frenzy over new resources - all forests should be cut down and developed. Drill, baby, drill?
Chopping is the path to victory. We can replant those forests later if we need 'em.
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Oh Civ 2, terraforming for the win. That game was hilariously unbalanced once you knew how to exploit the system. Stealth fighters in 500 AD!
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Only forests I leave up for future lumber milling are those on tundra, since any city built with access to tundra probably isn't going to want to touch the tundra tiles except for resource tiles (which is the only reason one should have a city built on/near tundra). Even then, chop half the trees and let them regrow, repeat.
Only forests I leave up for future lumber milling are those on tundra, since any city built with access to tundra probably isn't going to want to touch the tundra tiles except for resource tiles (which is the only reason one should have a city built on/near tundra). Even then, chop half the trees and let them regrow, repeat.
This is obviously what corporations were invented for in the game.
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Wait, how do you get more resources if you don't chop right away?
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Wait, how do you get more resources if you don't chop right away?
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Wait, how do you get more resources if you don't chop right away?
.....whut? Do you get 60 hammers instead of 30 if you chop the trees down later or do more gold coins materialize in the ground?
emnmnme on
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
well, those same forests give 2 resources/turn, so if you leave them up, you get more resources over the long run.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Wait, how do you get more resources if you don't chop right away?
.....whut? Do you get 60 hammers instead of 30 if you chop the trees down later or do more gold coins materialize in the ground?
Math. The key is Math. Both the in game technology and the practical application of it within the game mechanics.
If you wait to discover Math you'll get 50% more hammers.
If you never chop the forest you'll get X amount of hammers from the forest for the rest of the game. That might be worth more than the 90 or less hammers you immedietly get from chopping. This is like time/risk preference for bonds.
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
Says the guy who is worried about happiness.
The whip is all about population control so you don't have unhappy people. Unhappy people are slaves.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
1 x (turns) > whatever you get from chopping, yes.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
Says the guy who is worried about happiness.
The whip is all about population control so you don't have unhappy people. Unhappy people are slaves.
I whip too much and inappropriately. Yes, I've read the tutorials and have used BUG but I still do it poorly.
Update 4: My God, The Options! Wonders Artists may propose The Statue of Zeus (if people invade us they get unhappy faster) or The Parthenon (+50% Great People)
As a resident artist, I'd like to propose The Parthenon for our wonder.
Ideally, we won't have many problems with invasion. I know this is unreasonably optimistic, but I'm more in favor for a wonder that helps our civilization grow, rather then one that is so defensive in nature.
Also, arches and columns last longer than statuary.
Kitsurubami on
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
Update 4: My God, The Options! Wonders Artists may propose The Statue of Zeus (if people invade us they get unhappy faster) or The Parthenon (+50% Great People)
As a resident artist, I'd like to propose The Parthenon for our wonder.
Ideally, we won't have many problems with invasion. I know this is unreasonably optimistic, but I'm more in favor for a wonder that helps our civilization grow, rather then one that is so defensive in nature.
Also, arches and columns last longer than statuary.
This works out perfectly as we in Pi-Dongbury are fickle and cutting edge.
Update 5: I Fucking Hate Joao So Fucking Much. Real Life Portugal is Fucking Tiny, Developers. Were your Girlfriends Portuguese? Jesus.
Government is changed to adopt the will of the council. High maintenance Organized Religion was killer.
The invasion force stalks the land.
Hey look it's Lisbon (one of those guys in it left, bizarrely).
We find Parrots in the hills of east of Wangian! +1 commerce on the tile, sweet!
Catapults and other siege weapons have two main purposes: first they cause damage to units in the stack beyond just the first unit. Super useful. In the expansions (or in Beyond the Sword?) they were nerfed so they could not kill units outright. So they withdraw when they do sufficient damage.
Chaaaaaarge!
That was easy. Renamed to Lisboner, for obvious reasons.
That's an elephant, Mr. Frodo!
Indeed it is, Sam.
While the Catapults healed in Lisboner, the chariots (and reinforcements) diverted back to Evora. Where they were building spearmen. There's another source somewhere, gaaaah.
Drama! I get to work on Calendar to get us some easy commerce/resources. Luxuries especially. I don't think there was a plan, and if there was I would have countermanded it because we are boned economically!
This is the other use for catapults. They can reduce the defenses of a city. You get +20% defense for each level of culture you've achieved. Catapults remove 8% (not 8% of 20% but a hard 8%) each turn, in exchange for their moves. Unless the city has Walls, which reduces such things by half and gives the city 50% defenses. Stupid Walls. Castles are even worse.
Pacal is angry with us. He is tiny and powerless, so I ignore him.
Stuff happens, Church of the Nativity is the Christian holy building.
After many turns, and the loss of a few catapults softening up the city, Oporto falls. Hooray! Note that the bastard STILL has 7 cities. Because Joao is, as I mentioned, a fucking bastard. Let's take a look:
Burn it.
Guimares found Gems. Blah.
South of the rice by the lake, I think. Not awful.
Crap, torch it.
Holy crap! WANT! 1) Iron 2) Gems 3) There's Corn in the bottom right of the Big Fat Cross. 4) Cows! Very nice, definitely would be rebuilt by the French FAST.
Comments on these: AI is being all lovey-dovey despite the religion penalties. Stupid AI. Louis has Literature, so is probably working on the Great Library. Though we can build it in like 8 turns I bet with our marble.
So there are two important things to consider:
1) Continue prosecuting the war? We can get all of Joao's cash at this point. However that Iron/Gems city is really nice looking and our army is right there. We have plenty of catapults as I kind of drafted every city into a war setting. I think everyone is making Elephants/Chariots/Catapults as we had underdone it going in. Probably big enough to kill them now, but they KEEP MAKING CITIES. GRRRR.
2) Our economy blows. A ton of cities to support, a ton of troops to support, etc. Can probably subside on plunder if we keep going on the warpath, but longterm, this is an issue. Some markets/courthouses are required. Caste System for the merchant specialists might be a good idea.
This is a Great General. Specifically, it his Hippie. Great Generals are a type of Great Person that appears each time you get x experience from combat with other civilizations, where x increases (it was initially 30). Great Generals can: add themselves to a city giving each unit made in that city 2 experience when it is built (and 3 research since we're Representation). Or it can join a unit and give the stack it's in when it joins 20 experience. This could give us a Medic 3 chariot, which would be nice, as an example.
In this LP Great Generals will be named for the current Warlord, unless that person has already received a Great Person. If they have, non-Great General'd military members will get RNG'd to see who it is.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
how close are we to feudalism? could try and vassalize joe, too, for bufferage between everybody. Otherwise, keep plundering/razing till we get courthouses up and going.
Posts
Chopping is the path to victory. We can replant those forests later if we need 'em.
Unless those forests are on a mountain, in which case you get more resources for turning the mountain into open-pit acid worked strip mines.
Or unless those forests are on a grassland and you can turn them into cottages for the economic powerhouse.
So yeah, chopping down the forests is the way to go.
edit: replant? What is this, civ 2?
Oh Civ 2, terraforming for the win. That game was hilariously unbalanced once you knew how to exploit the system. Stealth fighters in 500 AD!
Only forests I leave up for future lumber milling are those on tundra, since any city built with access to tundra probably isn't going to want to touch the tundra tiles except for resource tiles (which is the only reason one should have a city built on/near tundra). Even then, chop half the trees and let them regrow, repeat.
This is obviously what corporations were invented for in the game.
We should try winning before corporations.
Wait, how do you get more resources if you don't chop right away?
.....whut? Do you get 60 hammers instead of 30 if you chop the trees down later or do more gold coins materialize in the ground?
Math. The key is Math. Both the in game technology and the practical application of it within the game mechanics.
If you wait to discover Math you'll get 50% more hammers.
If you never chop the forest you'll get X amount of hammers from the forest for the rest of the game. That might be worth more than the 90 or less hammers you immedietly get from chopping. This is like time/risk preference for bonds.
Of course, frequently you'll be cottaging the new grassland or mining the new hill, so it is worth chopping.
Also of note of course is the +.5 health from each forest, and +1 happy if you end up going with Environmentalism.
The health thing is huge when you have a ton of Floodplains. Blithely chopping your forests down can screw you over long term because of the health cap.
Eh, I never worry about health. There are tons of buildings to fix it, and the penalty isn't bad at all, really. Happy is bad. I need to make sure to micromanage our cities when I start tonight's update. (Also: we need more luxuries).
Well it can be doubly bad when those forests are also a main source of hammers. The worst starts for me are ones that are really high on food and low on health, production, and rivers.
Says the guy who is worried about happiness.
The whip is all about population control so you don't have unhappy people. Unhappy people are slaves.
I whip too much and inappropriately. Yes, I've read the tutorials and have used BUG but I still do it poorly.
As a resident artist, I'd like to propose The Parthenon for our wonder.
Ideally, we won't have many problems with invasion. I know this is unreasonably optimistic, but I'm more in favor for a wonder that helps our civilization grow, rather then one that is so defensive in nature.
Also, arches and columns last longer than statuary.
This works out perfectly as we in Pi-Dongbury are fickle and cutting edge.
You probably will, whipping it.
What are you, my mother?
EDIT: Or not. Excellent rolling by the Catapults.
giant flying stones of death for the win
Economy: in the shitter!
Next two Joao cities on the list: highly desireable!
Many orders: countermanded by Supreme Executive Authority (I needed more dudes).
Update, later, though it might take a while to put together.
Government is changed to adopt the will of the council. High maintenance Organized Religion was killer.
The invasion force stalks the land.
Hey look it's Lisbon (one of those guys in it left, bizarrely).
We find Parrots in the hills of east of Wangian! +1 commerce on the tile, sweet!
Catapults and other siege weapons have two main purposes: first they cause damage to units in the stack beyond just the first unit. Super useful. In the expansions (or in Beyond the Sword?) they were nerfed so they could not kill units outright. So they withdraw when they do sufficient damage.
Chaaaaaarge!
That was easy. Renamed to Lisboner, for obvious reasons.
That's an elephant, Mr. Frodo!
Indeed it is, Sam.
While the Catapults healed in Lisboner, the chariots (and reinforcements) diverted back to Evora. Where they were building spearmen. There's another source somewhere, gaaaah.
Drama! I get to work on Calendar to get us some easy commerce/resources. Luxuries especially. I don't think there was a plan, and if there was I would have countermanded it because we are boned economically!
This is the other use for catapults. They can reduce the defenses of a city. You get +20% defense for each level of culture you've achieved. Catapults remove 8% (not 8% of 20% but a hard 8%) each turn, in exchange for their moves. Unless the city has Walls, which reduces such things by half and gives the city 50% defenses. Stupid Walls. Castles are even worse.
Pacal is angry with us. He is tiny and powerless, so I ignore him.
Stuff happens, Church of the Nativity is the Christian holy building.
After many turns, and the loss of a few catapults softening up the city, Oporto falls. Hooray! Note that the bastard STILL has 7 cities. Because Joao is, as I mentioned, a fucking bastard. Let's take a look:
Burn it.
Guimares found Gems. Blah.
South of the rice by the lake, I think. Not awful.
Crap, torch it.
Holy crap! WANT! 1) Iron 2) Gems 3) There's Corn in the bottom right of the Big Fat Cross. 4) Cows! Very nice, definitely would be rebuilt by the French FAST.
Comments on these: AI is being all lovey-dovey despite the religion penalties. Stupid AI. Louis has Literature, so is probably working on the Great Library. Though we can build it in like 8 turns I bet with our marble.
So there are two important things to consider:
1) Continue prosecuting the war? We can get all of Joao's cash at this point. However that Iron/Gems city is really nice looking and our army is right there. We have plenty of catapults as I kind of drafted every city into a war setting. I think everyone is making Elephants/Chariots/Catapults as we had underdone it going in. Probably big enough to kill them now, but they KEEP MAKING CITIES. GRRRR.
2) Our economy blows. A ton of cities to support, a ton of troops to support, etc. Can probably subside on plunder if we keep going on the warpath, but longterm, this is an issue. Some markets/courthouses are required. Caste System for the merchant specialists might be a good idea.
This is a Great General. Specifically, it his Hippie. Great Generals are a type of Great Person that appears each time you get x experience from combat with other civilizations, where x increases (it was initially 30). Great Generals can: add themselves to a city giving each unit made in that city 2 experience when it is built (and 3 research since we're Representation). Or it can join a unit and give the stack it's in when it joins 20 experience. This could give us a Medic 3 chariot, which would be nice, as an example.
In this LP Great Generals will be named for the current Warlord, unless that person has already received a Great Person. If they have, non-Great General'd military members will get RNG'd to see who it is.
I think.
I would also like to take a stab at becoming a Governor by proposing the name of Hooterville.
So, I would prefer to lead an army, if thats ok with our great Queen? A medic 3 chariot does sound good...
And that there gem city is purty. It must be ours!
I'm gonna do it tomorrow night to keep things vaguely organized. If you're a governor who won't be around tomorrow, throw me a PM.