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News Media Personalities of America

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    AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    kaz67 wrote: »
    Sort of surprised to see the low opinions of CNN's coverage. With the exception of people like Nancy Grace and Dobbs, I have always found their anchors to be the least objectionable. Granted I am not a close follower of the prime time news shows, but I feel like there is less nonsense to sift through on CNN when I want to get an idea of what the major current events are.

    I don't think CNN has bad anchors as much as they do terrible coverage. They specialize in scandalous reporting, and then devote the majority of their programming to petty bullshit and uninformative partisan banter.

    And then there's the aforementioned week-long series on completely uninteresting and pointless crap, working the "human interest" angle.

    Atomika on
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    OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    CNN reports far too much on things like opinions and rhetoric. Stuff that can be actively debated.

    Give me facts, goddamn it. I don't care what Sen. Dipshit from Kentuklahoma has to say about something he only knows about via aides.

    OptimusZed on
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    AtomikaAtomika Live fast and get fucked or whatever Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    CNN reports far too much on things like opinions and rhetoric. Stuff that can be actively debated.

    Give me facts, goddamn it. I don't care what Sen. Dipshit from Kentuklahoma has to say about something he only knows about via aides.

    I can't actually remember the last time I turned on a cable news station and actually just saw news being reported. It's always Larry King or some puff piece or something. Why, when we have 3 major news nets, can we not get news reported?

    Atomika on
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Because opinion sells. Or is perceived to sell, considering the status of news ratings.

    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Yup. Real News is far less profitable. Especially if you actually, you know, go out and reserach it yourself.

    Which is why it's almost useless to talk about most of the Talking Heads.

    Although one wonders, are they all that way because that's the kind of scum that rises to the top in the industry these days? Or is it that staying at the top once you get there requires you to spout the kind of bullshit that (apparently) sells best no matter how much you'd rather be doing real reporting?

    shryke on
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    I'd say at this point we don't really know how well real news would sell, as it hasn't been done since at least the mid 90s.

    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    See sig.

    Opinion-oriented reporting actively outsold real news back in the 90s - it started with The O'Reilly Factor, didn't it? - and probably still does.

    ronya on
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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    re: Olbermann, this is probably my favorite thing Ben Affleck has ever done.

    http://www.hulu.com/watch/42024/saturday-night-live-countdown-with-keith-olbermann

    KalTorak on
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    NartwakNartwak Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    ronya wrote: »
    See sig.

    Hey everybody, let's listen to a Cato Institute wonk about political dogmatism.

    Nartwak on
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    IsidoreIsidore Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Nartwak wrote: »
    ronya wrote: »
    See sig.

    Hey everybody, let's listen to a Cato Institute wonk about political dogmatism.

    Pretty audacious to begin an article with
    The abysmal ignorance of the typical voter about politics and policy is by now pretty well-known, if not duly integrated into most theories of democracy.

    There aren't a lot more patently false things as that around nowadays.

    More poisonous than the news media is economic elites deciding on a whim that not only is everything within the sphere of economics (see "Freakonimics" and it's inexplicable success), but that they and they alone have exclusive knowledge of this arcane art (see "Freakonomics" and it's widespread hatred among economic elites).

    Isidore on
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    SkyGheNeSkyGheNe Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    I fucking LOVE Shepherd Smith. I have a lot of respect for him - while I may disagree with him sometimes, and believe him to lead with his questioning, I think he is by far THE most normal correspondent on Fox News.

    I have no clue how he keeps his job.

    WE DO NOT FUCKING TORTURE!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O6iV2IePH4

    Fox News Email Submissions are Insane
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxvunbIWNyI&feature=related

    Shepherd Smith Mocks Glenn Beck Openly
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6gyCBBRv9g

    SkyGheNe on
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    EnwolfEnwolf Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    SkyGheNe wrote: »
    I fucking LOVE Shepherd Smith. I have a lot of respect for him - while I may disagree with him sometimes, and believe him to lead with his questioning, I think he is by far THE most normal correspondent on Fox News.

    I have no clue how he keeps his job.

    *snip*

    Whats this? Fox news anchor who I don't immediately hate and despise...saying...sane sounding stuff. I'm not sure how to react to this

    *edit* LOL at the glen beck mockery. Fear Chamber, zany camera, "begrudged" this is gold right here. How dose this man still have a job? Must be blackmail, must be.

    Enwolf on
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    HozHoz Cool Cat Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    If he had terrible ratings they would get rid of him in an instant. But he doesn't, so they don't care.

    Hoz on
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Nartwak wrote: »
    ronya wrote: »
    See sig.

    Hey everybody, let's listen to a Cato Institute wonk about political dogmatism.

    Heh. That particular observation I quoted is still right, though.
    Isidore wrote: »
    Pretty audacious to begin an article with
    The abysmal ignorance of the typical voter about politics and policy is by now pretty well-known, if not duly integrated into most theories of democracy.

    There aren't a lot more patently false things as that around nowadays.

    You ever hear of the polls asking Americans how much foreign aid the US gives? To who? Or how much welfare spending the US has? Which social classes receive it? How much taxes each group pays? What the names, parties, or policies of their own Senators, Representative, and state governor are (never mind those of any other state or district)? Or simpler, concrete things like: how many people are there in the United States? Compared to Mexico and Canada? Compared to Europe? Compared to China? No need to give accurate answers here, just a rank ordering will do.

    And, of course, this isn't unique to the US; in practice most people around the world know relatively little about policy; people elsewhere just know a bit more about nearby countries whilst Americans know a bit more about nearby states. Also Americans don't typically have to worry about other countries, while everyone else has to worry about the US.

    That (1) the public knows little about policy and (2) that they, frankly, have no incentive to do so is solidly established in political science. The academic observation (for example) that the American public knows little about what their Congresscritters are up to dates back to 1962. Note that this doesn't yet say anything about the effectiveness of democracy; many theories of democracy just invoke assorted averaging mechanisms to explain why voters nonetheless choose somewhat sane representatives who do know things about policy. Which they do, in real life. That is the puzzle for political science to resolve.

    But in the meanwhile, it is still true the typical voter knows little about politics and policy. Wilkinson could have phrased it more delicately, to be sure.

    ronya on
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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    JebusUD wrote: »
    Also, Joe Scarborough is pretty dece. Sounds like a reasonable man to me.

    You mean Mr. Dead Girl? I bet he's thankful for Nancy Grace and Gary Condit.

    AngelHedgie on
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    LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    ronya wrote: »
    Nartwak wrote: »
    ronya wrote: »
    See sig.

    Hey everybody, let's listen to a Cato Institute wonk about political dogmatism.

    Heh. That particular observation I quoted is still right, though.
    Isidore wrote: »
    Pretty audacious to begin an article with
    The abysmal ignorance of the typical voter about politics and policy is by now pretty well-known, if not duly integrated into most theories of democracy.

    There aren't a lot more patently false things as that around nowadays.

    You ever hear of the polls asking Americans how much foreign aid the US gives? To who? Or how much welfare spending the US has? Which social classes receive it? How much taxes each group pays? What the names, parties, or policies of their own Senators, Representative, and state governor are (never mind those of any other state or district)? Or simpler, concrete things like: how many people are there in the United States? Compared to Mexico and Canada? Compared to Europe? Compared to China? No need to give accurate answers here, just a rank ordering will do.

    And, of course, this isn't unique to the US; in practice most people around the world know relatively little about policy; people elsewhere just know a bit more about nearby countries whilst Americans know a bit more about nearby states. Also Americans don't typically have to worry about other countries, while everyone else has to worry about the US.

    That (1) the public knows little about policy and (2) that they, frankly, have no incentive to do so is solidly established in political science. The academic observation (for example) that the American public knows little about what their Congresscritters are up to dates back to 1962. Note that this doesn't yet say anything about the effectiveness of democracy; many theories of democracy just invoke assorted averaging mechanisms to explain why voters nonetheless choose somewhat sane representatives who do know things about policy. Which they do, in real life. That is the puzzle for political science to resolve.

    But in the meanwhile, it is still true the typical voter knows little about politics and policy. Wilkinson could have phrased it more delicately, to be sure.

    Yes, if you ignore that the modern American populace, and the populace of most developed nations, is now more politically knowledgeable about more political issues than at any time in history and use an arbitrary standard for political savvy that the average citizen has never met, ever, then you can continue to paint the average voter as a knuckle-dragging moron.

    And the phrase "Congresscritter" continues to annoy the everloving fuck out of me, but that's neither here nor there.

    Lawndart on
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    JebusUD wrote: »
    Also, Joe Scarborough is pretty dece. Sounds like a reasonable man to me.

    You mean Mr. Dead Girl? I bet he's thankful for Nancy Grace and Gary Condit.

    See, he's a Republican. And they talk about morals all the time, so they must be moral themselves. Obviously.

    This is the second most infuriating double standard in the news media.

    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Hoz wrote: »
    If he had terrible ratings they would get rid of him in an instant. But he doesn't, so they don't care.

    It's true that Shep Smith is one of the highest-rated newscasters. But, possibly more importantly, he apparently signed a three-year contract with Fox in late 2007. So his contract hasn't expired yet.

    I note that Smith unexpectedly backed the public option and has other, recent fights with his fellow conservative pundits over his mentioning of the Homeland Security warning about violent right-wing groups.

    We'll see what happens once the contract expires.

    ronya on
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    wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    JebusUD wrote: »
    Also, Joe Scarborough is pretty dece. Sounds like a reasonable man to me.

    You mean Mr. Dead Girl? I bet he's thankful for Nancy Grace and Gary Condit.

    That issue aside, Scarborough is a thin-skinned, loud talking bully who doesn't have the chops to go toe to toe with someone who doesn't buy or put up with his shit. Maddow made a fucking habit of destroying him and leaving him sputtering during the 2008 election cycle. This is why his show is a haven for beltway pundits and Washington elites, and why people like Maddow who have the gall to call him on his bullshit never appear on the show for long. Also, the fucker keeps Pat Buchanan on TV and his co-host Mika is the weakest female on MSNBC.

    wwtMask on
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Yes, if you ignore that the modern American populace, and the populace of most developed nations, is now more politically knowledgeable about more political issues than at any time in history and use an arbitrary standard for political savvy that the average citizen has never met, ever, then you can continue to paint the average voter as a knuckle-dragging moron.

    And the phrase "Congresscritter" continues to annoy the everloving fuck out of me, but that's neither here nor there.

    The point is that average citizens are currently ignorant given the issues we ask of them, not that they are less ignorant than they used to be (which may or may not be true, I have frankly no idea). The standard of "what policies did your senators support" is not an unreasonably high or arbitrary demand, but it is still the case that most Americans would fail it.

    I don't really like "Congresscritter" either, to be honest, but Congressman seems gender-biased and Congressperson reads awkwardly to me.

    ronya on
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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    wwtMask wrote: »
    JebusUD wrote: »
    Also, Joe Scarborough is pretty dece. Sounds like a reasonable man to me.

    You mean Mr. Dead Girl? I bet he's thankful for Nancy Grace and Gary Condit.

    That issue aside, Scarborough is a thin-skinned, loud talking bully who doesn't have the chops to go toe to toe with someone who doesn't buy or put up with his shit. Maddow made a fucking habit of destroying him and leaving him sputtering during the 2008 election cycle. This is why his show is a haven for beltway pundits and Washington elites, and why people like Maddow who have the gall to call him on his bullshit never appear on the show for long. Also, the fucker keeps Pat Buchanan on TV and his co-host Mika is the weakest female on MSNBC.

    He's the reason that Kos is banned from MSNBC.

    AngelHedgie on
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    NartwakNartwak Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    ronya wrote: »
    Heh. That particular observation I quoted is still right, though.

    Woah, sorry about the sniping. I'm just enjoying a professional ideologue lecturing about the need for self-awareness among opinion pushers about their tendencies toward dogmatism. It's like seeing a rare animal in its natural habitat run into something.
    The point is that average citizens are currently ignorant given the issues we ask of them,
    Possibly, but where do the average citizen and the average voter intersect?

    Nartwak on
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Nartwak wrote: »
    ronya wrote: »
    Heh. That particular observation I quoted is still right, though.

    Woah, sorry about the sniping. I'm just enjoying a professional ideologue lecturing about the need for self-awareness among opinion pushers about their tendencies toward dogmatism. It's like seeing a rare animal in its natural habitat run into something.

    Yeah, it's cool. Wilkinson is aware of the irony, I presume -
    The problem is heightened by the fact that the reading public generally enjoys ideologues more than three-handed scholars, and so the more ideological among ideologues find themselves with larger audiences and more numerous and remunerative opportunities to publicly opine. What results is not so much an exercise in public reason as a smash-em-up reputation derby, where elites vie to increase their pull with the public and policymakers by disparaging ideological competitors. Moves in the reputation game take many forms, from sniffs of imperious condescension, to bald “stupidest man alive” name-calling, to self-congratulatory above-the-fray comments like this one. There is no reason to trust that this is a process through which truth unfolds.

    ...

    (P.S.: Floundering ideologues would deploy the pathetic weapon of epistemic humility in a flailing attempt to lay low the splendid blond beasts dominating the reputation derby, now wouldn’t they?)

    Italics added. The postscript makes it all rather meta.
    Nartwak wrote: »
    The point is that average citizens are currently ignorant given the issues we ask of them,
    Possibly, but where do the average citizen and the average voter intersect?

    If you're asking whether the average voter is more aware than the average citizen, my impression of the literature is that the answer is "generally no", particularly for higher, more publicised elections like general elections and presidential primaries and less so for state and other regional elections. Presumably, people who vote in the latter have to know about them, and thereby more likely about the issues involved. But for the major elections, ignorance and turnout seem only distantly related.

    ronya on
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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    I feel 100% ashamed of myself for not including Shep Smith in the OP, that guy is a champion. Like, he still has political views different than myself in general, but he refuses to sign on with the hyperbolic bullshit his colleagues are paid to do. Which causes me to probably overreact in how much respect I have for him.

    Henroid on
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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Apropos of nothing: Henroid, when did you inserting random links in your posts to underscore sarcasm? :P

    I'm decently certain I've seen that practice before on a prominent site elsewhere, but I can't remember which one.

    ronya on
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    NartwakNartwak Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    ronya wrote: »
    Yeah, it's cool. Wilkinson is aware of the irony, I presume -
    Oh, I noticed that italicized part to be sure. I missed the post script though.
    If you're asking whether the average voter is more aware than the average citizen, my impression of the literature is that the answer is "generally no", particularly for higher, more publicised elections like general elections and presidential primaries and less so for state and other regional elections. Presumably, people who vote in the latter have to know about them, and thereby more likely about the issues involved. But for the major elections, ignorance and turnout seem only distantly related.

    Yes, my theory was that the truly careless or gormless wouldn't be inclined to know about the election in the first, or even find the polling station should that they should. Thus self-selecting themselves from the voters pool.

    Nartwak on
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    Bionic MonkeyBionic Monkey Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2010
    I've been listening to the audio-only Countdown podcast for the last couple of weeks, and Olberman has really toned down the "angry liberal" shtick since the Bush administration. Whatever flipped in his head a few years back to turn that on full blast has apparently been put back away.

    Bionic Monkey on
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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    ronya wrote: »
    Apropos of nothing: Henroid, when did you inserting random links in your posts to underscore sarcasm? :P

    I'm decently certain I've seen that practice before on a prominent site elsewhere, but I can't remember which one.

    This is the first time I've done it for any long-winded post. <_<

    And I got the idea from Encyclopedia Dramatica (NOTE: that site is insanely NSFW so visit it at your own risk).

    Henroid on
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    RustRust __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2010
    wwtMask wrote: »
    JebusUD wrote: »
    Also, Joe Scarborough is pretty dece. Sounds like a reasonable man to me.

    You mean Mr. Dead Girl? I bet he's thankful for Nancy Grace and Gary Condit.

    That issue aside, Scarborough is a thin-skinned, loud talking bully who doesn't have the chops to go toe to toe with someone who doesn't buy or put up with his shit. Maddow made a fucking habit of destroying him and leaving him sputtering during the 2008 election cycle. This is why his show is a haven for beltway pundits and Washington elites, and why people like Maddow who have the gall to call him on his bullshit never appear on the show for long. Also, the fucker keeps Pat Buchanan on TV and his co-host Mika is the weakest female on MSNBC.

    there was the time when mika snatched a particularly inane portion of their script from one of the other newscasters and set it on fire

    unfortunately there was no maniacal laughter during this, so i give the act a C at best

    Rust on
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    DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Shep is the only guy on Fox who claims to be an independent, that I haven't felt is being somewhat dishonest about it. Used to watch Studio B for laughs during lunch breaks.

    Dehumanized on
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    HozHoz Cool Cat Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    He makes the best remarks to off-screen producers that we can't hear. He was genetically bred for newscasting.

    Hoz on
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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Hoz wrote: »
    He makes the best remarks to off-screen producers that we can't hear. He was genetically bred for newscasting.

    The idea of selective breeding for newscasters is hilarious.

    Henroid on
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    HozHoz Cool Cat Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Why do you think they made him gay?

    They want to keep the brand secure.

    Hoz on
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    ApollohApolloh Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Shep Smith: We have the twelve principles and the nine things, and the fear chamber and the whole darn thing.

    Pure gold.

    Apolloh on
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    DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SrTZSsNd60&feature=related

    Some of the footage that Shep did while covering the recent OJ trial is hilarious. I can't remember when it happened, but once when I was watching he started talking about how tired he is of OJ and that he wishes they'd just make another Naked Gun movie.


    edit: It's at around 5:20

    Dehumanized on
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    I now love Shep Smith even more. That was totally "This is the stupidest thing you people have ever made me do so I refuse to be serious about this crap". It's good to know he thinks it's as dumb as we do.

    shryke on
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    Man in the MistsMan in the Mists Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    :!:

    Enlightenedbum, if you make a full media Phalla, you could have Shep Smith be a conservative-only voterbomb.

    Man in the Mists on
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    frandelgearslipfrandelgearslip 457670Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Wow I knew fox and friends is bad, but jesus christ. I mean that is some 1850's racist ideals when you are against race mixing with the Irish and the Italians.

    My biggest problem is people who hate O'Reilly and then in the same breath praise Olbermann. They are the same guy. The reason Olbermann hates O'Reilly is that O'Reilly thinks he, Bill O'Reilly, is the center of the universe and Olbermann knows that is not true, because he, Keith Olbermann, is the actual center of the universe.

    I once watched Olbermann crow on air about how he beat O'reilly in the ratings during the 8:30-9:00 portion of his show on the east coast with Viewers 23-29 and he was completely serious.

    I also read a book about the history of ESPN that included an interview with Olbermann where Olbermann attributed all the success of ESPN to himself.

    frandelgearslip on
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    RaynagaRaynaga Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    To this day I love "I'm not in the fear chamber, that's what I put people in.

    "Oh."

    "Yeah, I'm in the doom room."

    Wow.

    Raynaga on
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    GoslingGosling Looking Up Soccer In Mongolia Right Now, Probably Watertown, WIRegistered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Question: would it be better to get Shep out of there and onto, say, CNN, where he can concentrate more on actual reporting, or would it be better to keep him on Fox News so there's at least one guy over there who's sane?

    Gosling on
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