0Replace4DisplaceThe best girls are ships and guns.Registered Userregular
edited August 2010
So after being away from my PC from launch day until today and just having it installed, I played my first MP game and won after not having played an RTS since WC3 five years ago.
I know the extractor steal at the beginning was pointless, that's not what I'm concerned about. They very second he can plant a tank at the bottom of my ramp, game is over.
Don't even need help, it's just bad micro as usual, hold position seems to be ignored all the time, barely outmacroing even though he's on one base, also par for the course. Prolly shoulda gone roaches, but I thought he was gonna have a ton of marauders, and they tend to rip my roaches to shit. I thought I could sneak in when they were unsieged and some space to maneuver...got that the first time. By then another one coming setup and I got locked in. Thought I might try dropping in on his tanks, but OL's were wandering because I was too concerned about hydras ignoring hold position. Infuriating.
The range on those motherfuckers is ginormous. I mean really? REALLY it needs to be that big?
You made a lot of mistakes, and could have beaten him. You floated a LOT of minerals.
First, your baneling bust was amazingly successful. If you had just pumped lings at him following that I doubt he could have fought it off efficiently.
Second, I disagree with you having gone hydras over mutas. Yes, he had marines, if you had gone mutas earlier I believe you would have been able to pull it off.
Third, roaches+burrow move=results. He had no raven, and only a limited number of scans. Theres literally no way he could have beaten that from what I saw. He was marine heavy over marauders, and you would have moved into the tanks deadzone.
Fourth, plant a couple banelings at your ramp as land mines. Take out those marines and the tanks are nothing.
I also think you could have expanded earlier considering your money.
Every time I've gotten greedy after busts in past I lose, so I just use it for early scouting and trying to get a foot in on econ. Not every time, but only vs bad players does it end the game for me.
Thanks for the tips snuggles.
Ezekiel on
I will throw you on the land and hurl you on the open field. I will let all the birds of the air settle on you and all the beasts of the earth gorge themselves on you. I will spread your flesh on the mountains and fill the valleys with your remains. I will drench the land with your flowing blood all the way to the mountains, and the ravines will be filled with your flesh. - Ezekiel 32: 4-6
So don't tell anyone, but I finally actually made that timer app since I couldn't find the one that I've heard about before. Now, even though it's called "Zerg Timer", it's really just a generic timer that will play an audio file when it counts down to 0, with the option to repeat. So it's not really for helping Zerg players keep up on their larva production. It's just a timer, okay guys?
I'll stick with my droid app...which now plays day9's scream as the larva reminder.
Ezekiel on
I will throw you on the land and hurl you on the open field. I will let all the birds of the air settle on you and all the beasts of the earth gorge themselves on you. I will spread your flesh on the mountains and fill the valleys with your remains. I will drench the land with your flowing blood all the way to the mountains, and the ravines will be filled with your flesh. - Ezekiel 32: 4-6
So don't tell anyone, but I finally actually made that timer app since I couldn't find the one that I've heard about before. Now, even though it's called "Zerg Timer", it's really just a generic timer that will play an audio file when it counts down to 0, with the option to repeat. So it's not really for helping Zerg players keep up on their larva production. It's just a timer, okay guys?
Edit: You don't have to specify a sound file; I included a free sample from freesound.org.
You see, when I point to this kind of stuff as evidence that Starcraft's got a tonne of micromanagement in it, people just call me crazy. Because it's impossible that Starcraft is a micromanagement heavy game.
Ah well, guess I can use that for timing my SCV's.
I know the extractor steal at the beginning was pointless, that's not what I'm concerned about. They very second he can plant a tank at the bottom of my ramp, game is over.
Don't even need help, it's just bad micro as usual, hold position seems to be ignored all the time, barely outmacroing even though he's on one base, also par for the course. Prolly shoulda gone roaches, but I thought he was gonna have a ton of marauders, and they tend to rip my roaches to shit. I thought I could sneak in when they were unsieged and some space to maneuver...got that the first time. By then another one coming setup and I got locked in. Thought I might try dropping in on his tanks, but OL's were wandering because I was too concerned about hydras ignoring hold position. Infuriating.
The range on those motherfuckers is ginormous. I mean really? REALLY it needs to be that big?
you played inconsequentially.
the marine tank ball could have been put down by units you already could produce; lings and blings.
I'll stick with my droid app...which now plays day9's scream as the larva reminder.
Which app? I might have to download it myself!
Man I've told you about the app like 3x now. :P
Ezekiel on
I will throw you on the land and hurl you on the open field. I will let all the birds of the air settle on you and all the beasts of the earth gorge themselves on you. I will spread your flesh on the mountains and fill the valleys with your remains. I will drench the land with your flowing blood all the way to the mountains, and the ravines will be filled with your flesh. - Ezekiel 32: 4-6
I'll stick with my droid app...which now plays day9's scream as the larva reminder.
Which app? I might have to download it myself!
Man I've told you about the app like 3x now. :P
Ah, I didn't have the patience to figure out how to get a repeating timer going. Plus, I'd rather have an app on my desktop than my phone for this. To each his own?
I will throw you on the land and hurl you on the open field. I will let all the birds of the air settle on you and all the beasts of the earth gorge themselves on you. I will spread your flesh on the mountains and fill the valleys with your remains. I will drench the land with your flowing blood all the way to the mountains, and the ravines will be filled with your flesh. - Ezekiel 32: 4-6
So don't tell anyone, but I finally actually made that timer app since I couldn't find the one that I've heard about before. Now, even though it's called "Zerg Timer", it's really just a generic timer that will play an audio file when it counts down to 0, with the option to repeat. So it's not really for helping Zerg players keep up on their larva production. It's just a timer, okay guys?
No I'm not going try to delve into DirectX hooks. That would be just a bit out of my league at this point. Sorry, you'll have to alt-tab. Play windowed no border. :P
Scrolling is annoying in windowed mode, though! Waaaah. Oh well. Stupid mechanic should be autocast (so then the hatchery should just poop out more larva if you have a queen nearby!)...or I could learn2Count I guess.
Xeddicus on
"For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
Scrolling is annoying in windowed mode, though! Waaaah. Oh well. Stupid mechanic should be autocast (so then the hatchery should just poop out more larva if you have a queen nearby!)...or I could learn2Count I guess.
If you do windowed no border (basically full screen, but no minimizing when you alt tab) it shouldn't be a problem. I notice that sometimes my mouse leaves the window during the loading screens, but click outside the window and then back in fixes it.
So don't tell anyone, but I finally actually made that timer app since I couldn't find the one that I've heard about before. Now, even though it's called "Zerg Timer", it's really just a generic timer that will play an audio file when it counts down to 0, with the option to repeat. So it's not really for helping Zerg players keep up on their larva production. It's just a timer, okay guys?
There are too many damned ramps into bases. As a terran player, this is an advantage for me I think, but still.
Imagine a base that absolutely no choke whatsoever, then imagine you are a terran player, then imagine speedlings.
I think if there were a lot of maps like this terrans would scream at how overpowered zerg is. I almost feel like making a map like this just to see how it would play out.
If it were exclusively open I would agree; but it's not.
And even if every base needs choke points, some of them could be on flat ground, for example. SC1 had plenty of those maps as I recall.
I know at least one map has them on flat ground, lost temple i believe or is it kulas ravine? I always get the two confused, but yeah it has the choke on flat ground
CasedOut on
0
0Replace4DisplaceThe best girls are ships and guns.Registered Userregular
edited August 2010
As Terran, what effective ways (if any) besides scanning are there to counter cloaked units if you're running an infantry build?
As Terran, what effective ways (if any) besides scanning are there to counter cloaked units if you're running an infantry build?
Throw up some turrets, or rush for Ravens. Scanning is the only mobile choice until Ravens. Against DTs, you should probably throw them up in 2s, since the DTs kill Turrets so fast.
Last night, played a PvP where he attempted to 2 gate zealot rush me. I forget which map it was, one of the new 4 player maps. I had just managed to get stalkers out and managed to fend him off. After I killed off his last zealot I noticed he started building cannons in my base o_O. So, I kill this silly goose's cannons and pylons and build up a little, after his next wave of zealots (why would you send more zealots against stalkers?) it was just a walk across the map to mop up his base.
I just dont understand how after a failed 2gate zealot rush it would seem like a good time to try to cannon push inside my base.
Last night, played a PvP where he attempted to 2 gate zealot rush me. I forget which map it was, one of the new 4 player maps. I had just managed to get stalkers out and managed to fend him off. After I killed off his last zealot I noticed he started building cannons in my base o_O. So, I kill this silly goose's cannons and pylons and build up a little, after his next wave of zealots (why would you send more zealots against stalkers?) it was just a walk across the map to mop up his base.
I just dont understand how after a failed 2gate zealot rush it would seem like a good time to try to cannon push inside my base.
Desperate times call for desperate measures. The guy just had poor decision making on what to do next is all.
I need some way to start that timer when my queen comes out.
Like Exo said, use windowed mode non-fullscreen. If it's set at your monitor's resolution it'll still be full screen, but you can alt tab to bring a window up. So just start the timer program up, start the game, then quickly hit alt-tab and start timer when your queen comes out and minimize the program. Only takes a second.
Or Exo could look into a "keep this window on top" toggle.
Xeddicus on
"For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
As Terran, what effective ways (if any) besides scanning are there to counter cloaked units if you're running an infantry build?
Throw up some turrets, or rush for Ravens. Scanning is the only mobile choice until Ravens. Against DTs, you should probably throw them up in 2s, since the DTs kill Turrets so fast.
so random just means you play mirror matches apparently. 3 ZvZs in a row and a TvT. was hoping to play a ZvT.
anyway i havent lost with 1 base roach build in ZvZ yet. if he expands he always loses
Man I cannot get a handle on Zerg. So much minerals just sitting around doing nothing every game. Are you supposed to multiple-hive like in SC1? Or am I just not larvae spawning enough?
so random just means you play mirror matches apparently. 3 ZvZs in a row and a TvT. was hoping to play a ZvT.
anyway i havent lost with 1 base roach build in ZvZ yet. if he expands he always loses
Man I cannot get a handle on Zerg. So much minerals just sitting around doing nothing every game. Are you supposed to multiple-hive like in SC1? Or am I just not larvae spawning enough?
If you even have to ask that question then you're not larva spawning enough. You should be doing it 100% of the time.
I know the extractor steal at the beginning was pointless, that's not what I'm concerned about. They very second he can plant a tank at the bottom of my ramp, game is over.
Don't even need help, it's just bad micro as usual, hold position seems to be ignored all the time, barely outmacroing even though he's on one base, also par for the course. Prolly shoulda gone roaches, but I thought he was gonna have a ton of marauders, and they tend to rip my roaches to shit. I thought I could sneak in when they were unsieged and some space to maneuver...got that the first time. By then another one coming setup and I got locked in. Thought I might try dropping in on his tanks, but OL's were wandering because I was too concerned about hydras ignoring hold position. Infuriating.
The range on those motherfuckers is ginormous. I mean really? REALLY it needs to be that big?
I'm more of a terran player so I paid more attention to what he was doing and I'm actually surprised he won. I'm WAY more efficient than he is yet I lose quite a bit (gold league). He scouted with at 10, built a rax at around 11 then stayed max at 11 supply for a bit because he went rax first, he then had to pull another svc off the minerals to build the first supply depot so he's tying up 3 SVC early on when it should be 2.
His wall didn't look tight, or at least it's noth how i would've built my wall. He also didn't do too great when you popped his wall open, he should've pulled 2-3 svc's to repair as soon as you showed up. I've almost go to the point where I put 3 on their on control group early on just for this purpose. With marines attacking and the SVCs negating or at least severly hampering your attack on the supply depots he shouldn't have lost anything. Terran's greatest advantage is the wall in and the fact that all their early combat units are range where zerg and protoss have melee.
He was marine heavy which maybe was an advantage for him, I tend to pump 1 maruader per every 2 marines myself, but that may not be better.
Basically I typically have a comparable force 4 minutes faster than he does and I'll still get my ass kicked.
edit: I'll be at 10 minutes in and BAM a roving pack of Mutas comes knocking on my mineral line and I've at best got 1 turret on either end, so they find a hole or they focus fire on one and then it's open buffet.
I'm then trying to move my marines over through my base to cover it. I've not got them in a separate control group so my maruaders and my 1 or 2 tanks try to come too. It's a mess.
Posts
yesss
You made a lot of mistakes, and could have beaten him. You floated a LOT of minerals.
First, your baneling bust was amazingly successful. If you had just pumped lings at him following that I doubt he could have fought it off efficiently.
Second, I disagree with you having gone hydras over mutas. Yes, he had marines, if you had gone mutas earlier I believe you would have been able to pull it off.
Third, roaches+burrow move=results. He had no raven, and only a limited number of scans. Theres literally no way he could have beaten that from what I saw. He was marine heavy over marauders, and you would have moved into the tanks deadzone.
Fourth, plant a couple banelings at your ramp as land mines. Take out those marines and the tanks are nothing.
I also think you could have expanded earlier considering your money.
Thanks for the tips snuggles.
http://exosquad.net/zergtimer/zergtimer.zip
Edit: You don't have to specify a sound file; I included a free sample from freesound.org.
Also it requires .Net 3.5 installed, but if you don't have it installed already you should probably upgrade from Windows 98.
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
Jerk.
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
You see, when I point to this kind of stuff as evidence that Starcraft's got a tonne of micromanagement in it, people just call me crazy. Because it's impossible that Starcraft is a micromanagement heavy game.
Ah well, guess I can use that for timing my SCV's.
*click download*
you played inconsequentially.
the marine tank ball could have been put down by units you already could produce; lings and blings.
Which app? I might have to download it myself!
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
Man I've told you about the app like 3x now. :P
Ah, I didn't have the patience to figure out how to get a repeating timer going. Plus, I'd rather have an app on my desktop than my phone for this. To each his own?
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
If you're up this hour want a game?
Well, any sound can be specified. I wouldn't mind having a clip of that, though.
Also, the best video ever: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEyJBSHM7Oo
No games for me tonight; I should have been in bed hours ago instead of programming.
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
Will this stay above SCII in full screen mode until minimized? Because it be handy if it did. :P
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
C#, Visual Studio 2010
If you do windowed no border (basically full screen, but no minimizing when you alt tab) it shouldn't be a problem. I notice that sometimes my mouse leaves the window during the loading screens, but click outside the window and then back in fixes it.
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
edit: also the fact that this exists is a testament to how stupid zerg's macro mechanic is compared to the other guys' stuff
Also I totally have to get up early so I don't know why I'm still up posting.
SC2 NA: exoplasm.519 | PA SC2 Mumble Server | My Website | My Stream
I know at least one map has them on flat ground, lost temple i believe or is it kulas ravine? I always get the two confused, but yeah it has the choke on flat ground
Throw up some turrets, or rush for Ravens. Scanning is the only mobile choice until Ravens. Against DTs, you should probably throw them up in 2s, since the DTs kill Turrets so fast.
The next PvP I get I 2 gate zealot spam to easy victory.
Then I can go back to playing real builds!
I just dont understand how after a failed 2gate zealot rush it would seem like a good time to try to cannon push inside my base.
Desperate times call for desperate measures. The guy just had poor decision making on what to do next is all.
SC2: XxKhrushchev.539
anyway i havent lost with 1 base roach build in ZvZ yet. if he expands he always loses
Like Exo said, use windowed mode non-fullscreen. If it's set at your monitor's resolution it'll still be full screen, but you can alt tab to bring a window up. So just start the timer program up, start the game, then quickly hit alt-tab and start timer when your queen comes out and minimize the program. Only takes a second.
Or Exo could look into a "keep this window on top" toggle.
If you even have to ask that question then you're not larva spawning enough. You should be doing it 100% of the time.
I'm more of a terran player so I paid more attention to what he was doing and I'm actually surprised he won. I'm WAY more efficient than he is yet I lose quite a bit (gold league). He scouted with at 10, built a rax at around 11 then stayed max at 11 supply for a bit because he went rax first, he then had to pull another svc off the minerals to build the first supply depot so he's tying up 3 SVC early on when it should be 2.
His wall didn't look tight, or at least it's noth how i would've built my wall. He also didn't do too great when you popped his wall open, he should've pulled 2-3 svc's to repair as soon as you showed up. I've almost go to the point where I put 3 on their on control group early on just for this purpose. With marines attacking and the SVCs negating or at least severly hampering your attack on the supply depots he shouldn't have lost anything. Terran's greatest advantage is the wall in and the fact that all their early combat units are range where zerg and protoss have melee.
He was marine heavy which maybe was an advantage for him, I tend to pump 1 maruader per every 2 marines myself, but that may not be better.
Basically I typically have a comparable force 4 minutes faster than he does and I'll still get my ass kicked.
edit: I'll be at 10 minutes in and BAM a roving pack of Mutas comes knocking on my mineral line and I've at best got 1 turret on either end, so they find a hole or they focus fire on one and then it's open buffet.
I'm then trying to move my marines over through my base to cover it. I've not got them in a separate control group so my maruaders and my 1 or 2 tanks try to come too. It's a mess.
Will be my first experience with Starcraft of any kind and am looking forward to it. I want to learn Zerg so very much.
Zoidzerg if you will.