I hope they DONT have persistent stats. I just want games to start and go. Leavers should also not be penalized.
Persistent stats and leaver penalties FORCE players to play the game when they dont want to.
For example, in Hon when the enemy has raxed two lanes and the other team is just farming your heroes, one of your teammates decides taht no, he will vote no on every concede vote and just portal into the corner.
I have wasted hours of my life being FORCED to play a videogame. Its just wrong. I do not want stats.
There's no reason they'd have to have the concede vote be unanimous. League has only 4/5 required to concede which I think is pretty reasonable. I wouldn't be surprised to see that turn up in DOTA 2.
Also, in no way is the game forcing you to play. It's just observing how likely you are to stick it out in games and grouping you with people with similar tendencies. If you view the thought of having to play with other people who act like you do as punishment, then it really is just saying a lot about the way you plan behave in games.
But we don't need to fight. People who hate stats have their own little league. Then complain about their games being ruined by people that leave at the first sign their team might not win.
ALSO: About TF2.
I think it is hilarious that the fact that you can wear purely decorative hats is enough to make some people hate the game. Like, they join a game and just get so angry because someone has the gall to be wearing a bowler hat.
Maybe it brings back painful memories of goldeneye.
I hope they DONT have persistent stats. I just want games to start and go. Leavers should also not be penalized.
Persistent stats and leaver penalties FORCE players to play the game when they dont want to.
For example, in Hon when the enemy has raxed two lanes and the other team is just farming your heroes, one of your teammates decides taht no, he will vote no on every concede vote and just portal into the corner.
I have wasted hours of my life being FORCED to play a videogame. Its just wrong. I do not want stats.
This is right, but this is also wrong. There's a balance that hasn't been reached in dota or hon - there's too much granularity of stats for public perusal in hon (letting people/teams go on farming benders when a game could be ended 15+ minutes sooner), and the absolute lack of stats found in dota (that turned every game into a 15 min or less game because people leave if they don't get a random hero, or a new hero, or fail at life).
There's a balance we should reach in all these games with a very specific purpose: keep out the dickery. The communities for all these types of games are just atrocious - it takes the xbox live 12 yr old racist mentality, and turns it up to 11 & I think the appropriate balance of public and private stats is how we do our part to stifle this negativity (along with the proper care and feeding of the playerbase - new and old).
For sure, 100%, leavers need to be pointed out - if you rage quit, if your internet sucks, if you fail at life and join a hon/dota game when you have to leave in 15 minutes, people should know that, because it's frustrating and ruins the game for everyone else.
KDR, on the other hand - is a horrible stat to show - it's DEFINITELY the epeen stat of choice in hon, and, as mentioned above, it's easily farmable, and in the end not very fun. If people want to keep this around, it should be completely private - potentially opt-in.
W/L ratio - I dunno how I really feel about this stat, or a PSR-ish stat - I saw a lot of negativity surrounding PSR, but maybe it did it's job. Basically, what this game needs is an absolutely KILLER matchmaking system for any group size & maybe you get a PSR per team or something, I dunno - definitely haven't thought that far ahead, but I definitely know what should stay and what should go.
hush on
This is the future. This is what we built. This is what we wanted. It must have been. Because we all had the fucking choice, didn't we? It is only our money that allows commercial culture to flower. If we didn't want to live like this, we could have changed it at any time, by not fucking paying for it.
So let's celebrate by all going out and buying the same burger. -transmet
I hope they DONT have persistent stats. I just want games to start and go. Leavers should also not be penalized.
Persistent stats and leaver penalties FORCE players to play the game when they dont want to.
For example, in Hon when the enemy has raxed two lanes and the other team is just farming your heroes, one of your teammates decides taht no, he will vote no on every concede vote and just portal into the corner.
I have wasted hours of my life being FORCED to play a videogame. Its just wrong. I do not want stats.
This is right, but this is also wrong. There's a balance that hasn't been reached in dota or hon - there's too much granularity of stats for public perusal in hon (letting people/teams go on farming benders when a game could be ended 15+ minutes sooner), and the absolute lack of stats found in dota (that turned every game into a 15 min or less game because people leave if they don't get a random hero, or a new hero, or fail at life).
There's a balance we should reach in all these games with a very specific purpose: keep out the dickery. The communities for all these types of games are just atrocious - it takes the xbox live 12 yr old racist mentality, and turns it up to 11 & I think the appropriate balance of public and private stats is how we do our part to stifle this negativity (along with the proper care and feeding of the playerbase - new and old).
For sure, 100%, leavers need to be pointed out - if you rage quit, if your internet sucks, if you fail at life and join a hon/dota game when you have to leave in 15 minutes, people should know that, because it's frustrating and ruins the game for everyone else.
KDR, on the other hand - is a horrible stat to show - it's DEFINITELY the epeen stat of choice in hon, and, as mentioned above, it's easily farmable, and in the end not very fun. If people want to keep this around, it should be completely private - potentially opt-in.
W/L ratio - I dunno how I really feel about this stat, or a PSR-ish stat - I saw a lot of negativity surrounding PSR, but maybe it did it's job. Basically, what this game needs is an absolutely KILLER matchmaking system for any group size & maybe you get a PSR per team or something, I dunno - definitely haven't thought that far ahead, but I definitely know what should stay and what should go.
I must agree with you, but in hon the winloss thing makes me nervous of playing any new matches. Constant stat tracking in such a difficult game discourages
- experimenting with new builds, heroes, strategies.
-playing at all.
Are hats really that srs bsns in TF2? I won't lie, I haven't played a lot since they started introducing those silly things (not for that reason, though).
Not really. I mean some people really want them, but in the grand scheme of things they're just cosmetic. My item pack's pretty vacant. Not like I care, it's still awesome fun to play, and the gakeplay's still evolved over time even if you don't have any of the alt-weapons.
More to the point, saying nothing stood out about TF2 on release is freaking ridiculous from any nominally objective view of the game, even if you do despise it. They took TFC and made some fairly sweeping changes to it, and crucially, made it fun and accessible even for new players to an extent that I've almost never seen before in an FPS. If you understand what they were doing with the stylised aesthetic then you realise how much even that was designed to play into this accessibility and ease of play, and still allowing for more experienced players to have fun.
I hope they DONT have persistent stats. I just want games to start and go. Leavers should also not be penalized.
Persistent stats and leaver penalties FORCE players to play the game when they dont want to.
For example, in Hon when the enemy has raxed two lanes and the other team is just farming your heroes, one of your teammates decides taht no, he will vote no on every concede vote and just portal into the corner.
I have wasted hours of my life being FORCED to play a videogame. Its just wrong. I do not want stats.
You do know that there is a perfectly viable option to play HoN the way you are asking to play. You can simply play a 'No Stat' game, which is pretty easy to find now that 'No Stats' games have increased in popularity with the release of their trial system. Hell, there are people complaining that they paid for HoN on their forums right now because non-payers can make unlimited trial accounts (through the facebook link) and play 'No Stat' indefinitely. It's a little disingenuous to say they are forcing you to play 'stats' games.
The addition of the 'Leave %' stat really improved the general experience. The situation you described is fairly uncommon, but I'd rather suffer through that every once in a while, rather than having a large percentage of my matches end because of leavers.
krapst78 on
Hello! My name is Inigo Montoya! You killed my father prepare to die!
Looking for a Hardcore Fantasy Extraction Shooter? - Dark and Darker
Look, sorry but hats don't make a good game good. And from everything I've heard about L4D2 it's L4D1.5 but that wasn't the point of my post. It's a personal opinion, feel free to keep buying and playing those games but in my opinion nothing stood out on either account.
But this is about DoTA2 and what I meant was, if this is just another HoN (even though I like this game) It won't be getting my money just because Valve is backing it. And please god don't put stupid ass hats in the game.
Valve announces Alien Swarm for free for everyone, Team 17 cries and nobody cares about Alien Breed.
Blizzard announces DotA free for everyone with SC2, Valve cries and nobody cares about DotA2?
Or did this happen when LoL was free, which is way before Valve?
Or when HoN was announced, which isn't free but it's also DotA?
And people still play the normal DotA!
And then there's this Bloodline Champions game and I dunno wtf.
SO CONFUSING
Did anyone at Team 17 actually complain about Alien Swarm? I read a lot of people saying that it must suck for them, but I never saw them saying anything about it. Then again, I didn't look for it.
I think it'll be interesting to see if Valve's DotA 2 or Blizzard's free DotA for SC2 will be more popular.
Valve announces Alien Swarm for free for everyone, Team 17 cries and nobody cares about Alien Breed.
Blizzard announces DotA free for everyone with SC2, Valve cries and nobody cares about DotA2?
Or did this happen when LoL was free, which is way before Valve?
Or when HoN was announced, which isn't free but it's also DotA?
And people still play the normal DotA!
And then there's this Bloodline Champions game and I dunno wtf.
SO CONFUSING
Did anyone at Team 17 actually complain about Alien Swarm? I read a lot of people saying that it must suck for them, but I never saw them saying anything about it. Then again, I didn't look for it.
I think it'll be interesting to see if Valve's DotA 2 or Blizzard's free DotA for SC2 will be more popular.
Blizzard's will likely be more popular. Aside from being free and being a spiritual successor, I'm guessing that there are going to be changes and improvements to the formula.
Being free (if you already own SC2) will definitely help it, but you never know for sure. There will definitely be features found in Dota 2 that won't be in the SC2 Dota map (and maybe even vice versa), which could at least make a difference for people that really care about it.
If Valve was doing their own spin on things, offering more than 1 map, and generally not just making a straight DOTA clone, I'd say they would have had a chance with their pricetag. Otherwise, I think free will win this one.
If Valve was doing their own spin on things, offering more than 1 map, and generally not just making a straight DOTA clone, I'd say they would have had a chance with their pricetag. Otherwise, I think free will win this one.
This is a problem, right here.
People already bitch about dota having such a massive learning curve. And that's on one map, with one map's worth of juke spots, neutral camps, fog of war, secret shops, runes, optimal ward and counter-ward placements, lanes, and whatever else.
If you had to go through that even twice it would bump the learning curve up by a huge margin.
DotA has been built and balanced on that map for years, and the layout does change. The items and heroes and everything else are balanced for that map.
You can ask for more maps, that's fine. But don't bitch about the game being too hard to get into at the same time.
Also, SC2 dota? It will do well if it goes its own way, just like hon. You copy+paste dota into a new engine and everything is wonky and wrong, which is how hon was for a long while before they started adding their own things to it. How successful it really is will depend entirely on the dev team and how much of a tourney scene they can muster. There are dozens and dozens of dota clones already for WC3 and SC1, but none of them make a dent because nobody tests them, the devs have little clue about balance, and there's no solid base for competition to build from.
Fair enough. I'm coming from the perspective of a FPS player, where in you have tons and tons of maps.
And DotA doesn't appeal to me at all, so I would never play it to say "It's too hard." It just, again coming from the perspective of a FPS player, that 1 map strikes me as just plain bizarre, and likely a holdover from when all the DotA mechanics were packed along with the map.
Even in fps games they have to have standard competitive maps on a rotation, and 99% of new maps are fucking garbage, and people will still only play the same 3 maps over and over again regardless.
I would be very surprised if this was a straight port of DotA in any way, shape or form. I think they just called it "Blizzard DotA" for this announcement so people would get the general idea. I'm also skeptical that they'll continue to update it at all beyond an initial release with a handful of heroes.
Zek on
0
Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
Even in fps games they have to have standard competitive maps on a rotation, and 99% of new maps are fucking garbage, and people will still only play the same 3 maps over and over again regardless.
There's so much that the average player leaves untapped in the classic dota map. So much that even a lot of top players don't take advantage of. It's not as if the map we already have is an old, dead horse.
I mean despite the learning curve and all that important stuff to consider when dealing with a game like this, playing on one map is just plain boring. I mean Counter Strike fanatics can kind of get away with this because a game doesn't take 40-65 minutes (rough estimate here). Most servers of CS have a few maps on rotation anyway, it doesn't have to be a whole bunch of maps, but 1 or 2 extra would be nice.
I think HoN proved that the majority of the playerbase will continue to play on the original, which isn't a bad thing but it definitely will turn a few people away from the game. But DotA is already madly complicated, I appreciate LoL for getting rid of a lot of the excess mechanics that steepen the learning curve like denies and it just seems like some heroes in dota can get way too powerful. But this is part of the appeal. However I think if Valve want's to make this a popular game they are either going to have to do an excellent job and training new players to play at a decent skill level or completely revamp the mechanics of DotA like League of Legends did.
Well, since they definitely aren't changing the gameplay, they could concentrate on teaching people how to play well.
But that's another kettle of fish. Most dota (and hon and lol) players aren't that good, and can only play maybe a dozen heroes. That's never hurt the popularity of the game, just made the community hard to deal with, and getting good at the game takes actual, real, effort and work. Far more than I'd wager most players are willing to invest. It could be done, but the real problem isn't getting players to play well in the way they want to, but getting them to play well in a rounded, consistent way.
For instance, every player above a certain level should know how to carry with at least half a dozen heroes, and be able to win games with at least 2 or 3 hard carries. Playing support is the easy route, and people either want to only play carries, or never play carries. There should be a dedicated carry slot for pubs or something, but even that wouldn't work. It's just a shame that a whole game can be ruined by bad picks before it even starts. You either get 4 hard carries or 5 support heroes, or someone picks invis after slardar or lucy, or broodmother after earthshaker, or phantom lancer against heavy aoe, or any number of other dumb, stupid things.
Even in fps games they have to have standard competitive maps on a rotation, and 99% of new maps are fucking garbage, and people will still only play the same 3 maps over and over again regardless.
IMO, pretty much any mutiplayer FPS from Valve or Epic would disagree with every statement you made. (Well, aside from the same 3 maps comment, but even then that's only if you play on a shitty server. And still, 3 maps is more variety than 1.)
There's a DOTA 2 website now. It has a short Q&A thing. Sounds like replays and spectating will be more convenient than in any of Valve's previous games. It would be neat if they brought that over to TF2.
There's a DOTA 2 website now. It has a short Q&A thing. Sounds like replays and spectating will be more convenient than in any of Valve's previous games. It would be neat if they brought that over to TF2.
Yeah I was impressed with how far they're going with taking care of the features for the competitive side. Even the ability to spectate pretty much any game going, which is really surprising.
I'm still not sure though, that the addition of community features will be enough to help new players into the game. But they did at least address the question of why they weren't making any major changes to the formula (at least initially), and I can see why.
Pretty slick website. I was hoping for more gameplay details, however all the features surrounding the game were pretty interesting as well. We'll see how this goes...
Pretty slick website. I was hoping for more gameplay details, however all the features surrounding the game were pretty interesting as well. We'll see how this goes...
its actually the features that are going to make this worth it for me. upgraded graphics are a plus, and I dont mind if gameplay stays the same as dota. but the real draw for me is:
reconnect on drop, extensive spectating and replay options, coaching system, and all the bells and whistles.
I hope Blizzard Allstars is fun. It'll be awesome with all the Blizzard heroes and the typical Blizzard polish, but its limited in it interface because of the limitations of Starcraft 2. It won't work as a long term option for me--unlike Dota2 or HoN.
I am excited. One of the main draws of this game is to easily be able to play with arcadians through the steam cloud. I am not very good at making friends in games like these, but if we have a playing group similar to the one we have now for L4D2 it should not be a problem to get together a few games a night with only PA people. That alone is going to improve the game a lot for me.
KDR, on the other hand - is a horrible stat to show - it's DEFINITELY the epeen stat of choice in hon, and, as mentioned above, it's easily farmable, and in the end not very fun. If people want to keep this around, it should be completely private - potentially opt-in.
Oh god the community would be so fucked if this was tracked
Lol already has enough people who join games and just dick around on their own trying to boost their own ratio without contributing to team play, the last thing we need is more of that.
You'd also have an absurd number of people playing carries and gankers and absolutely retarded team comps
Pretty slick website. I was hoping for more gameplay details, however all the features surrounding the game were pretty interesting as well. We'll see how this goes...
its actually the features that are going to make this worth it for me. upgraded graphics are a plus, and I dont mind if gameplay stays the same as dota. but the real draw for me is:
reconnect on drop, extensive spectating and replay options, coaching system, and all the bells and whistles.
I hope Blizzard Allstars is fun. It'll be awesome with all the Blizzard heroes and the typical Blizzard polish, but its limited in it interface because of the limitations of Starcraft 2. It won't work as a long term option for me--unlike Dota2 or HoN.
The name Blizzard Allstars brings awesome images to my mind. Imagine a DOTA game with its own improved engine, three unique maps (orcs vs humans from warcraft, angels vs demons from diablo and zerg vs terran from starcraft) and like a dozen heroes from each game to choose from plus a few others from their smaller games (like the lost vikings).
I feel like it being on Starcraft 2 isn't going to limit its interface all that much, have you seen some of the proof-of-concept mods out there for SC2? RPGs, kart-racers, 3rd person shooters, it is pretty wild.
Pretty slick website. I was hoping for more gameplay details, however all the features surrounding the game were pretty interesting as well. We'll see how this goes...
its actually the features that are going to make this worth it for me. upgraded graphics are a plus, and I dont mind if gameplay stays the same as dota. but the real draw for me is:
reconnect on drop, extensive spectating and replay options, coaching system, and all the bells and whistles.
I hope Blizzard Allstars is fun. It'll be awesome with all the Blizzard heroes and the typical Blizzard polish, but its limited in it interface because of the limitations of Starcraft 2. It won't work as a long term option for me--unlike Dota2 or HoN.
The name Blizzard Allstars brings awesome images to my mind. Imagine a DOTA game with its own improved engine, three unique maps (orcs vs humans from warcraft, angels vs demons from diablo and zerg vs terran from starcraft) and like a dozen heroes from each game to choose from plus a few others from their smaller games (like the lost vikings).
It would be pretty cool.
I think its all of those things at once: demons and orcs and zerg vs terran and angels and humans.
I feel like it being on Starcraft 2 isn't going to limit its interface all that much, have you seen some of the proof-of-concept mods out there for SC2? RPGs, kart-racers, 3rd person shooters, it is pretty wild.
I know they can replicate the scoreboard and all the basic dota mechanics (see storm of the imperial sanctum for a bad sc2 dota clone) but the nature of starcraft 2 makes rejoin on drop, persistent stat tracking, and all the really cool features of HoN/LoL/DotA2 impossible.
If you never played DotA back in the bad old days, you won't know how absolutely awful leavers, griefers and droppers were. Being able to rejoin a game after you dropped (or have your allies do so), tell who leavers are in advance, and have balanced teams (In HoN) was a huuuge upgrade from the DotA days. Even DotA with banlist was far inferior to HoNs interface options and features. This is leaving out all the replay/spectator/coaching options.
I played Blizzard DOTA at Blizzcon. It's really nothing special guys. It has the fun novelty of getting to play with characters from Blizzard games but it felt horribly balanced, the controls weren't particularly responsive and there were some definite bugs.
But then again, it's not meant to compete with stand alone DOTA clients at all. It was actually, along with the other 3 custom maps Blizzard was showing at Blizzcon, was to help them further develop the map editor and inspire people to make new maps. Blizzard DOTA was to help them refine the hero aspects of the map editor.
I played Blizzard DOTA at Blizzcon. It's really nothing special guys. It has the fun novelty of getting to play with characters from Blizzard games but it felt horribly balanced, the controls weren't particularly responsive and there were some definite bugs.
But then again, it's not meant to compete with stand alone DOTA clients at all. It was actually, along with the other 3 custom maps Blizzard was showing at Blizzcon, was to help them further develop the map editor and inspire people to make new maps. Blizzard DOTA was to help them refine the hero aspects of the map editor.
This was exactly my expectation.
edit: and their mapmaker seems dead on arrival. lot of power within the mapmaker itself, but stupid external choices really seem to be sapping hte community's enthusiasm and ability to make maps
With enough futzing around even WC3 dota managed stat tracking and reconnects, even if it was limited to people who knew about them and went out of their way to implement it. If enough people are interested I'm sure SC2 could get the same things.
But interest is the key. All the stuff that happened to WC3 dota happened because the community was there and frothing demand was also there.
Posts
Maybe it brings back painful memories of goldeneye.
This is right, but this is also wrong. There's a balance that hasn't been reached in dota or hon - there's too much granularity of stats for public perusal in hon (letting people/teams go on farming benders when a game could be ended 15+ minutes sooner), and the absolute lack of stats found in dota (that turned every game into a 15 min or less game because people leave if they don't get a random hero, or a new hero, or fail at life).
There's a balance we should reach in all these games with a very specific purpose: keep out the dickery. The communities for all these types of games are just atrocious - it takes the xbox live 12 yr old racist mentality, and turns it up to 11 & I think the appropriate balance of public and private stats is how we do our part to stifle this negativity (along with the proper care and feeding of the playerbase - new and old).
For sure, 100%, leavers need to be pointed out - if you rage quit, if your internet sucks, if you fail at life and join a hon/dota game when you have to leave in 15 minutes, people should know that, because it's frustrating and ruins the game for everyone else.
KDR, on the other hand - is a horrible stat to show - it's DEFINITELY the epeen stat of choice in hon, and, as mentioned above, it's easily farmable, and in the end not very fun. If people want to keep this around, it should be completely private - potentially opt-in.
W/L ratio - I dunno how I really feel about this stat, or a PSR-ish stat - I saw a lot of negativity surrounding PSR, but maybe it did it's job. Basically, what this game needs is an absolutely KILLER matchmaking system for any group size & maybe you get a PSR per team or something, I dunno - definitely haven't thought that far ahead, but I definitely know what should stay and what should go.
So let's celebrate by all going out and buying the same burger. -transmet
I must agree with you, but in hon the winloss thing makes me nervous of playing any new matches. Constant stat tracking in such a difficult game discourages
- experimenting with new builds, heroes, strategies.
-playing at all.
Not really. I mean some people really want them, but in the grand scheme of things they're just cosmetic. My item pack's pretty vacant. Not like I care, it's still awesome fun to play, and the gakeplay's still evolved over time even if you don't have any of the alt-weapons.
More to the point, saying nothing stood out about TF2 on release is freaking ridiculous from any nominally objective view of the game, even if you do despise it. They took TFC and made some fairly sweeping changes to it, and crucially, made it fun and accessible even for new players to an extent that I've almost never seen before in an FPS. If you understand what they were doing with the stylised aesthetic then you realise how much even that was designed to play into this accessibility and ease of play, and still allowing for more experienced players to have fun.
You do know that there is a perfectly viable option to play HoN the way you are asking to play. You can simply play a 'No Stat' game, which is pretty easy to find now that 'No Stats' games have increased in popularity with the release of their trial system. Hell, there are people complaining that they paid for HoN on their forums right now because non-payers can make unlimited trial accounts (through the facebook link) and play 'No Stat' indefinitely. It's a little disingenuous to say they are forcing you to play 'stats' games.
The addition of the 'Leave %' stat really improved the general experience. The situation you described is fairly uncommon, but I'd rather suffer through that every once in a while, rather than having a large percentage of my matches end because of leavers.
Looking for a Hardcore Fantasy Extraction Shooter? - Dark and Darker
uninformed opinions own
Now you can tell other people you've heard it's L4D2 and it's awesome and you should play it with us.
Blizzard announces DotA free for everyone with SC2, Valve cries and nobody cares about DotA2?
Or did this happen when LoL was free, which is way before Valve?
Or when HoN was announced, which isn't free but it's also DotA?
And people still play the normal DotA!
And then there's this Bloodline Champions game and I dunno wtf.
SO CONFUSING
Did anyone at Team 17 actually complain about Alien Swarm? I read a lot of people saying that it must suck for them, but I never saw them saying anything about it. Then again, I didn't look for it.
I think it'll be interesting to see if Valve's DotA 2 or Blizzard's free DotA for SC2 will be more popular.
This is a problem, right here.
People already bitch about dota having such a massive learning curve. And that's on one map, with one map's worth of juke spots, neutral camps, fog of war, secret shops, runes, optimal ward and counter-ward placements, lanes, and whatever else.
If you had to go through that even twice it would bump the learning curve up by a huge margin.
DotA has been built and balanced on that map for years, and the layout does change. The items and heroes and everything else are balanced for that map.
You can ask for more maps, that's fine. But don't bitch about the game being too hard to get into at the same time.
Also, SC2 dota? It will do well if it goes its own way, just like hon. You copy+paste dota into a new engine and everything is wonky and wrong, which is how hon was for a long while before they started adding their own things to it. How successful it really is will depend entirely on the dev team and how much of a tourney scene they can muster. There are dozens and dozens of dota clones already for WC3 and SC1, but none of them make a dent because nobody tests them, the devs have little clue about balance, and there's no solid base for competition to build from.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
And DotA doesn't appeal to me at all, so I would never play it to say "It's too hard." It just, again coming from the perspective of a FPS player, that 1 map strikes me as just plain bizarre, and likely a holdover from when all the DotA mechanics were packed along with the map.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
It's true
de_dust, bro
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
I'll still get dota2, having icefrog developing the game is fucking HUGE.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
I think HoN proved that the majority of the playerbase will continue to play on the original, which isn't a bad thing but it definitely will turn a few people away from the game. But DotA is already madly complicated, I appreciate LoL for getting rid of a lot of the excess mechanics that steepen the learning curve like denies and it just seems like some heroes in dota can get way too powerful. But this is part of the appeal. However I think if Valve want's to make this a popular game they are either going to have to do an excellent job and training new players to play at a decent skill level or completely revamp the mechanics of DotA like League of Legends did.
But that's another kettle of fish. Most dota (and hon and lol) players aren't that good, and can only play maybe a dozen heroes. That's never hurt the popularity of the game, just made the community hard to deal with, and getting good at the game takes actual, real, effort and work. Far more than I'd wager most players are willing to invest. It could be done, but the real problem isn't getting players to play well in the way they want to, but getting them to play well in a rounded, consistent way.
For instance, every player above a certain level should know how to carry with at least half a dozen heroes, and be able to win games with at least 2 or 3 hard carries. Playing support is the easy route, and people either want to only play carries, or never play carries. There should be a dedicated carry slot for pubs or something, but even that wouldn't work. It's just a shame that a whole game can be ruined by bad picks before it even starts. You either get 4 hard carries or 5 support heroes, or someone picks invis after slardar or lucy, or broodmother after earthshaker, or phantom lancer against heavy aoe, or any number of other dumb, stupid things.
All I want right now is built in omg support.
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IMO, pretty much any mutiplayer FPS from Valve or Epic would disagree with every statement you made. (Well, aside from the same 3 maps comment, but even then that's only if you play on a shitty server. And still, 3 maps is more variety than 1.)
Is it really called Blizzard Allstars? I guess that would make sense, but the official SC2 sitecalls it Blizzard DOTA.
But i cant find it mate, so this is just hearsay i guess.
Yeah I was impressed with how far they're going with taking care of the features for the competitive side. Even the ability to spectate pretty much any game going, which is really surprising.
I'm still not sure though, that the addition of community features will be enough to help new players into the game. But they did at least address the question of why they weren't making any major changes to the formula (at least initially), and I can see why.
its actually the features that are going to make this worth it for me. upgraded graphics are a plus, and I dont mind if gameplay stays the same as dota. but the real draw for me is:
reconnect on drop, extensive spectating and replay options, coaching system, and all the bells and whistles.
I hope Blizzard Allstars is fun. It'll be awesome with all the Blizzard heroes and the typical Blizzard polish, but its limited in it interface because of the limitations of Starcraft 2. It won't work as a long term option for me--unlike Dota2 or HoN.
Oh god the community would be so fucked if this was tracked
Lol already has enough people who join games and just dick around on their own trying to boost their own ratio without contributing to team play, the last thing we need is more of that.
You'd also have an absurd number of people playing carries and gankers and absolutely retarded team comps
The name Blizzard Allstars brings awesome images to my mind. Imagine a DOTA game with its own improved engine, three unique maps (orcs vs humans from warcraft, angels vs demons from diablo and zerg vs terran from starcraft) and like a dozen heroes from each game to choose from plus a few others from their smaller games (like the lost vikings).
It would be pretty cool.
I think its all of those things at once: demons and orcs and zerg vs terran and angels and humans.
I know they can replicate the scoreboard and all the basic dota mechanics (see storm of the imperial sanctum for a bad sc2 dota clone) but the nature of starcraft 2 makes rejoin on drop, persistent stat tracking, and all the really cool features of HoN/LoL/DotA2 impossible.
If you never played DotA back in the bad old days, you won't know how absolutely awful leavers, griefers and droppers were. Being able to rejoin a game after you dropped (or have your allies do so), tell who leavers are in advance, and have balanced teams (In HoN) was a huuuge upgrade from the DotA days. Even DotA with banlist was far inferior to HoNs interface options and features. This is leaving out all the replay/spectator/coaching options.
But then again, it's not meant to compete with stand alone DOTA clients at all. It was actually, along with the other 3 custom maps Blizzard was showing at Blizzcon, was to help them further develop the map editor and inspire people to make new maps. Blizzard DOTA was to help them refine the hero aspects of the map editor.
This was exactly my expectation.
edit: and their mapmaker seems dead on arrival. lot of power within the mapmaker itself, but stupid external choices really seem to be sapping hte community's enthusiasm and ability to make maps
But interest is the key. All the stuff that happened to WC3 dota happened because the community was there and frothing demand was also there.
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