Most of the other changes seem pretty good. Weird Thor changes, they're going to be pretty terrible for anti-air against carriers and battlecruisers now.
yeah but they pretty much always have been. You need way too many thors to AA massive stuff, there are a million other options you should be considering before them if that's what you're fighting.
Yeah, like vikings, and vikings, and, uh, vikings?
What are those million options again? It seems like Terran is pretty damn light on AA.
What?
Terran have quite a few good choices for AA: lots of marines, thors, vikings, and missile turrets. Not all of them are good against everything, but there's quite a bit to choose from there. And those aren't even everything terran has that can hit air.
Terran's AA situation is a whole lot better than that of Protoss and Zerg.
Terran is very heavy on the light AA (har har), but their options for defeating capital ships (except carriers) are much more limited. You are pretty much forced into going vikings.
I seriously love vikings, though, so don't take this as a complaint.
Yeah, marines can do the weak AA role pretty well, but anything other than that, you are looking at vikings. Marines, Ghosts, Thors, Vikings, BCs, and Raven Turrets are what you have for AA. Against capital ships only Vikings do anything decent.
And, yeah, you can use Turrets (the built kind) as AA. Only you can't move them, so they're sorta useless for attacking.
Yeah, marines can do the weak AA role pretty well, but anything other than that, you are looking at vikings. Marines, Ghosts, Thors, Vikings, BCs, and Raven Turrets are what you have for AA. Against capital ships only Vikings do anything decent.
And, yeah, you can use Turrets (the built kind) as AA. Only you can't move them, so they're sorta useless for attacking.
With the new patch, seeker missiles might be acceptable AA against capitals. I'll have to experiment with this.
i don't think 250 mm is good enough to warrant an upgrade AND increased energy cost. seriously? I often found myself not having enough energy to use it by the time i needed to anyway. It was rarely even a practical ability to use, i'd use it against thors and immortals and buildings for lols. a thor literally can't kill an immortal otherwise. and they'd get targetted down so fast while doing their retarded prep animation.
i don't think 250 mm is good enough to warrant an upgrade AND increased energy cost. seriously? I often found myself not having enough energy to use it by the time i needed to anyway. It was rarely even a practical ability to use, i'd use it against thors and immortals and buildings for lols. a thor literally can't kill an immortal otherwise. and they'd get targetted down so fast while doing their retarded prep animation.
Now that you say that, that reminds me of some other implications on the changes to attack speeds with the thor and colossus: their standard attack is now better against immortals. Previously while the hardened shields were up Immortals blocked half the dps from a colossus hitting them. Now they only block a third of the dps with hardened shields.
Against a thor, with hardened shields up immortals blocked 7/9ths of the thor's standard ground attack. Now they only block 2/3rds of the dps with hardened shields.
So why does toss whine about terran? I just fought a toss who actually used his abilities and there was basically nothing I could do. Huge forcefield walls forcing me into melee with mass lots, feedback on ghosts, etc.
*Whines about T*
*Is P*
*Doesn't use forcefields or high temps*
Well, that guy you played you called you stupid for suggesting colossi and sentries had the worst micro ever.
So I assume it's just the protoss who think they're good because they have a bunch of wins with attack-move that are complaining when their attack-move ball gets countered.
i don't think 250 mm is good enough to warrant an upgrade AND increased energy cost. seriously? I often found myself not having enough energy to use it by the time i needed to anyway. It was rarely even a practical ability to use, i'd use it against thors and immortals and buildings for lols. a thor literally can't kill an immortal otherwise. and they'd get targetted down so fast while doing their retarded prep animation.
Now that you say that, that reminds me of some other implications on the changes to attack speeds with the thor and colossus: their standard attack is now better against immortals. Previously while the hardened shields were up Immortals blocked half the dps from a colossus hitting them. Now they only block a third of the dps with hardened shields.
Against a thor, with hardened shields up immortals blocked 7/9ths of the thor's standard ground attack. Now they only block 2/3rds of the dps with hardened shields.
I believe a Thor will kill an Immortal now in a 1v1 even without its cannons. [Edit: Cannons which, by the way, no one will ever research. Ever.]
It's hilarious because they can fly in one direction while shooting and facing another. Like, it was already kind of ridiculous how all the flyers in SC could hover, but flying backwards too is just funny.
i don't think 250 mm is good enough to warrant an upgrade AND increased energy cost. seriously? I often found myself not having enough energy to use it by the time i needed to anyway. It was rarely even a practical ability to use, i'd use it against thors and immortals and buildings for lols. a thor literally can't kill an immortal otherwise. and they'd get targetted down so fast while doing their retarded prep animation.
Now that you say that, that reminds me of some other implications on the changes to attack speeds with the thor and colossus: their standard attack is now better against immortals. Previously while the hardened shields were up Immortals blocked half the dps from a colossus hitting them. Now they only block a third of the dps with hardened shields.
Against a thor, with hardened shields up immortals blocked 7/9ths of the thor's standard ground attack. Now they only block 2/3rds of the dps with hardened shields.
I believe a Thor will kill an Immortal now in a 1v1 even without its cannons. [Edit: Cannons which, by the way, no one will ever research. Ever.]
Decided to go test this. Looks like it's accurate; although it's damn close. Thor ends up less than one shot from death. An upgrade or two would probably shift this battle one way or the other.
Oh snap, they really sold short the changes to the archon buff in the notes by only mentioning the outer radius. You can see the new stats in the editor.
Now they do full damage in a radius 0.25 circle, half damage in a 0.5 radius circle, and one fourth damage in a radius 1 circle.
The full damage circle change is very large percentage wise, and could have very large gameplay ramifications. Previously, their full damage was only in a radius 0.093 circle, half damage in a 0.4 radius circle, and one fourth damage in a radius 0.8 radius circle.
For comparison, the thor AA is full damage in a radius 0.5 circle.
It looks like toss finally has good counters to mass mutas in this patch.
So, when I think Infestors I think Stig. So Stig, a question if you please. Ever used them on High Templars? Does it give you access to their psi-storm?
So, when I think Infestors I think Stig. So Stig, a question if you please. Ever used them on High Templars? Does it give you access to their psi-storm?
It does indeed.
Just gotta get em' before they feedback you! It's sudden death.
So, when I think Infestors I think Stig. So Stig, a question if you please. Ever used them on High Templars? Does it give you access to their psi-storm?
i remember him making a post about fungal growthing high templars once then parasiting them and psionic storming them while they were rooted
So, when I think Infestors I think Stig. So Stig, a question if you please. Ever used them on High Templars? Does it give you access to their psi-storm?
Yep it does and I have done it. It didn't save me from the ground army of death though.
Shens on
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Dusdais ashamed of this postSLC, UTRegistered Userregular
So I keep running into an extremely frustrating 2v2 start which Ive dubbed photon rush.
It involves one protoss and one terran player, The protoss will rush one of his initial probe into your base. While thats happening the second player will send the majority of his earned resources to the protoss player.
The protoss player will quickly build a pylon and cybernetics core while his probe is in transit. Once these are built he will send a second probe and blitz his initial probe into your base and build two pylons close to your command center. He will cancel the less hp having pylon once both are close to completion. After he will build two photon cannons and a second pylon and will have enough minerals to build a third by the time the initial two are half way done.
I 7 barracks and 8 supply depot for reference.
By the time my first marine is out and the second is a third completed his initial two pylons are half done.
My only option at this point is to life my command center and relocate because 2 marines are not enough to take down the targets. Ive had my teammate send his units to rush the oppositions base and destroy them since they wont have much to defend with. However the three to four zealots that he has out wont do nearly as much damage as the three photon cannons. And can easily be dealt with.
Welp, finished my 5 placement games and I'm Bronze apparently. I'm hoping that's not too terrible.
Immortals are officially my favorite now. They've been the heroes of just about every encounter I've used them in. This time they took out the 3 Thors that would have been the death of my group, while drawing enough fire to let me build up my Warp Rays or whatever they're called to blow their Command Center to smithereens. Oh, and another one also helped hold off an early Terran assault, though he did lose his life in the process.
So I keep running into an extremely frustrating 2v2 start which Ive dubbed photon rush.
It involves one protoss and one terran player, The protoss will rush one of his initial probe into your base. While thats happening the second player will send the majority of his earned resources to the protoss player.
The protoss player will quickly build a pylon and cybernetics core while his probe is in transit. Once these are built he will send a second probe and blitz his initial probe into your base and build two pylons close to your command center. He will cancel the less hp having pylon once both are close to completion. After he will build two photon cannons and a second pylon and will have enough minerals to build a third by the time the initial two are half way done.
I 7 barracks and 8 supply depot for reference.
By the time my first marine is out and the second is a third completed his initial two pylons are half done.
My only option at this point is to life my command center and relocate because 2 marines are not enough to take down the targets. Ive had my teammate send his units to rush the oppositions base and destroy them since they wont have much to defend with. However the three to four zealots that he has out wont do nearly as much damage as the three photon cannons. And can easily be dealt with.
The first probe is in my base before my first marine is up, while micro dodging my SCV's he can stay alive, when my first marine is up he builds the two pylons, I kill the probe and both pylons are over 1/3 built.
The second probe jumps in once the pylon is almost built and begins construction of the 3 buildings. Even if I kill the second probe I cannot kill 2-3 photon cannons.
Edit*Also this is all completed before I can build a barracks and 2 supply depots to completely close off my entrance (no to mention the larger ramp maps).
So I keep running into an extremely frustrating 2v2 start which Ive dubbed photon rush.
It involves one protoss and one terran player, The protoss will rush one of his initial probe into your base. While thats happening the second player will send the majority of his earned resources to the protoss player.
The protoss player will quickly build a pylon and cybernetics core while his probe is in transit. Once these are built he will send a second probe and blitz his initial probe into your base and build two pylons close to your command center. He will cancel the less hp having pylon once both are close to completion. After he will build two photon cannons and a second pylon and will have enough minerals to build a third by the time the initial two are half way done.
I 7 barracks and 8 supply depot for reference.
By the time my first marine is out and the second is a third completed his initial two pylons are half done.
My only option at this point is to life my command center and relocate because 2 marines are not enough to take down the targets. Ive had my teammate send his units to rush the oppositions base and destroy them since they wont have much to defend with. However the three to four zealots that he has out wont do nearly as much damage as the three photon cannons. And can easily be dealt with.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Kill the probe.
Someone needs to make a comic (*cough*) about this.
The first probe is in my base before my first marine is up, while micro dodging my SCV's he can stay alive, when my first marine is up he builds the two pylons, I kill the probe and both pylons are over 1/3 built.
The second probe jumps in once the pylon is almost built and begins construction of the 3 buildings. Even if I kill the second probe I cannot kill 2-3 photon cannons.
Edit*Also this is all completed before I can build a barracks and 2 supply depots to completely close off my entrance (no to mention the larger ramp maps).
On smaller ramps, build one supply depo/one supply depo + rax and physically use your units to block the remaining hole. Use hold position.
Oh, I should mention that I am not running a tournament this week but if someone else wants to (at least one person has shown interest) they have my blessing, I might even play in it :P
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I seriously love vikings, though, so don't take this as a complaint.
And, yeah, you can use Turrets (the built kind) as AA. Only you can't move them, so they're sorta useless for attacking.
Now that you say that, that reminds me of some other implications on the changes to attack speeds with the thor and colossus: their standard attack is now better against immortals. Previously while the hardened shields were up Immortals blocked half the dps from a colossus hitting them. Now they only block a third of the dps with hardened shields.
Against a thor, with hardened shields up immortals blocked 7/9ths of the thor's standard ground attack. Now they only block 2/3rds of the dps with hardened shields.
you leave my blobs alone! Tab'ing is hard...
FFBE: 898,311,440
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"Wait, this introduces micro with moving shots different than how it worked in SC1?! LET'S BITCH!"
While the actual big name players are much more open to it.
Decided to go test this. Looks like it's accurate; although it's damn close. Thor ends up less than one shot from death. An upgrade or two would probably shift this battle one way or the other.
Also I did an FFA today and pheonixs are fun.
Also getting 20 voids and just slaughtering everything is awesome.
Oh, back to the pheonixs-I slaughtered some MMM blob by just lifting all the marines really quickly. It was pretty funny.
Now they do full damage in a radius 0.25 circle, half damage in a 0.5 radius circle, and one fourth damage in a radius 1 circle.
The full damage circle change is very large percentage wise, and could have very large gameplay ramifications. Previously, their full damage was only in a radius 0.093 circle, half damage in a 0.4 radius circle, and one fourth damage in a radius 0.8 radius circle.
For comparison, the thor AA is full damage in a radius 0.5 circle.
It looks like toss finally has good counters to mass mutas in this patch.
see zerg make roach warren
see zerg get 5 immortals A moved into his base while i blink stalkers from the back into his mineral line
man, i don't want to become this
i don't want to become the protoss enemy
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It does indeed.
Just gotta get em' before they feedback you! It's sudden death.
i remember him making a post about fungal growthing high templars once then parasiting them and psionic storming them while they were rooted
Yep it does and I have done it. It didn't save me from the ground army of death though.
It involves one protoss and one terran player, The protoss will rush one of his initial probe into your base. While thats happening the second player will send the majority of his earned resources to the protoss player.
The protoss player will quickly build a pylon and cybernetics core while his probe is in transit. Once these are built he will send a second probe and blitz his initial probe into your base and build two pylons close to your command center. He will cancel the less hp having pylon once both are close to completion. After he will build two photon cannons and a second pylon and will have enough minerals to build a third by the time the initial two are half way done.
I 7 barracks and 8 supply depot for reference.
By the time my first marine is out and the second is a third completed his initial two pylons are half done.
My only option at this point is to life my command center and relocate because 2 marines are not enough to take down the targets. Ive had my teammate send his units to rush the oppositions base and destroy them since they wont have much to defend with. However the three to four zealots that he has out wont do nearly as much damage as the three photon cannons. And can easily be dealt with.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
I also froze when I quit the game earlier.
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Immortals are officially my favorite now. They've been the heroes of just about every encounter I've used them in. This time they took out the 3 Thors that would have been the death of my group, while drawing enough fire to let me build up my Warp Rays or whatever they're called to blow their Command Center to smithereens. Oh, and another one also helped hold off an early Terran assault, though he did lose his life in the process.
Man Immortals are awesome.
Not that top players would need such a feature, but it sure as hell would be helpful at a newbie level.
Kill the probe.
The second probe jumps in once the pylon is almost built and begins construction of the 3 buildings. Even if I kill the second probe I cannot kill 2-3 photon cannons.
Edit*Also this is all completed before I can build a barracks and 2 supply depots to completely close off my entrance (no to mention the larger ramp maps).
I want my extra pre-order key : (
Someone needs to make a comic (*cough*) about this.
Shit just got real.
On smaller ramps, build one supply depo/one supply depo + rax and physically use your units to block the remaining hole. Use hold position.