but they way the skills are set up now, it is built for 30 at the max and I don't see how they can incorporate another 30 levels very well without an overhaul
Well, yeah.
That's what I mean.
All I would do, were I them, is go "this game, you're going to be picking background and allocating a few skill points to start with."
You know, like BG2, Throne of Bhall, Dragon Age: Awakening, etc. It's assuming that if you get ME3, you're probably importing, and if you didn't import you'll just plop some points into your skills to start with.
The system itself would probably need to be overhauled to allow for 30-60 being interesting. I don't think level 5 + new skills was supposed to be like the correct answer, it's just throwing out an idea. Double the skills? Who knows?
Honestly, I just like the idea of a "Starting level" because it allows me to decide more about a new character. I hate starting at level 1 in almost any system.
but they way the skills are set up now, it is built for 30 at the max and I don't see how they can incorporate another 30 levels very well without an overhaul
Well, yeah.
That's what I mean.
All I would do, were I them, is go "this game, you're going to be picking background and allocating a few skill points to start with."
You know, like BG2, Throne of Bhall, Dragon Age: Awakening, etc. It's assuming that if you get ME3, you're probably importing, and if you didn't import you'll just plop some points into your skills to start with.
The system itself would probably need to be overhauled to allow for 30-60 being interesting. I don't think level 5 + new skills was supposed to be like the correct answer, it's just throwing out an idea. Double the skills? Who knows?
Honestly, I just like the idea of a "Starting level" because it allows me to decide more about a new character. I hate starting at level 1 in almost any system.
if they do overhaul the system to where 30-60 is interesting, like ME1, then starting at 30 seems unbalanced. a slightly higher starting level for imports, like ME2, would be fine to reward imported players with a little more choice in the beginning. Level 5 or something.
at this point it's not so much continuing the ME2 system with 30-60, because you can't do that, it's making a new system. That's what I wanted them to do in the first place, if all we disagree on is starting level that's details.
Baldur's Gate is based on the AD&D system, which has 20 levels built in to the basic system. (more than 20 is a mess, though)
Mass Effect comes up with a different system every game.
I wouldn't exactly call this a trend. They have changed things exactly one time. For all we know, ME3 will be very similar to ME2 in its combat and leveling system. The only change I'd like to see is that they remove scanning in place of something that's actually fun.
Good Lord! I can't believe one post from me has touched off a gigantic stupid argument.
So let me clarify, my problem is not with them starting us off at level one, per se, my problem would be is if to start us off at level one they do something stupid. Like say, kill Shepard, again and destroy the SR-2 and scatter our buddies to the four winds.
Maybe you start ME3 at lvl 60 with a fully upgraded crew and ship... but the Lazarus project work starts unraveling, and your crew and ship get beat up as you fight to stop the Reapers, so you actually delevel as you progress through the game.
An imported Shepard would be < lvl 60 and thus more progressed.
See?
We can get stupider!
Vicktor on
Origin: Viycktor
0
UtsanomikoBros before DoesRollin' in the thlayRegistered Userregular
edited March 2010
Hey guys
You know what that romance pack should have?
Joker/Femshep.
She can make him put on her N7 outfit tie his wrists together and make him bark like a dog.
Good Lord! I can't believe one post from me has touched off a gigantic stupid argument.
So let me clarify, my problem is not with them starting us off at level one, per se, my problem would be is if to start us off at level one they kill Shepard, again and destroy the SR-2, and scatter our buddies to the four winds.
I also doubt they will do THAT either. They'll probably just mix up the battle system enough that they don't need to explain it at all. And as far as buddies go, well, they can have them be 'around' without having them be willing to join your combat team per se.
Though I suspect Garrus and Tali will end up as playable, many of the others could decide to retire or whatnot. Mordin might want to go set up a clinic for Korgan, Samara hunt down some evildoer, Jack get drunk and blow something up, ect ect. You could have them pop up for a sidequest later, and if we're really lucky, show up for the big finale to help out.
Maybe you start ME3 at lvl 60 with a fully upgraded crew and ship... but the Lazarus project work starts unraveling, and your crew and ship get beat up as you fight to stop the Reapers, so you actually delevel as you progress through the game.
An imported Shepard would be < lvl 60 and thus more progressed.
See?
We can get stupider!
minus the whole imported shepard thing, I think this would be a really neat concept for a shooter
The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, coming to xbox 360 this summer!
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
Wait what? Is this something that fans have been clamoring for?
Well he was pretty high on her unofficial bang-list.
But you don't think Joker doesn't have fantasies of some strong, assertive military woman putting him in her arms and carrying him over the threshhold? Somebody out there's gotta be clamoring for it.
She can make him put on her N7 outfit tie his wrists together and make him bark like a dog.
Do you remember the scene in the opening sequence to Goldeneye?
You know, with the masochist Russian chick who gets off by killing guys she's having sex with by squeeezing them to death with her thighs?
Yeah. I'd kinda be like that. Only more snapping and popping.
Dr.Chakwas will be the kinkiest romance option available in ME3. You know she's got a laxtex and leather dominatrix outfit hidden in that desk drawer. It's like the bottle of Serrice Ice Brady that she never got to open. She's gonna put that outfit on one more time before it's too late.
Maybe you start ME3 at lvl 60 with a fully upgraded crew and ship... but the Lazarus project work starts unraveling, and your crew and ship get beat up as you fight to stop the Reapers, so you actually delevel as you progress through the game.
An imported Shepard would be < lvl 60 and thus more progressed.
See?
We can get stupider!
minus the whole imported shepard thing, I think this would be a really neat concept for a shooter
The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, coming to xbox 360 this summer!
I agree, but it would need a really good story to back it up. The Pavlovian response to incremental progression is a strong drive for games. Games like Diablo and WoW have story (ok, diablo has story, but wow has... purples?) but it's purely superfluous to the incremental progression and upgrade system that hooks and keeps people 'in'.
It's depressing to watch your character slowly waste away. I've played some indie games that tried to use this concept -and one did to great effect- but it was very unsettling... which was kinda the goal of the game (some statement about the slow decline and inevitability of our mortality). It was a nice piece of art, but not 'fun' in any way shape or form because no matter what, you knew you were going to 'lose'.
That's not to say that a creative group coulnd't make the concept fun though.
Vicktor on
Origin: Viycktor
0
UtsanomikoBros before DoesRollin' in the thlayRegistered Userregular
praetorian was pretty much the first time i've died in the game. guess i should have upgraded incinerate more/brought loyal zaeed along, but grunt's team fire ammo was a damn awesome thing
curly haired boy on
Registered just for the Mass Effect threads | Steam: click ^^^ | Origin: curlyhairedboy
praetorian was pretty much the first time i've died in the game. guess i should have upgraded incinerate more/brought loyal zaeed along, but grunt's team fire ammo was a damn awesome thing
Inferno Grenade's rubbish. While I haven't crunched the numbers personally, I have reason to believe it doesn't scale with any passive upgrades besides its own innate levelling (it's not tied to weapons, tech, or biotics since it apparently doesn't fall under any of those categories). It's fun, but it's way down there on the list of good bonus powers.
Also:
"I’ve had enough of your lackadaisical permutations!"
Combat drone is just there so that you can keep yourself always on cooldown if you want, right?
The one thing combat drone has going for it? It can tie up one enemy. One enemy will turn around, and attack it stupidly, ignoring whatever you and your squad do to it. Interestingly it confuses the hell out of scions, who turn around to look at it, do nothing, turn back to Shepard, do nothing, and repeat until the drone just despawns. Otherwise its guns are piss-weak, the explosion is rubbish, and several enemies still ignore it (notably, Husks).
also, it knocks enemies out of cover, so you can either cryo them so they are stuck out of cover and vulnerable to your gunfire, or incinerate them for kicks because everyone is an arsonist deep down
seriously a good engineer can just follow his drone around as it goes from enemy to enemy, tying them up in knots, while you provide the unstoppable advance of skullfuckery-through-tech-powers
Posts
That's what I mean.
All I would do, were I them, is go "this game, you're going to be picking background and allocating a few skill points to start with."
You know, like BG2, Throne of Bhall, Dragon Age: Awakening, etc. It's assuming that if you get ME3, you're probably importing, and if you didn't import you'll just plop some points into your skills to start with.
The system itself would probably need to be overhauled to allow for 30-60 being interesting. I don't think level 5 + new skills was supposed to be like the correct answer, it's just throwing out an idea. Double the skills? Who knows?
Honestly, I just like the idea of a "Starting level" because it allows me to decide more about a new character. I hate starting at level 1 in almost any system.
if they do overhaul the system to where 30-60 is interesting, like ME1, then starting at 30 seems unbalanced. a slightly higher starting level for imports, like ME2, would be fine to reward imported players with a little more choice in the beginning. Level 5 or something.
at this point it's not so much continuing the ME2 system with 30-60, because you can't do that, it's making a new system. That's what I wanted them to do in the first place, if all we disagree on is starting level that's details.
I wouldn't exactly call this a trend. They have changed things exactly one time. For all we know, ME3 will be very similar to ME2 in its combat and leveling system. The only change I'd like to see is that they remove scanning in place of something that's actually fun.
you will begin ME3 at a baseline level of ability tuned to accommodate a range of progression of different skills
what the fuck does it matter if they call the starting point level 1 or 2 or 30
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
That, my friend, sounds like a challenge! I'm sure we can do stupider.
nah man, my problem is if there are actually 29 whole levels behind that starting point
Really?
Why not just overhaul it and start you at level 1 again? It's not being "reset" as level 1 is again different from level 1 of the previous game.
is this ridiculous
How about they just make us start off as Level "A". Would that make everyone happy?
Would it?
Only because you are operating under the assumption that they are going to do something stupid, which they haven't done before.
i'm talking about if you are starting off with 50 squad points from an imported character, and have another 30 to gain on your way to level 60
I am pretty darn sure they are not going to do that.
what, I never said Bioware would do this, I am arguing against those who say they should
So let me clarify, my problem is not with them starting us off at level one, per se, my problem would be is if to start us off at level one they do something stupid. Like say, kill Shepard, again and destroy the SR-2 and scatter our buddies to the four winds.
An imported Shepard would be < lvl 60 and thus more progressed.
See?
Origin: Viycktor
You know what that romance pack should have?
Joker/Femshep.
I also doubt they will do THAT either. They'll probably just mix up the battle system enough that they don't need to explain it at all. And as far as buddies go, well, they can have them be 'around' without having them be willing to join your combat team per se.
Though I suspect Garrus and Tali will end up as playable, many of the others could decide to retire or whatnot. Mordin might want to go set up a clinic for Korgan, Samara hunt down some evildoer, Jack get drunk and blow something up, ect ect. You could have them pop up for a sidequest later, and if we're really lucky, show up for the big finale to help out.
Wait what? Is this something that fans have been clamoring for?
minus the whole imported shepard thing, I think this would be a really neat concept for a shooter
The Curious Case of Benjamin Button, coming to xbox 360 this summer!
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
not necessarily femshep
Well he was pretty high on her unofficial bang-list.
But you don't think Joker doesn't have fantasies of some strong, assertive military woman putting him in her arms and carrying him over the threshhold? Somebody out there's gotta be clamoring for it.
You know, with the masochist Russian chick who gets off by killing guys she's having sex with by squeeezing them to death with her thighs?
Yeah. I'd kinda be like that. Only more snapping and popping.
Dr.Chakwas will be the kinkiest romance option available in ME3. You know she's got a laxtex and leather dominatrix outfit hidden in that desk drawer. It's like the bottle of Serrice Ice Brady that she never got to open. She's gonna put that outfit on one more time before it's too late.
I agree, but it would need a really good story to back it up. The Pavlovian response to incremental progression is a strong drive for games. Games like Diablo and WoW have story (ok, diablo has story, but wow has... purples?) but it's purely superfluous to the incremental progression and upgrade system that hooks and keeps people 'in'.
It's depressing to watch your character slowly waste away. I've played some indie games that tried to use this concept -and one did to great effect- but it was very unsettling... which was kinda the goal of the game (some statement about the slow decline and inevitability of our mortality). It was a nice piece of art, but not 'fun' in any way shape or form because no matter what, you knew you were going to 'lose'.
That's not to say that a creative group coulnd't make the concept fun though.
Origin: Viycktor
Yeah I remember that scene.
You remember that episode of 30 Rock?
Hollow bones? Like a bird?
JOKER : "I would, but I get vertigo."
The sentinel class.
Obviously contains spoilers
ME2 Abridged.
Tali: "My thread is bigger!"
Fun stuffs.
harbinger is a joke
praetorian was pretty much the first time i've died in the game. guess i should have upgraded incinerate more/brought loyal zaeed along, but grunt's team fire ammo was a damn awesome thing
Registered just for the Mass Effect threads | Steam: click ^^^ | Origin: curlyhairedboy
i hear the enemies kill themselves
Inferno Grenade's rubbish. While I haven't crunched the numbers personally, I have reason to believe it doesn't scale with any passive upgrades besides its own innate levelling (it's not tied to weapons, tech, or biotics since it apparently doesn't fall under any of those categories). It's fun, but it's way down there on the list of good bonus powers.
Also:
"I’ve had enough of your lackadaisical permutations!"
This is an illogical romance.
In some cases, impacts with Shepseed have led to broken hips, pelvises, legs, and jaws.
Now imagine the effects of such destruction upon poor Krolik's-Syndrome-afflicted Joker.
I'm pretty sure that's giving combat drone too much credit. :P
Or because BioWare wanted to give Tali a throwaway power. :?
The one thing combat drone has going for it? It can tie up one enemy. One enemy will turn around, and attack it stupidly, ignoring whatever you and your squad do to it. Interestingly it confuses the hell out of scions, who turn around to look at it, do nothing, turn back to Shepard, do nothing, and repeat until the drone just despawns. Otherwise its guns are piss-weak, the explosion is rubbish, and several enemies still ignore it (notably, Husks).
seriously a good engineer can just follow his drone around as it goes from enemy to enemy, tying them up in knots, while you provide the unstoppable advance of skullfuckery-through-tech-powers