[WoW] Have you been posting? I'm sorry but I'll have to see some [RealID]!

bowen

Demiurge wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Boogdud wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Or , you could follow some 12-25 year old girl/woman boy/man around on the forums and e-stalk her /him because 99% of them are most definitely not the brightest people about their real life identity on the internet.

FTFY

Touche.

Though, it's kind of concerning that I've run into 4 people who admit they're pedophiles. Well, to them they're not pedophiles, because sleeping with 14 year old girls when you're 28 isn't really crazy to them for some reason.

Well its legal in Spain, don't transplant American taboo's on the rest of the world 8-)

Only Spain? And... why shouldn't I be concerned with American People in American Forums on American Servers that can use American Infrastructure to stalk someone?

Arch

bowen i think you should change your title and location in response to this

"Repeal the RealID"

"FOR LORDAERON!"

bowen

How's that?

Arch

haahahaha

dougly

bowen wrote: »

shryke wrote: »

Agent Cooper wrote: »

And how, exactly, is making people post with their real names going to make money?

Facebook integration.

How will that make money? Who the fuck knows. But it probably sounds really good to the people upstairs at Activision because all the kids are using Facebook these days and it's a big thing and Facebook makes money somehow and so on and so forth.

It's because of the tough stipulations Facebook puts on non-real people and accounts. They don't like it, so if WoW wants to deal with them, they'd probably have to cut that shit down.

It's relatively brilliant.

How many people have WoW "liked" on facebook? Very few.

What happens when every WoW player in the world is now exposed through facebook? "Michael Brown Just Killed the Lich King? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MOHAWK YET?! Click here to play WoW".

That's a Hell of a lot of advertising and I'd imagine they're banking on it generating more players than will leave over this fiasco.

Have fun running your mom's level 4 night elf mohawk to Darnassus.

-Phil-

Lorahalo wrote: »

autono-wally, erotibot300 wrote: »

So... what about, say, a celebrity playing WoW?
Will it affect people to see that the shaman they're playing with is actually Barack Obama

That'd be pretty fantastic though. Just randomly find out your healer is actually the president.

<Obaminator>: AFK, need to go launch some nukes...

dojango

Once again, I'm not sure that merely making a person's name available violates any privacy laws in the US.
What private individuals might do with that information might violate the law, like "That one Kid's law" passed after the facebook suicide, but blizzard is not going to be legally liable for that, any more than AT&T would be liable any damages caused by the man who tried to murder Steve Martin in 'The Jerk'.

JacksWastedLife

bowen wrote: »

I'm just going to go ahead and throw this out there. Hey Blizzard, if all your employees leave to start a new studio, I'll totally buy all your games.

Yes, because that worked so well in the past

http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/news/39866/Flagship-Studios-Closure-Confirmed-All-Staff-Fired-All-I-P-Lost-But-Now-The-Studio-Is-Saved

bowen

-Phil- wrote: »

Lorahalo wrote: »

autono-wally, erotibot300 wrote: »

So... what about, say, a celebrity playing WoW?
Will it affect people to see that the shaman they're playing with is actually Barack Obama

That'd be pretty fantastic though. Just randomly find out your healer is actually the president.

<IslamicShock>: AFK, need to go launch some nukes...

FTFY

dojango

dougly wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

shryke wrote: »

Agent Cooper wrote: »

And how, exactly, is making people post with their real names going to make money?

Facebook integration.

How will that make money? Who the fuck knows. But it probably sounds really good to the people upstairs at Activision because all the kids are using Facebook these days and it's a big thing and Facebook makes money somehow and so on and so forth.

It's because of the tough stipulations Facebook puts on non-real people and accounts. They don't like it, so if WoW wants to deal with them, they'd probably have to cut that shit down.

It's relatively brilliant.

How many people have WoW "liked" on facebook? Very few.

What happens when every WoW player in the world is now exposed through facebook? "Michael Brown Just Killed the Lich King? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MOHAWK YET?! Click here to play WoW".

That's a Hell of a lot of advertising and I'd imagine they're banking on it generating more players than will leave over this fiasco.

Have fun running your mom's level 4 night elf mohawk to Darnassus.

When is that facebook integration nonsense coming out? I sure as heck don't want facebook to notify the world when I'm playing WoW.

reVerse

bowen wrote: »

-Phil- wrote: »

Lorahalo wrote: »

autono-wally, erotibot300 wrote: »

So... what about, say, a celebrity playing WoW?
Will it affect people to see that the shaman they're playing with is actually Barack Obama

That'd be pretty fantastic though. Just randomly find out your healer is actually the president.

<IslamicShock>: AFK, need to go dismantle the democracy in favor of an atheistic islamic communist state...

FTFY

For our Republican readers.

bowen

I like where this is going.

bowen

dojango wrote: »

dougly wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

shryke wrote: »

Agent Cooper wrote: »

And how, exactly, is making people post with their real names going to make money?

Facebook integration.

How will that make money? Who the fuck knows. But it probably sounds really good to the people upstairs at Activision because all the kids are using Facebook these days and it's a big thing and Facebook makes money somehow and so on and so forth.

It's because of the tough stipulations Facebook puts on non-real people and accounts. They don't like it, so if WoW wants to deal with them, they'd probably have to cut that shit down.

It's relatively brilliant.

How many people have WoW "liked" on facebook? Very few.

What happens when every WoW player in the world is now exposed through facebook? "Michael Brown Just Killed the Lich King? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MOHAWK YET?! Click here to play WoW".

That's a Hell of a lot of advertising and I'd imagine they're banking on it generating more players than will leave over this fiasco.

Have fun running your mom's level 4 night elf mohawk to Darnassus.

When is that facebook integration nonsense coming out? I sure as heck don't want facebook to notify the world when I'm playing WoW.

http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/press/pressreleases.html?100505

Smrtnik

So how long before Nethera (one of the CMs) starts getting IRL stalkers?

SniperGuy

I mean, the US can't really raise a stink about it. Nor can really any other government. In no way are you required to give anyone your real name here. It's a video game. If you want to play it, don't post on the forums. If that still bothers you, don't play the game at all. They're not just exposing everyone's real name to the world instantly. You still have to make a conscious decision to give it to other people. Unless the EU works vastly different, it's it's own company that you have to voluntarily allow to show your name.

SniperGuy

And again, there's no way they can force you to connect your facebook to the game. I think it's a cool feature and probably will, but you certainly don't have to use it.

Brainleech

When the People from the GUILD thing were at blizzcon last year they talked about how they played the game When Felicia Day was asked by one boy about realm she played on and answered he cheered with a yes and I felt that was wrong because I had my death knight on that realm as well as my dual box experiment it went from a rather pleasant place to a place full of stalkers and rather creepy people in a few months


I have off and on for the last 3 years talked to a girl who is 17 about anything lately she has talked about all the guys she has seen this summer and what not. to find out more about her would be rather weird

bowen

Then I should hold legal rights over time I've invested in the account time I've purchased, regardless if Blizzard "owns" it because it's on their server.

It's only $5000, but what's the point if they're changing a service after I already spent time in it. That'd be like investing in a house and suddenly halfway through the contractor decides to change the blueprints even though you both already agreed on one thing and made concessions on other things.

dojango

bowen wrote: »

dojango wrote: »

dougly wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

shryke wrote: »

Agent Cooper wrote: »

And how, exactly, is making people post with their real names going to make money?

Facebook integration.

How will that make money? Who the fuck knows. But it probably sounds really good to the people upstairs at Activision because all the kids are using Facebook these days and it's a big thing and Facebook makes money somehow and so on and so forth.

It's because of the tough stipulations Facebook puts on non-real people and accounts. They don't like it, so if WoW wants to deal with them, they'd probably have to cut that shit down.

It's relatively brilliant.

How many people have WoW "liked" on facebook? Very few.

What happens when every WoW player in the world is now exposed through facebook? "Michael Brown Just Killed the Lich King? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MOHAWK YET?! Click here to play WoW".

That's a Hell of a lot of advertising and I'd imagine they're banking on it generating more players than will leave over this fiasco.

Have fun running your mom's level 4 night elf mohawk to Darnassus.

When is that facebook integration nonsense coming out? I sure as heck don't want facebook to notify the world when I'm playing WoW.

http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/press/pressreleases.html?100505

Cautionary Note Regarding Forward-looking Statements: Information in this press release that involves Blizzard Entertainment’s expectations, plans, intentions or strategies regarding the future are forward-looking statements that are not facts and involve a number of risks and uncertainties. Blizzard Entertainment generally uses words such as “outlook,” “will,” “could,” “would,” “might,” “remains,” “to be,” “plans,” “believes,” “may,” “expects,” “intends,” “anticipates,” “estimate,” future,” “plan,” “positioned,” “potential,” “project,” “remain,” “scheduled,” “set to,” “subject to,” “upcoming” and similar expressions to identify forward-looking statements. Factors that could cause Blizzard Entertainment’s actual future results to differ materially from those expressed in the forward-looking statements set forth in this release include, but are not limited to, sales levels of Blizzard Entertainment’s titles, shifts in consumer spending trends, the impact of the current macroeconomic environment, the seasonal and cyclical nature of the interactive game market, declines in software pricing, product returns and price protection, product delays, retail acceptance of Blizzard Entertainment’s products, competition from the used game market, industry competition and competition from other forms of entertainment, rapid changes in technology, industry standards and consumer preferences, including interest in specific genres such as real-time strategy, action–role-playing and massively multiplayer online games, protection of proprietary rights, litigation against Blizzard Entertainment, maintenance of relationships with key personnel, customers, licensees, licensors, vendors and third-party developers, including the ability to attract, retain and develop key personnel and developers who can create high quality “hit” titles, counterparty risks relating to customers, licensees, licensors and manufacturers, domestic and international economic, financial and political conditions and policies, foreign exchange rates and tax rates, and the identification of suitable future acquisition opportunities, and the other factors identified in the risk factors section of Activision Blizzard’s most recent annual report on Form 10-K and any subsequent quarterly reports on Form 10-Q. The forward-looking statements in this release are based upon information available to Blizzard Entertainment and Activision Blizzard as of the date of this release, and neither Blizzard Entertainment nor Activision Blizzard assumes any obligation to update any such forward-looking statements. Forward-looking statements believed to be true when made may ultimately prove to be incorrect. These statements are not guarantees of the future performance of Blizzard Entertainment or Activision Blizzard and are subject to risks, uncertainties and other factors, some of which are beyond its control and may cause actual results to differ materially from current expectations.

Weirdest damn fine-print I've seen in a long time.

bowen

Man is must be really nice that the wife of your CEO is a lawyer so you don't have to pay for one to write shit like that at least.

Brainleech

I found it funny also last night when I went to the offical forums and read some of the threads in general that someone was due to the 5 hour+ wait on the phone he was encouraging people to write into blizzard and complain about it

Bizazedo

Guy on another forum posted some stuff that made sense to me. Unlike him, I still play, but his points weren't about stalkers per se anyways..

Other Forum dude, Northerner wrote:

I think a number of people are falsely understanding the nature of the API changes. Yes indeed it is used for in-game addons and the like, which honestly don't much concern me as I don't play WoW anymore.

It is also however used for web-based interactions at some levels and I would say it is pretty obvious that RealID is part of the Facebook hook. In other words, playing any RealID enabled product should allow a web interface or crawler to extract your RealID information and cross-index it to Armory data, Ladder data and all the meta-data that Blizzard is already collecting and making quite open.

To summarize my concerns, I believe Blizzard has quite intentionally built tools so that someone who is your Facebook friend can obviously see your recent achievements and such but also as a product of those tools anyone with web access and open server access can compile a list of whatever they want and it will be completely open to the RealID information. A list of data of the top 100 Diamond Zergs with a >50% win rate against Terrans (including the RealID identifiers)? No problem. The name of that bitch that just 6-pooled you in Bronze? There's an app for that too!

That is what I think is the future intended, although obviously without a great deal of foresight.

He then was asked / challenged a bit, and he elaborated.

Northerner wrote:

It has nothing to do directly with Facebook though. It is a tool-set for deriving data through any number of possible interfaces and collating that into a dataset that you can then parse out in whatever way you want. We have had Armory crawlers for ages already and they can and do link up data into metadata without trouble. Hell, it is essentially what datamining is all about.

Adding in a RealID as the primary instead of a fictional and changeable name (or an obscured numeric or whatever) makes a massive difference however in terms of security and accessibility. That's perfectly fine for in-house only but it is absolutely and completely unacceptable for something shared over a public API. It isn't because ethugs will see your name on the forum or in game or whatever, it is because the inevitable product as I see it is a 3rd party site where you can bang in any in-game data (character name, SC2 handle, whatever) and get all the presently usual data like performance, gearscore, SC2 win/loss/whatever and so on but also RL info and soon enough you won't even need to search out details on your own past the initial datapoint.

This is not intended to facilitate stalking and crap of course, any more than Google itself is. Instead, it is intended to facilitate datamining and targeted advertising and so on which is frankly evil enough in my opinion but absolutely understandable for a corporation. It seems right now however that it is absolutely vulnerable and frankly wide open and the very design is at fault.

The manner in which they are opening the Facebook integration up is the issue I have. It isn't anything to do with Facebook nor even WoW or even BNet2.x in general. It is the hook however that makes exploitation inevitable as it stands and perhaps they'll redo the tech side still. I certainly don't know what is in their minds at present.

EDIT: By the way, I am indeed tinfoil-hatting to some degree here and all. Nothing like this may ever come to pass.

Brainleech

I think real id and getting my ass kicked all the time is why I did not play the Starcraft beta that much
I highly doubt I am going to play it online

SniperGuy

bowen wrote: »

Then I should hold legal rights over time I've invested in the account time I've purchased, regardless if Blizzard "owns" it because it's on their server.

It's only $5000, but what's the point if they're changing a service after I already spent time in it. That'd be like investing in a house and suddenly halfway through the contractor decides to change the blueprints even though you both already agreed on one thing and made concessions on other things.

What the hell are you talking about. Playing WoW, you agree to their contract and terms and conditions. EVERY TIME they patch they make you re-agree. If you agreed with the contractor that he was allowed to change the blueprints whenever, then you have no leg to stand on.


With WoW, you've agreed to play an ever changing game with ever changing rules. They have presented the change to you BEFORE THEY HAVE DONE IT and you have plenty of time to decide wether or not you want to be a part of that change.

No one is being forced to do anything, and fuck your "time invested" bullshit. You spent that time having fun playing the game.

bowen

Brainleech wrote: »

I think real id and getting my ass kicked all the time is why I did not play the Starcraft beta that much
I highly doubt I am going to play it online

bowen

SniperGuy wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Then I should hold legal rights over time I've invested in the account time I've purchased, regardless if Blizzard "owns" it because it's on their server.

It's only $5000, but what's the point if they're changing a service after I already spent time in it. That'd be like investing in a house and suddenly halfway through the contractor decides to change the blueprints even though you both already agreed on one thing and made concessions on other things.

What the hell are you talking about. Playing WoW, you agree to their contract and terms and conditions. EVERY TIME they patch they make you re-agree. If you agreed with the contractor that he was allowed to change the blueprints whenever, then you have no leg to stand on.


With WoW, you've agreed to play an ever changing game with ever changing rules. They have presented the change to you BEFORE THEY HAVE DONE IT and you have plenty of time to decide wether or not you want to be a part of that change.

No one is being forced to do anything, and fuck your "time invested" bullshit. You spent that time having fun playing the game.

It was hyperbole. Cry some more. Well, maybe not, but still, my second statement stands.

Corehealer

SniperGuy wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Then I should hold legal rights over time I've invested in the account time I've purchased, regardless if Blizzard "owns" it because it's on their server.

It's only $5000, but what's the point if they're changing a service after I already spent time in it. That'd be like investing in a house and suddenly halfway through the contractor decides to change the blueprints even though you both already agreed on one thing and made concessions on other things.

What the hell are you talking about. Playing WoW, you agree to their contract and terms and conditions. EVERY TIME they patch they make you re-agree. If you agreed with the contractor that he was allowed to change the blueprints whenever, then you have no leg to stand on.


With WoW, you've agreed to play an ever changing game with ever changing rules. They have presented the change to you BEFORE THEY HAVE DONE IT and you have plenty of time to decide wether or not you want to be a part of that change.

No one is being forced to do anything, and fuck your "time invested" bullshit. You spent that time having fun playing the game.

I would agree with this if not for the fact that RealID basically equates to: "Ethier use your real name in our forum and leave your ass hanging in the wind for someone to come fuck with, or don't, and miss out on a lot of community connection, technical help and gameplay tips by not posting at all. We are telling you now before hand that we are doing this, and we aren't changing it, so fuck you, the choice* is yours."

*Warning: Definition of choice used by Blizzard may differ slightly then reality's and more resemble being forced to do something against your will*.

Also, investing time in a character and a game means you own that time in your memory and that account, but not the actual character you paid for and created and nurtured, because that game and character and everything else attached to your account is still the intellectual property of the company. Blizzard is the one who actually owns your character because you can't take your character out of the game and do what you will with it, in the same way you would your car or your house. In a MMO, you basically rent their intellectual property and mold it to your desired look within given parameters and then play it until you need to pay for it again, or in the F2P sense, need to buy shiny things for it in the game shop.

I think that the above is a retarded way to manage people's efforts and emotional/social/financial investment in a game and their characters in it, but that's how it is.

Echo

-Phil- wrote: »

<Obaminator>: AFK, need to go launch some nukes...

Man, great pug dumping excuses.

"Shit gtg, east coast under Russian nuclear attack"

Gnutson

Corehealer wrote: »

SniperGuy wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Then I should hold legal rights over time I've invested in the account time I've purchased, regardless if Blizzard "owns" it because it's on their server.

It's only $5000, but what's the point if they're changing a service after I already spent time in it. That'd be like investing in a house and suddenly halfway through the contractor decides to change the blueprints even though you both already agreed on one thing and made concessions on other things.

What the hell are you talking about. Playing WoW, you agree to their contract and terms and conditions. EVERY TIME they patch they make you re-agree. If you agreed with the contractor that he was allowed to change the blueprints whenever, then you have no leg to stand on.


With WoW, you've agreed to play an ever changing game with ever changing rules. They have presented the change to you BEFORE THEY HAVE DONE IT and you have plenty of time to decide wether or not you want to be a part of that change.

No one is being forced to do anything, and fuck your "time invested" bullshit. You spent that time having fun playing the game.

I would agree with this if not for the fact that RealID basically equates to: "Ethier use your real name in our forum and leave your ass hanging in the wind for someone to come fuck with, or don't, and miss out on a lot of community connection, technical help and gameplay tips by not posting at all. We are telling you now before hand that we are doing this, and we aren't changing it, so fuck you, the choice* is yours."

*Warning: Definition of choice used by Blizzard may differ slightly then reality's and more resemble being forced to do something against your will*.

Also, investing time in a character and a game means you own that time in your memory and that account, but not the actual character you paid for and created and nurtured, because that game and character and everything else attached to your account is still the intellectual property of the company. Blizzard is the one who actually owns your character because you can't take your character out of the game and do what you will with it, in the same way you would your car or your house. In a MMO, you basically rent their intellectual property and mold it to your desired look within given parameters and then play it until you need to pay for it again, or in the F2P sense, need to buy shiny things for it in the game shop.

I think that the above is a retarded way to manage people's efforts and emotional/social/financial investment in a game and their characters in it, but that's how it is.

Except posting on the forums by no way do anything you can't do elsewhere. You can connet with the community in game, you can get support via email or phone, and you can read all the gameplay tips you want without posting.

I'm not going to lie, I think his change to the forums is a decent idea to add more real life community to the game. Where it goes from here might be scary, but I'm not going to fear monger on whats next untill it happens.

jackal

Generally the best time to think about negative consequences to actions is before the actions are taken.

GoodKingJayIII

Corehealer wrote: »

Agent Cooper wrote: »

I think a lot of people will try TOR, but I don't think it's going to significantly impact WoW.

GW2 probably won't because... believe it or not, because of no monthly subscription. People will assume it's a lesser game for that reason alone. Conspicuous consumption at its finest.

Then those retarded people can enjoy being stalked on WoW's forums while not being able to even breathe without a minimum 5k + GS and breathing achievement, in triplicate. Or can hope for the best out of SWTOR, which is the other awesome game in the pipe right now.

Several pages back, but I can't resist. Let's not forget that EA is running the TOR ship, and even if they had no other "big business vidja game" crimes, they're still pretty well known for one: making goddamn awful MMOs.

I have taken more and more interest in what's out there in the genre, and the ArenaNet guys are looking better and better. Also, GW2 is looking badass.

Gnutson

jackal wrote: »

Generally the best time to think about negative consequences to actions is before the actions are taken.

But alot of the actions people are talking about aren't even announced, and who knows if they ever will be.

People are reacting to what they assume is coming next at this point and not reacting to what has actually been announced.

bowen

jackal wrote: »

Generally the best time to think about negative consequences to actions is before the actions are taken.

Especially when it's already been signed to happen. A push to put a real life name in the forums and a link up to facebook. I think it's safe to assume that the only reason that there's real names in the forums is because facebook almost required them to do so.

forty

Cardboard Tube wrote: »

so don't troll people or be a dick

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying here.

Xaquin

Not sure if this has been brought up, but does this apply to South Korea too? I hear they take their Starcraft a lot more seriously over there.

The Wolfman

I think I preferred when the theory behind this action was because of South Korea laws, and not Facebook.

Tomanta

Xaquin wrote: »

Not sure if this has been brought up, but does this apply to South Korea too? I hear they take their Starcraft a lot more seriously over there.

Rumors are that this is BECAUSE of South Korean law and Starcraft

EDIT: Bah, beated

Naphtali

Gnutson wrote: »

jackal wrote: »

Generally the best time to think about negative consequences to actions is before the actions are taken.

But alot of the actions people are talking about aren't even announced, and who knows if they ever will be.

People are reacting to what they assume is coming next at this point and not reacting to what has actually been announced.

You realize, this is the same argument when people expressed displeasure at RealID showing people your real name when you used it to friend others, well before the "oh yeah, you post on the forums people will see your real name" bombshell was dropped.

My thinking is that if there is pushback now perhaps future changes and/or 'features' will be possibly less intrusive or distasteful.

Dehumanized

Yeah, when it was just a system for linking up with your real friends and nothing else it was just fine and most of the conspiracy theories were just that. Now, Blizzard has announced something way worse than most of the conspiracy theories is going to happen. All bets are off.

Corehealer

http://greyshades.wordpress.com/2010/07/08/an-open-letter-to-blizzard/

Read it. Just do it.

It's good stuff.