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NVIDIA'S FERMI: cooking eggs and bacon on your graphics card.

13

Posts

  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    psychoticdream on
  • PirusuPirusu Pierce Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm really only looking forward to FERMI's release so that it (hopefully) drops the prices on the 5800 cards. I don't mind shelling out 300 for a 5850, but I'd prefer not to. And around April is when I'll be looking to drop the dough anyways. Hmmm....must go without my desktop for a little while longer.

    Pirusu on
  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Pirusu wrote: »
    I'm really only looking forward to FERMI's release so that it (hopefully) drops the prices on the 5800 cards. I don't mind shelling out 300 for a 5850, but I'd prefer not to. And around April is when I'll be looking to drop the dough anyways. Hmmm....must go without my desktop for a little while longer.

    I think both the supply and the list price of Fermi cards are going to mean that ATI won't have to budge their prices when this hits. Unfortunately.

    It's pretty annoying that 5XXX cards haven't even hit their original MSRP prices yet.

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  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Pirusu wrote: »
    I'm really only looking forward to FERMI's release so that it (hopefully) drops the prices on the 5800 cards. I don't mind shelling out 300 for a 5850, but I'd prefer not to. And around April is when I'll be looking to drop the dough anyways. Hmmm....must go without my desktop for a little while longer.

    I think both the supply and the list price of Fermi cards are going to mean that ATI won't have to budge their prices when this hits. Unfortunately.

    It's pretty annoying that 5XXX cards haven't even hit their original MSRP prices yet.

    considering that the availability of the fermi cards is going to be very low yeah i think you are right

    its possible the 5xxx cards go up a bit in price too

    lets hope not

    psychoticdream on
  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Nvidia apparently being less than honest.

    Metallikat on
  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    Nvidia apparently being less than honest.

    that and this one hurt ... a lot

    psychoticdream on
  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    Nvidia apparently being less than honest.

    that and this one hurt ... a lot

    Christ that's ridiculous. I don't think Nvidia's going to be able to knock ATI off of it's pedestal anytime soon. Especially with the fact that ATI still has the 2GB version of the 5870 lurking in the shadows.

    Metallikat on
  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    psychoticdream on
  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    So apparently the 480 uses about 200 more Watts than a 5850 but just 15 more Watts than a 5970.

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  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    So apparently the 480 uses about 200 more Watts than a 5850 but just 15 more Watts than a 5970.

    guess its right to call it the baconator then o.o!!

    psychoticdream on
  • BlackDoveBlackDove Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    It's the 26th god damnit, did anyone see the stuff at PAX yet?

    BlackDove on
  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    BlackDove wrote: »
    It's the 26th god damnit, did anyone see the stuff at PAX yet?

    the nvidia presentation ends at 7 so at 7:01 the NDA lifts

    psychoticdream on
  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    So apparently the 480 uses about 200 more Watts than a 5850 but just 15 more Watts than a 5970.

    guess its right to call it the baconator then o.o!!

    Taking into account the fact that the 5970 is a dual gpu, while the 480 is a single but still uses more power, it's amazing what an energy hog it is. It's gonna be a real bitch for those planning on running these SLI. And the gains in performance are lackluster as well. In some cases, it barely beats the 5870 and more often than not gets mediocre improvement. ATI won't be lowering prices anytime soon.

    EDIT: Also, IXBT.com benchmarks posted.

    Metallikat on
  • amnesiasoftamnesiasoft Thick Creamy Furry Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    Taking into account the fact that the 5970 is a dual gpu, while the 480 is a single but still uses more power, it's amazing what an energy hog it is. It's gonna be a real bitch for those planning on running these SLI. And the gains in performance are lackluster as well. In some cases, it barely beats the 5870 and more often than not gets mediocre improvement. ATI won't be lowering prices anytime soon.

    I don't know, it seemed to hold it's own pretty well against the 5970 in some places, for what seems to be $200 less. and the rumors about idle power consumption seem to be more than a little overblown. Still, it would be nice to see results from more than a single source.

    I'm not sure I'd say these stomp ATI's offerings to the ground in terms of performance, but I don't feel Charlie's rantings have been even close to justified.

    amnesiasoft on
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  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    HardOCP's review is up:

    The Bottom Line

    We see no reason to purchase a GeForce GTX 470. It provides no gameplay advantages compared to the competition, and will actually end up costing you more power and dollars for the exact same performance you can get with the Radeon HD 5850. Factor in the power consumption, and it doesn’t seem worth it. If you have an HD 5850, stick with it, the GTX 470 is not an upgrade. If you are contemplating a great performing graphics card, for a decent price, the HD 5850 is still the best choice.

    The GeForce GTX 480 is more relevant in the market but it hasn’t exactly come out of the gate wowing us with performance either. There are some games where it is faster than the Radeon HD 5870, and there are some games where it is even with the Radeon HD 5870. Factor in the cost and power, and include the ability to run Eyefinity on a single GPU, the Radeon HD 5870, to us, seems like the better value for the gamer right now.

    lowlylowlycook on
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  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    HardOCP's review is up:

    The Bottom Line

    We see no reason to purchase a GeForce GTX 470. It provides no gameplay advantages compared to the competition, and will actually end up costing you more power and dollars for the exact same performance you can get with the Radeon HD 5850. Factor in the power consumption, and it doesn’t seem worth it. If you have an HD 5850, stick with it, the GTX 470 is not an upgrade. If you are contemplating a great performing graphics card, for a decent price, the HD 5850 is still the best choice.

    The GeForce GTX 480 is more relevant in the market but it hasn’t exactly come out of the gate wowing us with performance either. There are some games where it is faster than the Radeon HD 5870, and there are some games where it is even with the Radeon HD 5870. Factor in the cost and power, and include the ability to run Eyefinity on a single GPU, the Radeon HD 5870, to us, seems like the better value for the gamer right now.

    Was a little disappointed they pitted the 480 SLI setup against the 5970, instead of a more comparable 5870 Crossfire setup, but otherwise a good review.

    Metallikat on
  • ZxerolZxerol for the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't do so i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Gettin' flashbacks to the Geforce FX here...

    Zxerol on
  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm not sure I'd say these stomp ATI's offerings to the ground in terms of performance, but I don't feel Charlie's rantings have been even close to justified.

    Well the thing is that ATI's strategy is basically to concede the high end single GPU crown to NVidia but to have more economical mid range parts while using multi-GPU boards to cover the high end.

    So for the high end single GPU boards to be competitive means that NVidia has basically no advantage over over ATI.

    And that isn't factoring in whatever yield problems they are going to have and the resulting high cost of production.

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  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm not sure I'd say these stomp ATI's offerings to the ground in terms of performance, but I don't feel Charlie's rantings have been even close to justified.

    Well the thing is that ATI's strategy is basically to concede the high end single GPU crown to NVidia but to have more economical mid range parts while using multi-GPU boards to cover the high end.

    So for the high end single GPU boards to be competitive means that NVidia has basically no advantage over over ATI.

    And that isn't factoring in whatever yield problems they are going to have and the resulting high cost of production.

    But it's not much of a concession this round, seeing as how the 480 didn't beat out the 5870 by significant margins.

    Metallikat on
  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    I'm not sure I'd say these stomp ATI's offerings to the ground in terms of performance, but I don't feel Charlie's rantings have been even close to justified.

    Well the thing is that ATI's strategy is basically to concede the high end single GPU crown to NVidia but to have more economical mid range parts while using multi-GPU boards to cover the high end.

    So for the high end single GPU boards to be competitive means that NVidia has basically no advantage over over ATI.

    And that isn't factoring in whatever yield problems they are going to have and the resulting high cost of production.

    But it's not much of a concession this round, seeing as how the 480 didn't beat out the 5870 by significant margins.

    Right. I was explaining how these benchmarks represent a pretty big failure for NVidia even though it's not the case the that 5870 is faster than the 480.

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  • SakeidoSakeido Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I was going to get one of the new Fermis because I wanted to put together a 3D gaming rig. After seeing the benchmarks, I figured "well, alright that ain't bad." Then I saw the power consumption and temperature under load and that gave me pause. More telling, I listened to the clips Hard OCP had of the fans and that was a serious "WTF Nvidia" moment.

    I'm still thinking about it.. but I'm going to wait until a 3D solution for ATI comes out, and then make my decision.

    Sakeido on
  • amnesiasoftamnesiasoft Thick Creamy Furry Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm not really sure how that contradicts the part of my post you quoted. I said I wouldn't call it stomping ATI in terms of performance, because, well, it doesn't. Though you do have to admit, in a few cases it did have some pretty impressive performance, just not enough to be worthy of the descriptor "stomp."

    Then there's the part about Charlie. The only thing I really see that wasn't exaggerated all to hell was the yield, but that was already pretty obvious from the fact ATI can't even get a high enough yield to satisfy demand.

    I'd say the most likely outcome from this scenario probably resembles the outcome of AMD with Intel's Pentium 4. Instead of really being a victory for AMD in the long run, it'll probably just kick some sense into Nvidia to be a little more careful that they don't let their architecture run away into a mass of power consumption. Or something.

    amnesiasoft on
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  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm not really sure how that contradicts the part of my post you quoted. I said I wouldn't call it stomping ATI in terms of performance, because, well, it doesn't. Though you do have to admit, in a few cases it did have some pretty impressive performance, just not enough to be worthy of the descriptor "stomp."

    Then there's the part about Charlie. The only thing I really see that wasn't exaggerated all to hell was the yield, but that was already pretty obvious from the fact ATI can't even get a high enough yield to satisfy demand.

    I'd say the most likely outcome from this scenario probably resembles the outcome of AMD with Intel's Pentium 4. Instead of really being a victory for AMD in the long run, it'll probably just kick some sense into Nvidia to be a little more careful that they don't let their architecture run away into a mass of power consumption. Or something.

    The point is, it should have stomped the 5870. It's a high end single gpu card to what ATI considers a mid range single gpu card and it sometimes breaks even and sometimes pulls ahead, with the occasional large gain.
    Nvidia might be able to iron out the problems with the cards and release newer cards down the line that are less sloppy and power hungry. The problem for them is, doing it before ATI can release their newer cards. With the delay of the 4xx cards allowing ATI to get into the game before Nvidia, all ATI has to do it keep putting out strong cards that people will buy before Nvidia. That way if the newer Nvidia cards come out later, even if they are moderately more powerful, ATI has already dug in and gained ground.

    Metallikat on
  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    I'm not really sure how that contradicts the part of my post you quoted. I said I wouldn't call it stomping ATI in terms of performance, because, well, it doesn't. Though you do have to admit, in a few cases it did have some pretty impressive performance, just not enough to be worthy of the descriptor "stomp."

    Then there's the part about Charlie. The only thing I really see that wasn't exaggerated all to hell was the yield, but that was already pretty obvious from the fact ATI can't even get a high enough yield to satisfy demand.

    I'd say the most likely outcome from this scenario probably resembles the outcome of AMD with Intel's Pentium 4. Instead of really being a victory for AMD in the long run, it'll probably just kick some sense into Nvidia to be a little more careful that they don't let their architecture run away into a mass of power consumption. Or something.

    The point is, it should have stomped the 5870. It's a high end single gpu card to what ATI considers a mid range single gpu card and it sometimes breaks even and sometimes pulls ahead, with the occasional large gain.
    Nvidia might be able to iron out the problems with the cards and release newer cards down the line that are more less sloppy and power hungry. The problem for them is, doing it before ATI can release their newer cards. With the delay of the 4xx cards allowing ATI to get into the game before Nvidia, all ATI has to do it keep putting out strong cards that people will buy before Nvidia. That way if the newer Nvidia cards come out later, even if they are moderately more powerful, ATI has already dug in and gained ground.

    correct


    the thing that will keep nvidia afloat however remains their work in integrated gpus, with tegra getting in on a lot of mobile computers and not to mention handheld devices they'll be able to offset some of the loss (also if they win the upcoming lawsuit they are throwing at intel that won't hurt them)

    but kicking aside some of their best partners like BFG and threatening vendors to carry gtx2xx and gtx3xx parts to qualify for selling/carrying gtx4xx parts was kind of a dick move on their part

    as well as losing interest by laptop manufacturers/oems due to high power consumption on fermi based cards will come back to bite them in the ass

    psychoticdream on
  • GnomeTankGnomeTank Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    My problem with ATI is, and has always been, unstable drivers. Every ATI card I've ever owned has been a hilarious circus of driver stopped responding errors and blue screens. The only ATI card I ever owned that wasn't a steaming pile of driver nightmare was my 9800 Pro.

    And no, it wasn't a motherboard issue, as equivalent nVidia cards would run fine. ATI has, and probably always will, make great, great hardware...but their driver development is still inexplicably terrible.

    GnomeTank on
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  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    GnomeTank wrote: »
    My problem with ATI is, and has always been, unstable drivers. Every ATI card I've ever owned has been a hilarious circus of driver stopped responding errors and blue screens. The only ATI card I ever owned that wasn't a steaming pile of driver nightmare was my 9800 Pro.

    And no, it wasn't a motherboard issue, as equivalent nVidia cards would run fine. ATI has, and probably always will, make great, great hardware...but their driver development is still inexplicably terrible.

    My 5870's are the first ATI cards I've ever owned, and I've had absolutely no driver issues at all. I've never had any problems at all with Nvidia drivers either, though.

    Metallikat on
  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Finally got through to anandtech:

    Finally, as we asked in the title, was it worth the wait? No, probably not. A 15% faster single-GPU card is appreciated and we’re excited to see both AMD and NVIDIA once again on competitive footing with each other, but otherwise with much of Fermi’s enhanced abilities still untapped, we’re going to be waiting far longer for a proper resolution anyhow. For now we’re just happy to finally have Fermi, so that we can move on to the next step.

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  • GnomeTankGnomeTank Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    GnomeTank wrote: »
    My problem with ATI is, and has always been, unstable drivers. Every ATI card I've ever owned has been a hilarious circus of driver stopped responding errors and blue screens. The only ATI card I ever owned that wasn't a steaming pile of driver nightmare was my 9800 Pro.

    And no, it wasn't a motherboard issue, as equivalent nVidia cards would run fine. ATI has, and probably always will, make great, great hardware...but their driver development is still inexplicably terrible.

    My 5870's are the first ATI cards I've ever owned, and I've had absolutely no driver issues at all. I've never had any problems at all with Nvidia drivers either, though.

    Well, there is a very real possibility that under AMD's tutelage, the ATI driver developers were able to get their shit together (or maybe they were just canned and AMD driver developers took over)...I haven't owned any ATI card in a few years....past experience just taints my thinking, and I'm not keen to spend 400 bucks to find out I was wrong....though I do want a DX11 card that isn't a small star heat wise.

    GnomeTank on
    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
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  • MetallikatMetallikat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    GnomeTank wrote: »
    Metallikat wrote: »
    GnomeTank wrote: »
    My problem with ATI is, and has always been, unstable drivers. Every ATI card I've ever owned has been a hilarious circus of driver stopped responding errors and blue screens. The only ATI card I ever owned that wasn't a steaming pile of driver nightmare was my 9800 Pro.

    And no, it wasn't a motherboard issue, as equivalent nVidia cards would run fine. ATI has, and probably always will, make great, great hardware...but their driver development is still inexplicably terrible.

    My 5870's are the first ATI cards I've ever owned, and I've had absolutely no driver issues at all. I've never had any problems at all with Nvidia drivers either, though.

    Well, there is a very real possibility that under AMD's tutelage, the ATI driver developers were able to get their shit together (or maybe they were just canned and AMD driver developers took over)...I haven't owned any ATI card in a few years....past experience just taints my thinking, and I'm not keen to spend 400 bucks to find out I was wrong....though I do want a DX11 card that isn't a small star heat wise.

    I just might be incredibly lucky. Since my first PC in 1992 or so, I've never had a driver issue (that caused very bad system performance or crashing) ever, at all.

    Metallikat on
  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Ived owned most generations of ATI cards, from the radeon through the 8 series, 9 series, x800 series, and now the 4 series. Only serious problems I had are from the original radeon, the very first one. But Ive never had any major problems with Nvidia either. Guess I got lucky on matching up my hardware :P

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  • lowlylowlycooklowlylowlycook Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Hey, psychoticdream, you might want to change the thread title.

    lowlylowlycook on
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  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Hey, psychoticdream, you might want to change the thread title.

    yeah.. but to what? .. hmm...






    oh i got it :winky:

    psychoticdream on
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Sakeido wrote: »
    I was going to get one of the new Fermis because I wanted to put together a 3D gaming rig. After seeing the benchmarks, I figured "well, alright that ain't bad." Then I saw the power consumption and temperature under load and that gave me pause. More telling, I listened to the clips Hard OCP had of the fans and that was a serious "WTF Nvidia" moment.

    I'm still thinking about it.. but I'm going to wait until a 3D solution for ATI comes out, and then make my decision.

    Right now your options for ATI are IZ3D or buying a 3D TV and using that as a monitor.

    Because I'm in the same boat as you. I'm building my first new PC in 6 years and I wanted 3D gaming. I'm just not going to spend the money on nVidia. I'll get an OC'd 5870 2gig or track down a 5970 and save in the long run.

    Dark Shroud on
  • psychoticdreampsychoticdream Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Sakeido wrote: »
    I was going to get one of the new Fermis because I wanted to put together a 3D gaming rig. After seeing the benchmarks, I figured "well, alright that ain't bad." Then I saw the power consumption and temperature under load and that gave me pause. More telling, I listened to the clips Hard OCP had of the fans and that was a serious "WTF Nvidia" moment.

    I'm still thinking about it.. but I'm going to wait until a 3D solution for ATI comes out, and then make my decision.

    Right now your options for ATI are IZ3D or buying a 3D TV and using that as a monitor.

    Because I'm in the same boat as you. I'm building my first new PC in 6 years and I wanted 3D gaming. I'm just not going to spend the money on nVidia. I'll get an OC'd 5870 2gig or track down a 5970 and save in the long run.

    ohh check this out


    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102884 a 5850 for 279 bucks

    psychoticdream on
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Sakeido wrote: »
    I was going to get one of the new Fermis because I wanted to put together a 3D gaming rig. After seeing the benchmarks, I figured "well, alright that ain't bad." Then I saw the power consumption and temperature under load and that gave me pause. More telling, I listened to the clips Hard OCP had of the fans and that was a serious "WTF Nvidia" moment.

    I'm still thinking about it.. but I'm going to wait until a 3D solution for ATI comes out, and then make my decision.

    Right now your options for ATI are IZ3D or buying a 3D TV and using that as a monitor.

    Because I'm in the same boat as you. I'm building my first new PC in 6 years and I wanted 3D gaming. I'm just not going to spend the money on nVidia. I'll get an OC'd 5870 2gig or track down a 5970 and save in the long run.

    ohh check this out


    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102884 a 5850 for 279 bucks

    That's actually a good deal because that's Sapphire's newest non Vapor-X/Toxic model.

    Dark Shroud on
  • ClipseClipse Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Metallikat wrote: »
    The point is, it should have stomped the 5870. It's a high end single gpu card to what ATI considers a mid range single gpu card and it sometimes breaks even and sometimes pulls ahead, with the occasional large gain.

    When did a $400-500 graphics card become mid-range? I don't know if ATI has actually been marketing the 5870 as mid-range, but it is (on average) only 10% cheaper than the MSRP of the 480. It seems a bit odd to call one high end and the other mid-range.

    Clipse on
  • ZxerolZxerol for the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't do so i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    5870 is the highest-end, single-GPU card on ATI's line-up. No way in hell is that thing "mid-range."

    Zxerol on
  • Dark ShroudDark Shroud Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Clipse wrote: »
    Metallikat wrote: »
    The point is, it should have stomped the 5870. It's a high end single gpu card to what ATI considers a mid range single gpu card and it sometimes breaks even and sometimes pulls ahead, with the occasional large gain.

    When did a $400-500 graphics card become mid-range? I don't know if ATI has actually been marketing the 5870 as mid-range, but it is (on average) only 10% cheaper than the MSRP of the 480. It seems a bit odd to call one high end and the other mid-range.

    The 5870's MSRP is more than 10% cheaper. The problem is they've been selling with a much higher street value. When the 480 actually launches next month prices should come down a little. Personally I'm eying the 5970, but I'll probably end up going with a 5770 as a place holder & saving until the 6000 series launches.

    Dark Shroud on
  • BlackDoveBlackDove Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    So glad to finally see the GTX480 and 70 out and all the tests.

    Now it's confirmed.

    I'm buying a 5870.

    BlackDove on
  • ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm thinking of getting a GTX 470 in the next 3 to 6 months, mainly because I've had better experiences with Geforce cards on my rig than with ATI cards. Added to which, I like the PhysX stuff in Mirror's Edge and Batman: Arkham Asylum, but I can't just put a small Geforce in my machine as a dedicated physics accelerator due to the motherbord only supporting one card. Still, I'll wait for a) more reviews of the 470 and b) Swiss prices before I make any decision.

    Thirith on
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