Woohoo I made platinum! 8/10 matches. Let's see how long I can stay there!
DROPPED 2 GAMES ALREADY HAVE YOU?
DISAPPOINTED.
I'm 9-4 right now! And I only seem to win when I'm zergie! The world is upside down.
Whoa wait, I thought you were suppose to be bad Lemming. Anyway good job man, what is your B.net name?
He's awful.
But he's still better than 90% of the people in this thread. Platinum league is full of D+ newbies, and then a bunch of top tier SC1/War3 players. Things will change once the retail version is out though.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Woohoo I made platinum! 8/10 matches. Let's see how long I can stay there!
DROPPED 2 GAMES ALREADY HAVE YOU?
DISAPPOINTED.
I'm 9-4 right now! And I only seem to win when I'm zergie! The world is upside down.
Whoa wait, I thought you were suppose to be bad Lemming. Anyway good job man, what is your B.net name?
He's awful.
But he's still better than 90% of the people in this thread. Platinum league is full of D+ newbies, and then a bunch of top tier SC1/War3 players. Things will change once the retail version is out though...
I failed big time during my placement matches, but quickly rose to Silver once I got my space legs. Only issue now is that the top 10 in my division all have massive amount of points. Been stuck in 13th for a while now.
I went on a losing streak in 2v2, and I got placed in copper. After switching to toss and zerg (my new computer can handle the creep now), I rose to rank 6 in a few days. Anyone know what it takes to jump to the next division? I want to get in bronze.
I'm bronze cause I shat everywhere on my placement matches. Haven't had tons of time to play, but spring break is next week. I'm still dealing with the same problems I did in SC1 (macro in general). At least there are ultra noobs for me to stomp on. I think I'm like 8-9 or something similar right now.
Protoss can put some remarkable pressure on with basic infantry. Not necessarily unfair, but a steady stream of quickly-built (warped) zealots and stalkers can really put a player on the defensive.
Speaking of warps, PvP is stupid.
Thors are pretty neat but die stupid fast. Are the supposed to be a frontline unit at all? They seem best for standing just behind your siege tanks sniping air units, they're so easy to focus-fire and drop if they're anywhere even remotely close to the front of a fight. Their cannon ability doesn't seem particularly useful, "I'm a big slow vulnerable unit let me use a short-range ability that has me standing still."
Hellions are kinda trashy. Sorry. Build marauders or reapers instead.
Roaches to Mutalisks is an easy win in at least 4/5 matches I play as zerg. Use roaches to pressure and force a turtle and detection, harass with mutalisks, contain, win. Roaches are crazy.
Void Rays can kill an expansion really quick. Then they take an embarassingly long time to actually kill the workers there. Like an awkward amount of time. "You guys wanna run away?" "Nah, we're blocked in by rocks. Hurry this up, would you?"
Beta is really fun. Skill levels are really all over the place.
Hellions have their uses, mainly worker harass and rushing. Void rays are good at killing high HP things and bad at killing many low HP things by design.
I agree about Thors feeling oddly fragile. For 300 minerals and 200 gas you'd expect something that could survive more like a battlecruiser.
BahamutZERO on
0
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
edited March 2010
(non-beta) Hellions seem to be used to quite a good extent in worker harassment and/or generalized base harassment against Zerg.
If your opponent has terrible base defense, reapers will be significantly better harassment. Unlike hellions, they can bypass chokepoints and absolutely demolish any buildings that aren't incredibly well guarded close to cliffs or ledges.
If you're looking to inflict serious damage, a medivac drop is probably a better bet. Harder to defend against and more staying power, plus it can bypass chokepoints.
For anti-infantry, marauders combined with tanks are just better. Hellions might be great for some weird "holy crap he's building 10000000 zerglings what do I do p.s. no air units" fights, but a marine / marauder / tank force is not only going to be devastating against large groups of infantry, it will also be devastating against large groups of all sorts of other stuff too.
I'm just never in a situation where I think to myself "self, I really wish I had some hellions right now!" Any scenario where they're useful other units perform about as well, and those same units are useful in so many scenarios where hellions are not.
I'll try playing with them some more, but so far they're remarkably underwhelming.
unlike reapers they don't take 50 gas a pop, and they have a huge ranged splash attack that's good on units, vs. those crappy awful pistols that the reapers have that can't kill shit . Reapers are great vs. buildings and that's it, they can't even kill workers that well.
And they're faster than mutalisks. Faster than pretty much everything except possibly speed lings.
Hellions definitely are a niche unit, but you can get them out really fast. They're a viable unit to rush with.
BahamutZERO on
0
ApogeeLancks In Every Game EverRegistered Userregular
edited March 2010
From what I've seen (no-beta), 6 Hellions can roll into a worker line and evaporate it in 2 volleys. It's sickening. Just sequester a small group, and if the enemy leaves his base they roll in and flambe his econ.
Apogee on
0
eeSanGI slice like a goddamn hammer.Registered Userregular
People keep saying that Hellions aren't good at harassing because medivac drops are better, as though one is incapable of medivac dropping hellions!
Also, hellions cost no gas, this is big!
Hellions seem to be like void rays in that they are kind of whatever, only good at light harassment until you reach a critical number and then they are quite scary.
From what I've seen (no-beta), 6 Hellions can roll into a worker line and evaporate it in 2 volleys. It's sickening. Just sequester a small group, and if the enemy leaves his base they roll in and flambe his econ.
Hellions kill workers really really fast, don't get me wrong. Its just that, if your opponent is leaving their worker lines in a position where you can just rush 6 hellions in and blow up his worker line, who cares? "Overpowered against opponents with absolutely no sense" seems lackluster to me.
Hellions to Banshees as a specific anti-zerg strategy seems like it could work pretty well, early harass to slow them down and then you get banshees before they have any anti-air.
From what I've seen (no-beta), 6 Hellions can roll into a worker line and evaporate it in 2 volleys. It's sickening. Just sequester a small group, and if the enemy leaves his base they roll in and flambe his econ.
Hellions kill workers really really fast, don't get me wrong. Its just that, if your opponent is leaving their worker lines in a position where you can just rush 6 hellions in and blow up his worker line, who cares? "Overpowered against opponents with absolutely no sense" seems lackluster to me.
Hellions to Banshees as a specific anti-zerg strategy seems like it could work pretty well, early harass to slow them down and then you get banshees before they have any anti-air.
Do you not see the merit in keeping your enemy contained via hellions? Going early hellions basically makes it impossible to fast expand because you can't wall off your natural that early. For the relatively low investment of 4 hellions you can keep your opponent quite holed up. This seems to be a good thing to me.
From what I've seen (no-beta), 6 Hellions can roll into a worker line and evaporate it in 2 volleys. It's sickening. Just sequester a small group, and if the enemy leaves his base they roll in and flambe his econ.
Hellions kill workers really really fast, don't get me wrong. Its just that, if your opponent is leaving their worker lines in a position where you can just rush 6 hellions in and blow up his worker line, who cares? "Overpowered against opponents with absolutely no sense" seems lackluster to me.
Hellions to Banshees as a specific anti-zerg strategy seems like it could work pretty well, early harass to slow them down and then you get banshees before they have any anti-air.
Do you not see the merit in keeping your enemy contained via hellions? Going early hellions basically makes it impossible to fast expand because you can't wall off your natural that early. For the relatively low investment of 4 hellions you can keep your opponent quite holed up. This seems to be a good thing to me.
I would agree that Hellions aren't so hot against Terran. But when I've used them against Zerg, it's been great. They burn through Zerglings, Roaches, and Workers so fast - and what can the Zerg do? They can't wall off their base - you WILL get in.
Plus you can tech to Hellions crazy fast. Put a reactor on your Barracks while you build your Factory, then float the Factory to the Reactor, then build a second Factory with a Tech Lab to get the Hellion upgrade. Once you have like 7 Hellions, go kill all their workers.
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
edited March 2010
Is it possible to burrow a spine crawler on a ramp? I wonder if that might prevent hellions from getting into one's base while still allowing smaller units past it?
If you don't believe in the power of hellions, watch Day[9]'s analysis of some replays by cowgomoo at livestream.com/striderdoom. They are incredibly useful.
Hellions don't burn through roaches, but roaches can't really kill properly micro'd hellions either. Zerg can 'wall' of his ramp decently by putting roaches shoulder to shoulder across it.
I saw a game with oversky where he walled off his main with roaches like that and his opponent was microing hellions to take them out, so oversky used an overlord to extend the creep, and with the extra speed on the creep the roaches were fast enough to chase down and punish the hellions every time they came in for a shot.
Has anyone noticed that no one in here is in the gold league? It's all platinum or bronze. Weird how there isn't more middle ground.
i should make silver soonish.
I don't get why people don't use creep tumors more. even if you get another queen for the sole purpose of spreading creep it's freaking awesome how fast you can cover the map in the stuff. or just queenoverlordtumor the expansions.
Yeah, they burrow. But really if you are fighting zerg you really ought to have detectors because of burrow shenanigans, especially with new mobile burrowed units like infestors and roaches.
I stuck a burrowed roach in front of my opponents high yield patch and in the replay discovered he must have tried landing his CC there like 10 times, then I launched an attack and side tracked him, so he had a CC just floating not doing anything for awhile. I thought that was pretty funny he never figured out why he couldn't land. Granted, he also never expanded until then I had control of like 70% of the map and we both sucked, but it made me realize how handy a single unit can really be.
Xeddicus on
"For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
I stuck a burrowed roach in front of my opponents high yield patch and in the replay discovered he must have tried landing his CC there like 10 times, then I launched an attack and side tracked him, so he had a CC just floating not doing anything for awhile. I thought that was pretty funny he never figured out why he couldn't land. Granted, he also never expanded until then I had control of like 70% of the map and we both sucked, but it made me realize how handy a single unit can really be.
Ill dump a pylon in the way, or take the gas...just to be irritating. Once i had a guy commit his entire force to killing my pylon, when i saw how much force was there, i went and razed his base.
Yeah, they burrow. But really if you are fighting zerg you really ought to have detectors because of burrow shenanigans, especially with new mobile burrowed units like infestors and roaches.
I do have to say the new cloaking units and detection mechanics make invisible units much more satisfying. Banshees, Roaches, and Dark Templar all feel both sneaky and useful, even when detectors are in play, and the unique role stealth plays for each army is awesome.
You want detectors against every race, terrans to ensure random banshees don't murder your entire army, protoss to protect against both dark templar and observers, and zerg so they can't hide their entire army underneath your feet.
Posts
He's awful.
But he's still better than 90% of the people in this thread. Platinum league is full of D+ newbies, and then a bunch of top tier SC1/War3 players. Things will change once the retail version is out though.
Cooper here. And proud of it.
PC Gamer versus RPS
tee hee
Starcraft 2: jawaka.947
I believe that is correct.
Protoss can put some remarkable pressure on with basic infantry. Not necessarily unfair, but a steady stream of quickly-built (warped) zealots and stalkers can really put a player on the defensive.
Speaking of warps, PvP is stupid.
Thors are pretty neat but die stupid fast. Are the supposed to be a frontline unit at all? They seem best for standing just behind your siege tanks sniping air units, they're so easy to focus-fire and drop if they're anywhere even remotely close to the front of a fight. Their cannon ability doesn't seem particularly useful, "I'm a big slow vulnerable unit let me use a short-range ability that has me standing still."
Hellions are kinda trashy. Sorry. Build marauders or reapers instead.
Roaches to Mutalisks is an easy win in at least 4/5 matches I play as zerg. Use roaches to pressure and force a turtle and detection, harass with mutalisks, contain, win. Roaches are crazy.
Mothership Rush: Remarkably unwise, remarkably awesome.
Void Rays can kill an expansion really quick. Then they take an embarassingly long time to actually kill the workers there. Like an awkward amount of time. "You guys wanna run away?" "Nah, we're blocked in by rocks. Hurry this up, would you?"
Beta is really fun. Skill levels are really all over the place.
I agree about Thors feeling oddly fragile. For 300 minerals and 200 gas you'd expect something that could survive more like a battlecruiser.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
If your opponent has terrible base defense, reapers will be significantly better harassment. Unlike hellions, they can bypass chokepoints and absolutely demolish any buildings that aren't incredibly well guarded close to cliffs or ledges.
If you're looking to inflict serious damage, a medivac drop is probably a better bet. Harder to defend against and more staying power, plus it can bypass chokepoints.
For anti-infantry, marauders combined with tanks are just better. Hellions might be great for some weird "holy crap he's building 10000000 zerglings what do I do p.s. no air units" fights, but a marine / marauder / tank force is not only going to be devastating against large groups of infantry, it will also be devastating against large groups of all sorts of other stuff too.
I'm just never in a situation where I think to myself "self, I really wish I had some hellions right now!" Any scenario where they're useful other units perform about as well, and those same units are useful in so many scenarios where hellions are not.
I'll try playing with them some more, but so far they're remarkably underwhelming.
And they're faster than mutalisks. Faster than pretty much everything except possibly speed lings.
Hellions definitely are a niche unit, but you can get them out really fast. They're a viable unit to rush with.
Slice like a god damn hammer. LoL: Rafflesia / BNet: Talonflame#11979
Those are some neat strategies, I'll try a few of them out and see if they change my mind.
Also, hellions cost no gas, this is big!
Hellions seem to be like void rays in that they are kind of whatever, only good at light harassment until you reach a critical number and then they are quite scary.
Hellions kill workers really really fast, don't get me wrong. Its just that, if your opponent is leaving their worker lines in a position where you can just rush 6 hellions in and blow up his worker line, who cares? "Overpowered against opponents with absolutely no sense" seems lackluster to me.
Hellions to Banshees as a specific anti-zerg strategy seems like it could work pretty well, early harass to slow them down and then you get banshees before they have any anti-air.
Do you not see the merit in keeping your enemy contained via hellions? Going early hellions basically makes it impossible to fast expand because you can't wall off your natural that early. For the relatively low investment of 4 hellions you can keep your opponent quite holed up. This seems to be a good thing to me.
I would agree that Hellions aren't so hot against Terran. But when I've used them against Zerg, it's been great. They burn through Zerglings, Roaches, and Workers so fast - and what can the Zerg do? They can't wall off their base - you WILL get in.
Plus you can tech to Hellions crazy fast. Put a reactor on your Barracks while you build your Factory, then float the Factory to the Reactor, then build a second Factory with a Tech Lab to get the Hellion upgrade. Once you have like 7 Hellions, go kill all their workers.
(Disclaimer: remember that I suck)
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
i should make silver soonish.
I don't get why people don't use creep tumors more. even if you get another queen for the sole purpose of spreading creep it's freaking awesome how fast you can cover the map in the stuff. or just queenoverlordtumor the expansions.
I was in copper for awhile and after staying at #1 forever I hit silver.
I'm gold. Somehow.
I'm slightly positive (15-13) and hanging around 50 more or less staying with 1000 points. I am not moving up any time soon.
Ill dump a pylon in the way, or take the gas...just to be irritating. Once i had a guy commit his entire force to killing my pylon, when i saw how much force was there, i went and razed his base.
I do have to say the new cloaking units and detection mechanics make invisible units much more satisfying. Banshees, Roaches, and Dark Templar all feel both sneaky and useful, even when detectors are in play, and the unique role stealth plays for each army is awesome.
You want detectors against every race, terrans to ensure random banshees don't murder your entire army, protoss to protect against both dark templar and observers, and zerg so they can't hide their entire army underneath your feet.