"We started out when we finished with Enemy Territory: Quake Wars for the PC. We didn't do the console versions of that game. We were the lead developer on the PC version. When we finished that, that was essentially id Tech 4. id, of course, were working on RAGE and they were using id Tech 5."
"But we had some specific requirements for this game, a lot to do with the networking model which has to work irrespective of the way you play. In essence it has to be fast enough that I'm permanently hosting a server just in case I want a friend to join me at any given time."
"We started from the ground up with id Tech 4 again," Wedgewood said, "rewriting the renderer, rewriting the network model and all the other bits and pieces. It's still probably about a third id Tech 4, and then a whole bunch of rewritten stuff and then some additional code id Software have shared with us. But it's absolutely based on that id Software platform, which is why it feels so solid when you land and when you hit stuff and all that kind of thing.
I'm sure this has been posted before somewhere. No absolute definitive proof that the 30 tick rate "feel" of the game has been fixed, but maybe some people who played at PAX could shed some light on that
*HINT*HINT* @Kadoken: While I partially agree with you, and DO prefer strategy-heavy team-based shooters, I still think there's room in this world for the speedy over-the-top twitch shooters as well.
Tickrate's basically the setting that controls how often the server updates. 30 ticks means that the server updates 30 times per second. A higher tickrate means a more precise game. ET:QW was locked at 30 for performance reasons: the servers couldn't really handle more. I'm guessing Brink will go above 30 because it doesn't have to account for vehicles like ET:QW did.
Gotta be honest, I only ever played the Quake Wars demo - but I played the shit out of that one map. I don't know if offline play was limited in that way cause I can't say it ever felt jerky to me.
When I first heard about this game I was super stoked. Now I'm cautiously optimistic. Here's hoping it exceeds my lowered expectations.
A multiplayer demo would be nice, but the game has caught my interest. I'd like to see some longer gameplay videos and check with the group I play with to see if they're getting it, but I think it's safe to say that I'm buying the game soon after release.
Tickrate's basically the setting that controls how often the server updates. 30 ticks means that the server updates 30 times per second. A higher tickrate means a more precise game. ET:QW was locked at 30 for performance reasons: the servers couldn't really handle more. I'm guessing Brink will go above 30 because it doesn't have to account for vehicles like ET:QW did.
Do you know the tick rate of some other popular shooters (BLOPS, BC2, etc.)? I'm just curious how they compare. I've never heard of this term before.
Tickrate's basically the setting that controls how often the server updates. 30 ticks means that the server updates 30 times per second. A higher tickrate means a more precise game. ET:QW was locked at 30 for performance reasons: the servers couldn't really handle more. I'm guessing Brink will go above 30 because it doesn't have to account for vehicles like ET:QW did.
Do you know the tick rate of some other popular shooters (BLOPS, BC2, etc.)? I'm just curious how they compare. I've never heard of this term before.
It's not super useful to compare a tickrate across engines. Your best bet would be to just load up Counterstrike: Source and try out the different tickrates.
Tickrate's basically the setting that controls how often the server updates. 30 ticks means that the server updates 30 times per second. A higher tickrate means a more precise game. ET:QW was locked at 30 for performance reasons: the servers couldn't really handle more. I'm guessing Brink will go above 30 because it doesn't have to account for vehicles like ET:QW did.
Do you know the tick rate of some other popular shooters (BLOPS, BC2, etc.)? I'm just curious how they compare. I've never heard of this term before.
It's not super useful to compare a tickrate across engines. Your best bet would be to just load up Counterstrike: Source and try out the different tickrates.
Yeah different engines use different methods to "predict" what is going on in between ticks. All kinds of factors like ballistic models, player speeds, range and more technical stuff can play into how this feels from game to game. If you've ever been shot around corners or fired bullets through an opponent this is probably the culprit.
It's not really a useful statistic for comparison on it's own, since it doesn't take into account differences in server coding.
edit: There's a bunch of different names too; 'snaps', 'server frame rate', etc.
Quake 3, and most of the games that used the engine -- and I'm pretty sure id tech 4 as well, allowed servers and clients to modify their net settings. It was really noticeable when you were in a poorly optimized server.
But before that stuff was figured out, you could really mess with a servers physics by changing the sv_fps and the like.
They only thing I am worried about is this "tick rate." Everything else looks amazing. And I am not really worried about the tick rate, I just don't know anything about it.
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SenshiBALLING OUT OF CONTROLWavefrontRegistered Userregular
Tickrate's basically the setting that controls how often the server updates. 30 ticks means that the server updates 30 times per second. A higher tickrate means a more precise game. ET:QW was locked at 30 for performance reasons: the servers couldn't really handle more. I'm guessing Brink will go above 30 because it doesn't have to account for vehicles like ET:QW did.
That's tick rate, for anyone who still needs to know.
If you've got a copy of Quake 3 lying around it's easy to test.
For the server, the command is /sv_fps, for the client it's /snaps. Duelling servers, where people only played 1v1 on small maps, ran fine at 30, but servers that ran team games on larger maps were expected to have 40. Lower than that and you'd have problems. If you start a vanilla server and jack the sv_fps way, way up, you can change the server's physics, making jumps super floaty and the like.
The problem with vanilla Quake 3 was that it was optimized for shitty connections, which held things back until people figured that out. Later mods started to enforce better net settings, because it became possible for players to mess with their settings to make themselves laggy, and some people were too lazy to bother anyway.
There's a lot of math involved, and it ties back to Quake 3's weird fps based physics and movement, which in turn ties into the math behind strafe jumping.
A lot of the net settings stuff carried over to other games that used the engine, and a some of it into id tech 4.
Timenudge is the most interesting, as it allowed players to simulate lower ping connections (to a point, and it works better if you ping is already low) at the expense of smooth play. I couldn't play without it after a while, and before QuakeLive re-enabled it, I had a lot of trouble playing that as well. It's a sickness.
ps. This stuff really doesn't matter anymore. Newer games have it all locked down, and treat things differently anyway. Besides that, a lot of players got through years of Quake 3 without noticing.
EDIT: I forgot about automatic embedding.
There's no killcam because running out of hitpoints incapacitates a player instead of killing him. 1:29 shows a player "die"
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CarbonFireSee youin the countryRegistered Userregular
edited March 2011
One of the other issues with Quake Wars was that the animations and physics calculations were also tied to that 30 tickrate, so even if you ran the game at 60 FPS+ (which wasn't really that hard to do), everything still looked like it was running and reacting at a herky-jerky 30fps.
So far that DOESN'T appear to be the case with Brink, so here's hoping :^:
I can't believe this game is finally coming out! I couldn't wait when I saw the brief demo at PAX two years ago, but admittedly I haven't been keeping up on all the news. I still don't quite understand how the multiplayer mode works. From what I've seen you have story objectives, but you can play through those in a multiplayer match? Is it just like different maps, but doing a certain objective like capturing a "flag" or doing some event gets you single player points? I remember them saying the singleplayer and the multiplayer were somehow tied, but it wasn't an MMO. I still don't quite get how that works...
I can't believe this game is finally coming out! I couldn't wait when I saw the brief demo at PAX two years ago, but admittedly I haven't been keeping up on all the news. I still don't quite understand how the multiplayer mode works. From what I've seen you have story objectives, but you can play through those in a multiplayer match? Is it just like different maps, but doing a certain objective like capturing a "flag" or doing some event gets you single player points? I remember them saying the singleplayer and the multiplayer were somehow tied, but it wasn't an MMO. I still don't quite get how that works...
It's exactly like Wolfenstein: Enemey Territory or Enemy Territory: Quake Wars if you've ever heard of those. Each map has one team completing a bunch of objectives and the other team trying to stop them. The only difference between single player and multiplayer appears to be how many points you earn, whether you play with bots or other people, and whether you play the maps in a certain order.
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CarbonFireSee youin the countryRegistered Userregular
I can't believe this game is finally coming out! I couldn't wait when I saw the brief demo at PAX two years ago, but admittedly I haven't been keeping up on all the news. I still don't quite understand how the multiplayer mode works. From what I've seen you have story objectives, but you can play through those in a multiplayer match? Is it just like different maps, but doing a certain objective like capturing a "flag" or doing some event gets you single player points? I remember them saying the singleplayer and the multiplayer were somehow tied, but it wasn't an MMO. I still don't quite get how that works...
It's exactly like Wolfenstein: Enemey Territory or Enemy Territory: Quake Wars if you've ever heard of those. Each map has one team completing a bunch of objectives and the other team trying to stop them. The only difference between single player and multiplayer appears to be how many points you earn, whether you play with bots or other people, and whether you play the maps in a certain order.
According to that Ed Stern interview a few posts above, you can play Single Player online against human opponents.
How that's not a multiplayer game, I HAVE NO IDEA. It almost seems like just semantics at that point. Maybe single player and co-op get cutscenes, while the multiplayer does not?
Regardless, I think Splash Damage is partially missing the point. A lot of people who play single player shooters only do so because they are just terrible at shooters. No amount of hand-holding or mission generating is going to change that. You can't choose "easy" or "casual" when you're playing against other people. Luckily there is an offline mode, but I wonder if there will get difficulty settings?
I can't believe this game is finally coming out! I couldn't wait when I saw the brief demo at PAX two years ago, but admittedly I haven't been keeping up on all the news. I still don't quite understand how the multiplayer mode works. From what I've seen you have story objectives, but you can play through those in a multiplayer match? Is it just like different maps, but doing a certain objective like capturing a "flag" or doing some event gets you single player points? I remember them saying the singleplayer and the multiplayer were somehow tied, but it wasn't an MMO. I still don't quite get how that works...
It's exactly like Wolfenstein: Enemey Territory or Enemy Territory: Quake Wars if you've ever heard of those. Each map has one team completing a bunch of objectives and the other team trying to stop them. The only difference between single player and multiplayer appears to be how many points you earn, whether you play with bots or other people, and whether you play the maps in a certain order.
According to that Ed Stern interview a few posts above, you can play Single Player online against human opponents.
How that's not a multiplayer game, I HAVE NO IDEA. It almost seems like just semantics at that point. Maybe single player and co-op get cutscenes, while the multiplayer does not?
Regardless, I think Splash Damage is partially missing the point. A lot of people who play single player shooters only do so because they are just terrible at shooters. No amount of hand-holding or mission generating is going to change that. You can't choose "easy" or "casual" when you're playing against other people. Luckily there is an offline mode, but I wonder if there will get difficulty settings?
What's also important to realise is that people that play singleplayer FPS's typically expect a very structured and paced experience, which multiplayer isn't. There's no room in a multiplayer game like this for slow moments or dramatic gameplay changes (like say all of a sudden a helicopter comes out of nowhere and you're running for cover).
Even in more open ended games like Crysis the gameplay's still structured to provide an optimal multiplayer experience. Crysis' multiplayer maps are huge and open as well, but naturally playing against human opponents is completely different to playing a singleplayer mission.
According to that Ed Stern interview a few posts above, you can play Single Player online against human opponents.
How that's not a multiplayer game, I HAVE NO IDEA.
I think what he means is you can jump into the campaign and play the game with all the bells and whistles of a singleplayer experience, only everyone else is also a human player.
The main thing from the get go was completely erasing the line between SP and MP. Basically just a fancy way of saying Multiplayer has all the cutscenes and everything.
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Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
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That guy loves the shit out of painting guys flying around going HAHRHHRHGHA with their arms spread out
What is this 30 tick thing?
When I first heard about this game I was super stoked. Now I'm cautiously optimistic. Here's hoping it exceeds my lowered expectations.
Do you know the tick rate of some other popular shooters (BLOPS, BC2, etc.)? I'm just curious how they compare. I've never heard of this term before.
It's not really a useful statistic for comparison on it's own, since it doesn't take into account differences in server coding.
edit: There's a bunch of different names too; 'snaps', 'server frame rate', etc.
Steam
I might just be confused though. Do we know if pistols are primary weapons, or are they still secondaries?
Steam
It's not super useful to compare a tickrate across engines. Your best bet would be to just load up Counterstrike: Source and try out the different tickrates.
Yeah different engines use different methods to "predict" what is going on in between ticks. All kinds of factors like ballistic models, player speeds, range and more technical stuff can play into how this feels from game to game. If you've ever been shot around corners or fired bullets through an opponent this is probably the culprit.
Quake 3, and most of the games that used the engine -- and I'm pretty sure id tech 4 as well, allowed servers and clients to modify their net settings. It was really noticeable when you were in a poorly optimized server.
But before that stuff was figured out, you could really mess with a servers physics by changing the sv_fps and the like.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
Light characters will be limited to using light weapons, such as Light Rifles and SMGs as a primary weapons, and pistols as a secondary weapon.
Medium characters can use medium weapons or lower (i.e. light weapons) as primary weapons and light weapons or pistols as their secondary.
Heavy characters can use heavy weapons or lower as primary weapons and medium or lower as secondary.
http://brink.wikia.com/wiki/Body_Type
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmmpadsBEjs
http://gamermade.com/features/410-pax-report-brink-customization-preview.html
http://spong.com/feature/10110345/Interview-Splash-Damages-Paul-Wedgwood
Dat weapons
That's tick rate, for anyone who still needs to know.
And who knows, maybe that means a locked in tickrate. Regardless, that will almost definitely be the case for the console versions.
There's a lot that remains to be seen about the game, guys.
Worst case scenario, the tick rate/net codez is borked, I can still have an immensely enjoyable time playing offline.
Brink will be amazing no matter how you look at it.
Not sure. I want to say doubtful though.
For the server, the command is /sv_fps, for the client it's /snaps. Duelling servers, where people only played 1v1 on small maps, ran fine at 30, but servers that ran team games on larger maps were expected to have 40. Lower than that and you'd have problems. If you start a vanilla server and jack the sv_fps way, way up, you can change the server's physics, making jumps super floaty and the like.
The problem with vanilla Quake 3 was that it was optimized for shitty connections, which held things back until people figured that out. Later mods started to enforce better net settings, because it became possible for players to mess with their settings to make themselves laggy, and some people were too lazy to bother anyway.
There's a lot of math involved, and it ties back to Quake 3's weird fps based physics and movement, which in turn ties into the math behind strafe jumping.
A lot of the net settings stuff carried over to other games that used the engine, and a some of it into id tech 4.
If anyone is interested in some further reading, here are the numbers behind the connection settings, and here is the math behind strafe jumping
Timenudge is the most interesting, as it allowed players to simulate lower ping connections (to a point, and it works better if you ping is already low) at the expense of smooth play. I couldn't play without it after a while, and before QuakeLive re-enabled it, I had a lot of trouble playing that as well. It's a sickness.
ps. This stuff really doesn't matter anymore. Newer games have it all locked down, and treat things differently anyway. Besides that, a lot of players got through years of Quake 3 without noticing.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
There's no killcam because running out of hitpoints incapacitates a player instead of killing him.
1:29 shows a player "die"
So far that DOESN'T appear to be the case with Brink, so here's hoping :^:
Im shocked how many cohesive outfits they came up with.
With customized looks and guns, this is just a little overwhelming again.
I think i need to hop off the hype train before it gets into station. I may go insane if i dont.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTGKYMIRf20
talks about sniping at 730-ish
It's exactly like Wolfenstein: Enemey Territory or Enemy Territory: Quake Wars if you've ever heard of those. Each map has one team completing a bunch of objectives and the other team trying to stop them. The only difference between single player and multiplayer appears to be how many points you earn, whether you play with bots or other people, and whether you play the maps in a certain order.
According to that Ed Stern interview a few posts above, you can play Single Player online against human opponents.
How that's not a multiplayer game, I HAVE NO IDEA. It almost seems like just semantics at that point. Maybe single player and co-op get cutscenes, while the multiplayer does not?
Regardless, I think Splash Damage is partially missing the point. A lot of people who play single player shooters only do so because they are just terrible at shooters. No amount of hand-holding or mission generating is going to change that. You can't choose "easy" or "casual" when you're playing against other people. Luckily there is an offline mode, but I wonder if there will get difficulty settings?
What's also important to realise is that people that play singleplayer FPS's typically expect a very structured and paced experience, which multiplayer isn't. There's no room in a multiplayer game like this for slow moments or dramatic gameplay changes (like say all of a sudden a helicopter comes out of nowhere and you're running for cover).
Even in more open ended games like Crysis the gameplay's still structured to provide an optimal multiplayer experience. Crysis' multiplayer maps are huge and open as well, but naturally playing against human opponents is completely different to playing a singleplayer mission.
I think what he means is you can jump into the campaign and play the game with all the bells and whistles of a singleplayer experience, only everyone else is also a human player.
The main thing from the get go was completely erasing the line between SP and MP. Basically just a fancy way of saying Multiplayer has all the cutscenes and everything.