I'm really enjoying this game. I think you guys blew the faults way out of proportion. Though to be fair I'm still in Saudi Arabia, so maybe it gets worse?
It only gets better!
And regarding the Mass Effect bug, I only played through once but it happened pretty frequently, usually when you'd approach a random piece of level geometry on the ground. Wouldn't be too annoying except for when I hadn't saved in a while and needed to back-track.
Ok, replayed the opening mission as a Recruit instead and got the Training mission achievement. I think the reason it didnt unlock before was because I didnt do all of the orientation side missions via the 3 rooms.
First character only did the Darcey Room and bonus challenge then went to Head Cheese to talk. Oops :P At least I got the hang of lockpicking and alarms now. The hacking gives me a head ache though.
Fiannawolf on
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
edited June 2010
Hacking is awful with the mouse and keyboard. I have to pick up and move the mouse several times because it just doesn't move the string right. In fact, I also have to jam on the keys to move the other set. Boooo!
Just finished my second major city and I'm loving this game.
Went Saudi-Taipei-Rome
God damn, Marburg three shots me in melee. Holy christ. That's been my boss-fighting strategy until now, may have to mix it up.
The flying knee + Stomp may be the most satisfying video game move ever full stop. It's basically guaranteed that all my characters pump martial arts in some capacity.
Just finished my second major city and I'm loving this game.
Went Saudi-Taipei-Rome
God damn, Marburg three shots me in melee. Holy christ. That's been my boss-fighting strategy until now, may have to mix it up.
The flying knee + Stomp may be the most satisfying video game move ever full stop. It's basically guaranteed that all my characters pump martial arts in some capacity.
Maybe its my level or something, I started meleeing him and he never broke out of it and this was the same for everyone but Brayko and Sis.
I gotta start investing points in melee. Right now I've mainly done pistols, stealth, and those 2 support ones (there was sabotage and gadgets or something). But seeing how often I use melee, it definitely seems worth it.
I bought the game and I am about to break it open. I just got off the phone with Gamestop after they hoodwinked my wife when she volunteered to pick up my pre-ordered game for me.
Oh, man, I might not even play tonight I am so pissed. Oh, well, wrong thread for that but still. I am loving the thread and it is taking everything in me to not spoil the whole things. Looks like folks are having a great time with it.
Just finished my second major city and I'm loving this game.
Went Saudi-Taipei-Rome
God damn, Marburg three shots me in melee. Holy christ. That's been my boss-fighting strategy until now, may have to mix it up.
The flying knee + Stomp may be the most satisfying video game move ever full stop. It's basically guaranteed that all my characters pump martial arts in some capacity.
Maybe its my level or something, I started meleeing him and he never broke out of it and this was the same for everyone but Brayko and Sis.
I would keep him staggered for quite a while, but eventually my rhythm would break and the old bastard would put me down in about a second and a half.
Just finished my second major city and I'm loving this game.
Went Saudi-Taipei-Rome
God damn, Marburg three shots me in melee. Holy christ. That's been my boss-fighting strategy until now, may have to mix it up.
The flying knee + Stomp may be the most satisfying video game move ever full stop. It's basically guaranteed that all my characters pump martial arts in some capacity.
Maybe its my level or something, I started meleeing him and he never broke out of it and this was the same for everyone but Brayko and Sis.
I would keep him staggered for quite a while, but eventually my rhythm would break and the old bastard would put me down in about a second and a half.
Are you spamming E? Worked wonders for me except brakyo obviously because hes got a heavy immunity and hes a pain with those guns.
DarkWarrior on
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AlectharAlan ShoreWe're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered Userregular
edited June 2010
I think I'm definitely going to do a second playthrough. Partly to rectify some actions that I didn't like
Saved Madison, who I was totally neutral with, instead of stopping the bomb
Partly to be more consistent (personality-wise), and partly to switch it up a bit(mission sequence-wise). And also to really give the combat a workout. Now that I understand combat quite a bit better, it's much more enjoyable, and I'd like to be able to translate that to the whole game when I replay it.
I've been pumping all three spy skills (stealth, martial arts and pistols), and I've been doing alright thus far. Martial arts is a lot more useful than I initially thought, but I probably don't use pistols as much as I should.
This game is at its best when you utilize your abilities to systematically eliminate the opposition. When this game allows me to play it like I play Thief, I fucking love it. But it does become annoying when combat and/or a specific course of action is forced upon you. In several situations, stealth becomes almost entirely useless.
Cherrn on
All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
I'm still very early in the game and in the first level I made a switch from knocking guys out to killing them. Mina gave me a side mission saying that I should kill certain ones so I wouldn't have to face them later. I realized that I should do that for all of them. These are terrorists with AK47s. Perhaps later I will change this, but any terrorist with a gun and is intent on killing me is not getting back up.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited June 2010
I'm only 8 missions in but my general consensus is.
Dialogue good.
Gameplay fluctuates from very bad to bad.
I'll probably have a more detailed opinion once I'm finished with the game.
Man, Amazon has had this game as "Shipping Soon" since late last night. Disappointing.
Still, it doesn't matter that much since I have 9 days in a row at work, but I'd like to get a little bit of time in this week.
My order status changed to shipped. Apparently mine shipped hours ago but the status only now updated. Yours probably shipped already, but you'll just have to wait for that official confirmation.
Dashui on
Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
This game, oh man. I had a great email conversation with Heck, and I totally trolled him with some good old Time Cube.
TIME CUBE!
Since I have this strange ability to enjoy the fun parts of any game, no matter how bad, I am having a great time with this one. My major complaints are all technical problems. The bit where the game fails to properly reset the state of the mission after I die leads to some frustrating situations.
harvest on
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MongerI got the ham stink.Dallas, TXRegistered Userregular
The bit where the game fails to properly reset the state of the mission after I die leads to some frustrating situations.
On the other hand, I've once had it cause a large portion of the enemies in an area completely vanish on reload as a result. That was kind of rocking.
Yeah but if they despawn then I can't sneak up and choke them.
harvest on
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
edited June 2010
It really is a mighty shame that the combat is so, so terrible. Stealth is pretty worthless since sneaking is completely arbitrary; sometimes a guy might see out of the corner of his eye from across a room, sometimes you can stand literally right next to a guy and he completely ignores you. It really seems like they threw in the stealth at the last minute, which seems weird for a spy game. Sometimes you can miss a silenced shot and people walk around like nothing happens and then other times a missed silenced shot will mean an actual instantaneous alarm.
The NPCs almost never use the "caution" state and nearly always go from "unsuspecting" to "oh shit kill the spy!" for the littlest things. At one point, a guy was 75-100 feet away and looking away from me, yet standing up and running for cover to the side of me (and not actually any closer to him) caused him to whip around in an immediate "kill!" state. And since there were 4-5 other guys around, they did the exact same thing. The enemy AI makes it completely impossible to look at my orphan count as anything but an achievement.
Good thing the combat is really just the way to get you to decisions and not the focus of the game. Although I have to admit, I cannot think of a single game where one aspect (the choices and relationships) is so great and another (the combat) can be so very, very bad.
Ninja Snarl P on
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited June 2010
I've gotten very good with stealth myself.
But that is mainly because I dread any situation where I actually have to shoot.
Dragkonias on
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
edited June 2010
The stealth just seems so horrible and backwards after years of progression in that area. Cripes, Thief used shadows for stealth twelve years ago. The only way to tell how much noise you make is to guess, the only way to tell how visible you are to anything is just to guess, and so on.
They could've cloned the sneaking from the older Splinter Cell game for all I care, just something besides the haphazard way it is now. Give me a stupid light and sound meter, it isn't hard. Hell, just give me a sound meter, that one should be really easy.
Thankfully, Chain Shot seems to mitigate what would otherwise be a gamebreakingly awful combat and stealth system. Cut down a couple guys in an area right off the bat or finish off a firefight quickly; sure beats the hell out of waiting for reticules to shrink down to slightly smaller than a hot air balloon.
Ninja Snarl P on
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MongerI got the ham stink.Dallas, TXRegistered Userregular
edited June 2010
I've been detected from around corners and on the other side of walls while standing still. It doesn't seem badly designed so much as very buggy. It's the kind of stuff that could conceivably (and hopefully) be patched, either by Obsidian or the community.
At least I took assault rifles, though. If I get detected, I just shoot dudes. Dudes stop detecting me when they are shot. This has served me well.
Only have done Saudi and about halfway through Rome, I think, but so far it has been enjoyable. Popping people in the head with a silenced pistol never gets old to me. Also chain shot is re-goddamn-diculous.
Combat seems fine to me, but then I liked Deus Ex's shooting mechanics.
I've been detected from around corners and on the other side of walls while standing still. It doesn't seem badly designed so much as very buggy. It's the kind of stuff that could conceivably (and hopefully) be patched, either by Obsidian or the community.
At least I took assault rifles, though. If I get detected, I just shoot dudes. Dudes stop detecting me when they are shot. This has served me well.
I've never had issues being spotted. Of course I was dumping points into stealth and saved up for the advanced stealth armor. Someone spots me, instant evasion,followed by a punch in the throat. However, one time I was spotted from across a train yard when I knocked a guy out. But that's what chain shot is for.
Even the MGS stealth system is simplistic enough to work in here.
It is the MGS stealth system. They only notice things in the arc their arrow is pointing, so you can go right up next to them even from the side as long as you aren't too noisy. And their sight range is limited by your armor/perks/skills. Also, they pretty much blindly go investigate a dead body as long as you haven't alerted them by being loud, so you can easily attract them to a single dead enemy and take them all out at the same time with the invisible skill/chain shot/a gadget
Holy Christ, lockpicking is so much easier with mouse. There's no challenge at all, since there's no tension, you just move them into place and hit it. On the gamepad, only the last quarter of movement matters, and there's constant tension that you have to balance against, making it way harder. I've been swapping off from controller (hacking, everything) to mouse (difficult locks, like safes) and now no minigame is a hassle, except a single place: a mansion.
Those 10 circuit alarms in Marburg's place were infuriating. Can you get out of there without being captured? Thorton is an aggressive thug in this playthrough, and he sprang to attack when offered, but being stripped of weapons and left to use martial arts (0 points) or stealth (0 points, and decked in riot gear) to get past the enemies was stupidly frustrating and really highlighted the flaws of combat.
Also, someone earlier said that the operative specialization (pick 3 skills to continue improving) didn't let you max them out. This isn't true. It takes awhile (around level 15, I think it was) before the last two ranks unlock, but they do in time. Pistols/AR near maxed and half up toughness and technical aptitude has served me well.
Thankfully, Chain Shot seems to mitigate what would otherwise be a gamebreakingly awful combat and stealth system. Cut down a couple guys in an area right off the bat or finish off a firefight quickly; sure beats the hell out of waiting for reticules to shrink down to slightly smaller than a hot air balloon.
I'm under the impression that chain shot is crucial. I've been focusing on ARs with pistol as secondary, and while the AR is excellent against all the mooks, boss fights without using chain shot have been bleak and horrifying. I'm definitely taking pistols on every character, regardless.
Combat seems fine to me, but then I liked Deus Ex's shooting mechanics.
I've noticed is that skill doesn't matter much for accuracy: money does. I've got the AR tree maxed save the final (useless*) skill, but it's the money I've poured into getting 35 accuracy and good recoil/stability as well as damage that's made my AR useful on short notice. In Deus Ex, by the time you maxed the skill tree, you were dead accurate as soon as you stopped moving, and the spread was negligible while moving. Having a good AR has made the combat much more tolerable, but 165 armor and 150 HP doesn't hurt, either, although it's rarely proven necessary.
*I still don't know what the AR skill actually does. It doesn't seem to make aiming any easier. I just use it as a longer-lasting version of awareness (not a point in stealth) when battle erupts since it lights every enemy up with a big red "shoot me!" reticule.
SoundsPlush on
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MongerI got the ham stink.Dallas, TXRegistered Userregular
I've been detected from around corners and on the other side of walls while standing still. It doesn't seem badly designed so much as very buggy. It's the kind of stuff that could conceivably (and hopefully) be patched, either by Obsidian or the community.
At least I took assault rifles, though. If I get detected, I just shoot dudes. Dudes stop detecting me when they are shot. This has served me well.
I've never had issues being spotted. Of course I was dumping points into stealth and saved up for the advanced stealth armor. Someone spots me, instant evasion,followed by a punch in the throat. However, one time I was spotted from across a train yard when I knocked a guy out. But that's what chain shot is for.
I once set off an alarm while climbing a ladder in an empty room with no one within 200 feet of me. Guys started charging me down from the other side of the map and were already shooting at me when I walked outside.
Even the MGS stealth system is simplistic enough to work in here.
It is the MGS stealth system. They only notice things in the arc their arrow is pointing, so you can go right up next to them even from the side as long as you aren't too noisy. And their sight range is limited by your armor/perks/skills. Also, they pretty much blindly go investigate a dead body as long as you haven't alerted them by being loud, so you can easily attract them to a single dead enemy and take them all out at the same time with the invisible skill/chain shot/a gadget
I want to play this game. I've spent a lot of money on video games lately, and this one doesn't seem to justify the $50 yet. I'll use this opportunity to finish ten games half-done, then buy this one for $30 or so.
I'm pretty sure I'll like it; I enjoyed the hell out of KOTOR 2 and NWN2.
Honestly, I'm so addicted to the old school space sims I never had the chance to play. Just beat Freespace 2, downloading Independence war now. Then there's Red Dead Redemption...to satisfy the current gen games.
Apparently the UK D2D doesn't have any region locking, and you can get it for 25 pounds, which is about 36 dollars
Doing a second runthrough as a recruit on hard who's just blowing everything up. I think I might restart it back on normal though, it's not that it's harder, but the lack of money combined with going through resources a heck of a lot faster than a stealth character is kind of annoying. It's funny, using a controller makes hacking the easiest minigame and lockpicking the hardest. which is the opposite from using a mouse
I didn't have any issues with being noticed from far away until I started a soldier start and went with nothing but noisy shit. My engineer only had one point in stealth and never had an issue being heard or detected unless I was pretty close. I did use a silenced pistol and martial arts primarily, though.
Posts
Turrrrrrrrrrrrrrn up the radiooooooooooo!
And regarding the Mass Effect bug, I only played through once but it happened pretty frequently, usually when you'd approach a random piece of level geometry on the ground. Wouldn't be too annoying except for when I hadn't saved in a while and needed to back-track.
First character only did the Darcey Room and bonus challenge then went to Head Cheese to talk. Oops :P At least I got the hang of lockpicking and alarms now. The hacking gives me a head ache though.
The other two aren't so bad...
Click M1, hear gunshot. Hit X, see weapon select pop up.
Still nothing but black.
Went Saudi-Taipei-Rome
The flying knee + Stomp may be the most satisfying video game move ever full stop. It's basically guaranteed that all my characters pump martial arts in some capacity.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Maybe its my level or something, I started meleeing him and he never broke out of it and this was the same for everyone but Brayko and Sis.
Oh, man, I might not even play tonight I am so pissed. Oh, well, wrong thread for that but still. I am loving the thread and it is taking everything in me to not spoil the whole things. Looks like folks are having a great time with it.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Are you spamming E? Worked wonders for me except brakyo obviously because hes got a heavy immunity and hes a pain with those guns.
Battle.net
It's fun.
I like pretending the main guy is Michael Weston.
This game is at its best when you utilize your abilities to systematically eliminate the opposition. When this game allows me to play it like I play Thief, I fucking love it. But it does become annoying when combat and/or a specific course of action is forced upon you. In several situations, stealth becomes almost entirely useless.
Still, it doesn't matter that much since I have 9 days in a row at work, but I'd like to get a little bit of time in this week.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Dialogue good.
Gameplay fluctuates from very bad to bad.
I'll probably have a more detailed opinion once I'm finished with the game.
My order status changed to shipped. Apparently mine shipped hours ago but the status only now updated. Yours probably shipped already, but you'll just have to wait for that official confirmation.
TIME CUBE!
Since I have this strange ability to enjoy the fun parts of any game, no matter how bad, I am having a great time with this one. My major complaints are all technical problems. The bit where the game fails to properly reset the state of the mission after I die leads to some frustrating situations.
All right, people. It is not a gerbil. It is not a hamster. It is not a guinea pig. It is a death rabbit. Death. Rabbit. Say it with me, now.
Yeah but if they despawn then I can't sneak up and choke them.
The NPCs almost never use the "caution" state and nearly always go from "unsuspecting" to "oh shit kill the spy!" for the littlest things. At one point, a guy was 75-100 feet away and looking away from me, yet standing up and running for cover to the side of me (and not actually any closer to him) caused him to whip around in an immediate "kill!" state. And since there were 4-5 other guys around, they did the exact same thing. The enemy AI makes it completely impossible to look at my orphan count as anything but an achievement.
Good thing the combat is really just the way to get you to decisions and not the focus of the game. Although I have to admit, I cannot think of a single game where one aspect (the choices and relationships) is so great and another (the combat) can be so very, very bad.
But that is mainly because I dread any situation where I actually have to shoot.
They could've cloned the sneaking from the older Splinter Cell game for all I care, just something besides the haphazard way it is now. Give me a stupid light and sound meter, it isn't hard. Hell, just give me a sound meter, that one should be really easy.
Thankfully, Chain Shot seems to mitigate what would otherwise be a gamebreakingly awful combat and stealth system. Cut down a couple guys in an area right off the bat or finish off a firefight quickly; sure beats the hell out of waiting for reticules to shrink down to slightly smaller than a hot air balloon.
At least I took assault rifles, though. If I get detected, I just shoot dudes. Dudes stop detecting me when they are shot. This has served me well.
All right, people. It is not a gerbil. It is not a hamster. It is not a guinea pig. It is a death rabbit. Death. Rabbit. Say it with me, now.
Only have done Saudi and about halfway through Rome, I think, but so far it has been enjoyable. Popping people in the head with a silenced pistol never gets old to me. Also chain shot is re-goddamn-diculous.
Combat seems fine to me, but then I liked Deus Ex's shooting mechanics.
It is the MGS stealth system. They only notice things in the arc their arrow is pointing, so you can go right up next to them even from the side as long as you aren't too noisy. And their sight range is limited by your armor/perks/skills. Also, they pretty much blindly go investigate a dead body as long as you haven't alerted them by being loud, so you can easily attract them to a single dead enemy and take them all out at the same time with the invisible skill/chain shot/a gadget
Also, someone earlier said that the operative specialization (pick 3 skills to continue improving) didn't let you max them out. This isn't true. It takes awhile (around level 15, I think it was) before the last two ranks unlock, but they do in time. Pistols/AR near maxed and half up toughness and technical aptitude has served me well.
900 orphans. I hope to break 1k before the end.
I'm under the impression that chain shot is crucial. I've been focusing on ARs with pistol as secondary, and while the AR is excellent against all the mooks, boss fights without using chain shot have been bleak and horrifying. I'm definitely taking pistols on every character, regardless.
I've noticed is that skill doesn't matter much for accuracy: money does. I've got the AR tree maxed save the final (useless*) skill, but it's the money I've poured into getting 35 accuracy and good recoil/stability as well as damage that's made my AR useful on short notice. In Deus Ex, by the time you maxed the skill tree, you were dead accurate as soon as you stopped moving, and the spread was negligible while moving. Having a good AR has made the combat much more tolerable, but 165 armor and 150 HP doesn't hurt, either, although it's rarely proven necessary.
*I still don't know what the AR skill actually does. It doesn't seem to make aiming any easier. I just use it as a longer-lasting version of awareness (not a point in stealth) when battle erupts since it lights every enemy up with a big red "shoot me!" reticule.
And the cameras. The cameras are so Metal Gear.
All right, people. It is not a gerbil. It is not a hamster. It is not a guinea pig. It is a death rabbit. Death. Rabbit. Say it with me, now.
I'm pretty sure I'll like it; I enjoyed the hell out of KOTOR 2 and NWN2.
Honestly, I'm so addicted to the old school space sims I never had the chance to play. Just beat Freespace 2, downloading Independence war now. Then there's Red Dead Redemption...to satisfy the current gen games.
Doing a second runthrough as a recruit on hard who's just blowing everything up. I think I might restart it back on normal though, it's not that it's harder, but the lack of money combined with going through resources a heck of a lot faster than a stealth character is kind of annoying. It's funny, using a controller makes hacking the easiest minigame and lockpicking the hardest. which is the opposite from using a mouse