[WoW]Druids: CLOSED SLIGHTLY EARLY

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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Warlock82 wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Patch notes were posted in chat and this is all that I got from them:
    •Druids in Moonkin Form should now correctly be able to mount.

    About fucking time.

    Yeah this was pissing me off the entire time I was leveling. They are fixing it so Survey dismounts you from flight form too, right?

    I would hope not, since you can perform every other gathering skill type and most quest "pick up this quest item on the ground" while in flight form.

    Which is handy as all hell and makes questing go 10x as fast.

    Aegis on
    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    With Moonkin change I think I've lost 8% physical damage mitigation overall, while gaining 15% magical mitigation. Sad boomkin tank is sad :(

    Aegis on
    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • SyrdonSyrdon Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    You can't survey in flightform last I checked. You get a message saying something like you can't do that while pacified, so you actually need to switch out, then survey, then switch back. Having it just take you out of flight form would at least be an improvement.

    Syrdon on
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I'm gladly giving up 8% melee direct damage mitigation for 15% magic and bleed mitigation. Of course Ferals are nerfed in this patch as well, so I guess having that extra mitigation against bleeds isn't as important.

    And yeah, you can't survey while in bird form since Surveying is considered an offensive move so you can do it while in combat. Right now I have /cancelform at the front of my survey macro and have to hit it twice if in bird form. To fix it they'd either need to put in a special case around bird form to allow it to work, a special case around bird form to take you out of that form but not any other forms, or just make surveying take you out of any form period.

    Opty on
  • SyrdonSyrdon Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    When you say in combat do you just mean while getting hit? Because I'm pretty sure I can use any of the gathering skills while in combat and in flightform but that getting hit will interrupt it.

    Syrdon on
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I mean while getting hit in combat, yeah. When hit by a mob while gathering you stop, when hit by a mob while surveying you just get pushback.

    Opty on
  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Syrdon wrote: »
    You can't survey in flightform last I checked. You get a message saying something like you can't do that while pacified, so you actually need to switch out, then survey, then switch back. Having it just take you out of flight form would at least be an improvement.

    ^

    Though I was getting good at flinging myself to the spot I wanted to survey :)<3 flight form cancel forward momentum!

    Warlock82 on
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  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    That's one of the best/worst things about flight form is that you keep your forward momentum when shifting out. Normal mounts cancel your forward momentum when cancelled. I put worst in there as well because a couple of times I've misjudged my arc and clipped the top of a cliff or hit a branch or something and died. Or the one funny time when I overshot off the edge of a cliff but close enough so a ranged mob saw me and put me into combat so I couldn't shift back into bird.

    Opty on
  • HallowedFaithHallowedFaith Call me Cloud. Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Has [Fury of Stormrage] Talent always been Tier 3 in Resto?


    How... uh.. does a Boomkin take advantage of that?

    HallowedFaith on
    I'm making video games. DesignBy.Cloud
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    A boomkin doesn't. It's a resto talent: it was originally "free wrath plus proc instant Nourish" but then people complained and they switched it to Starfire. As such it only serves two purposes: a levelling talent for those crazy enough to level as resto, and free/extra DPS when you've outgeared an encounter to the point that you can keep up the tank with just HoTs and can Wrath in between refreshes.

    Opty on
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Yea, it's impossible for a Boomkin to pick it up given that they are required to have 31 points in Balance leaving not enough to get to the 3rd level in talents in resto with the remainder.

    And with good reason, honestly, because if we could gain access to that talent Boomkins would be completely overpowered.

    Aegis on
    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Opty wrote: »
    A boomkin doesn't. It's a resto talent: it was originally "free wrath plus proc instant Nourish" but then people complained and they switched it to Starfire. As such it only serves two purposes: a levelling talent for those crazy enough to level as resto, and free/extra DPS when you've outgeared an encounter to the point that you can keep up the tank with just HoTs and can Wrath in between refreshes.
    It would be useful on Magmaw during the impale phase. I assume it's also sort of useful for PvP.

    The problem is resto druids just can't afford to give up the points for it since they don't really have any free points that can't go into improving their healing/longevity. So not only is it generally only usable on content that you outgear, but you're probably only going to have it if you actually have an "outgeared content" dual spec.

    Where's that tri-spec already?

    forty on
    The best card in Hearthstone is your credit card.
  • HallowedFaithHallowedFaith Call me Cloud. Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    OK, what the fuck is going on. I have no threat anymore.

    I made a few runs since they hotfixed worgens and people are peeling threat off me so fucking fast. I'm even popping cooldowns to keep dps/tps up and it's now a game of tug of war. Even when they let me build threat up before they all come in to fight, every dps class is taking huge chunks of my threat away.

    HallowedFaith on
    I'm making video games. DesignBy.Cloud
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    OK, what the fuck is going on. I have no threat anymore.

    I made a few runs since they hotfixed worgens and people are peeling threat off me so fucking fast. I'm even popping cooldowns to keep dps/tps up and it's now a game of tug of war. Even when they let me build threat up before they all come in to fight, every dps class is taking huge chunks of my threat away.

    because they nerfed bear damage by 20% pretty much across the board?

    Bobble on
  • HallowedFaithHallowedFaith Call me Cloud. Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Yeah I know that, but my TPS is roughly half of what it was when I was running last night, so somehow 20% transfers to what i'm seeing as about 47% loss in TPS.

    That's HUGE! lol.

    HallowedFaith on
    I'm making video games. DesignBy.Cloud
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Were bears really doing ~20-25% more DPS/threat than the other tanks? I know Mangle was hitting pretty damn hard, but I wasn't aware that bears had that much of a lead overall.

    forty on
    The best card in Hearthstone is your credit card.
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited February 2011
    Even in PvP there is no room for free wrath. To make it function, you'd need to get the cast time reduction too.

    Magmaw's not a mana intense fight, so I just tree form during the head phase and wrath spam.

    Sterica on
    YL9WnCY.png
  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    My bear would fairly regularly beat lower-end dpsers in 5 mans.

    That's not even to talk bad about them, either; I could hit 8000 pretty easily.

    Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
    NREqxl5.jpg
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Hmmm...I'm liking the starfall buff. Just ran a Beasts Argaloth run, and starfall accounted for nearly equal the amount of damage my starfire and wrath did (16, 16 for wrath/starfire, & 14% for starfall). With both starfall glyphs was able to cast it 5 times and since we get the full 20 stars on a single target, it manages to hit 100 times.

    Aegis on
    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    So you had Focus Major and Starfall Major and got that? I wonder which is better between Starsurge Prime and Wrath Prime is now since you can use Starfall on trash.

    Opty on
  • ArkasArkas Registered User
    edited February 2011
    Wheee. Specced into Fungal growth from a bad Cho'gall comp last week, and holy cow, covering the ground with mushroom poop is entertaining.

    My raid wants to kill me.

    I'M PLAYING HARVEST MOON GUYS.

    Arkas on
  • BillmaanBillmaan Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Yeah I know that, but my TPS is roughly half of what it was when I was running last night, so somehow 20% transfers to what i'm seeing as about 47% loss in TPS.

    That's HUGE! lol.
    Well, keep in mind that losing threat means less rage, less vengeance, and GCDs wasted taunting.



    Other interesting bear news:

    Thick Hide was in fact buffed. Bears have way more armor now than they did pre-patch. Blizzard reps have said this might be a display issue resulting from the tooltip fix, but community theorycrafters are saying we really do have more armor.

    So, massive buff, right? Well, yes and no. Apparently bears who were in bear spec when 4.0 hit got to keep the old Protector of the Pack, and have had a phantom 12% damage reduction from 4.0 until now. The Thick Hide buff roughly offsets this fix for physical damage, but not for magic damage. (Druids who weren't in bear spec when 4.0 hit just got straight up buffed.)

    Billmaan on
  • DerrickDerrick Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    forty wrote: »
    Were bears really doing ~20-25% more DPS/threat than the other tanks? I know Mangle was hitting pretty damn hard, but I wasn't aware that bears had that much of a lead overall.

    No. http://stateofdps.com/ They were actually well behind warriors. They should be bringing up the rear with paladins now (who only do lower dps because they constantly heal themselves, as I understand it).

    This was a pure pvp nerf (aren't they all) wherein Blizzard has decided to scrub feral off the map.

    [edit @ Bill] I also like how some of the "community leaders" were taking a lot of time telling people how great druid tanking was to anyone having doubts, while knowingly enjoying a 12% flat damage reduction (physical and magical) and a 6% AP buff. Most likely the fix to this has lead to over-nerfing of the overall bear damage (and thus threat).

    That's just ethically reprehensible.

    Derrick on
    Steam and CFN: Enexemander
  • HallowedFaithHallowedFaith Call me Cloud. Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I wouldn't say that we are scrubbed off the map...

    There is a lot of room for adjustment though, specifically with tanking. I'm not sure how to adjust to it now though because we only have three threat builders.

    After running some more Heroics I find myself being forced to use Growl as soon as it is up and even with a 3x lacerate stack, ranged DPS are pulling those fuckers right off me. Something is uh.... off.

    HallowedFaith on
    I'm making video games. DesignBy.Cloud
  • DerrickDerrick Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I wouldn't say that we are scrubbed off the map...

    There is a lot of room for adjustment though, specifically with tanking. I'm not sure how to adjust to it now though because we only have three threat builders.

    After running some more Heroics I find myself being forced to use Growl as soon as it is up and even with a 3x lacerate stack, ranged DPS are pulling those fuckers right off me. Something is uh.... off.

    PvP-wise? Scrubbed off the map dude. It's not even close.

    On the official boards a post about it lasts about .5 seconds before it's deleted. And we're not talking about 1500 scrubs, we're talking the best of the best.

    Honestly (if you've played that long) this is just like the feral nerf of BC. Feral druids were competitive in pvp, so they nerfed them completely into oblivion. This had the added affect of destroying them in pve, as well (specifically, tanking). That hung around for quite a while before the pve side of things got fixed.

    Derrick on
    Steam and CFN: Enexemander
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Derrick wrote: »
    [edit @ Bill] I also like how some of the "community leaders" were taking a lot of time telling people how great druid tanking was to anyone having doubts, while knowingly enjoying a 12% flat damage reduction (physical and magical) and a 6% AP buff. Most likely the fix to this has lead to over-nerfing of the overall bear damage (and thus threat).

    That's just ethically reprehensible.

    Expand on this for me, please, I'd like to know more.

    Opty on
  • DerrickDerrick Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Opty wrote: »
    Derrick wrote: »
    [edit @ Bill] I also like how some of the "community leaders" were taking a lot of time telling people how great druid tanking was to anyone having doubts, while knowingly enjoying a 12% flat damage reduction (physical and magical) and a 6% AP buff. Most likely the fix to this has lead to over-nerfing of the overall bear damage (and thus threat).

    That's just ethically reprehensible.

    Expand on this for me, please, I'd like to know more.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2046735700

    The offender's blog (expanded) http://theincbear.com/thick-hide-theorycraft/

    Basically, the old talent was still active (ghosted) for ferals that happened to be in bear from when the shattering hit and talents were redone. This gave them a 12% flat damage reduction and 6% AP buff.

    They didn't tell anyone (presumably because a Blizzard employee confirmed it in exchange for silence. But we may never know). The most damning thing is that those that did know- Reesi, Fasc, Arielle, have been adamant on the forums about bear tanks being fine and that anyone having problems needs to l2p. One would *think* knowing you have a 12%, 6% advantage that they might take that into consideration.

    Really it comes down to the fact they were exploiting a bug and keeping a lid on it for as long as possible to continue to benefit, all the while obfuscating the issue by throwing up the old l2p with people who weren't exploiting said bug.

    Derrick on
    Steam and CFN: Enexemander
  • BikkstahBikkstah Registered User
    edited February 2011
    So, Wild Growth is the bee's knees. Heroics consist of me just rolling LB x 3 on the tank and Wild Growth. I haven't had to cast another spell yet.

    Bikkstah on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited February 2011
    The troll flight form is so embarrassingly awful. I honestly think they just FORGOT to put it in at launch, because it's beta terrible.

    It's nothing artistic. The camera's focus is on your ass, which makes for a very wonky experience as your whole body is farther out than normal. The model itself seems too big, but I guess it's pretty small for a flying mount.

    It has no sitting animation, no crafting/picking animation (you just freeze in place) and it still uses bird sound files (even though we've had bats since FUCKING LAUNCH). This is not something that they delayed to work on longer. It just slipped their minds, and is yet another piece of evidence showing that Cataclysm was rushed, rushed, rushed.

    Sterica on
    YL9WnCY.png
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Reports from EJ are that Wild Mushrooms are The New Hotness for AOEing. Provided the damage buff that was given to them isn't reverted, I wonder if it might be more viable to ditch the two points in Gale Winds (since AOE damage will now be done by mushrooms rather than Typhoon or Hurricane), and put them into Fungal Growth in order to gain some AOE control as you explode them all over the place? Mainly thinking of said use during fights like Magmaw with the parasites, or Halfus with the welps.

    Aegis on
    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Gale Winds to Fungal Growth sounds like a plan to me. I've barely used Hurricane in cata and Typhoon does shitall for damage with Gale Winds in the first place.

    Opty on
  • ShenShen Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Wow, massive boost to Moonkin dps this patch. I just pulled 15k dps on Argaloth, something like 3-4k more than normal. I'm going to try and eke more damage out by switching out of the mana saving talents, because that's not been a problem at all.

    Shen on
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  • CelianCelian Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Cat DPS seems fine after the patch, mine even improved some as I was messing around being closer to hit cap, so the harder hitting shred wasn't missing. My shred damage was #1 on Algaloth. I managed to pull 19.4K dps on him. Ferocious Bite is still poop and with the Shred buff, doesn't need to happen pre 25%.

    I fear switching to my tank spec though. Maybe I need to have a moonkin off-spec!

    Celian on
    PSN: BenTheFrenchy || Xbox: TheCanuck || Battle.Net: Celian#1956 || the100.io Pax Group
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Derrick wrote: »
    Opty wrote: »
    Derrick wrote: »
    [edit @ Bill] I also like how some of the "community leaders" were taking a lot of time telling people how great druid tanking was to anyone having doubts, while knowingly enjoying a 12% flat damage reduction (physical and magical) and a 6% AP buff. Most likely the fix to this has lead to over-nerfing of the overall bear damage (and thus threat).

    That's just ethically reprehensible.

    Expand on this for me, please, I'd like to know more.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2046735700

    The offender's blog (expanded) http://theincbear.com/thick-hide-theorycraft/

    Basically, the old talent was still active (ghosted) for ferals that happened to be in bear from when the shattering hit and talents were redone. This gave them a 12% flat damage reduction and 6% AP buff.

    They didn't tell anyone (presumably because a Blizzard employee confirmed it in exchange for silence. But we may never know). The most damning thing is that those that did know- Reesi, Fasc, Arielle, have been adamant on the forums about bear tanks being fine and that anyone having problems needs to l2p. One would *think* knowing you have a 12%, 6% advantage that they might take that into consideration.

    Really it comes down to the fact they were exploiting a bug and keeping a lid on it for as long as possible to continue to benefit, all the while obfuscating the issue by throwing up the old l2p with people who weren't exploiting said bug.
    I'm filtered, so I can't see what's behind those links, but the way you describe this implies there was some kind of bear conspiracy. I don't remember what spec I was in when 4.0 hit, so I have no idea if this bug applied to me. I know in Throne last night my threat was serviceable but not nearly as good as it used to be, and I felt like I was a little easier to heal (the extra 8k armor on my character sheet may have been an effective placebo, who knows).

    If I'd respecced after 4.0, did that remove the phantom talent?

    Bobble on
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Celian wrote: »
    Cat DPS seems fine after the patch, mine even improved some as I was messing around being closer to hit cap, so the harder hitting shred wasn't missing. My shred damage was #1 on Algaloth. I managed to pull 19.4K dps on him. Ferocious Bite is still poop and with the Shred buff, doesn't need to happen pre 25%.

    I fear switching to my tank spec though. Maybe I need to have a moonkin off-spec!

    I pulled an 11 on Argaloth last night, which was a small drop for me. Wasn't sure if the 'haste bug' I heard a rumor about was affected cats, and I had plenty of screw ups with John Madden. Are you just wasting a few cps in lieu of FB in order to hit shred again sometimes?

    Also, did you sit behind the boss? I stayed in to split the damage, which I hate about that fight :P

    Bobble on
  • GrobianGrobian What's on sale? Pliers!Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Bobble wrote: »
    Also, did you sit behind the boss? I stayed in to split the damage, which I hate about that fight :P

    When I go kitty for Argaloth, I just run in when he starts casting. I don't know if that's better or worse than just staying in front of him half the time.

    Grobian on
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  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Grobian wrote: »
    Bobble wrote: »
    Also, did you sit behind the boss? I stayed in to split the damage, which I hate about that fight :P

    When I go kitty for Argaloth, I just run in when he starts casting. I don't know if that's better or worse than just staying in front of him half the time.

    No question that's better as long as your group's understanding. When I've healed I've even seen a melee or two that just say behind him period and let 3-4 people eat the slash instead.

    Bobble on
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Yeah, it's just Argaloth. It shouldn't be a wipe if one feral druid isn't eating the slashes.

    I did the same thing with Auriaya back in the day. Raid piles up in front of her, I stay behind her and just quickly run in front while she's casting her cone thing. On the rare occasions where I missed soaking one, it wasn't the difference between a kill or a wipe anyway.

    So is it seriously worth just wasting CPs before 25% and just using only SR and Rip?

    forty on
    The best card in Hearthstone is your credit card.
  • RipplesmithRipplesmith Registered User
    edited February 2011
    Quick question for anyone that plays a boomkin here. What are the sta priorities after I have reached hit cap? Obviously Int is the king but whats next?

    Ripplesmith on
  • CelianCelian Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Bobble wrote: »
    Also, did you sit behind the boss? I stayed in to split the damage, which I hate about that fight :P

    Yeah, I charged and ravaged as well to get behind him. This was on 25m too so I likely had a bit more buffs and he had more debuffs.
    forty wrote: »
    So is it seriously worth just wasting CPs before 25% and just using only SR and Rip?

    From what I read yes, it's a negligible change to your dps, either up or down. So I'd rather use Shred and have more CPs up for stuff that actually hits. Gone are the days of enormous FB crits with ArPen and Crit being capped :(

    Celian on
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