So here's the question... can a "sequel" which has none of the original cast, a new director, makes no reference to the original, and doesn't have a 2 in the title actually be referred to as a "sequel."
You know, considering the director and Edward Norton being cast I feel like this movie should be super fucking gritty. Which is confusing because I don't know enough about The Hulk and I just can't see. Now I feel like a terrible nerd.
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of superhero movies suffer most from a weak villain / villainous plot? The Hulk is a good example, but also Spider-Man, FF, and X-Men. Spidey and FF transformed the great villains from the comics into clowns, and the "mutant machine" from X-Men was probably one of the silliest plot devices of any movie, ever.
CyberJackal on
0
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
edited April 2007
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of superhero movies suffer most from a weak villain / villainous plot? The Hulk is a good example, but also Spider-Man, FF, and X-Men. Spidey and FF transformed the great villains from the comics into clowns, and the "mutant machine" from X-Men was probably one of the silliest plot devices of any movie, ever.
As far as I remember, every X-men film has revolved around undoing all mutants or turning everyone into mutants. Every one. No super villain. Just that plot.
And Goblin was ok, they just dressed him like a tard which I still say was Raimi being his usual tard self. Like I always say, they could have Ripley fight a giant Alien Queen in a mecha fork-lift and they can't use make-up on Willem Dafoe? Gimme a break.
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
CyberJackal on
0
Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of superhero movies suffer most from a weak villain / villainous plot? The Hulk is a good example, but also Spider-Man, FF, and X-Men. Spidey and FF transformed the great villains from the comics into clowns, and the "mutant machine" from X-Men was probably one of the silliest plot devices of any movie, ever.
As far as I remember, every X-men film has revolved around undoing all mutants or turning everyone into mutants. Every one. No super villain. Just that plot.
And Goblin was ok, they just dressed him like a tard which I still say was Raimi being his usual tard self. Like I always say, they could have Ripley fight a giant Alien Queen in a mecha fork-lift and they can't use make-up on Willem Dafoe? Gimme a break.
It wasn't the plot I had a problem with, it was the machine itself. Whenever it was on screen, I was thinking "Why did they design this thing to only run on mutant magnetism powers?" I know that fact was integral to the plot of the movie, but they should have at least addressed the reason why they couldn't just plug it in (so to speak). Maybe it's just me.
And the Goblin was dressed ridiculously (but I guess they're trying to make us forget that in the 3rd movie by having Harry wear a costume even less like the actual Green Goblin's), but my real problem was with his scheme. Ok, so he starts off by getting revenge on his old business partners. Understandable. Then afterwards I guess he was trying to get Spidey to join up with him? But then what? I had a problem understanding what he was really trying to accomplish. The whole thing seemed really rushed at the end. Disappointing after how much I loved Peter gaining his powers and finishing high school.
Ok, so he starts off by getting revenge on his old business partners. Understandable. Then afterwards I guess he was trying to get Spidey to join up with him? But then what?
The first rule they teach at Villian Academy. When faced with a potential arch enemy, try and tempt said hero into joining up first. If and when that plan fails, you go for the kill.
I loved how, when Jason Todd returned from the dead as the Red Hood a while back he cornered Onyx and gave her the whole, "Join me or die," thing, and then quickly laughed it off like (paraphrased), "Hah, I mean, who says that? It's such a cliche. If I want someone to work for me I'll just pay them you know? I mean, why worry about some random person turning on you when you can just motivate someone through cash." One of the few Winick-written things I really enjoyed. Then he turned around and co-wrote Countdown that used that exact same convention in the traditional retarded manner.
Ok, so he starts off by getting revenge on his old business partners. Understandable. Then afterwards I guess he was trying to get Spidey to join up with him? But then what?
The first rule they teach at Villian Academy. When faced with a potential arch enemy, try and tempt said hero into joining up first. If and when that plan fails, you go for the kill.
Most villains have other hobbies, such as a criminal empire or the extermination of humanity.
CyberJackal on
0
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
Hasn't Lex himself been shown to subjugate other humans for his own goals, though?
Is he going to schools and inspiring youths to reach for new heights in between issues?
Hooraydiation on
0
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
Hasn't Lex himself been shown to subjugate other humans for his own goals, though?
Is he going to schools and inspiring youths to reach for new heights in between issues?
Inconsistent writing
The best example of this Lex is "Lex Luthor: Man of Steel". It's not canon, though (I think).
That's what the whole Everyman project (which is actually introduced in LL:MoS, but in a different fashion) was for: to show that humans don't need aliens (Superman) to protect them.
But then it turned into "We can turn the earth into Lextopia!" which made me throw up
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
Hasn't Lex himself been shown to subjugate other humans for his own goals, though?
Is he going to schools and inspiring youths to reach for new heights in between issues?
Inconsistent writing
The best example of this Lex is "Lex Luthor: Man of Steel". It's not canon, though (I think).
That's what the whole Everyman project (which is actually introduced in LL:MoS, but in a different fashion) was for: to show that humans don't need aliens (Superman) to protect them.
But then it turned into "We can turn the earth into Lextopia!" which made me throw up
Lex has always struck me as simply jealous of Superman. He's incredibly arrogant, vain, and to quote a term from 'Fierce Creatures,' pronoid. He really only wants to do good works and elevate mankind not for altruistic reasons, but so that people will build giant statues and monuments to his greatness, flocking through the streets and cheering his name. I don't think this is a recently developed character trait, I think he's always been this way.
What, you mean you don't love that every Superman movie has Luthor as the villain and it's not even the good Luthor it's the shitty "used car salesman" Luthor?
What's wrong with you?
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
Hasn't Lex himself been shown to subjugate other humans for his own goals, though?
Is he going to schools and inspiring youths to reach for new heights in between issues?
Inconsistent writing
The best example of this Lex is "Lex Luthor: Man of Steel". It's not canon, though (I think).
That's what the whole Everyman project (which is actually introduced in LL:MoS, but in a different fashion) was for: to show that humans don't need aliens (Superman) to protect them.
But then it turned into "We can turn the earth into Lextopia!" which made me throw up
Lex has always struck me as simply jealous of Superman. He's incredibly arrogant, vain, and to quote a term from 'Fierce Creatures,' pronoid. He really only wants to do good works and elevate mankind not for altruistic reasons, but so that people will build giant statues and monuments to his greatness, flocking through the streets and cheering his name. I don't think this is a recently developed character trait, I think he's always been this way.
(read Lex Luthor: Man of Steel)
Garlic Bread on
0
Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
edited April 2007
Well, I'll do it. But I'm not paying for it.
It's not that I've never seen Lex portrayed in a sympathic light, and he can be quite an engaging character in those cases. That episode of JLU where Amazo returns to Earth springs to mind - I really believed that Lex was trying to make up for past misdeeds, and that he even felt a bit sorry for it. And then next season he tried to conquer the universe with Brainiac.
LL:MoS seems good from what I've read of the summary on Wiki, but one story (which as you've said might not even be canon), doesn't quite convince me that he's a man with humanity's interests at heart underneath it all. I just don't think that's really the core of who he is.
I think I'll add 'xenophobic' to my earlier list, though. That probably explains a few things.
Seconded. Not limed, since that is frowned upon... but definitely seconded.
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
0
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
My initial reaction is "huh, that could work I guess" but then I thought about it and concluded that yeah, this is some stupid shit to pull. I mean if I can get pissed off at Optimus Prime having flames painted on him(as well as being the wrong kind of truck) then this should also be enough to put me off seeing this film. I never saw the first FF movie and haven't heard anything about it to make me want to, looks like FF2 will follow suit
My initial reaction is "huh, that could work I guess" but then I thought about it and concluded that yeah, this is some stupid shit to pull. I mean if I can get pissed off at Optimus Prime having flames painted on him(as well as being the wrong kind of truck) then this should also be enough to put me off seeing this film. I never saw the first FF movie and haven't heard anything about it to make me want to, looks like FF2 will follow suit
Lucky for me I was never a FF fan.
Sums up my feelings exactly.
Unless they are referring to Ultimate Galactus, the swarmy things... but even then...
MuddBudd on
There's no plan, there's no race to be run
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
0
Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
... and my theory is this: Tom Rothman was once molested by a giant.
It makes perfect sense.
That kinda sucks, but maybe it's just how Galactus will first appear in FF2. The sequel could reveal that his true form is at the heart of the storm or something. Or maybe Galactus manifests himself into his giant form when he descends to devour the Earth (kinda like how he appears differently depending on who's observing him.
Golden Yak on
0
AngryThe glory I had witnessedwas just a sleight of handRegistered Userregular
FF should have been the best, dammit. It's the one movie that needed a huge budget. It should have been a trippy awesome space adventure. Instead it was a damn lover's quarrel interspersed with explosions and stupid quips.
Posts
Nope, not really.
leagues better than FF and Daredevil at least
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of superhero movies suffer most from a weak villain / villainous plot? The Hulk is a good example, but also Spider-Man, FF, and X-Men. Spidey and FF transformed the great villains from the comics into clowns, and the "mutant machine" from X-Men was probably one of the silliest plot devices of any movie, ever.
What's wrong with you?
As far as I remember, every X-men film has revolved around undoing all mutants or turning everyone into mutants. Every one. No super villain. Just that plot.
And Goblin was ok, they just dressed him like a tard which I still say was Raimi being his usual tard self. Like I always say, they could have Ripley fight a giant Alien Queen in a mecha fork-lift and they can't use make-up on Willem Dafoe? Gimme a break.
I don't know. Maybe I have a brain tumor or something.
Fuck you guys, Kevin Spacey was excellent
Him and his little Kill Superman gokart
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
It wasn't the plot I had a problem with, it was the machine itself. Whenever it was on screen, I was thinking "Why did they design this thing to only run on mutant magnetism powers?" I know that fact was integral to the plot of the movie, but they should have at least addressed the reason why they couldn't just plug it in (so to speak). Maybe it's just me.
And the Goblin was dressed ridiculously (but I guess they're trying to make us forget that in the 3rd movie by having Harry wear a costume even less like the actual Green Goblin's), but my real problem was with his scheme. Ok, so he starts off by getting revenge on his old business partners. Understandable. Then afterwards I guess he was trying to get Spidey to join up with him? But then what? I had a problem understanding what he was really trying to accomplish. The whole thing seemed really rushed at the end. Disappointing after how much I loved Peter gaining his powers and finishing high school.
The first rule they teach at Villian Academy. When faced with a potential arch enemy, try and tempt said hero into joining up first. If and when that plan fails, you go for the kill.
PSN: OrneryRooster
Tumblr Twitter
Most villains have other hobbies, such as a criminal empire or the extermination of humanity.
Oh, he played the part well
But the part itself is retarded
The billionaire-businessman Lex that hates Superman because he's stunting human potential is the best Lex.
Hasn't Lex himself been shown to subjugate other humans for his own goals, though?
Is he going to schools and inspiring youths to reach for new heights in between issues?
Inconsistent writing
The best example of this Lex is "Lex Luthor: Man of Steel". It's not canon, though (I think).
That's what the whole Everyman project (which is actually introduced in LL:MoS, but in a different fashion) was for: to show that humans don't need aliens (Superman) to protect them.
But then it turned into "We can turn the earth into Lextopia!" which made me throw up
Lex has always struck me as simply jealous of Superman. He's incredibly arrogant, vain, and to quote a term from 'Fierce Creatures,' pronoid. He really only wants to do good works and elevate mankind not for altruistic reasons, but so that people will build giant statues and monuments to his greatness, flocking through the streets and cheering his name. I don't think this is a recently developed character trait, I think he's always been this way.
Tumblr Twitter
Epic win.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
(read Lex Luthor: Man of Steel)
It's not that I've never seen Lex portrayed in a sympathic light, and he can be quite an engaging character in those cases. That episode of JLU where Amazo returns to Earth springs to mind - I really believed that Lex was trying to make up for past misdeeds, and that he even felt a bit sorry for it. And then next season he tried to conquer the universe with Brainiac.
LL:MoS seems good from what I've read of the summary on Wiki, but one story (which as you've said might not even be canon), doesn't quite convince me that he's a man with humanity's interests at heart underneath it all. I just don't think that's really the core of who he is.
I think I'll add 'xenophobic' to my earlier list, though. That probably explains a few things.
Lex is amazing. This is all I really have to add.
Seconded. Not limed, since that is frowned upon... but definitely seconded.
the story's great and the art is amazing
it's how Batman's movie costumes should look
About Galactus. So, spoiler warning.
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/32330
It's going to suck, hard. Worse than even I thought.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
Lucky for me I was never a FF fan.
Sums up my feelings exactly.
Unless they are referring to Ultimate Galactus, the swarmy things... but even then...
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
It makes perfect sense.
wow.
This technically isn't a "slap in the face of the real Galactus".
I mean, we have no indication that Galactus has ever changed his shape depending on who is looking at him.
you must be a fucking genius
I'm now imagining you with a cigar going "a nyuk, nyuk, nyuk"
well
you still get my point
that's a bullshit excuse
Better dress appropriately.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
There should be a black spot the day after.
Sunday will still be there.
It's just us that won't.
I didn't make it anyway.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.