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Avengers have assembled! (pretty much just the Marvel movie thread now with some comics)

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Posts

  • NostregarNostregar Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    So, just went and read up on the Captain America movie.

    Apparently Hugo Weaving is rumored for the Red Skull?

    Yessssss

    Nostregar on
  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Nostregar wrote: »
    So, just went and read up on the Captain America movie.

    Apparently Hugo Weaving is rumored for the Red Skull?

    Yessssss

    ALL MY DICKS

    Salvation122 on
  • TalleyrandTalleyrand Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't mean to threadshit but I'm somewhat ambivalent about this move.

    It's good that comics are joining the 21st century with digital distribution but other than that I think it's a shame that it'll have a crutch to limp along in the same old tired fashion it has been.

    I lurve me some comic books but I can not stand the whole convoluted, episodic system that Marvel has set up. Seriously, I think there's 17 Spiderman universes and serieses..es floating around out there at the moment. The only superhero stories I will touch are delivered as single-shot graphic novels packaged as tradebacks. Everything else is horribly outdated male power fantasies and shallow gimmickery to keep people reading them out of sheer habit and/or ignorance of the world of not-sucking-so-hard graphic novels and independent comics.

    tl;dr I am a very angry ranty person when it comes to how terrible Marvel comics usually are

    Talleyrand on
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  • ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Talleyrand wrote: »
    I don't mean to threadshit but I'm somewhat ambivalent about this move.

    It's good that comics are joining the 21st century with digital distribution but other than that I think it's a shame that it'll have a crutch to limp along in the same old tired fashion it has been.

    I lurve me some comic books but I can not stand the whole convoluted, episodic system that Marvel has set up. Seriously, I think there's 17 Spiderman universes and serieses..es floating around out there at the moment. The only superhero stories I will touch are delivered as single-shot graphic novels packaged as tradebacks. Everything else is horribly outdated male power fantasies and shallow gimmickery to keep people reading them out of sheer habit and/or ignorance of the world of not-sucking-so-hard graphic novels and independent comics.

    tl;dr I am a very angry ranty person when it comes to how terrible Marvel comics usually are

    There's actually a lot more good/varied stuff than you seem to think right now in Marvel. It's just you have to have the patience to find the good stuff, and I completely understand not wanting to dig through piles of shit.

    Not to say there's a bunch of literary gems out there right this second, just that there's some entertaining stuff out there with stories somewhat deeper than dudes fighting for the title of manliest or whatever you think is going on at the moment.

    Zampanov on
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  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Also, Marvel has been in the process over the last few years of cleaning up the 800 different storyline and comic book series involving multiple monthly books. They've made Spider Man into about 3 series from what was once 8 or 9, they're closing out the multiple avengers books now that siege is over, etc. Whenever there's a big crossover event there is always going to be a few different books in limited runs, but Marvel has been really good about tagging them with the "limited series" label and showing exactly how many there are, and how it connects, should you want to avoid it.

    Point is, it's not like it was back in 2000 and earlier. They've made it better.

    amateurhour on
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  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Talleyrand wrote: »
    Seriously, I think there's 17 Spiderman universes and serieses..es floating around out there at the moment.
    Let's see:

    616
    Ultimate
    Mary Jane <3 Spider-Man
    Spider-Man Adventures
    2099
    Spectacular Spider-Girl
    Various other one-off or rarely used continuities (Zombies, Noir, 1602)

    Of those, Spider-Girl is kind of off in its own place and not really focused on Peter. MJ <3 SM is some kind of weird attempt to cash in on tween girls with a hard-on for romance manga. Adventures is intended as the kids line, although a lot of adults like it too. 2099 is and always has been a joke, and the one-offs can pretty much be dismissed out of hand. So there's basically two main continuities: 616 (3/month) and Ultimate (monthly,) with maybe Adventures thrown in if you feel like it. Not all that difficult to follow, especially if you just dismiss 616 out of hand because of all the stupid bullshit that keeps happening (FUCKING LET AUNT MAY DAY ARRGH)

    Salvation122 on
  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Talleyrand wrote: »
    Seriously, I think there's 17 Spiderman universes and serieses..es floating around out there at the moment.
    Let's see:

    616
    Ultimate
    Mary Jane <3 Spider-Man
    Spider-Man Adventures
    2099
    Spectacular Spider-Girl
    Various other one-off or rarely used continuities (Zombies, Noir, 1602)

    Personally, I wouldn't count anything currently listed as a complete series. Adventures is for younger readers so I leave this out because it's pointless and never ties into canon.

    That leaves you with 616, ultimate, and any tie in stuff that's currently still running. The best decision they made regarding spider man was to take all four books, (spectacular, amazing, and the other 616 books) cancel everything but amazing, and have it come out three times a month with different artists. I loved that decision.

    amateurhour on
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  • Loren MichaelLoren Michael Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Aunt May has been on the verge of death for like 30 years. Good god.

    Loren Michael on
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  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Aunt May has been on the verge of death for like 30 years. Good god.

    General guidelines are that 5 to 10 years of comics encompasses a single year in the marvel U. Obviously there's retcons and such as the times change, but that's why Peter Parker is still in his late 20's.

    amateurhour on
    are YOU on the beer list?
  • CherrnCherrn Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    But when people drop twenty bucks on a thick trade paperback, they expect a complete story, or at least something substantial-feeling - something that can be read and understood on its own. One of the great things about Watchmen is that it's complete in and of itself; you can just buy it and read it with no additional investment or work required. These giant crossovers are impossible to collect that way. By spreading a huge story over the entire line of books for months at a stretch, they basically have made a story like "Civil War" uncollectable. You can buy a thick book called Civil War, yes, but it will have the absolute bare bones of the plot! Want to know what Captain America and the Falcon were doing on page 5 of issue four? Better track down a copy of "Civil War: Frontlines: Secrets: Origins #0 variant edition" at your comic shop, because it sure as fuck won't be in the big thick book!

    This is so true. And also why it is a nightmare to try and collect comics when you don't have physical access to comic stores.

    Cherrn on
    All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 2010
    Man I said that :(

    Jacobkosh on
  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Man I said that :(

    amateurhour on
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  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Cherrn wrote: »
    But when people drop twenty bucks on a thick trade paperback, they expect a complete story, or at least something substantial-feeling - something that can be read and understood on its own. One of the great things about Watchmen is that it's complete in and of itself; you can just buy it and read it with no additional investment or work required. These giant crossovers are impossible to collect that way. By spreading a huge story over the entire line of books for months at a stretch, they basically have made a story like "Civil War" uncollectable. You can buy a thick book called Civil War, yes, but it will have the absolute bare bones of the plot! Want to know what Captain America and the Falcon were doing on page 5 of issue four? Better track down a copy of "Civil War: Frontlines: Secrets: Origins #0 variant edition" at your comic shop, because it sure as fuck won't be in the big thick book!

    This is so true. And also why it is a nightmare to try and collect comics when you don't have physical access to comic stores.

    Honestly, I'd love if like, buying a Main Line Trade of something would give you access to the digital copies of tie-ins at a reduced price, or all the one-shots for free or... something. It is true, the only collectors I know are 1.) My friend who is a letterer and 2.) my dad who is able to spend $90 a week on comics just because.

    I sure as hell won't be able to really buy full runs of anything. Watchmen is 12 books for $20. 12 individual issues are $40.

    durandal4532 on
    We're all in this together
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 2010
    Man I said that :(

    :x

    you:

    T1000.gif

    Jacobkosh on
  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't think there's any reason to be a collector anymore. I don't think any comics today, even something like invincible or walking dead #1, will be worth much money even 50 years from now. There's just too many of them in print that will never wear like golden and silver age books did due to the new paper and ink they use, and there's too many other ways to read the books through trades and digital distribution.

    amateurhour on
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  • NostregarNostregar Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't think there's any reason to be a collector anymore. I don't think any comics today, even something like invincible or walking dead #1, will be worth much money even 50 years from now. There's just too many of them in print that will never wear like golden and silver age books did due to the new paper and ink they use, and there's too many other ways to read the books through trades and digital distribution.

    Some people just...like to collect? I don't think that's a hard thing to grasp.

    Nostregar on
  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Nostregar wrote: »
    Nostregar wrote: »
    I'm honestly kind of curious to see how the Avengers movie is pulled off. All of the Avengers are strong characters - Cap, Iron Man, Thor, etc - so I'm not sure how they're going to balance the screen time and story-telling.

    Have they said anything about how they're doing it? I haven't been following it closely.

    Early reports had the Hulk being the villain, basically rehashing The Ultimates, Volume 1. But that was months ago, and nothing has come out in quite a while.


    Personally, I'm hoping for hot Kree-on-Skrull action.

    But... The Hulk was one of the original Avengers, wasn't he?

    I guess I didn't realize this was going to be Ultimate Avengers.

    Sigh.

    They could be setting up a World War Hulk movie. Which would be awesome.

    -Loki- on
  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't think there's any reason to be a collector anymore. I don't think any comics today, even something like invincible or walking dead #1, will be worth much money even 50 years from now. There's just too many of them in print that will never wear like golden and silver age books did due to the new paper and ink they use, and there's too many other ways to read the books through trades and digital distribution.

    There's no reason to ever actually buy a dvd either, technically

    most of us still do

    override367 on
  • AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't think there's any reason to be a collector anymore. I don't think any comics today, even something like invincible or walking dead #1, will be worth much money even 50 years from now. There's just too many of them in print that will never wear like golden and silver age books did due to the new paper and ink they use, and there's too many other ways to read the books through trades and digital distribution.

    There's no reason to ever actually buy a dvd either, technically

    most of us still do

    No one is talking about "buying" things, they're talking about "collecting" things. As in, "purchased for the primary function of simply existing."

    Atomika on
  • SliderSlider Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I don't think there's any reason to be a collector anymore. I don't think any comics today, even something like invincible or walking dead #1, will be worth much money even 50 years from now. There's just too many of them in print that will never wear like golden and silver age books did due to the new paper and ink they use, and there's too many other ways to read the books through trades and digital distribution.

    There's no reason to ever actually buy a dvd either, technically

    most of us still do

    Coincidentally, my last DVD purchase was Watchmen.

    I have some decent comic books in my collection - Spawn #1, for instance - but I stopped collecting years ago and don't consider it a viable commodity any longer.

    Slider on
  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    My dad, and by extension me, have around 40-50,000 comics.


    It um... it takes up a lot of space. I wouldn't recommend it. A couple are cool, but my dad was too young during the major #1's to get much in the way of really crazy stuff.

    durandal4532 on
    We're all in this together
  • Raybies666Raybies666 Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    -Loki- wrote: »
    Warcry wrote: »
    EDIT: Oh yes and Whedon wrote Alien: Resurrection.

    Reusrrection turning out like shit wasn't entirely his fault.

    It seems like with Whedon everything is always someone else's fault. The networks. The producers. The actors "not reading [his] lines right." At some point I eventually become skeptical.

    I think this is a bit of confirmation bias.

    Yes, Whedon has a style that isn't for everyone. I honestly can't sit through an entire episode of Buffy or Angel without leaving the room.

    But the guy gets comics, and can direct the shit out of action. Color me "cautiously optimistic."

    I wouldn't go that far. His hand to hand action is quite good, I'm just used to watching guys from Hong Kong do it way better in shitty little movies. I'm not criticising him for being crap or anything.

    One thing I will defend with him is the brawl at the end of Serenity. He knew enough that one long take of action is worth way more than zillions of cuts to achieve the same thing. That fight was not one take, but they really made it look like one (the editing here was spot on too), and I appreciate the hell out of that.

    Raybies666 on
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  • AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    I'm just used to watching guys from Hong Kong do it way better in shitty little movies.

    Most American films don't take it for granted that everyone somehow knows Fung Fu.

    I find most Asian films to be unwatchably ridiculous, if only because if the same film was made in the US it would be decried as racist stereotyping.

    Atomika on
  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    -Loki- wrote: »
    Warcry wrote: »
    EDIT: Oh yes and Whedon wrote Alien: Resurrection.

    Reusrrection turning out like shit wasn't entirely his fault.

    It seems like with Whedon everything is always someone else's fault. The networks. The producers. The actors "not reading [his] lines right." At some point I eventually become skeptical.

    I think this is a bit of confirmation bias.

    Yes, Whedon has a style that isn't for everyone. I honestly can't sit through an entire episode of Buffy or Angel without leaving the room.

    But the guy gets comics, and can direct the shit out of action. Color me "cautiously optimistic."

    I wouldn't go that far. His hand to hand action is quite good, I'm just used to watching guys from Hong Kong do it way better in shitty little movies. I'm not criticising him for being crap or anything.

    One thing I will defend with him is the brawl at the end of Serenity. He knew enough that one long take of action is worth way more than zillions of cuts to achieve the same thing. That fight was not one take, but they really made it look like one (the editing here was spot on too), and I appreciate the hell out of that.

    The brawl at the end of Serenity is a really good example of an awesome, non-kung fun (at least one of the characters anyway) action scene. Which is what you want in an Avengers movie, unless Iron Fist is in it.

    -Loki- on
  • legionofonelegionofone __BANNED USERS regular
    edited April 2010
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    legionofone on
  • AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    No, they seem to be in a "let's deconstruct every character we have, turn them into a giant asshole, and then kill them" mode.


    Of course, I stopped reading X-books in the mid-nineties, with the exception of the Ultimate line. That shit turned into a horrible melange of rehashed old shit and incestuous partner-swapping.

    Atomika on
  • LouieLouie Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    No, they seem to be in a "let's deconstruct every character we have, turn them into a giant asshole, and then kill them" mode.


    Of course, I stopped reading X-books in the mid-nineties, with the exception of the Ultimate line. That shit turned into a horrible melange of rehashed old shit and incestuous partner-swapping.

    I'm not sure what you are talking about, ultimates only had TWO volumes and they were awesome.

    Louie on
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  • AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Louie wrote: »
    I'm not sure what you are talking about, ultimates only had TWO volumes and they were awesome.

    I'm talking about the umpteen bajillion regular X-Men titles in the 616, not the Ultimate stuff.

    Atomika on
  • TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    Deadpool is the new Wolverine.

    Tomanta on
  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited April 2010
    The Ultimate Iron Man is kind of crappy, actually. There was a series written by Orson Scott Card that basically has him as a kid with some kind of immune deficiency, so his dad injects him with Wolverine's healing factor (not really, but it's the same thing) and it makes his brain constantly produce new cells to make him super smart. He drinks to kill them off so that he doesn't get stressed all the time.

    The Ultimates version though doesn't establish any of that as canon. So it's kind of fucked up.

    Didn't every cell in his body also double as a brain cell or something equally silly?

    Echo on
  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited April 2010
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    They even poke some fun at that themselvse. There's an issue of... whatever, with "feat. WOLVERINE!" and him on the cover. And nowhere else in the entire issue.

    Echo on
  • AvicusAvicus Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Avicus on
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  • David_TDavid_T A fashion yes-man is no good to me. Copenhagen, DenmarkRegistered User regular
    edited April 2010
    But how will Joss Whedon cast Nathan Fillion as the Wasp if she's already cast? I was promised cronyism!

    David_T on
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  • TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    David_T wrote: »
    But how will Joss Whedon cast Nathan Fillion as the Wasp if she's already cast? I was promised cronyism!

    Nathan was never going to be Wasp anyway. Nathan is going to be Hawkeye. Summer Glau was Joss' choice for Wasp.
    she's already tiny, so they would save money on making her smaller

    Tomanta on
  • ScooterScooter Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Aunt May has been on the verge of death for like 30 years. Good god.

    General guidelines are that 5 to 10 years of comics encompasses a single year in the marvel U. Obviously there's retcons and such as the times change, but that's why Peter Parker is still in his late 20's.

    I think it's around 4 years, and 10-12 years have passed since the Fantastic Four showed up (which I guess is counted as the beginning of 'modern' Marvel). So the FF are late 30s, original X-Men are young 30s, SM is late 20s, etc

    Scooter on
  • gtrmpgtrmp Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Slider wrote: »
    I have some decent comic books in my collection - Spawn #1, for instance - but I stopped collecting years ago and don't consider it a viable commodity any longer.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Comics-Spawn-1_W0QQitemZ160421286240QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2559da9160

    As far as investment goes, comics haven't been a "viable commodity" since 1995 at the latest. You can find 99% of those big-name hot comics from 1989-1995 for sale at cover price or less. My preferred comic shop picked up dozens of copies of X-Men #1 (1991, not 1963) in a bulk lot a few years ago, and put them on the sales floor at cover price... and it took over a year to get rid of them all. There are only a few comics that are worth any money today:
    • Comics from before ~1970
    • First appearances of major characters from before ~1980
    • Comics that a) had very low print runs, b) were never reprinted, and c) inexplicably picked up reader interest a few years later.
    The only modern comics that are worth any money on the secondhand market are the ones that fall into that last category, and there's no way to predict which comics will end up there, or how long they'll stay there. Ironically enough, because of their low print run, a lot of Marvel's late-'90s to mid-'00s trade paperbacks will sell for more money than the individual issues that they reprint, though that should change now that Marvel's supposedly getting more serious about keeping their back catalogue of collections in print.

    gtrmp on
  • gtrmpgtrmp Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Scooter wrote: »
    Aunt May has been on the verge of death for like 30 years. Good god.

    General guidelines are that 5 to 10 years of comics encompasses a single year in the marvel U. Obviously there's retcons and such as the times change, but that's why Peter Parker is still in his late 20's.

    I think it's around 4 years, and 10-12 years have passed since the Fantastic Four showed up (which I guess is counted as the beginning of 'modern' Marvel). So the FF are late 30s, original X-Men are young 30s, SM is late 20s, etc

    Ben Grimm had a second bar mitzvah a few years ago to commemorate thirteen years since he was first turned into The Thing. Granted, every other comic these days has a multi-month time shift between storylines, so who knows how long it's supposedly been by now.

    gtrmp on
  • ScooterScooter Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Time goes relative to a character's age, too. A newborn will be a pre-teen within a few years, a teenager can go from 15/16 to 18 in a few months (usually when they start dating an adult), and by the time they hit 60, they stop aging completely.

    Edit: Now that I think about it, Peter's mom either had him really late, or there was a big age gap between her and May. She's looked like a grandmother since forever but normally an aunt of a guy Peter's age would probably only be in their 50s

    Scooter on
  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited April 2010
    Louie wrote: »
    I'm curious. Has Marvel moved away from shoe horning Wolverine into everything they can, or is that still a part of their marketing strategy?

    No, they seem to be in a "let's deconstruct every character we have, turn them into a giant asshole, and then kill them" mode.


    Of course, I stopped reading X-books in the mid-nineties, with the exception of the Ultimate line. That shit turned into a horrible melange of rehashed old shit and incestuous partner-swapping.

    I'm not sure what you are talking about, ultimates only had TWO volumes and they were awesome.

    I read 10 pages of Ultimates 3 and....uh....oh my god my eyes.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
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  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 2010
    2099 is and always has been a joke

    No it hasn't. For a year or two there in the early 90s the 2099 books were by far the best thing Marvel had going. You had Peter David, John Francis Moore, Len Kaminski, and Warren Ellis writing, and art by Rick Leonardi, Pat Broderick, Chris Bachalo, Ernie Colón...these guys were not slouches and they were putting out work that was wildly different from almost anything else that was being done at the time.

    Jacobkosh on
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