Spawnbroker gets mad props for experimenting on me with baneling busts. I think I finally have the counter down to it (hellions) to withstand it if scouted.
But I am slowly learning that a) marauders don't get used much anymore in large numbers and b) zerg apparently don't use roaches much anymore. I am starting to have to use things like thors.
He should be busting before you get much out of a factory. How you setup your wall is a bigger factor in countering busts.
The hellions come out as the bust comes. And this is at the 5-6 minute mark anyway.
For what you were attempting to do, you were doing it awfully slowly. If that guy wasnt teching and did a tri-barracks marine rush you wouldve been screwed within the first five to six minutes. I think any rush by any of the races wouldve taken you out without much effort. You have to build some D, ACTUALLY wall off your base (there was a huge hole), and maybe plop one bunker. If youre not going to do that, at least get one or two siege tanks to intimidate any would be aggressors while you tech up.
Notice that he expanded rather quickly. I don't know why you didnt do the same. If you're going to go past tier one on unit building and plan to go into later game unit trees you have to expand to support the resource load. And you didnt do that until after you had made that first push.
Question: Did you know that he was going to mass Viks? Or if you didnt know about the vikings, did you at least see the rapid building of starports? Because if you saw either of those things, im not sure why you didnt build an Engineering bay and plop down like three AA turrets. Sure, the Vikings can land and disable them, but then youre forcing him to go to the ground so your Marauders can eat them up.
Theres alot of things that the red player did totally wrong. He didnt utilize the massive amounts of resources he had until it was too late, and he build the wrong counter to your setup. A combination of like four vikings and mass banshees wouldve eaten your army for breakfast. And if you look at the replay, he had the resources to do exactly that and decided Viking mass was the way to go.
There are things you did well. Stimpack research is key and you kept your dropships alive quite well. You took advantage of his terrible awful micro (He retreated his Vikings right across your stimmed marines for some reason) and annihilated his Viking squads when you had the opportunity to do so, and your macro was realtively good. You never piled up resources apart from Vespene, but your setup wasnt really Vespene intensive.
Things i would recommend? Get some damage upgrades during the game, if researched your stimmed up marines and marauders are just that much more deadly and the cost is equal to one Medivac. Expand more as i said above. Expand expand expand. Unless you absolutely need a couple more units to complete that rush/push whatever, use those 400 minerals to build an expansion and get to work mining more shit.
then you would know the paradise of not having to put up with tribulations of terran. no probes attacking your scvs while theyre building is only the start
Its so fucking dumb how much of an uphill battle TvP is for T no matter what. 5 straight losses and I can't do a damned thing about it. Mech is so immobile that they get carriers and T has NOTHING that can deal with them effectively. [Vikings only work if they have <5 carriers.]
Edit: Also, I think the stats for race % by player or whatever is skewed because it takes in to account leagues other than plat/diamond. I fight literally 70% protoss.
Its so fucking dumb how much of an uphill battle TvP is for T no matter what. 5 straight losses and I can't do a damned thing about it. Mech is so immobile that they get carriers and T has NOTHING that can deal with them effectively. [Vikings only work if they have <5 carriers.]
Edit: Also, I think the stats for race % by player or whatever is skewed because it takes in to account leagues other than plat/diamond. I fight literally 70% protoss.
If the toss has time to get carrier you are doing something horribly horribly wrong.
Okay guys, please watch this replay and tell me what I could have done differently. I know I made a myriad of mistakes on the macro level, but what I'm really looking for is a good strategy for what to do when a Terran does this.
He tried to move his original base to the gold minerals to start out, but died to my initial ling rush. Then he picks up all his buildings and moves to the south island where he turtles and builds anti-air for the entire game. I eventually won due to sheer macro power from having unlimited bases, but WTF can I do to end this quicker...broodlords? I don't know.
Its so fucking dumb how much of an uphill battle TvP is for T no matter what. 5 straight losses and I can't do a damned thing about it. Mech is so immobile that they get carriers and T has NOTHING that can deal with them effectively. [Vikings only work if they have <5 carriers.]
Edit: Also, I think the stats for race % by player or whatever is skewed because it takes in to account leagues other than plat/diamond. I fight literally 70% protoss.
If the toss has time to get carrier you are doing something horribly horribly wrong.
I can't push with ghost mech because it's extremely easy to fight back. If he never attacks me, he wins.
Edit: Two cannons in every line nullifies any harass I could ever do.
How do you guys remind yourselves to keep building SCV's / etc? I keep...getting carried away (.
This is hard to do at first. A couple days ago my brother pointed out that I don't build enough probes. I ended up forcing myself even when I thought "oh man but then I won't have enough offense/defense!" It has always worked out.
It just takes practice and forcing yourself to do it. Hot key your CC/Nexus/Hatchery and just go to town.
Want to watch two noobs slap fighting like silly girls?
The worst part is when he says how good I am. I cringe inside because I know I'm doing so many things wrong. Like letting my resources build to a million. But I just don't have the dexterity to keep up with things yet.
I think we both had fun at least.
Drool on
0
MaratastikJust call me Mara, please!Registered Userregular
edited July 2010
Oh, god. I just got promoted to rank 7 diamond. I'm screwed.
Want to watch two noobs slap fighting like silly girls?
The worst part is when he says how good I am. I cringe inside because I know I'm doing so many things wrong. Like letting my resources build to a million. But I just don't have the dexterity to keep up with things yet.
I think we both had fun at least.
I'd just like to correct you on something. He said "dam your good". It's obvious he was asking you to DAM (hold back) your GOOD (apparently your skill). It was a friendly request not to be so good at the game, and you missed it!
...or maybe he just doesn't know the difference between "your " and "you're". *shrugs*
That is... let's see... not enough for 4 bases, right? So, it's not enough.
Not sure I was ever at 4 non-depleted bases, though. And one was a gold. I suppose having only ~80 food worth of army isn't so bad when you're Protoss with ~10 warpgates and can replace half your army every 10 seconds.
I really hope this guy rage logged hard after this.
That guy was pretty dumb. I can't believe he just kept trying to baneling bust you over and over again. He could have backed off and teched up and made it a fight after the first try.
I cannot count the number of times I have done something terribly wrong or stupid and been in a situation where I should've lost, only to be able to bring back a win just by sheer force of Macro that FE allows.
That is... let's see... not enough for 4 bases, right? So, it's not enough.
Not sure I was ever at 4 non-depleted bases, though. And one was a gold. I suppose having only ~80 food worth of army isn't so bad when you're Protoss with ~10 warpgates and can replace half your army every 10 seconds.
What you do in that situation is keep building workers, expand everywhere, and build nuclear silos.
Make three ghosts and run around the map nuking shit. Fly your command centers around to create the illusion of not being anywhere at once.
Or if youre Protoss, make Mothership. Commence laughing.
Z v P, I harassed with some fast lings while building a roach den and building up a force of roaches while he built up a small army of zealots in order to counter the zerglings, I sent in 7 but I was able to micro my way to victory against his superior zealot force, all the while I started pouring zerlings into his base and he GG'd.
Second one was pretty boring, I let him think he had the advantage and then moved a bunch of lings that were hidden and destroyed his roaches while my roaches fought them off.
Third match I was quite proud of myself,
I successfully harrassed with banelings, a nydus cannal in his main base. He never made an expansion past his natural, while I tried to get him to attack me by sending small attack waves. Eventually he bought it, and he microed his roaches very well, but in the end I just had more hydras. Oh, and then I brought in some Ultralisks to finish the job
Fourth match, I got 6 pooled!
He had 6 lings in my base before my queen came out. Had it been a smaller map I would have lost for sure. However, I was able to use my workers to defeat him, although I lost my Queen in the process. I then used hometown advantage to build up a few zerglings and spine crawlers. His economy was dreadful, so I had a real advantage. After 3 small attacks that I was barely able to fend off thanks to my drones, I finally got a Roach Warren down and then fought off his final large attack, and sent my roaches with zergling escorts to his base. They arrived just as his Roach Warren had finished building, and he left the game shortly after I destroyed it. He didn't even have an extractor to build roaches out of .
Anyone for some games? I'd like to try Protoss out, but I don't want to wreck my rating. My code thing is..
Posts
but the campaign was almost solely terran missions
sooo
I'm getting PvP most of the time.
Guess how often I get 2 gated or 2 gate proxied.
The hellions come out as the bust comes. And this is at the 5-6 minute mark anyway.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
Because Mass thors+hellions is insane. I don't even know how to deal with it as zerg. Like it is seriously raping me.
3DS Code: 5043-2172-1361
Xbone Tag: Salal al Din
Ditto. If I don't win in the first 8 minutes, I am fucked. I cannot crack Terran mech as Zerg.
For what you were attempting to do, you were doing it awfully slowly. If that guy wasnt teching and did a tri-barracks marine rush you wouldve been screwed within the first five to six minutes. I think any rush by any of the races wouldve taken you out without much effort. You have to build some D, ACTUALLY wall off your base (there was a huge hole), and maybe plop one bunker. If youre not going to do that, at least get one or two siege tanks to intimidate any would be aggressors while you tech up.
Notice that he expanded rather quickly. I don't know why you didnt do the same. If you're going to go past tier one on unit building and plan to go into later game unit trees you have to expand to support the resource load. And you didnt do that until after you had made that first push.
Question: Did you know that he was going to mass Viks? Or if you didnt know about the vikings, did you at least see the rapid building of starports? Because if you saw either of those things, im not sure why you didnt build an Engineering bay and plop down like three AA turrets. Sure, the Vikings can land and disable them, but then youre forcing him to go to the ground so your Marauders can eat them up.
Theres alot of things that the red player did totally wrong. He didnt utilize the massive amounts of resources he had until it was too late, and he build the wrong counter to your setup. A combination of like four vikings and mass banshees wouldve eaten your army for breakfast. And if you look at the replay, he had the resources to do exactly that and decided Viking mass was the way to go.
There are things you did well. Stimpack research is key and you kept your dropships alive quite well. You took advantage of his terrible awful micro (He retreated his Vikings right across your stimmed marines for some reason) and annihilated his Viking squads when you had the opportunity to do so, and your macro was realtively good. You never piled up resources apart from Vespene, but your setup wasnt really Vespene intensive.
Things i would recommend? Get some damage upgrades during the game, if researched your stimmed up marines and marauders are just that much more deadly and the cost is equal to one Medivac. Expand more as i said above. Expand expand expand. Unless you absolutely need a couple more units to complete that rush/push whatever, use those 400 minerals to build an expansion and get to work mining more shit.
XBLGT:Banzeye SC2: Apollo.394
tia blizz
then you would know the paradise of not having to put up with tribulations of terran. no probes attacking your scvs while theyre building is only the start
I bought the game to play with Thors.
Edit: Also, I think the stats for race % by player or whatever is skewed because it takes in to account leagues other than plat/diamond. I fight literally 70% protoss.
So far every game against zerg they have tried a super early pool. Every time I just counter with hellions and win it really early.
If the toss has time to get carrier you are doing something horribly horribly wrong.
He tried to move his original base to the gold minerals to start out, but died to my initial ling rush. Then he picks up all his buildings and moves to the south island where he turtles and builds anti-air for the entire game. I eventually won due to sheer macro power from having unlimited bases, but WTF can I do to end this quicker...broodlords? I don't know.
[URL="[url=http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=download&id=134588][img]http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-134588.jpg[/img][/url]"][/url]
I tried to use the tips you guys graciously gave + Stoked is good and we took on some folk.
They massed Zealots and tried to end us and got pinched in between our two forces..they waited waaaaaaaay too long to attack.
Good stuff.
How do you guys remind yourselves to keep building SCV's / etc? I keep...getting carried away
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
I can't push with ghost mech because it's extremely easy to fight back. If he never attacks me, he wins.
Edit: Two cannons in every line nullifies any harass I could ever do.
This is hard to do at first. A couple days ago my brother pointed out that I don't build enough probes. I ended up forcing myself even when I thought "oh man but then I won't have enough offense/defense!" It has always worked out.
It just takes practice and forcing yourself to do it. Hot key your CC/Nexus/Hatchery and just go to town.
once you pop you just can't stop
The worst part is when he says how good I am. I cringe inside because I know I'm doing so many things wrong. Like letting my resources build to a million. But I just don't have the dexterity to keep up with things yet.
I think we both had fun at least.
XBLGT:Banzeye SC2: Apollo.394
I really hope this guy rage logged hard after this.
I'd just like to correct you on something. He said "dam your good". It's obvious he was asking you to DAM (hold back) your GOOD (apparently your skill). It was a friendly request not to be so good at the game, and you missed it!
...or maybe he just doesn't know the difference between "your " and "you're". *shrugs*
-Z
I think that was too many.
Nvm, it was actually easy to stop and I was just dumb.
He built a pylon in my base and instantly started making photon cannons, I shouldve used my SCVs to kill the probe as soon as he put the pylon down.
Ugh.
Do people have FUN getting easy wins like that, that will only work on noobs? Like, whats the point?
That is... let's see... not enough for 4 bases, right? So, it's not enough.
Figures.
That guy was pretty dumb. I can't believe he just kept trying to baneling bust you over and over again. He could have backed off and teched up and made it a fight after the first try.
I cannot count the number of times I have done something terribly wrong or stupid and been in a situation where I should've lost, only to be able to bring back a win just by sheer force of Macro that FE allows.
What you do in that situation is keep building workers, expand everywhere, and build nuclear silos.
Make three ghosts and run around the map nuking shit. Fly your command centers around to create the illusion of not being anywhere at once.
Or if youre Protoss, make Mothership. Commence laughing.
XBLGT:Banzeye SC2: Apollo.394
PSN: Robo_Wizard1
"Im bad at all of them so obviously it is Blizzards fault. Why cant my Zealots have shields and range with a possibility to CC?"
XBLGT:Banzeye SC2: Apollo.394
I know I have things to work on, sure, but that pales in comparison to how gay your race is.
They blame units if it's a mirror match.
Look, all I'm saying is every single ZvZ I've been in, Zerg has won. I don't know the official numbers, but clearly, Zerg needs a nerf.
Blaming, like, Protoss, Terran, and Zerg, or are they blaming Jews or black people or something? Because I could see it going either way.
First one was pretty awesome!
Second one was pretty boring, I let him think he had the advantage and then moved a bunch of lings that were hidden and destroyed his roaches while my roaches fought them off.
Third match I was quite proud of myself,
Fourth match, I got 6 pooled!
Anyone for some games? I'd like to try Protoss out, but I don't want to wreck my rating. My code thing is..
Brendan.121